Do 180 gram vinyl records actually weigh 180 grams? I decided to find out!
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- Опубликовано: 11 сен 2024
- How much do 180 gram premium vinyl records really weigh? Are we getting what we pay for? Let's find out...
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I work at a pressing plant and I can say from my experience that it’s actually pretty hard to get any record to the correct weight. We press 140 or 180 gram vinyl and we allow a 10 gram tolerance either direction. I always try and keep my records as close to weight that the customer has ordered, but there are factors that don’t always allow for such things.
Record presses operate using steam for heat and cold water to cool as well as pressure from the hydraulic press. Those are usually set to about 128 bar of pressure. Depending on the temperature inside or even outside of the plant, the presses will behave differently. We have full control over the settings tho, so when environmental factors play into how well or not something is pressing, we can adjust to compensate. The compounds used all have different properties and behaviors. So for instance, a white puck will be hard and rubbery, not easy to work with. This forces the press to have to work a little harder to achieve the desired weight or effect. By contrast, black is usually very pliable and easy to work with. The temperatures these pucks come out of the extruder at are about 125-150 degrees. If we have to stack pucks or make a half and half pressing, then you have to factor in the weight of each puck to combine to a total of about 6-10 grams above the desired weight. This doesn’t always happen due to again the differences in environmental conditions. As the puck cools, it shrinks. So if it comes out as a full 190 grams for example and it’s cold in the plant, within a few seconds, if that puck isn’t used, it’s shrunk by a few grams already.
You can see how seconds and minute changes can affect how a record comes off that press. It’s a constant juggling match to maintain weight and quality.
As a collector, I don’t hear a difference in sound quality with respect to weight. I have records that weigh 120 grams and below all the way up to 200+… it’s just how it is. To charge more for the higher weight is a bit of a scam in my opinion. The ONLY thing I can see making sense is the cost of materials. If there is a large run of a particular album at 180 grams, the company has to burn through more material to process that order. So the customer has to pay more to have the job pressed… to recoup costs, the label has to charge a bit more. So I guess it’s not really a scam. But marketing something as 180 grams and implying it’s superior to a 140 gram pressing of the same album is definitely a scam.
You work at a pressing plant, so I would like to ask you- why has quality control been so abysmal? I'm talking about warped records, particles baked into the grooves, off-center pressings, non fill, IGD? I'm not saying the records YOU press in particular; just new pressings in general.
@lenwennerberg1631 this is what happens in any skilled manufacturing where the worker's knowledge, skill, and experience impact the final product so directly.
Record production dropped off to the point that the world literally lost the majority of trained workers, there's a huge demand (ordering pressings have over a year wait at this point), and no manufacturing QA process can check every object made. IF you check 1% of product coming off a line when making bolts, problems are likely linear... a problem introduced doesn't self resolve, so you can trace back and find all messed up items. If the worker pressing makes a mistake for, say, 10 or 100 out of 5k or 10k... those may not be consecutive or noticed by anyone. The ones randomly checked could still be perfect. No one in that scenario is doing anything nefarious - it's just growing pains.
Some places will absolutely end up "missing" things to keep up with orders, capitalism being what it is, but I think this is just the pain of any manufacturing industry expanding so quickly. My honest expectation is that it will get better as companies invest in capacity and training... though records are likely to get more expensive to compensate.
@lenwennerberg1631 how many new records do you buy a year? How many are like how you have described? Same record label or different.
@@bobodog100 I've bought very few the past few years, because of the issues described above. Admittedly the few I have cherry picked recently, for the most part, I've gotten lucky. But I still regularly read and hear accounts of QC issues from those that do still purchase a fair amount of records.
I've been buying records since the early 80's and the QC was never as close to being as bad back then as I saw in the 2010's. I was genuinely interested in that gentleman's perspective because he actually works at one of these plants.
@@lenwennerberg1631 QA is an impossible job. Demand is so high right now that there are constantly records being made and at frankly alarmingly high volumes. They would need to assign one QA to one press op and have each record inspected as it came off the press. But that would slow production and your wait times for records increases. It’s not feasible. They check every hour, and when something is caught, that batch gets thoroughly checked and tossed out if the problem is present. We are not robots, and mistakes slip through the cracks. It’s hard to press records. It sounds easy, but it’s actually very involved.
Hey Frank, do you have any of those 1970’s RCA Dynaflex records? I’d love to see a sub-100 gram record!
I do! I should have pulled one. I'm curious now to see how much they weigh.
@@Channel33RPM it would drip off the edge of the scale like a slice of cheese
I think this is what's going on:
1. I think the 180g is not the weight of the record, but the weight of the vinyl puck used to make the recorrd.
2. As I think we've all seen, when you press a record, some of the vinyl sticks out of the press and gets shaved off after the vinyl cools.
3. Between the vinyl that you shave off and the weight of the label, you're going to get some variability on the weight of the final product.
4. Considering the sh*t quality of a lot of modern pressings, those less than 120g 80s pressings will probably sound better than a modern 180g pressing.
I like the feel of the 180 gram records. Feels like quality, although the play is never different.
Side Note: I wore one of your shirts to Tennessee and while walking around Gatlinburg sampling some moonshine, I heard someone say, “Frank is cool as F&$k”. I turned to see who said it and a guy smiled and said, “Great shirt man, Keep on Spinnin’ “.
thats great!
That's awesome. Thanks for sharing this story - made my day.
Frank
180 is supposed to give deeper grooves, but I have Dynaflex albums that can blow the doors off some newer 180 pressings. It’s all about mastering and Cutting of the lacquers.
You’re right Frank… 180 gram records do not sound Any better than standard weight records. And I wish I had a dollar for every brand new 180 gram record that arrived Warped! The only thing I think Might be better is that they May last longer, but even standard weight records will last a lifetime if stored properly
The warping is a definite pet peeve of mine.
I'd agree. I've been extremely disappointed with more than a few 180g records I bought that are very warped. So I'm not sure exactly what makes them better.
@@Faustustopheles I have some paper thin 60-70’s pressings that Trounce my 180 gram records sonically and they’re not warped either 😆
@@thomaslytle5519 right! i just think quality control is pretty bad these days.
@@thomaslytle5519 That's mainly because back then they knew how to master for record pressings. The art of pressing was somewhat lost during the CD reign so today there are a lot of bad pressings coming out of these newer plants. But there were also very bad records being pressed too in the 60s, 70s and 80s.
I'm not sure 100% but 180gr refers to the weight of the vinyl puck used when pressing the record. Once the record is pressed with the labels on each sides (which adds weight) and cut, and taking into consideration each vinyl press does not apply the same force, each record will most likely never weigh exactly the same. Also, in my experience, I've always found the thinner 70s and 80s records lacked bass and sounded "thinner" in general compared to thicker records.
Sounds right. This is partially why I expected them to weigh less than 180, but I didn't consider the labels. Good call.
@@Channel33RPM People forget the mastering is key here. A lot of the newer reissues of old stuff that is pressed on 180gr comes from digital masters, even from CDs! 180gr doesn't guaranty you the record is mastered from the original tapes. People need to know what they are actually buying. If the vinyl mastering process is botched, you most likely won't get a good sounding record even if it's pressed on 180gr.
I think the heavier the better. I just like the feel of putting a thicker heavier slab on the table as opposed to a thin flimsy light weight disc. I enjoy the record from a tactile perspective not for tone, I don’t have a setup to appreciate them on that level.
I’m sure it matters if you’re an audiophile and you’re into things like tone arm materials and dampening the chassis, and using weights… But if yours just spinning records through a lower end rig and enjoying the music regular pressings are fine.
6:45 was a but of a jumpscare, maybe the volume of the effect could be a bit lower. other than that, another wonderful and fun video!
I’m not bothered by weight, I actually get really excited when I get a new record that’s standard weight as you hardly ever come across that anymore. But for analogue presses, most of the OG 60s and 70s presses tend to sound the best despite being lower weight. It’s about the source and the mastering chain and cutting tools, back in the day, it was often valve equipment which tended to have a fuller “vinyl” sound. Really great seeing people like Kevin Gray and ERC putting so much effort into reproducing those setups.
180 grams means very little to me as well. I'm always excited about original pressings; some of my older thin records from the 80's sound way better than more modern 180 g pressings or regular reissues. So for records... size (and weight) do not matter imo!
10 years ago I began collecting Bert Kaempfert records and knew nothing about weight differences or that it was even an option. A 50 cent record from the Salvation Army was noticeably heavier and sounded amazing compared to all of the others. It was called Sweet and Gentle and to this day I can't get over how much better it sounds than every other record I own. It's 180 grams, the only record I own that weighs more than 120. So my experience is that there is a definite difference. In this case more bass.
It's funny that 40+ years ago we the kids believed that the thinner the record the better is - high technology, you know...
40 years later, I still prefer the wobbly super-thin vintage vinyl. Probably, just a matter of nostalgia. One practical issue though is that quite often the new vinyl has too narrow center holes, and if it happens, fitting the 180g to spindle takes more effort, all the way to using a conical drill.
I do seek out 180g for those reasons but I also find that 180g records tend to (mostly) be remastered audio. When an album is being remastered or remixed, or both, the label tends to press the album on 180g vinyl, which I like.
I think as a general rule that the quality of the record isn't from the weight rather than the mastering and the pressing plant. For example I believe every record I've gotten from Rhino record plant has been a great sounding record. Just my 2 cents
I'm surprised, I expected all newer vinyl to be way under 180 gm. Pleasantly surprised, thanks Frank.👍
Yes, I would chose the heavy weight over lighter.
When I was a record buying teenager the thing to buy was "imports" that were supposedly better but cost more. Well I bought one and it was warped and the record store would not allow me to return it because it did not skip! Needless to say that was my last import!
Keep up the good work.
I think they do it to charge us more for the record because most people believe it is a premium product
I think a while ago, (particularly in the 2000's when vinyl was still very much a niche market), re-releasing in 180g meant that a pressing had taken the time to properly press and release that version and generally if you saw a pressing was taking the care to press at 180g it was often an indicator that they had also done all the other stuff to make sure the pressing was good. Nowadays, in the vinyl revival, it doesn't mean much and is unfortunately marketed as a gimmick to denote that it is "audiophile" quality, when that doesn't necessarily mean that anymore. I have a number of very thin pressings, particularly from the 80's when record companies were doing their best to cut corners and some sound still good, while others are god awful. I personally still buy 180g vinyl, mostly because I prefer how they feel when I place them on my platter. I don't particularly seek it out nor does it influence my decision if I happen across a good copy of a record I like.
The heavier the vinyl the more premium it feels in your hands. At least that's what I feel. Thanks for your video 😎👍
I like records that flex alittle.
Funny thing, I always weigh my records, after I inspected them for any defects. And mostly the praised weight isn't at hand at all. Most 180 gram records are usually somewhere between 165 and 175 grams. Only a few of my collection (>2500 records) have 180-185 grams. But very few had even 190-200 grams.
I don't seek them. In fact if ordering online, I avoid them as they often will rip the sleeve if its paper or cardboard, and sometimes even the bottom edge of the cover, because of the weight.
Appreciate the video! I've weighed my records out of a similar curiosity and had concurring results. As a matter of opinion, I feel that the 180 gram hype is left over from the "dark days" of vinyl back in the late eighties and early nineties. It seems to me I remember indy labels and a few major labels using it as a value added selling point to illustrate the care and effort put into special vinyl releases. Other than that the only other place I remember weight being used as a selling point was with the Anadisc 200 line MoFi put out in the nineties. With those handful of instances I do feel that quality was held to a higher standard, but only because they were afforded the time to maintain it, as most of these releases at the time, were exceptionally small runs in relatively light product catalogs. Personally, if someone would like to achieve the quality of the Dolton pressings I have from the early sixties that'd be great, but otherwise I'm happy to have whatever I can afford and enjoy. Just my two cents 🙂 Oh, and again "THANK YOU!!!" for all your help recently. Take care, sir!
In my experience of collecting for about 40 years I have only ever had one standard weight lp warped at purchase and none cracked. I have had many 180 gram lps warped and 2 or 3 even cracked up on purchase. So I'm going with it's a marketing ploy to help ease our minds about how much vinyl costs these days. Make us think we are getting superior quality when probably 20% of the newer 180 gram vinyl I buy is warped or busts the spines of the jackets they come in lol
Frank. 18 months ago I had a thin out of my collection & sold some stuff to a local on-line seller I know. One of the albums was the 2lp Heathen Chemistry by Oasis. I'd had the album from new & not played heavily. Each record had not a mark on them, but even so there were a few 'pops'. Before selling (for a good price as copies in good condition are worth a bit) I recorded onto audacity & removed the 'pops'.
Interestingly the two records must have been cut on different machines. One had a definite edge cut at 90° to the playing surface, whereas the other was the usual rolled edge.
And the weight of the discs? Approximately 220g each. 😮
6:45 Those original pressings from the 70's and 80's weighed a lot less than 180g due to the energy crisis and OPEC oil embargo going on back then, so they make a really floppy sound when you shake them. :)
The majority of my collection is from the pre 180 gram era and I find no real difference between them sonically. As for seeking them out, no not at all, usually just coincidence when i get one. Its nice to see some well over 180 but I would rather trade better quality control in regards to scuffing and warping for a few extra grams. Great video!
180 gram records insure a more stability of the record and less wraping wich could create a low noise and depending of the stylus a certain wow effect. I remember when I was young my brother bought a sound system with a turntable. The stylus was strange. First the canteliver was thin and long so when a disc was not flat, I could see the canteliver moving up and down push the stylus point forward and backward. With a flat record the stylus is stable and sound better. Putting a record weight or clamp on your record could render a 105 gram record more stable as well.
I'm like you as I would have guessed e would be getting less than advertised. I'm love the seller point that 180g is less breakable. Speaking as someone who has never broken a record in the 50+ years I've been buying them, I'm now wondering what it take to snap one of these suckers in half. LOL
Of course Sharon will try to make an extra pence or two at any chance possible! Now it makes sense when Ozzy always yells out her name😂
I wonder what an RCA "Dynaflex" pressing would weigh. Those records were so thin you could almost see through them! I hate how RCA hyped those pressings, as if the thinness was a positive advance in record technology, when in fact all they did was use less vinyl to save themselves money. (The records were the same price as heavier pressings, of course.)
Never cared about the weight, as long as the record sounds good. But I can see how it improves the durability of the record so that's a plus
I don't usually look for 180 gram vinyl. I would of loved for you to weigh some from the 50's , 60's and 70's. I believe that in the 50's and 60's, the standards were closer to 140, but would love to know for sure. Good segment. Definitely different take. Loved it.😊
Pay crazy prices for records that are warped 75% of the time. Isnt the 180 geam supposed to prevent that?
Hi Frank Audio quality may not be impacted by weight, I would think that rigidity and longevity are. 105 gram to 180 gram is a significant amount of additional material to maintain use ability and reliability over the life of these amazing records, wouldn’t you agree?
I’ve never noticed a difference in sound quality and I don’t purposefully seek out 180G pressings.
Every 180 gram albums I have is my worst sounding especially the albums split to 2 records. It must be down to the master and modern presses.
GREAT VIDEO FRANK! i have a little obsession about the weight of my records, i prefer 180 grm i dont know why, well 2 years ago i ordered like 7 records in one sitting and when they came the lighter records got warped and one of them unlistenble...
The replies are interesting. Im surprised to hear about so much warping with the 180g records, but I also have not ordered one in the mail.
I have never looked out for it when purchasing records, but I would have assumed it was a sturdier record. Sounds like thats not the case!
The flatness and durability is the only reason I care about 180 gram. I have old paper thin records that sound just as good, but many more of those have warped over the years.
1) I have never found a great sounding heavy pressing. So I stopped wasting my money on them.
2) If you want heavy vinyl, because if feels good in your hand, or maybe it will be a collectible, etc, then by all means, have at it. But I purchase records to play them. And since I have never heard a great sounding heavy record, I gave up on them.
3) It is not the job of the record to support your stylus. If you want your records to sit better and track better, then use a quality record clamp. That will marry the record to your platter, giving your record the effective weight of your platter.
4) Heavy vinyl will raise your tone-arm a bit, throwing off the vertical tracking alignment.
Some tone-arms allow you to adjust the VTA. Depending on the tone-arm, it can be simple, or it can require tools. Either way, it is bothersome.
5) Durability. Yes, it stands to reason that heavy vinyl will be more durable than standard vinyl. But if you take care of your records, they will last longer than you will last, and longer than X generations after you are six feet under.
Anything that will damage a standard record will probably damage a heavy record.
My conclusion is that unless you purchase heavy vinyl for #2, above, then save your money.
Spending more on heavy vinyl for guaranteed medicare sound quality is a lose / lose situation. But if sound quality is of little or no interest to you, then none of my points will pertain to you.
I Love 180 Gram , they feel like a piece of slate . Less prone to being wrapped New out of the jacket .
I do believe that a heavier record makes it less likely to warp. That said I have also seen 180g vinyl with shallow grooves - the eight doesn’t guarantee a good pressing. I would like to to have seen some of those paper thin K-Tel records on the scale as well to see what they actually weigh.
One would think, but Nope. They warp Just as easily
@@thomaslytle5519 I agree! I have many 180 gm albums that are warped right out of the package.
I do not seek out the hundred and eighty gram vinyl. If it comes at way great but I'm not out looking for it lol. Great video of my friend really good, ❤️✌️🎸
Well done, Frank, now I don't have to dig out my scale 😉
Fun, interesting video - once again!
Heavier record weight is merely a marketing issue. Afterall, no matter the weight or vinyl mix quality, the vinyl used to press any weight of record costs mere pennies.
For the Santana album. you should have used an original copy "two-eye" from 1969, especially a Columbia Santa Maria pressing made from premium vinyl. They were fairly thicker and heavier.
QRP records are pressed by younger inexperienced people. They can't even set the presses up correctly for a certain thickness nor can they center the stampers so both sides of the a record is centered correctly. A vinyl puck must start out a certain weight to end up with a pressing of a certain weight. If the vinyl puck is of the proper weight, but if the press is set so the stampers have too little clearance, then more of the vinyl is extruded outside the stampers. QRP is known for cutting corner, so a sub-weight record may be intentional. We know that their QC isn't what it should because, myself, I have received multiple record pressings which don't measure up. Sometimes I have to exchange them several times. A clue that they know there is a problem is when they don't require a return of your original record. The return shipping costs them more than the vinyl did to press the records.
Yes, there is a difference in the sound of different weight pressings. The heavier the pressing the more of the higher frequency sounds are absorbed by the vinyl. Classic Records would put out comparison records as far as speeds and vinyl weights. Their 200g LP's cut off the higher frequencies at the 33 1/3 rpm speed, whereas their 45 rpm came closest to a 180g 33 1/3 rpm version.
QRP is about the only record pressing facility which still presses 200g LP's. Speaking with them a couple of years back, they were realizing the disadvantages of pressing 200g and now they only use it with their Clarity vinyl releases. One main problem with 200g pressings is that the record label can get damaged easily. You might have noticed that when they repress an LP which was formerly 200g, they are now 180g. When I have already had a 200g pressing, I will get a 180g pressing to compare. Eventhough they are using the same generation stampers, the 180g repressings sound better and brighter to me. With my hearing, I need the higher frequencies accentuated.
Standard weight pressings today are normally considered to be 120-140g's. The old RCA "Dynaflex" LP's, with were in the 90-100g range sound good to me.
Awesome video Frank! I do not agree with what the say about that 180 grams records will not get warped. I have purchased many current albums that are 180 grams and most of them are warped right out of the package. Quality control these days is terrible. I hate brand new albums that cost so much money that are warped right from the pressing plants.
Warps in 180 are the worst!
the actual lacquer cutting and plating has more to do with the sound quality than the weight of the vinyl.
Nice one Frank. Can't say I've ever heard any difference, but then again I don't have golden ears.😉
Jim🏴🙂
Actually learned something today...thanks Frank!
The one plant I would expect to get it right would be QRP. I have an OG NL Nevermind and it’s so light, you could fold it like a letter. One of the absolute best sounding records in my collection. As much as I might prefer heavier records for apparently no empirical reason, it seems really not to matter.
Many countries have Laws about stated weights. If something is CLAIMED to weigh a set amount (as stated on on label or otherwise mentioned on the product) then it MUST weight the stated weight. This can be averaged out over multi-disc sets. If it falls under the stated weight, then the record company COULD be be open to being sued for fraudulent claims. Anyway, I work in OUNCES.
I buy 180G records when available. I like the feel of them when handling.
New 180g pressings seem to have more warping problems going on ' I am sure of this
than back to the lighter thinner pressings from the late 70s to mid 80s it's my good guess that more heat has to be used to press 180g so in turn more a risk for warping in the cooling down period vinyl could indeed
be still be sighty warm at the packing stage
Can you make this into a drinking game?
Hi Frank. I honestly expected all those 180gram records to weigh significantly less...being the cynic that I am, so was pleasantly suprised by your findings. You are also right about there being no difference in sound quality. What I do like is the sturdiness of the heavier vinyl as the thinner ones from the 70's and 80's were as flimsy as hell !! Thanks for checking them out for us.
I had the same cynical thought...
I was hoping you checked some of the 200 gram records I’d be curious if they tend to be heavier. Another great video!
Very interesting vid, Frank. I never expected the majority to outweigh 180. I don’t seek them out but it seems the 180gram tag carried more weight (ha) years ago when it was the new selling point. Now buyers aren’t as impressed by that but it’s still nice. I have some Dynaflex so am curious also what they weigh. KOS!
Hey Frank, love your videos! Always informative and interesting.
What are your thoughts on the "old" Half speed Master pressings and the Direct Metal Masters?
I don't specifically look for 180g vinyl, but a lot of what I buy these days is new albums by both old a new artists, and I find most issues tend to be 180g only and very few of the artists I follow release on anything less. It appears to have just become the "standard" now.
No, I don’t seek it out for a 180 g . When I look for a record, I want to buy if it is 180 g or 150 g I will still buy it. I am from kichener Ontario.
A great video, I was surprised I thought that alot more would have been less than 180 grams. And I also heard alot of people say that they have more problems with warping with the 180 grams records because they have less flexabilty than standard pressings.
Same as you Frank. If I can get a good quality sounding pressing I’m not bothered by the weight . I’ve been caught out a few times especially when I obtained a copy of Fleetwood Mac’s Rumours on 180g not only did it weigh less but sounded horrible. I’m sticking to my 1977 copy it sounds fantastic.
I have an older pressing of Rumours and it also sounds great.
I have quite a few 180g records and I can't say I can hear any difference in the sound quality. The sound isn't anything to do with the weight of the vinyl but more to do with the mastering of the recordings I think. I have 180g vinyl that sounds fantastic, however my 180g reissue of Bob Marley's Legend album is rather bad. The volume level on my pressing is so low I have to crank up the volume on my amp quite considerably to be able to hear it. Just one example of poor mastering. The weight of the vinyl doesn't change the quality of the sound, I think it just means the heavier the vinyl, the more durable it is and less likely to break or warp. As far as getting the vinyl weights accurate goes, I guess it can be rather difficult to get the weight spot on and there will always be little discrepancies here and there. Very interesting video though, a great topic.
Interesting video Frank,but i do find myself more concerned with the quality of the pressing rather than the weight! i did find it funny that the 1st lp picked was KISS ALIVE,which i understand is a complete fraud as it is not live at all lol! Cheers
I am full on with 180 cause they last longer . Robert Fripp says that 200 vinyl is the route to go .
I recently opened 2 records(180 grams, both were sealed. I hate sealed records really) :-/ & both the inner sleeve were damaged at the bottom or sides(even one of the outer bottom of the sleeve was damaged to) because(I am guessing) the records were 180 grams etc etc :-/ Really annoying because they were expensive to + in the 1980's I never got records like that. I wish the inner sleeves were thicker & the quality control(some records were not mint like you expect them to be as they were sealed to) was better to nowadays. Oh well.
I don't seek out 180g vinyl at all I look for more affordable ones and also it drives me insane when they make 14 song or less album into a 2lp set just to make more money! I would be perfectly happy with it on 1 disc at a normal thickness as long as it's a good pressing!
Awesome video brother
I'm with you. I don't buy records based on advertised weight. As long as they sound good, that's enough for me. I gave noticed however that records from the '70s to early '80s do tend to warp easier than the heavier ones. But often it's not the weight so much as it's the way the records are handled and stored. Interesting video though, Frank.
The vinyl weight topic is marketing BS. Some experts use even 200g for their premium products and some experts say the best compromise is around 140g and as you said even thinner can sound very good if recorded well and produced well. At the end of the day I would appreciated if they would change the marketing to state "low noise vinyl", "High Quality Control against warped vinyl", "Pressed in an independet pressing plant for small record companies-Fxxx the Majors!" or something else that would really make sense...or not, what do I know
I think 140 to 150 is that sweet spot... all I need.
I just worry about if it’s the right album and artist in the cover, not the weight of the vinyl.
Some people have their TT set up specially for a certain weight because it effects geometry
Yea, it's marketing as you say Frank. Heavier records cause stress in inner and outer sleeves when shipped. Greg Lake from ELP stated that they should need to be more than 140 Grammes. Some of the late 70s imports from the USA are very thin. We call them Wobble Boards. The UK equivalents are thicker. I only got them as they were cheaper than the UK version. Records of 90 Grammes and upwards can sound fine.
Like most people I cant hear any difference with 180g and couldnt care less what weight each record is issued on.
However when wet cleaning 180g I don't feel like it's gonna break like I fear some featherweight 80's stuff may 🤣
I was surprised at the kiss vinyl, I would not have thought trash bags weighted so much....jk......side note and i know its early but frank do you know if you will bring back that Halloween 33 shirt from last October back. thanks. Brian from North Carolina
Trash bags... Who new people from NC were so funny...🤨
Funny you mention the Halloween tees. I am already working on a new one for this year. I commissioned some custom art... It's pretty sweet. I will launch em around Labour Day.
In my time collecting records I've on 2 occasions had a record fall on the floor, the first was an old pressing of the rolling stones and that just shattered on impact. The second was Iron Maidens The X Factor 180 gram that landed right on the edge of the record but not only did it not shatter it actually was almost completely unharmed with the exception of a small skip at the beginning and I still have it to this day so as far as I can tell 180 gram is worth it just for damage resistance alone.
Excellent video. A very simple issue but thank you for doing the work.
I'm glad you enjoyed it. I had no idea what the outcome of this video would be. I was pleasantly surprised.
Interesting experiment, Frank. I thought it was VERY interesting - and you didn't get into this - that the one you found that actually was short of 180 grams of those advertised as such came from one of the so-called "premium" companies, Quality Recordings. Hmmmm. All the record labels who claimed the 180 gram were well above the mark. I would have thought a company like Quality would have preferred to err on the high end as well, but apparently not. Again....hmmmmmm. Not surprised the earlier albums were much lower - you should have found a Dynaflex to do, i bet that would have been very eye opening, LOL!
But Frank, what did you expect? Those LPs were almost all *heavy rock!* I remember when "quality" was linked to purity of the PVC-- if it was translucent when held up to a lightbulb it was "the good stuff."
Haha true... heavy rock = heavy record. \m/
Great video Frank!
Most record’s especially 180gm have an edge warp! They do not sound better! In fact a lot of my best sounding albums are pretty thin!My first Cars Album is a German copy and sounds amazing!It is just hype!It is the mastering that is important not the weight!
This one reminds me of that NOFX record that had a heavy variant. Wasike 500 or 600 gram and was like a full centimeter thick lol
I do not seek out 180 gram records. I personally don't care for the extra weight and space they take up. And at the end of the day, a good pressing is a good pressing, is a good pressing!
180g not important to me - all about the sound quality/quality control. I’ve had new 180g records that have arrived warped, so have never really understood the advantage of 180g 👍
Now I don't know about the ones that weight more, but perhaps the 180 is a reference number how about the amount of grooves carved out or molded from everyone of those I mean why should the digital medium adapt to the 180 stricktly
Should have weighed one of those thinner pressings on Dynaflex that RCA cranked out.
And im calling bullshit on 180 grams not warping. Yes they do.
I'm glad you did this video and I'm a little surprised myself. So many of the 180 g hype sticker LPs I get have me questioning if they are more than 140 g. Some of them you have no doubt about because you can feel that heavyweight pressing. It's not hard to do and you can usually tell if something is going to be lighter or heavier than what it's being advertised as. But that's considering that they really did weigh 180 g to begin with. I think a lot get advertised as 180 g but when you open it and pull the vinyl LP out it feels no different than an LP you pull out of a sleeve from a 1970s record.
I was just thinking of weighing a few myself a couple of days ago. My digital scale is a lot smaller and I was going to have to find a way to raise the LP off of it and zero it out before putting the album on whatever I used. I'm still going to do it eventually but after seeing your video I'm not expecting any real 180 g weights now haha.
One thing I was wondering is whether or not something like the labels could be causing the various weight differences? I wonder if they consider weighing them prior to putting the label on when they come up with the 180 gram weight. Hopefully there's not enough dirt, dust, or anything else on the albums to even consider what it weighs. But I'm pretty sure they just have a roundabout figure and now I'm wondering if each album is cut and The weight is something different on each LP as they are being pressed?
Brian in Fort Worth 🎶
I found it interesting... some of these records did not 'feel' like 180 pressings (I'm looking at you, KISS), but they were.
Manythnx Frank!
Metallica represses on Blackened just don't feel 180. I think standard is it has to be over 160 gram at least.
maybe figure out how much the labels weigh... I bet they are around 8-10 grams. Also I would expect that as with most manufactuing processes there is a "range" that is acceptable... I don't know what it is but + or - 10 grams wouldn't surprise me.
Could they be weighing just the vinyl without the labels?
On a side question, do you put more weight into vinyl weight or half speed mastered/ 45 rpm pressings?
Seeing how they are made I am not surprised they're are different weights
The pressing is the pressing. I don't buy the LP because it's180 grams. I buy it because of the music. I wish the 180 gram phase of vinyl
LP marketing would come to pass. I would prefer the emphasis be on the quality of the pressing rather than how much it weighs.
Hey Frank.. how about they make 120 gram records and charge a lower price … these prices for new vinyl are hilarious! Leave the 180 gram vinyl exclusives to the fanatics to collect so they can brag about how much better pressings they are which is pretty nerdy anyway!!
You should try weighing a few RCA dynaflex. They are really thin but sound great.
You're right, that would have been interesting. I may try that.
I'm sure they didn't expect record collectors to start weighing there vinyl
So even the ones that missed the 180g mark are still vastly heavier than vinyl from back in the day… koo
160 180 gram vinyl doesn’t mean better sound and they still warp just the same as your regular pressings
You would think Cheap Trick would be the lightest.