I really appreciate that AMD is still supporting AM4! It's been such a great trip for me starting with a 3700x to a 5600x and now hopefully to the 5700X3D.
Yeah. I bought my first AM4 board by the time the Ryzen 5 3600 had already been in the market for several months. I had to go with a 2600, though. 3 years later we are still getting chips for that chipset and I can still upgrade to a nice COU if needed (I am currently using a R5 5600).
I hope they do the same with AM5. Their 7 years long (and counting) support for AM4 was the reason why I switched from Intel to AM5, when was time to upgrade my rig. I bought the best X670E mobo money could buy expecting at least another 3 gens worth o CPU upgrades.
Longevity of AM4 was a major point when building a PC in 2018 and I am still using my first (X470) motherboard today, just with a different CPU. It's not only cost effective, it's also good for the environment.
Dear AMD, please keep supporting AM4 as long as you can, even if it is with binned down chips that didn't make the first cut. As far as NPUs are concerned, it'd be nice to see an AM4 chip with one, even if it's a bit impractical to you, purely from an academic standpoint.
@@Dogzilla07 I've got some spare DDR4 if you think that's really a problem, because you know, it's like 35$ for rgb ddr4 on newegg right now....🤣You could always scav some from a derelict Intel rig.
why would they need to add an NPU to the AM4 cpus anyway, NPU is literally just for small ai acceleration stuff useless ones like background blurring and eye tracking, for the bigger ones like stable diffusion that generates images and running LLM the top choice is still a GPU
DDR4/5 price is not the reason some of us don't migrate to AM5, it's because certain motherboards are way too expensive. I'm not going to replace my core components when I can upgrade just the CPU and get similar results, for roughly half the cost. I will migrate to AM5 when it's more practical to do so.
yeah thats basically what I did, I built a couple new 5600 pc's for family members. I am currently using an old i77700k comp with a 980 ti card, this is one of the pc's that the new build replaced. Since I only game at 1080 older titles I am also hoping to get at least another few years out of it. Although, I learned that intel will stop support for this cup in the next few months, i'm thinking that doesn't make much of a difference. I believe the 5600 can run a relatively powerful card in the rx 6800 range so i'm thinking thats a good deal unless you need super high end gpu's in your pc. I think we have the same basic idea@@dagerry
the am5 platform is super pricey compared to am4, ddr5 prices have dropped since am5 launch yet the am5 boards are still double the am4 boards, sell cheaper boards get more customers on am5
i don't agree, there's good mobos for like 120-130 backs. like hdv/m2 or pro rs from asrock for example. it's only like 30 backs more than good b550 mobo
Sadly true, also DDR5 32GB 5600 CL28/6000 CL30 still cost at least 50-75% more than DDR4 32GB 3600 CL16. It's just too expensive (for me, and probably also for others) to switch to AM5. Full sized ATX motherboard compared to my MSI B450 Tomahawk start at a +75% price jump. I just can't find AM5 attractive at all at the moment.
@@julfy_god sure the entry level boards are, but that's a lateral move when we have the same features on a b550 or x570, I want 4x nvme slots at least now, and that is x670-p or above. add that to the total system costs and that 30$ difference per part starts to add up and eats into your budget for something like a GPU.
@@grtninja that's true, but overall including all the costs entry level am5 with b650 mobo and 6000 Mt/s memory costs like 50-100 bucks more, at least in my country. that's not really that much for midbudjet system and there are a lot of situations when you can't really get a better GPU for that money
In 2018 I bought a 2700x with a X470 board. I mean, to have the capability to upgrade to a 5xxx CPU in 2024 due to long platform support is the best I could imagine from the point of view of an average gaming customer.
In 2019 I moved from my 4790K to a 3700X. Now, I have a 5800X3D. Got a lot of value out of my cheapish X570 Board. I started with a GTX 1080 and no nvme drives, now I use all my M.2 slots, a PCI-e 4.0 card with RX 6800, etc.
These 8000 series chips are interesting. Easy to dismiss at a glance since it's still Zen 4, but I expect that the added NPU and beefed up iGPU will do more for the longevity of these chips than some might expect. Later in AM5's lifecycle they'll likely make for a very compelling budget option.
The 8000 series is pretty neat. But the 7000 non x series is still my MVP. As you can stick an Noctua NH-P1 passive cooler on an ryzen 7 7700. And have a system run whisper silent when you're not using the GPU.
Yeah, I can finally accept that I have too many other priorities to continue my new build this year. Just gonna replace my 1800X with a 5700X3D to stop bottlenecking my 7900 XTX so severely. 😂
I'm building a small PC for travel that will feature the 8700G. I've always hoped that AMD would consider a solution like what they did with Kaby Lake-G and its HBM, but that's essentially asking for desktop class SoCs. That might be the future anyway...
I have been thinking about getting a 5800X3D myself.. I currently have the 5900X and game at 4K with a 6800XT.. I can't do Ultra on every game but I can on most older and I usually drop to high settings.. Like right now I am playing Hogwarts at 4K high with some Ultra Mixed in with no problem, so for me I may wait for Navi 4 and what ever AM5 chip that makes sense at that time.. IDK.. But I feel like I am good for now.. The 6800XT with the 16 GIGs turned out to be a great GPU.. plus I play mostly older games and haven't spent money on games for a while now.. EA is all messed up, I can't get signed into games I own. Something is messed up.. But this is great news..
Hello, nice episode, I have a dilemma, here the components are expensive, if we are talking about AM5, if we are talking about AM4, they are relatively inexpensive and available. I was thinking about AM5 because even the powerful processors have 65W, which is ok in the current energy crisis. I currently have an old AM3+ platform with FX Bulldozer 125W 8x4 Ghz per core and I need to change it because the platform draws quite a lot of current, which translates into energy bills. As I wrote above, if the AM5 platform had a comparable price for components, I would choose this platform, but I will choose AM4 and top-shelf components, a board with a good power supply section and high sound, a processor up to 65W and 32 or 64 GHz clocked at 3600 and that is enough for me for a few years until the prices of components drop. Greetings from Poland.
They has 8 totally different processors on the AM4 socket, 10 if you count the dual chiplet chips 11 if you count X3D. There has not been a socket like that since socket 7!. we can only hope AM5 gets that level of support. bulldozer apu. zen zen+ zen+apu zen2 zen2 dual zen2 apu zen3 zen3 dual zen3 apu zen3X3D
I can remember playing most games out at the time on an Old FX APU in a Lenovo Laptop, And I played most every game at 720P on a 15" monitor on mid to high settings and it was a decent experience.. I have a Desktop now but I got by with an APU laptop.. I have an ASUS 15" now too with a 5500U in it that pushes games Ok too.. Sometimes you have to drop to 720 but on a 15" screen, it's hard to tell 720, or 900, from 1080P on a smaller screen. And these newer chips are probably great..
When will 8950GX3D 16-core with 1 x 16-core CCD with vcache? I like that they still do stuff for AM4, because for those who forked 500$ for an X570 motherboard, I sure would love to get more stuff that can fit on it and prolong its longevity.
I'm on 5800X3D, the friction to going to AM5 isn't JUST the memory, it's the overall performance per dollar. The 7800X3D alone is 400$. Then I would need a new motherboard, and the AM5 motherboards aren't that cheap, that's another 250$ or so. Then I need memory, 64gbytes for my workload, another 200$. So that's 850 dollars to replace the core of my computer for... about 15-20% more performance? It's just not worth it yet.
What about MGPU? AMD's Multi GPU system that allows to add same generation RDNA GPU, probably iGPU + discrete GPU too, but I cannot find tests or benchmarks about them. And perhaps for gamers it is worth the extra iGPU cost, or for productivity, to have monitors with the iGPU, and let the discrete GPU only process video.
Same bus and package, that said. No, that isn't a thing, think of it as another io die on the processor. It draws power and produces some heat, but it is so miniscule that it won't matter. You're more likely to notice the reduced clock speeds on the CPU cores, which is a characteristic lower binned dies anyway.
I just got my bnew AM4 with Ryzen 7 due to budget constraints but damn the performance has been awesome especially I play mostly VR games. I know I can still hold on to this for a few more years. Unless AM5 becomes cheaper or something better would be introduced at the right price. I am always late to the party when upgrading as tech here in my country is very expensive. The good thing now a days, PC performance gap between generations is not as significant as before and the need to upgrade is no longer a luxury in most basic cases.
AM4 with 2700 happy owner. I started thinking about getting a new PC when AM5 came out! :D So for me AM5 release and having an AM4 is a positive factor to AM5 adoption. The way I think is that instead of getting a new AM4 CPU, I 'll just wait until their prices drop VERY much, then I'll get that new and also a very cheap motherboard so I'll have in the 3 systems (2x AM4 and 1x AM5) for my homelab.
I have a mini pc with a R5 2400g pro and 32gb of ram 2933mhz in my bedroom and it can run a lot of game in 1080p/900p this thing will be a beast .I also have a laptop with a 680m and it runs game really well at 1080p.
The biggest question I'm asking myself: Why call those APUs 8700G and 8600G? Mobile APUs use the new naming scheme like 7840. Why aren't those APUs called 8740G and 8640G?
They are based on the mobile 8040 series. On top of that the mobile naming scheme is such so that AMD can use multiple parts... The second digit happens to be the most important, because it's the architecture ID, you can have an 8000 series in Mobile that is Zen 2 or Zen 3+. The desktop naming scheme simply doesn't contend with reality.
@@DuvJones You misunderstood my comment. Maybe I didn't phrase it clearly enough. It's not about the 7xxx/8xxx. It's rather about 8x0x instead of 8x4x. 8700G is the old naming scheme while the new one has specific rules (how logical is another story). Ryzen 7000 desktop CPUs don't use the new one because of reasons, fine, but then not use it for the new desktop APUs... When will they start using it in the desktop? With Zen5/Ryzen 9000? It's not like I care that much for it... It's just stupid.
Ryzen 5 8600G looks to be a sweetspot for the price to performance that it delivers. 80% of the iGPU performance and 95% of the CPU performance in 90% of all potential workloads. Virtually identical performance in Windows, web browsers, Adobe Photoshop, Premiere Pro and others compared to Ryzen 7 8700G.
5950X3D when ? Cause you know - the best for the final 😎👍 And I know, this one would be ultra niche product ( and not cheap one) , but for some ppl that wanna something universal ( 16 cores while 8 with gigacache for games ) It would be great to see that aswell as the last golden nail to the AM4 era.
These APUs have a lot of ai capability. On paper they beat Apple’s M2 ultra. 39 TOPS vs 32 TOPS. It’s such a shame then that they’re aren’t coming out with a version with higher memory bandwidth. This is critical for very large language models with 70 billion+ parameters. Apple is selling their M2 ultras to AI enthusiasts like hot cakes. Is AMD afraid of making money? What’s going on with their product development? Edit: made an error. It’s Qualcomm that has 45 TOPS. Still 39 TOPS is better than what Apple is offering.
I just replaced my system from that same era. I went from a 4770k with 32GB ram I built after Black Friday 2013 to a 14900k (Microcenter bundle) with 192GB ram, and geez what a difference even for the single threaded performance. Come summer I may regret not having a 7950X I can put in Eco Mode, but they didn't have any high end AMD bundles when I was shopping.
@@WilReid Half of your power is going to all that RAM anyway, and the Intel idle power is reportedly quite a bit lower even though the full load is higher.
In April 2019 I did buy my ASRock B450 motherboard for $59.99, I consider moving to AM5 if they have motherboards for say $79.99. I'm have to upgrade my Ryzen 3 2200G, enough choice now in the 5000G series. .
Get the most cores/best 5000-series G processor there is...the Ryzen 7-5700G, assuming for some reason you are determined to never actually buy a discrete GPU. (The onboard graphics of 5700G still is below that of even a GTX1050 GPU from 7 years ago..)
And yet, no vision to develop dedicated VRAM DIMMs. Imagine a world where your APU can use either shared DDR RAM or DDR for CPU side and GDDR for GPU side. Those GDDR DIMMs could also be used for dedicated GPU cards, either as the sole memory or for expansion. If AMD did this, you know that Intel and Nvidia would follow.
@@igitsolutions I disagree. They are already developing the GPUs and incorporating scaled down versions into their APUs. Segmentation will still be there, as the low-end cards have more cores than the high end cards APUs. As for cooling, they can put heatsinks on the DIMM package. In fact, since it would be different than the DDR DIMMs, they can make it any form factor they want to account for the cooling needed.
BTW, I used to rant about other things, like car makers should develop a standard way for 3rd parties to provide GPS navigation to their screens rather than forcing use of their crappy nav. "No way, they don't lose the money they make on nav!" Charge the same amount, just give the option to easily use a better nav module. If one car maker does it, others will follow to compete. Years later, we got something in the form of Apple CarPlay and Android Auto.
the real question is, is anyone going to be crazy enough to integrate ddr5 into am4 systems? asking as a dude who bought a 5950x during the shortage/scalper era (i paid msrp but it was a FIGHT to get one)
Adding support for a new memory type is not something a hobbyist modder could do. AMD can do it, but not without expending millions on what is basically a new chip.
it will come, new hardware will need new drivers & apis from software to tie into. Ideally on Linux it gets implemented in an open way like vulkan instead of cuda.
Honestly they should do one last hurrah, release Zen 3+ on AM4 as 6000 series, alongside Zen 5 which should blow it out of the water anyways so budget/futureproof conscious people will both have choices. Then end AM4 for good
Now that Nvidia and AMD killed PC gaming with overpriced graphics cards, these APUs look a lot more interesting. You don't need a discrete graphics card to run Microsoft office or watch RUclips videos.
Can you confirm that AM5 8000G APUs have 8 less PCIe lanes compared to AM5 CPUs? The previous AM4 Zen 2 and 3 APUs had the same amount of PCIe lanes as the AM4 CPUs, be it Gen3 instead of Gen4. 8 less PCIe lanes would likely be taken away from the main x16 PCIe slot, otherwise all NVMe slots would be dead. That would reduce performance of current/future PCIe dGPUs you could add to a system with a 8700G, for example…
Yeah, saw that, too and hope it‘s just a mistake. The last time it was like this was with the AM4 Zen+ 2000G/3000G APUs that only had 8 (main PCIe Slot) + 4 (NVMe) + 4 (Chipset Interface) PCIe Lanes.
it's a minus 4 scenario on their website "Native PCIe Lanes (Total/Usable) 20 / 16" for the 8700G & "Native PCIe Lanes (Total/Usable) 24 / 20" for 7700X The way most motherboards would implement this would be that the current gen 5 m.2 slot would probably be disabled having all NVME going through chipset & 16x gpu. The other way to split would be 8x for gpu, 4x for 1 nvme, 4x for 1 nvme, 4x for chipset.
8000G processors have Gen4-only lanes, and Ryzen 5 8500G and 8300G supposedly only have 10 usable lanes of PCI-E, because they're Phoenix2 parts that are made for budget laptops without a dGPU. 8600G and 8700G have 20 Gen4 lanes, with 20 being usable, and Ryzen 7000 CPUs have 28 Gen5 lanes, with 24 being usable. Incidentally, it says that Ryzen 7000 series supports up to 128GB RAM, whereass Ryzen 8000G will support 256GB RAM. Ryzen 5 8600G looks to be a sweetspot for the price to performance that it delivers. 80% of the iGPU performance and 95% of the CPU performance in 90% of all potential workloads. Virtually identical performance in Windows, web browsers, Adobe Photoshop, Premiere Pro and others compared to Ryzen 7 8700G.
In the same response to the AM5 platform just as they did to AM4, I have no doubt AMD will be producing a Ryzen 7 7700X3D as well as a Ryzen 9 8900G with a more improved NPU cores in the near future to spite Intel at their weak spots. No doubt AMD is alive and kicking better than Intel. The only option for Intel now is to go on a price war.
the day the music died - it has to happen - amd needs to goto pci-e v6 and bring more lanes to consumer boards - if they can and will slash and burn sku jungle is unknown but there are just too many tiers imo. for gpu that need to add more ram and bring in cheap cxl implementations - business decisions rule and it is going to be a 5 year plan before ai reaches escape velocity - semiaccurate
APUS need to reach RX 6600 or GTX 2060 speeds in order to truly replace entry gaming systems. Until then the G series will be mostly powering grandma's pcs
I only play 1440, already have AM4, a 5800x3D CPU, and only need to upgrade my 2070 Super, would you just do that and stick with AM4 for another 4-5 years. Maybe a 4070 Super?
AMD never fixed AM5. My 7700X still takes 30 seconds to get past BIOS, and apparently I'm leaving tons of performance on the table by not running one of the special RAM kits whose secret timings work for AM5. Stick to AM4.
Is it still the case that the iGPU gets disabled when you slot in a discrete GPU? I always thought this behavior sucked. The reasoning that the iGPU takes up PCI lanes is not convincing.
AMD on desktop cant afford to pull any rugs out on customers in their position. The potential problem is AMD is still proving its a budget brand, ao how long wnill customers expect that before you start pulling rugs out?
Those "new" AM4 chips are just failed bins of 5800x3d. 5600x3d has defective cores and 5700x3d is clocked lower because it cannot handle 5800x3d clocks. Come on, call them out instead of going with the marketing narrative.
04:01 Congratulations AMD for launching 6600G and 6700G in AM4, those 65W APUs with RDNA2 are going to retire much of the old generation PC such low price. 6600H and 6700H un-chained from laptop only.
If you already have a high end 7000 series CPU, then the 8000 series does appear to be like a series of meh processors coupled with NPUs and better onboard graphics, in which case if you also already have a high end GPU, would render it a pointless buy. Might even be a downgrade. I'm betting the next gen 9000 series processors will all come defaut with RDNA3 graphics and NPUs off the bat?
later this year when intel updates there will probably be a more direct replacement to the 7000 am5 chips. 8950x, 8700x3D, 8600 etc with chiplet design. the 8600g & 8700g are the laptop 7480u/7480hx/z1 extreme but on a desktop socket. "phoenix apu" the 8500g & 8300g are based off of "phoenix 2 apu"
A slap on the wrist for MSI and its B450 motherboards... They do not release the AGESA 120B updates, as if they had not sold said motherboards with the promise of "longevity, compatibility", of course... AM4 is dead on chipsets before B550, don't try to cover it under the rug.
I like Don, and I like AMD products. However, anyone who uses “but honestly” so often triggers my suspicion. I suggest he think about use of that phrase, especially for someone in marketing…an occupation known for slinging bs all too often.
I only play 1440, already have AM4, a 5800x3D CPU, and only need to upgrade my 2070 Super, would you just do that and stick with AM4 for another 4-5 years. Maybe a 4070 Super?
@@ThePalePatriot I would get a 3080 Ti or a 6800xt (depends on slush cash availability). I’m waiting for a couple years before upgrading my 5600x/3080 Ti, which runs great. Tho I’m not a frame rate nor ray tracing fanatic.
Honestly, I appreciate your feedback... J/k! I think I was a bit nervous on camera, I kind of repeat myself and stammer a bit when I'm put on the spot. :)
Sorry had to say this but...that AMD guy just feels like a normal salesman guy who doesnt know anything by the way he spoke and just repeat what his higher ups said "just keep telling em its great and nice" ...
@miloshp7399 but he's at CES talking to precifically a pc enthusiast youtube channel. A good sales person wont have just one single vanilla approach to every customer, this salesrep even acknowledged this youtuber was a "computer guy".
@@AthleticHobo-br4qhBro the guy is a desk jockey and he's been working CES for a week and there is a camera in his face. He wants to get in and out. Cut him some slack.
AMD also proved they were willing to screw the first adopters of their AM4 platform when they are desperate enough to sell more motherboards really shows just how little they care about their customers. The fact that I had to wait 2 years before I could upgrade to a 5800X just cause I have an X370 motherboard is just unfair and just because they eventually changed their mind doesn't make it OK.
LOL doesn't matter which company it is I know none of them is my friend and that none of them could be trusted I put my faith in AMD cause of the promise of long term support plus I knew they were trying to get back on their feet after Bulldozer pulled them down to the ground it's a lesson learned on my part as we all know the only reason AMD changed their minds and gave Ryzen 5000 support for 400 Series Motherboards was cause people were complaining loud enough but it still took over a year after that before they allowed Ryzen 5000 on 300 series Motherboards so AMD, Intel and Nvidia can go where the sun don't shine. @@mattpierce5009
Sucks that the new generation of Ryzen 3 are for OEM only. Not all budget gamers can afford an Ryzen 5 right away. I hope AMD will change their mind someday.
While it's cool that AMD still supports AM4, at the end of the day it's a dead end platform, which isn't actually cheaper than AM5 if you look at mid-range boards. More importantly, AMD seems to artificially keep the AM4 platform viable by refusing to release Athlons/Ryzen 3s for AM5! Even in their latest Ryzen 8000G announcements, the Ryzen 3 is OEM Only!!
AMD is tha 8 gen wold champion in APU. Osma tolti osma Veri good ..yeas ..yea AM4 weil raiz agen.. and agen as tha Weis is going ..caz way ..wel caz file is hard lol 🎉 😂 . Have a nice Day.. ther ar Aon may list for so long oomay good . A laptop witha a vega 10 APU and a Am4. Tha hole collection from athlon 3000 g gold to. R7 5700g. All of them yeaa if I cood . Just for tha test . I oredi have a A10 7850k yea ya on ddr3 na I shut a copal of moth a go gos Sam ddr 3 2400mhz gold vengen corsam.. wel dodo one happy day 😊😊😊😊
![Are AM4 CPUs Getting Cheaper? Is AM5 Support In Question? November Q&A [Part 2]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/EV5OsXiOQk4/mqdefault.jpg)
I love that AMD has Wolverine on the team.
I really appreciate that AMD is still supporting AM4! It's been such a great trip for me starting with a 3700x to a 5600x and now hopefully to the 5700X3D.
Yeah. I bought my first AM4 board by the time the Ryzen 5 3600 had already been in the market for several months. I had to go with a 2600, though. 3 years later we are still getting chips for that chipset and I can still upgrade to a nice COU if needed (I am currently using a R5 5600).
This is why we do AMD its not now, its the support in the future,
I hope they do the same with AM5. Their 7 years long (and counting) support for AM4 was the reason why I switched from Intel to AM5, when was time to upgrade my rig. I bought the best X670E mobo money could buy expecting at least another 3 gens worth o CPU upgrades.
Longevity of AM4 was a major point when building a PC in 2018 and I am still using my first (X470) motherboard today, just with a different CPU. It's not only cost effective, it's also good for the environment.
Yeah, I went from 1700X to 3600 to 3950X to 5950X on AM4. Amazing stuff. Current 7950X3D is stupid fast with Zen 5 and X3D on the way. Ty AMD
Dear AMD, please keep supporting AM4 as long as you can, even if it is with binned down chips that didn't make the first cut. As far as NPUs are concerned, it'd be nice to see an AM4 chip with one, even if it's a bit impractical to you, purely from an academic standpoint.
It's not up to them, it's not up to AMD, the rep literally explained in the video. It's all up to RAM manufacturers
@@Dogzilla07 I've got some spare DDR4 if you think that's really a problem, because you know, it's like 35$ for rgb ddr4 on newegg right now....🤣You could always scav some from a derelict Intel rig.
why would they need to add an NPU to the AM4 cpus anyway, NPU is literally just for small ai acceleration stuff useless ones like background blurring and eye tracking, for the bigger ones like stable diffusion that generates images and running LLM the top choice is still a GPU
DDR4/5 price is not the reason some of us don't migrate to AM5, it's because certain motherboards are way too expensive. I'm not going to replace my core components when I can upgrade just the CPU and get similar results, for roughly half the cost. I will migrate to AM5 when it's more practical to do so.
@@Eleganttf2 didn't I say it was academic? Maybe I have a use case for it that I don't wish to share with you.
I also like the continued development and support for AM4, not all users need to play new titles at 4k. 👍
yeah thats basically what I did, I built a couple new 5600 pc's for family members. I am currently using an old i77700k comp with a 980 ti card, this is one of the pc's that the new build replaced. Since I only game at 1080 older titles I am also hoping to get at least another few years out of it. Although, I learned that intel will stop support for this cup in the next few months, i'm thinking that doesn't make much of a difference. I believe the 5600 can run a relatively powerful card in the rx 6800 range so i'm thinking thats a good deal unless you need super high end gpu's in your pc. I think we have the same basic idea@@dagerry
the am5 platform is super pricey compared to am4, ddr5 prices have dropped since am5 launch yet the am5 boards are still double the am4 boards, sell cheaper boards get more customers on am5
i don't agree, there's good mobos for like 120-130 backs. like hdv/m2 or pro rs from asrock for example. it's only like 30 backs more than good b550 mobo
Yeah, idk why boards now cost upwards of $1000+ for the top tier one when decades ago you could get the same experience with mostly $300.
Sadly true, also DDR5 32GB 5600 CL28/6000 CL30 still cost at least 50-75% more than DDR4 32GB 3600 CL16. It's just too expensive (for me, and probably also for others) to switch to AM5.
Full sized ATX motherboard compared to my MSI B450 Tomahawk start at a +75% price jump.
I just can't find AM5 attractive at all at the moment.
@@julfy_god sure the entry level boards are, but that's a lateral move when we have the same features on a b550 or x570, I want 4x nvme slots at least now, and that is x670-p or above. add that to the total system costs and that 30$ difference per part starts to add up and eats into your budget for something like a GPU.
@@grtninja that's true, but overall including all the costs entry level am5 with b650 mobo and 6000 Mt/s memory costs like 50-100 bucks more, at least in my country. that's not really that much for midbudjet system and there are a lot of situations when you can't really get a better GPU for that money
In 2018 I bought a 2700x with a X470 board. I mean, to have the capability to upgrade to a 5xxx CPU in 2024 due to long platform support is the best I could imagine from the point of view of an average gaming customer.
In 2019 I moved from my 4790K to a 3700X. Now, I have a 5800X3D. Got a lot of value out of my cheapish X570 Board. I started with a GTX 1080 and no nvme drives, now I use all my M.2 slots, a PCI-e 4.0 card with RX 6800, etc.
Thanks AMD for keeping AM4 love you guys
Brilliant interview.
These 8000 series chips are interesting. Easy to dismiss at a glance since it's still Zen 4, but I expect that the added NPU and beefed up iGPU will do more for the longevity of these chips than some might expect. Later in AM5's lifecycle they'll likely make for a very compelling budget option.
The 8000 series is pretty neat. But the 7000 non x series is still my MVP. As you can stick an Noctua NH-P1 passive cooler on an ryzen 7 7700. And have a system run whisper silent when you're not using the GPU.
Amazing coverage, as always! Can't wait to upgrade from my 1700 to a 5700x3D! I am going to run AM4 till it dies! 🙂
Yeah, I can finally accept that I have too many other priorities to continue my new build this year. Just gonna replace my 1800X with a 5700X3D to stop bottlenecking my 7900 XTX so severely. 😂
I'm building a small PC for travel that will feature the 8700G. I've always hoped that AMD would consider a solution like what they did with Kaby Lake-G and its HBM, but that's essentially asking for desktop class SoCs. That might be the future anyway...
I wish you guys would turn on captions!
I have been thinking about getting a 5800X3D myself.. I currently have the 5900X and game at 4K with a 6800XT.. I can't do Ultra on every game but I can on most older and I usually drop to high settings.. Like right now I am playing Hogwarts at 4K high with some Ultra Mixed in with no problem, so for me I may wait for Navi 4 and what ever AM5 chip that makes sense at that time.. IDK.. But I feel like I am good for now.. The 6800XT with the 16 GIGs turned out to be a great GPU.. plus I play mostly older games and haven't spent money on games for a while now.. EA is all messed up, I can't get signed into games I own. Something is messed up.. But this is great news..
AM4 is just great!
Hello, nice episode, I have a dilemma, here the components are expensive, if we are talking about AM5, if we are talking about AM4, they are relatively inexpensive and available. I was thinking about AM5 because even the powerful processors have 65W, which is ok in the current energy crisis. I currently have an old AM3+ platform with FX Bulldozer 125W 8x4 Ghz per core and I need to change it because the platform draws quite a lot of current, which translates into energy bills. As I wrote above, if the AM5 platform had a comparable price for components, I would choose this platform, but I will choose AM4 and top-shelf components, a board with a good power supply section and high sound, a processor up to 65W and 32 or 64 GHz clocked at 3600 and that is enough for me for a few years until the prices of components drop. Greetings from Poland.
They has 8 totally different processors on the AM4 socket, 10 if you count the dual chiplet chips 11 if you count X3D. There has not been a socket like that since socket 7!. we can only hope AM5 gets that level of support.
bulldozer apu.
zen
zen+
zen+apu
zen2
zen2 dual
zen2 apu
zen3
zen3 dual
zen3 apu
zen3X3D
Am6 is coming soon in few years
Donny looks like a pretty cool guy... That had a pretty rough night.
I’ll vouch for the first half of that statement
@@ArsonistArborist he looks good, ngl
@@JoaquinVacas calm down, he’s married
@@ArsonistArborist well, didn't say I want to marry him, just that he looks good. Hope I look the same when I get older.
@@JoaquinVacas just bugging 😂 Totally agree
I can remember playing most games out at the time on an Old FX APU in a Lenovo Laptop, And I played most every game at 720P on a 15" monitor on mid to high settings and it was a decent experience.. I have a Desktop now but I got by with an APU laptop.. I have an ASUS 15" now too with a 5500U in it that pushes games Ok too.. Sometimes you have to drop to 720 but on a 15" screen, it's hard to tell 720, or 900, from 1080P on a smaller screen. And these newer chips are probably great..
When will 8950GX3D 16-core with 1 x 16-core CCD with vcache?
I like that they still do stuff for AM4, because for those who forked 500$ for an X570 motherboard, I sure would love to get more stuff that can fit on it and prolong its longevity.
Why spend 500 on mb
I'm on 5800X3D, the friction to going to AM5 isn't JUST the memory, it's the overall performance per dollar. The 7800X3D alone is 400$. Then I would need a new motherboard, and the AM5 motherboards aren't that cheap, that's another 250$ or so. Then I need memory, 64gbytes for my workload, another 200$. So that's 850 dollars to replace the core of my computer for... about 15-20% more performance? It's just not worth it yet.
I agree. I went with 5800x3d as well. At this point in time, especially if you're on AM4, this processor is the sensible way forward.
Very excited to hear about this product.
Would have been nice if you asked him what an NPU does.
9:00
What about MGPU? AMD's Multi GPU system that allows to add same generation RDNA GPU, probably iGPU + discrete GPU too, but I cannot find tests or benchmarks about them. And perhaps for gamers it is worth the extra iGPU cost, or for productivity, to have monitors with the iGPU, and let the discrete GPU only process video.
Damn these guys i recently got a few 5700G's paired wit 6700XT's for some friends builds wanted AM5 Apus and now they drop when i went AM4
Does the npu work independently of the cpu or does the cpu suffer when npu is fully loaded?
Same bus and package, that said. No, that isn't a thing, think of it as another io die on the processor. It draws power and produces some heat, but it is so miniscule that it won't matter. You're more likely to notice the reduced clock speeds on the CPU cores, which is a characteristic lower binned dies anyway.
Nope, NPU is using lot less power
@@BusAlexey Yes but it still puts strain on the bus
@@bogganalseryd2324 AI is still in early development, you can't be sure it uses a big amount of bandwidth
Any chance on release of 5950x3d CPU?
I just got my bnew AM4 with Ryzen 7 due to budget constraints but damn the performance has been awesome especially I play mostly VR games. I know I can still hold on to this for a few more years. Unless AM5 becomes cheaper or something better would be introduced at the right price. I am always late to the party when upgrading as tech here in my country is very expensive. The good thing now a days, PC performance gap between generations is not as significant as before and the need to upgrade is no longer a luxury in most basic cases.
2:10 $299 USD? Are you sure that it's not a typo? All the marketing slides and announcements show that 8600g will cost $229.
Now, if they would still release drivers fro their new AM4 APUs
As an AM4 owner now, I just want a 5900X3D or 5950X3D to replace my current 5950X.
yea you should upgrade to am5 honestly after 2 years
AM4 with 2700 happy owner. I started thinking about getting a new PC when AM5 came out! :D So for me AM5 release and having an AM4 is a positive factor to AM5 adoption. The way I think is that instead of getting a new AM4 CPU, I 'll just wait until their prices drop VERY much, then I'll get that new and also a very cheap motherboard so I'll have in the 3 systems (2x AM4 and 1x AM5) for my homelab.
Fuild motion frames on the 8700g ?
Yes sir! That is enabled in the driver to be released before the 8700G is for sale on Jan 31
Can't for the 8700G review.
Wait. Is there going to be another CPU after the 5950x on AM4???!!!
I have a mini pc with a R5 2400g pro and 32gb of ram 2933mhz in my bedroom and it can run a lot of game in 1080p/900p this thing will be a beast .I also have a laptop with a 680m and it runs game really well at 1080p.
what is the difference between 7840hs vs 8840hs for laptop. Should I wait for 8840hs or go with last generation.
The biggest question I'm asking myself:
Why call those APUs 8700G and 8600G? Mobile APUs use the new naming scheme like 7840. Why aren't those APUs called 8740G and 8640G?
They are based on the mobile 8040 series. On top of that the mobile naming scheme is such so that AMD can use multiple parts... The second digit happens to be the most important, because it's the architecture ID, you can have an 8000 series in Mobile that is Zen 2 or Zen 3+. The desktop naming scheme simply doesn't contend with reality.
@@DuvJones You misunderstood my comment. Maybe I didn't phrase it clearly enough.
It's not about the 7xxx/8xxx. It's rather about 8x0x instead of 8x4x.
8700G is the old naming scheme while the new one has specific rules (how logical is another story).
Ryzen 7000 desktop CPUs don't use the new one because of reasons, fine, but then not use it for the new desktop APUs... When will they start using it in the desktop? With Zen5/Ryzen 9000?
It's not like I care that much for it... It's just stupid.
because anything launch at 2024 would start at 8
@@Soras_ Holy crap! What's so difficult to understand that AMD is using two different naming schemes here?!
That wasn't my point FFS!
this guy is just spitting transparent facts and i love it .
why you don't add subtitle in your video? is it very hard?
5950X3D do it !!, ASUS 570 Dark Hero and 570 ROG Crosshair
VIII Extreme users want it ! I know I do !!!
Still on 3900x does really well may grab a ryzen 5000 soon
Ryzen 5 8600G looks to be a sweetspot for the price to performance that it delivers. 80% of the iGPU performance and 95% of the CPU performance in 90% of all potential workloads. Virtually identical performance in Windows, web browsers, Adobe Photoshop, Premiere Pro and others compared to Ryzen 7 8700G.
I wish AMD will release a new revision of 6 nm Rembrand die with 20 lanes PCIe Gen 4 and DDR4 for AM4 socket.
Rembrant die all 6000U/H/HX/HS processors use a DDR5 design, they are not dual interface like intel.
They need more mother boards with usb 4 support to be honest
Waiting for a 5950x3d or the 5900x3d we were promised
this is how you market your product without saying bad about the competitor
5950X3D when ?
Cause you know - the best for the final 😎👍
And I know, this one would be ultra niche product ( and not cheap one) , but for some ppl that wanna something universal ( 16 cores while 8 with gigacache for games )
It would be great to see that aswell as the last golden nail to the AM4 era.
These APUs have a lot of ai capability. On paper they beat Apple’s M2 ultra. 39 TOPS vs 32 TOPS.
It’s such a shame then that they’re aren’t coming out with a version with higher memory bandwidth. This is critical for very large language models with 70 billion+ parameters.
Apple is selling their M2 ultras to AI enthusiasts like hot cakes. Is AMD afraid of making money? What’s going on with their product development?
Edit: made an error. It’s Qualcomm that has 45 TOPS. Still 39 TOPS is better than what Apple is offering.
Don't think they can handle that much
How does this lower barrier of entry when its so expensive? You could buy a still decent processor and faster discrete GPU for less?
I still have a piledriver CPU. 😢
Still got a first gen i5. Sadge.
I just replaced my system from that same era. I went from a 4770k with 32GB ram I built after Black Friday 2013 to a 14900k (Microcenter bundle) with 192GB ram, and geez what a difference even for the single threaded performance. Come summer I may regret not having a 7950X I can put in Eco Mode, but they didn't have any high end AMD bundles when I was shopping.
@@WilReid Half of your power is going to all that RAM anyway, and the Intel idle power is reportedly quite a bit lower even though the full load is higher.
AM4 is just sooooo good, AM5 is cool, but AM6 Z7 is where it's gonna be at, and that's what im saving for.
Please give us a 5950x 3D!
Hope Ryzen 9000 and maybe even 10000 is AM5.
ddr5 mobos being too expensive is the only problem for am5
And ram.
In April 2019 I did buy my ASRock B450 motherboard for $59.99, I consider moving to AM5 if they have motherboards for say $79.99. I'm have to upgrade my Ryzen 3 2200G, enough choice now in the 5000G series. .
Get the most cores/best 5000-series G processor there is...the Ryzen 7-5700G, assuming for some reason you are determined to never actually buy a discrete GPU. (The onboard graphics of 5700G still is below that of even a GTX1050 GPU from 7 years ago..)
asrock had one for 75 usd but the prices are higher now. I think it's due to the good reviews they have gotten.
And yet, no vision to develop dedicated VRAM DIMMs. Imagine a world where your APU can use either shared DDR RAM or DDR for CPU side and GDDR for GPU side. Those GDDR DIMMs could also be used for dedicated GPU cards, either as the sole memory or for expansion. If AMD did this, you know that Intel and Nvidia would follow.
Does not make business sense. It will stagnate development and dissolve segmentation. GPU memory needs way more cooling as well.
@@igitsolutions I disagree. They are already developing the GPUs and incorporating scaled down versions into their APUs. Segmentation will still be there, as the low-end cards have more cores than the high end cards APUs. As for cooling, they can put heatsinks on the DIMM package. In fact, since it would be different than the DDR DIMMs, they can make it any form factor they want to account for the cooling needed.
BTW, I used to rant about other things, like car makers should develop a standard way for 3rd parties to provide GPS navigation to their screens rather than forcing use of their crappy nav. "No way, they don't lose the money they make on nav!" Charge the same amount, just give the option to easily use a better nav module. If one car maker does it, others will follow to compete. Years later, we got something in the form of Apple CarPlay and Android Auto.
Give us a 5950x3D AMD
the real question is, is anyone going to be crazy enough to integrate ddr5 into am4 systems? asking as a dude who bought a 5950x during the shortage/scalper era (i paid msrp but it was a FIGHT to get one)
It will never happen. It is extremely expensive to develop something like this. Probably hundreds of millions of dollars.
Adding support for a new memory type is not something a hobbyist modder could do. AMD can do it, but not without expending millions on what is basically a new chip.
@jairo8746 I know I know but a fella can dream can't I 😅🤣🤣
AMD, Linux gaming gods.
I love am4 so much and dont want to switch
I love mine too, but I'll switch to am5 in the future and give my am4 to my sis =)
My only regret was that there was no 5900X whit IGP, I can live whit that but man, you newer know when you may need it,...
long live am4
$25 for 2 more cores between the 8600g and 8700g. Interesting.
NPU On Desktop, but only on Window$. Please provide support for linux, too
What happens if one uses a windows VM on linux, is it useable then?
it will come, new hardware will need new drivers & apis from software to tie into. Ideally on Linux it gets implemented in an open way like vulkan instead of cuda.
Amd plz make powerful ARM APU for handheld pc
Honestly they should do one last hurrah, release Zen 3+ on AM4 as 6000 series, alongside Zen 5 which should blow it out of the water anyways so budget/futureproof conscious people will both have choices. Then end AM4 for good
Now that Nvidia and AMD killed PC gaming with overpriced graphics cards, these APUs look a lot more interesting.
You don't need a discrete graphics card to run Microsoft office or watch RUclips videos.
Can you confirm that AM5 8000G APUs have 8 less PCIe lanes compared to AM5 CPUs?
The previous AM4 Zen 2 and 3 APUs had the same amount of PCIe lanes as the AM4 CPUs, be it Gen3 instead of Gen4.
8 less PCIe lanes would likely be taken away from the main x16 PCIe slot, otherwise all NVMe slots would be dead. That would reduce performance of current/future PCIe dGPUs you could add to a system with a 8700G, for example…
They have fewer lanes according to the specs published on the AMD website
Yeah, saw that, too and hope it‘s just a mistake.
The last time it was like this was with the AM4 Zen+ 2000G/3000G APUs that only had 8 (main PCIe Slot) + 4 (NVMe) + 4 (Chipset Interface) PCIe Lanes.
it's a minus 4 scenario on their website "Native PCIe Lanes (Total/Usable) 20 / 16" for the 8700G & "Native PCIe Lanes (Total/Usable) 24 / 20" for 7700X
The way most motherboards would implement this would be that the current gen 5 m.2 slot would probably be disabled having all NVME going through chipset & 16x gpu.
The other way to split would be 8x for gpu, 4x for 1 nvme, 4x for 1 nvme, 4x for chipset.
8000G processors have Gen4-only lanes, and Ryzen 5 8500G and 8300G supposedly only have 10 usable lanes of PCI-E, because they're Phoenix2 parts that are made for budget laptops without a dGPU. 8600G and 8700G have 20 Gen4 lanes, with 20 being usable, and Ryzen 7000 CPUs have 28 Gen5 lanes, with 24 being usable. Incidentally, it says that Ryzen 7000 series supports up to 128GB RAM, whereass Ryzen 8000G will support 256GB RAM.
Ryzen 5 8600G looks to be a sweetspot for the price to performance that it delivers. 80% of the iGPU performance and 95% of the CPU performance in 90% of all potential workloads. Virtually identical performance in Windows, web browsers, Adobe Photoshop, Premiere Pro and others compared to Ryzen 7 8700G.
That likely means the secondary 4 NVMe lanes are going to be sacrificed. :(
AM4's longevity shouldn't be a topic. AM5's should be
In the same response to the AM5 platform just as they did to AM4, I have no doubt AMD will be producing a Ryzen 7 7700X3D as well as a Ryzen 9 8900G with a more improved NPU cores in the near future to spite Intel at their weak spots. No doubt AMD is alive and kicking better than Intel. The only option for Intel now is to go on a price war.
Having Donny standing in front of Joel can looks quite ... bizarre ... to be honest.
the day the music died - it has to happen - amd needs to goto pci-e v6 and bring more lanes to consumer boards - if they can and will slash and burn sku jungle is unknown but there are just too many tiers imo. for gpu that need to add more ram and bring in cheap cxl implementations - business decisions rule and it is going to be a 5 year plan before ai reaches escape velocity - semiaccurate
0:30 Yeah Don what took you so long!?!?!
>:(
Talks about lowering the barrier to entry and expanding the user base after saying they're only gonna release the 8300g to OEMs.
BS radar pinged
APUS need to reach RX 6600 or GTX 2060 speeds in order to truly replace entry gaming systems. Until then the G series will be mostly powering grandma's pcs
I only play 1440, already have AM4, a 5800x3D CPU, and only need to upgrade my 2070 Super, would you just do that and stick with AM4 for another 4-5 years. Maybe a 4070 Super?
AMD never fixed AM5. My 7700X still takes 30 seconds to get past BIOS, and apparently I'm leaving tons of performance on the table by not running one of the special RAM kits whose secret timings work for AM5.
Stick to AM4.
Is it still the case that the iGPU gets disabled when you slot in a discrete GPU? I always thought this behavior sucked. The reasoning that the iGPU takes up PCI lanes is not convincing.
AMD on desktop cant afford to pull any rugs out on customers in their position. The potential problem is AMD is still proving its a budget brand, ao how long wnill customers expect that before you start pulling rugs out?
Those "new" AM4 chips are just failed bins of 5800x3d. 5600x3d has defective cores and 5700x3d is clocked lower because it cannot handle 5800x3d clocks. Come on, call them out instead of going with the marketing narrative.
04:01 Congratulations AMD for launching 6600G and 6700G in AM4, those 65W APUs with RDNA2 are going to retire much of the old generation PC such low price.
6600H and 6700H un-chained from laptop only.
Afaik there are no 6000 series rdna 2 apus for desktop.
What a dream you busy in
man, my 5900x is getting old.
If you already have a high end 7000 series CPU, then the 8000 series does appear to be like a series of meh processors coupled with NPUs and better onboard graphics, in which case if you also already have a high end GPU, would render it a pointless buy. Might even be a downgrade. I'm betting the next gen 9000 series processors will all come defaut with RDNA3 graphics and NPUs off the bat?
later this year when intel updates there will probably be a more direct replacement to the 7000 am5 chips. 8950x, 8700x3D, 8600 etc with chiplet design. the 8600g & 8700g are the laptop 7480u/7480hx/z1 extreme but on a desktop socket. "phoenix apu" the 8500g & 8300g are based off of "phoenix 2 apu"
So AMD do admit that NPU rn is pretty useless in desktop. Could be useful in mobile but barely any difference on desktop at least for now
If it was cheaper, then I change to AM5, but now it is still too expensive!
A slap on the wrist for MSI and its B450 motherboards... They do not release the AGESA 120B updates, as if they had not sold said motherboards with the promise of "longevity, compatibility", of course...
AM4 is dead on chipsets before B550, don't try to cover it under the rug.
I like Don, and I like AMD products. However, anyone who uses “but honestly” so often triggers my suspicion. I suggest he think about use of that phrase, especially for someone in marketing…an occupation known for slinging bs all too often.
I only play 1440, already have AM4, a 5800x3D CPU, and only need to upgrade my 2070 Super, would you just do that and stick with AM4 for another 4-5 years. Maybe a 4070 Super?
@@ThePalePatriot I would get a 3080 Ti or a 6800xt (depends on slush cash availability). I’m waiting for a couple years before upgrading my 5600x/3080 Ti, which runs great. Tho I’m not a frame rate nor ray tracing fanatic.
Honestly, I appreciate your feedback...
J/k! I think I was a bit nervous on camera, I kind of repeat myself and stammer a bit when I'm put on the spot. :)
AM4 motherboards are still way cheaper than AM5.
Thats because no one with any sense would build a dead end platform from all new parts. The new 5000 cpus are for people upgrading existing boards.
Sorry had to say this but...that AMD guy just feels like a normal salesman guy who doesnt know anything by the way he spoke and just repeat what his higher ups said "just keep telling em its great and nice" ...
And you would? 😅
Oh look.. the amd expert is in the chat 😂
He just talks more english than technical. Potential buyers need simple explanation because not everyone can follow " Hz, MB, am45 " talk.
@miloshp7399 but he's at CES talking to precifically a pc enthusiast youtube channel. A good sales person wont have just one single vanilla approach to every customer, this salesrep even acknowledged this youtuber was a "computer guy".
@@AthleticHobo-br4qhBro the guy is a desk jockey and he's been working CES for a week and there is a camera in his face. He wants to get in and out. Cut him some slack.
🎉
reth sogen & eolverinew
👍
AMD also proved they were willing to screw the first adopters of their AM4 platform when they are desperate enough to sell more motherboards really shows just how little they care about their customers. The fact that I had to wait 2 years before I could upgrade to a 5800X just cause I have an X370 motherboard is just unfair and just because they eventually changed their mind doesn't make it OK.
Yeah, crappy AMD willing to screw their customers! Should've gone with Intel, right mate?
LOL doesn't matter which company it is I know none of them is my friend and that none of them could be trusted I put my faith in AMD cause of the promise of long term support plus I knew they were trying to get back on their feet after Bulldozer pulled them down to the ground it's a lesson learned on my part as we all know the only reason AMD changed their minds and gave Ryzen 5000 support for 400 Series Motherboards was cause people were complaining loud enough but it still took over a year after that before they allowed Ryzen 5000 on 300 series Motherboards so AMD, Intel and Nvidia can go where the sun don't shine. @@mattpierce5009
20 fps with lag on a r7 7730 w/ 16 gb-------unplayable on bf 2042
Sucks that the new generation of Ryzen 3 are for OEM only. Not all budget gamers can afford an Ryzen 5 right away. I hope AMD will change their mind someday.
While it's cool that AMD still supports AM4, at the end of the day it's a dead end platform, which isn't actually cheaper than AM5 if you look at mid-range boards. More importantly, AMD seems to artificially keep the AM4 platform viable by refusing to release Athlons/Ryzen 3s for AM5! Even in their latest Ryzen 8000G announcements, the Ryzen 3 is OEM Only!!
DDR5 is already cheaper. AMD boy is living in 2021.
to be fair, these last few years kinda feel like a blur
DDR4 needs to get more expensive as well
Its the am5 boards that are heavy
AMD is tha 8 gen wold champion in APU. Osma tolti osma Veri good ..yeas ..yea AM4 weil raiz agen.. and agen as tha Weis is going ..caz way ..wel caz file is hard lol 🎉 😂 . Have a nice Day.. ther ar Aon may list for so long oomay good . A laptop witha a vega 10 APU and a Am4. Tha hole collection from athlon 3000 g gold to. R7 5700g. All of them yeaa if I cood . Just for tha test . I oredi have a A10 7850k yea ya on ddr3 na I shut a copal of moth a go gos Sam ddr 3 2400mhz gold vengen corsam.. wel dodo one happy day 😊😊😊😊
This guy gets it! Just be happy about new tech. 🤣
You can tell he obsoletely hates that AMD is supporting AM4 still. Spoiled youtuber thinks a new CPU automatically makes last gen irrelevant!