Does Middle East Peace Require a Two-State Solution or a Palestinian Defeat? A Debate
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- Опубликовано: 28 мар 2019
- To resolve the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, Israel must first achieve defeat of the Palestinian movement. That was the topic of a debated hosted by the Soho Forum on March 18, 2019.
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It was an Oxford-style debate, in which the audience votes on the resolution at the beginning and end of the event, and the side that gains the most ground is victorious.
For the affirmative, Elan Journo, a fellow and director of policy research at the Ayn Rand Institute, argued that the Palestinian movement is irredeemably corrupt and must be defeated as a necessary condition to achieve peace. The P.L.O. and Hamas have a long history of inciting terrorism and suicide attacks, and they aremore concerned with destroying Israel than with winning justice and prosperity for the Palestinian people, he argued. The defeat of the movement will require a coalition of governments to wage a sustained campaign of economic, diplomatic, and military efforts.
Danny Sjursen, a U.S. Army strategist and former history instructor at West Point, rejected Journo's characterization of the Palestinian movement. He argued that most Palestinian organizations, including Hamas, are more willing than ever to make reasonable compromises for peace, accept a two-state solution, and at least tacitly recognize Israel's right to exist. The only way to achieve a lasting solution to the middle east crisis is to treat the Palestinian leadership as potential negotiating partners.
Sjursen prevailed by convincing about 14 percent of audience members to change their minds.
Journo's latest book is What Justice Demands: America and the Israeli-Palestinian Conflict. He is co-author of Failing to Confront Islamic Totalitarianism: From George W. Bush to Barack Obama and Beyond, and editor of Winning the Unwinnable War: America's Self-Crippled Response to Islamic Totalitarianism.
Sjursen served tours with reconnaissance units in both Iraq and Afghanistan. He has written for The Nation, The American Conservative, as well as a memoir and critical analysis of the Iraq War, Ghostriders of Baghdad: Soldiers, Civilians, and the Myth of the Surge.
Music: Modum by Kai Engel.
Danny's argument hasn't aged well
Willful ignorance? Or just naivety? Either way agreed, the argument did not age well.
"Democracy ellected hamas" does this guy not understand how democracy works?
Saying "they were elected therefore can't be that bad" is asinine. Money play a big role, tradition (as in how already established a movement is) plays a big role, what kind of competition is there plays a big role.
Hamas and PLL actually suppress the population, imagine the competition?
This debate is so buried. After the recent declaration of war, if you type in "Palestine Israel debate" to try and get both sides of the argument, one finds virtually nothing, only news, one sided propaganda.
@nobelphoenix. 10 years ago there were dozens of debates. Oxford, Cambridge, IQ squared, Doha debates. In every single one the Pro Palestinian camp won the debate. Every single one. I imagine that did not sit well with the pro Israeli lobby.
Both sides want to fulfill a prophecy of owning the holy land. The same holy land. There can't be a compromise on that.
what? palestinians aren't going on religious prophecy, they just want their land back as legally and morally entitled
@@DrRiq Jews also have a moral and legal claim, dating back even further. However, both sides also have a prophecy about this land, that's why they won't ever let it go.
So Muslims holy land is not mecca?
It is, but Muslims still view the territory that Israel controls as holy.
@@georgecataloni4720 What is the Jewish claim? Palestine was only 5% Jewish a hundred years ago. The Jews got the British to put up with massive immigration. The Zionists btw were SECULAR Jews who did not believe any of the religious claim "God gave this land to us" etc.
There is blood on the hands of both factions. If the Israelis will not budge on the formation of a Palestinian state, the question must be asked about why no Arab nation is willing to allocate the same amount of land to the Palestinians for the sake of furthering peace in the region.
Wait what do you mean "Israelis will not budge on the formation of a Palestinian state", the Palestinians were offered over 95% of the land 3 times since the 80's (last time it was 2007 iirc) and they declined all 3 of them because muh refugees
@@TheSpiritof76
Thanks for misquoting me. You omitted one essential word, thus changing the context of my OP. Do you work for the mainstream media?
@@jeffersonianideal I did the good old ctrl c ctrl v to "misquote" you, you got me. and yes I'm a shapeshifting lizard freemason that works at msnbc, got me again.
@@TheSpiritof76
Thank you. I humbly accept your gracious concession.
There one was a land named Palestine. Upon it's dissolution it was split into two states, one for the Jews, the other for the Palestinians. It was split along the River Jordan and so the Palestinians named there new state Jordan and the Jews called there promised land Israel. Then it did come to pass that they wen't to war a lot and we find our self in our current predicament.
Its okay to rule without the consent of the ruled because at least they’re better off than you think they would be without the rulers? I have to disagree.
CPubi when the “ruled” continue their attempt to murder the other side every time they’re given freedom, it would be better to cull them and say a nice eulogy about the sad reality that some are not capable of being free
The only reason why Israel has the right to be in the "Occupied territories" is because otherwise, it wouldn't exist at all.
In any trust that was put in the Palestinian government, a parallel knife was thrown on an isreali man, woman, or child, which is the third gender in isreal.
By any means, I agree that all countries ought to have sovereignty, and so does the Israeli government, the one who does not, is Hammas.
Giving a better life to citizens is no reason to occupy them, necessity is.
The only time a 2 State Solution came closer to reality was when Israel enforced it. For that, Israel sent it’s army against it’s own people, jews, to take their homes in Gaza so it would be clear from jews and ready to be given to Palestinians. Palestinians, on the other hand, denied a 2 State Solution the 3 times it was proposed, and went to war.
People who say “free Palestine! 2 State Solution!” Don’t understand that a free Palestine always fought against the 2 State Solution.
Appeal to complexity? Too complicated, so you can't change it.
My Resolution: Not the USA's business.
Feng Jiang So... To war by Jingo?
@Feng Jiang So ..... no argument, just "a typical not-me view, when reality is what I say" ?
Israel provides the US with a geopolitical foothold for that region. That's enough for some support.
It may not be "serious" but it is the correct answer. It isn't our business.@Feng Jiang
If somebody wants to murder you that isn't my business either. However, that isn't the point. Also, Elan Journo is correct on this issue and he does not advocate the USA fight for Israel.
PLO has never accepted Israel. In 1993 they issued a statement which looked like they accepted Israel's existence, but it was never ratified and as such cannot be accepted as a policy. A statement that PLO accepted Israel's existence is a lie.
It will never happen. It's like asking for India and Pakistan to make nice. The bad blood just runs way too deep. Anytime either side would come close to a peace a radical faction from either side will seek to stamp out the spark of peace before it can take hold.
Liar. IsraSHIT has broken every single peace treaty and even uses false flags .
@@averagebodybuilder A true man of knowledge.
No 1 state argument?
That seems like asking for trouble, you shoot rockets at us despite our having the Iron Dome and the ability to retaliate? You use suicide bombers and cars to attack civilians?
How about I invite you into the neighbourhood, that'll surely stop the attacks... A people dumb enough to invite terrorists (doesn't matter if it's 0.01%) into their nation are retarded and their civilization will die in short order and frankly, I'd have little sympathy at that point.
That's what you get when there are two liberals debating...
Check out Caroline Glick. She has one state solution.
@@cleanwaternasenyiuganda8124 we all know that if it's ever to be solved, it has to be one state solution. Either only Jewish state or only Fakestinian state. Time to stop pretending two state will ever have a peaceful outcome.
P. S. Not to mention, the Fakestinians already have two states of their own. Judea and Samaria + Gaza.
I think we need to go back to every post colonial deal that was made during that era. Seems like in 1947 they thought dividing cities would work, it does not. Berlin is the best example of reunification after such a bad plan was abandoned.
Many Palestinians have different versions of the Palestinian movement. What u consider the movement others might not
No intro by Dave? I liked him
Middle east peace ?
Thats a contradiction in terms
Never ever ever ever shall it be so
the only way for there to be a true peace in the middle east is if it were turned to glass, but then not just them would be destroyed in such a way.
@@Leviathis_Krade The problem is that we shall all go with the lunatics
It will be tit for tat thermonuclear extinction
There was peace there until colonial powers began intervening in the region, funding opposition against current powers, causing division amongst the people, etc.
@@Iammram Do you mean the Egyptians or the Romans?
@@gmilitaru Talking about modern day, the past 100+ years.
Everytime I try to understand both sides of this issue, the less I like Palestine. Every time I hear someone argue Palestines position it's simple apologists for religious intolerance.
Ya but please ignore the British colonializaiton that was aiding the Jewish colonization of Palestine.
I’d love your take on this situation when it’s happening to you. I would argue that if you lift a finger to repel this attack and invasion, then you are a terrorist and you must accept this classification wether you like it or not. Palestinians had nothing to do with the Holocaust and hitler. And Palestinians had nothing to do with Jewish aimed hostility pre 1900 when the Jewish migration began. Not only did they migrate but they began to take claims and land as theirs with the protection of the British.
Sorry you end up disliking Palestine the more you read on it. Maybe you just have a dogmatic fascistic world view and you side with your like.
@@samwise4589 This is wrong, on pretty much every level. The migrations of Jews to Palestine, was something that was already agreed upon and accepted by the Ottoman Empire prior to getting involved into WW1 -> you're basically saying the Ottoman Empire just allowed Jews to run Palestine any way they wanted, and then all of a sudden at the start of WW1 just shut them down lol.
The Mufti of Jerusalem and many of the elites in Palestine did work with Hitler and supported him, in the hope that he would eliminate the Jews, and that they could basically repossess the lands they had sold to the Jews, since the money was so good. Under both Palestinian and Ottoman rule, Jews had to buy land in order to move to Palestine. Land in Palestine was owned by elites (as is the case in many Feudal and Tribal Societies), who often sold that land to Jews for ridiculously high prices, this was also often land that was occupied by much poorer Arabs, who got kicked out after the transaction was done.
The British did support some parts of Zionism, but eventually abandoned it when both the Jews and Arabs in Palestine were basically terrorizing their soldiers while trying to build a compromise between them, which is why they withdrew and handed the conflict to the United Nations to come figure out, since they could no longer deal with the mess that was the fight between the Zionists and Arabs in Palestine. The UN came up with a compromise, the Arabs rejected, and as soon as the British withdrew the Arab League tried to invade and lost.
Isn't the opening resolution a little harsh?
I would personally much rather live under an Israeli society than a Palestinian one. And I believe Israel is the more libertarian state over Palestine. With that said - the U.S. shouldn't be "supporting" (i.e. looking for an oil base) either of them. Plain and simple. From there, you have to get practical. If the U.S. and its statist allies withdrew support from Israel and Palestine (i.e. Israel,) Israel likely ceases to exist in, what, a month? Then we don't have to worry about it.
I'm only 8 minutes in and I am asking myself, 1/ What does the elected government of the West Bank's treatment of the population have to do with Israel? 2/ Doesn't Israel prohibit speech against Israel? Are you not likely to find yourself in jail if you spoke against Israel from within Israel, particularly if you happen to be Muslim? 3/ And while Abbas has exceeded his 4 year term, hasn't Israel exceed the 5 year hand back agreed to in the Oslo accords? 4/ DOesn't it also encourage attacks against Palestinians by protecting rogue settlers with it's army and arresting any Palestinian brave enough to fight back? Most of the änti-Palestinian accusations made could easily also be labeled against Israel.
lol, yes, Israel allows free speech. Fact. Israel is also the only country in the Middle
East that recognizes gay marriage, if that helps you to understand any better that Israel is a land of freedom, courts, order...democracy. Not perfect, but a whole lot better than any country surrounding it.
@marklee1960 Free.speech is more than a slogan. Google " Arabs arrested by Israel for social media post" Check Israeli media articles so it's not biased view. Agree that Jews live in a democracy, but no Palestinian considers it a democracy. Being liberal when it comes to gays is not the benchmark for.a.country's human rights record, how it treats all people living in territories under its control is.
@@Botie2 Palestinians are not citizens of Israel...
@@Botie2Israeli Arab Supreme Court judges have sent Israeli prime ministers to prison. Israeli Arab citizens have exactly equal rights to Jews and are well represented in all levels of Israeli society. Arabs living outside the official Israeli borders are under their own governance (Hamas, Palestinian Authority, Palestinian Islamic Jihad etc…)and are not Israeli citizens.
@jwollheim An Arab Israeli judge sending a PM to prison, that happened once in 80 years. There has been 1 high court Arab Israeli and given they represent 20% of the population, I don't imagine 1 is representative.
They don't have exactly the same rights. There are 64 laws that discriminate against them to do qith family reunification, property ownership, Israeli Palestinians have been arrested for simply upvoting a social media post. Not to mention the vaguely shrouded discrimination in lack of funding, lack of crime investigations, the JNF, allowing individuals and businesses to discriminate based on race. Or the blatant social discrimination.
If they are living outside Israeli boarders, why is Israel building settlements there and allowing settlers to get away with murder and ethnic cleansing?
What about the British Government being responsible for this crisis, to begin with?
God bless Palestine 🇵🇸✊✊✊✊✊✊
Could God turn up and tell us mortals what he actually wants here? Becuase everyone seems to think he's on their side but no one seems able to prove it or get the others to accept it. Its like gods not there really ain't it?
@@platylobiumobtuseangulum1607God is not obliged to do everything you may wish. People must obey God’s word, but not the other way around.
@@saveliyfilistovich You believe there's a god or set of gods that actually exist and have specific desires on which group controls this splinter of southwest Asia huh? I don't & the evidence and science seems to be on my side here. Which god, whose interpretation of which suppoosedly divinely inspired book and why should anyone believe you? If, say, Allah really exists then why hasn't he done something by now? I don't think any god exists but if one does, it doesn't seem too bothered by what is going on on this planet let alone this tiny part of it. Your evidence to claim otherwise would be____?
@@platylobiumobtuseangulum1607god seems to be very sneaky, I can’t find him either
@@saveliyfilistovichwhich god?
no Dave Smith warm up act? boooo!!!!
Completely agreed. Oh well. I subscribe to his channel now, thanks to his previous appearances in these debates.
It'll be very interesting to see where this situation stands in 50 years, especially now since parts of the Democratic party within the United States are speaking out much more openly against the "blind support" for Israel.
My views aside, I honestly believe if most citizens in the U.S. were made aware of how much money has gone into the state, there would be a massive call to withdrawal support.
50 years from now it will be the same as today.
Israel is getting rich. It no longer needs US support.
Lol, are you aware of the amount yourself? It's nothing compared to even the average expenses of the US government. Get some perspective.
@@seichorn4079 if we coup the Bernie it won't
All country must know hidtories the fallen israel...jerusalem destroyed by romawi.Mohamad abas many politic..
Sjursen is so very wrong on so many points and so naive. He has no idea who the palestinians are, how incompetent and untrustworthy they are. One has to question how much reading he's done. Sorry Sjursen, you lose this debate.
There is no compromise between a murderer's desire to kill you and your desire to live.
1.) A Palestinian in Israel is safe, free, and defended by the law as long as he respects that law. An Israeli in Palestine is in danger of being attacked just for being an Israeli.
2.) Israel has attempted to fix the land dispute many times. They have actually offered a lot of land for peace, even though they've won the wars.
3.) If a two-state solution is what Palestine wanted, the conflict would have been ended a LONG time ago. They only want the death of Israel.
4.) Palestine has praised the exploitation of the deaths of children, unrelated to attacks, and even the deaths of Israeli children, including that of a newborn infant.
Yes this is exactly right
"There is no compromise between a murderer's desire to kill you and your desire to live"
Perfect point. Just that it applies to the Palestinians, not the Israelis,
1. A Palestinian in Israel may have the same rights, but in Israeli controlled West Bank, that is simply not true. Israelis are kicking Palestinians out of their homes to make room for illegal settlers. An Israeli can come under attack in the West Bank(Palestine) because they are part of the cabal of settlers going to illegal settlements. Not saying it is their fault though, they've been lied to by the Israeli government. The complaining about attacks of settlements is akin to a robber complaining that you shot him for breaking into your house.
2. Good joke. Israel right now wants to demographically replace Palestinians in their own lands to fully annex parts of the West Bank and beat the Gaza strip into submission.
Israel only negotiated with foreign Arab countries in which they have taken land from in wars, not the Palestinians.
3. The Palestinians just want a state, and the majority want a two state solution. The conflict has not ended because Israel wants a one state solution with Israel.
@@declannewton2556 If the Palestinians just want a state, why do they elect leaders who want to wipe Israel out?
@@cubenerf
Maybe if Israel stopped having a foreign policy geared towards wiping out any hope for a Palestinian state and assimilating their lands into Israel, the Palestinians wouldn't react in kind.
Palestinians only want that the invaders of palestine to be arrested, tried for crimes and pay reparations
America israel do not efected by many poliitc....
what about a no state solution?
Calm down, we have an anarquist over here!
[read it in tyson's voice]
southwest asia (AKA The Middle-east) would be much better off (thou not perfect) had Israel not been reformed 73 years ago
Why does Israel 🇮🇱 have to give up there land for peace ✌ with the Palestinians when God gave the land to Israel since the days of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. There are 44 Muslims countries but known of them want to give up some land for a Palestinian State. Instead Israel give up half your land the size of New Jersey with 8 million people. While Islam has 1.5 billion people the majority Islam ☪ and the 8 million Jewish are the minority in the land of giants.
Oh yah and god wants murder. By the way they were immigrating to Israel and were living in peace. But the flippen u.s had to screw it up for oil. P.s god gave them the land till the end times we are in those times and im a christian not a morman or witness
youre making it hard for israel to justify its existence with this kind of argument, stop it
Stop these psychotic delusional fairy tales
This is all politic..war 1967 1948 1956 1949 israel won...
How sbout this: IS gets to occupy the entire ME. Such a huge political monstrosity can not last, so will collapse along the lines of differing tribes. Those tribes were forced together tby France and GB after the collapse of the Ottoman empire post-WW1, thus the artificial countries had competing tribes vying for power, suppressing the other tribes with brutsl violence. When the big islamic state collapses, the tribes will be able to found their own countries. Balcanisation is far from ideal, but the current contraption is unhumane
The ME needs to be broken up along national/tribal areas. The trouble there is the same that plagued Europe until the 20th century.
Do not agree ..all america israel.all country world..this is reality
We need one with Ben Shapiro vs Scott Horton on a similar resolution
heck yes
"Palestine" would prosper if Israel would take over that land. Iranian government is the reason there is continued conflict.
There is a difference between a "land" prospering and a people prospering. The Germans used the same argument when they annexed Czechoslovakia and Austria, and invaded Poland. And under Nazi rule they did "prosper". Just millions of Jews, Slavs, Socialists and other groups were put into a situation that removed their political, economic and for some even physical freedom.
one of the reasons why #IranIsraelProxyWar
Palestine has already been defeated, they admitted just as much in a time magazine issue from about a year ago (Time magazine has a very pro Palestinian slant, especially in that issue of their magazine which took a very sympathetic stance on Palestine) and even they who have a very pro Palestinian bias are admitting that Palestine has been totally defeated by Israel and the muslims in the interview told them that they are currently waiting for the next generation to come about in hopes that it will succeed in Palestinian independence where they have failed, so if even Israel’s enemies are admitting that Israel has beaten them then I’d say it’s pretty likely that the dream of Palestinian independence fantasized about by Muslim fascists and their pawns amongst the Western bleeding heart liberal‘s overflowing with white guilt who look the other way when it’s convenient for them are both stuck at least for another generation. (better luck next time)
👌😉👍
What do you mean they have been "defeated". I cant find this article you speak of, but even if I could, those words dont even make sense. A movement of people, an idea in their brains cant really be "defeated". It could be repelled or slowed, but one cannot defeat an idea. Or at least when the USA has tried, it has failed. And, lets say the "dream" as defeated. Why are Palestinians STILL attacking Israel then? Like what legit happened last week in Tel Aviv? Like does anything you just typed make sense, under any educated persons reasoning?
Riddle me this, if Palestine is defeated, why is Israel continuously bombing them?
Nate Nembhard Considering that I already explained this shit (in more detail then idiots like you and Declan Newton-Maharaj deserve who are apparently too illiterate to understand what I wrote) and what I meant to delusional ass hats like him. I couldn’t have been more clearer to people like him and you who comically missed the point of what I was getting across. You’re more than welcome to read what I told him or not if you don’t want to, either way is fine by me because I get really tired of having to repeat myself to people who apparently are too fucking moronic to get what I meant the first time. If you wanna know so badly what I meant then read it for yourself or don’t because either way is no skin off my nose. 😉 but whether you do or don’t i’m afraid i’ve run out of patience wasting time with pseudo-intellectual wannabes like you, some of us have lives to return to, bye! 👌😁👍
@@thehedgehogsdilemma9478
Looks like your single digit IQ mind does not understand my point.
If a people are defeated and they admit to their defeat, then why is Israel continuously bombing places like the Gaza strip?
Don't you it's barbaric to chronically attack someone not even capable of fighting back?
Palestine is defeated because, for the
3 times a 2 State Solution was proposed, Israel said yes and Palestine said no and went to war. Now Israel enforces their preferred outcome, and the reality is Israel’s preferred outcome. So yes, Israel won.
And Israel still shoots missiles because Palestine still shoots missiles. Palestine missile shooting is pathetic terrorist revolt of the defeated. Israel missile shooting is suppression of the defeated’s missiles. By the way, f*ck Hamas and their human-shield strategy.
The best thing I heard to describe the conflict was "If Palestine stopped all attacks and said they will no longer fight Israel there would be peace if instead Israel declared they would no longer fight Palestine Israel would be wiped off the map the next day"
@@raggamuffin2682 hey that was one ship, compare to the fact the US has always been at war with islam, yes the losses were terrible, but they (palestine) have attacked many US military bases just because we dont want them to kill other human beings over a small bit of land that HAS belonged to Israel in the past and was given back to them as a "safe" place to live in the world without discrimination, how would you feel if you went on an expedition for five years and find your home flooded with people who claim it was theirs first even though they even came from another country as exiles but still try to keep you from going to your kitchen in the morning by throwing rocks at you and spitting at you. The palestinians ARE doing this to the Jews that originated in that land many thousands of years ago, the palestinians only took the land when jews were forced out by their military force which caused the diaspora.
and Israel does have bad apples but it IS their land.
I mean...its not Palestine making a claim over a piece of land due to the fact that their specific religious beliefs say its their land.
@@raggamuffin2682 I cant tell if you understood I was just defending the israel state and not conspiracy theories and btw its soros importing them here to the USA not the weak ben shappy. and you can tell things that are wrong about israel as long as they are truthful. One should also look at the democrats who are ALSO being paid by cartels and soros to make America less than sovereign which is treason but those imbeciles up top dont want to face the music to the fact they were for burning down the united states for money a stack of paper that is worthless without her.
Maybe instead of blaming jews because you see them as demons, you should blame and rally against your leaders who will try and take you hand in hand to desolation and defeat. I do also agree dual cit is bs and needs to be banned, or at least anyone with it should not be allowed to hold a governing office because next they are going to funnel money into china..... oh wait that happened b/c of obama appointing a dually of china as head of the reserve.
@@gorgthesalty That's what they get *because* they are fighting. If they stopped fighting, and meant it, they'd have state tomorrow.
@@raggamuffin2682 if you actually believe the jews are your leaders you need to vote for other individuals; you also gotta be careful with how we talk about this because either way we are anitsemetic or antipalestinian.
Stoped watching when I realized you cut Dave's intro. I would have watched the whole thing. Your loss.
Danny was fucking awful. Journo would say one thing, Danny would entirely strawman (or just completely put words in Journo’s mouth) Journo and barely argue against the strawman. Ugh, this was just annoying to watch.
This is not our prob. Neither is big enough to be a threat to us even if absorbed by a bigger entity. The sooner we disentangle ourselves from all of these incomprehensible arguments that have nothing to do with us the better.
Israel does have nukes. Not saying that ur wrong, but they still have nukes...
Civilized nations at threat from savages deserve moral support. This doesn’t imply foreign or military aid.
It requires an enormous nuber of apostate Muslims.
To paraphrase: "To resolve the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, one State must first defeat another State (or at least an aspiring one)." Where was the frickin libertarian perspective?
You exemplify the unprincipled, amoral confusion so many libertarians wallow in. All states are not equally moral.
@@sybo59 correction: the principled, moral conclusion that all states are equally amoral. how about simply not being a jerk and just embracing the golden rule?
@@shawnl661 So a state which has significant support for individual rights is morally equivalent to one with no recognition of individual rights? Got it. Your agnosticism is not morally neutral - you are giving cover to evil. Shame on you.
@@sybo59 i'm in no way agnostic. but you are relativistic. people always be choosing 7/10s evil over 9/10s evil thinking they're righteous. i'll pass.
@@shawnl661 You literally claimed all states are equally amoral. You stand by that?
There is a Palestinian State it's called Jordan, but no! This is exactly what the world needs, another Arab country, Jordan was a part of Palestine too, but no mention of that anywhere...
#Racism
Dude...let me explain something to you, and I hope you understand: Jordan, or as it was called "Transjordan" is not part of the geographic region known as Palestine, and people who live in Jordan, are called Jordanians, not Palestinians. No reasonable leader would even make the argument that Palestinians living in Gaza and the West Bank should just move to Jordan.
So let me try this too. "California wants to leave the US? But there is already a Californian state, and its called Mexico, but no! This is exactly what the world needs, another Latin American country, California was part of Mexico too, but no mention of that anywhere..."
@@joeyyusef #wantsanotherholocaust lol racist against who? I'm Arab, my dad is yemenis my mom is Iraqi...
@@nate8892 "palastinians make up almost %80 of Jordan, for God's sake the Jordanian Queen is Palestinian!
here you can find the original British map of the "Mandate of Palestine" www.mythsandfacts.org/conflict/mandate_for_palestine/mandate_for_palestine.htm
Note that it includes vast parts of Jordan educate yourself!
@@miltonfriedman3593 I am not sure what ur finding is correct...I found that about 18% of Jordan is Palestinian...but they are all refuges, and with your source, I'm looking at it, and it seems like its has a bit of an agenda. Other than the Palestinian Queen part(which could be an argument other than the fact that the Queen was born in Kuwait), Im not sure anything you said is correct. Nevertheless, the "Mandate of Palestine" was not even legally binding, and was made before many Jews moved to the area. The UN Resolution in 1947 was its successor, and that made a Palestinian state to rule over the maj. Palestinian territories, and a Jewish state to rule over the maj, Jewish territories.
So, Here you can find the original UN Partition Plan map for "Palestine"
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_Partition_Plan_for_Palestine
Note that it legit includes all of modern-day Israel, and does not include Jordan, as it was released separately by the UK educate yourself!
The left won't let good actors prevail!
I'm pretty neutral on this issue, but the fact that this is the debate that's happening is disappointing. Americans are wayyyy to pro-Israel.
I am pro-Israel. I would be ashamed to support anyone who send kids to blow up restorants and busses, those who hide behind women and children, who don't recognize freedom and democracy, who discriminate against minorities. I don't like thugs of any color.
Its all about the Benjamins, baby! 🎵 🎶😮
The British Government Must apologize to the Palestinians for what they did to them with Balfour Declaration over 100 years now #BalfourDeclaration
Elon: "We should support the side that is more free"
Translation: A gay couple has the right to take over the homestead of a religiously conservative family, because the gay couple believes in a greater standard of freedom
#FreePalestine
Neither, it requires an Israeli defeat.
#FreePalestine #2StateSolution
A 2 State Solution was 3 times proposed, 3 times Israel agreed and 3 times Palestine denied and preferred war. The only time a 2 State Solution came closer to reality was when Israel enforced it. For that, Israel sent it’s army against it’s own people, jews, to take their homes in Gaza so it would be clear from jews and ready to be given to Palestinians.
People who say “free Palestine! 2 State Solution!” Don’t understand that a free Palestine always fought against the 2 State Solution.