Building a Cedar Fiddle with Plate Tuning
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- Опубликовано: 19 сен 2024
- Decided to build a matching violin to a guitar I'm building. I wanted to share a bit of the plate tuning, too. I am certainly no videographer! I just record little bits and pieces and string them together.
This might be the most beautiful instrument I've ever seen! And it's so cool to have it match the guitar. Very well done! It sounds beautiful.
Thank you very much!
The color is ideal for folk and Celtic music. Very good job.
Jon Mangum, Sir, I must admit that I was going to sleep about three hours ago and here I am in the early hours of the morning still following your videos. I must admit that your method of logical and reason when working really captivated me as you do appreciate the engineering and science behind the instruments which you build. You also have a talent for selecting the woods and how to distribute the thickness to achieve the note which you want. I have never met a musician who enjoys his engineering and building skill as much as he enjoys his music. Heartiest congratulations for your work and It would be wonderful if all schools would amalgamate subjects as you do , for really, art, science, mathematics, engineering and spirtual subjects a ethics and religions are one an the same philosophy when we look at the bigger picture.
I have enjoyed all the videos I saw in the last three hours but it is late and I have to go and sleep !!!
Wow. I don't know what to say! Thankyou...those were some very kind words. I do love the art and aesthetics of the violin, the history, and I am fascinated with the science. We haven't a computer that can calculate the complexities of a 16th century instrument---wrapped in tradition, myth, and mystery.
Thanks so much!
I love your choice of alternate woods.
Thankyou!
Always look forward to when your videos pop up in my feed. Never a bad moment. Great work wonderful attitude. Cedar and Birds Eye.... Congrats!! :-)
Thanks, Seth. Really nice of you to say!
Beautiful Jon great job!!!!
Sounds as beautiful as it looks...very nice indeed. You play very well also, your bow strokes & vibrato are very soulful.
That is awful nice of you to say. Thankyou for such kind words.
such talent,,, ever thought of like a old man carving on end where the scroll is,, like some stradivarius violins,,, well another fantastic job.
I really enjoy your videos. I swear you could turn a wood shipping pallet into a violin :)
Haha, thanks, Rick! I actually thought of trying that!
love that violin,, bet u have made 50 violins in ur day,,,,that birds eye rocks.
That's a nice combination of woods
Great vids mate, bought the art of violin making at your recommend. Excellent book - made many guitars but carving my first back. Looking fwd to tuning!
Very good sound..... Wauw! 🎶🎻
love the violin,,, sounds like a 120 year old violin,,,, in minn we have long winters, i am working on restoring a 120 year old german violin. some fun stuff indeed. dana from minn.
Wonderful!
Beautiful work, bro.
Thankyou :)
you did a amazing job
Thanks for the kind words of encouragement!
Hi John ! Hey Bravo on rescuing your friend outta the dump !! ah? did he fall down in there or what ? hehe... Great Video... Yeah i`m envious.... and your wifes guitar ... what a warm looking guitar..:) Anyhow... i`m enjoying your vids ! Thanks ! And yeah... fiddle looks & Sound`s Great !
Thankyou so much. I'm glad you like the videos!
Nice to see someone making violins out of something other than spruce / maple. I like the look of the lighter sides with a dark top - which makes me wonder my other makes don’t sometimes stain the sides differently to the back and top plate for decorative effect. I’ve made 5 violins so far, all with predominantly Australian woods. I found your video when I was trying to get info about plate tuning - which I’ve never tired, don’t really understand and don’t even know if it is worthwhile. Much of the info on plate tuning I’ve looked at seems to set out to mystify it, I like your down to earth approach - I’m only disappointed the turning stuff was very brief! It was good to see you tune the top plate with the bass-bar fitted - other videos I’ve see have them turn the top plate without the bass-bar in place - which makes no sense to me! It would be awesome if you ever do a specific plate tuning video for dummies, showing how to adjust the plates to achieve what you are looking for. Cheers!
Thanks, Guy -- plate tuning has its merits, especially where I use odd woods. Yes, one can get carried away with it. You can change the voice of the violin with it, and it gives you a good reference point to get the plates to sing in harmony. I have had several requests for plate tuning, so maybe this next violin will give me the opportunity. Email me if you like and I'll try to be helpful. flyinpine at yahoo. com
Thanks Jon, I sent you an email...
thanks, I sent you an email...not sure you received it...
I got your first email and wrote right back.....no more after that one....
hmm, ok, can you resend please, nothing received. guybooth at hotmail dot com
These are absolutely beautiful. Love the channel.
Wow. One of the best videos on YT
I dont know about that! Thankyou for the compliment!!
wow! beautiful!
:) thanks, Jerome
You are one talented guy. Beautiful work man.
Very nice of you to say :)
Thankyou.
Beautiful, Jon!
Thanks alot, Bill!
I had wondered if any one had made violin with cedar top. GOOD VERY INTERESTING!
I found one maker who uses cedar exclusively. It started when I just wanted to be able to practice carving on something easily available. It must be thicknessed quite differently from spruce.
I love the look and the sound!
Thanks, Michael!
Beautiful fingerboard on that violin. I want my fingerboards to be like that when I finally make some violins.
That's very nice of you to say!
@@grandpasmountain Always a pleasure to watch your posts. I think these are an example to all to find a great vocation and be exploring new ideas. I wish I had a workshop like that!
My father's sister was lucky. She married a very 'enterprising?' exceedingly productive man, as you most certainly are, also. ✝️
I like it!
hi Jennifer! Nice to hear from you!
I don't think your microphone does that fiddle justice. They say these million dollar violins sound so much better than cheap ones, but truth be told, a well built violin or fiddle will sound great, and that's final. I'd like to see this in the hands of a master with high quality microphones, just to see your craft really show it's qualities. But, a man can only dream
Thanks for the vote of confidence!
Mr Jon, congratulations for your work. It is very good. I invite you to make electro acoustical violins too. I make musical instruments and I´m making five violins now
Wow! 5 violins. I prefer acoustic instruments over electric. It is fairly easy to add an electric bridge to a fiddle. Sounds like you are very busy!
this one is my favorite! :D
thankyou!
I would love to have one of your builds,aka,art work, 😊
Thanks, Richard!
Another very nice fiddle! And guitars as well. You are just too talented!! What was the name of that second tune you played? Sounds familiar and I can’t think of the name of it.
Thankyou very much! The first tune is a very old one called Archibald McDonald of Keppoch (Scotland).
The second tune is Wayfaring Stranger (Appalachian)
Thankyou for the kind words!
sounds amazing sounds like one of those hundred year old violins
i might get a good kit and make one a 2 year project, maybe
it sounds fantastic.
Thankyou!
Great violin! Do you have a video where you discuss working with the plates to adjust the mode 1 and mode 2? I've seen the one discussing mode 5 and it was very informative.
I’d love to eventually try to make a cedar topped fiddle with local woods, I live in ct so you can find white and red cedar here and I’ve tried carving on a small sample of local red cedar and it’s extremely easy to carve it’s actually easier than spruce, I’ve carved local red spruce into a violin bow and while relatively easy to carve it tore a lot even though I’ve sharpened the tools I was using, I actually thought it was eastern hemlock based upon workability and how it looked at first, maybe I’m just not great at sharpening but I have at max a 1000 grit whetstone , I also like the color that the red cedar here has which is a dark red color cause it make it so you wouldn’t have to use a colored varnish on it to finish the wood unless you wanted to on the top plate. I also like and would love to build Norwegian hardanger fiddles because they sound fantastic
That sounds terrific!
Collect some pieces of wood, and some plans and get started!
What would you like to use for the back plate?
Jon Mangum id probably would try alder with it because I’ve read that cedar can be harsh some times, I’ve read that alder makes a mellow tone and have heard it on some Norwegian fiddles, that plus it’s easy to carve.
You have really come along well. A long ways from where you started.
How many base bars do you put on your guitar?
Thank you Jon.
Good vibes
:)
You can see the bridge (the strings run over the bridge) is on top of the node where the tone generator made the tea leaves gather when the top plate (with f holes) was upside down.
Isn't the violin amazing? Invented about the time Columbus was proving the world was round.....
What is your opinion on how Stradivarius and Guanerius handled plate tuning? Great videos btw.
After making a few violins and experimenting, I would say that they could have used simple tap tuning, because they could hear the Mode 5 clearly. Their asymmetric graduations hint at that.
Funny thing to remember-- ALL Strads and Guarneris have new, longer necks and new bass bars.Also, the angle of the neck has been changed. None sound as they did when made....sooo...who's to say what is the "correct" sound?
I think I remember reading somewhere too that a lot of these violins have also been re-graduated. Man, maybe the old masters didn't know what the heck they were doing. :)
I guess it stands to reason that since modern makers start with the long necks and new bass bars that they should be able to surpass the old violins by getting things "right" from the beginning without having to modify old designs.
The "holy grail" of violin sound is really an illusion of sorts.
On person falls in love with one fiddle, and another believes a different fiddle is far superior -- and that happens with $500,000 fiddles.
In the famous double blind test, modern violins were chosen for sound over Strads. It's on RUclips here somewhere.
Sounds so nice!! :D
What wood is the sides (ribs)?
cool man
Ha! Thanks!
Do you sell, build and sell, commission or something like that, 🙂,,then what would you price,,,, love it, thank you
Good video.
thanks, Felix -- I don't really know what I am doing, haha
Given the roughly carved inside, how do you adjust it to get the right frequence? Or if its too long to explain, where can i read the information you learnt plate tuning from?
Awesome job on this and the others you've finished! i'm midway through a "cornerless" "rib-less" idea i've been attempting for way too long. but i keep going as I am curious the effect that rounded sides will have on the sound as there are no internal corners. I have a bin full of failed attempts as I keep breaking them but have the belly finished on the latest and holding my breath for this next go. Wish I had your patience and skill!
I'd sure love to see what you're working on! There are no internal corners in a violin....it's a guitar shape....and I have seen violins like that...I know you can get good sound with different shapes -- but, ribless? How so? Thanks for the compliments. Shoot me an email flyinpine at yahoo dot com.
Nice work .. what’s the prices start at for a violin ? Or do you not sell them
Nice!
nice
Thanks, Ernie
do you take orders?!?! I think your fiddles look and sound great I've been looking for a better bluegrass fiddle for a while because my current fiddle is a bit to bright for my tastes now that I'm playing more professionally
Hey, James. Sorry...no...most makers would rather not have orders, but have someone fall in love with an instrument first. Go over to my buddies at Fiddlershop.com and have Pierre or Michael set you up -- Pierre is a pro and played professionally. They have great fiddles for good prices and they're set up right.
OK thank you I totally understand and I'll definitely check your friends fiddles out :) thanks and merry making lol
Good deal. Don't be afraid to pick up the phone and give them a call. Super friendly and helpful.
The bass bar breaks sound. If you carve it into wavy shapes it will affect the tone. Your bass bar is very plain. If you make it smaller and more hills than the violin will sound very rich and vibrant. Also western red cedar has less density so it resonates better. The more dense wood the more mass and with more mass the sound cannot travel as fast.
Sorry to disagree, but I have not found what you have said to be true.
I have carved bassbars, removed and recarved, experimenting with length, height, and shape.
The speed of sound is a constant.
Mass would limit what we might call "attack" as the energy tries to vibrate the wood -- more mass would react less.
Too soft, and not enough mass absorbs the energy and produces less sound.
Red Cedar is LESS efficient at transmitting sound than Spruce, therefore, warmer.
@@grandpasmountain I tested my cedar plates and they vibrate stronger than spruce for the same vibration.
Jon, your violin making videos are very inspiring. Where might I be able to obtain the wooden mold that you use when building the garland?
Thankyou. I cut out my own from 3/4" plywood.
I am beginning a series on building a violin from scratch. Maybe it will be helpful!
I hope you get yours started!
Thanks Jon, I will be sure to tune in!
I wonder if the resonant frequencies of the plates change after you glue the body together
Yes it does! There is quite a difference between the resident frequency of a free plate and one that is attached to the Garland.
Jon Mangum Given that, why bother testing free plates?
In the quest for the "ultimate sound", great sounding violins were tested when apart for repairs-- i.e. Stradivaris and Guarneris. A correlation between the tuning of the free plates to each other was discovered. The makers at the time could only have tuned free plates, as they would have done it by ear. We know that having the plates tuned too high, too low, or too far or close from each other produces bad sounding violins.
Very nice!. If my ears don't cheat me, it has really nice basses. Should be because the wood used?. (Sorry my english....:) )
Yes, thankyou!
The Cedar does give a nice dark tone. Cedar sounds warmer than Spruce.
If i tried a red cedarwood for violin it is good?😁😁
Yes. Carve it a little thicker. 4mm on the top plate. Wonderful sound.
have u ever thought of boxelder wood, many trees are hundred years old.
No!
I don't know that I have that here.
zebra wood is so cool also.
Can i use cedar for bow rehairing?(for plugs)
I would not. Too soft. Use something harder like maple, poplar, walnut...a soft hardwood.
Often, the plugs come with the new bow hair.
@@grandpasmountain thank you for sugestion
👍
Rosewood doesn't sound the same as maple, or spruce, or oak.