I'm 26 & buying my first property on my own right now. I didn't go to uni & worked from the age of 17. I've been able to save, upgrade my income & live a reasonably lavish lifestyle without debt. For me, university was never an option. Debt, waste of time & no real benefit from a degree. Now I'm a qualified engineer at a Pharmaceutical company through work experience & apprenticeships. To any young people or parents with children, the working world is the best option in my opinion, but you must be willing to work. I've worked many long hours at awful times but it was all worth it.
Be wary of advising kids to go into the trades. Apprenticeships are hard to get, and the job ruins your body. You won't meet many bricklayers in their 50s because it just destroys you
This is underrated and depending on country you may also have to pay for gas, tools, recieved minimum wage and travel hours a day out of pocket. You are also expected to pay for schooling so for the first 2-3 years it is rough.
Yeah as somebody in a career of his degree and 3 herniated discs at 34 years old, ruining the rest of my life, I wish I'd taken a more active career path than a pencil pusher
Inactivity is also health risk, but agree physical labour has it's downsides (I worked as gardener for 12 months after getting PPE degree.) cold and hard work (and only £4.50 an hour) at my college LMH too.
Inactivity is a killer too, but working from an office/home doesn't mean you have to be sat all day. Break it up with exercise, frequently standing, standing desk etc.
Before Blair got everyone believing that you needed a degree to empty the bins there was an excellent vocational path through technical colleges (remember those?). It allowed people to choose their option and many, even though uni education was free, chose vocational qualifications. These ended up being the backbone of our manual labour, arts and science sectors. When recruiting, if you wanted someone who worked hard and had initiative, you went for non graduates, if you wanted someone who believed they didn't need to work hard but were bright then you hired graduates. I liked a team with both, the combination was the best of all worlds. Very good video.
The technical paths still exist - same types of courses as in the 1980s and 1990s but now more often delivered by what are known as sixth-form colleges and in some case universities. They are known as BTECs. They are excellent but not a replacement for university-level degree education in the more analytical of subjects. Having practiced as a design engineer for 40ish years, I deliver modules on such courses as a volunteer. It keeps the brain active!
Anecdotally, the graduate starting salary vs min wage premium coming in at 30% seems high, especially outside of London. At least here, a lot of graduate starting salaries are minimum wage.
I graduated in 1999, had all fees paid for and I was given a government grant to attend. I worked in the field I studied in and found it boring. So, by 25, I switched to a different career path. I used my boring job savings to pay 50k for training in my new career, which proved well worth it. This is pretty normal and very few teenagers know what they want to do career wise. So, 18 is a terrible age to sign up for binding long term debt. If you don’t like a trade, it is still possible to pursue a degree later on.
It's just simple simple economics of supply and demand. There are around 20,000 psychology grads every year compared to what 3000 odd electricians? How much does your average sparky charge? If there's a lot of something, the demand (no of jobs, salaries, progression) decreases. No one says this in sixth forms these days.
Not really. Apprenticeships have a very useful role to play, but cannot replace formal university level education for roles that require in-depth analysis, design and general intellectual capability. An apprenticeship is perfect for developing skills in manufacturing, services e.g. plumbing/bricklaying/boiler srevicing, but not at all suitable for someone who aspires to work on say air vehicle design. You cannot teach someone finite elemental analysis in an apprenticeship!
@@theolddog5129it depends mate, i started in non destructive testing as an apprentice after college and they train you on the job as well as job specific qualifications. Its worked out quite well for me started out in radiography now doing advanced ultrasonics (PAUT).
@@theolddog5129depends what apprenticeship your on mate because theres advanced ones. I started as an apprentice in non destructive testing, they put you through courses and lots of on site training. Now I’m doing radiography and advanced ultrasonics (PAUT) so it can be done
@@theolddog5129we are talking about the route to owning a home and living comfortably not a route into a specific specialist job that you may not even get even with all the qualifications. Apprenticeships, i left school at 15 in 2009, had my own house at 23, now live quite well with a car and 2 motorbikes at 31 and look set to have my mortgage paid off by 40.
I would recommend getting an apprenticeship as soon as possible after leaving school. Worked for me, save for a deposit and bought a house at 23 years old (8 years ago), and a mate of mine at work, his 24 year old son has just done the same this year.
Im a software engineer and the job market is dead in the uk. There are 500 Cvs being sent for every position. The wages are lower than 10 years ago. A mixture of bad economy, outsourcing to countries with lower taxes and AI adoption. I feel bad for anyone who chose to study CS in the last few years and would advise against it. It’s not worth the effort, time and money. Especially in the uk where you have to pay for the uni. (In most European countries higher education is free)
We are in the age when knowledge is no longer power and further studying is no longer worth it. Sadly speaking, when a country no longer rewards academia financially, who is going to do M.Phil or PhD. This could lead to an overall decline in research and innovation. If people in a country only think about getting a job early for money, this country is pretty hopeless. Sadly, this is the UK.
The company I work for makes no distinction between applicants with a technical Bachelor degree (4-5 years of study) and applicants with appropriate work experience and advanced technican qualifications (3 years of training + 2 years of study). In fact, they prefer the latter as their knowledge is based on hands-on practical experience.
The problem is not that universities exist - the problem is that the majority of students are doing nonsense degrees that never relate to their future field. Do we need 10k+ phycology grads a year?
£1500 for a gutter? It's better to buy a ladder that reaches the gutter(£600) and then buy the parts yourself - it will be cheaper and you have got ladder to use in the future, once needed.
I think part of the problem is the quality of some British universities. I studied computing at Greenwich after first working in industry and can honestly say I consider doing that to be one of the big regrets of my life. To describe them as terrible would be a massive understatement.
Let's be honest - going into a job straight from school can be really boring. You end up married at 23 to someone you met drunk in a nightclub, divorced at 30, and then your life is over. Contrary to what people think, being a seemingly idiot student for 4 years can give your maturity a chance to grow.
I did a City and Guld in radio and Television engineering in the 1970 and then later moved on to study Computer Science and programming at evening classes in the 1980's I had a very well paid work right up until I retired with a good pension pot at the age of 60. At that time (1960's) very few of the pupils at my school where expecting to go to university, only the very best students had this as an option, so the rest of use where directed toward the trades or unskilled work. My generation are not todays parents so they have a deferent ambition for their children, getting a good trade was what our parents had in mind for us.
I would say that if someone aims to study engineering, maths, medicine, law or economics (in a lesser degree), then I would say yes, if you are keen to learn and understand it. Everything else dont bother. I graduated in Financial Economics, and I got a decent job in banking, but if it was today I probably would ve become a plumber.
Agree absolutely. I did BA English and History..🙄 Then trained as a nurse where I worked until 55. What could I have done with my degree apart from teach? I would have been eaten on the first day! A classic case of going to uni because I could and felt I should…
A hard life in manual trades, no chance retiring probably in your 70s, look at the life expectancy for manual worker to that of a someone in graduate job. Difference in life expectancy between Executive and low skill manual in the region of 10 years according to some figures I have read. We do however penalise young people in this country, closing the door to Europe FOM reduces the opportunity for graduates disproportionately.
I didn't cope well in education despite being a bright individual. I skipped college and didn't go to University. I spent years in dead end jobs.... Now in my 30s, I decided to set up my own business and work for myself... In year two I was able to pay myself 50K, and this next tax year that will be higher. If you're smart, you may as well set up your own business and get earning enough to pay your mortgage, instead of working for somebody else and paying off theirs.
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11:31 into the video not sure where you got £40 an hour for a car mechanic, the going rate is £75 an hour plus VAT from garages I have called in the east and west midlands I gather it will be higher in te south where you are based
I'd rather keep my degree. I might be better off financially if I had become a plumber (although I think I will probably overtake this alternative version of myself fairly soon), but I'd also be working in the cold and I wouldn't have the same capacity to think... I grew up in relative poverty and received a very substandard education at my comprehensive (which became an academy since I assume they were failing so hard and wanted to rebrand, or perhaps get away from gov. regulations). Going back to school and then eventually getting a degree changed my thinking processes and the way I viewed the world. I'd hate to be trapped in my old mindset, working a physically demanding job. I'm not sure I would even know what to do with the money I earned either if not for studying Economics and Finance.
As an intelligent person and after 13 wasted years of a bad academic experience, I got a 1 year scholarship from the National Computer Centre, had a career as a programmer and semi retired age 34. It is about time that we had this conversation, Tejvan, given your teaching position. What is the point of an academic education over vocational ? and how many people would significantly benefit from each ? Why isn't testing used to find out what work roles suit students ? My thoughts - It's unethical, that someone who didn't go to university is saddled with the unpaid debts of people who have, through the tax system. Student loans should be a lifetime, interest bearing, obligation, and if still outstanding at death, repayable out of the estate. Organisations do not create sufficient numbers of roles suited to graduates. Supply needs to be changed to meet demand plus ~10%. Are people likely to know what suits them before mental maturity ~25yo +/-5 ? Shouldn't education be more about the whole person, exposing them to different situations to find out what they're good and bad at and what they like & dislike ?
Originally the people who went to University ended up as much more productive workers and so paid much more in taxes. So the argument that they should then pay even more tax, and do so over their lifetime is neither fair nor addresses the problem. I went to University (Greenwich, Computer Science) after first working in industry and I can say the quality of some of the other students as well as the 'quality' of the course left me speechless. They seemed to be taking on a lot of unsuitable students and even if they were actually good they were undermining them with terrible, disjointed and frankly disgracefully run courses. This made me realise why so many students have problems after going to University: it's a quantity over quality problem and IMO some of those institutions need to be shut down. They're a massive waste of time, money and perhaps most importantly of all, opportunity.
Be careful which subjects you study. The economist ran an article over ten years ago, stating that over 90% who obtained a degree medicine went on to work in that field, were as most people who had a degree in art did not work in an art related profession. I had a job dealing with the unemployed and I had a lot of people with degrees in either media studies or Leisure and Tourism, to my knowledge none of those that did find work found it in these two fields.
Blair promised that then IMMEDIATELY cancelled non-repayable grants for all and introduced fees, which have increased incrementally. I graduated in Arabic and German in 1983 and used both by LUCK. These days I wouldn't be able to go to university and wouldn't have been living in the south of France for 35 years. 😢
Masters is the new Degree. Bachelor's is the new A levels. No more than 20% need to go to University. And overseas students should be capped at 25% per institution.
It's not what you know but who you know and has been for a very long time, getting your feet under the table with say a council job as a pen pusher would normally set someone up for life.
It very much depends on what you study , how applicable it is to the jobs you intend to apply for and how much those skills are needed by business. After completing a Masters degree in data science my son has just secured a job in the city earning just under 40k. If you can apply yourself to the right degrees and apply for the relevant jobs there are opportunities. The Mickey Mouse and sexy but useless over subscribed subjects are best avoided. Education should be free- it benefits the country not just the individual. But I think there should be more vocational degrees , training / apprenticeships providing the relevant skills that are required in the jobs market. It shouldn’t be beyond the will of man to tie these things together and give young people the best chance of well paid employment .
University didn't hinder Rishi's job and wage prospects. Mr Blair suffered from not being a clairvoyant. University looked a good idea in 1999 maybe. The problem again is politics. If the Tories saw an issue they wouldn't want to point it out or do anything about it in case they lost votes. I was the first in the family to go to Uni back in the 1970's. My brother trained at a college for manual skilled work in the motor industry. He earned much more than me, and owned his own house by the time he was 35, but unfortunately by 60 he had to retire due to ill health and died early due to decades of hard physical work in poor environmental conditions.
@economicshelp Social work used to be a diploma. The course added exams and a couple of modules to make it a degree. The hoops we have to jump through, to get a piece of paper telling us we can do a job eh?
Here's why a degree is a waste of time and money. 1. Once, only about 2% of the population went to University. Back then, it didn't matter what subject was studied. Those who had a degree could pick and chose whatever they fancied without any question of their intelligence or common sense. They were very often 'clever idiots'. And they were your boss. And they earned loads more than you did. And that their education cost them nothing. What's to dislike about these lucky people? So, it was put to the masses that these monied slackers should at least pay for their good fortune (which was a vote winner) but not before Blair got involved. First, sell the idea that a degree was the answer to one's financial ambitions. Create a situation where you either had a degree or no degree. Once the numbers had developed, the payment was suggested. Future students were now terrorised into going for a qualification with questionable value and now had to pay for it. On top of that, it mattered not whether the student passed the exams, they still had to pay. The sums are ridiculous. The compounded interest is a scandal. All it does now is trap people in a circle of self imposed hardship. And it's not as if the Universities have all the information. It's all on the internet. Anyone can learn anything for free. Anyway, the connection between earning good money and good qualifications in tenuous at best. The real money is to be made from selling things to people that they want. It's easy. Really easy. Education is a system that teaches very little if anything at all that helps people exist in the real world.
Going to university is only viable if there is a well paying job at the end of it that requires a degree… currently you leave uni with £50k of debt and will be paying 9% student tax on everything you earn over a low threshold… Student debt is now payable for 40 years after graduating… so most people will be paying their loan off into there 60s…. On top of that there isn’t enough well paying jobs any more to guarantee you’ll earn well after graduating! It just isn’t worth the debt, try and find a skilled career that pays you whilst you learn and covers the cost of the qualification
I'm an electrician for that sort of money i will commute from north worcs . Can't get my son to follow me into electrical. My daughter is at Uni doing dentistry.
I'm in my late 60s and I saw this absurd rise in unnecessary higher education. It didn't used to work like this and it hasn't been a good thing. We could safely close half of out universities with no detriment to the country. Too many are doing Mickey Mouse degrees that lead to nothing worthwhile in terms of the degrees they gain. In my experience, many youngsters going to "uni" don't have the aptitude for higher education; they have a fun time there, but end up saddled with a huge debt and little in the way of career prospects. Let's have more apprenticeships, day release and evening courses and technical colleges. Then we can recruit more Brits and be less reliant on migrants.
Its all about the people, university graduates in the 1070s were few, (5%) elite and selected; graduates from 2000 were many (50%) mediocre and recruited! Devalue the product and turn it into a commodity what do you expect? I don't see why you act all surprised....
University makes working class people poorer in general but it still makes middle class students better off and higher paid. I have two children both have degrees, both working full time in jobs under £22k a year but there middle class colleagues have better jobs because they have connection in companies through there family and friends.
Knowing the right people to get your foot in the door is just a fact of life, doesn't diminish the value of a degree. The reality is most entry level jobs are badly paid but at least you're on the ladder. It was probably 6 years post-grad before I started earning well.
He is talking about oversupply of graduates and undersupply of tradesman... which does mean that tradesman can command a large salary than graduates. It's not a matter of believing they deserve the salary. It's a matter of "you have no choice because there aren't many of us" so their services go to the highest bidder. Let's stretch your example. If a society produces 1000 brain surgeons but only 5 elevator mechanics... who do you think can negotiate higher pay?
Tradesmen are always in short supply. Partly because training / apprenticeships are constrained. It also "helps" that the job knackers your body out after your thirties. So there aren't tons of 40, 50 something bricklayers ready to compete for labour.
I disagree, strongly... there's an over supply of tradesmen also... they are 10 a penny - plus one can now RUclips so many trade jobs, there's a rise in diy. There's an oversupply of PEOPLE - and not enough resources.
I'm 26 & buying my first property on my own right now. I didn't go to uni & worked from the age of 17. I've been able to save, upgrade my income & live a reasonably lavish lifestyle without debt.
For me, university was never an option. Debt, waste of time & no real benefit from a degree. Now I'm a qualified engineer at a Pharmaceutical company through work experience & apprenticeships. To any young people or parents with children, the working world is the best option in my opinion, but you must be willing to work. I've worked many long hours at awful times but it was all worth it.
Be wary of advising kids to go into the trades. Apprenticeships are hard to get, and the job ruins your body. You won't meet many bricklayers in their 50s because it just destroys you
This is underrated and depending on country you may also have to pay for gas, tools, recieved minimum wage and travel hours a day out of pocket. You are also expected to pay for schooling so for the first 2-3 years it is rough.
Sitting at a desk all day linked to cancer
Yeah as somebody in a career of his degree and 3 herniated discs at 34 years old, ruining the rest of my life, I wish I'd taken a more active career path than a pencil pusher
Inactivity is also health risk, but agree physical labour has it's downsides (I worked as gardener for 12 months after getting PPE degree.) cold and hard work (and only £4.50 an hour) at my college LMH too.
Inactivity is a killer too, but working from an office/home doesn't mean you have to be sat all day. Break it up with exercise, frequently standing, standing desk etc.
Before Blair got everyone believing that you needed a degree to empty the bins there was an excellent vocational path through technical colleges (remember those?). It allowed people to choose their option and many, even though uni education was free, chose vocational qualifications. These ended up being the backbone of our manual labour, arts and science sectors. When recruiting, if you wanted someone who worked hard and had initiative, you went for non graduates, if you wanted someone who believed they didn't need to work hard but were bright then you hired graduates. I liked a team with both, the combination was the best of all worlds. Very good video.
The technical paths still exist - same types of courses as in the 1980s and 1990s but now more often delivered by what are known as sixth-form colleges and in some case universities. They are known as BTECs. They are excellent but not a replacement for university-level degree education in the more analytical of subjects. Having practiced as a design engineer for 40ish years, I deliver modules on such courses as a volunteer. It keeps the brain active!
Anecdotally, the graduate starting salary vs min wage premium coming in at 30% seems high, especially outside of London. At least here, a lot of graduate starting salaries are minimum wage.
I graduated in 1999, had all fees paid for and I was given a government grant to attend. I worked in the field I studied in and found it boring. So, by 25, I switched to a different career path. I used my boring job savings to pay 50k for training in my new career, which proved well worth it. This is pretty normal and very few teenagers know what they want to do career wise. So, 18 is a terrible age to sign up for binding long term debt. If you don’t like a trade, it is still possible to pursue a degree later on.
Student loans are not debt.
They are an additional tax above a certain level for 30 years.
What did you retrain into?
It's just simple simple economics of supply and demand. There are around 20,000 psychology grads every year compared to what 3000 odd electricians? How much does your average sparky charge? If there's a lot of something, the demand (no of jobs, salaries, progression) decreases. No one says this in sixth forms these days.
Apprenticeships are the way (from experience)
Not really. Apprenticeships have a very useful role to play, but cannot replace formal university level education for roles that require in-depth analysis, design and general intellectual capability. An apprenticeship is perfect for developing skills in manufacturing, services e.g. plumbing/bricklaying/boiler srevicing, but not at all suitable for someone who aspires to work on say air vehicle design. You cannot teach someone finite elemental analysis in an apprenticeship!
@@theolddog5129it depends mate, i started in non destructive testing as an apprentice after college and they train you on the job as well as job specific qualifications. Its worked out quite well for me started out in radiography now doing advanced ultrasonics (PAUT).
@@theolddog5129depends what apprenticeship your on mate because theres advanced ones. I started as an apprentice in non destructive testing, they put you through courses and lots of on site training. Now I’m doing radiography and advanced ultrasonics (PAUT) so it can be done
@@theolddog5129we are talking about the route to owning a home and living comfortably not a route into a specific specialist job that you may not even get even with all the qualifications.
Apprenticeships, i left school at 15 in 2009, had my own house at 23, now live quite well with a car and 2 motorbikes at 31 and look set to have my mortgage paid off by 40.
Great post ❤
I would recommend getting an apprenticeship as soon as possible after leaving school.
Worked for me, save for a deposit and bought a house at 23 years old (8 years ago), and a mate of mine at work, his 24 year old son has just done the same this year.
Im a software engineer and the job market is dead in the uk. There are 500 Cvs being sent for every position. The wages are lower than 10 years ago. A mixture of bad economy, outsourcing to countries with lower taxes and AI adoption. I feel bad for anyone who chose to study CS in the last few years and would advise against it. It’s not worth the effort, time and money. Especially in the uk where you have to pay for the uni. (In most European countries higher education is free)
Yes... It's horrendous isn't it. I'm only in it because this was always what I wanted to do.
We are in the age when knowledge is no longer power and further studying is no longer worth it.
Sadly speaking, when a country no longer rewards academia financially, who is going to do M.Phil or PhD. This could lead to an overall decline in research and innovation.
If people in a country only think about getting a job early for money, this country is pretty hopeless.
Sadly, this is the UK.
The company I work for makes no distinction between applicants with a technical Bachelor degree (4-5 years of study) and applicants with appropriate work experience and advanced technican qualifications (3 years of training + 2 years of study). In fact, they prefer the latter as their knowledge is based on hands-on practical experience.
The problem is not that universities exist - the problem is that the majority of students are doing nonsense degrees that never relate to their future field. Do we need 10k+ phycology grads a year?
£1500 for a gutter? It's better to buy a ladder that reaches the gutter(£600) and then buy the parts yourself - it will be cheaper and you have got ladder to use in the future, once needed.
I did get a ladder, but felt so unsteady at top, I didn't want to risk it. That's another downside of some trades btw.
What Blair meant was "50% of young adults would get into debt because we don't want them buying houses or having any social mobility".
Great video, thanks. Enjoyed listening to your lecture.
My degree in Dance was worth it, I can walz down to the Job centre in double quick time.
lol
You're right, being an electrician would be amazing for young people. They're always needed and it's something that AI cannot replace.
I think part of the problem is the quality of some British universities. I studied computing at Greenwich after first working in industry and can honestly say I consider doing that to be one of the big regrets of my life. To describe them as terrible would be a massive understatement.
Let's be honest - going into a job straight from school can be really boring. You end up married at 23 to someone you met drunk in a nightclub, divorced at 30, and then your life is over.
Contrary to what people think, being a seemingly idiot student for 4 years can give your maturity a chance to grow.
My advanced basket weaving course has really set me up to ask people if they would like to make their meals XL.
I did a City and Guld in radio and Television engineering in the 1970 and then later moved on to study Computer Science and programming at evening classes in the 1980's I had a very well paid work right up until I retired with a good pension pot at the age of 60. At that time (1960's) very few of the pupils at my school where expecting to go to university, only the very best students had this as an option, so the rest of use where directed toward the trades or unskilled work. My generation are not todays parents so they have a deferent ambition for their children, getting a good trade was what our parents had in mind for us.
I would say that if someone aims to study engineering, maths, medicine, law or economics (in a lesser degree), then I would say yes, if you are keen to learn and understand it.
Everything else dont bother. I graduated in Financial Economics, and I got a decent job in banking, but if it was today I probably would ve become a plumber.
Agree absolutely. I did BA English and History..🙄 Then trained as a nurse where I worked until 55. What could I have done with my degree apart from teach? I would have been eaten on the first day! A classic case of going to uni because I could and felt I should…
I've been a window cleaner for 17 years. Earning potential between £80 - £100 an hour.
A hard life in manual trades, no chance retiring probably in your 70s, look at the life expectancy for manual worker to that of a someone in graduate job. Difference in life expectancy between Executive and low skill manual in the region of 10 years according to some figures I have read. We do however penalise young people in this country, closing the door to Europe FOM reduces the opportunity for graduates disproportionately.
I didn't cope well in education despite being a bright individual. I skipped college and didn't go to University. I spent years in dead end jobs.... Now in my 30s, I decided to set up my own business and work for myself... In year two I was able to pay myself 50K, and this next tax year that will be higher. If you're smart, you may as well set up your own business and get earning enough to pay your mortgage, instead of working for somebody else and paying off theirs.
Yep, Blair ruined UNI as well as the entire country. Uni should be for exceptional only & free
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11:31 into the video not sure where you got £40 an hour for a car mechanic, the going rate is £75 an hour plus VAT from garages I have called in the east and west midlands I gather it will be higher in te south where you are based
I'd rather keep my degree. I might be better off financially if I had become a plumber (although I think I will probably overtake this alternative version of myself fairly soon), but I'd also be working in the cold and I wouldn't have the same capacity to think... I grew up in relative poverty and received a very substandard education at my comprehensive (which became an academy since I assume they were failing so hard and wanted to rebrand, or perhaps get away from gov. regulations). Going back to school and then eventually getting a degree changed my thinking processes and the way I viewed the world. I'd hate to be trapped in my old mindset, working a physically demanding job. I'm not sure I would even know what to do with the money I earned either if not for studying Economics and Finance.
As an intelligent person and after 13 wasted years of a bad academic experience, I got a 1 year scholarship from the National Computer Centre, had a career as a programmer and semi retired age 34.
It is about time that we had this conversation, Tejvan, given your teaching position.
What is the point of an academic education over vocational ? and how many people would significantly benefit from each ?
Why isn't testing used to find out what work roles suit students ?
My thoughts -
It's unethical, that someone who didn't go to university is saddled with the unpaid debts of people who have, through the tax system. Student loans should be a lifetime, interest bearing, obligation, and if still outstanding at death, repayable out of the estate.
Organisations do not create sufficient numbers of roles suited to graduates. Supply needs to be changed to meet demand plus ~10%.
Are people likely to know what suits them before mental maturity ~25yo +/-5 ?
Shouldn't education be more about the whole person, exposing them to different situations to find out what they're good and bad at and what they like & dislike ?
Originally the people who went to University ended up as much more productive workers and so paid much more in taxes. So the argument that they should then pay even more tax, and do so over their lifetime is neither fair nor addresses the problem.
I went to University (Greenwich, Computer Science) after first working in industry and I can say the quality of some of the other students as well as the 'quality' of the course left me speechless. They seemed to be taking on a lot of unsuitable students and even if they were actually good they were undermining them with terrible, disjointed and frankly disgracefully run courses.
This made me realise why so many students have problems after going to University: it's a quantity over quality problem and IMO some of those institutions need to be shut down. They're a massive waste of time, money and perhaps most importantly of all, opportunity.
A lot of plumbers, electricians, etc. went back to Poland (where university education is also free).
Whatever whoever say about uni - go and dont hesitate! only people without higher education deny having it and they suffer. Suffer a lot
Be careful which subjects you study. The economist ran an article over ten years ago, stating that over 90% who obtained a degree medicine went on to work in that field, were as most people who had a degree in art did not work in an art related profession. I had a job dealing with the unemployed and I had a lot of people with degrees in either media studies or Leisure and Tourism, to my knowledge none of those that did find work found it in these two fields.
Blair promised that then IMMEDIATELY cancelled non-repayable grants for all and introduced fees, which have increased incrementally.
I graduated in Arabic and German in 1983 and used both by LUCK.
These days I wouldn't be able to go to university and wouldn't have been living in the south of France for 35 years. 😢
Depends what you study. If it’s medicine, or law, it’s worth it, most other courses are pointless.
Masters is the new Degree.
Bachelor's is the new A levels.
No more than 20% need to go to University. And overseas students should be capped at 25% per institution.
6:05 so they have just created an over supply of graduates ?
It's not what you know but who you know and has been for a very long time, getting your feet under the table with say a council job as a pen pusher would normally set someone up for life.
Can you do a video of why people with disabilities struggle to find work and how it could be fix
It very much depends on what you study , how applicable it is to the jobs you intend to apply for and how much those skills are needed by business. After completing a Masters degree in data science my son has just secured a job in the city earning just under 40k. If you can apply yourself to the right degrees and apply for the relevant jobs there are opportunities. The Mickey Mouse and sexy but useless over subscribed subjects are best avoided. Education should be free- it benefits the country not just the individual. But I think there should be more vocational degrees , training / apprenticeships providing the relevant skills that are required in the jobs market. It shouldn’t be beyond the will of man to tie these things together and give young people the best chance of well paid employment .
As a fella who considers himself overeducated, it's a hard no from me. 💀
University didn't hinder Rishi's job and wage prospects. Mr Blair suffered from not being a clairvoyant. University looked a good idea in 1999 maybe. The problem again is politics. If the Tories saw an issue they wouldn't want to point it out or do anything about it in case they lost votes. I was the first in the family to go to Uni back in the 1970's. My brother trained at a college for manual skilled work in the motor industry. He earned much more than me, and owned his own house by the time he was 35, but unfortunately by 60 he had to retire due to ill health and died early due to decades of hard physical work in poor environmental conditions.
Some jobs require a university degree. Nurses, social workers, dcotors etc.
There was a time when you could be a nurse without a degree. My mother and sister (both nurses) not convinced a degree is essential.
@economicshelp Social work used to be a diploma. The course added exams and a couple of modules to make it a degree. The hoops we have to jump through, to get a piece of paper telling us we can do a job eh?
Here's why a degree is a waste of time and money.
1. Once, only about 2% of the population went to University. Back then, it didn't matter what subject was studied. Those who had a degree could pick and chose whatever they fancied without any question of their intelligence or common sense. They were very often 'clever idiots'. And they were your boss. And they earned loads more than you did. And that their education cost them nothing. What's to dislike about these lucky people?
So, it was put to the masses that these monied slackers should at least pay for their good fortune (which was a vote winner) but not before Blair got involved.
First, sell the idea that a degree was the answer to one's financial ambitions. Create a situation where you either had a degree or no degree. Once the numbers had developed, the payment was suggested. Future students were now terrorised into going for a qualification with questionable value and now had to pay for it. On top of that, it mattered not whether the student passed the exams, they still had to pay. The sums are ridiculous. The compounded interest is a scandal.
All it does now is trap people in a circle of self imposed hardship. And it's not as if the Universities have all the information. It's all on the internet. Anyone can learn anything for free.
Anyway, the connection between earning good money and good qualifications in tenuous at best. The real money is to be made from selling things to people that they want. It's easy. Really easy.
Education is a system that teaches very little if anything at all that helps people exist in the real world.
Going to university is only viable if there is a well paying job at the end of it that requires a degree… currently you leave uni with £50k of debt and will be paying 9% student tax on everything you earn over a low threshold… Student debt is now payable for 40 years after graduating… so most people will be paying their loan off into there 60s…. On top of that there isn’t enough well paying jobs any more to guarantee you’ll earn well after graduating! It just isn’t worth the debt, try and find a skilled career that pays you whilst you learn and covers the cost of the qualification
I never went to university but most of my employees did.
* mic drop *
I'm an electrician for that sort of money i will commute from north worcs . Can't get my son to follow me into electrical. My daughter is at Uni doing dentistry.
Excess supply equals lower wages🤷♂️
😂😂😂 i am still laughing on ( AI unblocking your toilet)
These days degree is no longer seen as evidence of competence, employers are more concerned about work experience
I'm in my late 60s and I saw this absurd rise in unnecessary higher education. It didn't used to work like this and it hasn't been a good thing. We could safely close half of out universities with no detriment to the country. Too many are doing Mickey Mouse degrees that lead to nothing worthwhile in terms of the degrees they gain. In my experience, many youngsters going to "uni" don't have the aptitude for higher education; they have a fun time there, but end up saddled with a huge debt and little in the way of career prospects. Let's have more apprenticeships, day release and evening courses and technical colleges. Then we can recruit more Brits and be less reliant on migrants.
A quarter of Universities need to close and the rest need to downsize by a third.
Its all about the people, university graduates in the 1070s were few, (5%) elite and selected; graduates from 2000 were many (50%) mediocre and recruited!
Devalue the product and turn it into a commodity what do you expect? I don't see why you act all surprised....
It's definitely a product these days. One that's largely sold to foreign students looking for "world class" education for high fees.
No.
As someone who just graduated with a first class STEM degree who can’t get a job - simple answer NOT WORTH
Is it that tough out there right now?
@ yepppp
It's always the thing you didn't do isn't it.
Do a BEng or a BSc or get a job! Don't do a BA unless Daddy is paying.
University makes working class people poorer in general but it still makes middle class students better off and higher paid. I have two children both have degrees, both working full time in jobs under £22k a year but there middle class colleagues have better jobs because they have connection in companies through there family and friends.
I was working class. Dad ran a pub. First in my family to go to University. I got a professional job and earned four times as much as Dad ever did.
Knowing the right people to get your foot in the door is just a fact of life, doesn't diminish the value of a degree. The reality is most entry level jobs are badly paid but at least you're on the ladder. It was probably 6 years post-grad before I started earning well.
@@stephfoxwell4620 lucky you, but that doesn’t happen for the majority of working class people,
@zulu3621 Just takes a bit more determination.
I worked through every summer holiday.
Why do tradesmen think they deserve brain surgeon wages these days?
an economist would say supply and demand
He is talking about oversupply of graduates and undersupply of tradesman... which does mean that tradesman can command a large salary than graduates. It's not a matter of believing they deserve the salary. It's a matter of "you have no choice because there aren't many of us" so their services go to the highest bidder.
Let's stretch your example. If a society produces 1000 brain surgeons but only 5 elevator mechanics... who do you think can negotiate higher pay?
@@FrankLloydTeh The best tradesmen in my experience are those who have transitioned to the job from more professional sectors such as IT or teaching.
Tradesmen are always in short supply. Partly because training / apprenticeships are constrained. It also "helps" that the job knackers your body out after your thirties. So there aren't tons of 40, 50 something bricklayers ready to compete for labour.
I disagree, strongly... there's an over supply of tradesmen also... they are 10 a penny - plus one can now RUclips so many trade jobs, there's a rise in diy.
There's an oversupply of PEOPLE - and not enough resources.