great video! well explained. I love the N6 chord. I tend to use it more in root position though as I'm writing in a more modern context. coming from non-classical background to me it's best thought of as phyrgian modal interchange - but I love seeing the history here
I have a motivation question for the tempest sonata, the parts around bar 210-215. I see what I’d happening, with the a in the bass and the alternating between the tonic and the dominant seventh. I don’t understand the V86 notation. Much thanks if you see this :-) Edit: is this because the original v86 is being treated like a suspended dominant moving down to the dominant 7, and then repeating as if moves down further to the tonic?
Hi, nice video, but what makes you think that in the Beethoven example, the A chord in m. 3 is interpreted as dominant to the neapolitan chord? It seems this is rather a usual VI-IV-V progression leading to the tonic?
I do agree that if the D in the N6 chord was changed to a C#, the chord progression would be VI-iv6-V. But I see Beethoven use simple concepts and manipulate them to deceive the ear. Whether it's obscuring the tonal center in the opening bars or when the recapitulation actually starts in some of his other works. Are you familiar with the opening chord progression of Beethoven's Symphony No. 1?
@@TheSoundtrackofHistory Good example, did not know that, I see your point for that symphony. Although it is in the key of c major, it starts in c as a dominant 7th. That's indeed obscur. But I have difficulties converting that to the current example. The opening bar is simply in the tonic, manifesting c# minor as tonic, then a progression follows of the type VI-predominant-dominant-tonic. For me, this has a lot in common with Bach WTK 1, Prelude 1, first four bars, but I am ready to be corrected.
Yes, the upper voices are arranged in the same fashion as the opening measure in Prelude no. 1. For me, I see the proceeding measures of that prelude confirm the tonic, with the standard ii-V7-I chord progression. For moonlight sonata, the opening measure is in the tonic but unlike the prelude the very next measure turns the C# minor chord into a possibly a ii7 chord in B major, or a vi7 in E major. The third bar continues in developing this ambiguity with the introduction of the A major chord. So far, the first 3 chords have not established the tonic through a V chord. Then comes the N6 chord. This is the only tonic and dominant chord relationship we have been introduced to. This A major to the D major chord (N6) chord. It's only through this uncommon chord progression from the N6 to the V7 chord that we finally establish the tonic. I think it fits why the main theme is introduced after the tonic has been established through the V chord.
@@TheSoundtrackofHistory I start to see your point but I am still not fully convinced. For me, as the piece is in c minor and the first measure is in standard c minor, the tonic feels well established. Yes, the tonic is somehow clouded in m. 2 by the addition of the minor 7th, but could this not be interpreted as some kind of bridge chord to the VI? (Since the bass is lead downwards.) As the VI is a major chord, this indeed adds some new color and feels different from the Bach example, but I still cannot feel that a new tonal center is established.
Yes, it could be seen as a passing tone in the bass. I thinks its this ambiguous nature that Beethoven plays with simple techniques and where and how he uses them allows for the ear to be confused. If not establishing a new tonal center, at the very least, obscuring the tonal center until measure 5.
Thank you for taking the time to watch and appreciate the video. I understand your point about not overly lionizing composers. As a composer and music theorist, my intention is to convey respect and admiration for their craftsmanship and ingenuity, rather than elevating them beyond their human capabilities. I strive to highlight their creative contributions within a context of grounded appreciation for their musical achievements. Your feedback is valuable, and I'll keep it in mind for future videos.
Terrific videos
Nice video. You should delve into partimenti and figured bass!
great video! well explained. I love the N6 chord. I tend to use it more in root position though as I'm writing in a more modern context.
coming from non-classical background to me it's best thought of as phyrgian modal interchange - but I love seeing the history here
Excellent, keep the videos coming!!!!
More to come!
Felt like i learned a ton from this, would love to see more!
I have a motivation question for the tempest sonata, the parts around bar 210-215. I see what I’d happening, with the a in the bass and the alternating between the tonic and the dominant seventh. I don’t understand the V86 notation. Much thanks if you see this :-)
Edit: is this because the original v86 is being treated like a suspended dominant moving down to the dominant 7, and then repeating as if moves down further to the tonic?
Hi, nice video, but what makes you think that in the Beethoven example, the A chord in m. 3 is interpreted as dominant to the neapolitan chord? It seems this is rather a usual VI-IV-V progression leading to the tonic?
I do agree that if the D in the N6 chord was changed to a C#, the chord progression would be VI-iv6-V. But I see Beethoven use simple concepts and manipulate them to deceive the ear. Whether it's obscuring the tonal center in the opening bars or when the recapitulation actually starts in some of his other works. Are you familiar with the opening chord progression of Beethoven's Symphony No. 1?
@@TheSoundtrackofHistory Good example, did not know that, I see your point for that symphony. Although it is in the key of c major, it starts in c as a dominant 7th. That's indeed obscur. But I have difficulties converting that to the current example. The opening bar is simply in the tonic, manifesting c# minor as tonic, then a progression follows of the type VI-predominant-dominant-tonic. For me, this has a lot in common with Bach WTK 1, Prelude 1, first four bars, but I am ready to be corrected.
Yes, the upper voices are arranged in the same fashion as the opening measure in Prelude no. 1. For me, I see the proceeding measures of that prelude confirm the tonic, with the standard ii-V7-I chord progression.
For moonlight sonata, the opening measure is in the tonic but unlike the prelude the very next measure turns the C# minor chord into a possibly a ii7 chord in B major, or a vi7 in E major. The third bar continues in developing this ambiguity with the introduction of the A major chord. So far, the first 3 chords have not established the tonic through a V chord. Then comes the N6 chord. This is the only tonic and dominant chord relationship we have been introduced to. This A major to the D major chord (N6) chord. It's only through this uncommon chord progression from the N6 to the V7 chord that we finally establish the tonic. I think it fits why the main theme is introduced after the tonic has been established through the V chord.
@@TheSoundtrackofHistory I start to see your point but I am still not fully convinced. For me, as the piece is in c minor and the first measure is in standard c minor, the tonic feels well established. Yes, the tonic is somehow clouded in m. 2 by the addition of the minor 7th, but could this not be interpreted as some kind of bridge chord to the VI? (Since the bass is lead downwards.) As the VI is a major chord, this indeed adds some new color and feels different from the Bach example, but I still cannot feel that a new tonal center is established.
Yes, it could be seen as a passing tone in the bass. I thinks its this ambiguous nature that Beethoven plays with simple techniques and where and how he uses them allows for the ear to be confused. If not establishing a new tonal center, at the very least, obscuring the tonal center until measure 5.
8:15 Evil Morty theme
Great information, but we do not need all the adjectives lionizing these composer's genious. They are architects, not angels.
Thank you for taking the time to watch and appreciate the video. I understand your point about not overly lionizing composers. As a composer and music theorist, my intention is to convey respect and admiration for their craftsmanship and ingenuity, rather than elevating them beyond their human capabilities. I strive to highlight their creative contributions within a context of grounded appreciation for their musical achievements. Your feedback is valuable, and I'll keep it in mind for future videos.