I have searched high and low for the answer to this one important question. And you have answered it thank you. The question was… What happens when the system is regenerating and you need to use water? There is a bypass where the normal water or untreated water goes into the house while that process is in progress. Thank you so much
Jim, retired master plumber here as well as at one time, a WQA certified water specialist. I agree that most people will benefit by installing a softener but disagree as to the level of hardness. The WQA if memory serves recommends anything above 3.5 grains per gallon will benefit from softening. That might be a tad low but not by much. The terms you were using I will also disagree with. A softener is not a filter so it doesn't clean water. What takes place is ion exchange. The resin bed has a natural affinity for calcium and magnesium ions, when regenerated the resin is overwhelmed with such a strong sodium solution that it releases the calcium and or magnesium and a sodium ion reattaches. So even when working perfectly, and after a complete rinsing of the resin, the water now has a higher sodium content than before. That is from the ion exchange, higher sodium and hopefully no more calcium and magnesium. But these trace amounts of sodium added, IMHO, will never be detected by the user, even when on a low sodium diet. The amount of water you would have to drink to notice elevated sodium is more than you can drink. If you think it is still an issue, install an R.O. filter. The overwhelming majority, again IMHO, do not need to go over a 1 cu. ft. resin bed. It all depends on the size of the house and occupants. Much like sizing a water heater, not a hot water heater because you don't need to heat hot water, most residential heaters of 80 gal elec. or 50 gas are sufficient. The houses that need bigger heaters are the ones that would need a larger than 1 cu. ft. resin bed also. Some small condo's etc with one occupant only need a 1/2 or 3/4 cu. fu. But basically, you want to regenerate your bed once a week, so size accordingly. Personally, I use a Fleck 5600 metered softener control head. Reliable, competitively priced and easy to get parts to service. I would recommend avoiding the very high priced proprietary name brands that you can't get parts for unless a dealer. The amount of salt you will save by using their best of the best softener works out to just pennies saved, salt is very cheap. I buy mine a the box store for about 10 cents a pound.
From you expertise, I'm wondering your opinion on the effects a salt softener has on a residential gas water heater. Specifically a magnesium anode rod. I've heard recommendations to install an aluminum anode rod. Does the higher sodium content in the water damage the water heater tank itself ? Thanks for your time.
@@giovannip The higher sodium content from softening water does no harm to a water heater tank. I'll qualify that with a side note, a higher sodium content would make water more conductive to electricity. In that sense you could argue that galvanic corrosion would then be more active. Such as when a copper water pipe is screwed directly into a steel water heater tank, done by the overwhelming majority of plumbers, using a male adapter which creates an environment for galvanic corrosion. The proper way to join two dissimilar metals with fluid flowing between them is to use a dielectric union. (Edit: The purpose of a dielectric union is to remove the continuity between the two dissimilar metals thereby stopping the corrosion. On the nobility scale of metals, the copper pipe is above the steel tank and so the tank will corrode without the dielectric uniion. That is the purpose of the sacrificial anode rod, it is lower on the nobility scale than the steel tank so it will corrode, thereby increasing the service life of the heater tank) The reason some people may want to try changing their anode rod from magnesium to aluminum is for an odor. Sometimes, depending on different dissolved solids you may have in your water, they can react with the anode rod in the water heater and create an odor that will be noticeable when the water is first turned on after a time of inactivity, such as the morning when you first use it. The odor doesn't last long and it only happens after periods of non use, but still, some people want to eliminate it.
What is your experience with the “softeners” that are a coil wire wrapped around the water pipe? I was skeptical but have used one for 5 years and it seems to work well?
@@mori8424 I am also skeptical. It would be easy enough to test though. Test a sample for hardness before it goes through the "coil wire wrapped around the pipe" and also a sample after flowing through it. I would be surprised if it changed. I have also seen "magnetic softeners" where the water flows through a magnetic field. I even purchased a couple many years ago. They were also supposed to improve gas mileage if used on a fuel line. My opinion after using them is, snake oil.
I’m a master plumber. Med has certified. Backflow test and survey certified. Even have my EPA 608 universal license. But I know very little about water softeners and water quality. Where can I go to learn more on water quality? I have a customer with a TDS reading over 700. Not sure what that translates to grains but it’s ABSURD. I need to learn more on the subject of water quality, how to treat different situations, and how to work on these softeners
Thank you for such an informative video! What about a C02 system to soften water since I just want it for helping preserve the homes pipes and appliances and don't mind the nutritional magnesium and calcium in our well water, and not really wanting those minerals to be replaced by sodium chloride. Thanks for any advice you have on using C02 to soften.
EZ, you will not get perfectly soft water for at least a month because of the water heater. You should be at least less than 13 grains hard within a couple of days as long as you use the water heater.
I have well water, a water softner, and a 12 yr old water heater with magnesium Rod…and I’m having a rotten egg smell in the Hot water only. I want to get a new water heater…which type (aluminum, magnesium, aluminum/zinc, or Corro-protect electric anode Rod), do u recommend and how often should I replace the anode Rod?? I just want to make sure when I get the new water heater that it never develops this rotten egg smell. Thanks!!!!! :)
@nchen6150, if that was my water heater, I would remove the rod completely, drain and flush the heater, put a 3/4” pipe plug in the opening where the rod came out and keep the heater until it leaks. As far as a new heater, there is no guarantee that you won’t get the smell again. I don’t know if you can order a heater with a particular type of magnesium rod. The only heater I would recommend today would be an on demand gas heater.
Hey Grumpy Plumber! We live in Northern Michigan and need your input... We just had a water softener installed in the well house of our duplexes, but have to have the brine tanks (2) just outside it. We built a little "shed" around them, but the water lines to the brine tank are exposed (inside the shed). What's the best way to protect these lines from these Michigan Winters?? Thanks so much!
You need to keep those lines from freezing so insulating them will not prevent freezing. You need to heat the shed. Or, can you install smaller brine tanks that measure 11x11x40” in the well house?
A water softener is a water softener, and GE doesn’t make water softeners or water heaters, they just put their name on the product. They buy them from the cheapest manufacturer that will make them. But a 1/2 cubic foot volume softener as that should be enough for two people.
Can I install it by tapping on the water heater inlet to the softener then back to the water heater inlet?there is nothing out there that explain the installations.
Does water softener destroys the tank water heater? Also would it better to have the city water goes to 1. Whole house water filter then 2. Water softener then 3. Tank water heater then 4. Whole house reverse osmosis ?
If you are going to get a water softener, put it on the whole house. A water softener is cheaper than an RO system. A water softener is good for the hot water heater, the on demand heater, for all fixtures; and a water softener, when it regenerates, cleans 99% of the salt out of the mineral bed. An RO system for the whole house will probably cost $15,000 plus.
As you asking if your water softener caused pinhole leaks in your copper water lines? Or, did someone give you that information. I have a bridge for sale, are you interested?
Interested in the NaCl vs. KCl mention. I get that the resin bed is thoroughly flushed at regen, but as a hypertension patient I wonder if it isn't just good insurance to go with KCl? Also, as a freshwater aquarist I wonder about the better of the two. My understanding is the water softening process strips valuable Mg. RO filtered, or distilled is safest but I'm on a well with pretty irony water, and need a softener for domestic uses. Lastly, I wonder when to change the resin bed? Thanks for sharing!
ChuckD59, I recommend salt because I believe it does a better job especially if you have iron in the water. I recommend changing the mineral bed every 15 yrs. if you keep salt in it continuously.
I don't want a full on softener but am looking into a water conditioner with a resin tank. What are you thoughts on those systems and are they safe to drink?
Sae, are you talking about a whole house filter because a whole house filter is used to clean the water and then it goes into a softener. I recommend a water softener. The water that goes through a softener is drinkable. There is almost no salt in the water from a softener today. They clean themselves very well. The salt is used to clean the resin tank.
@nfn7121, I recommend a softener that uses salt. A softener that uses salt will clean the water better and when it cleans itself, it flushes all the salt out of the mineral bed so you don’t get any in your water. Do not buy a softener from a box store. Brand name does not matter. Make sure the mineral bed is at least 2 cubic foot. Try to get it a $2500 installed. If you buy one from a softener distributor, it will cost around $800 and you’ll need to install it yourself.
Real Wood Furniture, I recommend two units which include the salt tank and a mineral bed tank. I always recommend a two cubic foot mineral bed. My reasoning is: you can use more water before it has to regenerate and they should be all the same price.
It doesn’t matter on the brand of water softeners. I always recommend a 2 cubic foot as they will regenerate less and they are the same price as a 1 cubic foot. Check with your plumber. You’ll pay more money for a softener from a major water softener company because they pay commission to their employees. Do NOT rent a softener. It’s cheaper to own one.
Hello, I'm looking for a water softener for our home. It's a 4 bed 3.5 bath home. Family of 4. Any recommendations on softeners? I literally have no idea what is a good brand or models.
Shawn, a water softener is a water softener, it doesn’t matter the name. I recommend for every house a two cubic foot. That means the mineral bed size. You don’t want to buy a softener that the brine tank and mineral bed are combined in one as that is too small. Buy a mineral tank and a salt tank as they come together. There is no difference in price between a 1 cubic foot and a 2 1/2 cubic foot. You don’t want to pay more than $2000 installed. If you want to buy it yourself and put it in, it’s not hard to do. If you buy from a distributor, you save even more.
shannon brunger, a water softener must be in a vertical position but you can bury the tank but not the control valves. You also have a brine tank that can be buried. Both can be installed outside in warm climates.
Mr grumpy plumber, when I turn on my shower I need to turn the lever almost all the way up on the hot side to have a comfortable temperature. If I accident,y touch that lever I am suddenly freezing. Why is there no gradual range in temperature?
Michael, if this is a single handle shower faucet with a pressure balance cartridge, you probably need a new cartridge. It doesn’t sound like you run out of water, just can’t control it. One more thing you might look at; the pressure balance shower faucets have a stop on the handle and they only go so far. You might be able to rotate the stop and that might help. Good luck.
@@TheGrumpyPlumber My City pressure is not 80 psi, it is actually much lower. Do I still add a pressure regulator valve for an increase in supply pressure or just remove the piece inside the shower heads which does not help with the rest of the house ie dishwasher and faucets? How to get increased pressure is basically the question. (I installed an Aquasana and it is certainly not any softer water!---Our CIty went RO so took out old water softener that had gone bad thinking no need replace, then found RO wasn't what it was even prior to RO with softener, so ok get new system hence Aquansana and now stuck again with softeness issue)
Rachel Cronin, do not put a pressure regulator in. Remove the shower saver plugs. I’m sorry you removed your water softener. A sand filter will not soften water, only a water softener can do that. Do not buy any filters or devices that go on water heaters that claim they soften the water. If you buy a softener, try not to spend over $2500. Size should be a 2 cubic foot mineral bed.Do not rent a softener. Use salt to clean the mineral bed as it does a better job than potassium.
Maher M, it doesn’t sound like you have real hard water. They claim anything over 13 grams is hard but a softener can take out iron. I recommend a two cubic foot water softener. Should be the same price of a one cubic foot water softener. The reason I would go larger is because it would regenerate less. It doesn’t matter about brand names, a softener is a softener and don’t let anyone tell you different.
I am looking into a softener but I don't have a good location to discharge water during regeneration. The only drain close is and ejector pit. What are your thoughts on a saltless alternative softener from let's say pelican? I believe their product line is Natursoft. Thanks for your time.
Kevin, you can drain the water softener into the ejector pump and you can use salt to clean the softener. I have removed four different saltless softeners because the customers were not happy with them. Go with any brand softener as they are all the same and use salt. Salt does the best job over potassium.
Kevin, P.S. buy the softener from your plumber and have them install it. Keep no more than two or three bags of salt in the brine tank at all times. You don’t want to overfill it. If you do his, you should have no problem with the softener.
@@TheGrumpyPlumber I typically do most work myself, is there a reason you suggest I hire out the job? My apprehension with draining into the ejector pit is the corrosive properties of salt and the cost of quality ejector pumps and also if the ejector pump were to fail during a regeneration couldn't I end up with a flooded pit in my basement? Thanks for your feedback. I just found your channel today and I can't stop binge watching!
Kevin, I encourage people to do their own work. I think it’s great. An ejector pump could fail at any time but I don’t think the water softener would be a hindrance. Most dangerous thing to an ejector pump is sanitary napkins. A water softener can pump up to 8 ft. High on the drain and then gravity down to your sewer outlet. Thanks for subscribing and bing watching!
I am looking at AO Smith from Lowes and Raheem from Home Depot. Does brand matter or just the capacity? AO Smith comes with a battery backup incase of power outages. How hard is it to DIY one of these things? thanks
@somebb, first thing you need to do is check the salt in the brine tank and make sure it has not hardened. If it is, remove the old salt and replace with just one bag of salt and about two gallons of water. Plug the softener in, turn the bi-pass valve so the water is running through the softener, push the regeneration button. It should take 90 minutes to regenerate or clean itself. Push the button again to repeat the process. Do this about three times. Test the water to see if it’s soft. As you use the hot water, it will replace with soft water.
@@TheGrumpyPlumber Awesome. Thank you. The tank has about 25% water, no salt, maybe 2-3 gallons of water. Should I use Iron Out products to run through the system to help the resin?
I know this is a old thread but I am trying to decide if I really need a softener. Had it tested and they are saying we’re at 5-7. Our skin feels real itchy and dry after showers. Do we really need one?
S Brownson, the only differences between water softeners are the different control heads that they have. Rain Soft makes their own softener but I don’t think they are worth the difference in price. They don’t use salt but I think they use more water. Buy a softener that uses regular salt. When I buy a softener from the company I deal with, I know they will be there when I need them. You want to get a 1 1/2 to 2 cubic foot mineral bed. The larger mineral bed is the same price as the smaller one. If you are having someone install a water softener, it shouldn’t cost more than $1800 to $2000.
Great video! I just got a softener system installed last weekend and for some reason i have a feeling it's not set correctly or something. We noticed a change on the water feel, but not really much increase with suds, we are basically using the same amount of soap. Hardness is set to 25 and I'm wondering if i lower or bump it up will do something or that will only change the cycle of the Regen and not really improve the water? I'm pretty sure i overpaid this company for this system 6,000.00 for this "avantapure platinum 269" 10x54 1.5ft3 , but as long as I get really soft water i don't mind. Just have the feeling I'm not 😒
Jose A, you did pay a lot of money for the softener but you’ve got to give it awhile to clean up the ions in the water heater. Changing the hardness would only change the regeneration. Don’t overuse soap in the dishwasher or washing machine. It will get better.
@@TheGrumpyPlumber Yeah, i went with 2 of the big plumbing companies to make sure if get quality work and equipment and honestly didn't do deep research as i normally do. Total invoice was for 7500 which included a new heater as well. The sales rep said we would have instant SW dude to having a new heater installed. Is there anything on the settings i can do to improve the water? Thanks for the reply!
Jose A, go the a hardware store or Home Depot and get a water softener test kit. That will tell you if it works or not. Another thing, are you using salt or potassium? Salt does a much better job. Salt won’t bother a septic tank if you are on one plus it will save you a lot of money. If your softener is not working, call the company and have them come back out and check it.
@@TheGrumpyPlumber Yeah I'm with a salt container , not sure if there's better "brand" of salt or if it's all the same , but for now i have what they left +2 bags. I took 2 samples of water , 1 tap and 1 house to a pool supply store and told them i wanted to check levels and see if my softener is working properly. He said there's 0 chlorine , tap water is 220 and house is now at 60. The one thing i noticed going thru the main many of the system is that it says the capacity of it is 16,000. I could swear the sales rep said we needed a 30,000 capacity because of the size of the house and 6 people. Should I call and ask for a bigger capacity one? 😅
Jose A, if the softener is working well, you should be under five grains of hardness. I would question the sizing. For what you paid, you should have gotten a two cubic foot.
jammin6816, I know that a tank replacement service is expensive. You need to see if there is any place to discharge the dirty water from the softener. A softener can pump water vertically about 8 ft. and horizontally about 30 ft. by gravity. Another thing you could do is connect the drain to a sink drain by using a branch tailpiece. Make sure all the fittings are plastic. A plumber should be able to figure out how to drain the water for you. You would save a lot of money by putting in a regular softener.
holydogg7, water softeners do not harm the piping. A water softener only uses salt to clean the mineral bed. Then it rinses 99% of the salt out of the mineral bed. That’s why it doesn’t harm the piping.
Nai Saetern, yes, about $5K too much! A water softener is made up of a mineral bed with a brine tank that cleans the mineral bed. The softener control head tells it when to work. The larger the mineral bed, the longer period between cleanings. You do not have to spend that kind of money to get a good softener. You could probably call a local plumbing company and ask how much a two cubic foot softener would cost to install. I installed one recently for a customer and it was about $2400 and I did not give it away. I have a two cubic foot capacity softener and my water is 24 grains hard. Shop around.
Nai Saetern, I don’t know what TDS means in regards to water softeners. Water softener manufacturers can’t promise you what they can take out. For example, a softener will take out 3 parts per million of iron but they can’t tell you that. A softener is just a great filter that softens the water. I recommend a large capacity softener. All softeners should work. I doesn’t matter what the name brand is. Just don’t pay $7 K for a water softener.
K James, first off, I don’t know what your labor prices are in your area. It shouldn’t take more than four to install a new water softener. If there was one you were replacing, it shouldn’t take more than two hours or less to install.
Joe DiVita, I’ve heard about them. I had a customer that installed one in a very large home and he had it removed. I don’t know why. I don’t really know anything about them. I recommend water softeners that use salt.
thank you so much for answering my question. I recently got a quote from Costco that installs Ecowater treatment systems. The price they quoted me was 5K. I am trying to find out if that a reasonable price for a water softener for the whole house? What do you think? After doing a little research, the installation job seems to be a 2 hour process that a plumber would charge between $300-$600 for the labor. The problem is the home owner has to pick the water softener. Do you know of a good water softener. My water in Carlsbad CA is very hard - 13 grains, and it looks like I would need a 48,000 grain water softener system. These seem to run in the 1000 to 2000 range. Do you know of a good one? thank you.
Joe DeVita, anything over 13 grains is considered hard water. I recommend a 48 cubic foot water softener. The price you were quoted is reasonable. I buy water softeners from Performance Water Products 6902 Aragon Circle, Buena Park, CA. 800 374-6428. They will ship directly to you as long as you are there to accept the freight, I think. It’s worth a try anyway. Doesn’t really matter the brand name.
Scott, I believe you are asking how much hardness is in your water .....anything below 14ph is good so you shouldn’t have to treat your water. ....like using a water conditioner. If you don’t like the taste of your water, I would recommend a reverse osmosis if you want good drinking water. Chemistry was not my best subject in school!
Richardson, if you are talking about cast- iron drain lines, then, no, a softener would not be a problem. If you’re talking about galvanized water lines, a softener would not bother them either. Soft water will not eat up the pipes, it will improve your water quality.
Tom Tillman, I was on a septic tank for over 20 years and I would flush the brine into the tank and it never caused a problem with the bacteria in the tank.
Our city website says, "conventional water softening systems (those that use salts) may not be suitable for people on sodium-reduced diets." But, I thought we did not drink the treated water!
The new generation water softeners use the salt to clean the mineral bed and then it rinses the salt out of the mineral bed. You probably get more salt from a McDonald hamburger than you would get from your water softener. When water softeners were first used, they were manually cleaned and that’s when there was salt in the water. New softeners are computer driven and clean themselves. You can use potassium instead of salt but it is very expensive and doesn’t do as good of a job cleaning the mineral bed. Some people have a separate water spout and others have an RO drinking system.
Jungle Viper, filters can’t soften water. It will filter the water but not make it soft. You want the whole house to have soft water, correct? You need to locate the water softener where the water comes into the house. You want to tie in your outside faucets and your drinking water before the softener. I do not recommend putting the softener at the inlet of the water heater as that will only give you softened hot water. If you are worrying about the drain on the water softener, you can pump it vertically for 8 ft. for a total of around 30 ft. horizontally.
Ayman, Michigan apprenticeships are excellent, union or nonunion. I would look for a small residential plumber who would be willing to start you on an apprenticeship. Good luck.
As a Master Plumber and water treatment specialist - a lot of this information is not correct. Saying the salt "cleans the mineral bed" is flat wrong. It doesn't clean anything (take a look inside a brine tank that's been in service for a long time and you'll see what I mean; salt isn't all that clean to begin with. The salt is used in the ion exchange process, where you are essentially replacing your hardness minerals with sodium, and drawing the salt brine into the unit during regeneration actually works to overwhelm and replace all the trapped hardness minerals with sodium so the exchange process can continue. Additionally, it's not a "mineral bed" - the media in the softener is not mineral in any way, in fact, minerals are what you're trying to deal with in the first place because minerals are what make the water hard. I respect those who have worked in the trade for so long, however I've learned that a LOT of licensed plumbers simply don't understand water treatment. It's one thing to know how to pipe it in - another thing to understand how it works.
All of that said, yes, most homes could benefit from a water treatment system of some kind. It's also important to test your water before simply installing a water softener. Many well systems have other nuisance issues that can cause problems with a softener, along with harming your home's plumbing (iron, both ferric and ferrous, iron bacteria, acidic water, manganese, etc.). You need to know what's in your water before trying to treat it - I've had to cut out many, many softeners over the years from plumbers who don't know any better and think a softener is all that's needed.
Mike Fa, do not use soft water on plants, indoor plants or outdoor. Water softeners and water conditioners are both the same. A whole house carbon filter will not soften the water.
@@TheGrumpyPlumber I am in the limestone capital. The limestone for the Pentagon, the US Capitol, empire state building, etc. Came from here. Our city water has coated the hot water heater with so much limestone/calcium to both elements. I want to put in a water softener to deal with it.
Just get a Flek mechanical water softner. You dont need a freekin computer on a watersoftner.Every time the power goes out you will be downstairs screwing around with it and eventually replacing it. there junk.
Muddy, Flex is a brand name of the head on a water softener. I don’t know if you can call it a computer or not, but it’s an electronic board in the head that tells the softener when to regenerate.
@@TheGrumpyPlumber You can get a mechanical head that does not have a electronic board. Fleck makes the heads for many of the other brands but they also make there own and they make one with a mechanical head that was used for decades in the past and worked fine.
He's the not so grumpy plumber. Thanks for the advice!
I have searched high and low for the answer to this one important question. And you have answered it thank you. The question was… What happens when the system is regenerating and you need to use water? There is a bypass where the normal water or untreated water goes into the house while that process is in progress. Thank you so much
This is some great strait forward advice with no BS! You just got a new sub and like!
100% Agreed. We always have softener in our house. Our city water is quite hard. It helps protect our plumbing system too.
Jim, retired master plumber here as well as at one time, a WQA certified water specialist. I agree that most people will benefit by installing a softener but disagree as to the level of hardness. The WQA if memory serves recommends anything above 3.5 grains per gallon will benefit from softening. That might be a tad low but not by much. The terms you were using I will also disagree with. A softener is not a filter so it doesn't clean water. What takes place is ion exchange. The resin bed has a natural affinity for calcium and magnesium ions, when regenerated the resin is overwhelmed with such a strong sodium solution that it releases the calcium and or magnesium and a sodium ion reattaches. So even when working perfectly, and after a complete rinsing of the resin, the water now has a higher sodium content than before. That is from the ion exchange, higher sodium and hopefully no more calcium and magnesium. But these trace amounts of sodium added, IMHO, will never be detected by the user, even when on a low sodium diet. The amount of water you would have to drink to notice elevated sodium is more than you can drink. If you think it is still an issue, install an R.O. filter. The overwhelming majority, again IMHO, do not need to go over a 1 cu. ft. resin bed. It all depends on the size of the house and occupants. Much like sizing a water heater, not a hot water heater because you don't need to heat hot water, most residential heaters of 80 gal elec. or 50 gas are sufficient. The houses that need bigger heaters are the ones that would need a larger than 1 cu. ft. resin bed also. Some small condo's etc with one occupant only need a 1/2 or 3/4 cu. fu. But basically, you want to regenerate your bed once a week, so size accordingly. Personally, I use a Fleck 5600 metered softener control head. Reliable, competitively priced and easy to get parts to service. I would recommend avoiding the very high priced proprietary name brands that you can't get parts for unless a dealer. The amount of salt you will save by using their best of the best softener works out to just pennies saved, salt is very cheap. I buy mine a the box store for about 10 cents a pound.
From you expertise, I'm wondering your opinion on the effects a salt softener has on a residential gas water heater. Specifically a magnesium anode rod. I've heard recommendations to install an aluminum anode rod. Does the higher sodium content in the water damage the water heater tank itself ? Thanks for your time.
@@giovannip The higher sodium content from softening water does no harm to a water heater tank. I'll qualify that with a side note, a higher sodium content would make water more conductive to electricity. In that sense you could argue that galvanic corrosion would then be more active. Such as when a copper water pipe is screwed directly into a steel water heater tank, done by the overwhelming majority of plumbers, using a male adapter which creates an environment for galvanic corrosion. The proper way to join two dissimilar metals with fluid flowing between them is to use a dielectric union. (Edit: The purpose of a dielectric union is to remove the continuity between the two dissimilar metals thereby stopping the corrosion. On the nobility scale of metals, the copper pipe is above the steel tank and so the tank will corrode without the dielectric uniion. That is the purpose of the sacrificial anode rod, it is lower on the nobility scale than the steel tank so it will corrode, thereby increasing the service life of the heater tank) The reason some people may want to try changing their anode rod from magnesium to aluminum is for an odor. Sometimes, depending on different dissolved solids you may have in your water, they can react with the anode rod in the water heater and create an odor that will be noticeable when the water is first turned on after a time of inactivity, such as the morning when you first use it. The odor doesn't last long and it only happens after periods of non use, but still, some people want to eliminate it.
What is your experience with the “softeners” that are a coil wire wrapped around the water pipe? I was skeptical but have used one for 5 years and it seems to work well?
@@mori8424 I am also skeptical. It would be easy enough to test though. Test a sample for hardness before it goes through the "coil wire wrapped around the pipe" and also a sample after flowing through it. I would be surprised if it changed. I have also seen "magnetic softeners" where the water flows through a magnetic field. I even purchased a couple many years ago. They were also supposed to improve gas mileage if used on a fuel line. My opinion after using them is, snake oil.
I’m a master plumber. Med has certified. Backflow test and survey certified. Even have my EPA 608 universal license. But I know very little about water softeners and water quality.
Where can I go to learn more on water quality? I have a customer with a TDS reading over 700. Not sure what that translates to grains but it’s ABSURD. I need to learn more on the subject of water quality, how to treat different situations, and how to work on these softeners
It's amazing that we are able to benefit from so much Knowledge and experience! thanks Mr. Grumpy keep up your great job. Highly appreciated!.
I don't mind a grumpy guy AT ALL... I find they're the most honest.
Thank you for your wisdom, Sir!
Great advice! Your dad seems too nice to be grumpy!
Another great commentary by the non grumpy plumber....I love you
Really helpful info! Thank you!
I love your dad and his advice I had to subscribe! I have really hard water in my area and I don’t know much about this so this was helpful
Hey, you guys are great! Thanks for what you do!
LOL I asked my priest about water softeners and he said to ask Jim the Grumpy Plumber!
Less than four minutes in and I am smarter and saving money already! Thanks guys.
Good advice 👍 as always enjoy your wisdom.. great channel
Great info! How about downflow vs upflow system? Which one is better, pro's and cons ? Thanks
Nokias X, I’m not sure what you mean by a downflow and upflow system on a water softener.
@3.30 right to point, great talk.
Thank you for such an informative video! What about a C02 system to soften water since I just want it for helping preserve the homes pipes and appliances and don't mind the nutritional magnesium and calcium in our well water, and not really wanting those minerals to be replaced by sodium chloride. Thanks for any advice you have on using C02 to soften.
Thanks for the info!
Thanks for the info
Great info as always GP
This guy is great!
Great information. Thank you.
Jim, Thank you for your video!
what TDS numbers should show after water softener system installed?
EZ, you will not get perfectly soft water for at least a month because of the water heater. You should be at least less than 13 grains hard within a couple of days as long as you use the water heater.
I like the grumpy old man who I can get the job done properly
My house was built in 1987 and no water softener ready connections, Can I tap it to the water heater?
I have well water, a water softner, and a 12 yr old water heater with magnesium Rod…and I’m having a rotten egg smell in the Hot water only. I want to get a new water heater…which type (aluminum, magnesium, aluminum/zinc, or Corro-protect electric anode Rod), do u recommend and how often should I replace the anode Rod?? I just want to make sure when I get the new water heater that it never develops this rotten egg smell. Thanks!!!!! :)
@nchen6150, if that was my water heater, I would remove the rod completely, drain and flush the heater, put a 3/4” pipe plug in the opening where the rod came out and keep the heater until it leaks. As far as a new heater, there is no guarantee that you won’t get the smell again. I don’t know if you can order a heater with a particular type of magnesium rod. The only heater I would recommend today would be an on demand gas heater.
Hey Grumpy Plumber! We live in Northern Michigan and need your input... We just had a water softener installed in the well house of our duplexes, but have to have the brine tanks (2) just outside it. We built a little "shed" around them, but the water lines to the brine tank are exposed (inside the shed). What's the best way to protect these lines from these Michigan Winters?? Thanks so much!
You need to keep those lines from freezing so insulating them will not prevent freezing. You need to heat the shed. Or, can you install smaller brine tanks that measure 11x11x40” in the well house?
Heated the shed! Thanks!!@@TheGrumpyPlumber
Wondering what brand of water softener you like. We were thinking about the GE model. Just 2 of us in the house
A water softener is a water softener, and GE doesn’t make water softeners or water heaters, they just put their name on the product. They buy them from the cheapest manufacturer that will make them. But a 1/2 cubic foot volume softener as that should be enough for two people.
Can I install it by tapping on the water heater inlet to the softener then back to the water heater inlet?there is nothing out there that explain the installations.
Does water softener destroys the tank water heater? Also would it better to have the city water goes to 1. Whole house water filter then 2. Water softener then 3. Tank water heater then 4. Whole house reverse osmosis ?
If you are going to get a water softener, put it on the whole house. A water softener is cheaper than an RO system. A water softener is good for the hot water heater, the on demand heater, for all fixtures; and a water softener, when it regenerates, cleans 99% of the salt out of the mineral bed. An RO system for the whole house will probably cost $15,000 plus.
Is there any concerns about pinhole leaks in copper due to water softener?
As you asking if your water softener caused pinhole leaks in your copper water lines? Or, did someone give you that information. I have a bridge for sale, are you interested?
Interested in the NaCl vs. KCl mention.
I get that the resin bed is thoroughly flushed at regen, but as a hypertension patient I wonder if it isn't just good insurance to go with KCl?
Also, as a freshwater aquarist I wonder about the better of the two. My understanding is the water softening process strips valuable Mg. RO filtered, or distilled is safest but I'm on a well with pretty irony water, and need a softener for domestic uses.
Lastly, I wonder when to change the resin bed?
Thanks for sharing!
ChuckD59, I recommend salt because I believe it does a better job especially if you have iron in the water. I recommend changing the mineral bed every 15 yrs. if you keep salt in it continuously.
What’s a good unit for a small town home that can be placed outside
jag king custom designs, I recommend a water softener with a fleck control head. Any water softener should be able to be installed outside.
I don't want a full on softener but am looking into a water conditioner with a resin tank. What are you thoughts on those systems and are they safe to drink?
Sae, are you talking about a whole house filter because a whole house filter is used to clean the water and then it goes into a softener. I recommend a water softener. The water that goes through a softener is drinkable. There is almost no salt in the water from a softener today. They clean themselves very well. The salt is used to clean the resin tank.
Hey there! I am a priest and can tell that we also put salt (+ prayer) into the water to "make holy water."
We have hard water. So what is the best recommended system to get?
@nfn7121, I recommend a softener that uses salt. A softener that uses salt will clean the water better and when it cleans itself, it flushes all the salt out of the mineral bed so you don’t get any in your water. Do not buy a softener from a box store. Brand name does not matter. Make sure the mineral bed is at least 2 cubic foot. Try to get it a $2500 installed. If you buy one from a softener distributor, it will cost around $800 and you’ll need to install it yourself.
Do you recomend a 2 in one unit or having the cylindar separate from the salt tank?
Real Wood Furniture, I recommend two units which include the salt tank and a mineral bed tank. I always recommend a two cubic foot mineral bed. My reasoning is: you can use more water before it has to regenerate and they should be all the same price.
The Grumpy Plumber sure knows his onions!
What kind do you recommend?
It doesn’t matter on the brand of water softeners. I always recommend a 2 cubic foot as they will regenerate less and they are the same price as a 1 cubic foot. Check with your plumber. You’ll pay more money for a softener from a major water softener company because they pay commission to their employees. Do NOT rent a softener. It’s cheaper to own one.
Hello, I'm looking for a water softener for our home. It's a 4 bed 3.5 bath home. Family of 4. Any recommendations on softeners? I literally have no idea what is a good brand or models.
Shawn, a water softener is a water softener, it doesn’t matter the name. I recommend for every house a two cubic foot. That means the mineral bed size. You don’t want to buy a softener that the brine tank and mineral bed are combined in one as that is too small. Buy a mineral tank and a salt tank as they come together. There is no difference in price between a 1 cubic foot and a 2 1/2 cubic foot.
You don’t want to pay more than $2000 installed. If you want to buy it yourself and put it in, it’s not hard to do. If you buy from a distributor, you save even more.
Can you put a water softener in a flower bed and cover it up or do they have to stand up
shannon brunger, a water softener must be in a vertical position but you can bury the tank but not the control valves. You also have a brine tank that can be buried. Both can be installed outside in warm climates.
Mr grumpy plumber, when I turn on my shower I need to turn the lever almost all the way up on the hot side to have a comfortable temperature. If I accident,y touch that lever I am suddenly freezing. Why is there no gradual range in temperature?
Michael, if this is a single handle shower faucet with a pressure balance cartridge, you probably need a new cartridge. It doesn’t sound like you run out of water, just can’t control it. One more thing you might look at; the pressure balance shower faucets have a stop on the handle and they only go so far. You might be able to rotate the stop and that might help. Good luck.
Heyo! If ive got 80psi coming in (city water) should i install a pressure reducing valve?
Dave, you want that pressure to be around 60-65 psi so yes, install a pressure regulator.
@@TheGrumpyPlumber Thanks! The channel is great btw!
@@TheGrumpyPlumber My City pressure is not 80 psi, it is actually much lower. Do I still add a pressure regulator valve for an increase in supply pressure or just remove the piece inside the shower heads which does not help with the rest of the house ie dishwasher and faucets? How to get increased pressure is basically the question. (I installed an Aquasana and it is certainly not any softer water!---Our CIty went RO so took out old water softener that had gone bad thinking no need replace, then found RO wasn't what it was even prior to RO with softener, so ok get new system hence Aquansana and now stuck again with softeness issue)
Rachel Cronin, do not put a pressure regulator in. Remove the shower saver plugs. I’m sorry you removed your water softener. A sand filter will not soften water, only a water softener can do that. Do not buy any filters or devices that go on water heaters that claim they soften the water. If you buy a softener, try not to spend over $2500. Size should be a 2 cubic foot mineral bed.Do not rent a softener. Use salt to clean the mineral bed as it does a better job than potassium.
Hello, The water in my house reach 15 GPG, What do you recommend to install in order to get soft water, Regards
Maher M, it doesn’t sound like you have real hard water. They claim anything over 13 grams is hard but a softener can take out iron. I recommend a two cubic foot water softener. Should be the same price of a one cubic foot water softener. The reason I would go larger is because it would regenerate less. It doesn’t matter about brand names, a softener is a softener and don’t let anyone tell you different.
great tips, and seems very legit...
I am looking into a softener but I don't have a good location to discharge water during regeneration. The only drain close is and ejector pit. What are your thoughts on a saltless alternative softener from let's say pelican? I believe their product line is Natursoft. Thanks for your time.
Kevin, you can drain the water softener into the ejector pump and you can use salt to clean the softener. I have removed four different saltless softeners because the customers were not happy with them. Go with any brand softener as they are all the same and use salt. Salt does the best job over potassium.
Kevin, P.S. buy the softener from your plumber and have them install it. Keep no more than two or three bags of salt in the brine tank at all times. You don’t want to overfill it. If you do his, you should have no problem with the softener.
@@TheGrumpyPlumber I typically do most work myself, is there a reason you suggest I hire out the job? My apprehension with draining into the ejector pit is the corrosive properties of salt and the cost of quality ejector pumps and also if the ejector pump were to fail during a regeneration couldn't I end up with a flooded pit in my basement? Thanks for your feedback. I just found your channel today and I can't stop binge watching!
Kevin, I encourage people to do their own work. I think it’s great. An ejector pump could fail at any time but I don’t think the water softener would be a hindrance. Most dangerous thing to an ejector pump is sanitary napkins. A water softener can pump up to 8 ft. High on the drain and then gravity down to your sewer outlet. Thanks for subscribing and bing watching!
I am looking at AO Smith from Lowes and Raheem from Home Depot. Does brand matter or just the capacity? AO Smith comes with a battery backup incase of power outages. How hard is it to DIY one of these things? thanks
BJM, brand does not matter. You can install it yourself. Go for it.
My water has a hardness level of 6-12 grains per gallon (gpg) do i need water softener?
@@avrl12 if it was my house, I would install a softener. They are great to have in the home.
@TheGrumpyPlumber and if it's rental house, I mostly care about plumbing
My home has a water softener, has tank and salt container, it hasn't been used in a decade. Can I still use it? What exactly do I do?
@somebb, first thing you need to do is check the salt in the brine tank and make sure it has not hardened. If it is, remove the old salt and replace with just one bag of salt and about two gallons of water. Plug the softener in, turn the bi-pass valve so the water is running through the softener, push the regeneration button. It should take 90 minutes to regenerate or clean itself. Push the button again to repeat the process. Do this about three times. Test the water to see if it’s soft. As you use the hot water, it will replace with soft water.
@@TheGrumpyPlumber Awesome. Thank you. The tank has about 25% water, no salt, maybe 2-3 gallons of water. Should I use Iron Out products to run through the system to help the resin?
@somebb, it wouldn’t hurt along with fresh new salt.
I know this is a old thread but I am trying to decide if I really need a softener. Had it tested and they are saying we’re at 5-7. Our skin feels real itchy and dry after showers. Do we really need one?
The Keeler Family, hard water is usually 13 grains of hardness. Try a different soap. Irish Spring soap can dry out your skin.
What’s the best value water softener
S Brownson, the only differences between water softeners are the different control heads that they have. Rain Soft makes their own softener but I don’t think they are worth the difference in price. They don’t use salt but I think they use more water. Buy a softener that uses regular salt. When I buy a softener from the company I deal with, I know they will be there when I need them. You want to get a 1 1/2 to 2 cubic foot mineral bed. The larger mineral bed is the same price as the smaller one. If you are having someone install a water softener, it shouldn’t cost more than $1800 to $2000.
Great video!
I just got a softener system installed last weekend and for some reason i have a feeling it's not set correctly or something.
We noticed a change on the water feel, but not really much increase with suds, we are basically using the same amount of soap. Hardness is set to 25 and I'm wondering if i lower or bump it up will do something or that will only change the cycle of the Regen and not really improve the water?
I'm pretty sure i overpaid this company for this system 6,000.00 for this "avantapure platinum 269" 10x54 1.5ft3 , but as long as I get really soft water i don't mind.
Just have the feeling I'm not 😒
Jose A, you did pay a lot of money for the softener but you’ve got to give it awhile to clean up the ions in the water heater. Changing the hardness would only change the regeneration. Don’t overuse soap in the dishwasher or washing machine. It will get better.
@@TheGrumpyPlumber
Yeah, i went with 2 of the big plumbing companies to make sure if get quality work and equipment and honestly didn't do deep research as i normally do.
Total invoice was for 7500 which included a new heater as well.
The sales rep said we would have instant SW dude to having a new heater installed.
Is there anything on the settings i can do to improve the water?
Thanks for the reply!
Jose A, go the a hardware store or Home Depot and get a water softener test kit. That will tell you if it works or not. Another thing, are you using salt or potassium? Salt does a much better job. Salt won’t bother a septic tank if you are on one plus it will save you a lot of money. If your softener is not working, call the company and have them come back out and check it.
@@TheGrumpyPlumber Yeah I'm with a salt container , not sure if there's better "brand" of salt or if it's all the same , but for now i have what they left +2 bags.
I took 2 samples of water , 1 tap and 1 house to a pool supply store and told them i wanted to check levels and see if my softener is working properly.
He said there's 0 chlorine , tap water is 220 and house is now at 60.
The one thing i noticed going thru the main many of the system is that it says the capacity of it is 16,000. I could swear the sales rep said we needed a 30,000 capacity because of the size of the house and 6 people. Should I call and ask for a bigger capacity one? 😅
Jose A, if the softener is working well, you should be under five grains of hardness. I would question the sizing. For what you paid, you should have gotten a two cubic foot.
How does he feel about a tank replacement service?
jammin6816, I know that a tank replacement service is expensive. You need to see if there is any place to discharge the dirty water from the softener. A softener can pump water vertically about 8 ft. and horizontally about 30 ft. by gravity. Another thing you could do is connect the drain to a sink drain by using a branch tailpiece. Make sure all the fittings are plastic. A plumber should be able to figure out how to drain the water for you. You would save a lot of money by putting in a regular softener.
So I take it it’s not bad for the piping
holydogg7, water softeners do not harm the piping. A water softener only uses salt to clean the mineral bed. Then it rinses 99% of the salt out of the mineral bed. That’s why it doesn’t harm the piping.
Thoughts on puronics water system? $7k too much for a system?
Nai Saetern, yes, about $5K too much! A water softener is made up of a mineral bed with a brine tank that cleans the mineral bed. The softener control head tells it when to work. The larger the mineral bed, the longer period between cleanings. You do not have to spend that kind of money to get a good softener. You could probably call a local plumbing company and ask how much a two cubic foot softener would cost to install. I installed one recently for a customer and it was about $2400 and I did not give it away. I have a two cubic foot capacity softener and my water is 24 grains hard. Shop around.
@@TheGrumpyPlumber thank you so much. I been debating on this. Can you share with me what system you have? Or recommend?
@@TheGrumpyPlumber do you know if the softener cleans TDS?
Nai Saetern, I don’t know what TDS means in regards to water softeners. Water softener manufacturers can’t promise you what they can take out. For example, a softener will take out 3 parts per million of iron but they can’t tell you that. A softener is just a great filter that softens the water. I recommend a large capacity softener. All softeners should work. I doesn’t matter what the name brand is. Just don’t pay $7 K for a water softener.
What is a fair price for labor to install one?
K James, first off, I don’t know what your labor prices are in your area. It shouldn’t take more than four to install a new water softener. If there was one you were replacing, it shouldn’t take more than two hours or less to install.
Good stuff
What about the citric acid systems? Nuvoh2o is one
Joe DiVita, I’ve heard about them. I had a customer that installed one in a very large home and he had it removed. I don’t know why. I don’t really know anything about them. I recommend water softeners that use salt.
thank you so much for answering my question. I recently got a quote from Costco that installs Ecowater treatment systems. The price they quoted me was 5K. I am trying to find out if that a reasonable price for a water softener for the whole house? What do you think? After doing a little research, the installation job seems to be a 2 hour process that a plumber would charge between $300-$600 for the labor. The problem is the home owner has to pick the water softener. Do you know of a good water softener. My water in Carlsbad CA is very hard - 13 grains, and it looks like I would need a 48,000 grain water softener system. These seem to run in the 1000 to 2000 range. Do you know of a good one? thank you.
Joe DeVita, anything over 13 grains is considered hard water. I recommend a 48 cubic foot water softener. The price you were quoted is reasonable. I buy water softeners from Performance Water Products 6902 Aragon Circle, Buena Park, CA. 800 374-6428. They will ship directly to you as long as you are there to accept the freight, I think. It’s worth a try anyway. Doesn’t really matter the brand name.
What does the salt tank do?
Bon Bon, the salt added with the water makes a brine that cleans the mineral bed in the softener. Yes, I do recommend a softener.
@@TheGrumpyPlumber thank you
Would you mind telling me what 13 grains is in the ph reading ?
Scott, I believe you are asking how much hardness is in your water .....anything below 14ph is good so you shouldn’t have to treat your water. ....like using a water conditioner. If you don’t like the taste of your water, I would recommend a reverse osmosis if you want good drinking water. Chemistry was not my best subject in school!
Would this be harder on my old cast-iron pipes than just using the hard water that I’m currently getting?
Richardson, if you are talking about cast- iron drain lines, then, no, a softener would not be a problem. If you’re talking about galvanized water lines, a softener would not bother them either. Soft water will not eat up the pipes, it will improve your water quality.
is it ok for to flush the solution into the septic tank?
Tom Tillman, I was on a septic tank for over 20 years and I would flush the brine into the tank and it never caused a problem with the bacteria in the tank.
Is there a difference between salt crystals and pellets?
Hi Mitchell, use the pellets, I don’t like crystals. Nice hearing from you!
Mitchell, P. S. Buy the pellets at Costco.
If a water softener is installed, will the hard water deposits diminish over time?
Brian Glassburn, a water softener will not get rid of lime deposits. It will definitely help keep your fixtures cleaner if you wipe them down.
@@TheGrumpyPlumber how do you get rid of the hard water deposits once after you gave the softener put in?
Our city website says, "conventional water softening systems (those that use salts) may not be suitable for people on sodium-reduced diets." But, I thought we did not drink the treated water!
The new generation water softeners use the salt to clean the mineral bed and then it rinses the salt out of the mineral bed. You probably get more salt from a McDonald hamburger than you would get from your water softener. When water softeners were first used, they were manually cleaned and that’s when there was salt in the water. New softeners are computer driven and clean themselves. You can use potassium instead of salt but it is very expensive and doesn’t do as good of a job cleaning the mineral bed. Some people have a separate water spout and others have an RO drinking system.
My priest said he will stay out of plumbing if you stay out of religion. However, your advice appears to be more reliable. ;-)
I'm interested in what your Dad said when you stated he is the grumpy plumber. you can see the edit immediately after you said grumpy plumber.
Steven Alexander, take my word for it, you don’t want to know!!
@@TheGrumpyPlumber lol
I have hard water so I was told I need a water softener. However I want the water filtered for the whole house
Jungle Viper, filters can’t soften water. It will filter the water but not make it soft. You want the whole house to have soft water, correct? You need to locate the water softener where the water comes into the house. You want to tie in your outside faucets and your drinking water before the softener. I do not recommend putting the softener at the inlet of the water heater as that will only give you softened hot water. If you are worrying about the drain on the water softener, you can pump it vertically for 8 ft. for a total of around 30 ft. horizontally.
Whats a Good water softener to buy from Home Depot?
The vast majority of water treatment plants aren't removing any kind of hardness and I work in water treatment.
Hey,I want to work with someone or a company in the plumbing field. Please help me. I live in Dearborn Michigan
Ayman, Michigan apprenticeships are excellent, union or nonunion. I would look for a small residential plumber who would be willing to start you on an apprenticeship. Good luck.
Does anyone recommend saltless water softener?
Go with Puragain Water system. You won't need any salt at all. Great company.
As a Master Plumber and water treatment specialist - a lot of this information is not correct. Saying the salt "cleans the mineral bed" is flat wrong. It doesn't clean anything (take a look inside a brine tank that's been in service for a long time and you'll see what I mean; salt isn't all that clean to begin with. The salt is used in the ion exchange process, where you are essentially replacing your hardness minerals with sodium, and drawing the salt brine into the unit during regeneration actually works to overwhelm and replace all the trapped hardness minerals with sodium so the exchange process can continue. Additionally, it's not a "mineral bed" - the media in the softener is not mineral in any way, in fact, minerals are what you're trying to deal with in the first place because minerals are what make the water hard.
I respect those who have worked in the trade for so long, however I've learned that a LOT of licensed plumbers simply don't understand water treatment. It's one thing to know how to pipe it in - another thing to understand how it works.
All of that said, yes, most homes could benefit from a water treatment system of some kind. It's also important to test your water before simply installing a water softener. Many well systems have other nuisance issues that can cause problems with a softener, along with harming your home's plumbing (iron, both ferric and ferrous, iron bacteria, acidic water, manganese, etc.). You need to know what's in your water before trying to treat it - I've had to cut out many, many softeners over the years from plumbers who don't know any better and think a softener is all that's needed.
what brand model do you recommend?
Which water softener do you recommend what brand
"They're all about the same". Sound familiar?
Hello. Are you using a softener made in China by RunXin?
the salt brine cleans the resin filter at no point would you ever get any slat in your water,
Does water softener affect garden plants? How do you decide whether a water softener or water conditioner is more beneficial for the home?
Mike Fa, do not use soft water on plants, indoor plants or outdoor. Water softeners and water conditioners are both the same. A whole house carbon filter will not soften the water.
I bought mine today, install it tomorrow.
Stay away from a Sterling water softener. THEY ARE JUNK !!!
Hot water heaters don't last long around here with how hard the water is.
Matthew Conley, same thing here in CA. I think it’s the water pressure here even though we have pressure regulators.
@@TheGrumpyPlumber I am in the limestone capital. The limestone for the Pentagon, the US Capitol, empire state building, etc. Came from here. Our city water has coated the hot water heater with so much limestone/calcium to both elements. I want to put in a water softener to deal with it.
Matthew Conley, a water softener will help but it won’t completely solve your problem.
He's not grumpy at all. Lol
Just get a Flek mechanical water softner. You dont need a freekin computer on a watersoftner.Every time the power goes out you will be downstairs screwing around with it and eventually replacing it. there junk.
Muddy, Flex is a brand name of the head on a water softener. I don’t know if you can call it a computer or not, but it’s an electronic board in the head that tells the softener when to regenerate.
@@TheGrumpyPlumber You can get a mechanical head that does not have a electronic board. Fleck makes the heads for many of the other brands but they also make there own and they make one with a mechanical head that was used for decades in the past and worked fine.
he has no idea how the softener works at all - or the chemistry behind a mixed resin bed... but ok video for a layman
This guy is great!