I'll be honest, i legitimately don't understand people's obsession with action combat in MMOs. I rarely find it fun, and almost always find it tedious. Granted, i get that EQ level tab target etc is/can be boring AF. I just feel like everyone got obsessed with dark souls at some point and now it's this pernicious disease on gaming that just won't go away. I am personally quite happy with the "whatever we want to call it mix" that AoC has going on, but i can see why the action combat fans aren't pleased.
Thank you! Why oh why has every MMO for the last decade tried to do action combat, when all the best MMOs (IMO) use tab targetting? I don't mind a bit of action-y stuff like GW2 or Wildstar, but tab targetting is such a great base for balanced strategic combat on a large server
Now turn your comment into "I don't understand people's obsession with PvP in mmo's" because we like action combat, in BDO it was done perfectly and in games like GW2 the action system feels incredible if you set it up right. Feels god tier. You can like apple pie and not like key lime pie..it's still pie.
the vast majority of gamers choose to play games that involve mechanical skill- clearly it’s a good idea to design combat that attracts all types of gamers, not just ones that have played MMOs for 20years
I just hope that eventually they keep improving on the combat to make it even better. The fact that it's 'hybrid' is fine, to me. I play Guild Wars 2 with action camera toggle on. it makes the game play a lot more fun for me. To my understanding that is how Ashes is going to work at it's base functions. We'll just have to see how they evolve on the combat even more down the line. I'm personally excited for it.
As much as I wanted this game to go action, they just need to drop this whole hybrid thing and call it what it is, it's a tab game with a few action abilities sprinkled in, but the action abilities are really just AOE abilities. I do remember the arrow drop thing, though. It wasn't just you. I don't know, maybe there is more action out there we haven't seen yet. The basic melee swing video looked like it had more action.
Admonished! Nah man great video. Today's live stream was the clearest example of what many of us have been saying want the combat appeared to be doing. Before today there were some comments during the ranger showcase that definitely made the full action andies wet down under. But many people have been trying to convince them that those statement were likely being misunderstood or misrepresented. Today more than ever confirms the game really is a hybrid, which like I said in my previous comment is what most mmos are now. There are definitely tab features and there are action style skill shots.... hence hybrid. I think the biggest take away is that they are trying to expand upon all the tab hybrid systems and build the most sensible system for a massively multi-player online role playing game. When examined closely the roots of the classic rpg that the game is based on can be clearly seen in the way that the skills and combat work. You have basic targeted attacks that "roll" based on stats, and then you have line, cone, and spherical/cylindrical based spells that you place that are limited in use. The d&d/pathfinder inspiration is pretty strong is this game and I don't think its a bad thing to put the rpg back in mmorpg, and not just in some exclamation mark, quest dialog kind of way.
The mage update today was so sick. As soon as Trad took over and started playing like a real MMO player, swinging the camera around, using all the abilities, the dodge roll, etc., I was in love. I can't wait till 2044 when I finally get to play!
Honestly, that's kinda what I thought the arrows were supposed to do. Hence the reason Steven mentioned firing without a target. Doesn't really make sense at all to ever fire without a target if it's not to overcome the straight-as-an-arrow firing method rangers use. If the arrows do curve, then yeah, it's tab targeting. I feel like there's some missing information somewhere. What's the point of firing without a target then? Good question for the forums to clarify.
You see this in ESO. If you successfully target a player with snipe, the arrow follows the target. If you perform a ranged weapon attack, the arrow will go straight. And if the guy you're aiming at moves, it will hit the guy behind him. In ESO you can't fire snipe without a target. You can fire a weapon attack without a target. I think you will see the same thing for many of the skills in AoC. No one would say that the elder scrolls online is a tab target game. And plenty of action games like Black Desert have hard lock abilities. I don't think the definition is cut and dry because if it is, then all of our current MMO's have hybrid systems. And then the definitions have no meaning.
*Blind firing also exists in Ashes, because the projectiles will travel until they hit something, like a tree.* *You may be confusing hard Lock on target, with soft lock Action camera, with blind fire projectiles. All 3 are in Ashes.*
No, its actually hybrid. If you look at the ranged combat showcase, you can clearly see that those weapon attacks and skills are "action" based. While in the Mage showcase it shows "tab targeting" Steven even specificly states that a ranger/mage can add an augment to make their attacks do that bending, thus changing the default action combat to tab targeting. This to me will default to the following. Some classes are going to be favoring action, and others tab targeting, however, in those classes there are most likely going to be options available from either playstyle. In addition, it looks like that certain augments will be able to switch the default mode of those skills.
In the video Steven talks about how you can choose to be tab and "hardlock" onto players or you can switch to action for basic attacks and softlock onto them allowing you to also free fire without a target.
@@Razdasoldier thats still hard-lock, just ESO style. Yea, there's still a projectile hit-box that can hit stuff if you're not targeting anything, but that's still hard-lock/tab combat.
Nice clickbait title lol. I agree, this is a tab game with action elements. The melee basic attack swing, active block, and dodge roll are action elements imported into this tab-target mmo. There is also the different camera mode (with the direction-based ranged attacks), and we will see how much that impacts player choice and performance.
Yea, the range combat is largely hard-lock, as I said, though I did see Steven dodge roll once or twice in the Mage showcase today, and they had said that both active blocking and dodge-rolling wouldn't be in the game... so it looks like they want to mimic ESO's failed shit combat to a large extent.
Hahaha, WRONG, Finally WROOONGGG!!! muahahahahaa. Did it hurt? Are you going to be okay? Is this going to be the beginning of a delicious stream of wrong stretching out far into the future? I think so!
Basic attack definitely yes. But roll and block are still up in the air. I personally suspect that it will feel clunky and end up getting scrapped, we'll see.
I'll be honest, i legitimately don't understand people's obsession with action combat in MMOs. I rarely find it fun, and almost always find it tedious. Granted, i get that EQ level tab target etc is/can be boring AF. I just feel like everyone got obsessed with dark souls at some point and now it's this pernicious disease on gaming that just won't go away. I am personally quite happy with the "whatever we want to call it mix" that AoC has going on, but i can see why the action combat fans aren't pleased.
Thank you! Why oh why has every MMO for the last decade tried to do action combat, when all the best MMOs (IMO) use tab targetting?
I don't mind a bit of action-y stuff like GW2 or Wildstar, but tab targetting is such a great base for balanced strategic combat on a large server
I've always felt action combat doesn't translate well to the MMORPG genre. I'm happy with the direction combat is going.
If there's one thing real cool in New World is the action combat
Now turn your comment into "I don't understand people's obsession with PvP in mmo's" because we like action combat, in BDO it was done perfectly and in games like GW2 the action system feels incredible if you set it up right. Feels god tier. You can like apple pie and not like key lime pie..it's still pie.
the vast majority of gamers choose to play games that involve mechanical skill- clearly it’s a good idea to design combat that attracts all types of gamers, not just ones that have played MMOs for 20years
I just hope that eventually they keep improving on the combat to make it even better. The fact that it's 'hybrid' is fine, to me. I play Guild Wars 2 with action camera toggle on. it makes the game play a lot more fun for me. To my understanding that is how Ashes is going to work at it's base functions. We'll just have to see how they evolve on the combat even more down the line. I'm personally excited for it.
Yep, it's looking good.
This intro is hilarious lol either way though, the update looked great, despite the target arguments. We'll still be able to find it, enjoyable.
Trying to bring some of that Q comedy to the X chanel.
Weird but RUclips didn't give me any notifications for this video despite me being subbed and having notifications on.
Fix yo shit Dante!
As much as I wanted this game to go action, they just need to drop this whole hybrid thing and call it what it is, it's a tab game with a few action abilities sprinkled in, but the action abilities are really just AOE abilities. I do remember the arrow drop thing, though. It wasn't just you. I don't know, maybe there is more action out there we haven't seen yet. The basic melee swing video looked like it had more action.
I swear he said that at some point! I just couldn't find it.
That's age for you, young Padawan.
Yes yes, I know. BUT I DON'T LIKE IT! Thanks for watching Martin.
Admonished!
Nah man great video. Today's live stream was the clearest example of what many of us have been saying want the combat appeared to be doing. Before today there were some comments during the ranger showcase that definitely made the full action andies wet down under. But many people have been trying to convince them that those statement were likely being misunderstood or misrepresented.
Today more than ever confirms the game really is a hybrid, which like I said in my previous comment is what most mmos are now. There are definitely tab features and there are action style skill shots.... hence hybrid.
I think the biggest take away is that they are trying to expand upon all the tab hybrid systems and build the most sensible system for a massively multi-player online role playing game.
When examined closely the roots of the classic rpg that the game is based on can be clearly seen in the way that the skills and combat work. You have basic targeted attacks that "roll" based on stats, and then you have line, cone, and spherical/cylindrical based spells that you place that are limited in use. The d&d/pathfinder inspiration is pretty strong is this game and I don't think its a bad thing to put the rpg back in mmorpg, and not just in some exclamation mark, quest dialog kind of way.
The mage update today was so sick. As soon as Trad took over and started playing like a real MMO player, swinging the camera around, using all the abilities, the dodge roll, etc., I was in love. I can't wait till 2044 when I finally get to play!
Chin up sir. Being wrong happens to most people. I wouldn't know, but I've heard you can get over it and turn things around. Hang in there.
Pretty sure be wrong is fatal!
Walrik you are just so wrong you don't know you are.
Honestly, that's kinda what I thought the arrows were supposed to do. Hence the reason Steven mentioned firing without a target. Doesn't really make sense at all to ever fire without a target if it's not to overcome the straight-as-an-arrow firing method rangers use. If the arrows do curve, then yeah, it's tab targeting. I feel like there's some missing information somewhere. What's the point of firing without a target then? Good question for the forums to clarify.
You see this in ESO. If you successfully target a player with snipe, the arrow follows the target. If you perform a ranged weapon attack, the arrow will go straight. And if the guy you're aiming at moves, it will hit the guy behind him.
In ESO you can't fire snipe without a target. You can fire a weapon attack without a target. I think you will see the same thing for many of the skills in AoC.
No one would say that the elder scrolls online is a tab target game. And plenty of action games like Black Desert have hard lock abilities. I don't think the definition is cut and dry because if it is, then all of our current MMO's have hybrid systems. And then the definitions have no meaning.
A lot of truth in this.
*Blind firing also exists in Ashes, because the projectiles will travel until they hit something, like a tree.*
*You may be confusing hard Lock on target, with soft lock Action camera, with blind fire projectiles. All 3 are in Ashes.*
I had it in my head that it was an action game as well.
Is it just ranged that are tab targeted or does that include the melee as demoed in the combat livestream?
Some weapons basic melee attack cleave, which is one of the more action-y aspects to this hybrid combat system
ranger showcase did indeed showcase arrows not connecting due to tree between ranger and minitaur
No, its actually hybrid. If you look at the ranged combat showcase, you can clearly see that those weapon attacks and skills are "action" based. While in the Mage showcase it shows "tab targeting" Steven even specificly states that a ranger/mage can add an augment to make their attacks do that bending, thus changing the default action combat to tab targeting.
This to me will default to the following. Some classes are going to be favoring action, and others tab targeting, however, in those classes there are most likely going to be options available from either playstyle. In addition, it looks like that certain augments will be able to switch the default mode of those skills.
Following the evidence, a true scholar. Your scientific node awaits!
Hey my brother! Have you... have you lost a bit of the old weight, my friend? Looking good!
Long time! Yessir, I lost abour 60 pounds. Want to drop another 20-30
You are not wrong. The sound byte you are thinking of came from the ranger showcase
In the video Steven talks about how you can choose to be tab and "hardlock" onto players or you can switch to action for basic attacks and softlock onto them allowing you to also free fire without a target.
17 minutes 3 seconds
@@Razdasoldier thats still hard-lock, just ESO style. Yea, there's still a projectile hit-box that can hit stuff if you're not targeting anything, but that's still hard-lock/tab combat.
Great intro!!!
Thanks
Nice clickbait title lol. I agree, this is a tab game with action elements. The melee basic attack swing, active block, and dodge roll are action elements imported into this tab-target mmo. There is also the different camera mode (with the direction-based ranged attacks), and we will see how much that impacts player choice and performance.
Gotta win the click on youtube.
Plenty of action combat systems have curved projectiles.
Yea, the range combat is largely hard-lock, as I said, though I did see Steven dodge roll once or twice in the Mage showcase today, and they had said that both active blocking and dodge-rolling wouldn't be in the game... so it looks like they want to mimic ESO's failed shit combat to a large extent.
It'll be interesting to see if they can find a way to make either active block, or active dodge work in a mostly tab game.
@@Xillin Spoiler: no. They can't.
Awwww man, you ruined it for me!
Hahaha, WRONG, Finally WROOONGGG!!! muahahahahaa. Did it hurt? Are you going to be okay? Is this going to be the beginning of a delicious stream of wrong stretching out far into the future? I think so!
It was awful, I don't plan on ever being wrong again. Worse day of my life.
U have roll, basic attack and block.
Basic attack definitely yes. But roll and block are still up in the air. I personally suspect that it will feel clunky and end up getting scrapped, we'll see.
@@Xillin lets hope
Biggly.