🔗 FREE DOWNLOAD - 5 STEPS TO REDUCING INJURY RISK - wodprep.com/injury/ 🔗 Join WODprep Masters for coaching and programming from Dr CJ DePalma - wodprep.com/wodprep-masters/ 🔗 Work one on one with our Physical Therapists - wodprep.com/injury-rehab-and-prevention/
As an older athlete, I have to do something (foam rolling, stretching, mobility movements) before I can even begin a programmed movement. This wasn't so much the case when I was younger (
One thing we can all agree on is Ben is hilarious. The best athelete-comedian out there. The psoaz kettlebell handle hump clip was priceless. I feel like an amateur for humping the lacross ball on the floor to release my psoaz. I do find my 30 minute myofacial release routine to be quite a buzz kill on my schedule, so am curious to see if i can ween myself off it someday. At 41, I am already religious about the concept of do the thing, both from the perspective of warming up and gaining a skill. I never do a workout without first "lubing up" my body by doing a lighter version of the thing (or ramping up if going very heavy) and focussing on key elements of technique. From my experience myfacial release does not create any permanent change, it just provides me with temporary symptom relief of my trouble areas that are caused by injuries or imbalances. For my areas that are doing fine it does seem kind of pointless so maybe I'll start there by skipping those. In my experience, my chronic issues are better addressed by strengthening exercises and neuromuscular re-education.
When I started CrossFit my coach told ne : No more stretcing. We Just do 5 minuts od mobility= active squat, shoulder press and snatches with na empty barbell.... I am eternaly grateful for that. For findidng such a great box and such a great coach. And all od you at WODPREP Can't tell U how grateful I am for all od your videos, tutorials and support. You are the Best 💪
The truth is in the middle. "Highly mobile people can perform poorly." Yes, because "perform" is an even more subjective term than "mobile." It's obvious that people with better mobility generally perform better than those without, especially controlling for other factors. Strength/stability through a range of motion is the goal, but if you take two athletes with the same deadlift and OH press (strength) and have them do an OH squat workout, the one with better hip and shoulder mobility will perform better, often even if they are at a steep absolute strength deficit. From a functional perspective, it also doesn't necessarily matter if you are literally stretching the tissue or just desensitizing the nervous system. We shouldn't negate the concepts of tissue elasticity or connective integrity. Strength is generated in the nervous system as well, but we don't conclude that there's no reason to develop more contractile tissue. They're independent variables, but highly correlary -- developing one generally affects the other...and they both exist.
Thanks for the comment Stephen! I'm passing this along to the Docs and seeing if they can hop in to comment since I can't handle all the big words. 😅 They will comment soon I hope!
Hey Stephen. Thanks for the comment. Its tough to say that "people with better mobility generally perform better than those without" let alone it being obvious, especially with mobility and performance being so subjective, like you mentioned. Its more obvious that different people generate different adaptations that allow them to perform better at different goals/tasks that they train for. Those two people with the deadlift and OH press similarities may find that they OH squat differently, but I'm not sure that moving the field goal to overhead squatting shows that one is generally a better physical performer overall. Maybe they would be able to accomplish the OH squat better, but I think we would probably just consider them more skilled in accomplishing that task. For the functional (yet another subjective term) perspective, I don't think we are negating the concepts of tissue elasticity as we promote that there should be a warm up before training, specific to the task in front of us, which will improve tissue elasticity (ex. empty barbell squats to prepare for barbell squats). Strength is arguably a skill that improves with more exposure, similar to achieving positions or completing tasks. Rather than spend time stretching, spending time exposing oneself to the desired task is likely time better spent. This is a good read with some nice references to flip through: www.barbellmedicine.com/blog/mobility-explained/ Thanks again for the comment and I hope you find the read helpful. - Dr. Joe
You've talked about mobility and performance but what about mobity and pain. As an example i have chronic right back/trap/neck stiffness/pain with rounded shoulders. Physio prescribed strengthening exercises but also a pec stretch.
I agree with "do the thing". However, what I think I heard was "with good form". too many of us let out ego rule our head, adding weight before we have mastered "the thing". Good stuff, as usual.
I agree it’s not the most important for Mobility, but it does help. For me mobility it’s more about dynamic stretching or isometric contractions and blood flow.
Sleep, Hydrate, and eat enough calories. Sore muscles will be sore, and that's OK! Very normal response to training and shouldn't be considered "bad" :)
Gosh I love you guys but In terms of myth 2 regarding stretching, I can tell you personally that my 6 orthopedic surgeons from the top schools and residencies in the world, my 4 outstanding physical therapists I've worked with over the years who have resolved serious muscular problems I've had and hundreds of different medical papers would beg to differ. That’s all I have to say bc otherwise you guys are great. Oh, and the first myth regarding myofascial tissue release I would also disagree with, but I think we agree on the general concept (just not the hard objects issue).
Hey David. Thanks for the comment. I appreciate the perspective that you bring here as it highlights an unfortunate feeling of "this is how weve always done it" in the medical community that we are trying to move away from. Here are a couple of resources that we recommend perusing through in regard to our views on stretching and mobility. There aren't hundreds of medical papers here, but 145 is nothing to scoff at either. Resource #1: www.painscience.com/articles/stretching.php Resource #2: www.barbellmedicine.com/blog/mobility-explained/ I hope you find these helpful. Thanks again for the comment! - Dr. Joe
I used to do a warm up with an empty bar doing full body compound moves every gym session regardless if it was leg day or arm day. The basic foundations movements, presses, squats, hinges etc. The military PTI’s said it was wrong and I needed to static stretch before PT sessions. I got so injured over the next decade in the military and my injuries became debilitating as we just did more stretches. My current physio is awesome. Started today’s session with trap bar deadlifts no weight and deep squats no weight before loading the bar. Doing the exercises we have planned for the day. In over 15 years of physio I’ve never been so fortunate to have a physio like this. I’m stronger for it and my joints are working better. So some are taking to that last bit quite nicely. We don’t do any stretches at all. My back hurts less, my shoulder is more mobile and I can get deeper in my squats.
I dont think most people do those things to make them better at being prepared for a movement but rather for recovery. Wouldnt these things be very effective for recovery.
Are Ben and CJ standing on 25lbs plates for this one? Joe doesn't look _as_ gigantic this time. I still think there's like a 70% chance he's going to eat one of you after all the recording is done though.
🔗 FREE DOWNLOAD - 5 STEPS TO REDUCING INJURY RISK - wodprep.com/injury/
🔗 Join WODprep Masters for coaching and programming from Dr CJ DePalma - wodprep.com/wodprep-masters/
🔗 Work one on one with our Physical Therapists - wodprep.com/injury-rehab-and-prevention/
As an older athlete, I have to do something (foam rolling, stretching, mobility movements) before I can even begin a programmed movement. This wasn't so much the case when I was younger (
"I say whatever works for you, just do it." - we've found something we can all agree on!
One thing we can all agree on is Ben is hilarious. The best athelete-comedian out there. The psoaz kettlebell handle hump clip was priceless. I feel like an amateur for humping the lacross ball on the floor to release my psoaz.
I do find my 30 minute myofacial release routine to be quite a buzz kill on my schedule, so am curious to see if i can ween myself off it someday. At 41, I am already religious about the concept of do the thing, both from the perspective of warming up and gaining a skill. I never do a workout without first "lubing up" my body by doing a lighter version of the thing (or ramping up if going very heavy) and focussing on key elements of technique. From my experience myfacial release does not create any permanent change, it just provides me with temporary symptom relief of my trouble areas that are caused by injuries or imbalances. For my areas that are doing fine it does seem kind of pointless so maybe I'll start there by skipping those. In my experience, my chronic issues are better addressed by strengthening exercises and neuromuscular re-education.
When I started CrossFit my coach told ne : No more stretcing. We Just do 5 minuts od mobility= active squat, shoulder press and snatches with na empty barbell....
I am eternaly grateful for that.
For findidng such a great box and such a great coach.
And all od you at WODPREP
Can't tell U how grateful I am for all od your videos, tutorials and support.
You are the Best 💪
YES! Wish more people knew about this!
Thank you so much, means a lot to hear this!
Mind blown 🤯 I'm still going to use my lacrosse ball but with the understanding that I'm just indulging my short term reward system 😉
The truth is in the middle. "Highly mobile people can perform poorly." Yes, because "perform" is an even more subjective term than "mobile." It's obvious that people with better mobility generally perform better than those without, especially controlling for other factors.
Strength/stability through a range of motion is the goal, but if you take two athletes with the same deadlift and OH press (strength) and have them do an OH squat workout, the one with better hip and shoulder mobility will perform better, often even if they are at a steep absolute strength deficit.
From a functional perspective, it also doesn't necessarily matter if you are literally stretching the tissue or just desensitizing the nervous system. We shouldn't negate the concepts of tissue elasticity or connective integrity. Strength is generated in the nervous system as well, but we don't conclude that there's no reason to develop more contractile tissue. They're independent variables, but highly correlary -- developing one generally affects the other...and they both exist.
Thanks for the comment Stephen! I'm passing this along to the Docs and seeing if they can hop in to comment since I can't handle all the big words. 😅 They will comment soon I hope!
Hey Stephen. Thanks for the comment.
Its tough to say that "people with better mobility generally perform better than those without" let alone it being obvious, especially with mobility and performance being so subjective, like you mentioned. Its more obvious that different people generate different adaptations that allow them to perform better at different goals/tasks that they train for. Those two people with the deadlift and OH press similarities may find that they OH squat differently, but I'm not sure that moving the field goal to overhead squatting shows that one is generally a better physical performer overall. Maybe they would be able to accomplish the OH squat better, but I think we would probably just consider them more skilled in accomplishing that task.
For the functional (yet another subjective term) perspective, I don't think we are negating the concepts of tissue elasticity as we promote that there should be a warm up before training, specific to the task in front of us, which will improve tissue elasticity (ex. empty barbell squats to prepare for barbell squats). Strength is arguably a skill that improves with more exposure, similar to achieving positions or completing tasks. Rather than spend time stretching, spending time exposing oneself to the desired task is likely time better spent.
This is a good read with some nice references to flip through: www.barbellmedicine.com/blog/mobility-explained/
Thanks again for the comment and I hope you find the read helpful.
- Dr. Joe
You've talked about mobility and performance but what about mobity and pain. As an example i have chronic right back/trap/neck stiffness/pain with rounded shoulders. Physio prescribed strengthening exercises but also a pec stretch.
I agree with "do the thing". However, what I think I heard was "with good form". too many of us let out ego rule our head, adding weight before we have mastered "the thing". Good stuff, as usual.
Ah yes... "do the thing with a light weight until you feel like you can move it well" - that would be a better way to phrase it!
I agree it’s not the most important for Mobility, but it does help. For me mobility it’s more about dynamic stretching or isometric contractions and blood flow.
Wow this changed my perspective 👌
So what do we do for sore tight muscles?
Sleep, Hydrate, and eat enough calories. Sore muscles will be sore, and that's OK! Very normal response to training and shouldn't be considered "bad" :)
Gosh I love you guys but In terms of myth 2 regarding stretching, I can tell you personally that my 6 orthopedic surgeons from the top schools and residencies in the world, my 4 outstanding physical therapists I've worked with over the years who have resolved serious muscular problems I've had and hundreds of different medical papers would beg to differ. That’s all I have to say bc otherwise you guys are great. Oh, and the first myth regarding myofascial tissue release I would also disagree with, but I think we agree on the general concept (just not the hard objects issue).
Hey David! I appreciate the comment. I'm not smart enough to respond, so I'll try to pass this to the Physical Therapists!
Hey David. Thanks for the comment. I appreciate the perspective that you bring here as it highlights an unfortunate feeling of "this is how weve always done it" in the medical community that we are trying to move away from. Here are a couple of resources that we recommend perusing through in regard to our views on stretching and mobility. There aren't hundreds of medical papers here, but 145 is nothing to scoff at either.
Resource #1: www.painscience.com/articles/stretching.php
Resource #2: www.barbellmedicine.com/blog/mobility-explained/
I hope you find these helpful. Thanks again for the comment!
- Dr. Joe
Very nice to see dr toni kroos :D
How do we then approach groin/hip impingement? 🥺
Check this video out - ruclips.net/video/qOkZagl_3Mg/видео.html Hope it helps!
I used to do a warm up with an empty bar doing full body compound moves every gym session regardless if it was leg day or arm day. The basic foundations movements, presses, squats, hinges etc.
The military PTI’s said it was wrong and I needed to static stretch before PT sessions. I got so injured over the next decade in the military and my injuries became debilitating as we just did more stretches.
My current physio is awesome. Started today’s session with trap bar deadlifts no weight and deep squats no weight before loading the bar. Doing the exercises we have planned for the day. In over 15 years of physio I’ve never been so fortunate to have a physio like this. I’m stronger for it and my joints are working better.
So some are taking to that last bit quite nicely. We don’t do any stretches at all. My back hurts less, my shoulder is more mobile and I can get deeper in my squats.
So amazing to hear this. Sounds like you have a great physio and you're doing what #science actually shows!
As always, great stuff. Thanks for the pointers 😃
Great info !
Thanks Mildred!
So we shouldn’t ever stretch?
Rather than "stretching", think "active warm-up"... movement > static stretching
I dont think most people do those things to make them better at being prepared for a movement but rather for recovery. Wouldnt these things be very effective for recovery.
Are Ben and CJ standing on 25lbs plates for this one? Joe doesn't look _as_ gigantic this time. I still think there's like a 70% chance he's going to eat one of you after all the recording is done though.
I dug a hole and made Dr. Joe stand in it.
Disagree but can’t win them all