Recover from Narcissistic Abuse: Accept Your Role in It (with Brian Barnes)
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- Опубликовано: 13 июн 2024
- Narcissistic abuse involves multiple parties, not least of whom is the victim. Here is how to cope with it in various settings and circumstances.
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If you found out that a person is unable to have a baby, no matter what treatment is tried, but then insisted that they have one anyway, because they said they could, then people would rightly consider you to be illogical and denying reality. Similarly, if you consider that a narcissist is incapable of empathy or compassion, but then demand those traits from that person endlessly, who cannot provide them, then it's just as delusional. Not defending the evils of narcissism here, but no one who claims to be a victim of narcissistic abuse will ever heal if they perpetuate the same cycle over and over again. They are seeking water from a dry well.
You are correct….
I loathed my (narcissist) husband when we first met. Iabsolutely detested him. We were set up on a blind date by my best friend and her fiance, who was my husband's friend. I thought my future husband was an arrogant fool, and I had a visceral reaction to him that I had never had before. I left the table where we were all sitting and went to bed. I refused to say goodbye to him.
Thus began the chase. He kept pestering my best friend to set us up again and asking when I would visit her. He begged her to tell me that he was a good guy but just makes bad first impressions. I told my friend HELL NO. I will not see this man again, and never mention him to me again. Months go by and my friend (who is no longer my friend, btw) asked me to spend the weekend with her (we lived 2 hours from each other), and she wanted me to hang out and meet a teacher she knew. So I go there, and there's my future husband, sitting in her kitchen. She tricked me! There was no teacher! But I was in for an even bigger shock when this guy I loathed acted like my perfect soul mate. He did everything right. By the end of the night, I had fallen hard. I could write a book about it, so I will leave it here. The moral of the story, if you hate someone when you meet them, run, run away! Run farther than I did and never stop! Run like the most evil villian is after you because he is!
Editing to add, I was fascinated with Sam Vankin's book that he published in full on his websitein the late 90's. I sat there reading the whole thing. What was fascinating to me was that he freely admitted to being a narcissist in his book and he exposed his inner workings. I was in college majoring in psychology at the time. My narcissist husband was also in college and we were living together. So, rather oddly in retrospect, I've known about Sam for many years and was intrigued by his unique take on narcissism. I loved the irony of a narcissist writing openly about himself and his narcissism. It was all about him and yet what he was saying about himself wasn't good. I was intrigued and appalled in equal measure. I discussed his book with my narcissist husband, and for years, we would quote some of the phrases he coined in that book. Odd.
I can relate to that! When I first met the narcissist who abused me in my teens (who was also my friend's friend), I was appalled by him. He seemed disgusting to me. I refused to be walked home by him when he suggested it. But I was so lonely and unloved, a neglected child, and he seemed to be the only one who displayed an interest in me, that one day I asked my friend to say hi to him from me. Thus began the most devastating relationship of my life. And I detected the moment of entering his shared fantasy! I was shocked when I learned this concept from Sam Vaknin! I was standing in front of a mirror ironically, I hadn't cared about the guy too much before, I just needed to be in a relationship. When all of a sudden I felt a shift in my reality, everything became blurry and surreal. At that moment I felt like I fell in love with him. He was interested in black magic, so for many years I thought it was a spell cast on me to fall in love with him. But now I believe that it was a moment when I entered the shared fantasy. And he also taught me how to Photoshop my pictures to look better, another big irony! Now he is long gone from my life, but I still feel the effect of being infected with narcissism. I developed many self-defeating behaviors. I need to continue to work on myself. It's been 15 years, and I'm still not fully healed. After the final discard and the smear campaign (btw he punished me the most among all his exes, even attempted to repeat the campaign some years later) his friend reached out to me and asked me not to become like him. That all his exes changed somehow after the relationship with him. At that time it sounded odd for me. I thought it was ridiculous, I was immune to it, I reassured him that it wouldn't happen. But now I realize what he meant. How perceptive of him.
Blessings 🤲✨
Professor Sam Vaknin, you are the gift that keeps on giving.
It was all about trying to show my grandma the good things in life since she scapegoated my mother. It was an addiction. My codependency wanted to make it right by my mom. What's sad is realizing these people don't want anyone around them happy and it's not your fault at all. The codependency and confidence issues are all you need to fix
As someone who has watched countless score of your videos, I found this to be the most succinct recording of your advice and worthy of a public comment. All of your videos have held value for me, however this recording has come at the perfect time as a reminder of why I must hold fortitude to protect my baby. I am actively breaking the cycle and you are a wonderful help.
Thank you, the life for my children and I is much better now removed from violent narcissistic abuse, I appreciate that my outpouring of gratitude nurtures your own narcissistic needs, quite frankly, I don't give a damn. I recognise it now, many thanks to you!
🎯
So much food for thought in that interview. I am learning to be humble and more and more I can see my role in my relationship with a narcissist. There is no such thing as attracting and being attracted to a narcissist by pure coincidence.
Absolutely addicted to listening to him🙏🏻. I will listen until I have any disagreement- but it’s never coming, everything resonates within me…that’s why he is a teacher for me that I really have a great respect for🙌🏻
By the way, I’m Borderline, have ADHD, am Bipolar, have complex PTSD, and I am a survivor of severe physical and mental abuse. And Sam, I’m actually now single. At last. Humor is a great tool for survival😉
Mr. Vaknin’s life journey is fascinating. The comeback kid. 😎
Amazing to hear Sam Vaknins story! Thank you for everything you have brought to us.
I love what you say about ‘need to have a father’ I said this for years, a hundred percent an excuse for me to keep contacting him, he wasn’t a ‘father’ in any shape or form. My counsellor pointed this out to me finally wool lifted when I heard Sam say it on the video I finally understood what the counsellor was getting at. Thank you Sam 🙏🏻 so much grief letting go of the fantasy now..
The sh*t I did to my covert ex was...oof. When i tell people the stories i come off like a total abuser. At the time i justified it by the fact that she literally TOLD me to do these things to her and that they paled compared to what she did to me. When people would ask the obvious, "why didnt you just break up?" I used to draw a blank. Now I realize I became hooked on the power games. I was better at them than her. I did not know this talent I had.
I'm...sitting quietly by myself these days.
😂
Thank you so much Dear Professor ❤
Life is such a trip. To go from living with a narcissist for decades and wanting of un allive myself to having pity on them and wanting to help them... and then 'meeting' the man who coined the phrases and literally wrote the book. Life is awesome if you just look inside your self. look hard and look deep and never stop growing ad learning. Also, it's really great to hear people openly talk about being in prison because lots of us have served time, due to confusion at navigating the ins and outs of narcissistic abuse. My narc sibling actually put me in jail, but I needed that wake up call . All I have now, after hanging on your every word, is pity and compassion for the narcissist. I still don't have to be near them but I can feel hella sorry for them. Life is better thanks to you, Sam.
Also, it doesn't even have to be kids. Just a cat. A cat. One cat. That I loved and will never see again. Because narcissism.
This content was extremely informative & helped provide clarity! Thank you! 🙌
Sadly, Family courts and psychologists involved prioritise farther’s rights over children’s rights and voices and as a default look at 50-50. If you contest it, you are viewed as high conflict - it takes years for courts to see what is actually going on…
The narcissist parent can also be the mother, in 50% of cases it is the mother, And the legal system don’t have the training or the time Ro get into which parent is narcissistic, it’s very complicated unfortunately
@@brianbarneswellbeing4628 I fully agree. I was just relating it to my experience where fathers demands were repeatedly supported by some experts involved even when in the same breath they acknowledged he was more interested in his rights then responsibilities. And not to mention ignoring and minimising repeated domestic violence offences… same can relate to the mother of course…
The more I observed the more I knew he was SICK minded…I started to pull away and he caught on…
WOW what a discard he threw at me..
I needed this today!
Me too ❤
Sam. You help me so much. Thank you xxxx
What do I do now, I stayed 30 years in the marriage, he fought with my son kicked my son out of his business my son worked for him. He got violent with my son kicked him out of the house. He ruined my daughters marriage. Liquidated all assets, sold from under me. Left us with very little. My kids act like him now full of rage, lashing out, calling me names, I don't know what to do. He discarded them also. They are mad at me that I was not smart and I didn't understand what Narcissist was.
Now his back in there life, he promised my son his going to pay for his wedding. I m scared his going to disappoint him. He acted like a stranger to them for 5 years. My kids are
damaged. I don't know what to do. He wanted me to go back 2 years ago I said no. Now he has a new younger girlfriend has a good life traveling the world. While we suffered from depression, anxiety, angry, cant movie forward in life.
I was addicted to him for 30 years crawled away half dead
dr sam is genius from another planet
Still learning from you everyday! My narc ex also went to jail for fraud before I met him, ha!
So interesting to hear your journey into this life mission!
I had kids with a narcissistic- together for 18 yrs- fought in court for 3 yrs for NO parental rights & won- it was the hardest thing mentally I’ve ever had to do
To have to ask permission to see your child from the narcissist and have them do parental alienation to you and the child? That is hard as well. He has tried to provoke me to violence and I refuse to be that way to anybody.
My child will be free soon…. I will be waiting.
It will be a long road to recovery but I too am walking the same road.
Another brilliant post Sam . A very big thanks for your amazing work that you do . So insightful and very helpful.
...so thankful for you again, Bro...so eloquent.
Brilliant ❤
Thank you, Prof Vaknin for everything you have inadvertently done for me.
Brilliant! Sam is such an interesting person. His honesty is a breath of fresh air.
Excellent insight. Thank'you.
My mother is a narcissist, has dementia, and is 86 years old. Unfortunately for me, I have been charged with her care and there's no one else to take care of her.
I know that her father was abusive, to what extent I don't know.
My father was sexually abused by a priest for many years as a child. Looking back, my brother has been a narcissist since childhood, even though neither of us were really abused that I can remember. I could be blocking but I don't think so.
There's a lot of what the Doctor said in this interview that resonates with my current situation. Taking care of my Mom since my father passed has been the time that I realized how narcissistic she is. It's deffinatly like dealing with a child. I've had to set strict boundaries and diligently enforce those boundaries without being cruel.
It's helpful to know that narcissism can be caused by abuse. I think my brother was susceptible to being a narcissist because he is week minded and allowed my mother to make him that way. My father was not narcissistic even though he was abused and I'm not either. Very interesting video.
Narcissist: you are not good enough, because you don't confirm to my internal image of you, and whenever I get a glance of this, I will respond with abuse. Midwit psychologist: you are good enough. Tell yourself that you are good enough. But that is not true, because as is stated in Rilke's poem 'Archaïscher Torso Apollos': "Du musst dein Leben ändern" (you have to change your life). You still have to reach your potential, especially because the narcissist has constantly been sabotaging you, but also in general because of the human condition: what we are is nothing, what we can become is everything.
The man has started the discard and sent this text message to me “ Man look at the pics close u upgrade drastically with me not jus physically u crazy if I haven't been super beneficial to u”
Thanks a lot 🌹🙏
Thanks for this
I’m 11 months away from a narc/Psycopath and have been in trauma since her pay for the same time and yet I still find myself paralysed by obsession. I think I relate to the idea that I want to escape from life. Also had a narc mother so I have the coalition voices. All about how I look old and not good enough. I was strong and walked away because I wanted to survive but cannot let go of the mental obsession/addiction. I still long for him to ‘see’ me. Longing for the gaze perhaps? Any tips would be much appreciated
Sam is an absolute genius .
... How come I find you poetic somehow Mr Vaknin?
My role in it was trusting a woman I shouldnt have...my wife. Im getting a dog, its loyal.
Yes dogs are mentally sane
32:17 , spot on
Of course I took my responsibility in it he showed me my own narcissistic traits not going into the story the pasts the past i moved on
Sam, where can I find the images and quotes you have edited in this video?
Thank you for your works. Much obliged
On my Instagram accounts vakninsamnarcissist and narcissismwithvaknin
@@samvaknin bravo. thank you
You know. I have very much difficulty of understanding something.
I know a narcissist is a victim of his childhood.(Of himself) So he couldn’t do anything about it. (It feels very sad(being neglected when you were a child/baby)) in there most fragile period.
At the other hand, we need to go ‘no contact’ with them.
For me, it feels very contradictory. It gives me ambiguous feeling.
A dissonant feeling…
Because going ‘no contact’ with a narcissist/person (or in general) is something harsh to do. (Specially when they think (or believe), they love you)
As an “empath”, and within the knowledge of knowing they are a sad victim of there youth. You, also abandon them. So you do the same, AS what happend when they were a baby. You contribute within the same kind of abuse! (When they were mortified or when you defined there narratives, even more.) Mortification would be something again, horribly to go through..
What is worse?: Being dead? Or living your whole life searching for true love, but never be able to find it? Because it’s not and will never be within their reach?
It’s sad. I believe, you can only fight evil, not with evil. But with doing the opposite, with a light.. And never let someone, let it lose it, despite the circumstances or what happend. No?
That is what keeps an empathic person stuck. Trying to show the narcissist that there is love and empathy.. You love the Narcissist or that wounded child that they were and are. However, a narcissist will devalue you and abandon you as if you never existed when they find other supply..They are charming when they need you and you are an object otherwise. When you are so depleated you can not serve them anymore... or when you get sick they also abandon you. If you stay long enough you burn out and have nothing left. You become a shell yourself... You even can begin to use a few narcissistic tactics to survive... There comes a time that you realize that the narcissist can not change. I listened to a Christian woman online say that we can not waist empathy on a demon that influences the narcissist ( she meant that literally).. empathy can help and change a flawed but normal human being... One thing I think about is that many people have Horrific childhoods.some become narcissists some become more sensitive to the pain of others and decide not to hurt people as they were hurt.. Often, most often it is the narcissist that discards YOU , over and over.... some of us have had 20 plus years of it and it can kill your spirit.. Narcissists usually find other supply... they may miss what you provided... such as loyalty, a personal assitant a confidant but they do not appreciate and love YOU.... only what you provided........... this is my expereince.. Dr. Vakin is highly intellectual and has personal and book knowledge but I do not believe he can place himself fully in their shoes of a person who is not a narcisisst who is empathic . Leaving someone who is using you, disrespecting you, playing mind games, gaslighting....etc. is not being evil. It is self preservation.. I tried for 21 years.. and the person I was with may not even be a full blown narc... but there was enough damage,.. He always seemed to need me... and I am a rescuer and I had a love for him.... I have to take responsibility for my part in my own abuse................ so Benitictube, you sound as if you have not been with a narc or been too long with a narc.... do not waist 21 years.. DR, Vaknin is an anomaly ( In my opinion) in that he is self aware.. he is so intelligent and can see from a birdseye view...... Most Narcs can not face their flaws... or take responsibility. They blame you... my ex told me there are no victims only volunteers...... thay may be true to a degree but also a cold rationalization...... I thought that my love and care would change my ex.. it did not... but it damaged me... to the point I am not as empathic as I used to be and I trust less... I save my empathy for children who are truly innocent...... a few years ago I was told by a random lady who I told my story to... (she was older and wise) and told me to not waist ONE MORE MINUTE of my time on him.... I did not listen. he devalued me and discarded me until he needed me again to rescue him from another problem....... and he is very intelligent and capable... but his life is a soap opera of sexual exploits....... one last point ( and sorry I am long winded but my brain is in a fog still)...... you mention having a light and well many in the spiritual communities believe that empathic people do carry a light and narcissists are sent by the evil one ( satan) to extinguish that... knock you off of your path. I know that the spiritual answers do not sit well in intellectual discussions or pyschology but I do believe there is something to it...... The Dr. who is a narcissist has said to go no contact..... I think ( in my case) after 21 years... I can give myself permission because I did all I could do.... I centered my life around his and .... he does not care....... the relationship is like a drug ( by the way).... I over shared to vent and to also give you some insight into what will happen if you remain.
@@cynthiabiel7714 I agree with you and thank you for sharing your poignant perspective.
Dr. Vaknin, I know you say a covert narcissist is not psychopathically intentional…but can they be both a narcissist and a psychopath? The covert narcissist I experienced would manipulate and create intentional situations where he would lie and cheat me in business dealings to get the outcome to benefit him.
Yes. A small percentage are comorbid psychopathic narcissists.
Thank you for responding- it’s most appreciated!
It would be cool if you made these as a podcast too.
They are podcasted.
I unfortunately had to co-parent or at least thought I did. If I knew what I knew now I would have limited my daughters time with her father. U said by the time they are 16 after being exposed to both myself and the narc hopefully they make the right choice. My daughter has just turned 16 and it did not turn in my favor . I am broken being separated from her. I would love to have your insight on my situation it’s a long shot but if your willing to hear my story maybe you could help. It’s tragic and I pray I can rebuild .
@samvaknin
Sam, you mention that Narcissism can arise when the early developmental phase of separation and individuation (at 18-36 months) is not happening successfully.
Let's say you are co-parenting with a narcissistic mother. Would it be enough that the toddler is with the other parent (i.e., not seeing the mother) repeatedly for some time in that phase to break the generational cycle of merging and fusing?
To some extent, yes.
CULTISH with an “N” 😉
They would suck the soul out of you.
Have been listening to Sam for a while now, I love his work. It’s great to hear an Irish interview with him. 🇮🇪🙏🏻🇮🇪
"They would suck the soul out of you."
This is not just a saying, I had one of those Near Death Experiences (NDE's) (more commonly mistaken for Out of Body Experiences) (OOBE) after my ex and I split. Shortly after, we remained in contact, and she also told me how she had one as well. When having an NDE, it feels like your soul leaves your body, and you travel to another dimension, kind of ironic how the saying fit's the experience.
Is it possible then for one to "get" more intense narcassist traits due to THC consumption?
Coke and alcohol are documented to produce temporary grandiosity (watch the video on this channel). Not enough data on cannabis.
Prof if psychopathy is a brain abnormality can one become psychopathic at least in behaviour and thinking from brain damage through long term alcohol and drug addiction?
Yes. Search the channel for "brain".
@@samvaknin thank you!
What about a covert entitled narcissist that is very evil and was treated like a queen and given everything not abused a very very evil woman
“Giving” a kid absolutely everything is neglect and abuse too. Kids needs boundaries. This was the case of the narcissist I know.