Why You're WRONG about the Lumix S9... BUT so were Lumix
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- Опубликовано: 11 июн 2024
- The Lumix S9 camera had mixed reviews upon release but I think it is one of the best cameras to be released in 2024 of this size.
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As pricing goes, Panasonic has tendency to overprice and then cut price dramatically. Need to come back to this topic year later 😉
Also, putting yourself in the shoes of Lumix, I think it's worth the risk to overprice and piggyback off the x100v compact hype, then adjust accordingly.
Not as overpriced as the ZVE1. Today, the S9 is Php105K with a 20-60 vs ZVE1's Php144K with a 28-60. The S5II is also around PHP139K with the same lens.
So the S9 is the way to go. Also, its unfair to compare it with the X100VI, thats APSC. The A7C2 with 28-60 is PHP146K.
@PPLRRN yeah I wasn't comparing it to the 100v. I was saying that model of camera inflated costs of models that are similar to it, so it made sense they thought they could get more given how coveted those types of cameras are rn
This product release cycle has been great for exposing precisely which content creators are in the pockets of big manufacturers, if nothing else.
Who cares? Not me. I don't give a shit about all that fake drama.
Dont be mad at him. Hes a Lumix user, influencer and content creator with a lot of accessories laying around. The s9 is intended for guys like him, imagine the amount of accessories he can make content of to offset the limitations of the s9.
Funny times out here. No one seems to care about what images this camera actually PRODUCES! It’s baffling.
The reality is that when it comes to gear (and that could be cameras, music gear etc) we are firmly in the “prosumer” world where the people with the money go buy these things to sort of live the dream of professionalism but have full time jobs that mean they can’t use them to their fullest potential anyways!
So they worry about specs because specs make them feel closer to being “professional” vs just a hobbyist. Even if they don’t know how to produce the professional content they dream they can produce with this gear. (I’m one of these guys so I get it!)
The reality is a real “professional” in any field will put up with whatever crap they had to get the shot or the sound they need. Because the output is always more important than how you got it.
Legendary art has been produced with synths that went out of tune, cameras with crap focus, etc etc. but it was worth it.
Which brings me back to the s9. Until someone shows me a full frame camera that can produce out the box images with stabilisation this good with a box this small I don’t want to hear how it’s not worth it.
It’s just a lie. Sonys can’t do it. Fuji can’t. Canon can’t.
People more in love with feeling like they are pro’s than just making art. It’s mental. You can’t make better art for 1500 with a similar sized device. You just can’t.
An additional 'reality' is that 'Professional' is not a thing about merely getting paid to do something. 'Professional' is also about process and commitment to quality or, as someone justly famous once said - 'the Professional is dedicated to the total eradication of error -it has nothing whatsoever to do with money'. Plenty of jobbing photographers are pretty average, and some are crap... and more than a few of your 'hobbyists' are superb craftspeople who can and do hold their own in any company. And an aside - the quality of 'Art', in any field, is not correlated with the price of the equipment, and the size of any (or your) device is also irrelevant.
I’ve been using and loving a Sigma FPL for about two years now. Surviving without a mechanical shutter and evf has been just fine. I mostly shoot stills, but I love the video I’ve captured while using a gimbal or tripod. Since the S9 works with all my lenses and fits in my camera bag more easily than a tripod or gimbal, it’s very tempting. For anyone crying over time limits on video, talk to someone who’s shot movies on film. (Super 8 is on a 5min cartridge) I’m pretty sure 16mm was half that.
They just had to copy the X-E4 but the missing shutter and tilty flippy screen is really limiting for photography.
Amazing video Sam, your unpopular opinion is exactly what I think too. The price is totally wrong, and I think they need to rethink a bit the marketing strategies here, they have too many cameras at the same price point, and it starts making things a bit hard and confusing. Like how can the S9, cost only 200 less than the S5II, that’s it is designed for the majority of the people, and think that the S9 will sell well. Like I am pro LUMIX, but this decision, I didn’t get it at all. I hope they will understand that, and drop the price at some point.
The S9 is such a confusing camera and I think that's what makes it so interesting. 800 or 900 "sniffs" is what I was wanting / expecting, I wonder whether they could have just taken out a bunch of the "pro" features and priced it less... but then it's kinda cool you get top tier anamorphic features in the tiny body.
Q: Do you like compact size of S9 with full frame sensor?
A: Yeah!!! but no EVF and no mechanical shutter...
Q: Okay then, how about S5II? With weather sealed magnesium body, EVF, dual SD cards?
A: Yeah... but too bulky and too heavy...
Q: Oh, how about Sony A7CII? Compact size with EVF, better auto focus and more lens selections?
A: Right, but S9 has better IBIS.
There is no reason to blame S9 - prioritize features you really need, because there is no one perfect camera.
EXACTLY - you can't have everything !
The S9 checks a lot of boxes for me when it comes to being a fun camera for travel or walking around my city. I think the price is holding me back, though. I feel like this is a great camera to wait about a year or so until it goes on sale. Now, if Lumix would please release a similar micro four thirds version that's slightly smaller but has most of the same features, well, I'd jump on that in a heartbeat. I would LOVE an updated GM1 style camera. I'll take one in red or green, please. :D
To be fair, the first ever version of the X100 was released for $1200 in 2010 which is $1,728.38 in todays money so the first ever Fuji X100 was more expensive than the S9. Also to be fair it's hard to push down the MSRP of a full frame mirrorless camera that is that small but still has class leading IBIS and features like Open Gate 6K plus that's the MSRP, it will most likely drop in price quite quickly just like the S5II.
EDIT: And btw, the sales numbers were released a few days ago and the S9 is selling like crazy. Lumix obviously did their market research as it's selling like hotcakes which isn't all that surprising. I mean, multi billion dollar company usually knows what they're doing and by the look of the numbers they absolutely did know what they were doing.
Not selling that great on the reports I have seen. But it should get there if true.
@@brianwhiteside well, not sure what reports you have read by both PetaPixel and L-Rumors have reported on that the S9 has outsold expectations by Lumix and that the amount of pre-orders have already succeeded Lumix's production capabilities meaning supply chain issues might come.
Now ive been using the s9 for longer, i do wish it had a little grippy grip, like the Lumix gx80 for example. It wouldnt make it any bigger.
Also, broken record I know. I just wish it was a new GM5ii (or whatever you want to call it). Space for a mechanical shutter, space for EVF, etc... it would solve literally all the issues everyone has
Hey Emily! Love your videos, and I also think you're underrated as a photographer as well!
I was curious if you could ever fit plans into making a video about Lumix' constant preview when you had some free time 😌
I have done tons of research, but the lag and feedback when using it have led me to believe that I have no clue how to properly utilize it in my Lumix cameras... Would just be nice so see when it's useful and how to use
Well "compactness" is the sales pitch right? Thats why they even made an f8 pancake lens to make that fake dream a little bit more real. And that fake dream will also cost you an additional 200usd.
@TechHour-nc1gf The grip doesnt have to be the size of the GX8 or sonys a6k series, and the camera could still be compact with better ergonomics.
A lot of people didn't like the GX8 because the grip was ugly and bulbous. Might be why they went the route of an RX1 like body instead. A gx85 grip would've been very nice on it, however.
Right? Dlux8 ironically better release than S9
Oh Lumix didn't give you a free Smallrig grip for your S9?
I was considering going to the Fx30 for a second more compact and light weight setup thats easily mounted everywhere but now with the S9 there is a awesome compact full frame body in the lineup so no chance. Most people dont realize yet how insane the potential of Lumix and the L mount as a whole is. If they crush it with the rumoured box camera and S2H then their lineup will be crazy
I almost wish I was in the market for one now! I love that you felt it necessary to put out a well balanced rationale, nice one. Nowthen, can I find the spare money ……🤭
Great video as always. Totally agree with your statement but unfortunately this topic has already reached "controversial" area which means simply that you cannot talk about it and expect majority of people to stay calm and rational. But hey, maybe thanks to S9 more people will hear about Lumix cameras which is always a win. More rivalry between camera manufacturers is always good:3
is this a new set? it looks amazing
i love lumix cameras. but that camera is just to expensive...
It’s a full frame, interchangeable lens, 6K open gate, 10-Bit, best in industry IBIS camera. Name something that even comes close for the price?
@@9adriano21 rather lumixs5ii
wait, A7cm2 image quality is no near to s9??
Sam, it’s over priced and you know it. Side note: your video looks great! You really nailed that PM vibe. Fly the flag.
Is the Leica Q3 (6.000€) over priced?
Yes obviously, all Leica are overpriced, but they get away with it because it's a luxury brand with luxury brand prices. Panasonic is not and doesn't have the heritage or cache to get away with overpricing their products. @@xaviergut8232
I’ve been mulling over what I think of it since it was announced. Where it really misses is no mechanical shutter, not just for the rolling shutter issue but also for the mechanical click that gives you a tactile experience (this is so often overlooked).
Secondly no flash, fine no hot shoe, give us a cheap flip up fill flash. If they’re aiming for influencers then that ‘disposable’ look with a cheap flash is very popular.
There is a lot to like and it will hopefully open the market for cheap full frame cameras. The style and size is something the FF market is missing and the ,real-time LUT feature is a game changer.
However, at the starting rrp it is lacking a bit too much.
I'll just keeping waiting for my x100vi to arrive in 1 or 2 years.
Yeah, one week before VII announcement.
@@Propaganda_Films If I'm lucky.
@@AllenRReid Yes you are lucky, because mine will arrive a week AFTER VII announcement.
What if they would add an Optic viewer on for the Sigma 45mm or 50mm
Personally, I'd like to see a M43 version of the S9. I think there's a hole in the market for a new really compact camera using all the new technology which will take the huge range of smaller lenses.
All I wanted was a mechanical shutter given how bad the rolling shutter is. The mount was already protruding from the body in S9. They can easily make it few millimeters thickers and added a shutter.
so i looked at this camera very briefly and then preordered the xt50. I thought that was expensive, but the s9 takes the biscuit. The s9 just is nt targeted at me, and the photography compromises are just too great for me. It will be interesting to see the sales figures in a years time for the s9, xt50 and x100vi, and their current as new purchase prices.
I will have to save a year to get the Lumix, it really has a tendency to drop prices a few months after its launch or when preparing for the next saga
Sam, please ask Lumix when the S1H ii is coming... thanks
10 minute record limit for a concent creator camera in 2024 ? Any intention on being mean but ; Are you serious about stating that this camera is not a joke ?
6K Formats 10 minutes
5.9K Formats 10 minutes
4K/UHD Formats 15 minutes
3.8K Formats 15 minutes
3.3K Formats 15 minutes
1080p Formats 20 minutes
Is that not the case anymore ?
I think you should've compared it to the x100vi to be more fair. Then I think the price is a little more justified. Personally still think it should be a bit cheaper considering you still have to pick up a lens as opposed to the x100vi has a built in lens. It just ready out of the box. Great video as always🙏🏽
They have one with the silver top in Asian markets.
We need a photography oriented S9 with ALL of the features left out from the S5II. Maybe with record limits...
When you showed fuji film sim vs some luts on tge lumix it was clear as day fuji film sims are not just instagram filters, colors are just much better and “authentic” is like black magic
A7CII "not even close", in stabilization, ok. No open gate, ok. Everything else, what are you talking about? Much better stills camera, I think the S9/S5II also incur a crop in 4k60, right? Battery life (a huge point, Sony kills it)...
I just buy a week ago my first samsung smartphone and the pictures are good for internet and YT compression.
$1000 or under.. maybe. but even at that price, the lack of mech shutter would still an issue.. probably it will be disxounted at $1300 or so, and be available used at or under $1000 in a year or so.. will be interesting then
This looks so similar to the zv1e which is stellar but the additional open gate.
Some solid valid points, Sam. But it is in your first words over priced without a clear user group nor no reputation of the S5 II yet $200 less.
The ball is in LUMIX’s Court, do they let this camera lose market interest as other brands will have new cameras out shortly and the S9 becomes Book 📕 Ends in LUMIX’s Warehouse.
The your point about the features close to the S5 II, it should have been $1099.00 USD ($1199.00) max to box out the likes of the Canon R8 and this “fun” Camera would have flew off the shelves. At least force buyers to consider the S9, the fact the S9 has more features of the market phenomenon with the Fuji which will surely slow down like the Popeye Chicken Craze 😂. I think the S9 would be a great camera to buy but at that price I can’t help to sell, “ I have to look at all the other Options available whether Full Frame or not.
I could shoot professional jobs on that camera all day. Photo shoots, event coverage, concerts, a commercial, music videos, a documentary, doesn't matter. Can't wait to pick one up and get to it ! Would be a perfect backup body for travel or to my S5ii.
Agree, everything I’ve shot on the S5II I could shoot on the S9, paid (music videos, events, nightlife, travel, and small business social media) and personal (travel and daily vlogs).
If it was 1000- 1200€ instead 1600€ I wouldnt think twice to'upgrade from my S5.( I was waiting to pick a used S5II).
In my case I do content for an Olympic champion, when i'm on a tournament with him and I send him photos out of his match and I retouch some he almost post only unretouched one etc. So if I can lut tweak a lut/style so its more créative and send him directly to post right after his match, he can speed up a lot the workflow
FYI iPhone Pros are $1500 too, people saying this is “too exercise “ and “overpriced” like if the iPhones with the Pro video features where $300…
Hey Hey, you're a friend of Ed! Thinking about joining his course!
Its positioning wasn't great. At that price, it should come with a viewfinder! That's the problem with many compacts. By not having great viewfinders, they were what gave the initial wave of mirrorless cameras about 15 years ago a bad reputation. Yes, an EVF would add a bit of height to the camera, but not a whole lot. It really is a must have. The number one struggle photographers have with smartphones is the lack of a visible viewfinder in bright sun, especially when wearing sunglasses. Otherwise, it is a great machine.
I agree with everything you're saying. I have a video planned very similar to this, and I think you hit it on the head.... Also Not My overheating video 😜😜
5.12 for the win! I feel the same way about luts
S9 is an amazing fashionable photo camera that is suitable for video content creation as well, a little overpriced at launch as many lumix cameras, price will drop and i will pick one up then
Good Camera for travel.
I do have s5ii for a year now and I pre-ordered the s9 for travel. :)
I think Panasonic chose the wrong price point and size. They could have gone up market and used materials to rival x100v/vi. Included hotshoe and mech shutter.
Sam, you are right. Many thanks for this video.👍
It's a very similar to a Sigma FP, why nobody talks about the Sigma FP when they talk about the Lumix S9.
Well done 👏🏼
The real comparison should be with the Sigma FP and Black Magic Cinema 4k, this is the target use for the S9: a compact cinema cam that can be rigged out however the user wishes.
I've been watching your channel since you put a candelabra on a black Smith Corona😍 back to the topic, this camera is very confusing it's the worst case of jack of all trades and master of none. It's positioned as a photo camera, video camera and also crash camera. I will make a video about this camera and what can be fixed to launch a better one
@@ModernVersusVintage If we ignore the still photo capability entirely, it’s simply a compact cinema camera, that can be used as-is, or easily rigged out, this is how Panasonic should have marketed it.
Thank you also for watching my channel!
@Joe_VanCleave I think that as a cinema camera, this falls short because of the limitations put by Panasonic regarding record times. A BS1H would be a better camera than this.
4:58 The fuji is brighter. The lumix is dark. Are the jpegs straight out of camera also dark. They are on the S1. Canon R8 is a lot more happy camera. Why is the S1 so depressed? How is the S5?
I want to see Lumix do well but that’s why you need to criticise them when they release a poorly conceived camera. The omissions of EFC shutter and hotshoe did not save much manufacturing cost. Their inclusion would have made the camera more appealing to photographers and videographers. There is no argument against that, is anyone really telling me TikTok influencers would suddenly be disinterested if those were included?! If someone offered me a 100V/A7C or an S9 I wouldn’t be choosing the S9 and I love Lumix cameras I’ve owned 5 including the GH5 and G9
This camera will be the most hated but one day will be the most wanted.. trust me…
Sorry Sam I can’t agree with you though I’m a Lulix S series user since they were launched
What make Lumix great for me is the user interface
I never had such a great experience using a camera
The S9 has lost all the essence of a Lumix camera
Even Leica SL is more user friendly 😅😂
The price is far toooo high
I prefer paying few more and get the S5ii
And more than that, whatever the price , I loose too much with this UI drop that I wouldn’t get one S9
The final judge will be the market answer to this Alien 👽
Good points. Still though, this cam should be no more than 1k
And still no test about banding and rolling shutter ….
To me it seems that you fully forget about the lens when you call it a small camera and compare it also price wise with the Fuji. And what ever others might have said I would not start to talk about “hate”. There a serious points where this concept of a content creator camera still has some questionable aspects even if you do regard it as something outside of our traditional photo/video game. But ok, I saw some nice videos produced with this cam so it’s surely not totally useless but in order to check wether it really makes sense for wider audiences we have at least to wait for some appropriate lenses.
Sam, do you think this camera beats the R8? The release price is the same. I’m curious to hear your thoughts.
When anyone says that consumers are thinking about a product wrong, that product is pretty much doomed. This is too expensive to find out that their thinking is “wrong” with too many other competing options. About the only way to overcome this huge hurdle is if Taylor Swift used it and promoted it… haha
S9 can replace my both S5 and Sigma fp. Only scenario I can't shoot with S9 is sport.
Perfect travel camera. Fk all that other bs. I dont want a full size S5II in my carry on. The S9 price is perfect for me.
Sorry Sam I can’t agree with you though I’m a Lulix S series user since they were launched
What make Lumix great for me is the user interface
I never had such a great experience using a camera
The S9 has lost all the essence of a Lumix camera
Even Leica SL is more user friendly 😅😂
The price is far toooo high
I prefer paying few more and get the S5ii
And more than that, whatever the price , I loose too much with this UI drop that I wouldn’t get one S9
The problem with S9 is that it kinda lies in the middle of casual/hobbist camera and professional camera. For the same price, people who want a casual camera will buy x100vi for its small, classic design, and of course it is a compact point n shoot with a focus on user experience. And for people who want a professional gear, they will buy a7cii. S9 spec is better than x100vi but it is not as appealing and fun as the x100vi. But its also lack core feature of a professional gear that a7cii or a7iv offers
yeah was excepting a this video is sponsored by Lumix in the first 30 seconds of the video!
Fujifilm is not video first, it is photo first, so showing comparison examples of video is just wrong.
S9 has a much better image quality than the A7CII, that's very controversial to say that for video, and completely wrong for photo as, um the S9 has not mech shutter.
Lastly the S9 is a great hybrid camera is just, so, so LOL!
the price is cheaper than the zve1 right, so I dont see a problem
A nice looking $1800 budget camera. That would be with a lens as well. Doesn't sound so budget like.
@LumixGang budget relative to 30 grand bodies. 20 percent the price of a top price red, this is...the same price as the s5ii in European shops lol. Nothing wrong with that but it's not budget. it's just a stylish remodel for people that want that, budget is nothing to do with it.
It's a crippled s5ii for the same price as the s5ii second hand. The only things going for it are its size and the lumix lab app, which is gimmicky atm compared to fuji simulations. Feels like a bit of a half baked product.
No hotshoe
No mechanical shutter
Crippled video specs
No EVF
The worst ergonomic
🙄
I dont need any of that bs. Perfect travel camera. Fk the hot shoe bla bla bla. Rarely use it when I travel. There no substitute for skill.
Itss a perfect travel camera. There is no substitute for skill
oh man always the sony argument " it's no way near the same image quality" well as the s9 drama the bad sony color science still without a good reason an hate point, it is just a point of view point. Any cameras have wrong color science on certain specific points , and lumix is not an exception ( I'm an happy onwer of an s5IIX, vlog great dynamic range better than canon but suffer from not very accurate blues, which to get more pleasing wrong face colors (pink is not a natural face color) get noticibly ( to the human eye) more purple than it should do, shure sony is not perfect but "I prefer that souldn't be a good reason to do what bad was exactly made to the s9 talking tast without being fair.
It needs a viewfinder
@samholland Thank you Sam, I genuinely think Panasonic isn't loved enough.
A7C ii image quality is nowhere near to S9? How so? The Sony offers lot more, a good grip and an EVF to start with worth any extra price. Not to mention a range of small first and third party lenses... Panasonic has a long way to catch up. Agree S9 is a cute camera and maybe good for someone with already L mount lenses.
Image quality
the fujifim is a tool for photography, the linix is not. Saying the s9 is nether because it can do what is what build for half decent and therefore is nether than the x100 makes no sense. The cameras are not even in the sama league in any way...
The s9 is for short form content creators...
why did you defend lumix s9 on its limitations when starting out with saying you didn't get paid by lumix? Why defending something like this for free?
Fujifilm does not make cameras they just have enough for reviewers.
I came to be convinced ... but it is still over priced IMO. 1200 bucks would be right in the middle of 900 and 1500 ... no mechanical shutter absolutely kills me.
The dial and quality is bad.My gx9 in same size have all things what i missing at the S9 without pdaf.🤷
To me the S9 is a “around” thousand bucks product, its introductory price is just foolish marketing. The whole point of camera bodies is to sell the whole lens mount system, so the cheeper they get you hooked on L-mount the better. The Lumix S lenses are great, but also quite similarly priced to Canon or Sony, yet the L-mount is not as popular and the S9 could have changed it.
the Sigma FP and PF L are a better camera
I actually like the camera, but would never buy it at that price. It offers nothing I actually need for content creation. I have a GH5, and I’d be better off with an LX100 if I need that small of body.
The first and most important spec of a camera is...
The price.
And from what ever the price is that you are willing to shell out then you are going to see what else you can get for your money.
My second spec choice would be camera sensor size.
Maybe that is why Panasonic is marketing MFT and Full Frame on equal billing. Each has its pros and cons but they are as good as each other.
Two full frame cameras priced similarly is always going to end in tears if one is perceived to be considerably lacking in spec to the other camera.
This.
👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾
Sam, lol, “Lumix went a little wrong”; it’s crapola. If it had proper control wheels, flash, joystick, and better handling, Lumix would have had a monster hit on its hands. This camera is intended for influencers needing to make a sale for Lumix 😂😂😂.
Bro this thing has no where near the build quality or capability of the x100vi. And I’m not even a fan of the x100 line
$999 and i would have called it a masterpiece
It seems like a $1199 camera.
Hi Sam, where did you get the S9 from? Are you in any way affiliated with Panasonic? why don't you mention those key points in the video? In the beginning of the video you say "I'm not telling you to buy this camera" but you definitely try to put it in a positive light and emphasize it's USPs.
I am not affiliated with Lumix and I didn’t get to keep the camera. It’s gone back already. I talk about the positives because that’s what I wanted to do. I was not asked to make a video. I just wanted to highlight some key points.
No view finder and only electric shutter, sorry you blew it.
Cough cough Signa Fp and maybe sony zve1
S5ii much better choice with much nicer specs. Oh well good thing I am staying with Canon lol
You were holding the S9 in your hand and referring to it as a compact content creator camera. It looks like a big ugly brick to be honest. Long time Panasonic fan here, but why even waste the money purchasing this as a B-Cam. Better cameras already exist for the same price.
It's sad to see how the video IQ has dropped since the S5II, this camera is full of bad sharpening and smoothed out details in 4K. A bit better in 6K but still not great, and the IBIS is of course not as good as in 4K.
Sure, the IBIS and AF are better than the S1 but at the cost of image quality.
And now we get this S9 with the same overprocessed image, fantastic IBIS performance yes, even more with EIS but with even worse image quality. So the new Panasonic consumers are people wanting the best IBIS and the smartphone footage look ? Even my GH5 has better details rendering at low ISO than all the recents Panasonic full frame cameras. Panasonic, at least give us raw like on the GH7 if you are not able to make good video engine anymore.
At $800-900, this a valid contender, but still not a winner.
I would not recommend this camera for majority of people. Look into the Lumix s5ii
Lol. 2024 and videos are just WRONG, TRUTH, the REAL TRUTH. Was I MISTAKEN?
It would be amazing for 500 dollars 400 pounds
Who else loves the fact they literally made a pancake lens to sell the idea that this is smaller than compact cameras, didnt include it with the camera and thought we should fork out 200usd price tag to boot. 😅
Lumix should be around $900... Panasonic s9 is a flopped
1k brick..
Drama in the RUclips world🙈😂