KLINGONS Join PICARD in Star Trek Nemesis? - WHAT IF - Star Trek Starship Battles
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- Опубликовано: 3 июл 2024
- #startrek #starships #startrekbridgecommander
Today we have a request and it is to see what would have happened if the Klingons had shown up, instead of the Romulans in Star Trek Nemesis.
Will 2 Negh'vars be more effective than 2 Valdores?
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Despite the hate Nemesis gets (I love it!), it is weird that the space battle is often called the best, and the Scimitar gets so much love from people.
The problem here is the Scimitar can fire while cloaked in the movies and this version can’t
You would've won the first round if you kept your fingers off the cloaking device. 😉
This comment can be cut and pasted to several, if not all, of Retro's vids.
@@SupremeCleave Ooohhh, burn! 🔥😆
He also would have won if he kept on cloaking whenever the Scimitar cloaked, repaired, and moved the ship to target the weakest shields and then fired the green anti-starbase weapons.
@@davidprinzing8059 Nah. If he did that, the Plot Device would've kicked in and the Scimitar would somehow outmaneuver him. 😉
Crossing the Romulan Neutral Zone, the Ent-E should had a tactical advantage like a normal cloak or a transphasic cloaking device. For the Klingons, having a cloak is more of a disadvantage for them. It's best to use counter cloak tactics like releasing tachyon bursts or cloaked mines in a standard deployment pattern to flush out a cloaked ship. The Reman Scimitar's advantage being able to fire while cloak. Take away that advantage and as the Klingons are better off being part of that tachyon net by releasing that tachyon bursts in different corners of the battle space. Overall distance and reaction time will give the Klingons and Ent-E the advantage instead of being surprised by a cloaked Scimitar. Then again if Picard used the same tactic that Kirk had used against Qang's BOP, then the Klingons won't be needed. Also not sure if the Ent-E can use a transphasic cloak since it can be replicated by Data&LaForge and install it.
Time for Picard to throw back some Klingon fire wine in Stovokor!
I still think that the Scimitar is the greatest of all humanoid canon ships.
You'd have to hit the (I forget how it's spelled) thaleron radiation container.
That would kill all organics on board. 😀
I forget the results, but I think you did pit the Scimitar against a standard Borg cube.
Perhaps against a single Undine (8472) vessel.
Both pack a punch.
How about the Scimitar against a Dominion fleet? If the Dominion War went worse for the Alpha Quadrant alliance and Shinzon had to use his new ship to defend Romulus and Remus against Dominion invasion.
He did a showdown Scimitar against a Dominion battleship
ruclips.net/video/7fFrMmSYQAs/видео.htmlfeature=shared
According to ST: Nemesis, Shinzon had twenty engagements in the Dominion War and all were successful.
Love to see the Scimitar vs CSS ships!
Would love to see Scimitar vs these ships and the 2 Valdore ships. I bet Schizon would be 💩 his pants then😂
The reason the Scimitar was so formidable was because it could use its shields and fire while cloaked. As soon as Troi located the ship, a single volley of quantum torpedoes did significant damage to the Scimitar, disabling some systems etc. I’m not convinced in a 1 on 1 fight that the Enterprise couldn’t have won alone if it was hammering the Scimitar with two different types of torpedoes from the start.
Modders always make it a super ship, which is odd
😨Gosh Imagine if ... yes The Klingons against the Scimitar.. that would have been a battle jeepers, lol. eeh. someone took the tape off the cloak button oh my.. lol. at 1:04 seeing the Scimitar come towards you gosh looked like in the movie. eeh. Funny with all that tech.. no one came up with shields even under cloak..hmmm.. lol Eeh. Think Shinzon beamed Picard over before the explosion.. oh gosh.. This was wicked to watch , yes the Scimitar, is an amazing ship, and I would have thought the Ent E would have rammed but hmm well now we know what would have happened oh gosh.. !! Great battle Admiral.!😊🖖
Thanks Steve! You're right, we needed a ramming in this,lol. It can't be canon... Still the Negh'var's almost had victory. 🖖
@@RetroBadgerGaming Yes the Negh'Vars did better than the Romulans.. still tough battle.. 🖖
Valdore is a superior ship to the neg'var and I love the neg'var. Valdores have so much better maneuverability they can keep front toward enemy much better than the neg'var. And when your shtick is to pull all the firepower forward you need to be fast enough to turn with your enemy. Basically how the general design went with TNG was romulans had worse power generation thanks to singularity cores so they were bigger and bulkier so they tended to pack more firepower, klingons liked to be fast and nimble with ambush it and run, because the treaty of algerion feds put more effort into shields and stout space frames making feds more tanky. With the valdore and the neg'nar you see the switch between both of romulan and klingon designs. If the negvar was faster it would be a pretty amazing ship speed holds it back a ton, if it cant out run its enemy it has to out fight them, and while its firepower is impressive and its kinda tanky it doesn't match its fed counter parts nearly as well as the valdore does. Vorcha's I think would have been the better ships to send. Though I'm comparing it more with the movie version of the scimitar firing while cloaked, neg'var would be huge siting ducks to it.
If only Scimitar had multi targeting, wow
How about Captain and General Picard vs Shinzon??
Also I would love to see you incorporate battle group omega In star trek battle commander.
He has done so already - ruclips.net/video/tGI93Pne_DE/видео.htmlsi=mv_gP8J0nL6C0PKj
Nice scenario and good battle 👍
Qapl'a To stovakor we go!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Ty for the video and LLAP!
Today the crew of the two Neg'Vars and the Enterprise feast with Kahless in the great halls of Sto'Vo'Kor upon dying in glorious battle! Q'APLA!!!
I wonder if it was Picard data and riker were all injured And worf was in command 😅
Now try doing it without being able to get a target lock on them. That would be more realistic since it can fire while cloaked. It's just an OP ship.
The only way to do this is coordinating the fire onto a single shield face.
There isn't much that I can say about this fight. Have you ever checked how it compares to the USS Sovereign from the "Bridge Commander" story?
Would you happen to know if the USS Babylon, Ulysses-class, had the Gorn weaponry?
Now try it again where Klingons arrive to help Big E and Valdores ... 5 v 1.... your going to lose a ship maybe 2... but the mark of a good Captain or Admiral is to accept losing some ships... IMO. .... otherwise you are not ready for the Big chair of Commanding a Starship in battle, otherwise the simulation at the academy is always open and ready for you...😂😂😂... more you bleed in training,less tou bleed in Combat....
Kinda irrelevant because Shinzon needed Picard alive for the blood transfusion.
As good as the AIs are, they just don’t know enough to turn the ship when the forward shields are gone.
Yes! There is currently something Called Quick Battle Plus, which has new AI's. Although they get a bit miffed when losing and try to ram into you! 🖖
Add 2 cloak capable defiants to the mix
In the Established Star Trek Canon the Negh’Var class is a battleship well the Scimitar is a Dreadnought. The Negh’Var is already outgunned and outclassed by the Scimitar.
The Negh’Var is also equipped with Standard Disruptor Beams and Two Forward Mounted Standard Disruptor Cannons, a forward Disruptor Cannon and two Auxiliary Warp Nacelles mounted standard Disruptor Cannons underneath the ship. They aren’t siege cannons. In DS9 what took down the shields was concentrated fire. The Negh’Var stayed in station keeping and didn’t orbit the station like the other ships in the Klingon Fleet thus the Negh’Var was constantly targeting the same location with all her weapon batteries.
You can literally see in this attached video from the episode that the Negh’Var just turn right at the station and fires. Prior to that they were still stationary in one location well all the other ships weakened DS9’s shields as this is what Energy Weapons are meant for, even Disruptor Cannons. All they did was target the already weakened area. ruclips.net/video/apP-4wNr2zg/видео.htmlsi=qnKdzFzol0hzZ1YJ
they are literally siege guns or super heavy disruptor cannons that are on a ball mount, they are the size of K'tingas in mass. if they are only standard disruptor cannons, then they are woefully over sized.
If i had to classify this ship its, for the klingons at this time, a dreadnought/heavy battleship just in terms of a mass increase from the Vor'cha. A real example would have to be the IJN's Yamato class compared to the previouse generation battleship of the Nagato CLass, difference in size and armament classified it as a super battleship.
From the 'Way of the warrior' Battle, the impression that i got was the Klingons were not expecting DS9 to be such a tough nut to crack, the shields for gonna fail, sure , but at the rate they were losing ships, they wouldn't have much of a fleet left, so they did the smart thing and used the big guns to overload 2 of the 3 shield generators of DS9.
The standard disruptor cannons on the negh'var are on the end of each wing as dual emitters, i would consider them heavy disruptor cannons due to the size.
on some other models, there are also 2 dual disruptor turrets on the inside dorsal wings. (sketchfab.com/3d-models/negh-var-class-a74716758bd04624b849e947f3f4e420) here's a fan model, that can be use as a visual guide.
there would be other weapons such as disruptor beams and torpedo launchers aswell. one another version of the ship, in the TNG finale, they had a long barreled disruptor emmitter coming out the front of the head, that fire a similar weapon to the tip of wing mounted guns
now against the Scimitar, of course it would be outmatched, its too slow and the big guns only effectivey work on either slow, stationary or large targets in the foreward arc. now if they hit, the scimitar will feel it, but it can shrug off the damage much better due to seconfary shielding. closest reacdh world example would have to be a Queen elizibeth class battleship refit vs the Vanguard battleship class, similare firepower but new gen. tech, armour and superior speed but a very large margine allowing it to dictate the battle.
@@Hierachy fan models don’t count for the Established Star Trek Canon! The Established Star Trek Canon is LAW when it comes to the Star Trek Franchise! The Star Trek Franchise and thus the Established Star Trek Canon has stated that they are Standard Disruptor Cannons mounted on Auxiliary Warp Nacelles! Meaning they are just your STANDARD DISRUPTOR CANNONS! That’s Established Canon FACT! Thus what you and fans want to assume isn’t CANON making it 100% FALSE! Only ESTABLISHED SOURCES are factually accurate and thus correct, factual sources are the Very Important Dialogue in the Episodes and Movies ONLY! Dialogue has stated exactly what I’m saying!
As a Star Trek author it’s my job to know these things how these starships are armed! I am required as an author within the Star Trek Franchise to use the Established Star Trek Canon. That means I outright know that the Negh’Var class doesn’t have Siege Cannons and that it only has STANDARD DISRUPTOR CANNONS!
Here’s the outright accepted to the Established Star Trek Canon schematics for the Negh’Var and as you can see no Siege Cannons whatsoever!
static.wikia.nocookie.net/spaceship/images/e/e3/Klingon_neghvar_dorsal.gif/revision/latest?cb=20120125035513
static.wikia.nocookie.net/startrek/images/a/a1/Negh%27Var_class_ortho.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20220504215736
The fact the pods underneath are Auxiliary Warp Nacelles is even stated in Memory Alpha even though Paramount states Memory Alpha isn’t sanctioned as part of the Established Star Trek Canon: memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Negh%27Var_warship
@@jetnova16 matey, the fan model was just to show the disruptor turrets inboard of the warp nacelles.....cause they modeled it. like you can search online for the dorsal side of the Negh'var model and see that they are there.
if your read my statement, i said siege cannons OR super heavy disruptor cannons. Either or matey. they are definately not auxiliary warp nacelles, the same article you list states weapons pods....
If you want to use the higher power of estabilished canon, the Show, especially in the battle, Visually the weapon effects visually state they are cannons of an order of magnatude more powerful than a standard disruptor cannon. Other wise you are stating that the B'rels in the battle have the same weapons on the end of each wing,
would be relegated to beta canon if you are actually an author. unless, otherwise if endorssed by Paramount in a show. you are about as much of a 'fan' as the rest of us, you are no different. So get off your high horse.
If i wrote a star trek novel or become an author, would you then consider me at 'equal' footing? most likely you will probably pull another reason out of your rear end as to why i am not.
I Actually just looked at your 'Source' for what they are.....i can't belive you think the eaglemoss diagram is an 'accurate' source.
like i was laughing my arse off, they are notoriously unreliable, they point to random stuff half the time and say 'ooohhhh yeah thats a deflector panel' btw that was for the armored feather patern on the K'tinga. they also incorrectly put a label on the neck calling it a 'Disruptor weapon'. other quick examples include:
- on the Jem'hadar battlecruiser they label all of the warp nacells as everything else other than warp nacelles.....
- to refence the B'rel from earlier in this post, they also lable the weapons on the B'rels as 'Disruptor cannons'
- the Ent-E, they label the rear windows above the saucer shuttle bay as a shuttlebay, for the Ent-Refit they label the observation lounge as the docking port
i could keep on going, but i hope you understand that the source you are using is very visually incorrect. The only ones i know for sure are fine/pretty accurate are the ones done by Thomas Marrone for the STO ships as he models them. TBF to Eaglemoss they get some of the basics right, but overall they are not a reliable source for diagrams/schematics.
like either way they are still a 'Disruptor cannon' just they are super heavy ones. analogous to the 'Mega Phasers' on the Miranda class or the 'Phaser lance' on the Galaxy-dreanought refit seen in TNG finale.
i don't know as to why you have a chip on your shoulder, but i digress, they are some 'form' of heavy disruptor, otherwise the show creators wouldn't have shown them off in that way.
@@Hierachy Wrong! The Established Star Trek Canon states that they are 100% Auxiliary Warp Nacelles! At the front of those Auxiliary Warp Nacelles are two STANDARD DISRUPTOR CANNONS. Plus the diagram isn’t Eaglemoss at all yet Eaglemoss is SANCTIONED by Paramount Studios to make models and is required to use their onscreen stated dialogue for what each component is and thus Eaglemoss has it 100% RIGHT! Thus guess what you’re still outright wrong to say Eaglemoss isn’t an accurate source when under the determination of the OWNERS of the Star Trek Franchise including Eugene Roddenberry Jr. Eaglemoss models are accurate to the Established Star Trek Canon. And there is a Disruptor Turret on the neck of the K’Tinga, it’s seen firing as well in DS9 during the battle of DS9 and certain Dominion War battles as well as visible in their first appearance in Star Trek: The Motion Picture.
You clearly don’t understand Eaglemoss and how they’re sanctioned by Paramount and used the onscreen dialogue and production notes for the episodes and movies to make their models. They also incorporated the designers information such as info given by John Eaves, Doug Drexler and others.
Plus I never used Eaglemoss as a source! My sources are MEMORY ALPHA, DEVIANT ART and the Official Star Trek Website! And other sanctioned websites by Paramount, the direct owners of the Star Trek Franchise.
Literally if you went to Memory Alpha and Memory Beta my images are from there! Thus you’re 100% wrong yet again for Eaglemoss isn’t one of my sources!
If you want further proof that I’m right then listen to Trekyards breaking down the facts of the Negh’Var for they’ve stated exactly what I have that the ship has Auxiliary Warp Nacelles with forwarded mounted Disruptor Cannons! That’s because it’s part of the Established Star Trek Canon. Want further evidence? Then visit TrekCulture as well and TrekCentral!
Even VenomGeekMedia has broken down the Negh’Var Class and stated these outright facts. That’s because I’m stating the direct facts strictly based on the ESTABLISHED STAR TREK CANON! Thus all these Trek Sources that pride themselves on following the Established Star Trek Canon have all stated that there are no Siege Disruptor Cannons or Super Heavy Disruptor Cannons on the Negh’Var for they don’t exist whatsoever on the Negh’Var. Only in your flawed headcanon do they exist.
@@jetnova16 I used the links you provided, one of them is in fact a page from the eaglemoss book. to which states its only a disruptor cannon.
I would much like trekyards/venom geek media and several other channels to contribute to star trek lore to bring consistancy to the lore, especially visual consistancy (which is sorely needed).
even though eaglemoss is sanctioned by paramount, it doesn't mean they cant get things wrong, an example is in Star Trek: prodigy (run by paramount), the USS Dauntless fires phasers from its modeled RCS thrusters, considering its a show, one would think paramount would be ontop of things like that? wouldnt they?
i've watched the video that Trekyards did on the Negh'var, multiple times throughout the years and Samuel openly states 'Yes, yes in the second version, they have these big beefy disruptor cannons on the bottom' after Captain Foley asked 'Are they guns?' (3:45 onwards). Foley does state they are similar to the D7 warp nacelles in passing resemblance. he also speculates that it doesnt act as a warp engine, it just enchances the 'super heavy disruptor cannon'.
to talk about the Auxiliary warp nacelles, Trekyards in the video you mentioned, samuel asked Foley at 1:27 onwards, 'if those are two warp nacelles on each wing with a seperation line' he asked foley this as he unsure, foley states 'that hes wondered himself' and that 'that he kinda thinks taht its 4 engines'. he's talking about just the nacelles, not the weapon pods underneath the ship.
in the same video there is a MSD at 7:25 of the Negh'var, and you can visually see that the weapon pods are not in fact, warp nacelles with disruptors on the front. what we do see is that the smaller nacelles underneath the primary ones are infact the auxiliary warp nacelles. you can visually tell that the weapon pods contain much larger disruptors than those on the wings.
Venom geek media did a video aswell, called "Wings of Kahless: Vor'cha & Negh'var class 'Brothers in Arms'", at 13:00 he calls them 'Heavy siege disruptors' and in the video in his head canon, that the Negh'var is one of the few klingon 4 nacelled ships.
Also as you stated before and i quote 'Thus what you and fans want to assume isn’t CANON'. To which i find odd, its either you believe in this statement or you pick and choose when to apply it. It's funny really, the channels you describe are all into the idea of the 'super heavy disruptors'. so far the only person who isnt into the idea, is you.
What i believe, is that you are stating your own interpritation of canon, overlayed with sprinkle of narcissism. You badger anyone who disagrees, treating them with contempt as you do in your writing/replies to me.
i wont be Replying further as you are most likely a Troll and would not even consider if you are wrong. Also due to the fact i have to go to bed for work tommorow. believe what you will, and to those who are reading these comments in the future, i hope you enjoyed your popcorn.
Do you make a fight between the Scimitar and a Shadow-Crab?
Scimitar Vs the Orville
the Scimitar is such a BS ship and i love it
I wonder if you had cloaked at thr same time that last time the Scimitar cloaked and waited for them to uncloak if that would have turned the tide because them you could have lined up all your weapons properly for an alpha strike.
You need 50 starfleet ships.
Data is the only thing that can beat the scimitar
1:24 then perhaps you shouldn't have cloaked. Just sayin! 😹
I am going to come Quarks for all my tactical advice in future. Gul Dukat lost a customer 🖖
I’d say this was accurate. After all Shinzon fought in the Dominion War and assumed he had the Scimitar at the time. Could explain why he won the 12 engagements he fought in during the war.
those where all ground engagements, and there was no way he would have had it at the time.
I wonder what would've happened if Picard actually made it to the fleet
The Simatar is an amazing ship imagion a fleet of them lol 😮....gteat as all ways RB 👏 😊
Thanks :-) Oooooh, now you're giving me ideas! I wonder if a fleet of them could take down the 29th Century Borg Cube? 🤔
@RetroBadgerGaming That has to happen lol can't wait 😆
Dumbest part of that battle was the scimitar cloaked and firing and I they had to keep trying to find it. Once you hit it a couple of time with three ships you could pretty much keep hitting over and over again , but they acted like it was all over the place and couldn't find it.
To be fair, the largest strongest Klingon ship was essentially 4 galaxy classes or 3.2 defiants, however…the scimitar is the same as essentially 20 galaxy classes, with almost double the torpedo launchers as an akira class, honestly the Klingons would lose extremely quickly, same as Picard
How is a Neghvar „essentially 4 Galaxy classes“? I‘d say it‘s roughly en par with a Dominion Refit Galaxy or a Nemesis era Sovereign. Maybe more firepower (the siege weapon is useless against most enemy ships) but less maneuvrability.
The Enterprise-F easily beats a Neghvar…
Didn't Sisko in the Mirror Defiant pretty much solo Worfs Neghvar ship?
@@tomastomasi975 Haha, true - but that was the mirror universe and the Defiant has invincibility plot armor in DS9. It‘s just an armored gunboat with oversized weapons…still no match 1v1 against a battleship.
@@stephanbergmann8373 in terms of power output, the neghvar according to every single ever mentioned official spec sheet, or manual is superior vastly.
@@tomastomasi975 ds9’s main ship, took many sustained blasts, and they are using the defiants 4 type 12 cannons, keeping in mind pulsed phase weapons are stronger than beams, and these were enhanced further by tying into the newly developed 4 chamber warp core.
How would it fair against a few of those Cardassian/Kessok hybrid ships? lol.
Bring battle group omega in
The Scimitar outclasses anything?? Ahem... AHEM, Sir!
🤣 Hmmm, does it sound like Vegas? .... struggling to remember.. NOG is always watching 👀
Retro how about the Scimatar against the Reaver from Masseffect some did this on a board like game and not bridge commander so I think this would be a good test for any ship even Spieces 8472
Reaper would be deader than disco.
Why don't ships have portal weapons?
What does targeting the bridge do?
It depends on the ship. In Remastered some of the ships actually blow up if the Bridge is Destroyed. On the Player ship the crew fall on the floor and the bridge sets on fire!
@@RetroBadgerGaming
🤣
REKT
7:34 The Scimitar. Lost. To a single. Sovereign class.