Classic Who Review - Time and the Rani
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- Опубликовано: 15 окт 2024
- The inaugural adventure of the Seventh Doctor, gets a look under one geek's microscope.
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Sylvester's season 24 is infamous. Season 25 is really strong while season 26 is amazing and consistent. Sylvester McCoy is a really underrated and great doctor.
With the exception of Delta and the Bannermen which I thought was passable enough; I hate season 24. Time and the Rani was pretty bad and didn't really do any favours for Sylvester McCoy who was lumbered with some lousy dialogue. Paradise Towers and Dragonfire were just woeful as well.
Thankfully things did improve with series 25 which wasn't perfect (Silver Nemesis which was supposed to celebrate the 25th anniversary of the series was just god awful) benefitted from having Remembrance of the Daleks which was a strong story. There's so much in it that's really good and the ending is one of the most memorable and it arguably shows him at his most manipulative. The Happiness Patrol was decent enough for what it is if silly although I do get the whole allegorical aspect of it being a satire on Thatcherite Britian in the eighties. The Kandyman also has to rank as one of the most bizarre monsters in the entirety of the series. The Greatest Show in the Galaxy is another one which while I hear a lot of fans praise it, I can't see the big fuss over. I didn't dislike it but I like; The Happiness Patrol it was decent enough just nothing special.
Then we have the 26th and final season of the classic series which rates as the best in mu opinion of McCoy's run. it doesn't get off to a good start with Battlefield which while it had a decent concept wasn't all that well executed. Surprising considering it's script was written by Ben Aaronovitch who also wrote; Remembrance of the Daleks because I would have expected better but it's not a story I would care to watch again even though it was the final story of the series ever to properly feature the wonderful Nicolas Courtney as the Brigadier alongside the Doctor. Other than seeing the welcome return of him there's no other reason I can find to would want to watch it again. Ghost Light however which followed thankfully proved to be so much better and ranks as one of the best stories of the entire classic series as a whole. The inspired plot aside it also features I think one of the best depictions of the relationship between the Seventh Doctor and Ace; and how much he cares for her. The story acts as him basicly attempting to find closure over something traumatic that happened in her childhood and find some kind of closure and once again displays him atbeing typically wily and manipulative. The Curse of Fenric, well what can be said about but great story, great monsters and another excellent depiction of the relationship between both the Doctor and Ace and the undoubted affection they have for one another. It's also not without it's surprises as it has something of a neat ironic twist at the end in regards to Ace's past. Surviival makes for a terrific end to the classic run with the return of Anthony Ainley's Master . If there is a flaw with this story although I consider it minor it never explains how he managed to escape being presuambly incarcerated by the Time Lords after becoming trapped in the Matrix at the end of; The Trial of a Time Lord: The Ultimate Foe but then an explantion might have been contrived. It couldn't have been worse than the lack of explanation how he survived being burnt to a cinder at the end of; Planet of Fire in; The Mark of the Rani. Anyway it undoubtedly for me features the best depiction of Anthony Ainley's Master as well as the best performance from him.Ainley really shines in this and I love the verbal sparring between he and the Seventh Doctor as well as again, his relationship with Ace as she returns to her home district of Perivale in London., and she meets with old friends of her's all be it under the worst of circumstances.
Lmao when did I write this
Yeah he is amazing it's just we are unable to have him higher because of 24 and the other doctors are just phenomenal still i try to make him as highly placed as possible
@@robertmcelwaine7024 at least dragonfire had ace and while she was not as good as she would become she was maybe the best companion in the JNT era except possibly romana depending on where you stand but 2 of three i think of the 24 stories are holidays paradise towers to delta and the bannerman we won a holiday to we need a holiday
The sad thing is that this may be the most positive review about this story, that's how bad Time and the Rani is
That does kind of say it all.
Sylvester is my favourite Doctor, I find his character arc fascinating going from a bumbling clown to the master manipulator to a tired old man. You could have go at the Marco Polo soundtrack.
Bonnie Langford, who played Mel, was already known in Britain for saying "I'll scream and scream and scream until I'm sick" with a marked lisp playing Violet Elizabeth Bott in a 1970s British TV version of the Just William stories. Time and the Rani was the Rani's last appearance in main continuity - she was main antagonist in Dimensions in Space which was a 15 minute or so special made for "Children in Need" which is the main BBC telethon in 1993 during a hiatus.
I remember in dragon fire Mel was screaming and ace was there and Sophie Aldred looked so confused and almost in pain it was really funny
Mel’s scream is so glass shattering, so piercing, it’s actually quite impressive. Like when it happens, I’m not annoyed, I’m more just like, “....woah.”
I see a lot of people group character like The Rani and The Meddling Monk into just being other versions of The Master. But I think they serve different functions as foils for The Doctor. For instance, the Meddling Monk could challenge The Doctor's defence of history, asking why they SHOULDN'T just fix the things humanity "got wrong". The Doctor is also a person who learns about the universe by experiencing it, while The Rani would rather tear the universe apart to learn about it.
I love the 7th doctor, he's my favourite and I'd recommend his era to anyone trying to get into classic who - but, trust me, skip his 1st series. It's awful. His 2nd and 3rd series, however, are brilliant - the perfect combination of dark and fun, and Ace is probably the greatest Doctor who companion ever. Remembrance of the Daleks, Curse of Fenric and Survival are all widely adknowledged as amazing, The Greatest Show in the Galaxy is also brilliant and the Happiness Patrol and Ghost Light are two "love it or hate it" stories--which I love.
Totally agree with pretty much everything you said here... though I thought Dragonfire was... "fine"... and Paradise towers had its moments.
As for the other 2 episodes... yeah... more bad than good. No nice way of saying it. Some slivers of "decent"... and Sylvester is a lot of fun... but... he cant save it alone :(
Battlefield is also an amazing underrated gem
no doubt... slightly "grating" overuse of music at times... but techno-knights from another dimension? Hello? AMAZING!!! :D
Delta and Dragonfire are good
I´ll grant Delta its good basic idea... I´ll also praise it for being severely dark (im a morbid f*ck at times so I love that)...
but the execution of the episode was ... mediocre at best. The production quality was simply not good enough. (budget issues obviously)
Season 24 has the shortest prep time as it was commissioned sooo late so producer John Nathan-Turner was in a very tough situation. He only had a companion - he had to find a new Doctor, new script editor and just reboot the show but no time to actually think it through. This was a panic season.
Time and the Rani wasn't written to be a new Doctor story. Pip and Jane Baker wrote it to be Baker's finale - hoping he'd be persuaded to do a final story. So the new doctor is introduced to us through the Rani as apposed to the companion as is the normal way (the companion being the audience stand-in. Since she treats him like a complete moron - that doesn't do the audience perspective any favours. The script is a rather generic and one note.
McCoy is charming and so watchable. He is a breath of fresh air after the troubled sixth Doctor era. He's just a little guy bumbling around the universe looking for adventures in season 24 which I really like.
Mel - poor Bonnie Langford knew that she wasn't getting anything worthwhile to do so didn't stay any longer than a short season and a bit. Her first script editor didn't like the character created by the producer so didn't really give her much to do and then when Andrew Cartmel came in as her second script editor, he didn't bother enhancing or developing her (not that he had the time in the short run up) and just was happy to lose her to bring Ace in.
I didn't like Time and the Rani in 1987 as an 8 year old, it was boring to me but I find it fascinating now due to it's interesting production background and that everyone was just finding their way.
I think the direction is the biggest liability. Andrew Morgan just doesn't direct the actors or his camera in any creative or truly dramatic way. But he's saved by the ingenuity of the special effects with the practical effects and video effect guys working closely together.
While The Rani's appearances weren't great I always liked the concept of her. That's why I thought that Missy should have been Rani as she would have fit well in season 8's storyline and would have made more sense. I know having the Master change genders was a test run for eventually changing the Doctor's gender but it still felt unnecessary to have a female Master when Rani already existed.
Well... its not so much about her different gender than her different attitude. She was (supposed to at least) an unethical scientist... with no ambition to wreck stuff or conquer worlds etc... just research without ethics.
Sadly in this episode she pretty much became the Master...
Her first episode wasnt "great" but she was at least a clearly different person than the Master was. And she disliked him and the Doctor equally it seemed ;) Pointing out that they were in fact bickering children and she just wanted to get on with her work. I liked that concept quite a lot.
I have always thought that too
Daelyas Doesn't stop Moffat from missing the point of a villian's character like the Sontarans are supposed to be a war-driven race(who are parodies of real-life warmongers) that uses other races as pawns in their war against the Rutons. Of course he writes them as comic reliefs that probably would be considered a flaw in the cloning process by the likes of Linx.
Oh I agree that Strax was very overused as a comedy character with every appearance. Though I did like the idea of him in his first few appearances - with every new episode he became more and more of a joke :(
Of course its possible to rationalize everything away in a show like DW... so one could claim that Strax and Lynx are 10.000 years apart for instance... or that Strax is indeed an anomaly among his kind as you said :)
But lets face it: Its Moffats obsession with the fairy tale style writing. And his instance on giving everything a lighthearted touch and a happy end.
He (often) writes good part 1s though... then cocks it up in part 2 by cancelling all the great stuff out with no drawbacks... you cant kill people over and over again and bring them back to life...if you dont want to kill them... DONT KILL THEM in the first place! :D But death (for companions) is meaningless atm in the show.
I just hope this does not carry on ... or that the BBC is to afraid to change the direction of the show because people are now so used to it being more "happy" and "safe".
In short... I want more episodes like "midnight". By far one of the best examples of a great modern who episode. Its also really "cheap"... only one set and not even a "monster" to be seen... yet so damn effective and suspenseful.
I think if that happened I would be thinking “why bring back the rani when you can just have a female master”
My issue with the Rani is this story. In Mark of the Rani (which I like), the Rani is portrayed as a mad scientist. Amoral, selfish, detached. She has no delusions of grandeur or dreams of conquest (like the Master does). And then there's this story. The Rani's plan included conquest. And it involved the Rani wearing a disguise to trick the Doctor... in this story, the Rani was re-written to be the Master.
100% agreed
I started Sylvester's run with Time and the Rani. Big mistake. Please don't judge the rest of his era on this.
If you haven't already watch Rememberance of the Daleks, The Greatest Show in the Galaxy and the whole of Season 26.
The greatest show in the galaxy is the best episode of any Doctor Who of all time. It could destroy any Moffat, RTD and especially any Chibnall episode.
@@bobbygolden8058 I think I respect greatest show in the Glalaxy more than I like it. I don't think it was necessary to spend ALL of part 1 just getting to the circus, the 7th Doctor seemed to be tricked way to easily, the werewolf was just kind of weird and felt out of place and overall... it kind of depressed me. In the way I think it was meant to, the show is commenting on its condition and how it was being treated and while I do really respect the awareness and guts they're showing it just kind of makes me really sad.
I only have one defense when it comes to Mel......Big Finish Audio. Better stories better acting....and way less screaming!
ilovecatweazle She wasn’t given a character or a backstory on tv. It’s a pity too, because Bonnie Langford isn’t a bad actress when she’s given good material. Her Big Finish stuff is consistently great
True enough. Even Patrick Stewart or Meryl Streep would not be able to save "Jersey Shore"... material does matter ;)
After the big finish audios Mel is one of my favorite companions
The creatures with the multiple eyes are called Tetraps I believe. Also one of the humanoid creatures they are called Lakertyans , anyway one of them is played by Wanda Ventham. Wanda Ventham is an actress in her own right and Benedict Cumberbatch’s mother. Yes, the Rani was meant to be a female Master type character and interesting fact, when Riversong turned up or Tasha Lemm or Missy, etc. for the first time people joked that they ( the character) were the Rani until proven otherwise. In fact there’s an out take of Missy saying she is The Rani in order to cover the fact that she is in fact The Master before the Series 8 finale aired. Anyway, just thought you might like to know this stuff.
I'm not sure people were joking when they kept declaring so may female characters will end up being the Rani, it always struck me more as an attempt to be able to say "I called it!" if it ever happens.
7th doctor is my favourite so I just pretend that “that year” didn’t exist
The rani’s impression of mel made me wee tho
7 is my favourite too! He is still great even in his bad ones
I was thirteen years of age and my lovely parents were racing me back home, having just arrived back in England from our holiday in Spain. I was SO excited about new Doctor Who, then I saw it.... I recall my Mum turning to me and saying, 'so we rushed back for...that? What the bloody hell were they all wearing?' I was slightly devastated and then I warmed to Sylv (from Delta and the Bannerman onward.)
I think it sounds like you are not anti-Rani as much as against the acting and the writing of the character. In current canon the Master and the Doctor are former school-mates who have a different idea of life (Omega's messing with the Master not withstanding). If the Rani were another school-mate who felt inferior and has been trying to show how smart she was but just doing the experiments, motivated with the discovery and to show she's better than the Doctor at science. Where the Master wants to be in charge and sees others as inferior, and the Doctor wants to help those less than him, the Rani just wants to be the one in the history books and taught in schools.
I think all these "rogue Time Lords" should resurface to give the Doctor the contrast to them, while still keeping the mystery of his backstory.
Technically, the Rani has three appearances. She is also the nominal villain in the 30th anniversary charity special "Dimensions in Time', This is just a barely passable fan service romp bringing back as many actors as they could get away with. The Rani's companion in that is played by a very young Sam West. Her Tardis had a very cool design. That's about the best that can be said about her.. Only lookup DiT if you're feeling really completist!
I do love that a later Doctor (I really cant remember who anymore though) brought up "Dimensions in Time" as a bad dream he once had where he was being chased around a British soap opera set :D
As I said... I cant recall if thats from a comic, audio book or even a throw away line from a new who episode... I just remember it happening.
Its a great shame they accidentally destroyed Rani's tardis set as it would of been a great starting point to make a new Tardis interior for the doctor
To be honest, Dimensions in Time isn't that bad. It's a real joy to watch. There's been specials worse than this. Is it canon? If we can make that poor excuse of a 50th canon, I don't see why this can't.
You watched "Time & the Rani", Oh dear, my condolences.
The actress who played Mel was previously known for acting as a spoilt girl in the Just William stories.
It was all pantomime level acting, or rather over acting. Very broad.
Your review was incredibly generous.
The funny thing is one of the kids on The Sarah Jane Adventures was named Rani.
Another reminder: Classic Doctor Who marathon is still on Twitch, they have just started the 3rd Doctor,
Hi! My dear friend Nathaniel, I agree with everything you said in your brilliant review, this was made at the time when the BBC was killing it off. So they didn't really care about the show much. Have you had chance to watch the excellent Sarah Jane Adventures yet. I think you would enjoy it! Thanks for your great reviews and keep up with the excellent work my friend!
I could be wrong, but based on what I read and heard at the time, Pip and Jane Baker were mediocre writers, but they were fast. They tended to get called in when the production team needed a script in a hurry.
okay, who does your thumbnails now? THEY ARE REALLY REALLY GOOD
Gent by the name of Joel Johnson.
A Doctor's debut can't be any worst than this. Yes I think Time and the Rani is worse than The Twin Dilemma
Mel is one of those characters who benefited from appearances in non-TV Doctor Who mediums like Big Finish.
I rather like the fact that Big Finish seems to have set the challenge for themselves of reviving failed characters from the show.
Ah, now you've reached the era when I first started to work on the show. Not a particular fav of mine sadly. We made the miniatures of the Tetraps hanging in the caves and we also painted and haired the fill size suit heads. In house did the rest. This was not the worst story ever done, but far from great either. Mel always use to get on my nerves so any gains from slightly higher production values was unfortunately crushed by her OTT performance.
Very much a kind of 'meh' story.
silverspike1 Wow, What would be a fave of yours?
Shows like Doctor Who and Blakes 7 were inspiring to me as a kid because the sets, aliens, and space stuff looked like something it might be possible to make for myself. May I ask, what other episodes/shows did you work on?
Hi there,
Well I've worked on other episodes of Who (Curse of Fenric/Battlefield/Happiness Patrol/Dargonfire/Greatest show etc, etc, the old Max Headroom series, Terrahawks, 2 Harry Potter movies, and a whole host of other daftness. :)
silverspike1 WHOA WAIT... You worked on Curse of Fenric?!
THAT ONE'S A FAN FAVORITE!!!
I've watched all of these and, I must say... GREAT JOB!
Do you remember Sophie Aldred's little 'incident' during the filming for Battlefield? Poor Sylvester McCoy had to go into 'hero mode' when it happened! 😯
Yes I remember it. I was in the studio that day and was only 3 feet away from the tank when it blew. We all saw the cracks starting in the glass and stood there frozen to the spot, and when it finally broke we all ran like idiots! I remember running and jumping getting to one of the studio gantry's before the lights went out and the emergency lighting came on.
Dear old Sylvester really had his wits about him that day. :D
My main memories associated with this story involve the fact that the VHS was due out during my final year GCSE school exams, and i spent the entirety of my English Lit exam thinking about how i was going to go into town afterwards and buy it. So it distracted me a bit. I got a B though, so it was OK in the end.
It turned out not to be worth the anticipation, though, obviously.
I'm not too savvy on Dr. Who stuff, but it's always nice to hear an explanation I can follow.
CONGRATS ON 20K!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
For Mel as a character look at terror of the verviods or delta and the bannaman
You want good Mel? Look to Big Finish... They did her right... I really do love Big Finish Mel... She's very charming and OMG! Useful...
Do I have to? I mean... Terror of the vervoids is... Fine. Delta is... Not good.
@@alexinabox6931 i like both tbh
@@zakjaggs9761 I do get enjoyment from Vervoids, the monsters have a good concept, but the Trial of a Timelord stuff let it down a lot.
I know you're against The Rani coming back, but don't you think in the right hands (writer and performer) there could be a really interesting version of her in nu who? Either a bit Bones-y or even Glados-y?
In the right hands any character can be made to work, but I would much rather see them start from scratch with the same template "scientist with no scruples," rather than try to resuscitate this failed version of that idea.
I don't know...
I rather think it might be interesting to have The Rani actually DONE right for once... This could be NuWho's chance to really one-up Classic by taking a character done poorly before and finally do her justice... 😀
Mel is one of the worst companions but in defence of bonnie langford having met her she is one of the loveliest people you could meet. And is now showing what a good actress she is in eastenders. As for time & the rani 4 out of 10
Time and THE RANI
Hello, and congrats on another great Dr. Who vid. even though this is my least favorite 7th Doctor story, I have to disagree with you on The Rani, I absolutely LOVE this character, and I must admit even more so than The Master. The Rani was (at the time) a modern take on the "mad scientist". I like the fact that she is a character of little morals in the pursuit of scientific discovery. This is the kind of character that had not been done with a female character. Unfortunately, she was swept under the mix and was not utilized to her full potential.
As far as her dressing up like Mel, yes it was ridiculous (which she says as such), but for the time, it wasn't that bad and it makes sense. Cause how memory works in the brain is with visual and vocal ques. I
But any who's, I think you would like this character better if there was more of her. I think her character was very well executed. She is a mad scientist, who suffers from a huge case of narcissism. I would love to see her in new Who. Cause I think Missy came across very well, but I never really bought her as the Master, I saw Missy more conveying of the Rani. We definitely need a good female villain, not just in Who, but in other mediums as well. Not to go all SJW on ya, but women can be just as diabolical as men, and how awesome would it be to have the 13th doctor go up against such a character.
As always, excellent video!!
7 is my second favorite Doctor after 2... only a "sliver" behind him in fact...
If 2 gets the 10/10 ... then 7 is a 9,99999/10...
But I really cant defend this one... Kate O. is a fun actress and all... and I dont dislike the Rani in her first episode (where she was her own character and annoyed at both the Doctor and the Master)... but here she just turns into the first female Master loosing almost all her original attributes.
Anyway.... pretty terrible start for an amazing Doctor. :(
Some slivers of "good" here and there... but ... yeah...
And then top it off with Mels screaming ... what a (terrible) ride. *sigh*
Daelyas 7 was to silly in this but in his run he was incredible
What's ur favourite 7th story
Uff... pretty much every episode after Ace joins. For me its always the Doctor/companion double act that needs to really fit.
Thats what makes the episodes amazing.
And there are many good combos out there... going from "best -> downwards" its:
2 - Jamie
7 - Ace
10 - Donna
3 - Joe
4 - Leela
And then it gets tricky to rank (I hate ranking anyway ... I am a fan... and I love all of it... even the "bad" parts :D though there are 2 episodes in the shows history that I really cant stand... Invasion of time and Hell Bent)
The OG crew around the first Doctor also worked very well... arg! as I said... its hard to rank after my top picks...
And to your question: If I HAD to put my finger on my favorite 7th Doctor story... uff... Ghostlight for its absurdity and sheer insanity and creativity... Remembrance of the Daleks for the most bad ass Doctor moments (talking a Dalek into suicide... wtf!!!... seriously... the 7th Doctor would have won the Time War in a few hours :D ) ... Curse of Fenric for the atmosphere... oh god... nope... cant choose :D Sorry!
I haven't seen this story, but I have seen 'Mark of the Rani' and I really like it. I agree that the Rani is a great concept for a character and I think she's executed well in that earlier story.
Have you listened to 'The Rani Elite' from Big Finish? Siobhan Redmond's version of the Rani is excellent and it really does justice to the character.
Big Finish actually has a new regeneration for the Rani. I'm sure you know about Big Finish's retcon for Six.
Out of the 100 Classic stories I've seen so far, this is definitely the worst. Doesn't mean it's absolutely awful, as there are some good elements to it, as you pointed out (McCoy in particular). The only other Classic stories that I've seen and thought were pretty bad are Time-Flight and Silver Nemesis, which I think are slightly better than Time and the Rani.
I only know the seventh doctor through his audio adventures, and even with those he’s my favourite classic doctor. His voice is really good for being mad or insane and the audio stories have monsters steal his voice all the time to really chilling effect.
Also, Mel isn’t a screamer in the audio. She has a backbone to her and she likes to sass people, though she’s still very much outshined by Ace
Made my day thank you so much love ur stuff
You make some good points. I still love the Rani. Her first episode (Mark of the Rani) really captured my imagination. I was so disappointed in this episode, which seemed to sink her chances for a return. The Master has had some ridiculous episodes and he got to come back (too many times in my opinion). I appreciate your comments on how interesting she is on paper. For me, that is a reason to bring a character back, another chance to shine.
just making a quick correction about colin baker. he wasn't just invited for the opening scene, he was invited for an entire last story and a regeneration at the end. he tried to have a final entire series but Michael grade wouldn't budge and so colin baker eventually decided to just not appear period
Great review! I think this is your last regeneration episode, so are you thinking of ranking them?
I think the special effects (as in the explosions and computer effects - not the aliens) around this time started getting done by people who went on to work on Red Dwarf a few years later.
Considering what they went on to produce on a tight budget on a BBC 2 show no surprise some of the elements they worked on stood out to you.
Mark of the Rani is much better than Time and the Rani. She has much stronger characterisation in her first story, and it's especially noticeable because she's going up against The Doctor and The Master. There's a reason Mel is nicknamed 'Scream Queen' in certain circles. It's ear-splitting and horribly jarring. And she spends a lot of time doing it in this story. I don't know why things wen't so far the other way. From Jo Grant (or arguably even Zoe) onward, the female companions didn't scream that much. Then we get to Peri and things start to go backwards in that respect. It's like they acknowledged women's lib whilst it was at it's height, and then disavowed it later on. Things don't really pick up for Sylvester McCoy's Doctor until Ace comes on the scene in Dragonfire. I do really like the story, mostly because of the way The Doctor acts in it - I really love the way he mashes up the sayings. "time and tide melts the snowman" and "two wrongs don't make a right turn" are ones that come to mind. And you can just pick up a tiny trace of his adorable Scottish accent, which makes it all even better! No wonder he was voted Best Doctor in 1990.
Yeah I don't really like this one my favourite 7th doctor story is probably remembrance of the daleks
Ace with a electric baseball bat? What's not to love?
Hoehner Tim I agree when everyone thinks the ace they think off this story
Her entire run was just pure gold. I would have loved to see an on screen Ace, Jamie, Leela team up... just wrecking shit across time and space :D
It happens in novel form at least. Thats something :)
Stab, punch... and rocket launcher :D
I actually liked both, but Remembrance was way better.
I love this story for its retro camp appeal. Oh and Kate O' Mara, and my favourite Doctor!
During the Twitch streaming, the Gunfighters had caused the viewing of the stream it was a part of to drop. Would not be surprised if Mel stories and the 6th Doctor stories are the lowest viewed streams.
And according to the schedule (it already lied) Warrior of the deep and the caves of Androzani will be streamed on the same day
I believe I am in the minority group of people who actually sincerely enjoys the Gunfighters :D
Sure... bolstered be mass amount of alcohol... but hey! :D The american accents are "gold" and the song wont ever let you go... no matter how you might try to forget it ;)
I liked the Rani. Which may be due to her only showing up...twice in the old Doctor Who series? In other words, like the Monk, who also only showed up twice, she didn't overstay her welcome.
You watch give Joe? You watch he man? You watch Ninja turtles? That is so cool!
It was pretty cool they used strange matter in a story back then.
Probably a good thing you saw this first as The Mark of the Rani is much better, as she calls the Master an idiot. The nails are good as well the color works for you.
Can you please, please review Big Finish's "Deadline" by Robert Shearman? Iknow I'm not a patreon, but if any of them are listening, I would be really be happy if my favorite youtuber talked about my favorite Big Finish.
We'll see what happens down the line.
Big Finish have revisited the Rani a few years I can't comment on whether they utilise the character better because I haven't listened to them yet.
What I really want is for the Rani to come back, leading an experiment that's designed to cure some horrible future disease, but she's killing people by infecting them in her attempts to cure it.
Basically play the Mummy on the Orient Express moral conundrum, but instead of the Doctor using the deaths that are already happening to get info that could prevent future deaths, the Rani is killing people to find a way to prevent more deaths. That slight shift that makes in unethical.
I think there's a strong moral conflict there, and her end goals being good, but her means being evil, makes her distinct from the Master in a way she didn't get to be before.
Dalekchris Productions That...
That's... I actually think that is an AWESOME idea!
I-I would LOVE to perhaps see that as a fan-fic at LEAST, if not an actual EPISODE! :D
Mel doesn't get any better and between her and Peri I don't know which one is worse.
Peri has the better "costume" ... yeah yeah... I shouldn't "perv"... but still... woof!
Apart from "that" though... at least she had some half way good episodes going for her.
They both do better in Big Finish though. I love Peri in BF
You see the actress who played Peri in the "Black Adder Christmas Special"? She was in rare form with her glass-shattering laugh and 'thick-headedness'. She was great.
Lies... Mel is much better in Big Finish... She's useful and actually uses her intelligence and programing skills... And she's quiet charming and doesn't just sit around screaming...
Peri's great - and I don't mean because of her looks. Nicola Bryant is a fine actress, and has her fair share of splendid performances - her contribution to "Caves of Androzani" in particular was superbly played, but there were other stories in which she shone, too. Some of the weaker scripts might have turned her into a screaming "damsel in distress", but overall I think that Peri was a much better companion than her reputation sometimes suggests.
Screaming was all Mel ever did. The story goes that she was hired because the producer liked the way she screamed. As far as the Rani is concerned, the character was created during a time in the show when the folks behind the scenes might have some decent concepts, but weren't good at pulling them off. Keep in mind she was at least the sixth significant or recurring time lord that the doctor had come across in the show's history.
Did you notice that spider while talking about the Rani's character? 7:09
If was her last unless you count Dimensions and Time, the Children In Need/ 30th anniversary special.
You know the actress who played Mel got her job based entirely off her scream. I remember her saying that was pretty much her audition.
One of the first episodes I bought on VHS. It wasn't well written and the whole plot was kind of shady but Kate O'Mara was great and I DO like the character.
If the Rani were to return, (Joanna Lumley would be good in the part) why not have her as a reformed character who actually calls on the Doctor for help when an experiment goes horribly wrong (sabotaged) and is being framed by the real enemy, but the Doctor doesn't quite trust her fully
Yeah 7's second and third season are much better than his first, but I do have a soft spot for this one as it was the first story I saw of his Doctor. Excellent review.
The Rani - in her original story, as written, the character is a dramatic dead end; she kills the story. Her detachment means that nothing would happen - that's why Mark of the Rani needed the Master as he's the only reason anything happens. She needed this story shift even though it doesn't really work.
I have the Mel action figure in it's original box from this ep
Does it have a scream function? ;)
Ah... Im being harsh on Mel... aside from melting earwax its not like she wasnt a good person or anything.
your nail polish is super cute. o3o
I personally put Time and the Rani into the so bad it's funny category I really enjoy watching it.
The bat people are not native to that planet, the Rani brought them and they were working for her becaue she said she would help them with their need for blood on their home planet. That's why it ends the way it does.
Some people say a few of Colin Bakers stories are the worst in doctor who history but I do believe Time and the Rani is with a few of Peter Capaldi's from his first series coming a close 2nd....
Bonnie "Mel" Langford was a tap dancing, triple threat, entitled, stage school child actor most (in)famous for her lisping, nauseating catch-phrase:
"I'll thcweam and thcweam and thcweam until I make my thelf THICK! And I CAN!"
In Doctor Who, she screamed and screamed and screamed until WE were sick. In a can. Of Bakers Condensed Soup. She worked hard at it and boy did she succeed: in terms of annoying companions, like Adric, she was the real McCoy.
Bless her. Now I feel bad.
In terms of finding YOUR classic Doctor: have you? And Who might that be? The key, I think is to focus on the one (or two) that work for you. Or to say, screw it! I'm New Who all the way...
It's not compulsory to love all (or any) of the old-school stuff.
For me, there's enough Hartnell, Troughton, Pertwee and Sir Thomas of Bakerville to last me until the end of Time. Sure, I've got my C. Baker, Davison, and McCoy up there, on the shelf. And there they'll stay. I tried. I really did. But sometimes...
...It's not what you know.
It's the Who you know
hgwells allthewayfrom1899 What did you think of Ace?
Zak Rosenfeld The character of Ace was constructed as some kind of uber-feminist, "right on", pc, badge wearing rebellious teen. And why not? It fit the politically aware, youth-aesthetic of the age. Trouble is, her post-punk, placard carrying, one-girl-riot routine came across as so fake, so contrived, that she alienated more fans than she made.
For all her faux "streetwise" slang and no-bullshit inner strength, she came across as a posh kid acting common, and weak to boot. She was a fail: McCoy was a fail; the show was dieing a lingering death following a third miscast regeneration and it was time to put the senile old dog to sleep and bury it in a time capsule in the Blue Peter garden.
Ace was a casualty of a desperate attempt to reinvigorate the franchise by introducing an element of "cool". She wasn't.
If she's a favourite of yours, then I apologise. Each to there own. I'm not out to troll you if you disagree. I mean, I recently grew to enjoy Leela, a character I'd always dismissed. Now I'm busy catching up on her adventures with the 4th. Who knows, maybe one day I'll find myself warming to Ace in the same way. So now...I'm almost afraid to ask...what's your take on Ace?
She’s currently killing it in eastenders she needs an award
I remember hearing her saying her entire audition for the role was her screaming. They had her scream a bunch of times then said "you're hired".
I liked them both actually. Ace was a nice departure from form, at the time, and I just loved Sylvester McCoy and his performance.
The humanoids are the Lakertians.....
The bat things are called Tetraps.....
The horror of the Rani is that the Time Lords' philosophy revolves around observation and non interference..... so for them? They tolerate the Doctor because he helps ppl and battles the enemies of Gallifrey. The Doctor has also saved Gallifrey several times, so he's tolerated.
The Rani's total interference and collateral damage? Breaches ALL the Time Lord's philosophies..... She isn't exactly EVIL? Just so pragmatically RUTHLESS in the application of her experiments? That it borders on evil, but she literally doesn't care about good or evil. Just Success.
Have you checked out the Twitch Marathon of the classic series at all?
I don’t have time. Streaming on my time is pretty much a requirement for me.
That's understandable. It's been a wonderful experience, seeing so many newer (and older) fans interact in such a positive way. LONDON 1965.
I'd have to disagree that the Rani was just female version of the Master. She was trying attain godlike powers to be sure but only so she could run scientific experiments on the universe, the Master would want to rule over planets and people. The Rani on the other hand wanted to bring the dinosaurs back as that's what she was interested in, not ruling over 'inferior species' like humans.
Actually no. Ruling the universe wasn't the goal. Her stated goal was to create a giant time manipulator so she could re-write time itself to her whim. One example was to prevent the death of the dinosaurs so they would continue their evolutionary path and thus humans would never exist.
It feels like you weren't paying attention a lot of the time.
21:34 I REFUSE TO BE CHEATED
You're not wrong about Mel. Bonnie Langford was cast mainly for her ability to scream. She probably ranks right behind Adric as the worst companion ever. Thankfully, she got redeemed by Big Finish. Check out The Fires Of Vulcan.
And yes, she looked ridiculous. The 80s hit Doctor Who hard.
The Rani works much better in her introductory story 'The Mark of the Rani', i think. She's a lot more like her cold and calculating amoral scientist description in that one. Alas, this story came after Kate O' Mara had been in... was it 'Dynasty' or 'The Colbys'? One of those... and i think JNT wanted that sort of bitchy camp soap queen thing accentuated more.
Ugh...this episode. I think your Patrons want you to suffer if they picked this one.
Curious, have you watched "Quick Guide to Classic Who?" video series on RUclips? The creator covers the entire run of all 26 seasons of Classic Who in an overview format. Each video is about 10-15 minutes long, with "best/worst/must see" recommendations. It's a good reference to cherry pick episodes to check out.
Good job on this video...really enjoyed it & agree with you about The Rani. They just wrote her character badly.
What a lad
Siobhan Redmond is amazing as the Rani though... Takes it back to what she's supposed to be...
I got so worried that missy would be rani im glad she wasn't
I love the new Thumbnails! Keep up the good work. Sylvester McCoy is my second favorite Doctor from classic Who. I know, I can't believe it myself. As a long time subscriber, I feel ok in saying this..you need a new backround lol. Gizmo and Cards against humanity are the first things I think of when your posts pop up in my feed lol.
It's more likely that things will be added to the background than anything get swapped out. And yeah, somebody else is doing the thumbnails now so they're much better.
I wanted to like The Rani. I liked the idea of her and I liked Kate O'Mara. But I thought she came across as just a female retread of The Master.
I think you'd have to experience a British pantomime to understand properly what JNT was doing with this show at this time. It's very much aimed at a younger audience not to forget that JNT was trying anything to keep the show alive as Michael Grade was looking for any excuse to pull the plug on Doctor Who he really didn't like the show.
Carwyn Morris Michael Grade was the absolute WORST excuse for a human that could've EVER been installed as BBC Controller...
Did you hear the interview he did for a Doctor Who retrospective that was done I think during the '90s? Mind you... He'd ALREADY killed the show off (as we thought back then) and his contempt for Doctor Who STILL showed EVEN THEN!
That man was just a flat-out narcissist HANDS-DOWN!
The Rani in this story alone comes across as the Doctor Who version of V's Diana, more than a morality-free Scientist. It wasn't really a good note for the character to leave the TV series on.
I think the main problem (not to mention the awful script written by Pip and Jane Baker) is the main threat to the Doctor, which is the Rani. She is a very interesting character that should be written down with the same mindset as Krona, a DC Comics character from the 60's whose only interested on the results of his experiments and actions, but also the meaning behind it all. Indeed, it's not an ugly episode/story/arc to watch and the bubble effects from the traps are pretty good and McCoy is good as well (not great, just good) and looks well with previous Doctor outfits (what are the odds? McCoy is very photogenic), but there's lack of focus, too many things going on at the same time and poorly written dialogues. It could have been a great debut story for a Doctor, but end up being one of the most mediocre ones. Probably a 4/10
i had totally forgotten about Bonnie Langford, i hated her when i was a kid.
This one gets a like *just* for that opening line!
They’re not spoilers if it’s decades old.... just say what you like xxx
Kate Omara looks fantastic....but there just too many Time Lords.
They are always better when off screen. As soon as they do show up they are mostly morons of epic proportions.
Best Time lords in the series to this day (obviously discounting the Doctor and the Master... and Romana I suppose) are from "The War Games". No contest ;)
Not as many as there were Kryptonians and the Time Lords planet was even destroyed at that point. :)
The issue is that since The Doctor is the driving force of the show, he has to stand out. However, placing him with a planet full of people who theoretically have as much (possibly more) knowledge and experience as he does and you run into a problem. They had to make them corrupt and bureaucratic, so The Doctor can excel among them. The most interesting thing is that they seem to recognize this and that's why they either want to execute The Doctor or put him in charge. There's no middle ground for them.
Thats not untrue but they are just plain "dumb" from the tom baker era onward.
The Doctor passed his Timelord exam on the second attempt with 51% (according to Romana)... so by Time Lord standards he is no "genius". His strength is his out of the box thinking, compassion, bravery and creativity... all aspects that the Time Lords usually lack.
They can be bureaucratic, strict, close minded, even naive to the reality of life outside of their system etc...
They can NOT be idiots that get tricked by Sontarons for instance.
Classic who made them dumber and dumber with each recurrence. And New Who has not done them any favors either. Hell Bent was... atrocious in how it handled Rassilon for instance.
In the War Games they stopped time from across the universe, isolated the War Lords in a time loop and then erased their leader from existence all together with a thought, hijacked the TARDIS back to Gallifrey before zapping Zoey and Jamie back to their times and "executing" the Doctor. All the while showing no emotion either way... just passive superiority. Essentially they were "technological Gods"...
and now... well... they suck :(
To me the Doctor's edge against other Timelords is his experience out in the universe and that he has built allies and understands how the universe really works as opposed to having just read about how it's supposed to work.
Notice in the Romona episodes (especially the early ones) where her knowledge was very much academic while he was very much experience and often she would find out he knew better.
To translate it into human terms it's like taking a streetwise guy and a bookworm and dropping them in the middle of a major city. See which one is able to survive and thrive an which one can't.
Also, it's amusing the Timelords thought that banishing the Doctor to Earth with a new face would somehow punish him when he managed to reconnect with UNIT and his friend the Brigadier in short order and was only inconvenienced by his TARDIS not working correctly.
They just didn't understand that he had friends and contacts who would take him in and help him out.
This was the first Doctor Who story to He heavily use CGI
BE VERY HAPPY MISSY WAS NOT THE RANI MOFFAT ISN'T THAT SILLY
Time and the rani is a personal story I like Its my guilty pleasure
I have a soft spot for this story. Is it technically good? Perhaps not. Is it fun if you watch it as a panto? Absolutely
Regeneration stories are all important and although this is better than The Twin Dilemma, it's not much better. If it had been a superb new start to the show, things might have been different, but Mels out of all control squawking wouldn't have won any new viewers. I don't think Sylvester shines at all, there's glimmers of twinkling promise but no sparkling sheen. I actually like the Rani, a fabulous villain not terribly well written, but O Mara I thinks quite powerfully camp in the role. I don't like this or rest of the season, mainly because of Mel, but it also seems JNT totally overdoses on the over the top pantomime-ness of it all. Great review though, I like theses dips into the classics. Gx
Rather than gender swapping the Master, they should have just brought back the Rani when they wanted an Evil female time lord to be played by Michelle Gomez ("Missy")
All but three doctor who actors started out in theatre. A few guesses. Collin was one. Eckleson another. And oddly Troutan the last. Of Fourteen Whoos fifteen including the new lass the test were Stage Actors. Thats what makes me laugh when new whovians take pot shots on who the new who will be and non of them have been on stage.
Mel was the only companion in the classic show that I did not like. I liked her in this story, but in the other stories, I absolutely can't stand her. And I know I'm going to be the oddball in the fan base, but I really liked this story. It's the only one in Sylvester McCoy's first season I thought really highly of. Dragonfire I thought was okay, but the other stories in this season, I hated. Plus Mel's in all of them... that doesn't help either.
Mel is my least favourite Classic companion. Katarina came close, Grace from the TV movie came closer, Adric came closest, but it is Mel. She is a health freak who screams a lot, and nothing else. She has no personality, no likeable characteristics and falls into the trap of being yet another companion swept off their feet by a man.
Maybe the Master and the Rani are the same person.