Totally agree about elevation and HVAC but something to keep in mind, that even in a gas car... you can lose nearly 30% of your highway efficiency driving 80mph vs 55mph. So a vehicle that gets 25mpg at 55mph, will only get ~18mpg when driving at 80mph (of course all that depends on aerodynamics, tire design, gearing and friction in the drivetrain). I have a Volt, and one thing I've noticed that the guess-o-meter miles after doing a long downhill regen are not the same as miles you gain through overnight charging. The Bolt has a much more sophisticated system for calculating remaining range... whereas with the Volt, it's like "oh well, you still got a generator".
As an EV owner, EVs really shine when used locally and charged exclusively at home. Our charging infrastructure just isn't ready for EVs to travel long distances. Too far and in between and in my opinion kwh costs are too high.
Enjoy it while it lasts, electricity is on the rise and tier rate systems for the governments to match the ICE profits for people home charging. Smart electrical panels are the next thing that will be forced into homes as it will be needed for neighborhood power consumption to balance the power grid when many more people drive EVs.
As a Bolt owner I very much appreciate the honest review. EVs are an adjustment but I also found that the Bolt is just fabulous. It's just a good car with very good manners and requires nearly no adjustments for ICE drivers. I regularly do a 450km run on mostly flat terrain and I usually top up 3/4 of the way just to make sure i've got some extra drive time when i get to where I'm going.
Most of this is more about the Bolt than about other EVs (such as Tesla) that have efficient heat pumps, fast charging, far more reliable and numerous charging options, more efficient regeneration, automatic routing to appropriate Superchargers, next generation maps, etc.
Well, gas powered cars also have diminished autonomy at high speed and in the mountains (even-though EVs get back a portion of it when going down afterwards like you said). You just see it less because gas stations are abundant. The difference in winter comes from the fact that the electric motor doesn't generate heat the way the petrol engine does, so you use more battery (that's when the heat pump can make a difference). For me, I can't go back to petrol cars. But I live in France, so probably easier here than in the USA from what I see in videos.
I just bought a 2020 Bolt and have put 1000 miles on it. 98% of my driving is under 50 MPH so my average has been 4.6 miles per KWH. Our terrain is hilly and our need for heat has been minimal. I think my first 2 months have been close to ideal and I am experiencing a cost of about $4.00 per 100 miles driven. The car we were driving was costing about $20.00 per 100 miles driven. I anticipate after driving a year that my average for the Bolt might go up to $5.00 per 100 miles driven when the heat is being used. When I look at my annual cost to drive I anticipate a savings of $1500.00 in fuel and $200.00 in maintenance. My used Bolt was a buyback with a new Battery with 100K and 8 years of warranty and a 12/12 fairly inclusive warranty. If I drive this and don’t incur any major repair expense after 5 years my fuel savings will have made my cost to own zero. I received a 4K federal tax rebate and a 3K State grant and bought at the perfect time when fear and inventory was high. And while I personally benefited from the government incentives I would like to see them go away. In addition I would like to see all of the incentives and special tax breaks that the Petroleum industry receives be terminated and tax them to reflect the true costs that the tailpipe and refinery pollution adds to health costs. With no tax breaks or incentives and fuel subsidies gone the consumer will make the choice that is best for them and the manufacturers will produce vehicles that meet those needs.
What a lot of thought has to go into an EV road trip. Can I make it? will I need heating or cooling? Will the route be uphill at the start or end? Will there be a working charger available? With an ICE car:- "wanna stop for a burger and get some gas - how long is the next town?"
Thanks for this, considering an ev and have a similar elevation change and highway route from home to the coast here in australia and wondered how it would look charging wise. Food for thought
You are most accurate with the 3 things that impact you. Also not just the heater as I dont turn it on even in 25 degree weather, but ambient temperature outside below 50 degrees has huge impact as well at 25 degrees range drops like rock even with heat off.
The issues you mentioned are partly why I passed on a Bolt as an upgrade to my 2012 Volt. There aren't any real improvements in drivetrain/HVAC technology, which should have happened at sometime in the Bolt's lifecycle.
The freakiest thing I noticed about hills was that you don't even notice them. No changing font position, no sliwing down, ev is just a beast on hills. It is more expensive to travel on long distances when relying on motorway charging, but unless you never go home to charge, the extra motorway charge is a tiny fraction of the massive savings over diesel or petrol.
Thanks for the information and putting the effort into sharing it. For EV’s in general range anxiety on longer trips may not be worth it for most, driving around town may be worth it. Also the pre-planning portion, taking into account the variables mentioned, can stress owners or potential owners out. Only the owner or prospective owner can decide if an EV is the right choice.
The Bolt is a very good EV option, not least its price, esp after incentives but the points raised here are largely Bolt issues rather than applies to all EVs. Heating in particularly, many EVs are now equipped with a heat pump (and some also really optimise the heating/cooling systems) so that heating (or cooling) has almost no impact on real world range. As I say it’s a good EV but probably not the best suited to the trip here, esp when winter temperatures arrive. Oh and we have to mention that real time prediction data would make it a lot easier for the new arc driver to work out if they will have enough, will be short or just need to slow down a touch. The only brand I know who does this well is Tesla; they take account of elevation, wind speed, temperature etc.
I had the 17, 20 and 21 Bolt EV. In my own observations, for every 1000 feet of elevation gained, the car tends to lose 8 miles in terms of efficiency. Nevertheless, this loss is typically compensated for when descending back to sea level. Turning on the heater shoudl be kept at a minimum for range. It is better to purchase the Premier model with the heated steering wheel and heated seats.
I own a BYD and use the A/C a lot and yes, it takes some energy. But of no real concern if you are aware of this. Mountains are no issue, maybe the Chevrolet Bolt regen brake issue. It was all fine I would never go back to an ICE vehicle. Tesla is more efficient. Enjoy.
As much as I appreciate the positive aspects of driving an EV - quick, smooth, quiet, and convenient (with home charging / city driving), other factors give me pause. With solid state battery and other advancements coming in 5-7 years, current EVs will be obsolete and their resale value will plummet. And also once the battery warranty runs out you better hope it doesn't break. Replacement cost will be high and we don't even know if the manufacturers will still make outdated batteries then. So enjoy your EV now but think about getting rid of it before it's worth next to nothing.
I live at the North end of BC by Yukon border. No one has them up here. Pretty much useless up here when it's -20 to -45 all winter. None of them have the range to make it to another charger in the winter. Charger infrastucture is pretty much non existant. Whitehorse Yukon to Fort St John BC is 1400km & climbs over 2 mountain ranges. Chargers in FSJ, 100km North of FSJ at rest stop, Fort nelson, Watson Lake , Whitehorse. that's it. Undoable even in summer. Winter, impossible. Bring your Honda generator I guess.
This is generally the case. Some of the big Fords from the 70s would get more MPG if worked harder. 90 MPH A/C on then if on drove 65, Don't have one in my pocket so I can't prove it.
A gas car suffers the same efficiency drop the faster they go, as aerodynamic drag doesn't care what power system you have under the hood. The reason a gas car's highway efficiency is higher than its city rating is because a gas car is _horrendously_ inefficient in slow stop-and-go driving in the city. A gas car needs to keep the engine spinning at least 30 times per second even when stopped at an intersection, to say nothing of the losses you deal with when accelerating away from that intersection.
I’m just going to buy a hybrid Camry and be done. I’ve rented a Niro EV for 3 weeks and while love the passing power and smooth drivetrain, it is annoying to wait to chRge and then wait while actually charging and charging away from home is the same price per mile as gas.
Not to ruin the party, but although the Bolt is indeed a full EV, it's on the very lower end of EVs. It's not meant for long trips. It doesn't have a heat pump to save energy, and it charges horribly, and therefore, it regens just as slow. It charges like an EV from 10 years ago. So you're doing this video on an EV with technology from 10 years ago. If you had done this on a fast charging modern EV, such as a Model 3 or Y with Supercharges access everywhere and 500 kilometers of range and proper regen to regain on the way down most of the energy lost going up, you would have had zero issues. Do this same trip on one of those and then come back to us.
All of the factors affecting electric vehicle range also affect internal combustion vehicles. We need to stop spending taxpayer money to support the oil industry and start improving, developing, and maintaining our electrical infrastructure.
Smart EV owners don't say those things, they know what they lose and gain with EVs I have a '23 Bolt and was quite Aware of the one hour that it takes to go from 20% to 80% BUT! I will spend more than an hour dilly dallying on my phone every day checking out the news and RUclips as I am now so I can combine charging and doing phone stuff
But the car for you. I wouldn’t buy a 1litre petrol engine car to do long freeway or mountainous journeys, just as I wouldn’t buy an electric for the same journey. 50 mile daily commute round trip buy electric. Simple.
if you use an EV to its tregths, then yes, I totally agree, cheapest thing out there. However, if you're thinking about a 1.5K mile trip in an EV, regardless of brand, that's going to always be the most expensive means of transport. You will literally waste your most valuable asset, which is your time. a 1000K trip in an ICE took someone 12 hrs, including stops. Took someone else 2 days in a model S.
Totally agree about elevation and HVAC but something to keep in mind, that even in a gas car... you can lose nearly 30% of your highway efficiency driving 80mph vs 55mph. So a vehicle that gets 25mpg at 55mph, will only get ~18mpg when driving at 80mph (of course all that depends on aerodynamics, tire design, gearing and friction in the drivetrain). I have a Volt, and one thing I've noticed that the guess-o-meter miles after doing a long downhill regen are not the same as miles you gain through overnight charging. The Bolt has a much more sophisticated system for calculating remaining range... whereas with the Volt, it's like "oh well, you still got a generator".
As an EV owner, EVs really shine when used locally and charged exclusively at home.
Our charging infrastructure just isn't ready for EVs to travel long distances. Too far and in between and in my opinion kwh costs are too high.
Enjoy it while it lasts, electricity is on the rise and tier rate systems for the governments to match the ICE profits for people home charging. Smart electrical panels are the next thing that will be forced into homes as it will be needed for neighborhood power consumption to balance the power grid when many more people drive EVs.
In California the gas tax is more than the cost of the gasoline! And the governor wants to get rid of tax's? Does seem a little fishy to me.
As a Bolt owner I very much appreciate the honest review. EVs are an adjustment but I also found that the Bolt is just fabulous. It's just a good car with very good manners and requires nearly no adjustments for ICE drivers. I regularly do a 450km run on mostly flat terrain and I usually top up 3/4 of the way just to make sure i've got some extra drive time when i get to where I'm going.
Most of this is more about the Bolt than about other EVs (such as Tesla) that have efficient heat pumps, fast charging, far more reliable and numerous charging options, more efficient regeneration, automatic routing to appropriate Superchargers, next generation maps, etc.
Jech... T*sl@ ... barfff...
Well, gas powered cars also have diminished autonomy at high speed and in the mountains (even-though EVs get back a portion of it when going down afterwards like you said). You just see it less because gas stations are abundant.
The difference in winter comes from the fact that the electric motor doesn't generate heat the way the petrol engine does, so you use more battery (that's when the heat pump can make a difference).
For me, I can't go back to petrol cars. But I live in France, so probably easier here than in the USA from what I see in videos.
I just bought a 2020 Bolt and have put 1000 miles on it. 98% of my driving is under 50 MPH so my average has been 4.6 miles per KWH. Our terrain is hilly and our need for heat has been minimal. I think my first 2 months have been close to ideal and I am experiencing a cost of about $4.00 per 100 miles driven. The car we were driving was costing about $20.00 per 100 miles driven. I anticipate after driving a year that my average for the Bolt might go up to $5.00 per 100 miles driven when the heat is being used. When I look at my annual cost to drive I anticipate a savings of $1500.00 in fuel and $200.00 in maintenance. My used Bolt was a buyback with a new Battery with 100K and 8 years of warranty and a 12/12 fairly inclusive warranty. If I drive this and don’t incur any major repair expense after 5 years my fuel savings will have made my cost to own zero. I received a 4K federal tax rebate and a 3K State grant and bought at the perfect time when fear and inventory was high. And while I personally benefited from the government incentives I would like to see them go away. In addition I would like to see all of the incentives and special tax breaks that the Petroleum industry receives be terminated and tax them to reflect the true costs that the tailpipe and refinery pollution adds to health costs. With no tax breaks or incentives and fuel subsidies gone the consumer will make the choice that is best for them and the manufacturers will produce vehicles that meet those needs.
A guy who lives in a country near the Arctic circle, had a holiday in his Tesla. He travelled north, and he either into or close to the Arctic circle.
What a lot of thought has to go into an EV road trip. Can I make it? will I need heating or cooling? Will the route be uphill at the start or end? Will there be a working charger available?
With an ICE car:- "wanna stop for a burger and get some gas - how long is the next town?"
Agree 100%. Infrastructure for EV’s just isn’t widely available unfortunately.
Thanks for this, considering an ev and have a similar elevation change and highway route from home to the coast here in australia and wondered how it would look charging wise. Food for thought
Very informative, love all your graphics! Thank you!
You are most accurate with the 3 things that impact you. Also not just the heater as I dont turn it on even in 25 degree weather, but ambient temperature outside below 50 degrees has huge impact as well at 25 degrees range drops like rock even with heat off.
Bottom line: If I had to depend on public chargers, I wouldn't have purchased my lightning platinum.
The issues you mentioned are partly why I passed on a Bolt as an upgrade to my 2012 Volt. There aren't any real improvements in drivetrain/HVAC technology, which should have happened at sometime in the Bolt's lifecycle.
The freakiest thing I noticed about hills was that you don't even notice them. No changing font position, no sliwing down, ev is just a beast on hills.
It is more expensive to travel on long distances when relying on motorway charging, but unless you never go home to charge, the extra motorway charge is a tiny fraction of the massive savings over diesel or petrol.
Thanks for the information and putting the effort into sharing it. For EV’s in general range anxiety on longer trips may not be worth it for most, driving around town may be worth it. Also the pre-planning portion, taking into account the variables mentioned, can stress owners or potential owners out. Only the owner or prospective owner can decide if an EV is the right choice.
The Bolt is a very good EV option, not least its price, esp after incentives but the points raised here are largely Bolt issues rather than applies to all EVs. Heating in particularly, many EVs are now equipped with a heat pump (and some also really optimise the heating/cooling systems) so that heating (or cooling) has almost no impact on real world range. As I say it’s a good EV but probably not the best suited to the trip here, esp when winter temperatures arrive.
Oh and we have to mention that real time prediction data would make it a lot easier for the new arc driver to work out if they will have enough, will be short or just need to slow down a touch. The only brand I know who does this well is Tesla; they take account of elevation, wind speed, temperature etc.
I had the 17, 20 and 21 Bolt EV. In my own observations, for every 1000 feet of elevation gained, the car tends to lose 8 miles in terms of efficiency. Nevertheless, this loss is typically compensated for when descending back to sea level. Turning on the heater shoudl be kept at a minimum for range. It is better to purchase the Premier model with the heated steering wheel and heated seats.
Whatever route you take, you got multi spots to charge up. Kelowna Kamloops Hope. #3 Princeton, Manning Park by Eastgate, Hope
I own a BYD and use the A/C a lot and yes, it takes some energy. But of no real concern if you are aware of this. Mountains are no issue, maybe the Chevrolet Bolt regen brake issue. It was all fine I would never go back to an ICE vehicle. Tesla is more efficient. Enjoy.
As much as I appreciate the positive aspects of driving an EV - quick, smooth, quiet, and convenient (with home charging / city driving), other factors give me pause. With solid state battery and other advancements coming in 5-7 years, current EVs will be obsolete and their resale value will plummet. And also once the battery warranty runs out you better hope it doesn't break. Replacement cost will be high and we don't even know if the manufacturers will still make outdated batteries then. So enjoy your EV now but think about getting rid of it before it's worth next to nothing.
just bring along a battery back up unit like eccoflow you could use it for heat or to add power if you run out
I can't imagine doing that road trip at 105. Even 120 seems slow on the straight sections.
You bring a small honda whisper generator that charges in 220 and a jerry can on mountain trips to charge in a emergency
I have an hybrid, my 2020 Toyota Corolla with a internal combustion engine has an electric fuel pump!😊
I live at the North end of BC by Yukon border. No one has them up here. Pretty much useless up here when it's -20 to -45 all winter. None of them have the range to make it to another charger in the winter. Charger infrastucture is pretty much non existant. Whitehorse Yukon to Fort St John BC is 1400km & climbs over 2 mountain ranges. Chargers in FSJ, 100km North of FSJ at rest stop, Fort nelson, Watson Lake , Whitehorse. that's it. Undoable even in summer. Winter, impossible. Bring your Honda generator I guess.
Yep, that won’t work. Also move away. I moved from Manitoba because…well…winter.
Everyone should realize range will drop more at higher speeds in an EV just as it drops with a gas vehicle.
This is generally the case. Some of the big Fords from the 70s would get more MPG if worked harder. 90 MPH A/C on then if on drove 65, Don't have one in my pocket so I can't prove it.
A gas car suffers the same efficiency drop the faster they go, as aerodynamic drag doesn't care what power system you have under the hood. The reason a gas car's highway efficiency is higher than its city rating is because a gas car is _horrendously_ inefficient in slow stop-and-go driving in the city. A gas car needs to keep the engine spinning at least 30 times per second even when stopped at an intersection, to say nothing of the losses you deal with when accelerating away from that intersection.
Like a 30 gallon tank of a Bugatti gets sucked dry in 11 minutes at full speed.
I’m just going to buy a hybrid Camry and be done. I’ve rented a Niro EV for 3 weeks and while love the passing power and smooth drivetrain, it is annoying to wait to chRge and then wait while actually charging and charging away from home is the same price per mile as gas.
What is 105 kilometers in American?
65 MPH. Divide by 1.6 on everything I said…🤣
@@that_jamesguy I always found it easier to multiply by 0.6 in my head
63 miles
Not to ruin the party, but although the Bolt is indeed a full EV, it's on the very lower end of EVs. It's not meant for long trips. It doesn't have a heat pump to save energy, and it charges horribly, and therefore, it regens just as slow. It charges like an EV from 10 years ago. So you're doing this video on an EV with technology from 10 years ago.
If you had done this on a fast charging modern EV, such as a Model 3 or Y with Supercharges access everywhere and 500 kilometers of range and proper regen to regain on the way down most of the energy lost going up, you would have had zero issues. Do this same trip on one of those and then come back to us.
All of the factors affecting electric vehicle range also affect internal combustion vehicles. We need to stop spending taxpayer money to support the oil industry and start improving, developing, and maintaining our electrical infrastructure.
My e-bike battery doesn’t like hills either.
Smart EV owners don't say those things, they know what they lose and gain with EVs
I have a '23 Bolt and was quite Aware of the one hour that it takes to go from 20% to 80%
BUT! I will spend more than an hour dilly dallying on my phone every day checking out the news and RUclips as I am now so I can combine charging and doing phone stuff
I've never met a smart EV owner , do they really exist?
But the car for you. I wouldn’t buy a 1litre petrol engine car to do long freeway or mountainous journeys, just as I wouldn’t buy an electric for the same journey. 50 mile daily commute round trip buy electric. Simple.
You had bought a Tesla you wouldn’t be dealing with those issues! Just saying…
Yes if only I had that extra $100K, no problem!
Range is almost always irrelevant. You are still far cheaper than anything else on the road
Not if you want to do mountain pass trips!
if you use an EV to its tregths, then yes, I totally agree, cheapest thing out there. However, if you're thinking about a 1.5K mile trip in an EV, regardless of brand, that's going to always be the most expensive means of transport. You will literally waste your most valuable asset, which is your time. a 1000K trip in an ICE took someone 12 hrs, including stops. Took someone else 2 days in a model S.
Hahahaha... wait till you see my Smart 451...
@@playlist11110000 yep - you are bang on! So far most of my “trips” are 1.25-1.50 battery pack distances, so still doable.
@@that_jamesguy Really - h ave you even driven one? Coming down off a mountain pass I went 57 miles with no change in charge level.