How job surveillance is changing trucking in America
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- Опубликовано: 19 ноя 2017
- Automation is coming for truckers - but first, they're being watched.
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The promise of self-driving trucks will radically reshape one of America's most common jobs. There are 3.5 million professional drivers in the US, all of whom may face job displacement in the autonomous future being developed by companies like Otto, Daimler, and Tesla. But before robots take the wheel entirely, there will be a long period where truckers and artificial technology split the responsibilities of the work. The first big step toward that future comes in the form of the electronic logging device, a dashboard monitor that tracks speed, location, and a driver's schedule, and reports it to an employer or a third-party monitoring service. It has a lot of truckers worried.
Read Karen Levy's work here:
goo.gl/XHYuvv
goo.gl/BVJWmY
Read the FMCSA's report on ELD safety:
goo.gl/ydYx1R
Read the NAS report on driving fatigue:
goo.gl/VJVZMa
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My dad is a trucker and he’s got a computer in his truck that caps his speed at 62 miles an hour. If you ever see a truck going slow down the interstate in the US, that might not be the driver’s choice.
Governors are nothing new, they've been around for a while, though some older ones could be easily bypassed just by simply clutching in at the top of a hill.
Its always the drivers choice to pull out in that left lane. They choose to hold everyone up.
.....ELDS will make the turtle races worse. Something this didn't cover.
I figured they were being forced to. Gas is expensive. As long as they stick to the right lane, I don't mind.
Well now they are "forced" in the left lane to race the eld clock.
I wish they would force dash cams and front sensors forcing cars to stay at least 3 seconds apart at all times. Our insurance would be sooooooooo much cheaper.
Some trucking companies forced driver facing cams and would look at you while you were sleeping or changing clothes etc...
RiderOmega 62 mph (100 km/h) is pretty fast though. Here in Europe trucks are limited to go 90 km/h or 55 mph, except for Romania where they're allowed to go 70 mph (110 km/h)
I'm quite surprised because in Europe we have that for years! With less driving and work allowed. But it's forbidden here to get paid by the miles, we are paid by the hours.
You probably have more unions too. Republicans have cut the legs off our unions and now we’re paying the price.
Thats the Key, if they would be paid by hour, the Computers would make sense
Oh, there are still protests here even after all these years with ELDs in the EU.
One important difference is Europeans have the option to "overdrive" for an extra hour twice a week. A 5 day week, may I add. This gives that safety net, so you'll never get stuck for 10 hours 5 minutes away from your destination.
If Americans are paid by the hour, it would take a entire day to deliver a container, that would take a paid by mile contractor a hour.
kil koh Thats assuming the worst, not everyone is dishonest
this is one of those "Get comfortable inside the prison we're building around you" videos
how is it a prison? Their are laws for a reason, nobody wants to get flatted by a 18 wheeler because the driver fell asleep after he exceed his work limit. The computers being installed on 18 wheelers report your speed location etc, no employer wants to pay for a speeding ticket or for the employee to go on adventures on company time. But their not gonna be complaining for much longer, automated cars are slowly but surely getting better and better.
@@xxjr8axx how is it a prison? I hope that is rhetorical question.
Yes, there are laws for a reason but sometimes the laws make the reason worse.
Yes, nobody wants to get flatted by a 18 wheeler because the driver fell asleep after he exceed his work limit, but who wants to get flatted by a 18 wheeler because the driver had to drive in order to sustain the mandated "ELD schedule" (else lose money!) when circumstances would be much safer by changing the schedule? Throwing laws at something that is complicated and not even well understood by lawmakers is usually a recipe for disaster.
@@2Truth4Liberty Rhetorical question?go ask someone in maximum security prison if he thinks that someone who willingly choose to be a trucker and can legally quit whenever he wants is in a prison. If the drivers are losing money they should ask for more money or find a new job. Truckers are gonna become extinct probably within 2 decades. Their service is gonna become obsolete like the fabric weaver of the medical era. Companies and consumers want cheaper, faster and more reliable shipping and human operators wont be able to compete with the robots. As an electronics engineering student i cant wait to throw in my 2 cent to the building of these wonders of tech. As for the more useless members of society good luck, your gonna need it.
@@xxjr8axx "ask someone in maximum security prison"?
How about ask someone in a minimum security prison with TV/game room, and guaranteed 3 meals a day and a secure place to sleep every night.
@@xxjr8axx and YOU are not gonna be complaining for much longer either
Regulations always go up. Fines go up. Truck drivers pay stays the same.
All wages do it's ridiculous needs to be a revolt companies make money but share the wealth
That's not fair.
Clearly drivers need to get paid more so they can continue breaking the law for delivery company's bottom lines otherwise how can thous company's afford to pay their works to break the law for them leading to more rules and fines.
Its a vicious cycle and clearly solely all blame is on the government who clearly have no good intentions or idea what their doing when trying to force people who drive for 8+hours consistently on open roads to take breaks.
Besides it's not like the governmentS fliping the Bill's for road repair whenever truckers get into accidents on public roads due to driver negligence and fatigue. Thous responsible belong to only the free market and god so jesus please take the wheel because I'm getting sleepy!!
Form or join a union bro .
@@Davido50 I wish it were that simple
It's a low-requirement job. Obviously, the more people u have for a job the lower the pay.
Hey, I'm 5 minutes from your location, but I've got to stop. See you in 10 hours.
cjxgraphics today is 5, tomorrow is 15
I usually go over my time in that case, driver leader says 2-3 times a month going over is ok. Anymore and they tell me to take a class lol
Where do you drive? In the USA?
In Europe if you drive more hours than it's allowed then the police in whatever country you're driving in at the moment can ticket you for the following 2 weeks because it stays recorded in your driver's card. So let's say you drive 15 minutes over your daily time in the Netherlands and you drive to Spain then if you are stopped by the Spanish police they can ticket you for that violation even though it wasn't commited in that country. Crazy, right?
BeMoto Same deal, I just try not to get pulled over and gotta watch out for DOT in the weigh stations/rest areas.
Edit: yeah US
cjxgraphics so true. ELD’s are bs
Oh, its simple. Just pay them by the hours not per mile...
exactly, but that would give them 30 hours per week of OT.
the industry from the employers side wouldn't want that.
When I drove I noticed all the hourly paying jobs get taken asap.
Many companies already do that. Especially in California where the traffic is bad.
Prior to ELD's I don't know one (over the road) trucker who wanted to be paid by the hour. It cost them money, but now yes hourly might be better, but which hours do you pay for? Driving? Stopped in traffic? Waiting on a load? Etc etc
Ya so I can pullover and sleep and get paid for it.
The American dream not to work but earn
@@alexanderberry3199 Well it easy to tell if you did that. If GPS says you are not moving and Google says there is no traffic then you are clocked out. I can understand there are ways you could cheat, but get caught once and get fired and black balled
I've never driven tired when I was on paper logs. When I was on the ELD, I was EXHAUSTED EVERY DAY
Mr. Ed all that sitting around
Why? What'd you do differently?
Truckers are the backbone of this country and economy, if truckers stop trucking everything will collapse
And that is... The Truth.
Gabriel Huang but as of now we need them
@@projectdvan4568 self driving trucks are still years away so if all truck drivers quit then most of the economy would be shut down by then
Automation is a thing
That’s why JFK and RFK wanted to get rid of Jimmy Hoffa.
I'm a trucker. I like the ELD in that I don't have to do the paper work. ELD don't really change anything according to the law.
However, the real issue that we have are the hours. Just like the drivers are saying in the video, once we start the truck, we HAVE to run whether we're tired or not.
If they make it looser such as " drivers can only drive 12 hours a day TOTAL regardless of when". Then if we need to pull over and sleep a few hours, we can do it.
In the UK you get fined for driving while tired
Eric Dumke. Right
At first I thought the driving time is the total driving time. Which makes more sense to me.
agreed i got family who do trucking and i know not being able to take a break if they need it would be hell.
I think you're right Eric, the trucker should be able to take a break whenever he needs to, that's most important. The number of hours isn't the problem, it's the truckers control over when he/she gets those hours in on their own schedule that is the problem. I'm all for the truckers. Corporations are making record profits and don't share those profits with the people bringing that money in.
I stopped driving a truck because of the camera they wanted to put in the cab- I live in there, so no.
Here all buses, subways, taxis and kindergartens/primary/secondary schools are required to have cameras and cameras watch andtrack all people at all 5m distance. 1 camera controls 4 people.
scared they might catch ya doing the naughty ;)
no they are just making sure your still alive
@EpiDemic117 if there is an attack on the driver than the video may help catch the guy
@@pray7056 lol if you believe that
And they wonder why there is a shortage of drivers
@Dee Bro 🤯
no such thing..
There's a shortage because the work stinks and the pay stinks.
worker abuse turns people away.
Make the people who make these RULES ride in a truck for a week so they can see first hand why it's a bad idea
I agree driver
yup all regulations need to be tested first on the lawmakers' hide
I'm so glad I had to leave this business; I developed more physical problems on this job than any other. That's not blaming the job, just an observation. As far as the surveillance issue: I worked with qualcomm onboard from day 1. When I went to work as a contractor with my own truck, I was leashed to the cell phone. I actually had clients call me and ask why I was stopped while fueling and feeding, true story. It only got worse. I miss travelling and delivering products- I liked knowing I was providing for a region when delivering food stuffs, or getting a production's stage set to its location on time. I don't miss seeing endless corn fields. :-D I do miss bringing my kid and calling him to the front so I could say LOOK, CORN!! though. My heart goes out to those on The Big Road. Be glad for me, good ol' "Sparky" found out he had a brain and is on honor roll in college, making us "dumb drivers" proud! Keep the dirty side down!
Glad I got out before the tech made the job less fun. As a dock worker the company the brought in a efficiency company. One guy told me that it should take 22 minutes to unload a trailer. Shut off forklift and asked him to show me. Of course he had never drove a forklift. Informed him he not wearing safety shoes and he had to leave the dock. The last place we only had a bar code sticker with skid count and section # . Sometimes a 10 skid shipment would end up on 3 different trailers. Seen more damage in 4 months that what I did personally over 30 years! The only last good job in trucking now is to shunt! So glad to be in the last "15" years of work life and not at the start of it !
I want to start driving trucks long haul cross country.
I’m 29, had my CDL for 4 years and am apart of the current ELD switch that went into mandate this week. I understand it from both sides of the isle. I want to be as safe and as rested as possible for my drive every time I get behind the wheel but I don’t feel like ELDs make me a “safer driver”. Better work/life balance and a better quality of life will do those things. We are poorly represented legally but responsible for 70% of the U.S. Distribution of goods. Poorly compensated. And if truck drivers were to unionize and not hit the road for 48 hours, everything in this country would grind to a halt. With that amount of reliance of industry, the conversation and changes need to be heard and dealt.
Michael Musashi I don’t believe so. The work doesn’t disappear. The only way to be heard today, is by getting in the pockets of shareholders and companies. Being democratic about it has gotten this industry nothing. I love my job. I like driving. I want this industry to grow and become safer, smarter and I want wages to grow with it. But it won’t being led by worrying about the company and shareholders. Because they don’t care about us drivers
You say you have no union. What ever happened to the Teamster's Union? I thought they had the lock on commercial truck driving in the U.S.
Jeff Foehringer
They pretty much died out when the large companies started the CDL mills with clauses in their contracts stating that if you were to join a union then you can be fired at any time without recourse.
Lawyers and big trucking companies are like the helix in a strand of DNA, so tight that it takes years to get anywhere.
JUST FKIN DO IT ! bezos making bilions on you guyz.... show em what you can do !
Just accept your pay
The ELDs actually seem like a good idea. The problem is the trucking rules. Drivers should be allowed to drive 10 hours in one day, not 10 hours in one stretch! That will make driving much more flexible.
that and get rid of the pay by mile scale for better salaries but cut back on the ELD system
Good point
Have you ever driven a truck cuz I have I've done over over 250000 Mi safely if you've never driven a truck don't put a comment up here and you don't drive 10 hours every day you have up to 11 hours a day driving with a full 14-hour clock for the day of on duty time and you don't do the 11 hours straight you have to drive either 8 hours do a 30 minute break or somehow work you 30 minute break in before you ate our clock is up then you have to take that break so either way you don't do no straight driving for the entire day
Why not 10 hours in a day? I'm not even a trucker and I've done 16 hour days driving before, it's not that hard
@KRYMauL do you drive a truck that requires electronic logs cuz I do for a living and I have a 11 hours to drive and a 14-hour clock every drive shift I do everyday so if you do not know what you're talkin about please be quiet and quit putting words in other people's mouths it is unsanitary oh yeah and for the week I have 70 hours after my 70 hours is up I can either run my 8th day game what I get on the 8th day if not I have to sit for 34 hours to regain my 70-hour clock back so I start off fresh
Interesting to see so many Sikh truck drivers at the rally. Does this group account for a large proportion of American truckers?
That’s a really good observation I don’t have an answer tho
They're a big part of trucking in India so I'd assume some of them continue to work the same job in US
Abhishek Soni I think the same
I think sikhs culturally have strong union membership
I know that the Sikh community is big in trucking in Canada. I wouldn't be surprised if it was the same in the US.
I worked as a Personal Shopper once and my employer tracked everything in my working day, from length of break to how much I'd worked and its awful to feel like you've always got someone watching over you and worse - the lack of trust that you'll do the right thing. On top of that you were expected to work a 12 hour shift with a 15 minute break (including toilet breaks). And when you got physically exhausted during your shift you'd get management whining at me because my pick rate had fallen. That job was the definition of dystopia. For truckers that must be so much worse.
What's a personal shooper?
joan Alonso - a personal shopper is someone who basically does shopping for other people from a shop or supermarket so that it can be delivered to them or picked up directly from the store.
Chris Campbell - nah it was a British company ASDA, its owned by Wallmart - I hear Amazon is really bad though
Thomas Owusu-Abayie - Well I believe you can have effective Capitalism while also looking after your employees and valuing them. I hate the whole model that efficiency is more important than humanity. but yeah you are right.
Nah it wasn't a zero hour contract but basically they threatened to fire me if I didn't coming in sometimes. Like also they wouldn't let me leave when I was contracted to. I think they eventually backed down after a law suit was threatened, but that was after I'd left that hellhole.
It seems to me that the real problem is how truckers are paid: by the mile.
This incentivizes fast speeds and long hours - after all, if you're being paid by the mile, then the sooner you get the goods across the miles, the sooner you can take another job, and make more money.
Yet, there are limits on speed and time spent driving, so truckers have to make the choice to break laws in order to make a profit. And the more they break the law, the greater the profit they're able to make.
What would the problem be to changing the pay of truckers to a salary model - with expectations of days worked, rather than miles on the road?
That way, goods could be shipped more safely, since the trucker could take breaks on the way as needed, and not feel the need to artificially take a break that wasn't needed.
There'd need to be some negotiating of what salaries made sense - and how they would be paid - but I think that the solution must rely on moving away from a paid-by-mile system in any case.
Lucus Levy Keppel also not required by federal law to pay overtime, holiday pay, Sunday pay or minimum wage.
Exactly right I'm a mechanice and our flat rate system breeds it's own unique sets of problems and of course dishonesty.
Can trucks even break speed limits? Like physically is that even possible
Blanco if i wanted to my truck will do 95 mph with a load
Lucus Levy Keppel and on to this subject I personally love being paid by the mile as well i also love the ELD. When i was a kid my dad was a driver and he would drive for way past what the legal limit is and it would put un needed stress and fatigue on him. And the reason he could do this was because the log books could be falsified. Now with this new system it’s essentially 14 on 10 off. And going on the pay rate out of California the speed limit for trucks is the same for cars. If i set my cruise to 75 MPH i can do 750-800 miles a day, which in turn nets the truck approximately 12-1300 dollars per day. They way the paid per mile benefits me is because i own my own truck and if i was to get paid a hourly or salary its would be a absolutely ridiculous number, and would wind up raising the prices on shipping good which in-turn fall on the consumer. Honestly i have absolutely no problem with the amount of money i take home and as well i take a 3 week vacation every year. The way having a salary or hourly helps is when we get into company drivers, so the people who drive the company trucks they are almost all on a hourly rate already because they dont have to worry about maintenance or fuel
I drove OTR for 18 years and when the E-Logs started, I could see the smoke on the horizon and got out of the industry. Unless or until the matters of parking as well as shippers and receivers stealing your hours by forcing you to wait hours upon hours to load or unload is addressed, drivers will continue to get screwed 8 ways from Sunday.
the problem is not e-logs, its that no one respects the drivers in the business side. you can not drive 11 hrs a day, without any breaks and live a healthy life. the problem is your pay has been deducted at so company's can increase their profit margin at your expense
I’d quit immediately if they mandated that. People don’t understand the morale kill of surveillance
You can say that again. I've done everything from short haul to school bus (I'm retired now). The last job I had driving paratransit, and they monitored everything. Let's just say I found it to be pretty intrusive. Yes, workers need some kind of supervision, but nobody wants to work with someone constantly peering over your shoulder.
Realistically the most pressing issue for truckers came up in only the last 30 seconds of this video. Truckers just aren’t paid enough for their work. My grandfather, who has raised me and my siblings for almost half of my life, has been a trucker for nearly 40 years now. He wakes up at 3 AM, leaves the house by 3:45, and doesn’t get home until around 6 PM every single weekday. Over his near 40 years of working for the same company, he’s received several pay raises, now earning nearly 1.5 times as much as new recruits to the job, and currently makes around $68,000 a year. If we spread out his holiday bonus to the rest of his paychecks throughout the year, that would amount to ~$18.68/hr. And that’s after 40 fricken years of service. In stark contrast to this, straight out of high school I was able to get a job that pays $15.38/hr, and I get better health benefits, get to work inside, and only have to work from 7:30 to 4. I feel that the reform we need to be focusing on isn’t whether or not truckers are being tracked, because as my grandpa put it “if they’re doing they’re job right, they don’t need to worry about it”, but rather the amount of pay they get for all the work they do.
darren trivedi 👍
where tf u work at
Wow, Thank you for sharing. I was making 20 bucks an hour inputting numbers into a database 10 years ago. Your grandfather is a good man for working so hard and long for his family, I'm sorry his company didn't feel the need to pay him an honest wage.
darren trivedi Yea what I gathered from this video is that before this big brother tech truck drivers would forge the log book and drive more than what was safe in a day to make sure they could cram as many miles in as possible and earn more money. While invasive and annoying they seem to be focusing their anger at the wrong issue. They really should be getting compensation not by by miles but by salary.
The open market values goods and services depending on supply and demand. If there really were not enough truckers, or their services were extremely valuable, they might be paid better. But this seems to be the case with all "simple" jobs, by which I mean jobs that do not require complex training. If there's a huge influx of people into the field, and low barriers to entry, of course prices and thus wages will go down. Only solution to this is finding a niche where your skills are still valuable and still create that value beyond what is easily obtainable at low prices.
Truck drivers absorb all the inefficiencies of the logistics chain which they pay for with their personal time and lost wages. We must change how drivers are paid, teach lane discipline to 4 wheelers, make sure drivers are paid for sitting in traffic, waiting to load/unload at shippers/receivers and end poorly planned, timed and executed roadwork.
Also to make sure drivers are FORCED to manage fatigue to not have them kill others.
Well said Joe
And world peace!
Hyperloop is gonna change everything!
One word! Union
One advantage electronic logs offer is that companies can't force drivers to violate their hours of service like they used to. One disadvantage is that drivers are now having to rush more to get their miles and find a place to park. We need more parking above all else.
All of that is true.
But I think the video (and the whole debate) is missing a crucial part of the discussion: Why are drivers paid by miles driven and not by hours? In earlier days: Sure, they might sleep 14 hours and then tell their boss that more was just not possible and cash in. But today? The ELD logs everything. So if the boss asks why you didn't get your miles in when being paid to drive for 11 hours, you give him the ELD and say: See where I drove slow and compare it to other trucks. Do they all drive slow there? Contruction? Traffic jam? etc.
Point being: Surveilance is GOOD for the drivers (and not disadvantageous to the companies) if you pay them by the hour.
(Ofcourse this loads the usual roadside risks [weather, traffic, breakdowns, etc.] on the companies shoulders. But since they promised the delivery date, maybe they SHOULD be taking - and calculating - the risks, no?)
you can still cheat them in canada anyways, as long as the system isnt hooked up to gps which is usually the most expensive part of the system, meaning most companies wont pay for it, its all i hear about from drivers, just stay away from the large compainies and you can drive as long as you want
Parking already takes up a shot tone of urban planning space, we don't need more parking. We need better parking.
In Europe truckers have a quoter of longer days they can use if needed. So you have 10 hour days, but three times a fortnight you can do an 11 hour day.
This gives flexibility and control to the drivers
Start paying the driver by the hour period. To me is nonsense that they are being paid by the mile, pushing drivers to rush an cover as much in little time.
All the details boil down to how companies have been treating their drivers lately. If you look at what deregulation has done to the industry; the companies that exploit their drivers en masse, and look at the huge turnover rate in this industry, one can summarize that private enterprise has corrupted the entire system and has made surveillance the bread and butter to their day to day operations.
Hey, Kevin...
You are the only person in the few dozen or so comments I've read to throw that word, "deregulation," into the discussion.
That is indeed the entirety of this "debate". Everything else is quibbling over those details that followed to where trucking is now, very much like listening to a CB radio, hour after hour.
You stay safe and be well.
I was driving back in the 80s when the trucking industry was deregulated. Watched the nationwide line-haul network dissolve as one common carrier after another went belly up and hundreds of thousands of good paying union driving jobs (including mine) disappeared. As a union driver, I was paid for every hour I was on the clock. Most of us had jobs that got us home every night or every other night. Used to be a good middle-class career. Now, like the book title says it’s a “sweatshop on wheels.
i'm a truck driver , been driving for years . the reason these truckers don't want the e logs is so they can run how ever many hours they can , pure and simple . why because the unions are gone and the shipping companies pay dogshit rates . they all fight each other instead of standing as one . I get paid by the hour , time and half after 8 . if they all got paid like that we wouldn't have a problem . the lady in the video explaining this is 100% correct .
direct998
Can you imagine for a moment how much common goods would cost if long haul trucker were paid by the hour?
And ton mile rates have messed alot of the freight base rates up.
As well as desperate people willing to haul for virtually nothing.
As for logging illegally, it's not that I want to
But sometimes it's best to have the flexibility to stay off the road during peak hours, or say go over three mountain passes and get to a safe place to park.
Rather than have undue pressure to perform .....because that number is getting smaller by the minute, making you go faster than you should.
I have used elds in the past, and paper logs for numerous decades.
And I don't like either
I'd rather use a -1 form and drive when I feel safe to do so.
Licenced driver since 87' no violations or accidents.
I don't care how many miles I've covered
Your just a steering wheel holder. Not the one who has to go weeks away from home like me
Not by much. I don't know about US, but in Europe it costs about ~1 EUR per km on average for delivery while goods are valued in tens of thousands of euros. So if the cargos worth is 50 000 EUR(which is fairly low end) and you have to deliver 2000km(which is very high end km for delivery) the freight cost is only 4%
nismo510 but then they're a risk to others and themselves. Like paying a disposal company if it wasn't regulated, they would take the easy way and dump waste straight into the river. In turn, many drivers would take stimulants and drive as far as possible as fast as possible, no matter the risk to others.
Toggle of Baelgun
So you are proud to take it in the shorts by the trucking companies because you are a rugged individual . The problem started when trucking was deregulated and it pitted poorly educated drivers like you against equally stupid drivers in a race to the bottom . You won , dumbass
I thing Karen Levy from Cornell University has spotted the major problem, you can not solve the unfair payment that workers receive with technology.
A problem in every single country and in almost all works. Great video Vox and greetings to Karen.
We need to switch over from cpm to an hourly rate.
Actually pay per load with added inconvenience pay (waiting fees, dry run, etc) works best. CPM & hourly gets milked hard but pay per load keeps truckers honest while the inconvenience pay keeps the pay fair.
Hourly rate decreases the efficiency of truckers. This is not at all sensible
Hourly rate is comming
@@MagicHamsta Unless it's winter time in certain areas where you are inevitably slowed down and make less.
I would work for 100 dollar an hour
y’all should check out Andrew Yang. he’s the only 2020 nominee talking about this issue.
This is one of the main reasons I quit driving after 20+ years. You literally have a camera in the trucks along with the eld, and you have zero privacy. It videos you continuously. If you hit a bump, swerve, stop suddenly, or anything sudden; it will send footage from the seconds preceding the event n post event to your company safety guy. So whatever you were doing or saying during that event gets seen by not only the people paid to monitor these things at the company who provides the service, but your employers see it as well. It’s rather invasive. So if your pressed for time n your eating a snack while driving, to keep from losing precious time by stopping; that can be seen as a safety issue, and potentially get you pulled in the office. I had one friend who kept himself up at night by rapping. He was fired twice for talking on the phone. The safety guy thought he had a hands free device talking on the phone while driving. He lost work, and had to bring in phone records to show proof he wasn’t on the phone both times to get his job back. No compensation for neither time & money lost, nor money spent.
THANK YOU! SOMEONE WHO CAN USE THEIR BRAIN!
one driver I know objected to the camera watching him drive so he drove naked at night with scales closed and masturbated for the camera, with a 12 year accident free record, firing him would be stupid so the turned the camera toward the hood.
Anthony Hawkins someone gets paid to watch me adjust my balls , sicko
Cameras on roads with major potholes , there's always an unlimited fund for surveillance ? ask Venezuela how that works out . Privacy has its own priceless value / function . Trucking is one of the loneliest jobs , but the trade-off was the privacy, that was an attractive feature for many , it'll be tougher to get drivers
This country magically has unlimited $ for the wierdest things , but has to fight to fund the corrupted essentials
I am a retired driver with 2.5 millions miles in the saddle..
It has always been this way, drivers being pushed by Fleet
Managers to haul more and more freight and not
recognizing that the driver is human and has needs
beyond the JOB he's doing..
In spite of regulations trucking companies will constantly
push drivers, especially the younger drivers who don't
know better to haul that freight or get fired which is
coercion and highly illegal..
Companies can not threaten any driver with termination
for not taking a load because of the hours of service regs..
If the driver does not have the hours to do that job he
should say so up front, and refuse to move that rig until
he has the hours to do so......
we are not Humans and can be exploited....because we have to the bills.............we dont stand up for ourselves.
I left the montn ELD became mandatory, lucky for me I have experience in Electronics and Pharmaceuticals, I will never go bsck to trucking, unsafe, unhealthy, lonely, stressful, disrespected by everyone, ( shippers, receivers, DOT, Troopers, dispatchers) and now with the electronic logs , less money, more waiting time, the list goes on. F- That.,
Every word you said is true.
You write like you failed 7th grade!
@@yashveer1x Your short comment tells me you can't write much, you probably didn't get passed 5th grade.
Thank you for your service. I wish you the best.
When employers try to save couple bucks in this case thousands they will lose loyal workers. Good luck.
Seems to me like the device is meant to decrease driver fatigue and improve general work conditions but in reality is doing the exact opposite. Technology is not the problem here, it is the people making laws about something they have no idea about.
Exactly the law was the culprit all along. The device only allowed proper enforcement of a bad law. A more sensible law is the answer here. Though it doesn't answer the privacy issue
Honestly thies things arnt bad its how they micro manage people if you are tired or if you drove your truck to get repaired and then went to sleep for a while before getting your truck back and start your day it dosent know how to manage i think it should just be a logger see the drivers style and let the driver write there log book on paper so when they to to inspection stations they can be compaired between the written log and the eld
Right. It's a good thing in PRINCIPLE. It's not PRACTICAL.
It doesn't work for all applications equally.
Trucking is not one size fits all.
So many different modes. Livestock.. LTL.. seasonal farming, etc.
Trucking is a ruff trade to get into everybody is trying to rip off the driver .
Cameron Williams especially the Big wig CEOs
the drivers essentially volunteer to be ripped off...
Pay per mile is stupid and dangerous.
F Huber now a days yes but remeber this was adopted back before you or me where born there was no regulations so these guys floored it and ran hard and it made sense for them but now days its a bad idea for drivers.
Cameron Williams, you are just slightly off mark...everyone not trying to rip off drivers...they ARE ripping off drivers. From truckstops to the boardroom.
It's not really unique just to trucking. Any industry that has salaried people has the same problem really. In one form or another.
Well, the guys on the top are not willing to slash their salaries to pay more for their employees. Sure there are some whom will be fine with that but for the most they wouldn't want to. If I am rich. I don't necessarily want to lose my wealth. So then that increase in benefits for any inudstry's employees that cost will be passed on to the customers. Inevitably one way or another and those customers are us and we must be willing to pay more for them to have a better life. Which we don't want either. Not because we are just as selfish but most of us probably more or less belong within the same wage group as the truckers. So at the end of the day some one has to foot the bill. The question is who and since money runs the world, it's gonna be very hard to fight against the big shots.
The tobacco industry as an example, their net worth is literally higher than the GDP of a bunch of countries in the world. John Oliver did a segment on that and they have the ability to make a country go into bankruptcy for not listening to them. Not even through blackmail but just by dragging them to an expensive legal law suit that they can't afford.
Even if you tighten the rules on big shots, they could simply decide to not entertain everyone anymore and just shut down the industry for all they care and it will take time for some one else to pick up from where they left off.
The best solution is probably tightening laws on those that have money but you gonna have to get some one with the balls to do it in legislation and as long money is involved with politics and political parties...then it's pretty much a dead end.
Speaking as a CDL driver. I drive charter buses, not trucks, so hours of service laws are a bit different for me. I see two common threads in the ELD debate.
#1 the vast majority of complaints are coming from older drivers who simply don't want to switch to a new technology. When this comment was posted I was in my early 30's and I find the ELD's a huge improvement from paper logs. Much easier to fill out and keep track of since the ELD automatically logs a lot of things for you. Its only the older folks that can't figure out how to use the new ELD's that have an issue with them, folks that figure them out generally like them in my experience. The whole reason for the ELD mandate was that too many drivers were falsifying them, which leads me to #2.
#2 the really big one, the issue isn't drivers, its companies exploiting their workers. Paying by the mile/load is simply a way for the company to pay their driver as little as possible. Me, I get paid by the hour. So if I run into traffic or bad weather, my incentive is to consider safety first, since I still get paid even if I arrive late, or can only make one trip instead of two. The example of a driver 20 minutes away from home and out of hours is most likely because the company scheduled them to drive for exactly 10/11 hours and didn't give them any leeway. Instead of protesting regulations that are in place TO MAKE THE ROADS SAFER I wish these drivers would protest the companies that are taking advantage of them.
NO WONDER THERE'S A DRIVER SHORTAGE. I'M GLAD I'M OUT OF IT
how about getting paid per hour like everybody and not per mile.
Trucker drivers would make more money, companies of course don't want this.
Go local after a year
since when the number of hours somebody work translates into actual results. Diferent truckers can cover different amount of miles during the same time. The one who covered less ground doenst deserve thhe same amount
Depends what you do. Some companies pay per hour but you'll be local. Tankers get paid by how much they drop
If truckers got paid by hour, why wouldn't they drive 55 and take the scenic routes?
Government demanding that truckers take breaks and mandated sleep times, yet rest areas are being closed and most truck stops are far too small for very many trucks to be in at any one time. Look at the Federal labor code and you will find that truck drivers are not protected by wage and work laws. Listed as workers that are governed by log book laws. A system that often abused by trucking companies. Worse yet is the growth of freight brokerage companies that don't have any capasity to move freight. Just solicit freight services and then shift the carriage of freight to an actual trucking company to take the risk of moving freight. The freight brokerage often times demands a 75% cut of the entire amount paid by the customer shipping the freight. Yet another way the guy actually doing the job is cheated of the fruits of their labor. Stop the corruption of freight brokerage agents by mandating any entity in the business of moving freight must have the actual assets to move the freight. Many times freight is re-brokered so much, with constant fees removed from the original freight cost by the sender, there is nothing left for the guy that is actually moving the freight. Want safety? Take a good long look at the amount of unscrupulous business practices of freight brokerage companies. Put them out of business.
❤️This
Come on over to ohio, governor is set on closing rest areas. Get a ticket parking on a ramp. next time your parents take a trip they'll have to s#%% in a ditch.
I’ve been on the dispatch/management side of this for 20 years. MAKE NO MISTAKE ABOUT IT: THIS IS 10000% ABOUT NOT BEING ABLE TO “FUDGE” THE LOGS. PERIOD.
I drive a truck in Europe. I have a camera pointing at me a box measuring my braking and driving style, plus I’m being monitored by a tracker. As of August I am no longer a trucker they can stick it.
It's great to see people from different culture getting together fighting for the same purpose. (That's awesome)
I noticed that too, it doesn't matter their race or religion, they're all unified by trucking, and fighting for the same thing
Trucking is a popular choice of profession among Sikhs in India too.
fkin Human yeah it's cool. Alot of different races and stuff choose truck driving because they can't work at a office or like a "good" job and then truck driving is the best thing close that would make good money.
Um, that's not the case....
Please, once the problem is solved, they would back at it again with killing and blaming each other.
I don't know what make of the trucker issue, but 8:35 seeing a rural white trucker stand side by a brown Sikh wearing a turban is just the kind of unity we need to see these days...
why would u think a rual white dude would have a problem with it why is it so amazing to realize people arent like the msm told u shocker next u will tell us how suprised u were to see the skys blue
@@MrEvilsurpent Didnt rural white people start racism?
@mickey7411 But I mean whenever there is a fight somebody started it. That's what I'm asking like who started it ? Ya know
@mickey7411 Actually humanity did originate in Africa but not in the way that Black supremacist like to talk about.
@@johnnyparsons4702 Xenophobia stems from difference. It's a natural adeptation for surving in a herd.
"Humans are primitive beast who live in a modern world that's not created for them."
No mention of companies limiting top speed, which effectively controls the drivers time. You have this many miles, and this time frame to do it in... oh and to improve our profit ten under the speed limit.
Yep and hey it's winter time, your Christmas gift is essentially a pay cut via bad weather and slower traffic
enjoy!
Ya in cali the speed limit if you are hauling anything what so ever is 55
Often times I’d love to take a nap and wait for rush hour traffic to ease up but if I do that I won’t have enough time to make it back home. The people who are making these rules work from behind a computer and never been behind the wheel of a truck
I've never thought before that a Sikh trucker with his turban and aviator sunglasses could be that badass!
Oğulcan ACAR then your an idiot..
i never saw a sikh trucker, it's just normal. and, "you're". educate yourself.
Maybe you should stop underestimating people then.
@@headphonic8 why are you so mad?
Stop lowering the prices on the loads & they would t need to over work
Ronnie Cardoso 👍
so true
load prices are very sensitive, if you have even one guy willing to turn and burn, he will throw off an entire market. Here in Toronto there are PLENTY of guys willing to do that
You mean PLENTY of new Canadians
Agreed! Im a company driver making .52 loaded and .47 empty. 50% of my miles are empty. I average 2800 miles a week. Since I run less than 3k miles a week, I never have to reset. These owner ops and small fleets are at fault for under bidding, and needing to run illegal.
If Americans truckers would be content to live on less than they make, they wouldnt be stressed with the ELD mandate.
Im in my mid 40's and will FULLY retire DEBT FREE in 5 more years. Im making more with ELD, than I did while running paper. ELD just forces you to be efficient and plan your trips better. If I run into bad weather, I shut down and try again in the morning. My life is not worth what Im hauling.
The only guys in my company crying about the ELD are the ones making a $900 a month payment on a pickup that sits 3 weeks out of the month.
The guys hauling cheap freight did it to themselves. My company is one of the most expensive carriers in the country. Due to "just in time freight", we have never been busier in the 55 years my company has been in business.
In Europe all trucks already have digital datarecorders which record on a truckers personal card. Rules also that limit daily driving to 9 hours with obligatory 45 min break somewhere between.
Do the drivers get paid by mille there?
@@chuasmare22 It depends on the company, in some you get paid by km in some you get payed by the amount of days spent on the road while in other you have fixed salary. And the digital cards truckers have record up to 29 days so if you get stopped by a police and you have made a mistake in the past 29 days they can write you a ticket, both you and your company.
My job tracks me as I deliver and even lets them know when I’m on my phone , I feel that’s intrusive but I get some people text and drive but I like to look at my phone when I can to make my day go by but not on the road.
Yeah, there's no overtime pay, I'll do 70 hr weeks and still make base pay. And if I'm supposed to get up at 6 for work and the roads aren't plowed, I'm sitting here until they are. That log just tells us no matter the conditions, we have to be moving at this time if we want a paycheck.
That doesn't sound like a problem with technology tracking you but with the rules it is enforcing no?
Techno Magician and your life when I can't stop in rough weather. You like seeing people die in traffic? Because that is what you implied.
That isn't the technologies fault though, that is the fault of the employment system you signed up to, fight against that. Fight for a wage that isn't impacted for taking breaks in those conditions. The fact that technology is forcing you to follow the rules that are currently in place is a good thing, you should be following the rules that are in place, if something is wrong it's with the rules, not with the thing making you follow the rules.
Techno Magician yeah most of us do follow the regulations. The problem is not the technology (I personally hate hand written logs as I have poor handwriting skills) but how the technology forces us into unfavorable and unsafe conditions if we want to keep our jobs or make a half decent paycheck.
Techno Magician private companies do not just hire drivers, they ask the gov if its okay to hire us. The amount of power jj Keller, insurance companies, and dot have over the industry is disgusting.
From the first minute i knew what the root of the problem was. Sadly they don't fight for a fair pay just against the new technology...
Der Aero I thought trucker was one of the most payed job that you dont need a College Degree for?
Der Aero May be they just like the job? It looks like its hard for some people to realize that money is not everything- they don't want better loans, they want to keep their jobs.
Apparently they still need to work overtime and falsify their records to receive a good paycheck. This shouldn't have to be the case.
Maybe they do. I didn't say anything against that. But wouldn't everyone benifit if Truck drivers are not fatigued, because they have to work overtime and thus drive safely? A fair pay would stop putting so much pressure on them. Noone will risk their safety if they don't have to.
Humans are the problems. We are solving the problems with technology, which is better than human would ever be. That's the reality of it. Heck, even internet are better than your family member right now.
This kind of surveillance is happening everywhere. I remember working as a manager in fast food and the upper management in their offices would watch us in our stores to see how we're doing. I even had a general manager who called us to micro manage us when he saw something through the cameras.
My day 2 day life lol
I was never a manager but I did work in fast food it was the graveyard shift and there would be 3 people 2 not including the sleeping manager who'd occasionally wake up to watch tv the supervisor would call to tell the manager to tell at me for not cleaning when dealing with customers or vise versa
I’m not even done watching the video but that focus pull at 2:10 for the graph is a genius way to edit that.
Its not the privacy invasion which bothers the truckers, its the loss of flexibility.
Thanks Vox. There's still a lot of nuance and concerns you didn't get to but as much as you covered in as short a time, without vilifying truckers, this is the best mainstream coverage of the issue I've seen so far.
need an updated video on this topic
One thirty-minute break for 11 hours of driving? That's insane
A few weeks ago, I came out to my car parked on the city street to see a truck double parked blocking a number of cars including my own. I walked over to the cab to find two guys just sitting there while their truck blocked an entire lane of traffic and my car, so I politely asked them to move the truck up 10 feet so I could get my car out and they refused! The guy pointed to a device and said he couldn't start the truck for another 15 minutes or he'd get in trouble. This is such a messed up world that they were required by law to block traffic and piss me off any longer than they had to. I sat in my car fuming for the 15 minutes until he could finally move. I couldn't for the life of me understand how this could possibly be a law but now I see this video and I guess the dude wasn't bullshitting me haha. Intrusive government regulations like this affect all of our daily lives in one way or another and it's quite frankly obnoxious. Gah why is the world like this??? /end rant
The problem is not the tech itself, some ELD's will allow you to roll at 15 MPH so this situation would never happen. But to be honest that trucker is an irresponsible idiot.
He was probably very close to parking but had cut himself a few seconds to short
Have you seen the fine for double parking? I think it would have been cheaper to move than get caught double parked
depends on if we would have got points otherwise
yeah wait till ur sitting in the shoulder of an eit ramp then tell me who is irresponsible u cant control the traffic flow around u and this is what can and will cause delays ur ability to think criticly is lacking this is why u love the eld ur in ability to think for urself is offset my a machine that thinks for u good luck to u
While I agree that ELD's are extremely intrusive to ones privacy, not all truckers are responsible and rest when they should. This isn't employees messing around in the bathroom, these guys can put peoples lives at risk. A month ago, a nurse was coming home from a late shift just down the road from me and was stopped at a red light. Then a trucker flew up the highway, only he had fallen asleep at the wheel and plowed right into her, killing her instantly. The first thing my mom told me when I learned to drive was that my car a potential weapon much like a bullet and that I should always remember that and drive responsibly. Truck drivers have 10x that amount of responsibility because they are basically driving around a 3 ton tank.
Keith Treason hrmm yet that nurse most likely worked a 12 hour shift and was reaponsible to handing out meds which could kill or hurt someone, where are their mandatory rest times or doctors for that matter , what about pharm techs ? Law enforcement working double shifts but having to make split second choises about peoples lives and driving at high speeds ? Seems to me truckers are the least worry of all of these
Way to switch topics and blame the dead nurse. Professions like heath and law are working to help save lives. Truckers are trying to make a delivery and make a profit. Any medical devices that are urgently needed are shipped via van or personal vehicle and cops give them leniency if they speed and are pulled over (I work for a medical device company so I've talked with those drivers).
3? You just wish. Try 40 tons. Divide by 10 brakes, vs 1.5 tons divided by 4 brakes...
This should be at the top. I don't know how this video didn't have more 👎
Incadazant01 my dad’s semi truck could weigh a total of 80 tons when it was fully loaded
My father is an owner operator that used leave on Monday and be home on Thursday. Now that’s a rare occasion, he always comes home on Friday cause he runs out of time to drive his truck. HIS TRUCK.
I remember when my company added face mounted cameras and the outcome was slower production, and lots of returns. Drivers were no longer trying to back up into very tight places with a 53, eventually the company pulled out all cameras!
I'll tell you how it's transforming it... by having trucks park on interstate ramps!
Exactly!
Got stuck in traffic? Too bad! Sleep tight and don't let the raccoons bite!
That's not the reason. The reason for that is that trucks pay the lions share of the road tax and states are closing down rest areas left and right where trucks can park. There are a great deal more trucks on the road than there are places to park them over night and the number of places to park are going down but the number of trucks are going up every year. There are states that have closed every single truck rest area within their state so they can divert the money elsewhere that will buy them votes. Politicians could not care one bit about your or anyone' else's safety all they care about is that next election that will let them keep their cushy over paid job or to let them step up to a higher level elected cushy even more over paid job.
Alot worse my friend, thank your govt, next time you get a chance
I drove for 16 years. I always did a trip plan that put me in a LARGE Truck Stop at the end of my drive time. Never a Rest Area ( their not always open) or "Fuel Stop" like Pilot or Loves. I have seen trucks parked on ramps at the same exit as a large TS with plenty of parking. Most guys who park on ramps chose to. One of the thing's the trucking industry must do is not allow consignee's to hold drivers while they prep the product for storage, stores deliveries... Make it Mandatory that all loads be sealed by the shipper and broke by con's. Short don't hold the Driver. Call the Shipper. This will take care of a lot of time sensitive issues effecting the driver. Subsidies Truck stops to help them expand and build more Large Full Service ( TA, Petro, Flying J) stops.
"I drove for 16 years". If you haven't been driving for the last 2-3 years, or your driving career was spent in the midwest or west, you would be surprised at how quick the truckstops fill up at night. If you want to guarantee a spot you had better be parked by 6:00pm. As a former driver you know that isn't always possible.
damn ..I never thought about this perspective of technologies like self driving. .
Thanks vox
This is not about self driving technology
Atharva Pande if you look at it like this Schneider JB Hunt Swift England Stevens Transport they're the ones that push for electronic log books but yet those are the companies that have the most accidents
It probably should have touched on it actually (but you're right, I'm not sure why they commented what they did) - truck driving as a profession is almost certainly not going to be around in 20 years... at the very least no where close to the number of people it employs today.
therespublica yep
therespublica and nobody knows what's going to happen to all of us. I'm not well suited for office work and there's no other job that would allow me to travel like I do.
And u never get paid for all u do. If ur loading. Unloading. Stuck in traffic and u get paid by the mile. Guess what there is hours ur not getting paid. And ur 11 hour clock is running out
It would be nice if the drivers could be capable of all sticking together and just not driving until the law changes. Truckers are the backbone of everything and as soon as they stop everything stops. Within 1 week elds would be history.
Maithê Caroline Inácio. Yeah I wouldn't think blocking the roads would be a smart move, I would say thats why the military got called in. But America is different so I think it would ha e a shot not with gas prices cuz you cant change the global market but with lil eld devices I think they would submit.
this is bs. electronic logs back off the company from running the driver in to the ground. for twenty-five years i thought it was normal to be tired 24/7. now i feel much less tired...and now i have time to sleep.
8:33
The American truckers sounds like a super hero team
ELD or the similar have been used for ages in EU. Not with GPS but all the other. It's safety measure. They are used in buses too. I'm not a truck or buss driver but I'm a car driver.
In the form of tachograph. One of my relatives is an ex-trucker
And yet I still see 20 to 30 Truckers per week either texting and driving or holding their phone and driving.
NJ Moto and from up there in the truckers seat we see about a billion car drivers holding the phone an hour
@@ukraine1keiv31 True. She probably does it her self too😂
Unfortunately, every job has this. Fast food workers in the 1950s weren't tracked by how long it took to serve an order, now, it's measured. Waiters and waitresses collected tips, but now the employer collects those (via credit cards) and sometimes distributes them to other staff. We used to have paper files, film negatives, microfiche. The ability to convert data to computer always requires a transition and it is always painful. But ultimately, the consumer dollar is what speaks up. Fast food workers still get tracked, but some companies are upfront about their potential delays, or will pull a car to let others complete. Wait staff have learned to share their income OR move to another establishment that gives them more of their tips directly. And secretaries were laid off by the droves with the advent of email or digital communications. Right now the problem is that they are required to do these and the companies are fulfilling the letter of the laws, not the spirit of the law. The spirit is to lower crashes. If a driver is ill, then they stay offline. Sure, it eats into their profit, but that's the nature of contracts, but if their employer gave them "sick time" per se and could give them chances to recover, then it would work fine. I think the technology is the check at this point, but there are solutions but it requires companies to think more creatively about their contracts both in delivery and with the individual truckers, and until then, it's gonna be difficult. This coming from a guy who used to work Help Desk and suffered four layoffs in six years until I finally changed fields and got out of it... Why were we laid off? Outsourcing overseas. I don't blame the companies for using cheaper labor, but the quality they got suffered as a result, and these days we see a mix of outsourcing and insourcing. Doesn't matter to me, I found a more stable field... for now.
Tony Bossaller What field did you get into?
As a pilot I feel your pain, my plane will tell on me if I over speed flaps ect even if it's by 1 knot. No mercy I'll get a phone call when I land and in 2020 ADS-B will be mandatory on every plane in the sky. Big brother is watching, you better believe it.
Christopher M hey I'm a current truck driver, been thinking of hitting the sky's. How much is it to learn and how long does it take? I'm thinking it's gotta be at least 10k for the lessons.
I shudder to think of what will happen when it won't let you and something happens when you really need to. For instance a sudden emergency landing. "Sorry everyone, I need to let the computer know that I need to perform a 3g turn instead of 2g because we need to perform an emergency landing. Just a minute."
MW Final It really depends on where and who you do it with as far as costs go. I got my private pilot's license just north of Dallas in a very suburban area with a retired airline pilot. For the Dallas Metroplex he was pretty cheap it cost about $10,000 he really wasn't making a whole lot off me like a flight school would have. That being said I have a friend in Arkansas that got his for $5,000 at a flying club. So if you really look around you can find them pretty cheep, but they might be in the middle of nowhere. I'd strongly recommend a private individual or Flying Club because they aren't in it for the money they just like flying. Flight schools are very over priced probably $15,000 for your private license and they really just care about your money. Whether or not you you get your license is irrelevant to them because they still get paid the same. As far as time it takes to get your license you could probably do it in 3 months it you fly every day and you're highly motivated. If you're going to do it try to save up the money so you can do it all at once. If you don't fly for a while you really lose your skills. I've seen people pay $20,000 over 4 years because of all of the refreshes they take because they couldn't do it all at once.
Andrew Young Fly-by-wire is what that's called and it scares the heck out of me too! I did a 10 page research paper in college over it and it really is terrifying to think the pilot is just making suggestions to the plane. The final thing in control is the computer system in almost all of the new airliners today. They have 3 computers on board so they minimize the likelihood of all of them crashing at once but if it ever did happen your plane would turn into a rock. Also most modern jet engines have a FADEC system (full Authority digital engine control) that does exactly what you were talking about. If I need above redline engine power in an emergency situation the aircraft would say no because that might damage the engines, even if that extra power might save the plane in a microburst.
Christopher M Wow really appreciate an answer, this info is really helpful! I know enough in life to save extra money, just gotta get the rest haha 😂
Laws for safety: Gets enforced
People: hOw DaRe YoU!
It’s eventually going to increase shipping cost, delivery times, retail, etc.
However I still see truckers not being treated right by payers. If you truckers organize like the eld then organize to demand better treatment
i drove OTR for 10 years, stopped about 8 years ago, after seeing this im glad i did. Good luck Drivers God speed.
I agree with the truckers point entirely on this matter. But, ironically I'm sure when self automated semi trucks take off they will be lobbying the U.S for additional regulations against computers.
Andy Rodriguez that's 25 to 40 years away
When you take the driver out of the truck accidents will go up and by a lot. Oh yes its easy to get a car to stop its an entirely another story to get a semi to stop. A truck driver can see some moron passing them and know that the moron will cut them off, slam on their brakes right in front of the truck because they are passing the exit that they wanted. No this is not something that happens rarely its a daily event it happens even more in cities. I have had days where I lost count of how many times it happened to me that day. There is a good reason that to a truck driver calling someone a four wheeler is a big insult.
A computer will only know there is an issue as the car is cutting it off and by that time its way to late to hit the brakes. On a good day a semi truck takes five times the distance to slow down than it takes a car add other factors and the truck will take even farther to slow down.
Another reason to keep a computer from driving a human can look in front of them and say oh I think that curve might be icy I should slow down even more and be extra careful. The computer will realize that the curve has ice is when its sliding across the road ramming into cars going the other direction and plunging down the raven on the other side of the road.
Well said Donkeyearsa.
The lunatics have been running the asylum for some time. Do you know what is written on the Georgia Guidestones?
Donkeyearsa. I completely agree with you
They truck our jobs!
I refuse to give more than i am contractually obliged to do, when watched all the time at work.
I used to think I was born too early, I wanted to see the future. Now however, I'm glad I won't be around for it.
CobaltBob RIP
this is the future brother,
The future doesn't have to be bad as long as we realize we'll have to make some radical changes :)
The future is UBI
I still think that I was born to early, because just look at the scientific progress we are making!
I work for an ELD manufacturer, Messenger Terabit Networks, and I designed the casing for an ELD called the Shotgun Rider. The manual of regulations for these things is literally about 450 pages long. They're a ridiculous intrusion on both privacy and habits, and you bet we took advantage of every loophole in those 450 pages.
Big Red Amateur. I invented the color green and the spoon.
I invented the most effective bots
i invented
If you did why the hell did you do that. Really couldn't find any other work than to contribute to workplace fascism?
Hyperloop is gonna change everything!
idk ive seen some horrendous truck drivers out on the road swerving all over the place damn near causing accidents to innocent people just trying to get home safe. its all too common. most likely some guy doped up on 5hr energy and cocaine. road safety should be the most important thing.
Excellent job Vox. I have 2 truckers in my family and their main complaint is they can't fudge the books anymore. They are both upset that they have to follow the rules. An excellent point to remember is this is a skilled labor job. 6 weeks of training or less sometimes and you are on the road. The pay is reflective of the amount of skill required to perform the job.
I was recently talking to a Turkish driver and his work hours are different than the ones in America--and I don't think for the better. He can only drive for 2x4hours with one hour of break in between. And that is it for his day. He can drive again after 12 hours.
Another problem is that in Europe he has to wait in line at every border which is sometimes up to 12 hours. Which means that his work hours are spent by sitting and waiting in line and his break hours are sleeping in that same spot on the side of a road.
And of course, being monitored all the time is messing with your brain big time.
you mean in europe where there are generally 0 border controls?
Edijs Lohijs Turkey isn't a part of the EU. I think with a Turkish license plate he needs to wait at every border.
"Another problem is that in Europe he has to wait in line at every border which is sometimes up to 12 hours."
Maybe in the past, but most of the EU is effectively borderless nowadays. There are no customs checks between most countries, just a road sign.
Coupla things: No, a truck registered to a European country doesn't wait 12 hours at a border, they don't even stop unless pulled for inspection. 2 Turkey isn't in Europe, at least the economic or political landscape of Europe, and those driver regulations you quote, well, are wrong.
Bert, there aren't border posts at most crossings. There is no one watching. Since the terror attacks yes, from time to time there are cop cars selectively stopping some cars, but not inspecting trucks for their merch. Maybe getting into the EU is a long wait, i dunno. I know the EU/Russia border is hectic. But once you're in, you're in, freedom of movement bithezzzz :D
There's a security camera pointed at me for 10 hours a day at work. I understand that no one likes to be watched, but being a trucker is a JOB you're going to be watched to make sure that you're doing it right, just like any other job
did you get the point of the video? forcing truckers to stop driving even if they're close and mandating sleep breaks even if they're right next to their house. look, I'm all for ELDS but comparing it to a security camera is unintelligent.
maddy mace you clearly don't understand in your job as if any job you go there and its owned by the company so you follow there rules but with trucking there a big difference with this line of work there's three things you need to know
1 whoever owns the truck makes the rules
2 the driver has a choice
3 these horrific cases of a driver being fatieg are 2 main factors either 1 they are a real outlaw trucker who is not certified (CDL) and can do what they want or 2 they are pressured by the company to get it there on time by cutting their wages by minutes by thousands of dollars
but back to the point whoever owns the truck makes the rules if a driver chooses to drive the company truck then they follow their rules and don't drive the truck extra time but if he owns his own truck then whos to say when he drives it where. if he wants to pick up hick hikers he can do that in his own truck but if he drives the company truck that's a BIG NO NO...you see what I mean
to get to the point these machines conjoin this decision of the truck driving his own truck his way like your job trying to tell you how to drive and how to get there when you only work there at a business office right or something that you don't own here's an explanation of what I'm saying, you own your own car and you drive to work every day and you go where you please as you please because you own it. well imagine your company (lets say you work for a credit card company) puts a logger and tracker in you car and tells you when you can and cant drive it.like lets say you need grocries but as soon as you turn the key if youve been to work it wont let you leave even if your at home well you might say thats redicolus because its your car well thats what there trying to do to personal truck drivers and make it seem like its the company truck when its not
Maddy Mace does it watch you 24/7? didn’t think so
I understand that trucking is different than a lot of other fields, and this isn't a great solution, but all jobs need regulation, trucking is no different. This is a flawed plan, but you can't expect them to just NOT watch you while you work
Thanks for bringing this to light. The same technologies are just as intrusive in call centers, warehouses, delivery persons, and I'm sure many more jobs.
This technology is soul crushing and extremely detrimental to job performance.
How? If people were doing what they were supposed to then it shouldn't change their behavior at all. It should literally change nothing.
Exellent input. The goal conflict was described quick and comprehensible. Thx for broadening the minds of people.
Big brother is watching you.
without his socks on
And China.
is that panopticon reference
its from "1984" by george orwell bro
1984😍
This was fascinating and terrifying. The way we work nowadays is taking a toll on our lives and the boundary between professional and personal life is thinning dangerously, bordering on slavery at times.
Thanks for this truly interesting video.
Companies will “under pay” drivers as long as drivers are willing to do it.
Sleepy truckers and truckers trying to make up time are most dangerous.
Surveillance will only put additional pressure on them. That´s the wrong turn.
Disagree. By far I see more four wheelers making the roadway dangerous.
@@ShainAndrews absolutely..
Well truckers are not having the worst of the problem. we pilots are even more unpaid and even more monitoring from government agencies.
Tommi Chen yea but pilots dont sleep/live in the plane and work 70-90hrs a week either.
Pilots don't even fly planes.- delta 30 year engineer.
Just like no one hit their allotted calories day in and day out. There should be breathing room for drivers to drive according to their experience level. As long as they hit their targets overall for the week, then the system should have built in tolerances for deviation. 10-20%. Inexperienced drivers 5-10% and 15-20% for experienced drivers.
Putting everyone on a strict timetable feels like it's removing the individuality and humanness of each driver. We can program that in with tolerances. The computers can do the math to make sure everyone is contributing the correct amount.
tdreamgmail Absolutely, this is the right answer. Earlier the problem was the law was just as harsh but could not be enforced but now that it can..the problem is not with the device but with the very strict law. Allow for tolerances and more sensible law that takes in the data from these devices to make more sensible rules.
sorry thats just a dumb idea, dumbest idea i've seen on this topic, adjust the rules around hours of service but not like that, its just dumb... did i mention it was a dumb idea??
This is really trucked up, man. Cheers!
Karen from Cornell University interviewed in the video totally gets it. Pay the drivers better so they can work reasonable hours. An ELD will not solve this fundamental problem.
Something something Orwell was right again
That is Bentham silly
Thats George Orwell, dumbass
muh jerbs
Except it isn't the government watching, it's corporations
I said "muh" so it's not a valid issue lmao
Trucking just ain't the same as it was in the 70's for us truckers.
Gone are the good ole days.......
Yea but neither is the world.. it's not just trucks
Trucker’s average yearly income in 1980 (the height of the American Trucker) was $37,000. Adjusted for inflation that’s $111,000 in 2018. The average trucker today only makes about $50,000. Truckers are getting screwed. They should just stop working for 48 hours to send a message.
Ronnie Kenworth it's way better now.
Back in my day *shakes cane* 😂😂😂
Truckers used to keep two sets of drivers logs. As recently as the late 1990's. They can't really do that now, and that has a real impact on how long it takes them to deliver a load, and in some instances the profitability of their rig. If they were using paper logbooks, and were 5 minutes from destination, they could easily fudge the books. If you were wondering what the second set of books was for, it was for the highway patrol. It showed that you drove the perfect amount of time on the road. Keeps you out of trouble.
There's a simple change to this that would be able to counter a lot of the problems.
Instead of having a straight block of 11 hours a day, we should extend the block to 33 hours over three days, and we should allow truckers to split up that time block how they want to. We should also monitor how our companies control the drivers.
This problem isn't with the government getting too involved, it's that the government isn't involved enough in the ways that it should be involved
Well then a driver could theoretically drive 30 hours straight to reach their destination, take a few days rest while the truck is unloaded/reloaded and then do the same thing back the other way.
Don't piss off truckers! This country would stop in less than a week, more like 3 days without them. No food in grocery stores, no fuel delivery, no mail etc.. That includes your precious Amazon too.. No one from the 1% down can live without them.
I remember hearing once there was a proposed Bill in California against truckers. Forgot exactly what it was, but it pissed them off so much that they started to organize a boycott of shipping into California. as soon as word it was being organized broke out, the State had an emergency meeting to get the bill shot down lol
Odin31b so true...
This would be even worst where I live ( Brazil), here we don't have railroads. The country only survives with highways
Reminds me of when the CIA paid off the truckers in Chile to go on strike in order to make Allende's government fall. It was one of the mayor events which led to the dictatorship of Pinochet. Its proof of just how critical truckers are for the economy and stability of a country.
Jose L Romero
Oh yeah 9/11 ... that was also a Tuesday 1974 (or was it 72?)
The people here talking smack about truckers need to ride with one sometime and see how it really is.
WikdSeafood And they’re the same people who will flip out if their Amazon Prime delivery doesn’t arrive on time.
Saving up and buying your own truck is the best thing you can do. Skip all this bs
WikdSeafood for what
WikdSeafood most truckers are some scheming mfers, my uncle is one and he and his buddy's always talk about ways around stopping and how to keep going because if you're not moving you're not making as much money because you don't ship as much.
WikdSeafood
Only problem with that is...you can't fix stupid.
Thank you for this clip.
As a CDL driver who works for the electric utility, I do not have to log any of my hours. We used to, then we became exempt. We can legally drive and work 24 hours a day and do not have a penalty. We work 16 hour shifts regularly, especially during power restoration after storms. There are other times when I work a 8 hour shift then get home when the phone rings and it is a case of trouble where I may have a 16 hour shift before I get to go back home.