I've used Scrintal for a while, but Affine is open source, free and has canvas with notes. It has shapes, arrows and pen, anything to customize the canvas in any way you want.
This isn’t a criticism of you specifically but the main output of productivity gurus like Ali Abdaal is talking about productivity in abstract. Not a single video about what all this time spent harvesting and organizing information actually accomplished in the real world. Harvesting and organizing is not an end in itself.
Thanks, that's very good feedback 😊 I believe Knowledge Management is a means to an end, but it is true that most of the time we just assume the end rather than demonstrate it. I have a couple of videos already scheduled, but I will work on a few new ones based on your feedback. Thanks a lot!
I love your use of strikethrough to indicate something has been processed. Fills in a big gap for me. I often get stuck on the question of where things should live: in the source note or in the new note. This solves that conundrum!
I have a workflow you might consider the reverse of yours. I creating a large number of small notes that tend to coalesce around a topic as I link them. Then I use the graph view to see those relationships and identify the orphans and outliers. I think the difference is seeing the relationships that grow instead of creating them visually first.
Thanks. I liked the explanation. Most comparison videos focus on the small little features that are different between the two, but not necessarily on the workflow of each app. I was struggling to notice the difference between the two myself until I used them both for an extended period of time. Hopefully, this video will help new users to make a faster decision when choosing between the two.
Thanks for the feedback and I am glad it helped 😊 Only in my workflow alone there are other points of comparison, most in favour of Scrintal but some definitely in favour of Obsidian as well. Your comment inspired me to think about other videos I could be recording. I won't promise but I will definitely keep it in mind. Thanks a lot!
I love Scrintal, but the faintness of the lines is a pain. Plus, I want to document the connections rather than just link them. Heptabase has a nicer graphical view but lacks the ability to have boards within boards, so as a Visual-Spatial thinker Heptabase lacks the added dimensions. However, Scrintal has a major update planned for Autumn 24 so lets so what improvements are coming.
I would love to be able to see a card as a link. That way, the card itself is the documentation of the link 😉 I am not sure if that's what you have in mind.
Really good explanation of the differences! Question about Scrintal: taking book notes as an example, say I want to be able to connect ideas from different books to each other. Will I have to create all of my book notes within the same board, or do the notes live independently from boards, and I can bring them into boards as I choose? Thought about using Obsidian to do the same thing that you do on Scrintal: Use the graph instead of a canvas. The graph shows the relationship between notes and as soon as you create a new note, it's going to appear on the graph and be connected to the first note! You can keep multiple notes open side by side to copy and paste between them. While Scrintal looks great, The reason I'll be sticking with Obsidian for the time being is that it works entirely offline. Even if I ever lose access to Obsidian, I will not lose access to my notes which are stored in plain text. And the conventions that Obsidian uses to link notes to each other and create the graph view are already used by other PKM applications. So even if the Obsidian team stops its development, there are alternatives and there are going to be successors too.
In Scrintal, the notes live independently of the boards, so you can move them in or out of boards as you wish. In fact, a note can exist outside of all boards (you can find it via the Archive, links from other notes, or the search). The general graph tends to have too much information to be useful for this use case. If I open my Scrintal graph in Obsidian I can't really see the "empty space" between connected components. The local graph wouldn't work as I wouldn't know which local graphs to have opened. We only know after seeing all cards created within that "section". Someone mentioned ExcaliBrain, but I haven't tried it so I am not sure if it would work. Maybe worth a try? I only confidently made the move to Scrintal when they added the option to export all my notes as Markdown files, so I always have my own backup. Having said that, I wouldn't try to convince you to go out of Obsidian. Each person has their own needs (and honestly, Obsidian is great!) so if that works well for you, I don't see why you would need to move 😊
@@BiaResearcher I’m always looking at alternatives, it’s not I find Obsidian perfect~ Thanks for the info! If you export your Scrintal notes in MD, and you open the folder as a vault in Obsidian, would the connections work? I.e. does Scrintal use the same way of connecting files (at least in the exports) as Obsidian and co?
Yes, the notes work and the exported links are like the ones in Obsidian. Having said that, the export function in Scrintal is not the best. In the filesystem, each file needs to have a unique name, but in Scrintal two or more cards can have the same title if you want to. So when they export, the name of the file is a code rather than the title of the card, which is not good if you want to know what is inside a note. That's something we have reported so let's see when the team will change that.
Your video illustrates the shortfalls of Obsidian, for now. Perhaps in the future, plugins may be developed that augment the Canvas utility. Scrintal is an interesting tool and I am definitely considering it. I do a great deal of research for novels. I am never sure what I will use or how it relates to other information when I do. Your presentation shows how it can be done. So thank you. Also...I love your accent.
Thanks 🥰 I am usually too self-conscious about my accent and pronounciation, so your comment warms my heart. For developing plots you may want to check the new version of Scrintal they will be releasing the next days: ruclips.net/video/Q2WhJtCn5eY/видео.htmlsi=II3geKFVt5s8PbPz
While Obsidian has everything I want in a notetaking app, it doesn't do whiteboarding particularly well in my experience. It's very clunky to use with adding new files and editing existing cards. Apps like Scrintal are very good for people who prefer visual notetaking.
@@BiaResearcher It seems that most people who use obsidian prefer note-based link navigation from note to note. I like being able to see all my notes in one spot, and often get lost if I can't get a bird's eye view. If Scrintal had a mobile app for recording fleeting notes and such it would be perfect, but for now I just use other apps for that.
I make the links manually between cards. But as cards get added to the board, if there is any link between them, the link will automatically display in the board. Whereas in Obsidian if the link won't automatically appear in the Canvas. Does it make sense?
@@TheChameleon84 The concept is similar but the execution is very different because notes are stored on the Graph itself, not in files and folders. Because the notes live on the graph all that additional organisation isn't required.
@TheChameleon84 I am not sure if you mean the graph view (like in Obsidian Graph view). If that's the case, it is not the same. The graph view doesn't allow to create new notes "in" the graph view, or to open multiple notes while seeing the graph at the back. I am not sure if ExcaliBrain would be more flexible, though, as I haven't tried it.
Thank you. This was very helpful. I very much want to be able to see the primary connections instantly. This might make me stay in Scrintal. I'm really weighing between the two programs to that degree that I haven't started using any of them properly. My hesitation is also connected to having many learning lessbilities. I know it will take a lot of effort to make it work and I don't want to put the energy in the wrong tool. I thought I had chosen Scrintal, until I realized that I'm not even allowed in to the app without being online, so all off line work goes away. I also find that Scrintal is more difficult to use in ways I didn't expect.
Have you made a list with your needs yet? It is important to take some time to choose your workflow first (mindset and methods) then use that knowledge to choose the best tool. For instance: - In which contexts do you want to take notes? Is it on a computer, mobile or tablet? Comfortable at home, at your work desk, or while commuting? How often do you have/need Internet connection? - Which type of notes you want to take? Reflections, descriptions of your knowledge, or quotes and meeting descriptions? - In which situations you need to find those notes again? Your goals, context, and way of thinking will indicate the best tool for your needs.
Thank you! I have thought that I was clear in my head on an inner list of what needs I have, but thinking about it now I realise that I always go on to a compromise mood and rather wonder how I can make the system's functions work for me with the consequence that I start to adjust my needs and goals to what possibilities the tools are offering.
Been there, done that 😅 And it is the case for most (if not all) of my clients, so you are not alone on that. I hope the reflection will give you a bit more of direction 😊
@@BiaResearcher Thanks, definitely. Your two latest videos were very useful. And for me it ends up with going for Scrintal. It does have more of a flow regarding how I think I want to work.
I love the idea behind Excalidraw. I don't think it solves the problem I mentioned in the video (I may be wrong as there is sometime already since I last tested it), but it opens up the possibility for something that I would love to see as reality: linked diagrams. No other app is so close to it as the Excalidraw plugin, I believe. That's the idea where the different "shapes" in a diagram link to different notes/boards. So rather than representing everything as a graph, we can represent things as graphics. I don't know any other tool that can do that apart from the Excalidraw plug-in. (do you know any?)
@@BiaResearcher No I dont know another that does it like excalidraw. Its a game changer but I see your point most defineately. Keep the videos coming. You earned a new subscriber 🙂
@zbyszeks3657 It is currently on-line only. You can use it offline if you are logged into the app but if it logs off then you need internet. Their main use case is synch between devices and collaboration by teams, so I guess that's why they took this route.
I could never figure out how to make Obsidian work for me. It's too open, too many options. The more I learn about Scrintal, the more willing I am to pay for a subscription. It looks simple enough to use, yet packed with invaluable, useful options.
Yes. You can get a free trial if invited by a current customer. I am not sure if they are releasing a public free trial after the official launch though.
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I've used Scrintal for a while, but Affine is open source, free and has canvas with notes. It has shapes, arrows and pen, anything to customize the canvas in any way you want.
This isn’t a criticism of you specifically but the main output of productivity gurus like Ali Abdaal is talking about productivity in abstract. Not a single video about what all this time spent harvesting and organizing information actually accomplished in the real world. Harvesting and organizing is not an end in itself.
Thanks, that's very good feedback 😊
I believe Knowledge Management is a means to an end, but it is true that most of the time we just assume the end rather than demonstrate it.
I have a couple of videos already scheduled, but I will work on a few new ones based on your feedback.
Thanks a lot!
I love your use of strikethrough to indicate something has been processed. Fills in a big gap for me. I often get stuck on the question of where things should live: in the source note or in the new note. This solves that conundrum!
I am happy you found this little trick useful 😊
I have a workflow you might consider the reverse of yours. I creating a large number of small notes that tend to coalesce around a topic as I link them. Then I use the graph view to see those relationships and identify the orphans and outliers. I think the difference is seeing the relationships that grow instead of creating them visually first.
I have that workflow as well 😊
Thank you for sharing your process. I’m using obsidian but will probably think about this as I try to incorporate canvas into my workflow
I am happy it was useful 😊
Thanks. I liked the explanation. Most comparison videos focus on the small little features that are different between the two, but not necessarily on the workflow of each app. I was struggling to notice the difference between the two myself until I used them both for an extended period of time. Hopefully, this video will help new users to make a faster decision when choosing between the two.
Thanks for the feedback and I am glad it helped 😊
Only in my workflow alone there are other points of comparison, most in favour of Scrintal but some definitely in favour of Obsidian as well. Your comment inspired me to think about other videos I could be recording. I won't promise but I will definitely keep it in mind. Thanks a lot!
I love Scrintal, but the faintness of the lines is a pain. Plus, I want to document the connections rather than just link them.
Heptabase has a nicer graphical view but lacks the ability to have boards within boards, so as a Visual-Spatial thinker Heptabase lacks the added dimensions. However, Scrintal has a major update planned for Autumn 24 so lets so what improvements are coming.
I would love to be able to see a card as a link. That way, the card itself is the documentation of the link 😉
I am not sure if that's what you have in mind.
Really good explanation of the differences!
Question about Scrintal: taking book notes as an example, say I want to be able to connect ideas from different books to each other. Will I have to create all of my book notes within the same board, or do the notes live independently from boards, and I can bring them into boards as I choose?
Thought about using Obsidian to do the same thing that you do on Scrintal: Use the graph instead of a canvas. The graph shows the relationship between notes and as soon as you create a new note, it's going to appear on the graph and be connected to the first note! You can keep multiple notes open side by side to copy and paste between them.
While Scrintal looks great, The reason I'll be sticking with Obsidian for the time being is that it works entirely offline. Even if I ever lose access to Obsidian, I will not lose access to my notes which are stored in plain text. And the conventions that Obsidian uses to link notes to each other and create the graph view are already used by other PKM applications. So even if the Obsidian team stops its development, there are alternatives and there are going to be successors too.
In Scrintal, the notes live independently of the boards, so you can move them in or out of boards as you wish. In fact, a note can exist outside of all boards (you can find it via the Archive, links from other notes, or the search).
The general graph tends to have too much information to be useful for this use case. If I open my Scrintal graph in Obsidian I can't really see the "empty space" between connected components. The local graph wouldn't work as I wouldn't know which local graphs to have opened. We only know after seeing all cards created within that "section".
Someone mentioned ExcaliBrain, but I haven't tried it so I am not sure if it would work. Maybe worth a try?
I only confidently made the move to Scrintal when they added the option to export all my notes as Markdown files, so I always have my own backup. Having said that, I wouldn't try to convince you to go out of Obsidian. Each person has their own needs (and honestly, Obsidian is great!) so if that works well for you, I don't see why you would need to move 😊
@@BiaResearcher I’m always looking at alternatives, it’s not I find Obsidian perfect~ Thanks for the info! If you export your Scrintal notes in MD, and you open the folder as a vault in Obsidian, would the connections work? I.e. does Scrintal use the same way of connecting files (at least in the exports) as Obsidian and co?
Yes, the notes work and the exported links are like the ones in Obsidian. Having said that, the export function in Scrintal is not the best.
In the filesystem, each file needs to have a unique name, but in Scrintal two or more cards can have the same title if you want to. So when they export, the name of the file is a code rather than the title of the card, which is not good if you want to know what is inside a note. That's something we have reported so let's see when the team will change that.
@@BiaResearcher very useful, thanks!
Your video illustrates the shortfalls of Obsidian, for now. Perhaps in the future, plugins may be developed that augment the Canvas utility. Scrintal is an interesting tool and I am definitely considering it. I do a great deal of research for novels. I am never sure what I will use or how it relates to other information when I do. Your presentation shows how it can be done.
So thank you. Also...I love your accent.
Thanks 🥰 I am usually too self-conscious about my accent and pronounciation, so your comment warms my heart.
For developing plots you may want to check the new version of Scrintal they will be releasing the next days: ruclips.net/video/Q2WhJtCn5eY/видео.htmlsi=II3geKFVt5s8PbPz
While Obsidian has everything I want in a notetaking app, it doesn't do whiteboarding particularly well in my experience. It's very clunky to use with adding new files and editing existing cards. Apps like Scrintal are very good for people who prefer visual notetaking.
Yes. I would expect Obsidian would have at least some plug-ins improving the Canvas by now. Perhaps it is not a priority?
@@BiaResearcher It seems that most people who use obsidian prefer note-based link navigation from note to note. I like being able to see all my notes in one spot, and often get lost if I can't get a bird's eye view. If Scrintal had a mobile app for recording fleeting notes and such it would be perfect, but for now I just use other apps for that.
Very helpful video. I heard Scrintal gets laggy and slow when you have lots of notes / cards / content. Do you have any issues with that?
I used to have that issue but then it got fixed as they improved the platform a few months ago.
Excelente, Bia! Vou experimentar algo parecido, mas no meu caso com o Muse.
Nice. I never tried Muse. Would you recommend it?
I guess I don’t understand how Srintal makes the links automatically. Like aren’t you making the links there as well
I make the links manually between cards.
But as cards get added to the board, if there is any link between them, the link will automatically display in the board.
Whereas in Obsidian if the link won't automatically appear in the Canvas.
Does it make sense?
@@BiaResearcherisn’t this just the graph view then? If you want more customisability then excalibrain might help with that.
@@TheChameleon84 The concept is similar but the execution is very different because notes are stored on the Graph itself, not in files and folders. Because the notes live on the graph all that additional organisation isn't required.
@@DavidROliveryeah I think excalibrain has that functionality.
@TheChameleon84 I am not sure if you mean the graph view (like in Obsidian Graph view). If that's the case, it is not the same.
The graph view doesn't allow to create new notes "in" the graph view, or to open multiple notes while seeing the graph at the back.
I am not sure if ExcaliBrain would be more flexible, though, as I haven't tried it.
Thank you. This was very helpful. I very much want to be able to see the primary connections instantly. This might make me stay in Scrintal.
I'm really weighing between the two programs to that degree that I haven't started using any of them properly. My hesitation is also connected to having many learning lessbilities. I know it will take a lot of effort to make it work and I don't want to put the energy in the wrong tool. I thought I had chosen Scrintal, until I realized that I'm not even allowed in to the app without being online, so all off line work goes away. I also find that Scrintal is more difficult to use in ways I didn't expect.
Have you made a list with your needs yet?
It is important to take some time to choose your workflow first (mindset and methods) then use that knowledge to choose the best tool.
For instance:
- In which contexts do you want to take notes? Is it on a computer, mobile or tablet? Comfortable at home, at your work desk, or while commuting? How often do you have/need Internet connection?
- Which type of notes you want to take? Reflections, descriptions of your knowledge, or quotes and meeting descriptions?
- In which situations you need to find those notes again?
Your goals, context, and way of thinking will indicate the best tool for your needs.
Thank you! I have thought that I was clear in my head on an inner list of what needs I have, but thinking about it now I realise that I always go on to a compromise mood and rather wonder how I can make the system's functions work for me with the consequence that I start to adjust my needs and goals to what possibilities the tools are offering.
Been there, done that 😅 And it is the case for most (if not all) of my clients, so you are not alone on that.
I hope the reflection will give you a bit more of direction 😊
@@BiaResearcher Thanks, definitely. Your two latest videos were very useful. And for me it ends up with going for Scrintal. It does have more of a flow regarding how I think I want to work.
@@BodilWandt I am happy you found what may work for you 😊If you have any Scrintal big questions, let's chat.
Good video!! I felt this way until I was introduced to the "Excalidraw plugin” in Obsidian. It is Like Canvas on steroids plus tax. 😊
I love the idea behind Excalidraw. I don't think it solves the problem I mentioned in the video (I may be wrong as there is sometime already since I last tested it), but it opens up the possibility for something that I would love to see as reality: linked diagrams. No other app is so close to it as the Excalidraw plugin, I believe.
That's the idea where the different "shapes" in a diagram link to different notes/boards. So rather than representing everything as a graph, we can represent things as graphics. I don't know any other tool that can do that apart from the Excalidraw plug-in. (do you know any?)
@@BiaResearcher No I dont know another that does it like excalidraw. Its a game changer but I see your point most defineately. Keep the videos coming. You earned a new subscriber 🙂
oh thanks. I just hope my next videos won't disappoint 😅
Dá uma olhada no Excalibrain, que é usado junto com o Excalidraw. Acho que é essa a solução para o que vc quer!
It is on-line not off-line?
@zbyszeks3657 It is currently on-line only. You can use it offline if you are logged into the app but if it logs off then you need internet. Their main use case is synch between devices and collaboration by teams, so I guess that's why they took this route.
too bad, its not available on ios yet.
True. They have a Web version only. That's the one I use on my mobile.
I could never figure out how to make Obsidian work for me. It's too open, too many options. The more I learn about Scrintal, the more willing I am to pay for a subscription. It looks simple enough to use, yet packed with invaluable, useful options.
Scrintal has a new version coming up in a few days: ruclips.net/video/Q2WhJtCn5eY/видео.htmlsi=II3geKFVt5s8PbPz
Scrintal looks interesting, but its paid-only.
Yes. You can get a free trial if invited by a current customer. I am not sure if they are releasing a public free trial after the official launch though.