Funny story time: I had a viewer recently who cussed me out, told me I sold out because I apparently "no longer review cheap Chinese frames." And then unsubscribed. Had he waited literally a week later before becoming unhinged...he'd still be here haha
Just received my 3rd frame (GR021, FM639 and GR048) all in custom colours. Happy to wait for the longer shipping times, I really like their frames, the paint jobs, the quality and ease of communication.
🎄Hyvää Joulua, Patrick! 🎄 🇫🇮 That's a nice spec bike, and great colour, cant wait to see how it looks built up. Nice to see all the new features like UDH and internal storage, on a frame with really reasonable geometry. Ticks all the geometry boxes for a low slung gravel flyer, especially with the low BB and big tires.
Not the lightest gravel frameset ever. Actually quite heavy. However, it should be bulletproof. The added weight is essentially a built-in warranty from the manufacturer. And this frame has already proven be worthy enough for the British Gravel Championship race.
@@ariffau Funny Story Time: A had viewer recently who cussed me out, told me I sold out because I apparently "no longer review cheap Chinese frames." And then unsubscribed. Had he waited literally a week later before becoming unhinged...he'd still be here haha
Just a quick editing idea I had. When you weigh the components and read out the weights, maybe have an overlay with the weights and the running total 😊
I bought a GR044 from Tantan two years ago, I also ordered 2 Carbon rims. I Like this bike! everything works fine. Just a Tip: put some grease on the frame screws. One Screw i don’t get out anymore.
Tan tan/Seraph is legit. I just finished up a CX season on my seraph gr029 and it was so reliable and tough as nails. I took some HITS on that bike and it never skipped a beat. I like it so much that I ordered another one! I convinced my girlfriend to buy a gr048 and she loves it too.
The weight is pretty good for a gravel frame with all the hardware including a storage compartment. For example Giant Revolt in medium weight about 1200g and 2025 version with storage I guess even more (I'll get it later this year). But yeah, the amount of features on this frame is a deal breaker. Nice color 👌🏻
I like the musical interlude prior to weighing the frame. It’s cool to share what we like in music. Excellent review. I’m surprised at the features available for this price. Tire clearance is IMO too small for most bikes and brands, gravel endurance and race/road. Gravel should have the option of up to 64mm Endurance 45mm and road 35mm. Thanks for the review.
Checkmate has only 45 mm tire clearance but also 426 mm chainstays. So hard to compare with this bike´s 435mm, Checkmate is not a bikepacking bike. I know some riders opt for 2.1 Thunder Burts instead of gravel tires, they have very low rolling resistance and for some races it makes sense but for other races it is not good to have 150g weight penalty over some lightweight gravel tires. New Open will also limit its tire clearance at around 45mm which was an intentional choice from Gerard Vroomen. He says that they wanted a bike you can enjoy both on gravel and road as many riders live in big cities and ride plenty of tarmac before they reach gravel and 45mm clearance was the limit for such a bike. They will have a bike with bigger tire clearance but you just can´t have everything in one bike. Trying to do it means you need to have longer chainstays, less stiff/asymmetric solutions etc. On the other hand Ridley´s new ASTR RS has 50mm clearance with short chainstays...but they keep Kanzo Fast in their lineup for faster races - so maybe even ASTR RS is not the one bike to rule them all...future will be interesting:) This bike is unfortunately too low and long for my preferences which is the case of many chinese bikes. Weird to make it so low as most people agree that your gravel position should be a bit (around 1cm) higher than on your racing road bike.
Ma boy patty, got a tire recommendation for you: for an allroad/fast gravel bike the Hutchinson caracal race are FLYING! We visited my in-laws during Xmas, and I couldn't decide for a bike to bring. So I brought my gravelbike to ride anything. Omg, these tires are insane! Almost like a road bike on tarmac.
@@DittersGustav I LOVE this. I was about to head over to pick up a set of 42 Pathfinder Pros, but now I'll just order these LoL. I plan to do a lot of gravel next summer. In the meantime these will do! Thanks guys.
As shown on chinertown, I received an other heavier seatpost with mine. Your's seems better ! And the seatpost is 27,2mm, 31,8 is the diameter of the seat tube of the frame. Nice review as always
@@PatrickLino does the centered seat post put you too far over the bike? I thought it might be nice to make up for the long reach. How does this bike feel with the relatively short stack?
I'd say if TanTan offers a 90 or 100mm stem cockpit, get the 54. The 52 will have a shorter reach that you'd need, but most likely the stack will just be too low. Check out the website Geometry Geeks to compare geometry to your current gravel frame just to be sure.
I know you said you won’t need 2.2in tires but in the review video, I would love to know what you think the max width you could fit on it. Either way looks like a great price for a winter/camping bike
I thought for a second there would be actual noodles that were sent with the frame 😂 looks fire! Looking forward to the build as I’m looking to get one too for the winters here in Toronto
If the group sets are the killer, then may I suggest (after having the mechanical of RX 2x or GRT 1x Ltwoo) I have found them to be a great option and breaking performance phenomenal and seriously cheap! (P.S you don't need the box option)
I’m looking at the a Tan Tan frame that has the ahem 😮 the speed sniffer 😂. As someone who actually has this bike Tan Tan appear to have a reasonable rep and this could be a good racing/crit bike. Better than buying the same from Ali Express would be nice if some chilly done a review. Fancy it Patty 😉
Whats crazy is that * ahem * speed sniffer frame has a very competitive weight. I think around 900g real world weight. My SL8 Pro frame came in at 825g. How did TanTan manage similar weight without using expensive grade of carbon? And will it actually be stiff??
@ Have the same bar, but mine came only with a compression ring made out of plastic. No shim needed I guess, seems a pretty tight fit with the steerertube. Love the channel! Now when subscribed I have tons of videos to pingewatch durning the holidays! All the best!
Wheeltop group? 1x ftw.. and whats the white Tavelo frameset over there in the box!??🧐🧐 xplor rd max is 46t👎 popular sram 1x method: mullet setup with mtb rd. Axs or ttype 50 or 52t rear
I notice you didn't speak to the headtube angle very much, 72.2 is quite steep for a gravel bike. That one number makes this a hard sell to anyone who goes down minor descents. Ironically we can fit 50mm tires. Some nice mud clearance for most I suppose!
Merry Christmas from Canada, One question Airwolf or TanTan which is better quality. I already have Specialized Allez from 2016 and I wanted a second bike.
In Sworks Crux competitor out there? I’ve been patiently waiting and searching but after your praise of the Tarmac on quality I might bite the bullet… Thoughts?
The Crux is still a CX frame cosplaying as a gravel bike. 47c tire clearance, no mounting points on the frame, and a tall bottom bracket height just doesn't cut it for an ultra modern all-day gravel bike. Perhaps Specialized will fix these issues in their upcoming Crux refresh.
@@PatrickLino the tire clearance i agree with, but mounting points is not something I want for the Crux. I have a Crux and I hope they keep it light and only increase the tire clearance a bit.
@ lol “ Issues” … I will take that as your “ Chinese frame marketing” response.. But if you ever brush up on gravel racing Ultra endurance no one ever won with more than 47c tires and low bottom brackets.
Same as my Shimano but the battery is in the frame. Both “non removable’, that’s how they improve the waterproofing. My shop hates sram cause the batteries r terrible, won’t charge than u have to hit them on the counter to get them charging. And u can take off the wheel top bat if u want to it has two little bolts. And u could get the wheel top sent to u for free cause of ur YT. I say go for it!!!
Personally I think the battery configuration of the wheel top is the best: Fully wireless, so no wires to snag or disconnect, and the installation is simple. Securely attached battery, so it's not going to bounce out on the trail or be forgotten at home. The battery is still easily replaced with a couple screws and wheeltop seems to be doing well with building a distributor network (we already have a few distributors here in Canada) so we'll have to see how well supplied they are with replacement parts.
I'm just amazed how you were able to find so many Chinese frames ! For the record, I'm a Chinese from China, neither my riding bodies nor I have never heard about some of the brands you test. Jokes aside, many of the OEMs probably only sell to westerns and don't really sell in domestic market. I've seen so many reviews on youtube now, Chinese OEMs frames are way better than pre-covid times. I feel like the stupid names of these brands is really a put off for me. And yes, their names sounds just as stupid in Chinese as in English.
The Chinese brands REALLY need to do MUCH better with their name convention. I suppose at one point, the name "GIANT" was probably laughed at too haha. Perhaps they should invest in a Western marketing/branding team.
@@PatrickLino I think most of the brand probably have marketing professionals who understand the western market already; however, I don't think the Owner/boss who came up with the name wants to be pointed out that the names are stupid.
The only thing the Chinese brands seem to lack is someone who can create great brand _names_ 😂 some are close but some are just off the charts weird. ‘Tan Tan’? Really?
"tan" is a direct translation of the pronunciation of the chinese character 碳, which means carbon. The Chinese brands were not set up on day one to try to masquerade as a brand originating from the english speaking world, most just use simple translation for its english name when it need to do business outside China. So sometimes the translated name can sound somewhat weird or funny. But the same is true for some western bike brand names when translated into chinese or how it is commonly being called in the chinese speaking world. For example, Cervelo is commonly called "死肥佬“ for those who speak cantonese, which means "dead fat man" 😂 By the way, tantan is part of their official company name. They do have a an English name for their frame brand which is Seraph. Here is their RUclips channel. www.youtube.com/@seraph6583 I built up my gravel bike with their GR044 gravel frame (almost all components are China made). It performed flawlessly on many of my gravel & road cycling event trips around southeast asia and also on my bike packing trip. Solid product and after sales customer service was fantastic! Highly recommended if you are looking to custom build your own bike. Cheaper price tag does not always mean lower quality or performance.
![BLACK BAG - Official Trailer [HD] - Only in Theaters March 14](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Du0Xp8WX_7I/mqdefault.jpg)
Funny story time: I had a viewer recently who cussed me out, told me I sold out because I apparently "no longer review cheap Chinese frames." And then unsubscribed. Had he waited literally a week later before becoming unhinged...he'd still be here haha
Haters be hating.
They’ll be back 🚴✨✨
Good riddance
Just received my 3rd frame (GR021, FM639 and GR048) all in custom colours. Happy to wait for the longer shipping times, I really like their frames, the paint jobs, the quality and ease of communication.
Thanks Susanne!
Sweet overview! The big brands should definitely be afraid. That's an awesome looking rig.
Tan Tan also needs a "Test Rider" for the hot and brutal Texas summers.The gravel really heats up here. ( size small )
EMAIL THEM!
Merry Christmas Patrick
Enjoy your week kind sir!
🎄Hyvää Joulua, Patrick! 🎄 🇫🇮
That's a nice spec bike, and great colour, cant wait to see how it looks built up. Nice to see all the new features like UDH and internal storage, on a frame with really reasonable geometry.
Ticks all the geometry boxes for a low slung gravel flyer, especially with the low BB and big tires.
Already almost finished building it. But man 1x components are pricey.
Not the lightest gravel frameset ever. Actually quite heavy. However, it should be bulletproof. The added weight is essentially a built-in warranty from the manufacturer. And this frame has already proven be worthy enough for the British Gravel Championship race.
The weight IMHO is respectable. It’s lighter than an aluminium Crux or an Allez Sprint from the Big Red S
@@ariffau Funny Story Time: A had viewer recently who cussed me out, told me I sold out because I apparently "no longer review cheap Chinese frames." And then unsubscribed. Had he waited literally a week later before becoming unhinged...he'd still be here haha
ye better to have some weight to the bike.
Just a quick editing idea I had. When you weigh the components and read out the weights, maybe have an overlay with the weights and the running total 😊
@@cookxride I need to get over my laziness and spend the extra 30 seconds required to do this haha. Thank you for reminding me!
I bought a GR044 from Tantan two years ago, I also ordered 2 Carbon rims. I Like this bike! everything works fine. Just a Tip: put some grease on the frame screws. One Screw i don’t get out anymore.
Thanks for the tip! I'll do that RIGHT NOW. Because I do plan for this to also be my foul weather bike.
Tan tan/Seraph is legit. I just finished up a CX season on my seraph gr029 and it was so reliable and tough as nails. I took some HITS on that bike and it never skipped a beat. I like it so much that I ordered another one! I convinced my girlfriend to buy a gr048 and she loves it too.
Always great to hear customer feedback in here. Thanks for watching!
The weight is pretty good for a gravel frame with all the hardware including a storage compartment.
For example Giant Revolt in medium weight about 1200g and 2025 version with storage I guess even more (I'll get it later this year).
But yeah, the amount of features on this frame is a deal breaker.
Nice color 👌🏻
I like the musical interlude prior to weighing the frame. It’s cool to share what we like in music. Excellent review. I’m surprised at the features available for this price. Tire clearance is IMO too small for most bikes and brands, gravel endurance and race/road. Gravel should have the option of up to 64mm Endurance 45mm and road 35mm. Thanks for the review.
Definitely one of my favorite youtuber :)
You are far too kind, thank you!
Checkmate has only 45 mm tire clearance but also 426 mm chainstays. So hard to compare with this bike´s 435mm, Checkmate is not a bikepacking bike. I know some riders opt for 2.1 Thunder Burts instead of gravel tires, they have very low rolling resistance and for some races it makes sense but for other races it is not good to have 150g weight penalty over some lightweight gravel tires. New Open will also limit its tire clearance at around 45mm which was an intentional choice from Gerard Vroomen. He says that they wanted a bike you can enjoy both on gravel and road as many riders live in big cities and ride plenty of tarmac before they reach gravel and 45mm clearance was the limit for such a bike. They will have a bike with bigger tire clearance but you just can´t have everything in one bike. Trying to do it means you need to have longer chainstays, less stiff/asymmetric solutions etc. On the other hand Ridley´s new ASTR RS has 50mm clearance with short chainstays...but they keep Kanzo Fast in their lineup for faster races - so maybe even ASTR RS is not the one bike to rule them all...future will be interesting:) This bike is unfortunately too low and long for my preferences which is the case of many chinese bikes. Weird to make it so low as most people agree that your gravel position should be a bit (around 1cm) higher than on your racing road bike.
Ma boy patty, got a tire recommendation for you: for an allroad/fast gravel bike the Hutchinson caracal race are FLYING! We visited my in-laws during Xmas, and I couldn't decide for a bike to bring. So I brought my gravelbike to ride anything. Omg, these tires are insane! Almost like a road bike on tarmac.
WICKED! Thanks for the suggestion man.
2x on that recommendation, just be sure to get the race version, the regular one is pretty draggy.
@@DittersGustav I LOVE this. I was about to head over to pick up a set of 42 Pathfinder Pros, but now I'll just order these LoL. I plan to do a lot of gravel next summer. In the meantime these will do! Thanks guys.
@@DittersGustav Dang...sold out everywhere LoL
@@PatrickLino yeah man, imported mine from Spain to Germany. they're like hotcakes, you gotta be quick 😅.
As shown on chinertown, I received an other heavier seatpost with mine. Your's seems better !
And the seatpost is 27,2mm, 31,8 is the diameter of the seat tube of the frame.
Nice review as always
Pretty sure I'll need a 20mm setback seat post as a permanent component
@@PatrickLino does the centered seat post put you too far over the bike? I thought it might be nice to make up for the long reach. How does this bike feel with the relatively short stack?
@@m5paeplow I’ll have a video once I’ve built and ridden it.
At 180cm, should I go 52 or 54? I currently ride a Canyon Ultimate in a medium.
I'd say if TanTan offers a 90 or 100mm stem cockpit, get the 54. The 52 will have a shorter reach that you'd need, but most likely the stack will just be too low. Check out the website Geometry Geeks to compare geometry to your current gravel frame just to be sure.
One day you are going to release a side channel where you cruise around Chicago picking up and listening to records. Ill be here for it
"Patty Goes Vinyl Shoppin'"
I just got a FM639 w/custom paint, absolutely love it, very high quality and rides well. Was like 950g with chameleon paint, pretty damn good
Thanks for chiming in! Good to know...
I know you said you won’t need 2.2in tires but in the review video, I would love to know what you think the max width you could fit on it. Either way looks like a great price for a winter/camping bike
Quick measurements just now. The fork can very easily take 2.2in. The rear will clear 2.2s on dry roads.
@ thanks so much!
Man, that looks like a really good gravel bike and checks all the boxes for a gravel bike
You know what you need to do...
I thought for a second there would be actual noodles that were sent with the frame 😂 looks fire! Looking forward to the build as I’m looking to get one too for the winters here in Toronto
Thanks Henry. Have a great weekend kind sir ❄️
Mom say's Merry Christmas!
hahaha thank you
If the group sets are the killer, then may I suggest (after having the mechanical of RX 2x or GRT 1x Ltwoo) I have found them to be a great option and breaking performance phenomenal and seriously cheap! (P.S you don't need the box option)
Thanks David! Have a great weekend sir!
just from the glimpse, these newer frames are looking much cleaner on the inside.
I would tend to agree.
What a striking brand name.
I’m looking at the a Tan Tan frame that has the ahem 😮 the speed sniffer 😂. As someone who actually has this bike Tan Tan appear to have a reasonable rep and this could be a good racing/crit bike. Better than buying the same from Ali Express would be nice if some chilly done a review.
Fancy it Patty 😉
Whats crazy is that * ahem * speed sniffer frame has a very competitive weight. I think around 900g real world weight. My SL8 Pro frame came in at 825g. How did TanTan manage similar weight without using expensive grade of carbon? And will it actually be stiff??
I'm a big fan of the on bike storage
Gonna store my weed in there.
Happy Holidays 🍻
At 5:25 the shim, what’s that? Goes on the steerer with the compression ring? /// btw subscribed!!! ❤
Yup it's a shim for the integrated handlebars
@ Have the same bar, but mine came only with a compression ring made out of plastic. No shim needed I guess, seems a pretty tight fit with the steerertube. Love the channel! Now when subscribed I have tons of videos to pingewatch durning the holidays! All the best!
@@E.T_rode_bikes_As_well Thanks ET!
Wheeltop group? 1x ftw.. and whats the white Tavelo frameset over there in the box!??🧐🧐 xplor rd max is 46t👎 popular sram 1x method: mullet setup with mtb rd. Axs or ttype 50 or 52t rear
The build is basically finished. Gonna settle on Eagle Transmission GX. Running just a regular Force RD until it arrives.
It's like an affordable enve mog that I'd actually dare take bikepacking
But with a 72.2 HTA, the MOG sits at 71. Big difference in capability.
I notice you didn't speak to the headtube angle very much, 72.2 is quite steep for a gravel bike.
That one number makes this a hard sell to anyone who goes down minor descents. Ironically we can fit 50mm tires. Some nice mud clearance for most I suppose!
@@Peregrino.51 great point! What gravel bike are you currently running?
@@Peregrino.51 I also didn’t wanna touch on steering dynamic until I actually build and ride it in the real world
@@PatrickLino Makes sense! Looking forward to your take on this style of geo.
will you reviewing quick pro bike?
Ha you are probably the 10th person to ask. No plans at the moment, as that decision is up to Panda Podium.
Merry Christmas from Canada, One question Airwolf or TanTan which is better quality. I already have Specialized Allez from 2016 and I wanted a second bike.
Yeah...you're gonna wanna completely stay away from Airwolf. TanTan has a proven track record online of being a reliable affordable Chinese brand.
What do you think the max rider weight is
@@SabianDB02 My guess maybe 250lbs? Not sure. Gravel bikes are intended to carry lots and lots of added weight.
In Sworks Crux competitor out there? I’ve been patiently waiting and searching but after your praise of the Tarmac on quality I might bite the bullet… Thoughts?
The Crux is still a CX frame cosplaying as a gravel bike. 47c tire clearance, no mounting points on the frame, and a tall bottom bracket height just doesn't cut it for an ultra modern all-day gravel bike. Perhaps Specialized will fix these issues in their upcoming Crux refresh.
@@PatrickLino the tire clearance i agree with, but mounting points is not something I want for the Crux. I have a Crux and I hope they keep it light and only increase the tire clearance a bit.
@ lol “ Issues” … I will take that as your “ Chinese frame marketing” response.. But if you ever brush up on gravel racing Ultra endurance no one ever won with more than 47c tires and low bottom brackets.
@@adamgoodman3422Lol asks for my opinion. Doesn’t like my opinion. Okay great, buy the Crux then. Problem solved. ❤
@@PatrickLino solely because you specifically posted asking for a Chinese frame that has crux geometry.. cmon bruh.. but I respect your take 👊🏾
Do a wheel top gex
That non-removable derailleur battery 😭
Same as my Shimano but the battery is in the frame. Both “non removable’, that’s how they improve the waterproofing. My shop hates sram cause the batteries r terrible, won’t charge than u have to hit them on the counter to get them charging. And u can take off the wheel top bat if u want to it has two little bolts. And u could get the wheel top sent to u for free cause of ur YT. I say go for it!!!
@@jonphotos8631 I love the way you think hahaha!
Wait for the new shimano grx 1x with no internal battery ;)
It's just a few months ahead.
Personally I think the battery configuration of the wheel top is the best: Fully wireless, so no wires to snag or disconnect, and the installation is simple. Securely attached battery, so it's not going to bounce out on the trail or be forgotten at home.
The battery is still easily replaced with a couple screws and wheeltop seems to be doing well with building a distributor network (we already have a few distributors here in Canada) so we'll have to see how well supplied they are with replacement parts.
I'm just amazed how you were able to find so many Chinese frames ! For the record, I'm a Chinese from China, neither my riding bodies nor I have never heard about some of the brands you test. Jokes aside, many of the OEMs probably only sell to westerns and don't really sell in domestic market. I've seen so many reviews on youtube now, Chinese OEMs frames are way better than pre-covid times. I feel like the stupid names of these brands is really a put off for me. And yes, their names sounds just as stupid in Chinese as in English.
The Chinese brands REALLY need to do MUCH better with their name convention. I suppose at one point, the name "GIANT" was probably laughed at too haha. Perhaps they should invest in a Western marketing/branding team.
@@PatrickLino I think most of the brand probably have marketing professionals who understand the western market already; however, I don't think the Owner/boss who came up with the name wants to be pointed out that the names are stupid.
@@renzhilin2775I don’t recall pointing out their names to be stupid.
I love noodles too!
hahahhha
Well, I guess it doesn't hurt to have some more carbon on a Chinese frame from a brand unknown to most.
Whoops…seat post is 27.2
Why 31.8? 31.6 would allow you to run a dropper.
@@jeffreyhoops3611 whoops, seat post is 27.2
The question is: does in fit 2.2 race kings #bonkbros
@@matsstefens we shall find out #backwardshatdylan
The only thing the Chinese brands seem to lack is someone who can create great brand _names_ 😂 some are close but some are just off the charts weird. ‘Tan Tan’? Really?
Thankfully the words: "Tan Tan" are nowhere to be found the frame LoL
@ it should have the formula for ‘tan’ (as in sin cos tan trigonometry functions) ‘tan x = sin x / cos x’ just printed twice
"tan" is a direct translation of the pronunciation of the chinese character 碳, which means carbon. The Chinese brands were not set up on day one to try to masquerade as a brand originating from the english speaking world, most just use simple translation for its english name when it need to do business outside China. So sometimes the translated name can sound somewhat weird or funny. But the same is true for some western bike brand names when translated into chinese or how it is commonly being called in the chinese speaking world. For example, Cervelo is commonly called "死肥佬“ for those who speak cantonese, which means "dead fat man" 😂
By the way, tantan is part of their official company name. They do have a an English name for their frame brand which is Seraph. Here is their RUclips channel.
www.youtube.com/@seraph6583
I built up my gravel bike with their GR044 gravel frame (almost all components are China made). It performed flawlessly on many of my gravel & road cycling event trips around southeast asia and also on my bike packing trip. Solid product and after sales customer service was fantastic! Highly recommended if you are looking to custom build your own bike. Cheaper price tag does not always mean lower quality or performance.
The smallest size is still too large
Funny, since most Chinese brands rarely offer up frames larger than XXL for anyone over 6 feet in height.
After checking out the geometry chart for this and being a short person - I gotta agree