Most of the time, it's because the villain either underestimates their opponents or they start celebrating early. Mostly the second option is more common
Also it was a plot point through your the entirety of kung fu panda 2 that inner peace grants you some sort of power and when po finally gains inner peace he then manages to redirect the cannons it is a little plot armory but not the kind he is trynna say
In the case of Waternoose, his slip up makes sense. He didn’t know he was somewhere other monsters could hear him, and he had enough history with Sully to try convincing Sully rather than instantly choosing violence or trying to overpower him. Plus, if Sully had been the only one to hear him, no one would’ve believed a scarer who “fell from glory” over the company CEO.
Keep in mind that company belonged to his family, that company was essentially the pillar he held his life on and that kid was the only way for him to keep it running, so when he sees sullly take that opprptytnih from him hes going to lose all sense of stability.
True. He also lives in a world that sees children as dangerous beasts to be exploited for resources. Kidnapping isn't far removed from what's currently considered socially acceptable.
The foreshadowing for him been the twist villian was great, they foreshadow is so well witj this line alone, " this company has been in my family for generations I would do anything to keep it from going under " on the surface it sounds noble but then you realize when he says anything he means it literally, ANYTHING
Well, these villains each made a simple miscalculation! 😅 Also, regarding Scar spilling the beans by whispering into Simba's ear that he's the one who killed Mufasa, he was highly confident that there was nothing that could possibly stop him from that moment on that he didn't count on Simba to strike back with sheer force.
Also at his core Scar is prideful and self-serving we see that in the last seen when he thinks he's won he can't help but share his master plan with someone smarter than a hyena and he told the whole pride so Simba wouldn't hurt him immediately
I mean who wouldn't be you've essentially overthrown a monarchy and you sit at the top with an army filled with thousands where nobody dares challenge your rule, you've placed your nephew in a helpless position, I mean come on who in scars situation would resist the urge to gloat.
Randall taunting Sully before letting him fall to his death makes perfect sense Sully is his life long rival and Randall wanted nothing more than to get one over on him so it's totally in character for Randall to want to stick one to Sully before finishing the job
Yeah exactly you can't twll me that if you had your worst enemy finally in a position of powerlessness you wouldn't just take the time to rub it in, I would
I feel like Scar underestimated Simba, since he managed to kill mufasa scar assumed history would repeat itself. As for hades he sent a demon named Panic to kill Hercules, that just isn't a good idea, and would you want to go up to him and say "so uh, we didn't kill him" and be condemned to eternal torture
Scar took the easy way when it came to his brother. Simba survived outside of the pride(albeit with help), so it is not too surprising he won apart from the laziness of him we were shown.
To be honest scar was pretty much putting simba on the backburner for most of the fight simba only won by using a cheapshot something he learnt from sparring with nala.
Makes sense scar would underestimate simba, I mean come on he's a little kid in his eyes, it's the equivalent of a world champion facing off against a beginner, a world champion as battle iq savvy as they are wouldn't take a mere beginner as a threat
Hades also overextended himself. If he didn't send the Cyclops to kill Herc Meg wouldn't have risked her life to save him, the deal wouldn't be nullified, and Hercules would still be powerless and unable to thwart his Olympus takeover.
Even if those villains had been smart enough to "quit while they were ahead", they'd still go down eventually: no conditioned experience is ever truly satisfying--if it were, people would abide in it instead of cycling through sensorial pleasures
I mean who wouldn't want to deliver a good last monologue and relish in the psychological torment of their victim before delivering the final blow? It's classic sadistic hubris. Happens with real life serial killers too to an extent.
Real people who start fires or explode buildings are known to be there in the crowd to see it happen. What's the point of being a supervillain if you can't take pleasure in your work?
Something worth keeping in mind is that the same things villains do that cause them to fail are why they're villains in the first place Ernesto wouldn't have gotten away with killing his brother by being more humble because if he was more humble he wouldn't have killed his brother Scar wouldn't have managed to kill Simba by keeping his mouth shut because it was envy and spite that drove him to kill Scar and Simba as well as try to crush their spirits with his words in their final moments And it's not just a movie thing. Criminals self-sabotage all the time, whether it's the convenience store robber blinded by greed who sets his gun down or the killer who gets drunk and brags about getting away with their crime in a bar
I think the real point of this video is to explain how true villains (not mere opponents of the protagonist) are destined to lose by their own hand. If the villain was competent enough to keep their pride in check and avoid these traps, would they really be evil?
Villains are usually caught because of their ego. Just...flat out. All their choices, leaving it to incompetent henchmen, and so on, that's all their egos showing. But that's what makes them so intriguing for a movie. Villains irl don't show anything, because they know they'll be caught. They do one crime, wait a while, do it again, and so on, so the pattern is unlikely to be found. But the dark triad personalities all have one thing in common: none of them have impulse control. It's hard to write a character that is fully evil without taking that impulse control away because it's all over irl, otherwise, they usually just find a different way to do things. It's...interesting, to say the least.
I’ve enjoyed all your videos, but I will say I think you missed the mark with this one. A lot of these characters, both hero, villain, and henchmen have character qualities and effects that give an exact reason why the villains failed, and not because of plot armor or writing. It was a reasonable, viable reason the villains would undo themselves or why the heroes could prevail. I did a lengthy comment regarding Scar, but would love a chance to explain my views on each point to you! That being said, I again note I enjoy your videos and me disagreeing with this one doesn’t change that! Keep up the good work!
Exactly I take no issue with overpowered villians been their undoing due to their own flaws that the hero exploits, but it's when you establish that they dont have these flaws its an issue when all of a sudden they take an action that isn t in line with how they are established that leads to their downfall, that's the issue.
I do want say it makes some sense in the lionking 2:29 Scar is not the most atheltic and he's been working on his master plan and once he gets tk gloat a little he does.
10:38 It's foreshadowed earlier in the movie with Mantis' acupressure where he says that he has a hard time finding Po's pressure points. It wasn't fully just pulled out of the writers' butt plus it makes sense that it'd work on everyone but a fat panda because in what other circumstance would Tai Lung ever feel the need to use the pressure point attack against a larger fighter when larger often means slower?
Also it's established at tbe start of kung fu panda that po has supreme Knowledge of kung fu he knows everything there is to know you see him actually perform kung fu before been trained, he knows it he just needed the confidence to execute it, and he knows even nore than the master that trained him as shown when he figures out the wuxi finger hold on his own. So po always had the ability he just needed the confidence to execute it Shifu was onky training him to refine what he already knew it makes complete logical sense. CAUSE AND AFFECT LADIES AND GENTLEMAN.
Tai Lung's defeat is actually a good example. The issue is that even without the nerve attack, he would wash the floor with Po. He managed to defeat both the Five and Shifu without any sign of real struggle, and even one member of the Five would literally no diff Po based on the movie. This is why Kung Fu Panda's ending is sadly not that good, they essentially made Tai Lung stupid, gave Po an OP counter, not to mention he randomly learns the Wuxi finger hold without explanation. Tai Lung was portrayed as a cunning and skilled fighter who can always turn the fight even when he is in great disadvantage. So while the movie tries to explain why Po ended up victorious, sadly it doesn't work very well. Tai Lung was, quite simply, made too powerful of an antagonist for the hero to defeat, hence why they had to nerf him in the final battle :D
Well,to put it simply,me and my friends grab each others pressure point on their neck,but for my big fat friend,when we do it to him,it doesnt hurt him,so technically that’s just what happens to fat people irl
I am reminded of the two ways of dealing with a fatty character in Fist of the North Star: Either slashing them apart or hitting one spot so much an opening reveals a pressure point.
I remember that scene from the good the bad and the ugly where a man get the ugly at gun point whe he's taking a bath but in stead of shooting him he starts monologing. So then the ugly just shot him and was like "if your gona shoot just shoot don't talk"
Why is Shen on this list? It's stated verbatim he wasn't a match for Po or thundering rhino and would've been caught if it wasn't for the latter's PTSD
He should have actually lost even quicker if it weren't for Po. He escapes the heroes for the first time solely because of Po's flashback stunning him for a moment. Second time is when the Five go and try to blow up his factory, as they would have actually succeeded and likely even killed Shen. They had to abandon their plan however as Po showed up to the scene and would have also died :D
2:30 I respectfully completely disagree. As a major Lion King fan and aspiring writer, this absolutely fits Scar’s character. There needs to be taken into account the “flaws” in Scar’s character. What I mean is the cracks in the genius, the moments where the perfection of his villainy is revealed, similar to protagonist flaws. Scar has always had 2 problems: Envy(first and foremost) and Pride. He has always thought himself superior to others, and has wanted everything that others have had. And your response has one problem: he isn’t a cold villain. He’s heartless, but he takes a certain joy to the game, “playing with his food”, as we saw in his very first scene. He relishes his opponent’s defeat, and enjoys seeing the reaction. We saw this during the stampede, when Mufasa is thrown down, Scar takes a moment for the realization to sink in for Mufasa. He doesn’t even end Simba himself, he guilt trips him and exiles him before sending the hyenas to end him, giving maximum torment to Simba before Simba’s intended end. So Scar taking a moment as Simba is dangling over the edge to reveal the truth is spot on, and Scar didn’t just shout out the truth at will, he has demonstrated his cowardice too, and did it out of fear of Simba ending him when he had him pinned. That’s my respectful counter, and I enjoy watching your videos!
And if you have you opponent dangling over a cliff, your going to be pretty assured that they won’t be able to pull themselves back up. Me for certain, scar could whisper that eye opener to me but I don’t have the upper body strength to pull myself up.
Tbf to Scar, he thought he already won: Simba was dangling over a cliff (and frankly shouldn’t have been able to haul himself up and overwhelm Scar) so Scar, being the bastard he is, tries to twist the knife just a little further before the final blow. Randal had held a massive grudge against Sully for years and Boo had been terrified of him up until that moment so his motivation makes sense. Waternoose was lured into a carefully planned trap where he’d reveal his plans/actions to the authorities. And he was so focused on Sully that he didn’t notice that it wasn’t Boo’s door but the simulation room. Want to see a bad monologuing villain just look at Evelyn from Incredibles 2 8:25 it wasn’t plot armor considering inner peace was the point of the plot and by mastering it Po had unlocked something seemingly impossible: redirecting a fireball almost the same as a drop of rain. It was also a subtle notion that Kung Fu still beat technology It would’ve been plot armor if Po redirected the ball without the setup or it led to something “”subversive”” but unsatisfying (such as the fireballs bouncing off of Po’s fat or something).
Shen's downfall also plays into another part of his story, which mirrors something Oogway alludes to as far back as the first Kung Fu Panda movie with Tai Lung and Shifu: "One often meets his destiny on the road he takes to avoid it." Shen was told a prophecy at a young age, along with his parents, that he would be defeated by a warrior of black and white - which he correctly deduced to be a panda. He refused to let that happen and committed genocide on the panda population in an attempt to cheat his fate, but in the process only sealed it. The rest of the movie is a showcasing of Po learning to heal from his past and grow from the experience, aka finding inner peace. But it is also of Shen's fate slowly coming true due to his own actions, lacking inner peace because he could never let go of the past or of the prophecy.
@theterrorofdimensions1326 well said. I’ll add that the only moment of Peace for Shen comes when the cannon is about to drop on him because for once in his life *he* was in charge of his own destiny. A warrior of black and white, and rather than his final downfall being caused by Po it was only himself and refusing to flee when given the chance.
What do you mean? Scar should’ve won, but he lost because of his egotistical callousness, which is why he didn’t “shut his trap,” he wanted Simba to know the truth before killing him. Lord Shen lost because Po found inner peace and acceptance of which what Shen had done to his people, The Pandas who are implied to have been all eradicated (at least up until the post credit scene), Po did not gain “plot armor.” Ernesto de la Cruz already WON, in LIFE, his loss at the end of Coco is him paying for his actions (killing Hector and stealing his songs), which in DEATH was a long time coming. He lost in DEATH when the truth that he maliciously swept under the rug was finally revealed by Miguel and his family.
3:07 to Scars defense he likes to brag, and make a song about himself getting to greatness. And a thing about being in the top is ... its kinda boring up there with no schemes to plot.
@Fffiioghiutt0 Good point. Besides, heres another thing people miss: How old is Scar at this point? Age standpoint Scar is way older, way weaker when he killed Mufasa ten + years ago. It can very well be he overestimated his power.
It makes complete sense that Ok would beat Tai Lung in their final fight, po at the beginning of the film was established to have supreme knowledge of kung fu he learnt the wuxi finger hold on his own, and he was established at the start to have powerful fat, mantis couldn't find his nerves underneath all of that fat, and Tai lungs weakness was his obsession wirh the scroll which Po exploited so it makes complete logic sense that Po was able to defeat him to say otherwise is to ignore all the set up that the writers did in making sure it all makes sense.
You can make a whole SERIES of this based on action movies with “serious” actors in place of action stars. When you have someone playing a character who they can’t fully move like, you get more than just “we can see the stunt double”. You also get choreography contrivances like The Protagonist Throw, The Vulnerable Taught, The Side Character Clutch, Saved by a Nearby Object, The Lethal Ring-out, etc
With the monologue trap you must also realize that characters are often times arrogant and can't help but gloat when they think they've won. There is no one to humiliate if the hero is dead.
What really frustrates me about him js the fact that the family chases him and he could of just easily destroyed the picture but he just Carries on running it's a stupid mistake.
I've heard from people who have real life and death confrontations with evil. The monologue before they shoot you is completely true to life. They literally will sabotage themselves with last minute monologues and gloating confessions, they do it in real life.
Scar also suffers from incompetent henchmen. Instead of killing Simba himself, he leaves it to the hyenas, who fail and lie about it until Simba shows up as an adult.
2:07 scar whispered to Mufasa Long live the king, I get where you were go with the idea about monologuing but Taka was consistent 3:44 Plot Amor & finishing the earned character arc for the child. From Tai long, Shen, Hades, the commander, finally villains getting justice 17:21 The Heel Cena meme touched my soul
I've heard before that if you want a villain to win, the writers did a good job with them--but I'd also say it means they made flaws in the story if the hero has plot armor.
with simba the real problem that he should have worked through his guilt before the end, not completly, but enough that he doesn't end up hanging from a cliff.
2:40 TDK Joker fell into this one as well. He would’ve blown the two boats up first and then talked about his scars if the directors didn’t step in to make him lose one of his scenarios
I suggest to everyone who can to play the boardgame "Villainous" with friends/family. Just so you understand first hand how hard it feels to be a Disney villain.
With Shen, the whole inner peace was foreshadowed at the start of the movie. As for Ti-Long, realizing that the scroll wasn't the god mode item he thought I feel sapped part of his will to fight. Everything he did in the movie was to claim what was "his".
Most of these aren't even "plot armor saved them", just the characters having flaws/traits that causes the villains downfall. Picked the worst examples possible to make this point since: Scar wanted to feel superior and did the same thing to Mufasa. Randall wanted to be better than Sully since forever. Waternoose has a bit of a case, but honestly who would've expected Mike to get the other peeps to that place so quickly since they ran there. Peacock literally set everything in motion, letting the soothsayer go due to his emotions. Also, he literally set the scene for his own downfall by doing what he did. Tai lung was obsessed with the scroll and Po's presure point thing had been explored in an earlier scene. Hades literally sent a titan after Hercules when he could've just offed him right then and there or just ignored him since Herc wouldn't be able to participate in the take over. Kronk is dumb and hung, and to his credit, the folded paper did look like a skull. Seriously, who organizes everything to look the same when they do vastly different things? Thats just calling for accidents. Ernesto has little to no creativity, thats why he took credit for all the songs. Why would someone literally make a movie of a crime they comitted and not expect a fanboy to connect the dots. The last guy literally got too greedy for his own good.
Im actually under the impression that Ezma actually likes having kronk around due to his cooking, he's even able to convince her to dessert and coffee before taking kuzco out of town. Thats why she puts up with his flaws.
Inner peace was whar allows Po to hear shen it aint plot armour its cause and affect the writers established that anything is possible of you have inner peace and it gets played off in the final battle.
I've read a book "Eye of the Needle" and it did it even worse. I was really enjoying reading about the ever dexterious master spy until he experienced a brain flop, started making dumb mistakes and was defeated in a stupid way. (not including the details so I don't spoil it for those who want to read that book)
Most of the time, it's because the villain either underestimates their opponents or they start celebrating early. Mostly the second option is more common
That's right
Agreed
Also it was a plot point through your the entirety of kung fu panda 2 that inner peace grants you some sort of power and when po finally gains inner peace he then manages to redirect the cannons it is a little plot armory but not the kind he is trynna say
Most of the time they have the writers have to make the villains either brain dead or extremely weak
@Tyson-y3e Good Idea for help to lot of wants it
2:07 scar whispered long live the king to mufasa its pretty consistent
Yeah, that's right!
In the case of Waternoose, his slip up makes sense. He didn’t know he was somewhere other monsters could hear him, and he had enough history with Sully to try convincing Sully rather than instantly choosing violence or trying to overpower him. Plus, if Sully had been the only one to hear him, no one would’ve believed a scarer who “fell from glory” over the company CEO.
Keep in mind that company belonged to his family, that company was essentially the pillar he held his life on and that kid was the only way for him to keep it running, so when he sees sullly take that opprptytnih from him hes going to lose all sense of stability.
True. He also lives in a world that sees children as dangerous beasts to be exploited for resources. Kidnapping isn't far removed from what's currently considered socially acceptable.
The foreshadowing for him been the twist villian was great, they foreshadow is so well witj this line alone, " this company has been in my family for generations I would do anything to keep it from going under " on the surface it sounds noble but then you realize when he says anything he means it literally, ANYTHING
@winkone101 Yeah “Monsters At Work” pretty much addresses that the change shouldn’t have been instantly accepted like that.
Using genocidical bird in the thumbnail and going "not all villains are bad" 2 minutes into the video is an interesting choice
Ikr! “interesting choice”, bro make another 😭
😂😂😂.
I think he meant they are not either, bad villains, bad charecters(quality), or bad planners. Idk tho
we not talking about the lion whos the allegory of hitler? 😂
He meant not bad as in not lazy written
Well, these villains each made a simple miscalculation! 😅 Also, regarding Scar spilling the beans by whispering into Simba's ear that he's the one who killed Mufasa, he was highly confident that there was nothing that could possibly stop him from that moment on that he didn't count on Simba to strike back with sheer force.
Also at his core Scar is prideful and self-serving we see that in the last seen when he thinks he's won he can't help but share his master plan with someone smarter than a hyena and he told the whole pride so Simba wouldn't hurt him immediately
I mean who wouldn't be you've essentially overthrown a monarchy and you sit at the top with an army filled with thousands where nobody dares challenge your rule, you've placed your nephew in a helpless position, I mean come on who in scars situation would resist the urge to gloat.
@try-w5s Exactly
That was his mistake
Simba suddenly gaining super grip while sliding off the rock was bull.
Randall taunting Sully before letting him fall to his death makes perfect sense
Sully is his life long rival and Randall wanted nothing more than to get one over on him
so it's totally in character for Randall to want to stick one to Sully before finishing the job
Yeah exactly you can't twll me that if you had your worst enemy finally in a position of powerlessness you wouldn't just take the time to rub it in, I would
I feel like Scar underestimated Simba, since he managed to kill mufasa scar assumed history would repeat itself. As for hades he sent a demon named Panic to kill Hercules, that just isn't a good idea, and would you want to go up to him and say "so uh, we didn't kill him" and be condemned to eternal torture
Scar took the easy way when it came to his brother. Simba survived outside of the pride(albeit with help), so it is not too surprising he won apart from the laziness of him we were shown.
To be honest scar was pretty much putting simba on the backburner for most of the fight simba only won by using a cheapshot something he learnt from sparring with nala.
Makes sense scar would underestimate simba, I mean come on he's a little kid in his eyes, it's the equivalent of a world champion facing off against a beginner, a world champion as battle iq savvy as they are wouldn't take a mere beginner as a threat
Hades also overextended himself. If he didn't send the Cyclops to kill Herc Meg wouldn't have risked her life to save him, the deal wouldn't be nullified, and Hercules would still be powerless and unable to thwart his Olympus takeover.
Even if those villains had been smart enough to "quit while they were ahead", they'd still go down eventually: no conditioned experience is ever truly satisfying--if it were, people would abide in it instead of cycling through sensorial pleasures
I mean who wouldn't want to deliver a good last monologue and relish in the psychological torment of their victim before delivering the final blow? It's classic sadistic hubris. Happens with real life serial killers too to an extent.
Real people who start fires or explode buildings are known to be there in the crowd to see it happen. What's the point of being a supervillain if you can't take pleasure in your work?
Complete definition right here, out of the dictionary and pasted to the internet.
These 3 sentence alone gives the indepth definition of the video
Something worth keeping in mind is that the same things villains do that cause them to fail are why they're villains in the first place
Ernesto wouldn't have gotten away with killing his brother by being more humble because if he was more humble he wouldn't have killed his brother
Scar wouldn't have managed to kill Simba by keeping his mouth shut because it was envy and spite that drove him to kill Scar and Simba as well as try to crush their spirits with his words in their final moments
And it's not just a movie thing. Criminals self-sabotage all the time, whether it's the convenience store robber blinded by greed who sets his gun down or the killer who gets drunk and brags about getting away with their crime in a bar
I disagree with some if the points, since some of these are due to character flaws in the villain
This video isn’t well thought out
I think the real point of this video is to explain how true villains (not mere opponents of the protagonist) are destined to lose by their own hand. If the villain was competent enough to keep their pride in check and avoid these traps, would they really be evil?
Villains are usually caught because of their ego. Just...flat out. All their choices, leaving it to incompetent henchmen, and so on, that's all their egos showing. But that's what makes them so intriguing for a movie. Villains irl don't show anything, because they know they'll be caught. They do one crime, wait a while, do it again, and so on, so the pattern is unlikely to be found. But the dark triad personalities all have one thing in common: none of them have impulse control. It's hard to write a character that is fully evil without taking that impulse control away because it's all over irl, otherwise, they usually just find a different way to do things. It's...interesting, to say the least.
So writers are just bad at making villains
I’ve enjoyed all your videos, but I will say I think you missed the mark with this one. A lot of these characters, both hero, villain, and henchmen have character qualities and effects that give an exact reason why the villains failed, and not because of plot armor or writing. It was a reasonable, viable reason the villains would undo themselves or why the heroes could prevail. I did a lengthy comment regarding Scar, but would love a chance to explain my views on each point to you! That being said, I again note I enjoy your videos and me disagreeing with this one doesn’t change that! Keep up the good work!
Exactly I take no issue with overpowered villians been their undoing due to their own flaws that the hero exploits, but it's when you establish that they dont have these flaws its an issue when all of a sudden they take an action that isn t in line with how they are established that leads to their downfall, that's the issue.
i will not have anyone talk ill about kronk
Real lol
@B@BetchaPlayGameshe was the goat of idiots
how are any of these "plotholes" instead of long existing flaws in the villain coming to fruition?
18:45 Ernesto had no qualms using his own crimes as movie script because the one person hearing those words was dead.
Ah yes, the Monologue Trap. Classic Disney Villains tropes.
I do want say it makes some sense in the lionking 2:29 Scar is not the most atheltic and he's been working on his master plan and once he gets tk gloat a little he does.
10:38 It's foreshadowed earlier in the movie with Mantis' acupressure where he says that he has a hard time finding Po's pressure points. It wasn't fully just pulled out of the writers' butt plus it makes sense that it'd work on everyone but a fat panda because in what other circumstance would Tai Lung ever feel the need to use the pressure point attack against a larger fighter when larger often means slower?
Also it's established at tbe start of kung fu panda that po has supreme Knowledge of kung fu he knows everything there is to know you see him actually perform kung fu before been trained, he knows it he just needed the confidence to execute it, and he knows even nore than the master that trained him as shown when he figures out the wuxi finger hold on his own. So po always had the ability he just needed the confidence to execute it Shifu was onky training him to refine what he already knew it makes complete logical sense.
CAUSE AND AFFECT LADIES AND GENTLEMAN.
Tai Lung's defeat is actually a good example. The issue is that even without the nerve attack, he would wash the floor with Po. He managed to defeat both the Five and Shifu without any sign of real struggle, and even one member of the Five would literally no diff Po based on the movie.
This is why Kung Fu Panda's ending is sadly not that good, they essentially made Tai Lung stupid, gave Po an OP counter, not to mention he randomly learns the Wuxi finger hold without explanation. Tai Lung was portrayed as a cunning and skilled fighter who can always turn the fight even when he is in great disadvantage. So while the movie tries to explain why Po ended up victorious, sadly it doesn't work very well.
Tai Lung was, quite simply, made too powerful of an antagonist for the hero to defeat, hence why they had to nerf him in the final battle :D
Well,to put it simply,me and my friends grab each others pressure point on their neck,but for my big fat friend,when we do it to him,it doesnt hurt him,so technically that’s just what happens to fat people irl
I am reminded of the two ways of dealing with a fatty character in Fist of the North Star: Either slashing them apart or hitting one spot so much an opening reveals a pressure point.
I remember that scene from the good the bad and the ugly where a man get the ugly at gun point whe he's taking a bath but in stead of shooting him he starts monologing. So then the ugly just shot him and was like "if your gona shoot just shoot don't talk"
Why is Shen on this list? It's stated verbatim he wasn't a match for Po or thundering rhino and would've been caught if it wasn't for the latter's PTSD
Exactly.
He should have actually lost even quicker if it weren't for Po. He escapes the heroes for the first time solely because of Po's flashback stunning him for a moment. Second time is when the Five go and try to blow up his factory, as they would have actually succeeded and likely even killed Shen. They had to abandon their plan however as Po showed up to the scene and would have also died :D
A fatal mistake is preferable by far to casual plot armor.
As a villain myself, I must admit that I do tend to monolog. I mean, my schemes are so great I just have to brag about them....LOL!!
2:30 I respectfully completely disagree. As a major Lion King fan and aspiring writer, this absolutely fits Scar’s character. There needs to be taken into account the “flaws” in Scar’s character. What I mean is the cracks in the genius, the moments where the perfection of his villainy is revealed, similar to protagonist flaws. Scar has always had 2 problems: Envy(first and foremost) and Pride. He has always thought himself superior to others, and has wanted everything that others have had. And your response has one problem: he isn’t a cold villain. He’s heartless, but he takes a certain joy to the game, “playing with his food”, as we saw in his very first scene. He relishes his opponent’s defeat, and enjoys seeing the reaction. We saw this during the stampede, when Mufasa is thrown down, Scar takes a moment for the realization to sink in for Mufasa. He doesn’t even end Simba himself, he guilt trips him and exiles him before sending the hyenas to end him, giving maximum torment to Simba before Simba’s intended end. So Scar taking a moment as Simba is dangling over the edge to reveal the truth is spot on, and Scar didn’t just shout out the truth at will, he has demonstrated his cowardice too, and did it out of fear of Simba ending him when he had him pinned. That’s my respectful counter, and I enjoy watching your videos!
And if you have you opponent dangling over a cliff, your going to be pretty assured that they won’t be able to pull themselves back up. Me for certain, scar could whisper that eye opener to me but I don’t have the upper body strength to pull myself up.
True
He was definitely going to die
Same though with more, the bad guys flaws are plot armor, the good guys flaws are part of the story. I mean... cmon
14:15
"We tripped at the finish line... why? Because our little Nutmeg had to go all noble!"
6:30 Well, we didn't have to roast Po like that, but. :U
About the Taiong thing, it's foreshadowed about Po's body being difficult to pressure point by the scene where mantis try's acupuncture on Po.
“You caught me monologuing!”
randal taking action by.... not taking action... very well executed plan.
14:59 don't diss ma boy kronk like that 😮
In the context of the video, it becomes a compliment.
i love guide vids like this
breaking down the ins and outs of writing
21:55 IT'S TIME TO BE A BIG SHOT!
Tbf to Scar, he thought he already won: Simba was dangling over a cliff (and frankly shouldn’t have been able to haul himself up and overwhelm Scar) so Scar, being the bastard he is, tries to twist the knife just a little further before the final blow.
Randal had held a massive grudge against Sully for years and Boo had been terrified of him up until that moment so his motivation makes sense.
Waternoose was lured into a carefully planned trap where he’d reveal his plans/actions to the authorities. And he was so focused on Sully that he didn’t notice that it wasn’t Boo’s door but the simulation room.
Want to see a bad monologuing villain just look at Evelyn from Incredibles 2
8:25 it wasn’t plot armor considering inner peace was the point of the plot and by mastering it Po had unlocked something seemingly impossible: redirecting a fireball almost the same as a drop of rain. It was also a subtle notion that Kung Fu still beat technology
It would’ve been plot armor if Po redirected the ball without the setup or it led to something “”subversive”” but unsatisfying (such as the fireballs bouncing off of Po’s fat or something).
Shen's downfall also plays into another part of his story, which mirrors something Oogway alludes to as far back as the first Kung Fu Panda movie with Tai Lung and Shifu: "One often meets his destiny on the road he takes to avoid it."
Shen was told a prophecy at a young age, along with his parents, that he would be defeated by a warrior of black and white - which he correctly deduced to be a panda. He refused to let that happen and committed genocide on the panda population in an attempt to cheat his fate, but in the process only sealed it. The rest of the movie is a showcasing of Po learning to heal from his past and grow from the experience, aka finding inner peace. But it is also of Shen's fate slowly coming true due to his own actions, lacking inner peace because he could never let go of the past or of the prophecy.
@theterrorofdimensions1326 well said. I’ll add that the only moment of Peace for Shen comes when the cannon is about to drop on him because for once in his life *he* was in charge of his own destiny.
A warrior of black and white, and rather than his final downfall being caused by Po it was only himself and refusing to flee when given the chance.
The reason Tai Lung lost is because he’s never fought anyone like Po.
and the creator missed something pointed out earlier when mantis was trying to find po's pressure points for acupuncture
What do you mean? Scar should’ve won, but he lost because of his egotistical callousness, which is why he didn’t “shut his trap,” he wanted Simba to know the truth before killing him. Lord Shen lost because Po found inner peace and acceptance of which what Shen had done to his people, The Pandas who are implied to have been all eradicated (at least up until the post credit scene), Po did not gain “plot armor.” Ernesto de la Cruz already WON, in LIFE, his loss at the end of Coco is him paying for his actions (killing Hector and stealing his songs), which in DEATH was a long time coming. He lost in DEATH when the truth that he maliciously swept under the rug was finally revealed by Miguel and his family.
3:07 to Scars defense he likes to brag, and make a song about himself getting to greatness. And a thing about being in the top is ... its kinda boring up there with no schemes to plot.
I guess you can say his PRIDE got the better of him! 😏
@caristhecake137
My words are matter of pride!
Right? If he's going to kill simpa too then might as well brag a little and let him die with agony and that little secret
@Fffiioghiutt0
Good point. Besides, heres another thing people miss: How old is Scar at this point? Age standpoint Scar is way older, way weaker when he killed Mufasa ten + years ago. It can very well be he overestimated his power.
@kindkindredwait I never considered that actually it makes so much sense
its in all of us to monologue tell the person who damage you, who hurt you, who took away from your success.
It makes complete sense that Ok would beat Tai Lung in their final fight, po at the beginning of the film was established to have supreme knowledge of kung fu he learnt the wuxi finger hold on his own, and he was established at the start to have powerful fat, mantis couldn't find his nerves underneath all of that fat, and Tai lungs weakness was his obsession wirh the scroll which Po exploited so it makes complete logic sense that Po was able to defeat him to say otherwise is to ignore all the set up that the writers did in making sure it all makes sense.
I always thought, too, that Tai Lung struggled dealing with Po's unusual fighting style, he hadn't ever dealed with an opponent like that
The plot armor twist is the best one, the others can feel cliche if not done properly. Monologue trap worked for the Lion King tho
The best dhow case if monoliging is in incredibles because syndrome said to him "you got me monoliging"
I just wish more villains were written well like lord shen and win too.
I think a lot of times the monologue downfall is also directly tied to the Pride downfall
i will never be able to say how much i love bad endings
These Villains are the closest to perfection...
General Grevous is a perfect example
You can make a whole SERIES of this based on action movies with “serious” actors in place of action stars. When you have someone playing a character who they can’t fully move like, you get more than just “we can see the stunt double”. You also get choreography contrivances like The Protagonist Throw, The Vulnerable Taught, The Side Character Clutch, Saved by a Nearby Object, The Lethal Ring-out, etc
Plot armor, that’s it.
Its called inner peace rimes with po
genocidical bird and sayin not all villains are so bad is WILD
With the monologue trap you must also realize that characters are often times arrogant and can't help but gloat when they think they've won.
There is no one to humiliate if the hero is dead.
id say ernesto's is still the monologue trap because he loses his fanbase after threatening a kid on television
He didn’t know he was being recorded
What really frustrates me about him js the fact that the family chases him and he could of just easily destroyed the picture but he just Carries on running it's a stupid mistake.
I've heard from people who have real life and death confrontations with evil. The monologue before they shoot you is completely true to life. They literally will sabotage themselves with last minute monologues and gloating confessions, they do it in real life.
Scar also suffers from incompetent henchmen. Instead of killing Simba himself, he leaves it to the hyenas, who fail and lie about it until Simba shows up as an adult.
Yeah that's the only issue with scar , but the caviert to that is that if he gets the hyenas to do it theirs not any blood on his handsm
19:49 This is why Machiavelli advises against leaving a wounded adversary. Enemies should be totally avoided or totally destroyed.
Po was mocked about his fat, than it is what saved him in the end, it’s like a lesson to “always be yourself”
surprised this doesn't include Deus Ex Machina
TBF the kung fu panda one was implied when mantis couldn’t find Po’s pressure points
2:07 scar whispered to Mufasa Long live the king, I get where you were go with the idea about monologuing but Taka was consistent 3:44 Plot Amor & finishing the earned character arc for the child. From Tai long, Shen, Hades, the commander, finally villains getting justice 17:21 The Heel Cena meme touched my soul
You NEED to compare the two Animal Farm movies when the new one comes out
The Annoying Villagers series does a phenomenal job making fun of the incompetent henchman trope
Elite ball knowledge
Disney needs to start making alternate ending videos where the villain wins
I've heard before that if you want a villain to win, the writers did a good job with them--but I'd also say it means they made flaws in the story if the hero has plot armor.
Have you ever considered a channel like this but for anime or video games? I'd be eager to hear your thoughts on villains and heroes in those.
What an interesting topic.
16:14
"It's called a cruel irony... like my dependence on you."
with simba the real problem that he should have worked through his guilt before the end, not completly, but enough that he doesn't end up hanging from a cliff.
No way this guy be dissing my boy kronk
Madara, and erase the alien thingy in general in Naruto
Didn’t work out right in your opinion? Just asking
No way you put Shen & Ernesto on the Thumbnail.
Kronk slander will not be tolerated
*Frank Horrigan has entered the chat.*
12:31 not gonna lie, debatably the most annoying trope of all.
2:40 TDK Joker fell into this one as well. He would’ve blown the two boats up first and then talked about his scars if the directors didn’t step in to make him lose one of his scenarios
I suggest to everyone who can to play the boardgame "Villainous" with friends/family.
Just so you understand first hand how hard it feels to be a Disney villain.
In kronks defense.
Her potions literally look like each other out of from the shelves x-D
10:05
There is no secret ingredient... it's just you.
There's also more villains like Lotso, Chick Hicks, Jackson Storm in a sense, Gabby Gabby
In one of my shitty stories i make in my head when I'm bored, the main protagonist and the main villain end in a ,,draw" (they oof eachother)
With Shen, the whole inner peace was foreshadowed at the start of the movie. As for Ti-Long, realizing that the scroll wasn't the god mode item he thought I feel sapped part of his will to fight. Everything he did in the movie was to claim what was "his".
Its cause and affect set up and pay off.
@try-w5s Yep. You pretty much shortened what I meant to only several words. 😀
Now make how (not) write a rivalry🙏😂
Incredibles not mentioned in the monolog part is criminal safe to say my disappointment is immeasurable and my day is ruined
Most of these aren't even "plot armor saved them", just the characters having flaws/traits that causes the villains downfall. Picked the worst examples possible to make this point since:
Scar wanted to feel superior and did the same thing to Mufasa.
Randall wanted to be better than Sully since forever.
Waternoose has a bit of a case, but honestly who would've expected Mike to get the other peeps to that place so quickly since they ran there.
Peacock literally set everything in motion, letting the soothsayer go due to his emotions. Also, he literally set the scene for his own downfall by doing what he did.
Tai lung was obsessed with the scroll and Po's presure point thing had been explored in an earlier scene.
Hades literally sent a titan after Hercules when he could've just offed him right then and there or just ignored him since Herc wouldn't be able to participate in the take over.
Kronk is dumb and hung, and to his credit, the folded paper did look like a skull. Seriously, who organizes everything to look the same when they do vastly different things? Thats just calling for accidents.
Ernesto has little to no creativity, thats why he took credit for all the songs. Why would someone literally make a movie of a crime they comitted and not expect a fanboy to connect the dots.
The last guy literally got too greedy for his own good.
Everyone just likes to use the plot armor argument for everything and it's grating
I think with Scar, he's being cocky, and he thinks he's won. So he didn't think revealing the truth would be stabbing himself in the back
9:04 Everytime I see this guy I think of that one limbo meme from geometry dash like this part at 11:05
Im actually under the impression that Ezma actually likes having kronk around due to his cooking, he's even able to convince her to dessert and coffee before taking kuzco out of town. Thats why she puts up with his flaws.
Kronk can't be blamed. She failed to label the potion cabinet. So she can only blame herself.
Nothing can defeat plot armor, everybody knows this.
WRIGHT A STORYTELLING BOOK ALREADY!
Atlantis: The Lost EMPIRE
YES I agree
2:06 I still wanna know how tf did bro get up back from there, let alone that quickly 😅
How (NOT) to Write the Perfect Hero
If po didn't have plot armor the movie, and series would end there
1:49 And that's why you shouldn't eat bugs, kids
Pride comes before the fall
knrok is so harmless🥰
Inner peace was whar allows Po to hear shen it aint plot armour its cause and affect the writers established that anything is possible of you have inner peace and it gets played off in the final battle.
8:37 Baisically Nami fights in One Piece
On paper it shouldn't work. But when done right it does. I don't know how.
I've read a book "Eye of the Needle" and it did it even worse. I was really enjoying reading about the ever dexterious master spy until he experienced a brain flop, started making dumb mistakes and was defeated in a stupid way. (not including the details so I don't spoil it for those who want to read that book)