REWATCH: Star Wars Episode VI Return of The Jedi- The Sith Council:
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- Опубликовано: 18 сен 2024
- tar Wars The Empire Strikes Back was released in May of 1980 is widely regarding as the best. Star Wars movie of all time. Luke Skywalker, Han Solo, Leia, Darth Vader, Chewy, Yoda, Lando all shine . It was a the sequel to the one that started it all.. On this episode of REWATCH, Kristian Harloff and Steph Sabraw return after our hiatus to breakdown the classic, Episode V. How will this film tie into the upcoming series?
#starwars #returnofthejedi #EpisodeVI
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I took it that Luke threw his lightsaber because the Emperor wanted Luke to strike him down in anger, so that Luke can turn to the Dark Side. By throwing away the saber, he was willing to die instead of be consumed by the Dark.
That's how I took it, too. That he was so committed to not turning that he throws his weapon away to avoid even the temptation of striking at Palpatine in anger/hate. As a kid, I was baffled at that decision, too, but as I got older, this is how I understood that.
I mean I get it but it is still your weapon for protection.
@@TheKristianHarloff I think it was mainly intended as a story telling device. Practically speaking, like you said, it dumb.
It's the same as when he willingly fell to his assumed death after Vader told him he was his father in Empire. It's Luke showing that he would rather die than join the dark side. He even told the emperor that he would soon be dead, and you with me. Luke never expected to survive his trip up to the Death Star in the first place.
I felt like he threw it for dramatic effect more than anything.
Not to slam his directing(which was fine) but Richard Marquand's greatest contribution to the saga was convincing George Lucas to make ILM storyboard artist Nilo Rodis-Jamero the costume designer for ROTJ. The Emperor's guard, Biker Scout, Rebel Commando, Imperial Dignitaries, Leia's slave outfit, etc. All iconic.
Facts
Harloff at 12:57 you broke my brain when you said I don’t understand why Luke threw his lightsaber. That moment was the exact moment when Luke became a true Jedi. The reason why the film is called…Return of the Jedi. Luke even says it at that exact moment. I AM A JEDI, LIKE MY FATHER BEFORE ME. Throwing his lightsaber was the most Jedi example Luke could have done.
Eh, "This lightsaber is your life" -Obi-Wan
@@TheKristianHarloff No doubt about it
…but what Luke does at this moment (throwing his lightsaber) goes against the fallen bloated Jedi order of the prequels…Yoda and Obi-WAN’s half truths and manipulations to serve their own interests…Luke delivered “The Last Jedi” lesson that his father never learned from Yoda or Obi-Wan…A care beyond themselves…It’s not about a green, blue or red lightsaber…or adventure as Yoda says. His love for his father was greater than any lightsaber. The Emperor could never understand that and that’s why Luke unarmed himself and followed the true Jedi way.
@@TheKristianHarloff the force is used for knowledge and defense never for attack. -Yoda
Luke throwing away the lightsaber is the most Jedi thing that's ever happened in all nine films
I think it’s important and powerful that he throws it down. I think at that moment Luke sees what Vader has become and what he can become if he goes through with this, and how easy it is to succumb to the dark side. When the Emperor starts egging him on, it hits him that this is how it happens. He basically says “I’ll bet that’s what you told my father all those years ago, and he may have gone along with it, but I’m not playing your games anymore”
I still love this movie. A great close to a epic trilogy
It is a great trilogy.
Empires best for me but jedi has some of the most important and memorable moments from the whole saga
Great moments.
This is THE #1 Star Wars movie for me. Hands down. Luke is my favorite character and this was the first Star Wars movie I saw in theatres. The dark outfit, the green saber, the speeder bikes, biker scouts, everything in this movie clicks for me. Luke was treated horribly in the sequel trilogies, but The Mandalorian got it right. That's the version of Luke we all wanted to see after ROTJ just like Vader in Rogue One. We never saw Vader and Luke at the height of their power.
It is a great one!
“You were right about me, tell your sister… you were right” that line right there should have made Rian Johnson scrap his version of Luke in TLJ.
The Luke who nearly killed Vader when he threatened to turn Leia to the Dark Side? Also Lucas was the one who came up with the bitter Luke who exiled himself and was disillusioned with the Jedi in his original Episode 7 treatment
@@Mokkari77 yup
@@Mokkari77 why did luke become disillusioned in George's version?
Facts
@@Mokkari77 Ive always been a fan of disillusioned Luke as a CONCEPT. But it was HIGHLY dependent upon execution. I think many fans had a problem with TLJs execution of the concept and so they blame the concept. I don't think ANYONE would have been upset if we had just gotten the Luke we expected. Oh, well. "If you play with fire," right?
I think it was very smart and creative of Lucas to have his films "rhyme". It allows you to watch both Luke and Anakin be confronted with the same problems. Some times they chose the same path and lost a hand. Ultimately they are confronted with choosing whether to kill their downed opponent and their choices end up deciding the fate of the galaxy. Great stuff!
Thank you!
A fascinating discussion as usual from Kristian and Steph. I'd only take issue with one thing- I think that Kristian's dismissal of Richard Marquand and his contribution to the movie and Star Wars is a little unfair. I think that the issue is that Marquand died tragically young, so that the fans never really got to know him or hear his side of the story. Kershner lived to old age and was an enthusiastic contributor to the interviews/ conventions / DVD commentaries etc. to the end. Marquand never had that opportunity, and that's a terrible shame. So this myth has propagated that ROTJ was essentially ghost-directed by Lucas himself, and that Marquand has unfortunately been rather marginalised because of it.
In fact, Richard Marquand was a highly talented filmmaker in his own right (Jagged Edge is a superb thriller - if you've never seen it, then you should). And many of his decisions regarding the design, costumes, and the visual style of the movie have continued to be used in the Star Wars films of subsequent decades (interestingly, Marquand was not a particular fan of Empire, calling it 'mediocre' and 'not a well costumed movie'.) Marquand wanted to bring the fun of the original back. The Yoda scene is only in the movie because Marquand insisted on it. Ian Mcdiarmid's casting? Marquand (the original actor fell ill with the flu on the day of shooting - how different would the history of Star Wars be if he hadn't, one wonders?). And so on.
Richard Marquand, for the saddest of reasons, will always be something of an enigma to Star Wars fans , but he deserves a lot more credit than he actually gets for ROTJ.
I understand all your points, thank you for sharing.
@@TheKristianHarloff no problem at all Kristian, I know that you're not the kind of commentator to be wilfully unfair to any creative individual, let alone a Star Wars contributor. It's just that Marquand's early passing has, I think, led to his contribution being rather under-represented in the discussion around the movie.
I'm sure that you've already read them, but J.W. Rinzler's 'Making Of' books for the trilogy did go some way to redressing the balance in this regard.
Vader taunting Luke with Leah turning to the Dark Side in the throne room LightSaber fight is great even though Luke throws his Saber away and the Williams score is so epic.
Kristian's never looked better, than in that thumbnail...
Ha thanks
@@TheKristianHarloff love that you finally put this over the cinematic shiz stain that is rogue one.
TSC- Wonderful job guys was a lot of fun reminiscing about the movie after all these years, I was never crazy about the original ending, when the special edition came out, I not only repurchased to replace the VHS Tapes with DVD's to have the preferred updated version. " May The Force Be With Us All"
Kristian, about your question about if Han Spends time on the Falcon in this movie, they leave Tatooine in it as Luke leaves with his X-Wing, but there's no actual footage of Han in the ship, just a shot of the 2 ships flying away then Han speaking to Luke on the radio. There is a deleted scene though of them arriving back at the Falcon in the middle of a sandstorm
Yes! I rewatched after this show!
This was my favourite Star Wars movie as a kid because of all the action. Before I got deep into the Jedi lore, Star Wars was all about the space battles and the ships/vehicles.
As I got older and more into the mythology it dropped being Empire and eventually New Hope as well but that's not taking anything away from this movie which is still closely behind the others in this trilogy.
The thing about that soldier being Rex is that of course it's a retcon but I don't see a problem if that's indeed now canon. Rex may know a lot from the past but he's not in the inner circle of the main characters from these movies and Ahsoka isn't a Jedi anymore and is off on her own adventures. Therefore, bringing her up to the rebel hierarchy would make no difference. For all we know she could have asked Rex to stay silent/keep her out of the conflict or possibly even gone off the radar with Rex not knowing where she is or if she's even alive.
Also, the stuff regarding Obiwan I don't have a problem with either. Technically he did take it upon himself to train Anakin (yes, at the request of his dying master) but against the wishes of the Jedi Council at first until Yoda agreed in the closing scenes of Phantom Menace. Obiwan also massaged the truth a few times when speaking to Luke to manipulate/direct him into taking a certain path and this was evident before the prequels came out. So I think there's always been plenty of wiggle room with the dialogue where context can be applied to these decisions which can be interpreted in different ways.
Great points! Thank you!
I love the rewatching of these movies because I am a fan and they are my favorite movies ever. The knowledge you and Steph is amazing
Thank you!!
I know Jedi isn't the best one but I can't help but call it my favorite. So much love for the movie. That being said, GOOD GOD the special edition took it down a notch.
Yeah favorite and best made film are better.
Every last addition in the Jedi special edition was terrible. George Lucas should have been flogged publicly, even moreso than having Greedo shoot first. At least in the other two films they added some good with the bad. Not so this one.
I saw this movie the night it came out back in 1983. I still have the program that they sold in the theater to go along with the movie. I had this ranked above A New Hope after I saw it. Now, I've moved A New Hope in front of it. I loved all of the Han and Leia moments in this film. I was thrilled she was the one to unthaw him. I thought the stuff with Luke in the Emperor's throne room was intense. My best friend and I were on the edge of our seats. The music during those scenes enhanced the drama. I was also convinced that Lando and the Millennium Falcon were not going to make it out of the Death Star battle because of the scene where Han said he felt like he'd never see his ship again. I'm glad I was wrong, but wasn't it written in one of the early drafts of the script that the Falcon didn't make it out before the Death Star blew?
Hmm that one I am not sure if I heard.
I missed this when you released it but its kind of funny hearing you guys discuss Obi-Wan and your expectations for show and what we actually got. I love these rewatch shows though.
Thank you!
Never had an issue with Luke choking Jabba's guards really as he only disabled them to defend himself. Very different to Vader choking people to death.
I agree, I don't have an issue with it. Just not traditional Jedi.
@harloff, the reason Lucas couldn't use Hollywood directors as in Spielberg, Lucas would not put the opening credits at the beginning of the films,. I read this many yrs ago.
He was also part of the union which was the big no
@@TheKristianHarloff yes, that's what I was getting at. 👍
I hear people say all the time that the Jabba stuff is one film, and the rest of is another. But Kristian, you were right. We really get to see what Luke has become here.
The plan is not good. But I think the main point is that Luke is trying to give Jabba the opportunity to repent, until finally it's "Free us, or die." I think this is the way Luke understands being a Jedi, where violence is a last resort.
Yeah he def deals in absolutes!
My 2nd fav film of the whole series. I still remember going into my backyard acting out the Vader moments LOL - While the film is my #2.... it does actually have my favorite moment in all the films. And is a very small, but powerful moment. The scene where Vader and Luke talk in the hallway The "It's too late for me son" - such a small little scene that has so much emotion and power.... and the best shot IN that scene is Vader goes to the window and looks out at the forest moon of Endor... Even wearing a mask I can actual see his emotion thru that dark mask as he flashes thru the mistake he made. Ep 3 makes that scene even stronger now... now when I watch that scene of Vader looking out the window I see his mind filled with Ep 1,2 and 3 moments. In a series full of amazing effects and action... Vader looking out that window is much more powerful and actually makes me cry. I can't wait to see Hayden return as Vader/Ani in the Obi-Wan (before 4) and Ahsoka (after Jed) series to see more of my favorite character in the series. Vader is such a deep tragic character.
It really does have a great impact for sure.
@@TheKristianHarloff Hayden returning to Star Wars in Obi-Wan and Ahsoka as Vader and Anakin.. I'm gonna lose it. lol
I laugh my motherflipping ass off everytime you do the Anakin creepy stare thing. Also the emperor weird faces hahaha.
Am I wrong? Haha
@@TheKristianHarloff Absolutely not man haha. Me and my dad always point them out too, especially Palpatine. Classic.
A long time ago in a house near, nearby, „Return of the Jedi“ became my very first contact with Star Wars. I remember fondly how we kids snuck into the living room, when the parents of my neighbour watched that movie. It must have been at some point during the first 20 or 30 minutes, if my diminishing recollection of that time doesn't deceive me.
It was one of those early „what the heck?!“ experiences, watching that somewhat disgusting Jabba creature talk in tongues never heard, while some guy in a block on the wall got rescued by a mysterious figure sporting some odd „thermal detonator“. Crazy creatures all around - everything felt so alive - input overload - mind blown!
It didn't take long until I got to see the rest of the movie, so where shall I begin?
First and foremost „Return of the Jedi“ has been my first contact with Star Wars and that'll never change. However this movie has become a bit of an elevator-entry of the saga for me, moving up and down the ranks of the entire saga. During the early years it was my absolute favourite of the original trilogy. The space battle was great. Also I absolutely loved Endor for its setting, that insane speeder bike chase (which completely tricked my mind in 80s) and even the Ewoks (including the adorable Wicked). Of course it was cool to see some lightsabers being crossed and that incomplete deathstar just looked much more menacing in its rugged shape than the finished original one.
Kenner action figures included, „Return“ was my introduction into the world of fairitaly space adventures. And yes, we actually played with the figures...a lot! Blissful days!
By the way, I actually find it quite remarkable these days, how much time the movie actually spends on Tatooine and the rescue of Han. By today's standards this compares to an entire episode of the Mandalorian and it's quite peculiar how organically the saga film's work if you try to break them down into 40 minute-ish episodical chapters.
Fast forward to 2021 - roughly 35 years of experience and numerous rewatches under my belt, I must say „Return of the Jedi“ generally holds up pretty well after climbing the ladder up and down for over three decades. Yes, it contains some debateable elements that deteriorated over time, but they get balanced out by all the deep layers and coherencies you just don't fully get when you're a kid. There's always something new to be learned, a new context, a tiny detail - even today with the expanding Star Wars universe. It's an age realated focus shift that keeps this movie afloat in the pantheon of the greats!
The Ewoks in general are an interesting element in that respect. Cute little teddybears with savage undertones and a perfect example of how Star Wars tailors parts of its universe for kids. While Leia and Wicked have an awesome screen presence together in their first scene, the Ewoks in general are a great tonal anchor for us (now) older kids. Even if these pals seem a bit silly to us today, the Ewoks allow us see and appreciate the newer movies through the eyes of a younger audience, because we were that audience back in the days! That being said, some of those poor Ewoks still die a horrible death, which again isn't all that kid compatible after all.
Talking about „Return of the Jedi“ in a more visual sense, of course some effects aged more gracefully than others. While Jabba is still a marvelous achievement in the field of practical effects, that glorious speeder bike sequence of old lost a bit of its mojo over time. The rancor has aged as well. Back then it was a terrifying and believeable sequence. Now it is one of these moments in the movie to resort to some blissful suspension of disbelief. On the other hand I admit, I wouldn't wan't the rancor any other way. I suppose if they did it in CGI, like certain other additions, we would've long been having Don Corleone pop up, quoting his famous line: „Look how they massacred my boy“. It was a boy, or was it?! ;)
This is actually a nice segue to some of the not so successful changes in the special edition. We have to talk about Sy Snootles and the Max Rebo band - or actually we don't! Out of all the special edition changes this infamous scene looks and feels brutally out of place. It absolutely kills the mesmerizingly dark and dense atmosphere of Jabba's palace in that moment. Perhaps they would have gotten away with it, if they came up with a more sombre tune (smoky jazz club style) but as the scene unfolds, it's feels like a discarded snippet of „Monsters, Inc.“ from the lost and found office - but enough of THAT, let's talk (about) FETT (baby)!
I never really minded Boba Fett going out in the unceremonious way he did. Sometimes you just don't see it coming. What's far more interesting is the inherent philosophical debate you can lead about deaths and fake deaths in movies. Like in many older movies one of the strong points of the original trilogy were some of the certainties that came along with it. Rebels good, empire bad, and if someone dies on screen, he's probably quite dead. Things were so much simpler back then, as far as it goes for the movies and there were stakes. Today those stakes are constantly diminished. There's always some smart writer coming up with an excuse why character xyz lives to fight another day. I must admit, as someone who isn't invested in the books or comics, Boba Fett has always been dead to me from the moment he fell into that pit. It never occurred to me that he might have survived until people talked about it online. So I wasn't all that big on the idea of Boba Fett returning to the screen in „The Mandalorian“. I wasn't in for another fake death, we've gotten so used to as of late (hello MCU / oh hi, Maul / greetings, emperor Palpatine). I really thought that chapter was done.
However, as it turned out, the return of Boba Fett actually was executed in a clever and convincing way, so it's one of the few „miraculous resurrections“ that kind of make sense with all the armour and gadgets he has at his disposal. Also the way Boba Fett got reintroduced and the way his character was written are some of the strongest moments in Star Wars.
Does Star Wars need fake deaths in general? No! Was it necessary to have Boba back? No! Did he return in style? Absolutely! But that's down to good writing and not just for the sake of it - that's why it worked so well. I really hope they don't run overboard in the future and bring back too many other „assumed dead“ characters (like Mace Windu). A good story needs stakes, not plot armour (pun intended). Give us new characters and flesh them out!
Moving on to the „Rex situation“, I agree with you, Kristian. It sounds very far fetched that the old bearded trooper on Endor was Rex. He just wasn't. It's a convenient coincidence that got made up to create some extra connectivity, but I'll take it. What I disagree with you is the „Ahsoka wasn't mentioned“ part. We don't know what happend off-screen and it wasn't all that important to mention her during the battle of Endor. The characters had other problems at hand that required their immediate attention. The same goes for Vader. It was all about his son Luke during his final moments, why would he bother with a long gone padawan from the other side of the force at that particular moment? Despite the fact Ahsoka didn't exist when „Return“ got filmed, it would have distracted from the core conflict at hand. To me it's alright for us as the audience to have the knowledge about Ahsoka from other sources, so we don't need to be reminded by the movie that there's another deep layer hidden behind the mask.
Anyway, the absolute climax and heart of the film lie(s) in the final act - that final confrontation, the seduction, the desperate rebel attack, the tension and an Ian McDiarmid at the absolute top of his game - only rivaled by the opera house sequence in „Revenge of the Sith“. It's immensely powerful and still holds up to all the high standards by which it's measured! Perhaps it's even a bit too strong, as it became a bit of a template for other Star Wars content to riff on it in one variation or another - be it at the end of „Rebels“ or the ending of „The Rise of Skywalker“. Even the looking glass in Snoke's throne room in „The last Jedi“ brings on a more recent variation of the emotional pressure Luke had to endure, while the rebels held off the overwhelming imperial forces in „Return“.
What finally hammers the movie home is the overall atmosphere of the sets as well as its prop- and character/costume designs. Palpatine's throne room in particular! A dark, bleak and cold-hearted masterpiece, perfectly encapsulating the dehumanized ruthlessness of the emperor, illustrating Luke's literal trip into the „heart of darkness“. Of course Jabba's palace look equally awesome. It even gained from the special edition in form of that one establishing exterior shot. I guess we can call it even with the horrendous song scene. And there's so much more: the barges, the imperial shuttle craft, speeder bikes, the sarlac pit, gamorrean guards, Bib Fortuna, Salacious Crumb, Leia's and Lando's bounty hunter costumes...all iconic integral parts that shaped the look and feel of Star Wars for decades after release and decades still in the future.
It's also fascinating to see, how many elements of the movie have been fleshed out further over time from what the movie originally offered at face value. With Star Wars ever expanding today, even the old movies are still like living, breathing entities, growing from the material surrounding them - for better or for worse.
Anyway, these are just my humble thoughts before we dive into the final trilogy part of the saga that still has to prove its own legacy.
(Apologies for any mistakes if you find them, it's a very long text today)
WOW! Thank you for sharing this and taking the time for such a passionate and detailed response!!
The Family Guy spoof has a great take on Yoda's death. "Luke..." "yeah" "Luke..." "uhuh" "Luke..." "right here" "Luke..." "haven't gone anywhere"
Hahaha
Luke fails a lot. Shoots controls that would extend a bridge, gets jumped by a Wampa, loses his gunner, crashes his X-wing, rushes into a fight with "Vader" at the Cave then rushes off to fall into Vader's trap anyway, gets his hand cut off, has to get saved by Lando/Leia/Chewie, gets captured by Jabba, gives away that he has a twin sister, and nearly falls to the Dark Side. It doesn't ultimately matter that he has powers, he's a hero because he faced a ton of adversity, learned from his mistakes (and his father's), and believed in his father so much that he showed him it was possible to stand up to the Emperor, the living representation of the evil that had corrupted him. That alone makes it a top 2 SW film for me.
I def see the points here!
After he first read the ROTJ script in England Harrison Ford said to the filmmakers "I guess you really like Luke, huh?"
Hahaha
I dunno about my favorite, personally, but I’d say it’s up there.
After the first Star Wars Lucas thought he could just let other directors shoot the sequels oversees while he stayed in America but then Empire(which he was financing himself) went over budget and over schedule made him realize he had to be there to oversee the next one. So he was working even harder while his marriage was falling apart so by the time ROTJ was completed Lucas was done with making more Star Wars movies for a while.
Yeah but I wish Kirshner would have done Jedi!
@@TheKristianHarloff I think there was a problem with the Directors Guild plus he said he was just worn out after making the movie. ROTJ was still going to have Ewoks and a lesser role for Han. Marquand pretty much came up with what happens in Jabba's palace in the story meetings and chose the red squid alien design to be Admiral Ackbar.
There is so much to love in this film. Weirdly enough, it might be the one I've watched the least of the first 6 films. And yet, through general SW canon osmosis, it is still in my top 5 films. I'm a prequels guy, so my opinions are skewed. That said, instead of the normal Christmas films I'd watch, I'm planning on having my own SW rewatch in December. So thanks for that SEN Network. 😊
Glad to hear it!
Nothing wrong with being a prequels guy. I didn't care for TPM when it came out but i really enjoy it now in the context of the first 6 films. Clones is actually my least favorite of the first two trilogies but when it came out, i was one of those people that flipped their minds when i saw Yoda bust out his saber. I still enjoy it, but not as much as the other 5. There is a lot to love in the prequels and it paved the way for the truly incredible Clone Wars series.
Circa 1987 when I was 12, I recorded Empire Strikes Back and Return of the Jedi from HBO when they would play them back to back. I always thought it was weird they never had New Hope on there, but It was always just Empire Strikes Back and Return of the Jedi. Anyway for years when I would watch that VHS, I would never just watch one or the other movie, it was always both, so for me it was always just one really long movie that played one right into the other, and back then they played all of the credits without starting the next movie. Then in 1995, I got the trilogy on the VHS box set for Christmas, and it was never the same when I had to switch out VHS tapes between Empire and Jedi. Now I can watch Jedi stand alone, but I always have kind of a hard time watching Empire without then also watching ROTJ.
Thank you for sharing this memory!
Lmao your impressions are so on point. Saw Guerrera, Yoda, Sidious…dude, you got me actually chuckling out loud 😂 but yeah ROTJ has so many memorable scenes in so many different landscapes that for me, it just shoots up as my favorite. On any given day, it’s a toss up between Rogue One and ROTJ as my favorite in the franchise.
Thank you!
Han was so trusting of lando because Han and chewie were in the same cell and chewie told him everything that happened
Yup!
Such a fun movie. One thing I noticed coming off of watching empire is how different the portrayal of Vader is. He is at his absolute most menacing in empire, and I felt that from very early on in Jedi he appears softer. Or, at the very least, doesn’t get any “oh shit, did he just do that?” Moments. Makes sense if you’re trying to sell the redemption I suppose but in looking at the whole Vader corpus, what we get the in OT is not that much peak/prime Vader. New hope he has his moments, but as you guys point out is clear second fiddle to Tarkin. Empire he’s a boss. Then in Jedi he quickly becomes sympathizable. Rebels, Obi Wan, and Rogue one actually add a lot to the villainous lore of Darth
I always cry at the end, EVEN with the creepy smile haha it's just a sweet simple happy ending, and it also makes me hate with a passion the ending of episode 9. ROTJ is such a good conclusion to the whole saga, the way it balances the space battle, endor and lightsaber fight it's perfect. And like you said Palpatine is such a great character and Ian McDiarmid plays him SO well, and how Luke kinda puts an end to solving the conflict with violence, he proves he's the ultimate Jedi, it's like he single handedly returns the "religion" to its core values. Basically the greateness of this movie is the reason why the whole sequel trilogy is a mess, I could never hate it but it destroys so much of what the OT built. Anyways, awesome episode as always and looking forward to the sequel breakdown!
Thank you! Right around the corner!
Hayden's creepy look is why I wish they kept Sebastian Shaw's Force Ghost. He looked so much more jovial and proud. 52:00 I didn't realize that happened with this film, but you can definitely tell George Lucas did the same thing for Red Tails.
True
@@TheKristianHarloff also, am I the only one that preferred the special edition victor celebration ending over the Yub Nub song?
Watched it tonight after not seeing it in years. It's interesting hearing some of your qualms (light ones) about the movie but they don't affect your overall enjoyment. For me I like the character development with Luke but there was just too much stuff with the Ewoks. They should've trimmed that and given more to the death star battle and Luke/Vader fight.
Return of the Jedi always makes me think of How I Met Your Mother when Jason Segel says, "I don't know why people are so cynical about Ewoks. The Rebellion would have failed without them." Classic. I love RotJ. I get some of the issues people have with it, especially the god awful special edition adds, but the cinematography, use of color, and emotional weight in the fight between Vader and Luke is absolutely incredible to this day. That Williams score when Luke starts going ham on Vader is one of the best music cues in film history.
Music is untouchable
Obi wan did take it upon himself, he said to Yoda at the end of the film he would train him with or without the councils permission in TPM
I'm saying! Frustrated me when they spoke of that
Eh I mean sure.
@@TheKristianHarloff ik it's not perfect! But it is there
@@TheKristianHarloff Totally with you. Obi should have found the boy and spent the remainder of TPM trying to convince the Jedi of his awesomeness. Would have given Obi such more juice right off the bat.
That thumbnail.
Sorry, I don’t have anything witty or original,
but still...it’s just so good.
Ha thank you, thank Bryan Ward!
red v green lightsabers fight and crossing in front of palp is dope
Well there ya go!
On Kristian’s point about Jedi basically becoming superheroes with their powers now, I wonder if they’ll introduce something like lead for Superman where maybe they don’t sense things properly. I guess Beskar is something that challenges the lightsaber in terms of battle.
We shall see!
The thing that bothered me far more than Vader now screaming Nooo in the special editions was Anakins force ghost change my dad and I hate it because Anakin never died young when he was redeemed to the lightside he simply died as an old man, the change was dumb cause if that was the case then obi one and yoda should have became a young force ghost, but idk it is what it is
Yeah, rules wee always changing.
Call me crazy but the special edition of this movie (outside of the added Vader “NO”) is lit. And I will forever say that the ending celebration music in the special edition is better than “Yub Nub”
You like the band part at Jabba's?
@@TheKristianHarloff yeah that song slaps too
Great Episode. For me RotJ has always been my number 1. I agree about the jabas palace concert scene. No need for it. But I enjoyed a lot of the other additions like the herd of banthas moving freely in the desert. I also enjoy the deleted scenes like Luke constructing his Green Lightsabre and them returning to their ships after rescuing Han. Yes Han only spends a moment on the Falcon this movie.
Thank you for listening!
Hell yes the final star wars movie
Haha
The final saga film. Indeed.
what did you think of the original outline for return of the jedi that Gary Kurtz wanted to do??
Refresh my memory.
@@TheKristianHarloff no second death star and ewoks, han solo dies, emperor had a volcanic throne room. sorry bad at explaining something this magnitude 😅 but just look up "Gary Kurtz Return of the Jedi"
what you were saying about Rex went over my head. he clearly didn't exist in 1983. As far as Vader's line "Obi-Wan once thought as you do" i've always taken that to mean Luke's adherence to the light side of the Force.
Yeah who knows where it goes
Speaking of the Ewoks....Splinter of the Mind's Eye.. you can see the initial versions of Georges orig outlines for the story arc...race changes: Yuzzem...then thinking Wookies...and then ended up Ewoks. An early version of Kyber Crystals..."Kaiburr" I read that book so much after the orig star Wars, when the movies came out, who knew I was reading behind the scenes developmental history...it was such a different fun "back then" lol
Yup
I've always been under the impression, well since tpm anyway, that Obi-Wan blames himself for Anakin because he defied the council to train Anakin. And I think Luke throws the saber because he truly believes they're all dead anyway, but saving his father's soul was more important than saving their lives
Kristian, can you do a video or recomendation of some OLD Starwars canon material? I want to explore good non Disney Starwars material.
Well there is NO non-Disney canon. Do you mean legends?
@@TheKristianHarloff Yes legends that you consider essential to a starwars fan to read or learn about that has nothing to do with Disney canon.
I like that "Nik Sant" is Rex, I think it works well enough and Ahsoka is, at least to Rex, still presumed dead from Season 2 of Rebels. If he ever finds out before hand though... that could complicate things.
Fair enough!
George created a story that definitely got bigger than him and his sense of humor (for kids) almost killed the story. I guess I like the serious Star Wars or better said, when the humor is part of the characters and story. Thank goodness for the shows. Another great review.
I am also one for the more serious side of Star Wars for sure. And TV is the future!
They definitely leave Tatooine in the Millennium Falcon and X-Wing. I just always remember how cool it was to see them fly right behind one another then split off. And yes, thank you for pointing out how goofy Han was in this movie. I don’t believe Ford was phoning it in, but it was like he almost became a different character. Though the movie is important in various story and character arcs, it goes to the bottom half of the 12 movies for me. Definitely not the worst, but I don’t like it as much as everyone else does.
Yeah they did, rewatched.
I have a wild theory about obi wan, what if the do like a “current” story to the time period this is set place but have flashbacks every episode to like a clone wars mission of anakin and obi wan. That way Haden can be in most episodes and it could even tie into what Obi wan’s doing. Love the discussion every show
I wonder, but we will get a lot of flashbacks in Boba I think.
Obi Wan wasnt forced to train Anakin, like he says in this movie, i took him and trained him, because he was willing to fullfill a promise to his master which he respected so much, Obi Wan could easily said Nah i wont train this kid, but he thought he was going to honor Qui Gon by doing it, the thing is that in this movie he never mentions that it was because a promise to his old master, so thats why the confusion
Yeah I guess?
@@TheKristianHarloff also Filoni has said it many times, in episode 1 was duel of the fates because was the fate of anakin, Qui-Gon was the father figure that anakin needed, Obi Wan was more like an older brother to him
I can Never Get Over the Ewoks defeating a Mechanized Armored Division of Imperial Soldiers.
Just like the United States didn't get over being defeated by the Vietcong.
or the Taliban or any group that wears sandals really
@@Mokkari77 If our goodie goodie politicians and moral compass allowed us the fight the way they fought us...but America has to be seen as fair and doing what's right when war is the opposite.
Yeah
@@tlmarshall21 A regular army is always going to have problems fighting guerillas on their territory. You think the Soviets couldn't win in Afghanistan because they were too nice? Or Napoleon's Grand Armee in Spain?
My favorite Star Wars movie
It is a lot of peoples favorite!
The Max Rebo Band was in the original version but it was just 3 Max Rebo Sy Snootles and Droopy McCool and the Song was different it was Laptii Nek also what a way to dance around the Gold Bikini
Oh I am very aware that they were in it but not this travesty.
I don't believe it's been 100% confirmed it's Rex. Filoni just showed the image of Rex in the same armor as this guy for season 4 of Rebels. But Filoni never actually said it was him in ROTJ. It was more unspoken that it's him, so I guess it's up to interpretation
I am pretty sure somewhere he confirmed it. www.denofgeek.com/movies/star-wars-rebels-finale-reveals-that-captain-rex-was-in-return-of-the-jedi/
Oh yeah. I think they said Rex was on Endor in the Rebels finale. But I suppose if you want, you can pretend he was some other guy on Endor taking a leak in the forest
The emperor's plan makes no sense , the Ewoks defeating the emperor's troops makes no sense , them bringing back the death star wars was lazy
But the scene were Luke tells the emperor ima jedi like my father before me was top 3 moments in all of star wars
People always forget the Ewoks were losing the battle until Chewbacca and two Ewoks took control of a scout walker.
@@Mokkari77 that shouldn't be all it takes to defeat the empires troops that are literally guarding the death star that the emperor himself is on 😂😂
@@jessieurena7583 There's a deleted scene where the Emperor orders the Death Star commander to destroy Endor so he had a contingency. Anyways it's odd that fans make jokes about Stormtroopers being lousy shots yet still can't believe native warriors fighting on their territory against soldiers who are not camouflaged wouldn't hold their own.
Agreed with all of it
@@Mokkari77 An entire legion of the Emperor's best troops. Why set that up and not pay it off? The problem isn't the Ewoks winning. The problem is its easily the worst fight the Empire's ever waged. Instead of writing it/directing it to make the troops look like clowns, have the troops look like the elite force the Emperor said they were and have the Ewoks be more fierce.
Luke always called Obi Wan by the name Ben Kenobi for respect I guess but when Obi Wan tells Luke “Yoda will always be with you” Luke calls him OBI Wan like in a semi angry way. Such a small detail for me its great.
True
As far as Hayden force ghost goes I agree with Steph that it ties into the entire saga. However, to appease all of the OT fans I wish that Disney + would place the original theatrical trilogy as a choice on their platform. Wishful thinking I know, very doubtful they would ever do that.
Yeah doubtful
God I remember getting the return of the jedi sticker album in August of 83. First sticker I completed Lukes Jedi leap in rancor pit. I was like MUM THIS WAS NOT IN THE MOVIE ! No sometimes Andy scenes get cut out of films. Oh so this when this kid learnt that. But there is so many great scene's that didn't make this movie. General Madine for example had his space battle moment didn't make the film 😢. But I love the line OBI WAN ONCE THOUGHT AS YOU DO ! We are going to see that Kristian 👀
Thank you for sharing your memories! One of my favorite part of this series we are doing is to see how these movies mean to everyone!
@@TheKristianHarloff absolutely to me the orginal trilogy was magic. The only time I felt that again was Rogue One. The prequels and sequels never gave me that feeling.
Actually it has been confirmed it's not Rex in ROTJ
?? Filoni himself confirmed that is Rex...
It was confirmed that it IS Rex, you mean.
It’s a retcon, obviously, but that’s the current canon.
You mean it was confirmed that it is.
@@TheKristianHarloff just so everyone knows, I am not against Rex being at the battle of endor, but every thing I have read said Filoni jokes about it, so I don't know if it's official Canon.
Loved the Boba Fett discussion.
Thank you!
obviously there were changes made, but when Obi Wan says he took it upon himself to train Anakin, I still feel that Obi Wan believes that and it simplifies the story for Luke. Qui Gon died and Obi Wan DID take it upon himself to train Anakin even if it was to fulfill his promise to Qui Gon. He didn't have to train Anakin, he pushed back against Yoda in order to fulfill his promise to Qui Gon.
Sure, I am forgiving of it.
Kristian's gonna be devastated if the "Obi-Wam once thought as you" line isn't referenced in the Obi-Wan series 😂
Truth haha
Unless we find out that Ahsoka dies before RoTJ!
Truth
David Lynch was offered to direct this one but turned it down
Yeah
Rex thought Ahsoka was dead by this point. She was supposed to have been killed when the Sith temple on Malachor blew up. He didn't know Ezra saved her through a time portal because Ezra was lost in hyperspace. Also Rex didn't know Vader is Anakin.
There is No way she did not tell Rex what happened to Anakin after she found out. Rex was just as close to Anakin as he was to Ashoka. She wouldn't have kept that from him. You think Ezra never told anyone that he saved Ashoka in the temple? Ezra getting lost with Thrawn happened way after he saved her. Rex Definitely knew Ashoka lived. He also knew Anakin was Vader. Besides the comics. In Rebels Ashoka talked about it openly towards the end of the series with the ghost crew. She wasn't keeping it a secret and Rex was her best friend, you think she didn't reach out to him after Ezra saved her? NO WAY. Ezra totally expected to hook up with her after he got out of the temple. So why would he keep it a secret that she was alive?
@@superdave452 "Way after"? It was two episodes later! And I assume Ezra didn't tell Rex because he wouldn't believe him unless he saw her himself.
True
Dude your impressions are hilarious 😆
Ha thank you
Also Spielberg recommended Paul Verhoeven to replace him as director but after seeing his sexually explicit film, Spetters, he was like, “never mind,” and withdrew recommendation.
Yeah I think How Star Wars Conquered the Universe covers that?
The numerous things in this film, OG version yeah...Tarzan scream...wtf lol. THAT stayed?! I do love the Harrison story lol.
Right?!
i enjoyed the sequels, a lot. i do feel that this would have been the perfect ending for eps 1-6. it brought the prophecy full circle. Anakin, by killing the emperor, brought peace to the galaxy.
Wonder how the tv shows will fill in gaps.
Harloff, where'd you hear about Harrison Ford defending extras from Marquand on set?
Hmmm not sure.
Finally, the greatest Star Wars movie of all time 👍👍
Haha sure?
C’mon - the metal bikini? Luke in black? Anakin’s redemption? Great movie. The sequels hacks should’ve watched it before they started writing-
I don’t think Luke’s plan was as bad as you frame it.
The droids were not a bargaining chip so Luke wouldn’t have gotten Han back in exchange for the droids.
Droids were thrown in as a “gift of good will” in exchange with an audience with Jabba.
And it worked as a plan to smuggle Luke’s lightsaber on-site, so I think it worked.
Yeah but he was lying, nice guy.
In the manga version of Lost Stars, lucasfilm puts Rex in the war room in return of the Jedi which I consider canon
Oh yea?
@@TheKristianHarloff yeah it’s pretty cool. I also think when you see the son of a former close friend who you haven’t spoken to or of in decades, you usually don’t tend to talk about said former friend. Plus Luke was probably less involved in the war room stuff in btw Empire & Jedi since he had all that training/Jedi stuff to do so Rex & Luke probably didn’t have opportunities to speak to one another. Just what I think. I definitely recommend Lost Stars manga
Unfortunately ROTJ was a sign of what was to come with the prequels.
The special edition additions you mean?
Wrex thinks Ahsoka is dead after season 2 of rebels. But yeah it's little muddy
True
Actually they said that Harrison Ford said he wanted to die in return of the Jedi, not Empire strikes back.
Actually, he wanted to die in both.
@@TheKristianHarloff that is interesting because I have never heard of him wanting his character to die in Empire and when I looked it up before commenting on the video I couldn’t find anything about that. Can you post a link, I am not trying to be difficult or anything and it isn’t because I don’t believe you, but I just want to see it because I am very curious. I have always been very disappointed in how Harrison Ford isn’t a fan of Han Solo and Star Wars, so any quotes from him about any of the Star Wars original movies I find very interesting and fun to look at
@@StarWarsGeek_03 Pretty sure it was in How Star Wars Conquered the Universe book.
@@StarWarsGeek_03 gamerant.com/star-wars-harrison-ford-han-solo-dead/#:~:text=In%20fact%2C%20Ford%20lobbied%20for,idea%20was%20unthinkable%20back%20then.
@@TheKristianHarloff thanks I appreciate it, I really need to get that book, I have been wanting it for a while I don’t know why I haven’t gotten it yet though. Also just want to say I love this channel and all of you who are involved in it thanks and keep up the good work
Haha! Now I need to see a hillbilly Yoda movie with Kristian doing the voice work.
Hahaha
Is there gonna be a force awakens revisit today? @harloff
4PM
@@TheKristianHarloff ok cool, just didn't see a preview post. Thanks.
Call me crazy but I am not a big fan of this movie. The more I see it the less I like it. I actually think revenge of the sith closed out the prequel series better than ROTJ closed out the original trilogy. It just felt so anticlimactic to me.
I agree with you. It’s still decent IMO, but It’s definitely lost it’s luster over the years for me. It was second for me after empire for a long time, but now I would rank it 5th.
ESB
ANH
ROTS
RO
ROTJ
Hey, totally respect the take!
Thank you revenge of the sith , rouge one and force awakens are all better then this imo
To me, ROTS and ROTJ are at the exact same level in terms of quality, but, due to their respective trilogies, ROTS is the better closer...simply because ANH and TESB are two of the greatest films ever made...and TPM and AOTC are...
definitely films.🤗
There……. Is………. Another………… Sky……..walker….. 💀 👻. 20:10
:)
I think it's just a natural issue/problem when a franchise is this long lived that story continuities like Ahsoka still being around the time of Luke or Obi-Wan saying he was instructed by Yoda (though Kristian has pointed out that Obi-Wan doesn't say Yoda was his master) with no mention of Qui-Gon, etc, start to creep in and unless they have massive overhauls of the storyline or inserting unsatisfying throwaway explanations and, even then, you will have fans that complain, I think it's the sort of thing that needs to be given a pass.
Agreed
Ehh, the Obi Wan/Qui-Gonn stuff was completely on George and could have been remedied simply by not creating Qui-Gonn in the first place?
Is it me or is Steph looking uber sultry and hot? AND yes Kristian - the other folks ARE in the Falcon when leaving Tatooine...
Hey I am pretty sultry and hot myself!
@@TheKristianHarloff and of the not nobody can deny Mr Harloff, I just feel Steph and I may have more physical synergy, I hope you don't take that too hard? But yeah keep up the great work, the channel is evolving nicely, Really enjoying the re-watch discussions, though I would say, maybe a touch less "summary of the scenes" of the movies and more emotion, how the movies beats, characters and situations and memories made you feel! You know - then and now! - Let it all out dude! Hope that makes some sense? Peace THP
ROTJ has some amazing highs but overall I think it's become VERY overrated
How? It's incredible. It anything Empire is slightly overrated even though it's a great film. The throne scene with Luke, Vader and the Emepeor is arguably the best sequence in the saga. Jabba scenes are amazing, scenes when Luke surrenders is amazing.
That's fair.
@@SN2903 the plot and a lot of what happens doesn't make much sense. Like the emperor is a complete idiot in this film , the ewoks basically taking down the empire makes no sense and the death star coming back was lazy. Luke's plan in the beginning makes no sense. I've showed a lot of people star wars for the first time they always don't have positive things to say about this movie compared to a new hope and empire. Its a solid movie and it's star wars so I love it but it's a clear drop off from the first two and I think just because the ending is great and it's part of the OT it gets this super nostalgia pass when tbh its not a top 3 star wars movie it just gets lumped in there because it's from the OT
How did you feel watching it now knowing that Palpatine didn't die ?
Well he did, kind of.
It still plays. As we all know, the sequel trilogy is a zany, whimsical "What If..." scenario.
😂
😐
Obi-wan is a liar, it's canon "...from a certain point of view..."
haha true
Return of the Jedi is ok. But I just want so say that I just dont get it with The Mandalorian? Or any of the Star Wars TV shows for that matter? Its alright, but that good? Really? Maybe its just me and TV shows. It might be that I tend to stray towards the cinematic feeling in general. The Mandalorian to me must be one of the most overrated shows ever. Maybe I just dont get it. And I am just not a fan of baby Yoda. And no, I am not lying, at all.
Oh man yeah def different sides of the fence. Madalorian is fantastic and some of the best Star Wars since ROTJ
It's a real shame that people overtime are starting to forget about Sebastian Shaw as the older Anakin Skywalker due to the Special Editions, very much like Jason Wingreen as the original voice of Boba Fett. I still much prefer Anakin to be an older man in the afterlife as a Force ghost, due to the continuity of your spiritual self being portrayed at your death age. I like Hayden Christensen, but I'd much rather have Anakin be represented by Shaw as a Force ghost and his older age.
How are people forgetting about Sebastian Shaw? They only changed the Anakin force ghost. They didn't take him out of his actual scene with Luke on the death star.
@@superdave452 I know that. I’m just saying it’s a shame people only know him as the dying Darth Vader and not as the older Jedi of Anakin Skywalker at the end. Younger generations will only see Hayden Christensen, unless their parents don’t show them the Despecialized Edition of 4K83.
I get that.
@@noahlawson8405 ahh, gotcha