I really enjoyed this series. Unless I'm gripped by a fierce passion for the piece I'm writing, I often struggle to develop it and more often than not leave it as an unfinished sketch. These ideas are all so useful as "nuts and bolts" that I think I can put to good and productive use. Many thanks :)
This was a great mind opener. I am glad you mentioned this becoming a subconscious quality and how historically it is not recorded that composers actually thought about using Rhetorical Devices. I would even say that it is something that is so embedded in our language and music that it almost comes at a second nature, but being able to identify each Rhetorical Device is very useful and also impressive. I feel this explains a lot of those moments in music (and also socializing) where someone does something clever and someone else says, "I see what you did there." A funny example is Joe Crocker's - Feelin' Alright. The lyrics: You're feelin' alright? (Oh, no) I'm not feelin' too good myself (no, no) Yes sir, you're feelin' alright? (Oh, no) I'm not feelin' that good myself, yeah (no, no)
@Musica Universalis, I think I speak for many of us when I ask if you are able to put the aforementioned Rhetorical Device sheet in the description of this video. It would be extremely helpful on an already brilliant series, thanks again for all your hard work.
I can't seem to find the source of my printout, perhaps the website no longer exists, however the link below is very similar to what I have. rhetorische-mittel.net/wichtige-stilmittel-liste/
I just realised how lop-sided my earlier musical education was because of not being taught well enough these rhetorical principles which are embedded in music, and especially how a solo performer can better shape the performance having understood these devices.
I don’t know if you’ll see this comment but the quality of my musical ideas/compositions and classical improvisations, according to my teachers, has greatly improved after I started applying the rhetorical methods you describe in your videos. Do you have a patreon or similar account? I thank you for your work!
I think this series is highly relevant. Pop music is full of rhetorical devices; it's basically what a hook is. And public speaking is full of music. Great speakers like MLK or Churchill knew how to modulation their pitch, dynamics, and especially rhythm to the greatest effect. Try reading "I have a dream" in a normal speaking voice, then contrast it with the real thing.
I would say that the Antithesis is one of the most common rhetorical devices in Beethoven’s music, even if it’s just dynamics, as the sudden contrast of piano and forte is part of his style.
The metaphor and analogy both fall under the concept of hypotyposis. However it is interesting to make this distinction. UPDATE: Not sure, but I am inclined to think that analogy is the equivalent of hypotyposis, and metaphor is equivalent of patopoeia. The former is the direct depiction of things, the latter is rather an emotional depiction of things. The Beethoven example is perfect. At the beginning the composer wants you to feel on the countryside (patopoeia), and later on he shows you exactly the birds (hypotyposis).
I watched this series earlier today. After thinking about it, I’d be really curious to hear your thoughts on Arvo Pärt’s method of generating music from a text.
I am wondering if the constant switch between major and minor Registers in Beethoven's moonlight sonata might also be an Example of Antithesis . thanks for the wonderful input
I would consider a major/minor switch, relative or parallel, or distantly related to be an Antithesis personally, as major and minor are opposites, which is the essence of Antithesis. Especially if the Major is peaceful and the Minor is dramatic.
@@MusicaUniversalis wise answer ;) Are you familiar with the Bernstein's lectures at Harvard? He talks a bit about that subject there. I don't know if you enjoy the work of Bernstein
I feel as though the anacoluthon is applied in Baroque overtures that shift suddenly from the arpeggios to the fugue in the middle, often with a different tempo and even different time signature. Is that true?
If it’s Bach, probably many devices. I took a look at it. Keep in mind that many rhetorical devices can be conveyed rhythmically, meaning the same rhythmical pattern is used over and over. And there are plenty of examples of that in the piece you referred to.
Yes, being a lost art more or less, I am by no means someone who understands its intricacies. Something to look into definitely. The highest level of partimento training had musicians improvising fugues, that's a talent very few possess nowadays.
![Blox Fruits Dragon Rework Update [Full Stream]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/EqDAp8udhm0/mqdefault.jpg)
I really enjoyed this series. Unless I'm gripped by a fierce passion for the piece I'm writing, I often struggle to develop it and more often than not leave it as an unfinished sketch. These ideas are all so useful as "nuts and bolts" that I think I can put to good and productive use. Many thanks :)
Great series of videos! Thanx for widening our horizons and our perspectives on music!😁
Can't thank you enough for this series. Incredibly helpful and insightful. Thank you.
Thanks for sharing this valuable content.
Couldn't help but remember Bernstein's Norton Lectures "The Unanswered Question".
Fascinating material, thank you 👏
I was thinking that!
This was a great mind opener. I am glad you mentioned this becoming a subconscious quality and how historically it is not recorded that composers actually thought about using Rhetorical Devices. I would even say that it is something that is so embedded in our language and music that it almost comes at a second nature, but being able to identify each Rhetorical Device is very useful and also impressive. I feel this explains a lot of those moments in music (and also socializing) where someone does something clever and someone else says, "I see what you did there." A funny example is Joe Crocker's - Feelin' Alright. The lyrics:
You're feelin' alright? (Oh, no)
I'm not feelin' too good myself (no, no)
Yes sir, you're feelin' alright? (Oh, no)
I'm not feelin' that good myself, yeah (no, no)
@Musica Universalis, I think I speak for many of us when I ask if you are able to put the aforementioned Rhetorical Device sheet in the description of this video. It would be extremely helpful on an already brilliant series, thanks again for all your hard work.
The list is in german, does that bother you?
@@MusicaUniversalis I'm more then happy putting in the work to translate it, much obliged!
I can't seem to find the source of my printout, perhaps the website no longer exists, however the link below is very similar to what I have.
rhetorische-mittel.net/wichtige-stilmittel-liste/
Fantastic educational material
I just realised how lop-sided my earlier musical education was because of not being taught well enough these rhetorical principles which are embedded in music, and especially how a solo performer can better shape the performance having understood these devices.
I don’t know if you’ll see this comment but the quality of my musical ideas/compositions and classical improvisations, according to my teachers, has greatly improved after I started applying the rhetorical methods you describe in your videos. Do you have a patreon or similar account? I thank you for your work!
It‘s always a pleasure to read such comments. I will make a patreon when I reach 10K subs.
I think this series is highly relevant. Pop music is full of rhetorical devices; it's basically what a hook is. And public speaking is full of music. Great speakers like MLK or Churchill knew how to modulation their pitch, dynamics, and especially rhythm to the greatest effect. Try reading "I have a dream" in a normal speaking voice, then contrast it with the real thing.
I would say that the Antithesis is one of the most common rhetorical devices in Beethoven’s music, even if it’s just dynamics, as the sudden contrast of piano and forte is part of his style.
The metaphor and analogy both fall under the concept of hypotyposis. However it is interesting to make this distinction.
UPDATE: Not sure, but I am inclined to think that analogy is the equivalent of hypotyposis, and metaphor is equivalent of patopoeia. The former is the direct depiction of things, the latter is rather an emotional depiction of things. The Beethoven example is perfect. At the beginning the composer wants you to feel on the countryside (patopoeia), and later on he shows you exactly the birds (hypotyposis).
Very, very good.
Amazing and inspiring content
Danke!
Besides the dorian melody, Schubert makes it sound ancient by sticking to fundamental chords (no inversions). Schumann does this on occasion too.
Woah wait this is the first time I've ever been the first viewer for any video woohoo!
9:43 you could say: apisiopedis leaves it to the imagination …
Which is a very powerful way.
That works for photos of beautiful women too…
I watched this series earlier today. After thinking about it, I’d be really curious to hear your thoughts on Arvo Pärt’s method of generating music from a text.
When I write lyrics, l subconsciously use metaphors and sometimes even get the rhythm correctly.
And sometimes I use stories like Rapunzel or the Flying Dutchman as a method of delivering..
Germans always have solid explanations for everything.
I am wondering if the constant switch between major and minor Registers in Beethoven's moonlight sonata might also be an Example of Antithesis .
thanks for the wonderful input
I would consider a major/minor switch, relative or parallel, or distantly related to be an Antithesis personally, as major and minor are opposites, which is the essence of Antithesis.
Especially if the Major is peaceful and the Minor is dramatic.
Thanks for the series and the new perspective. Are you interested in linguistics applied to music?
I‘m interested in how anything can be applied to music, thus the name of the channel musica universalis.
@@MusicaUniversalis wise answer ;)
Are you familiar with the Bernstein's lectures at Harvard? He talks a bit about that subject there. I don't know if you enjoy the work of Bernstein
I feel as though the anacoluthon is applied in Baroque overtures that shift suddenly from the arpeggios to the fugue in the middle, often with a different tempo and even different time signature. Is that true?
I wish I could applied this to a passage in Bach BWV 1011 Allemande. I can't figure the rhetorical device used
If it’s Bach, probably many devices. I took a look at it. Keep in mind that many rhetorical devices can be conveyed rhythmically, meaning the same rhythmical pattern is used over and over. And there are plenty of examples of that in the piece you referred to.
Could the ending of Bach's fugue from the Prelude and Fugue in E Minor (Book 1) be considered a form of aposiopesis?
Definitely not.
are you aware of partimento and thoroughbass?
Yes, being a lost art more or less, I am by no means someone who understands its intricacies. Something to look into definitely. The highest level of partimento training had musicians improvising fugues, that's a talent very few possess nowadays.
Second