I'm not a motor mechanic. I'm a locksmith, but what you are saying really rings true with me. 999 times out of 1000, when I get a call from a customer and they say "I need new handles for my door, because they don't open the latch anymore", it's not the handle that is at fault, but the mechanism that those handles interface with inside the door. When they say "I think I need a new lock strip, because I can't get my latch to retract when I push the handle down" its actually the handles that have messed up. I used to try and prepare myself with replacement parts on hand, based on customer assessments, but now I just roll out, look it over for myself while all but ignoring customer concerns, its almost never the case that the customer has correctly identified the trouble source. Hell, I go out to jobs sometimes where the customer thinks their door is broken, and it turns out the hinges are just incorrectly adjusted. I've learned to filter their comments for noise, to better hear the signal, put it that way.
I agree with you, 100%. I'm not an auto mechanic but I've worked in factory maintenance... Everyone would do what you talked about... my boss, every other department supervisor... they'd say this wasn't working and "I THINK THIS IS WHY". Well, they were wrong almost every time. But the bigger problem is that they were supervisors, so they were all "my boss". I usually wasn't allowed to check things in a logical order, I had to check their suspect device first because they hovered over me. When I told them that their suspect item was not the problem, they'd get very angry. One dept. supervisor would yell at me to get away and then would call my boss to get someone else. Well, my boss would send me back.. And I'd troubleshoot logically and find the real problem. This went on for five years before I bailed out.
I feel your pain. I work at a landscaping company as their fleet mechanic the mechanic they had before me has given himself a promotion to shop secretary and does nothing except sit at the desk we have in the shop smoking cigarettes all day long. anything something breaks all the does is scream saying we don't have time to diagnose things just replace something a send it back out. I always tort back to him we don't have time to figure it out but we have time to replace thousands of dollars worth of parts that don't need to be replaced? so annoying
Worked in a soybean plant and we had an oil pump that would stop moving oil. The boss man ( A chemical engineer fresh out of college) said the problem was the pump shaft seal. We changed that out 3 times, the seals were 1500 dollars each. The mechanics said it was polarizing oil. Oil turns into a rubbery material that clogs up the pipe. Much discussion ensued about that with the boss saying it must be the seal because I'm a chemical engineer and I'm smarter than all the mechanics who had cleaned this stuff out before. They finally went ahead and pulled out a couple of pieces of pipe and cleaned out the oil goo. Problem solved. Cost of a couple of 10 dollar gaskets. Not the first nor the last thing this idiot pulled. Do I sound a little bitter?
Centric/Power Stop have break in instructions on the pads box to properly bed and not leave an imprint on one spot. - 5 aggressive decelerations 40MPH-10MPH, no complete stops - 5 moderate decelerations 35MPH-5MPH, no complete stops - Drive slowly for 5 minutes to cool the brakes, no complete stops Worked fantastic.
My brother sold me a used car that belonged to his step-son. His step-son drives like a maniac, so the new brakes he had just done were ruined. Same thing, they hadn't been broken in properly. He carefully instructed me on how to do the burnishing. I had the car another 3 years and the brakes were perfect.
I pre-diagnosed a bad head gasket on my Cadillac. I even pressurized the cooling system to hear air seeping from the head by the firewall. I took it in to my awesome mechanic, and he knew I was prepared to pay for new head gaskets. He called me a few hours later and said the car was ready. He ignored what I said and did his own diagnosis and found that the seeping air I heard was coming from the coolant reservoir, not the head. I paid $300 rather than $3000 to fix my car. God bless that shop!
What symptoms lead to you believing that the head gasket was bad? Signs of a bad head gasket include, but not limited to, overheating, oil in the coolant, coolant in the oil, oil/ coolant leaking between the block and head, and/or coolant in the cylinders. Was the reservoir cracked? For $300, I hope they replaced something.
@@kevinyancey958 I had coolant loss somewhere up against the firewall, but I was unable to see exactly where due to how tightly packed it was. I did a coolant test to see if there were exhaust gasses present, and it was not a clear result either way. I put a pressure tester on the coolant system and I heard air leaking by the firewall, and to my ears it sounded like it was coming from where the head gasket would be. I was wrong on that, and I'm so glad my mechanic didn't take my word!
@@bikerguy5829 I used one (with the blue stuff that changes color), but the result wasn't clear either way to me. And, that only works if the break in the head gasket is allowing exhaust into the coolant passages. I suspected that I just had a break between a coolant passage and the outside. I'm really glad my mechanic didn't just take my results, and that he did his own testing / observations.
Totally agree. I run a handyman business and have learned to focus on the symptoms of their problem and discount whatever they tell me about what they think is or isn't causing their problem.
SMA did some Stoptech rotors recently, and guess what, followed the Stoptech instructions for burnishing. Took us along for the ride. So, no Ray isn't the only one. I do it myself after I get new rotors -- neither the dealer nor an otherwise good indie mechanic have a clue. The need to do it has been known for, er, um about six or seven decades or more.
That's about the most in depth and complete brake inspectiom/ troubleshooting/asssembly process video I hace ever seen. Thanks for the $2.00 tour on this subject. We should have all learned a lots from your instructions.
20 years of trucking, taught me muscle memory. My car, with 89k miles, still had 40% on the brake pads, when I did a pad slap on my car. How you brake, really does determine the overall condition of your braking system over time. Not only pads and rotors, but everything else.
With you on the ease off and save money! Was getting some work done before a cross continent road trip and the mech said my fronts weren't bad, but to be on safe side due to distance I was travelling should change the pads. The factory pads were still on vehicle at 189000km in a 2003 Elantra 5spd manual. From that, the mech guessed (correctly) I was a truckie! Drive smoothly, sensibly, use your gearbox/engine combined and you days will be safer and cheaper.
I fully agree with You on the statements about coming to the shop, service writer, and mechanic. I fix Air conditioning for a living and after the customer tells me.what the unit isn't doing, I tune the rest out. Just tell me the symptoms and I'll take it from there
Im no mechanic but I remember watching one of your videos for my first time and you were tearing apart a dash and I was so impressed on how in the world you could keep track of all those nuts bolts lets just say all those parts and be able to put it all back together again ! How could you possibly remember where everything goes. 😂 I was so impressed and entertained that's why I started watching your videos 😂
I totally agree with you. Funny how I just had the same scenario happen to my coworker at work earlier today. Office worker states monitor not displaying anything, replace monitor. My colleague went to attend the request. As I had some free time, I decided to tag along to provide assistance. Only to find out the laptop was simply not properly configured to use the monitor display. My poor coworker had just wasted time and effort lugging a new monitor to the worker's desk.
Ray I did see you check the pins. If one brake pin is sticking it will vibrate like you have warped rotors. The rubber on the brake pin must be good or the grease will dry out. Nice video Ray. Ooo I like your puppy’s
Good diagnosis & great advice. Such a shame most shops don't have the time or inclination to bed in the brakes for a customer like you did. Of course the bedding-in continues for a few hundred miles with the customer, with advice.
Thanks again for your thoughtful evaluation. I have worked on cars most of my adult life. Lots of brakes over the years. One of the things that has never made sense is that most of the stories of bedding pads was at good speed firmly depress the brakes several times and do not stop. Did that with Audi and rotor surfaces wear has been very groovy. Your approach is much more logical in that gentle depression allows the surfaces to conform and not overheat. Thanks again for your logical thinking, and entertainment 🙂
Morning Ray, Best to you and your family. Based on your experience and expertise, who do you think is responsible for the burnishing process? Is that something a technician should do as part of the repair? Is it more of an owner task? Do you think it can be one or the other depending on the specific job? Does all-data or your quote tools include book time for burnishing? Would love for you to answer in one of your future videos. This might be a broad question many viewers have and a video response may help more people than just the one who read your YT comments. PS: Absolutely glad to be here with you.
New sub! Thx Ray! I have a 2012 odyssey with 236k miles… Honda rotors suck! Dealer replaced fronts at 40 & 75k - I replaced with drilled/slotted power stops (lol almost a racing rotor 😂 on my minivan) and have gone 120k on them. I now have a tiny wobble when braking! Thx for THOROUGH reminder on burnish!
As a truck driver I learned to give mechanics symptoms only. If I told them what I thought it might be, they usually just check that and don’t dig in further to diagnose the actual problem. Too many people just replace blown fuses, for example, without finding the reason the fuse blew
Customer, “I need an alignment.” Service advisor writes on ticket, alignment. Tech sets wheel alignment. The next day, customer states,”my wheels are still shaking at 60 mph.” I pleaded with the service advisor to question customer concerns when asking for specific work. I finally started calling customers, i.e. doing the SA’s job.
Thanks for bringing attention to this Ray. Been doing my own brakes for years in the driveway. I'm a pro when it comes to rotors and pads, but have never had a bad caliper before. The rotor pistons were working well when the pad was worn, but when I pressed the pistons back for NEW pads one got stuck. When I went to do my BURNISH, the piston Pushed but didn't retract and the rotor and pad got so hot they smoked on the way back home. I tried my damnedest to not completely stop but was forced to for just a few seconds. When I took it apart you could clearly see where the pad and rotor touched and held while hot. Rotor vibrated for months after that but eventually did go away.
I admit, I self diagnose. Sometimes, depending on if I feel confident enough to do the repair myself, I will. But, when I take it to my prefered shop, I always ask them to double check my work. That way, if I only fixed a symptom, they can fix the actual issue.
4:00 Ray, you're absolutely spot-on. I work as "the IT person" in my workplace, and it really grinds my gears when people coming tell me "X is broken"[1] or worse, "Is it possible that...?"[2] instead of "I was minding my own business trying to do Y but it failed with Z" (I'll even settle for "Things don't work. Fix"!). Now, in the extremely rare cases where people do the "I was trying to do Y but failed with Z", I do appreciate hearing their diagnosis (if there was any), as for my money it's the most teachable case (honing their diagnosis skills). [1]: There's typically a 50% chance X wasn't even near the blast radius of the problem [2]: Yes, since 0% probability is a mathematical construct not applicable in this reality. (and given most people I do support for either have a Ph.D in STEM or are studying for such a Ph.D yes, I do dole out this answer frequently)
Thanks for the video Ray....just picking up on the driving aspect and reading the road ahead, as a truck driver we are trained to read the road ahead and its a great way to drive with no surprises....
I'm a retired truck driver, I was a truck driver first, a motorcyclist second and a car driver third, being a truck driver and motorcyclist taught me the advantage of forward thinking, being a motorcyclist taught me to ride/drive defensively, being a car drive just annoyed the hell out of me for being shut up in a tiny box lol, moral here is that forward thinking gives advanced warnings of whats going on ahead of you.
I agree with you whole heartedly. Read the road ahead , anticipate possible problems before they happen. My parents were taught this by their driving instructor, who it happens was a police driving instructor. This was back in the 1950s. I have always driven like that. Although when learning to drive l was not taught this. Stay safe on the road mate. Truckers are the knights of the road.
Good morning, Ray. As for rotors, for motorcycles I've several times hand corrected that rotor condition by wet sanding them down on both sides with a rotary sanding disk, with 320 grit black paper, then wd40 to get the water out, brake kleen to get the wd40 out, and new pads. Works like a charm.
You’re 100% correct. Just tell the service writer or tech what you’re experiencing. Let them figure it out. It can also save you money because less scrupulous shops may tell you they fixed your perceived problem and charge you for it instead of fixing the actual problem.
I love that you mentioned that you look at the cars in front of the car(s) in front of you to apply the brakes and maintaining the right speed. 10 steps ahead of what other cars in front of you is the best way to avoid anything that can come in your future. I am guessing the person who owns the vehicle is a hard gas and hard braking person. No need to drive so aggressive!
Yep, agree with you. If I have a mechanical problem I always say what I'm experiencing and when it happens. In this case I would say I'm experiencing a shuddering vibration through the steering wheel under braking. As you say that is then your experience in what you do best to diagnose the fault.
Well, that flip of the screwdriver to return that screw to the rotor was cool! I have been watching for over two years and forget you often use just one hand.
Agree 100. I'm also willing to bed when those new rotors and pads were put on. They were burnished in. I do the 30/30/30 rule. 30 mph to a stop hold 30 seconds. Perform 30 times.
I haven't ridden then year at all, but have you noticed that over the last bunch of years, that drivers are much more aggressive and even threatening to bikers? Like, coming up fast behind them, maybe even honking and/or swerving to try to get a biker to over steer and crash?
Love to watch your process! If you were able to give the original rotors a turn to freshen up the surface, could you then reburnish the pads to the rotors?
It seems that there’s rarely enough meat left on the rotors to turn. I had a similar vibration with less than 10k miles on the rotors and they were not thick enough to turn according to the local orielly auto. Basically they manufacture them just above the minimum and you’ll need new ones when they come off.
@@willbenner3 nah, they are made with plenty to machine off, the mechanics just didn't want to waste their time doing it. Rotors are fairly inexpensive too.
Great explanation of the brake break-in/burnishing process, and why it is done. Even those who know how to do brakes - like me - can always use a refresher. 😊 Well said about "being self aware" - it's so important, just like "pay attention to your surroundings" - so important.
As an engineer, I have found that a lot of problems can be solved at the problem definition stage. Make sure you and the customer agree what the problem to be solved is. During that process the customer is forced to understand what is wrong--posibly for the first time.
Informative well done video, yes rotors come with different coatings as rust prohibitors Cosmoline you clean off surface contact areas, ultra coat style you don't have to as its metal based already. Maybe ray can add that in a future brake repair.
When I drive in hot weather and apply the brake for extensive downhill use, I get a temporary brake shudder that goes away when the car is cold. I think one of the front rotors warps a little with heat. It may be the runout you measured did not show the abnormality because the rotors had cooled down.
Mr Ray the most intelligent drivers always apply the accelerator when approaching a yellow light only to have to slam on the brakes. This intelligence ensures premature brake failure and mechanics in business despite global events. 😂😂😂
I agree... I spent years as the middleman between the auto Engineer and the weld control Engineer. The best expression was: "Bring me the problem, not the solution".
I paused around the 9 min mark to comment. Of course, as I go through the video, this may be mentioned. But we had a similar issue with our 2016 Honda CRV. On braking, there's be some vibrating, but more than that, the rotors got hot. I mean HOT! So I finally decided to do a brake job on it and check bearings and the like. What I discovered, was that the problem was the calipers themselves. The slides were mostly stuck or binding. So I replaced all rotors and pads. I did a maintenance on the calipers by cleaning out mounting brackets and their slots, lock pins, guide pins and as much around the pistons and seals as I could without doing a full breakdown. It was clear that the pins were in bad shape. No rust or anything, but the grease was dirty and the pins were mis-colored. The slots they go into were also nasty. After this full cleaning and re-greasing, the calipers now moved in and out smoothly. After putting this all back together, all braking issues and the over heating thing on the rotors were gone. I do have to say, as a non-mechanic (just your reg. home fixer-upper) the Honda braking system was the easiest to repair. All my other old vehicles, through life, were a lot more tedious. Now... I'll continue to the video to see if THIS turns out to be the same problem.... LOL
I was taught to drive by a Police response driver in the Uk and in that teaching I was taught to look about 9 to 10 car lengths ahead as well because what is happening up ahead will impact your drive. I'm also so glad you didn't abandon the car where you first pulled back into the shop car park it would of driven me crazy lol
Ray Bay, still as always love your mechanical and video talent. There are very few that take the initiative to make sure their viewers can see exactly what you’re seeing and working on. Just uno thing. When you were describing the surface of the front rotors while measuring the runout with your dial indicator you stated the front side and the back side of said left front and right front rotor. Which could be confusing for some, so might I just say, “ Front side is “Outboard”, backside is “inboard”. Makes for easier identification of the particular side of the rotor your working on. As always, keep on wrenching Ray‼️
It is really important to make sure they are cleaned of any oil or grease first, with plenty of brake clean. I bet they got some brake grease on those rotors when they replaced them. I break in the brakes, but I don't do it for that long. I do about 4 trips around the block light pedal pressure at first then a little harder until they smoke a little and I can start to smell them, then I do a final trip around the block with no pedal pressure to let them cool down a little.
The bedding in process is the most important task of any brake job! Your diagnosis Ray is spot on! Pity for your client, now after you fitted the new discs, that will make it 3 new sets of discs he/she has paid for. Note this: you could have got those discs machined for a fraction of the cost of new ones! The only inconvenience with this is that it takes more time to do so. I always machine discs before replacing them as long as the minimum thickness is not breached.
What he could've done was try and clean them by hand, like he did the pads. But why would he do that if he has to go back in once it doesn't work? New disc often costs around $50 or less, and machining is probably $40.
@@notsoeloquent Properly machining the rotors requires a lathe. You can't do it by hand and expect to do anything but destroy the rotors. Also, for larger vehicles machining the rotors can absolutely make financial sense.
You're a good mechanic. When I go to a shop most of the time these days saying "Hey, Code P#### is in from my scanner." They say okay, then perform a 100-point inspection before even looking at what the code is telling them. Always fun when they charge $85 an hour for labor. And no, not all of them remove the inspection fee if they do work.
I have to agree with you. I actually work in the IT service desk industry and will often get people trying to steer me in a certain direction when they have an issue. (It isn't all "turn it off then on again" - if it was then I'd have changed jobs years ago!)
To combat that, I instructed my service advisors to document the customers concerns, and not state their beliefs. I also withheld prior service history as to not influence my technicians investigation. Also, a pre-inspection test drive was mandatory if the vehicle was capable of it, to verify customers complaints and identify possible other issues and concerns, and a post vehicle test drive to validate repairs. I was also very leery of accepting work on vehicles that could not be test driven, because I got burned with the, "it never did that before story."
You just reminded me of a great old song: "You make a left and then a right Go down three blocks, look for a light And if it's on, come on in But if it's off, he's home again"
I like how I got this advice of "don't point a tech toward a problem" exactly 3 days after requesting a quote and specifically pointing out what is wrong 😂
Being a big "tires and brakes" guy meaning no matter how crappy my cars were I always put new brakes and tires on right from the get-go. Watching this video brought another awareness I never thought of, is that those two bolts holding the caliper bracket on is all there is holding the whole shebang to the vehicle. Faith. LOL.
My wife suddenly had the pedal pulsation/ steering shake not too long after I changed the pads and rotors and yes followed the burnishing instructions to a T. I had and idea, I took her SUV out on the highway late and night and redid the burnishing which is now at least a month in the past and guess what? All the vibrations and steering shake etc stopped for the next few years (62,000) miles until it was time for the next set of brakes. It had to be excess pad material in one place and the pads kept grabbing harder at each revolution. I figured what did I have to lose trying before but g another set and redoing the job. Next year will be year 50 of working on my vehicles from minor repairs to building engines among other repairs. You do a great job Ray especially in how you explain it to those who may not know how. I’ve been following since the last shop and some memorable diagnostic work and the actual repairs!
Sometimes we diagnose correctly. Yesterday I told the shop that there was something wrong with the (automatic) clutch on my bus. And today it was in the shop for a clutch change. But they did start by trying to calibrate the gearbox but it only made it worse.
Someone drives this car really fast and runs up on traffic. Thats' how you turn 'em blue. That warps and changes things. Some people have the capacity to damage a steel ball with a rubber mallet.
Hey Ray, you need to put a shut-off valve at every hose reel, on the pipes so you have a quick shut off😊 and you can shut them off at night 50 prevent damage the hose were to burst, when they start getting older, I know they're brand new😊
Thanks Ray. Good to know my brother in law was wrong about breaking them in. He said to get it up to 50 and slam on the brakes 😁 we changed the pads and rotors out on my car about 6 months ago but I haven't had any trouble, so I guess I got lucky.
I appreciate your advice on what to tell a shop when bringing a vehicle in. I'm taking my vehicle in to a stealership tomorrow for a diagnosis, because all the shops in my area act terrified when I say the word "Mitsubishi". I wrote up a 1 page sheet with my name, make, model, VIN, Engine type, Brief history of the vehicle, types of driving, whether it was garaged. Then I wrote problem description, just symptoms, and added a dated step by step of what codes I got. What parts and fixes I attempted, and the symptoms afterwards. Then I told them that if the repair looks like it wouldn't be worth it, they can feel free to take a pic of the sheet and the car, and use it as an example to train techs on what not to do. I did request they not do any repairs until they ask, because if it costs more than $1000, it might just be better to either scrap the car, or get a rebuilt crate motor.
I totally agree abt stating the issue and not self diagnosing. Just tell us what you’re experiencing and not what you think it is. So many times wrong customer states responds to wrong fix of problem due to self diagnosing.
Shops must be different over the pond, for example there was play in the steering from the front right wheel the mechanic stated "needs tie-rod ball joint" even tho that felt tight fine replaced it took it back "sorry still has play needs steering rack" except what he didn't do was check the wheel bearing which i know it to be the bearing since the steering itself has 0 play just the front wheel not to mention the rack feels fine also the whining noise + change in rotational noise depending on the direction the vehicle is turning = wheel bearing. mechanics aren't all like you lad, some do it because they enjoy it and some do it for a quick buck to screw you over as much as possible and majority just can't be arsed to diagnose problems just fire parts cannons, if it looks old = bad in alot of garages.
That's why its important to find good mechanics, and pay them what they are worth and not devalue them, those other guys aren't mechanics/technicians, they are monkey part changers.
You are quite correct. One of the worst examples is the shop trying to upsell when simple things are needed. My most recent experience with that involved free tire rotation. That's an old gimmick and the last time the tire store told me my brakes were severely worn and needed replacing. Less than 10K miles since the last brake job that they did! There is not one damn thing wrong with the brakes. Since I had to change a flat tire a couple of weeks before, I knew they were trying to upsell an unnecessary brake job because I always look for wear whenever I have tires off. Here's the real problem that they failed to mention: The steering rack has a little play in it and I'll be replacing it within the next couple of months. I'm sure they didn't say anything because that play contributes to tire wear. That shop just lost a long-time customer. I'll rotate my own tires from now on. I might try to convince myself that I need to add a new air freshener or something.
Both Advance and Car Quest brake rotors had a major warp problem in all of their brand new rotors. They had to return and scrap 50,000 brand new rotors because of extreme warpage. You put them on and they sounded like an Indian war drum!!
I always say Ray, people need to get themselves and their cars under control. Most people are safe and courteous drivers, it’s the 10% of the knuckleheads you need to look out for.
I was a technician for 35 years and I worked with a guy that would go out and stand on the brakes and he always had come backs on his brake jobs. I told him the same way you do it and he never had a problem again on his brake jobs.
Last year I replaced pads and rotors, front and rear on our Van. I used Wagner pads and rotors all around and followed Wagner's recommendations for burnishing the new pads and rotors - Make approx. 20 complete stops from 30 MPH with light pedal pressure - then, approx. 20 Slow Downs from 50 MPH to 20 MPH with light to moderate pedal pressure - allow 30 seconds between brake applications. It took a few minutes on a couple of side streets. Result perfect braking - straight and true, no wobble. and quite as a mouse. Never use an air impact on disc brakes, always torque them in the star pattern. You'll never have a problem if you take the time to burnish your pads and rotors.
That's right Ray, when a customer directs you a lot of mechanics get, "Tunnel Vision". And the lazier ones will do something like changing parts that weren't even a problem. But you're an honest guy who knows. peace & GB ALL
100% agree with your recommendation when explaining concerns with to auto service center . However I would add that I also sometimes am very explicit in my service request. For example if I’ve just bought a new vehicle, I might say (1) can you do a complete service and check the car over. (2). I want all the fluids changed. Transmission, transfer, radiator coolant. This assumes that if the brakes don’t get touched, the brake fluid is not changed.
I can agree to a point. I've been diagnosing computer issues for a long time. We can take the observations of the customer and apply it to the diagnostic process. Sometimes it's really vague like "The internet isn't working." Turns out it's a specific website they can't access. Maybe some will hyperfocus on the customer complaint, but generally the computer techs I know think outside the customer box and examine the issue from higher level to determine what the actual problem is.
I had a vibration on my 96 K1500 Cheyenne. It turned out to be rust on the axel end, inside of the rotors and the back side of the rim. I cleaned all the surfaces and put it back together and it took care of the issue.
I'm not a motor mechanic. I'm a locksmith, but what you are saying really rings true with me. 999 times out of 1000, when I get a call from a customer and they say "I need new handles for my door, because they don't open the latch anymore", it's not the handle that is at fault, but the mechanism that those handles interface with inside the door. When they say "I think I need a new lock strip, because I can't get my latch to retract when I push the handle down" its actually the handles that have messed up. I used to try and prepare myself with replacement parts on hand, based on customer assessments, but now I just roll out, look it over for myself while all but ignoring customer concerns, its almost never the case that the customer has correctly identified the trouble source. Hell, I go out to jobs sometimes where the customer thinks their door is broken, and it turns out the hinges are just incorrectly adjusted.
I've learned to filter their comments for noise, to better hear the signal, put it that way.
I agree with you, 100%. I'm not an auto mechanic but I've worked in factory maintenance... Everyone would do what you talked about... my boss, every other department supervisor... they'd say this wasn't working and "I THINK THIS IS WHY". Well, they were wrong almost every time. But the bigger problem is that they were supervisors, so they were all "my boss". I usually wasn't allowed to check things in a logical order, I had to check their suspect device first because they hovered over me. When I told them that their suspect item was not the problem, they'd get very angry. One dept. supervisor would yell at me to get away and then would call my boss to get someone else. Well, my boss would send me back.. And I'd troubleshoot logically and find the real problem. This went on for five years before I bailed out.
I was in plant maintenance for 25 years with management it's a common problem
I feel your pain. I work at a landscaping company as their fleet mechanic the mechanic they had before me has given himself a promotion to shop secretary and does nothing except sit at the desk we have in the shop smoking cigarettes all day long. anything something breaks all the does is scream saying we don't have time to diagnose things just replace something a send it back out. I always tort back to him we don't have time to figure it out but we have time to replace thousands of dollars worth of parts that don't need to be replaced? so annoying
Worked in a soybean plant and we had an oil pump that would stop moving oil. The boss man ( A chemical engineer fresh out of college) said the problem was the pump shaft seal. We changed that out 3 times, the seals were 1500 dollars each. The mechanics said it was polarizing oil. Oil turns into a rubbery material that clogs up the pipe. Much discussion ensued about that with the boss saying it must be the seal because I'm a chemical engineer and I'm smarter than all the mechanics who had cleaned this stuff out before. They finally went ahead and pulled out a couple of pieces of pipe and cleaned out the oil goo. Problem solved. Cost of a couple of 10 dollar gaskets. Not the first nor the last thing this idiot pulled. Do I sound a little bitter?
@@kenore4003 Polymerizing? In all fairness, the first time I tried to spell this word (badly), that is what spell check offered.
@russellstyles5381 Yes, thanks. My spelling is going bad.
Centric/Power Stop have break in instructions on the pads box to properly bed and not leave an imprint on one spot.
- 5 aggressive decelerations 40MPH-10MPH, no complete stops
- 5 moderate decelerations 35MPH-5MPH, no complete stops
- Drive slowly for 5 minutes to cool the brakes, no complete stops
Worked fantastic.
My brother sold me a used car that belonged to his step-son. His step-son drives like a maniac, so the new brakes he had just done were ruined. Same thing, they hadn't been broken in properly. He carefully instructed me on how to do the burnishing. I had the car another 3 years and the brakes were perfect.
I pre-diagnosed a bad head gasket on my Cadillac. I even pressurized the cooling system to hear air seeping from the head by the firewall. I took it in to my awesome mechanic, and he knew I was prepared to pay for new head gaskets. He called me a few hours later and said the car was ready. He ignored what I said and did his own diagnosis and found that the seeping air I heard was coming from the coolant reservoir, not the head. I paid $300 rather than $3000 to fix my car. God bless that shop!
You can buy a simple test kit to see if your head gasket is blown.
What symptoms lead to you believing that the head gasket was bad? Signs of a bad head gasket include, but not limited to, overheating, oil in the coolant, coolant in the oil, oil/ coolant leaking between the block and head, and/or coolant in the cylinders. Was the reservoir cracked? For $300, I hope they replaced something.
and this is why honest mechanics are poor , but busy .
@@kevinyancey958 I had coolant loss somewhere up against the firewall, but I was unable to see exactly where due to how tightly packed it was. I did a coolant test to see if there were exhaust gasses present, and it was not a clear result either way. I put a pressure tester on the coolant system and I heard air leaking by the firewall, and to my ears it sounded like it was coming from where the head gasket would be. I was wrong on that, and I'm so glad my mechanic didn't take my word!
@@bikerguy5829 I used one (with the blue stuff that changes color), but the result wasn't clear either way to me. And, that only works if the break in the head gasket is allowing exhaust into the coolant passages. I suspected that I just had a break between a coolant passage and the outside. I'm really glad my mechanic didn't just take my results, and that he did his own testing / observations.
Totally agree. I run a handyman business and have learned to focus on the symptoms of their problem and discount whatever they tell me about what they think is or isn't causing their problem.
Brake burnishing is one of those things no one ever does right. Except you Ray. This is an EXCELLENT instructional vid on how to do it properly.
This is the first I've ever heard the details of this!
Cool. Heh. My dad taught me to do this on our '65 Ford Fairlane when I was 12. He was a good mechanic, rest his soul.
I was taught to do this also. I thought it was common, obviously not.
Most people who aren't in shops look at me like I have 6 heads when I explain burnishing.
SMA did some Stoptech rotors recently, and guess what, followed the Stoptech instructions for burnishing. Took us along for the ride. So, no Ray isn't the only one. I do it myself after I get new rotors -- neither the dealer nor an otherwise good indie mechanic have a clue. The need to do it has been known for, er, um about six or seven decades or more.
That's about the most in depth and complete brake inspectiom/ troubleshooting/asssembly process video I hace ever seen. Thanks for the $2.00 tour on this subject. We should have all learned a lots from your instructions.
20 years of trucking, taught me muscle memory.
My car, with 89k miles, still had 40% on the brake pads, when I did a pad slap on my car.
How you brake, really does determine the overall condition of your braking system over time.
Not only pads and rotors, but everything else.
Highway driving doesn’t wear brakes
@@Mr572u Until you exit the freeway, and drive around town, picking up and delivering...
@@KentuckyRangerwhat do you mean by muscle memory? Not going 90 on the off ramp and standing on the breaks?
With you on the ease off and save money! Was getting some work done before a cross continent road trip and the mech said my fronts weren't bad, but to be on safe side due to distance I was travelling should change the pads. The factory pads were still on vehicle at 189000km in a 2003 Elantra 5spd manual. From that, the mech guessed (correctly) I was a truckie! Drive smoothly, sensibly, use your gearbox/engine combined and you days will be safer and cheaper.
I used to drive a milk truck. You REALLY learn to look down the road and brake smoothly.
I fully agree with You on the statements about coming to the shop, service writer, and mechanic. I fix Air conditioning for a living and after the customer tells me.what the unit isn't doing, I tune the rest out. Just tell me the symptoms and I'll take it from there
Im no mechanic but I remember watching one of your videos for my first time and you were tearing apart a dash and I was so impressed on how in the world you could keep track of all those nuts bolts lets just say all those parts and be able to put it all back together again ! How could you possibly remember where everything goes. 😂 I was so impressed and entertained that's why I started watching your videos 😂
He put Humty Dumpty back together again after all the King's men left.
@psquared5574 😂 😂
I totally agree with you. Funny how I just had the same scenario happen to my coworker at work earlier today.
Office worker states monitor not displaying anything, replace monitor. My colleague went to attend the request. As I had some free time, I decided to tag along to provide assistance. Only to find out the laptop was simply not properly configured to use the monitor display. My poor coworker had just wasted time and effort lugging a new monitor to the worker's desk.
Ray I did see you check the pins. If one brake pin is sticking it will vibrate like you have warped rotors. The rubber on the brake pin must be good or the grease will dry out. Nice video Ray. Ooo I like your puppy’s
Good diagnosis & great advice. Such a shame most shops don't have the time or inclination to bed in the brakes for a customer like you did. Of course the bedding-in continues for a few hundred miles with the customer, with advice.
Love you guys. Well done Ray. The only good vibrations come from Beach Boys.
Thanks again for your thoughtful evaluation. I have worked on cars most of my adult life. Lots of brakes over the years. One of the things that has never made sense is that most of the stories of bedding pads was at good speed firmly depress the brakes several times and do not stop. Did that with Audi and rotor surfaces wear has been very groovy. Your approach is much more logical in that gentle depression allows the surfaces to conform and not overheat. Thanks again for your logical thinking, and entertainment 🙂
Morning Ray, Best to you and your family. Based on your experience and expertise, who do you think is responsible for the burnishing process? Is that something a technician should do as part of the repair? Is it more of an owner task? Do you think it can be one or the other depending on the specific job? Does all-data or your quote tools include book time for burnishing? Would love for you to answer in one of your future videos. This might be a broad question many viewers have and a video response may help more people than just the one who read your YT comments.
PS: Absolutely glad to be here with you.
New sub! Thx Ray! I have a 2012 odyssey with 236k miles… Honda rotors suck! Dealer replaced fronts at 40 & 75k - I replaced with drilled/slotted power stops (lol almost a racing rotor 😂 on my minivan) and have gone 120k on them. I now have a tiny wobble when braking!
Thx for THOROUGH reminder on burnish!
As a truck driver I learned to give mechanics symptoms only. If I told them what I thought it might be, they usually just check that and don’t dig in further to diagnose the actual problem. Too many people just replace blown fuses, for example, without finding the reason the fuse blew
Customer, “I need an alignment.” Service advisor writes on ticket, alignment. Tech sets wheel alignment. The next day, customer states,”my wheels are still shaking at 60 mph.” I pleaded with the service advisor to question customer concerns when asking for specific work. I finally started calling customers, i.e. doing the SA’s job.
Thanks for bringing attention to this Ray. Been doing my own brakes for years in the driveway. I'm a pro when it comes to rotors and pads, but have never had a bad caliper before. The rotor pistons were working well when the pad was worn, but when I pressed the pistons back for NEW pads one got stuck. When I went to do my BURNISH, the piston Pushed but didn't retract and the rotor and pad got so hot they smoked on the way back home. I tried my damnedest to not completely stop but was forced to for just a few seconds. When I took it apart you could clearly see where the pad and rotor touched and held while hot. Rotor vibrated for months after that but eventually did go away.
But you already knew all that Ray. No matter what my whole family loves watching you.
I admit, I self diagnose. Sometimes, depending on if I feel confident enough to do the repair myself, I will. But, when I take it to my prefered shop, I always ask them to double check my work. That way, if I only fixed a symptom, they can fix the actual issue.
Awesome reminder how to properly burnish in brakes. Thank you again Ray.
I picked up new rotors and pads for this problem exactly. I will hopefully get them installed soon. Thanks for the video, it was very informative.
Customers fail to recognize that the service advisor is first and foremost a salesman.
Thank you for that very informative video. I will always drive that way from now on❤❤❤
Always good to watch. This is the best start to my day.
4:00 Ray, you're absolutely spot-on. I work as "the IT person" in my workplace, and it really grinds my gears when people coming tell me "X is broken"[1] or worse, "Is it possible that...?"[2] instead of "I was minding my own business trying to do Y but it failed with Z" (I'll even settle for "Things don't work. Fix"!). Now, in the extremely rare cases where people do the "I was trying to do Y but failed with Z", I do appreciate hearing their diagnosis (if there was any), as for my money it's the most teachable case (honing their diagnosis skills).
[1]: There's typically a 50% chance X wasn't even near the blast radius of the problem
[2]: Yes, since 0% probability is a mathematical construct not applicable in this reality. (and given most people I do support for either have a Ph.D in STEM or are studying for such a Ph.D yes, I do dole out this answer frequently)
I work in IT and I always say to users, "Come with your problems not a solution, I'm here for the solution, hopefuly"
Thanks for the video Ray....just picking up on the driving aspect and reading the road ahead, as a truck driver we are trained to read the road ahead and its a great way to drive with no surprises....
That was the first advice given to me as a learner driver. I still stand by it.
I'm a retired truck driver, I was a truck driver first, a motorcyclist second and a car driver third, being a truck driver and motorcyclist taught me the advantage of forward thinking, being a motorcyclist taught me to ride/drive defensively, being a car drive just annoyed the hell out of me for being shut up in a tiny box lol, moral here is that forward thinking gives advanced warnings of whats going on ahead of you.
I agree with you whole heartedly.
Read the road ahead , anticipate possible problems before they happen.
My parents were taught this by their driving instructor, who it happens was a police driving instructor. This was back in the 1950s. I have always driven like that. Although when learning to drive l was not taught this.
Stay safe on the road mate. Truckers are the knights of the road.
Good morning, Ray.
As for rotors, for motorcycles I've several times hand corrected that rotor condition by wet sanding them down on both sides with a rotary sanding disk, with 320 grit black paper, then wd40 to get the water out, brake kleen to get the wd40 out, and new pads. Works like a charm.
I was going to call you out on those pins that keep the brake pads off the rotor but you caught yourself on it good job Ray !!!
Another great video Ray Man well done on the brake burnishing
I believe the words you're searching for is "Confirmation bias". Well put.
You’re 100% correct. Just tell the service writer or tech what you’re experiencing. Let them figure it out. It can also save you money because less scrupulous shops may tell you they fixed your perceived problem and charge you for it instead of fixing the actual problem.
I love that you mentioned that you look at the cars in front of the car(s) in front of you to apply the brakes and maintaining the right speed. 10 steps ahead of what other cars in front of you is the best way to avoid anything that can come in your future. I am guessing the person who owns the vehicle is a hard gas and hard braking person. No need to drive so aggressive!
All that 'road rage'😁
Yep, agree with you. If I have a mechanical problem I always say what I'm experiencing and when it happens. In this case I would say I'm experiencing a shuddering vibration through the steering wheel under braking. As you say that is then your experience in what you do best to diagnose the fault.
Good morning Ray and A Rod. Words is the word for today.
You are telling the truth. When you go to the doctor, the doc wants symptoms not what you think the diagnosis is.
Well, that flip of the screwdriver to return that screw to the rotor was cool! I have been watching for over two years and forget you often use just one hand.
Agree 100. I'm also willing to bed when those new rotors and pads were put on. They were burnished in. I do the 30/30/30 rule. 30 mph to a stop hold 30 seconds. Perform 30 times.
Can agree with you about drivers for sure. I'm a biker here in central Florida and it's a life and death gamble every time I ride in traffic.
I haven't ridden then year at all, but have you noticed that over the last bunch of years, that drivers are much more aggressive and even threatening to bikers?
Like, coming up fast behind them, maybe even honking and/or swerving to try to get a biker to over steer and crash?
Stay out of traffic. Cars are like rats-they travel in packs
Love to watch your process! If you were able to give the original rotors a turn to freshen up the surface, could you then reburnish the pads to the rotors?
Yes, but Ray Doesn't machine discs as he thinks buying new is cheaper, IMO that is throwing parts at things, not repairing things.
@@johnt.848 Used to be standard to turn discs/drums when I was a kid. Now, there are NO garages around me that do it. Sad.
It seems that there’s rarely enough meat left on the rotors to turn. I had a similar vibration with less than 10k miles on the rotors and they were not thick enough to turn according to the local orielly auto. Basically they manufacture them just above the minimum and you’ll need new ones when they come off.
@@willbenner3 nah, they are made with plenty to machine off, the mechanics just didn't want to waste their time doing it. Rotors are fairly inexpensive too.
Hey Ray, I like it when you diagnose a problem and save the customer some money, yes it was very informative and educational, see later.
Great explanation of the brake break-in/burnishing process, and why it is done. Even those who know how to do brakes - like me - can always use a refresher. 😊
Well said about "being self aware" - it's so important, just like "pay attention to your surroundings" - so important.
As an engineer, I have found that a lot of problems can be solved at the problem definition stage. Make sure you and the customer agree what the problem to be solved is. During that process the customer is forced to understand what is wrong--posibly for the first time.
Informative well done video, yes rotors come with different coatings as rust prohibitors Cosmoline you clean off surface contact areas, ultra coat style you don't have to as its metal based already. Maybe ray can add that in a future brake repair.
(@29:05) - Ah, the “wobbly hose trick” strikes again! So it really does work like in the cartoons - LOL! 🤣
When I drive in hot weather and apply the brake for extensive downhill use, I get a temporary brake shudder that goes away when the car is cold. I think one of the front rotors warps a little with heat. It may be the runout you measured did not show the abnormality because the rotors had cooled down.
Mr Ray the most intelligent drivers always apply the accelerator when approaching a yellow light only to have to slam on the brakes. This intelligence ensures premature brake failure and mechanics in business despite global events. 😂😂😂
Welcome to Flori-Duh.....
@@realcdcruze3558 EV one pedal driving is making much better drivers out of people.
Ray i know how you feel about other drivers, i feel the same. I don't really mind them as long as they're not on the road at the same time as me.🤪
I agree... I spent years as the middleman between the auto Engineer and the weld control Engineer. The best expression was: "Bring me the problem, not the solution".
I paused around the 9 min mark to comment.
Of course, as I go through the video, this may be mentioned.
But we had a similar issue with our 2016 Honda CRV.
On braking, there's be some vibrating, but more than that, the rotors got hot. I mean HOT!
So I finally decided to do a brake job on it and check bearings and the like.
What I discovered, was that the problem was the calipers themselves.
The slides were mostly stuck or binding.
So I replaced all rotors and pads.
I did a maintenance on the calipers by cleaning out mounting brackets and their slots, lock pins, guide pins and as much around the pistons and seals as I could without doing a full breakdown.
It was clear that the pins were in bad shape. No rust or anything, but the grease was dirty and the pins were mis-colored. The slots they go into were also nasty.
After this full cleaning and re-greasing, the calipers now moved in and out smoothly.
After putting this all back together, all braking issues and the over heating thing on the rotors were gone.
I do have to say, as a non-mechanic (just your reg. home fixer-upper) the Honda braking system was the easiest to repair. All my other old vehicles, through life, were a lot more tedious.
Now... I'll continue to the video to see if THIS turns out to be the same problem.... LOL
I was taught to drive by a Police response driver in the Uk and in that teaching I was taught to look about 9 to 10 car lengths ahead as well because what is happening up ahead will impact your drive. I'm also so glad you didn't abandon the car where you first pulled back into the shop car park it would of driven me crazy lol
Brother Ray I totally agree with you what you're saying
Ray Bay, still as always love your mechanical and video talent. There are very few that take the initiative to make sure their viewers can see exactly what you’re seeing and working on. Just uno thing. When you were describing the surface of the front rotors while measuring the runout with your dial indicator you stated the front side and the back side of said left front and right front rotor. Which could be confusing for some, so might I just say, “ Front side is “Outboard”, backside is “inboard”.
Makes for easier identification of the particular side of the rotor your working on.
As always, keep on wrenching Ray‼️
It is really important to make sure they are cleaned of any oil or grease first, with plenty of brake clean. I bet they got some brake grease on those rotors when they replaced them. I break in the brakes, but I don't do it for that long. I do about 4 trips around the block light pedal pressure at first then a little harder until they smoke a little and I can start to smell them, then I do a final trip around the block with no pedal pressure to let them cool down a little.
The bedding in process is the most important task of any brake job! Your diagnosis Ray is spot on! Pity for your client, now after you fitted the new discs, that will make it 3 new sets of discs he/she has paid for. Note this: you could have got those discs machined for a fraction of the cost of new ones! The only inconvenience with this is that it takes more time to do so. I always machine discs before replacing them as long as the minimum thickness is not breached.
What he could've done was try and clean them by hand, like he did the pads. But why would he do that if he has to go back in once it doesn't work? New disc often costs around $50 or less, and machining is probably $40.
@@notsoeloquent Properly machining the rotors requires a lathe. You can't do it by hand and expect to do anything but destroy the rotors. Also, for larger vehicles machining the rotors can absolutely make financial sense.
You're a good mechanic. When I go to a shop most of the time these days saying "Hey, Code P#### is in from my scanner." They say okay, then perform a 100-point inspection before even looking at what the code is telling them. Always fun when they charge $85 an hour for labor. And no, not all of them remove the inspection fee if they do work.
great diagnosis. Stay true.
I have to agree with you. I actually work in the IT service desk industry and will often get people trying to steer me in a certain direction when they have an issue. (It isn't all "turn it off then on again" - if it was then I'd have changed jobs years ago!)
I agree with you. When someone diagnosis the problem it throws me off.
To combat that, I instructed my service advisors to document the customers concerns, and not state their beliefs. I also withheld prior service history as to not influence my technicians investigation. Also, a pre-inspection test drive was mandatory if the vehicle was capable of it, to verify customers complaints and identify possible other issues and concerns, and a post vehicle test drive to validate repairs.
I was also very leery of accepting work on vehicles that could not be test driven, because I got burned with the, "it never did that before story."
I love what you are doing mat
You just reminded me of a great old song:
"You make a left and then a right
Go down three blocks, look for a light
And if it's on, come on in
But if it's off, he's home again"
I call it defensive driving, I taught my son to always be aware of everyone around him while driving. Good information Ray!!
Very good information. I try to do that whenever I have my car serviced or repaired.
I like how I got this advice of "don't point a tech toward a problem" exactly 3 days after requesting a quote and specifically pointing out what is wrong 😂
I agree. Just mention the symptoms so the mechanic isn't sent down a rabbit hole.
Breaking in brakes is smart to do I always do that when I last changed all my front and rear pads it evens out and helps make braking more safer.
Being a big "tires and brakes" guy meaning no matter how crappy my cars were I always put new brakes and tires on right from the get-go. Watching this video brought another awareness I never thought of, is that those two bolts holding the caliper bracket on is all there is holding the whole shebang to the vehicle. Faith. LOL.
My wife suddenly had the pedal pulsation/ steering shake not too long after I changed the pads and rotors and yes followed the burnishing instructions to a T. I had and idea, I took her SUV out on the highway late and night and redid the burnishing which is now at least a month in the past and guess what? All the vibrations and steering shake etc stopped for the next few years (62,000) miles until it was time for the next set of brakes. It had to be excess pad material in one place and the pads kept grabbing harder at each revolution.
I figured what did I have to lose trying before but g another set and redoing the job. Next year will be year 50 of working on my vehicles from minor repairs to building engines among other repairs. You do a great job Ray especially in how you explain it to those who may not know how. I’ve been following since the last shop and some memorable diagnostic work and the actual repairs!
I fairly new to automotive technician I’ve learned a lot from ray.
Yes, your theory makes sense
Wow. Never fail to impress and teach me.
Sometimes we diagnose correctly. Yesterday I told the shop that there was something wrong with the (automatic) clutch on my bus.
And today it was in the shop for a clutch change.
But they did start by trying to calibrate the gearbox but it only made it worse.
The 3.5 V6 Honda engine sounds awesome. Honda Odyssey is a very nice SUV with a gutsy reliable engine.
Kudos to you, Ray, for getting and using a magnetic ashtray. You really are moving on up.
Someone drives this car really fast and runs up on traffic. Thats' how you turn 'em blue. That warps and changes things. Some people have the capacity to damage a steel ball with a rubber mallet.
Keeping it real. Keeping it loud.
Hey Ray, you need to put a shut-off valve at every hose reel, on the pipes so you have a quick shut off😊 and you can shut them off at night 50 prevent damage the hose were to burst, when they start getting older, I know they're brand new😊
Thanks Ray. Good to know my brother in law was wrong about breaking them in. He said to get it up to 50 and slam on the brakes 😁 we changed the pads and rotors out on my car about 6 months ago but I haven't had any trouble, so I guess I got lucky.
So many methods. I too learned the 50 mph, brake hard several times, and never come to a complete stop break in method. Always served me well.
I appreciate your advice on what to tell a shop when bringing a vehicle in. I'm taking my vehicle in to a stealership tomorrow for a diagnosis, because all the shops in my area act terrified when I say the word "Mitsubishi". I wrote up a 1 page sheet with my name, make, model, VIN, Engine type, Brief history of the vehicle, types of driving, whether it was garaged. Then I wrote problem description, just symptoms, and added a dated step by step of what codes I got. What parts and fixes I attempted, and the symptoms afterwards.
Then I told them that if the repair looks like it wouldn't be worth it, they can feel free to take a pic of the sheet and the car, and use it as an example to train techs on what not to do.
I did request they not do any repairs until they ask, because if it costs more than $1000, it might just be better to either scrap the car, or get a rebuilt crate motor.
I totally agree abt stating the issue and not self diagnosing. Just tell us what you’re experiencing and not what you think it is. So many times wrong customer states responds to wrong fix of problem due to self diagnosing.
Shops must be different over the pond, for example there was play in the steering from the front right wheel the mechanic stated "needs tie-rod ball joint" even tho that felt tight fine replaced it took it back "sorry still has play needs steering rack" except what he didn't do was check the wheel bearing which i know it to be the bearing since the steering itself has 0 play just the front wheel not to mention the rack feels fine also the whining noise + change in rotational noise depending on the direction the vehicle is turning = wheel bearing.
mechanics aren't all like you lad, some do it because they enjoy it and some do it for a quick buck to screw you over as much as possible and majority just can't be arsed to diagnose problems just fire parts cannons, if it looks old = bad in alot of garages.
That's why its important to find good mechanics, and pay them what they are worth and not devalue them, those other guys aren't mechanics/technicians, they are monkey part changers.
You are quite correct. One of the worst examples is the shop trying to upsell when simple things are needed. My most recent experience with that involved free tire rotation. That's an old gimmick and the last time the tire store told me my brakes were severely worn and needed replacing. Less than 10K miles since the last brake job that they did! There is not one damn thing wrong with the brakes. Since I had to change a flat tire a couple of weeks before, I knew they were trying to upsell an unnecessary brake job because I always look for wear whenever I have tires off.
Here's the real problem that they failed to mention: The steering rack has a little play in it and I'll be replacing it within the next couple of months. I'm sure they didn't say anything because that play contributes to tire wear.
That shop just lost a long-time customer. I'll rotate my own tires from now on. I might try to convince myself that I need to add a new air freshener or something.
Nice info. Hope your family is doing well too.
Both Advance and Car Quest brake rotors had a major warp problem in all of their brand new rotors. They had to return and scrap 50,000 brand new rotors because of extreme warpage. You put them on and they sounded like an Indian war drum!!
I always say Ray, people need to get themselves and their cars under control. Most people are safe and courteous drivers, it’s the 10% of the knuckleheads you need to look out for.
I was a technician for 35 years and I worked with a guy that would go out and stand on the brakes and he always had come backs on his brake jobs. I told him the same way you do it and he never had a problem again on his brake jobs.
Ray, that advice about driving ahead, that was taught to me in drivers ed back when it was an elective in high school. It's valid.
Great video ray! Thanks
Last year I replaced pads and rotors, front and rear on our Van. I used Wagner pads and rotors all around and followed Wagner's recommendations for burnishing the new pads and rotors - Make approx. 20 complete stops from 30 MPH with light pedal pressure - then, approx. 20 Slow Downs from 50 MPH to 20 MPH with light to moderate pedal pressure - allow 30 seconds between brake applications. It took a few minutes on a couple of side streets. Result perfect braking - straight and true, no wobble. and quite as a mouse. Never use an air impact on disc brakes, always torque them in the star pattern. You'll never have a problem if you take the time to burnish your pads and rotors.
That's right Ray, when a customer directs you a lot of mechanics get, "Tunnel Vision". And the lazier ones will do something
like changing parts that weren't even a problem. But you're an honest guy who knows. peace & GB ALL
100% agree with your recommendation when explaining concerns with to auto service center .
However I would add that I also sometimes am very explicit in my service request.
For example if I’ve just bought a new vehicle, I might say (1) can you do a complete service and check the car over.
(2). I want all the fluids changed. Transmission, transfer, radiator coolant.
This assumes that if the brakes don’t get touched, the brake fluid is not changed.
I can agree to a point. I've been diagnosing computer issues for a long time. We can take the observations of the customer and apply it to the diagnostic process. Sometimes it's really vague like "The internet isn't working." Turns out it's a specific website they can't access. Maybe some will hyperfocus on the customer complaint, but generally the computer techs I know think outside the customer box and examine the issue from higher level to determine what the actual problem is.
Good morning buddy. Job well done.
I had a vibration on my 96 K1500 Cheyenne. It turned out to be rust on the axel end, inside of the rotors and the back side of the rim. I cleaned all the surfaces and put it back together and it took care of the issue.
Definitely agree, my mechanic saids the same thing
Silly Ray.... you've got to say stop before you can say hammertime! 😂