I thought I was used to everything being expensive, but those prices for the cassettes and chains made me wince. For disposable parts it's crazy -- I hope this isn't a precedent for other groupsets.
Bikes are so stupid expensive these days. Just go look at the price of brand new motorcycles! It is insane that a bike, that has no engine, alternator, electronic harness, carbs, radiators, fuel tanks, fuel lines, transmissions, clutches, headlights, blinkers, tachometers, DOT rated tires and wheels, beefy brakes and way burly suspension, can be more expensive than a brand new motorcycle. Bikes and bike parts are insanely overpriced.
@spencergiles574 yea man its ridiculous, did you watch the GMBN episode where the one guy they asked who works with carbon said the price of raw carbon material is stupid cheap compared to whats its sold for as a complete frame? But carbon "doesn't expire" no shit but the plastic resin holding it together does lol
Spot on! Lately I've been going the other way, with one-by Shimano Deore 11-speed set ups on my bikes. It's reliable and inexpensive to install and replace parts. And I get by fine with one less sprocket. Cheers
AdventX for me. All the range I need, works great, lasts well so far, and a new chain and cassette is $75. For everyone who is not an elite racer, SRAM has lost their minds.
I am running a 3x9 speed SRAM X7 derailleur from 2011 and triple oval Rotor front chain rings, both bought second hand. On a steel bike from 2008. Still working flawless. Bought these parts because I used the original Shimano parts for another steel second hand frame bike build which I later sold. My last build, mostly all second hand parts, is on a third hand steel On One Inbred frame which is also from 2008 I think. Two bikes, one soul. Parts can be swept, maintenance is dead cheap and bombproof. Gear range is awesome. Cost was less than a XO drivetrain. I wonder how long it takes for these new standards to become obsolete and when they do if still will be able to get replacement parts then. I wouldn’t put my money on this new stuff as far as that’s concerned.
it's cheaper than the outgoing XO1 AXS full group, you do realize that right? and yes it is the future of mountain biking. at least you were half right.
i'm glad you mentioned the price, and felt it was a bit hefty. alot of "bike" sites dont really talk about it. these new technologies will trickle down from the top of the range stuff and be more "affordable". BUT bike companies aren't reinventing the wheel they are just tweeking designs that have been around for years. i understand that having an app to adjust the setup will cost money to create. I've always felt that all bike related parts are more expensive than they need to be. i'm glad that companies like ltwoo and sensah exist. i'll be looking to utilize their components when i put my gravel build together
@tweed0929 wait a few more after that and you'll have to pay a monthly subscription to use your electro shifting, and if you want even "MORE reliable" shifting it will run you extra 😂
Whew! That was a lot of info. Thank you for being so thorough. It will be interesting to see how all of this affects standards and tech moving forward.
I have SRAM NX on my FS (UDH equipped) bike, Eagle AXS XX1 on my HT (non-UDH) bike. They’re both great! I’ve had Eagle AXS for four years and I can’t wait to try ET. Up to now, the only thing 12spd. Shimano XTR does better is shifting under power. If ET durability is as good as Eagle AXS AND it shifts well under full power, then it seems worth the money. The flattop chain and cassette will probably last a looooong time, btw. My Eagle AXS chain and cassette are still going! I get that this isn’t for everyone. Racers will fund the development of lower cost versions, if history repeats. Until then, enjoy what you have, even if it’s a $400 NX group set.
OK why is this good thing? Regardless of price the whole goal of the der hanger is to be sacrificial - ie they break and this is a good thing. So now we have a very rigid der tied right into the dropout, and when we crash and we all crash how is this going to go?
Would love an update if you start getting a feel for how much shorter the battery life is on this new transmission compared to the older SRAM wireless systems.
The previous model year lasted 4 chains for me compared to the 2 I usually make it through. Srams cassettes are great for durability, but yeah they're not cheap
interesting that Sram comes out with this on the high end while shimano seems to be focusing on the low-end with their new universal 9 to 11 speed drivetrains.
Because Sram has given up the fight against Shimano in the mid and lower groups and is leaving this field to them. OEMs prefer Shimano there. In addition, Sram would have to face the growing numbers of smaller manufacturers from Taiwan and China there. If you look at Srams development like this, then they have eliminated everything "unsporty" in the last few years and are now mainly concentrating on the market for sporty ambitious riders.
@@CycloTourist this makes sense, I am relatively new to cycling as sport so not really knowledgeable about market segments in a historical perspective. Thanks for the addition. You're right, there's also some interesting chinese manufacturers coming with shimano competitors (like Ltwoo)... I hope more competition will translate to better offer for us on the "lower" end of the spectrum and faster trickle-down of technology.
the engineering is super cool and functionality with etap is nice but I cannot see it worth the price tag or the full component commitment. I don't want to drop $2k or whatever just to compensate for my bad shifting technique...
If I wanted to run Transmission on my 142mm (non-boost) gravel frame, what kind of chainline and crankset do I need? My current Eason EC90SL has a 47mm chainline, which I assume will not be optimal.
Let me get this strait, when you crash the derailleur will now bork your frame? Also, frame manufactures rely on the loose tolerances allowed by derailleur hangers and through-axle surfaces are rarely perfect, since this derailleur lacks the adjustment allowed by the hanger it will need some other kind of adjustment mechanism, which isn't immediately apparent. I'm usually a SRAM fan, but this looks like a very poorly thought out design.
Its been almost a year now since this video came out. I acquired this transmission, with the purchase of an Epic Evo. Love the bike but I'm not bonding with the transmission. No way I'd race with it just yet. It might be for sale, if i can get comfortable with it.
Just pointing out here that if we compare an EAGLE transmission XO level at $1600 to the outgoing EAGLE AXS XO1 groupset at $1900 I'm having a hard time with the CONSTANT statements that it comes at a higher price point.... it's literally cheaper... a lot cheaper. That is all folks.
Please tell me that it is compatible with SRAM Red Axis chain rings and shifters. I have a specialized crux with a UDH hanger and want to set this up with as a mullet!!!! But wound need a 40-44 tooth chain ring up front. Will that work??? Please say yes or if not do they offer a bigger chain rings with the eagle xx SL? Very excited about this possibility
How can I put a 42 or 44 tooth chain ring on this group set. Is any thing else compatible? They don’t sell anything bigger then a 36 on there web Page. Thanks for your help.
The hanger is the failure point by design. I'd rather break a hanger than a derailleur or worst, dropout. I'm confused as to what problem does this design solve? And that gimmick of the derailleur moving in is... not impressive. Any impact higher and it won't matter...
I hate the direction bikes are going... The only thing I find impressive is the jocky wheel that will still spin if something gets in it's spokes. I will always ride a bike that doesn't need batteries for operation, even if I have to stock up on parts for the hopefully 20 or so years I have left breathing. I miss the 9-speed Shimano days, where everything can be mixed & matched.
With these pricing policies, the eentire biking business needs a shakeup in the form of most of the companies setting these prices going out of business. It's like they're trying to match the price of e-bikes for pedal bikes.
My next bike - and my current - is/will be aluminum with mechanical derailleur and a hanger. And I’ll put that more-than-great Shimano XT LinkGlide drive train on it for fast, smooth shifting under load … for $330. And I’ll replace the chain for $30 every year or so and the cassette for $160 every 3 yrs. Thanks all the same …
An app to adjust the derailleur😂 I’m waiting to upgrade until they offer neural implants for completely hands free shifting.. And I’m gonna need some lasers on there somewhere.
No, thanks. I'll stick to my affordable mechanical stuff. Oh, and by the way, there are rumors circulating around Campagnolo sticking to mechanical groupos, because they do understand that there's huge market of old bicycles that need to be maintained. Just saying ;)
If the gravel bike uses UDH, likely yes. For example, Fezzari has created a UDH version of their Shafer frame and is offering it with SRAM Transmission.
I pulled a steel Shimano Eagle derailleur out of the derailleurs bin, and it's silent and flawless on the five speed. Course, you do need to be able to discern the chain being centered on cog. Which means you might have to leave your damn noisy smartphone on the dresser. For a change. Jesus. This is what happened to Volvo after the 240 got phased out.
In my opinion electronic shifting is less about innovation and consumer advantages and (if not now, eventually) more about locking the consumer into a manufacturers ecosystem and planned forced obsolescence. What happens when sram (or shimano, etc.) decide not to produce the battery for your system in a compatible package, to no longer support the app on the version of phone / mobile os that you use, not offering replacement parts at a price point that makes sense, etc. At that point you will probably have no recourse other than to upgrade, which could be a whole drivetrain and shifting replacement. Just my two shifts on what could happen. Time will tell.
Sram's been using the same battery since etap's release in 2015, there's also quite the aftermarket support for them. Shimano is on its 3rd battery now, iirc.
@@cosinus_square that may be the case, but ultimately the one that controls the firmware, software and supply chain of replacement parts ultimately owns the system, and can do what they like regardless of what would be in the best interest of the end consumer.
@@cosinus_square Yeah that is 2015. My bike for the city is from 1990-2000 and I can still get parts. Do you think they are going to be updating the app for 30+ years?
@@chuckyfox9284 why does it need constant updating? We have cars from the '80's working fine on their original software. It only needs to shift gears, which works without an app.
@@sean6417 I'm not worried at all. People have been re-cell'ing their shimano batteries for ages, easy to 3d print a common battery cell holder into a Sram form factor battery.
So, at the end of the day, what problem did we solve? What did we improve to justify these prices? Slightly better shifting performance that hardly anyone was complaining about in the first place? Minimal compatibility for (dare i say the "majority") most of the viewers of Bikepacking that ride oddball bikes. Oh greedy Sram.
Let me add that bike/component manufacturers are just making it harder and harder to introduce people to the sport with the constant uptick in prices. I realize life is getting more expensive, but the price increases of bike stuff is way beyond unison to other increases in life. I remember just a few years ago, it was hard to get people to jump over that $500 mark for an entry level bike. Now, $1000 still only gets you a very heavy bike with a crappy drivetrain. 😕
I just built a new cargo fatbike with 2x11 Di2. The truly wireless setup of SRAM is soooo sexy, but it just doesn't give me the range a 2x setup can, and I'm too old and fat now to go bikepacking with 1x. 😅 38/28 and 11-46 gives some pretty good range, and I think I can get away with a couple more teeth on the big ring, and/or a couple smaller on the small ring. Since the Di2 system makes sure I never run big-big or small-small, there is just extra capacity since the extreme limits are never reached. 40/26 with an 11-46 cassette anyone?
@@spencergiles72 and they'll clear an 11-46 cassette? Even with a Wolftooth Goatlink my GRX and Ultegra rear der's will only clear a 40 tooth reliably. With an XT rear der I didn't have to get a longer link to clear a 46, and it controls the front mech shifting automatically so I only have to use a single shifter. Not saying SRAM doesn't have 2x, I just didn't find a combination that had the same range in 2x, and as a matter of personal preference I do like 11 speed over 12 for durability. I'm no SRAM lineup expert, and it's possible I missed a combination of components that will work flat bar or drop bar 2x with that range and automatic front der shifting, and maybe my less than great experience with 12 speed SRAM Eagle GX durability was just bad luck. I also have other 11 speed Shimano equipped bikes, so the benefits of building with some common components is of value to me as well.
I want 50/34 with a 10-52 cassette and drop bar shifters. Then I can do fast and light road rides and slog up a hill with a fully loaded weekend setup.
Planned Obsolescence, on many levels . . . very sad in my opinion. What used to be a great entry point for learning basic mechanics is now captured by over-engineering, with its' attendant consumer-dependency drafting so closely behind that many won't see it until they've already irrevocably bought-in. I prefer technologies that are more holistically beneficial to the human side of the equation. We all have our quirks. I happily claim this as one of mine.
6:57 Use #438 of a reusable chopstick. As for the drive train, not even remotely interested. This mess is for people that use Apple computers. Ecosystem electronics suck.
This is a fantastic, let me repeat myself, because this is what I really am thinking this is a fantastic set up!! Why do I like that. But you didn’t mention how long the battery lasts you know worst case scenario what’s the least amount of time the battery would last.
I'm already hoarding older drivetrain components and parts as I'm slowly nailing down some nice steel and titanium forever frames to drape them from. Electronic drivetrains only benefit the manufacturers in that they are the equivalent of fast fashion, making riding bikes both cost prohibitive and unsustainable.
There is nothing earth shattering with the new rear derailleur to me, just a massive waste of money before gearbox systems arrive, I hope. The thing is, I rather go back to more simpler/older mtb tech than adopt the overpriced crap we are marketed to buy.
@tweed0929 let alone a whole new derailleur to go along with it, maybe they'll offer a monthly insurance (subscription) plan in the event the derailleur snaps or it snaps your bike?? Would be very kind and thoughtful of them no?? And for the sake of having "MORE reliable" shifting, I dont think they've come this far having "less reliable" shitty shifting all of these years. It sure is starting to look like people in the bike world should start buying and stocking up on their favorite cable actuated groupsets before everything goes digital and they make us pay a monthly cost for "MORE reliable" shifting
@@wheelzandgillz not to mention that when the new groupset will be released, they'll stop producing batteries for their old stuff, thusly making the stuff obsolete again. This vicious circle will never end. I'm stocking my nice mechanical, cable-actuated stuff from now on.
This is not improvement. Just making user maintenance inaccessible/impossible. If you want your LBS to evolve into an Apple Store type vibe, go for it!
I hate it. Last thing I want on my bike is another battery. I feel like the industry is shoving us all into this electronic shifting and I want not part of it. I want a simple system and if I bend a hanger... I bend a hanger. Big deal. I guess I just start buying spares and shifters.
Sounds good, but I think 90% of this groupset is for maketing hype lol They really scrap the end of the barrel of finding "innovations", finding expensive solutions on minor problems.
I'm so glad I ride SS.
I thought I was used to everything being expensive, but those prices for the cassettes and chains made me wince. For disposable parts it's crazy -- I hope this isn't a precedent for other groupsets.
Bikes are so stupid expensive these days. Just go look at the price of brand new motorcycles! It is insane that a bike, that has no engine, alternator, electronic harness, carbs, radiators, fuel tanks, fuel lines, transmissions, clutches, headlights, blinkers, tachometers, DOT rated tires and wheels, beefy brakes and way burly suspension, can be more expensive than a brand new motorcycle.
Bikes and bike parts are insanely overpriced.
@spencergiles574 yea man its ridiculous, did you watch the GMBN episode where the one guy they asked who works with carbon said the price of raw carbon material is stupid cheap compared to whats its sold for as a complete frame? But carbon "doesn't expire" no shit but the plastic resin holding it together does lol
Spot on! Lately I've been going the other way, with one-by Shimano Deore 11-speed set ups on my bikes. It's reliable and inexpensive to install and replace parts.
And I get by fine with one less sprocket.
Cheers
I run 2x10 grx 400. I just replaced my 11-34 cassette and chain for a total of 35€. Who pays 600$ for a cassette, holy shit.
AdventX for me. All the range I need, works great, lasts well so far, and a new chain and cassette is $75. For everyone who is not an elite racer, SRAM has lost their minds.
The most underrated driver out there.
Don’t forget, also easy to change out a front ring for more or less gear according to your application.
I am running a 3x9 speed SRAM X7 derailleur from 2011 and triple oval Rotor front chain rings, both bought second hand. On a steel bike from 2008. Still working flawless. Bought these parts because I used the original Shimano parts for another steel second hand frame bike build which I later sold. My last build, mostly all second hand parts, is on a third hand steel On One Inbred frame which is also from 2008 I think. Two bikes, one soul. Parts can be swept, maintenance is dead cheap and bombproof. Gear range is awesome. Cost was less than a XO drivetrain. I wonder how long it takes for these new standards to become obsolete and when they do if still will be able to get replacement parts then. I wouldn’t put my money on this new stuff as far as that’s concerned.
$1600 groupset mounted on a $800 bike mounted to the roof of a $400 car heading to the trails...this is the future of mountain biking folks.😅
lol
No price grunt from me even I think it is $$$. Rather applaud innovation!
it's cheaper than the outgoing XO1 AXS full group, you do realize that right? and yes it is the future of mountain biking. at least you were half right.
Yes, but i want to see prices on the bikes with this on...
i'm glad you mentioned the price, and felt it was a bit hefty. alot of "bike" sites dont really talk about it. these new technologies will trickle down from the top of the range stuff and be more "affordable". BUT bike companies aren't reinventing the wheel they are just tweeking designs that have been around for years. i understand that having an app to adjust the setup will cost money to create. I've always felt that all bike related parts are more expensive than they need to be. i'm glad that companies like ltwoo and sensah exist. i'll be looking to utilize their components when i put my gravel build together
Makes me want to just get a Rohloff: Same price/weight, more reliable, and easier to use.
Or a pinion gearbox bike
Make mechanical great again 😊
-Shimano
I can get behind that.
@@tuftschristopher, you might be joking. Even Shimano 105 is Di2 now. Wait a couple of years and Shimano Cues will be electronic too.
@tweed0929 wait a few more after that and you'll have to pay a monthly subscription to use your electro shifting, and if you want even "MORE reliable" shifting it will run you extra 😂
Whew! That was a lot of info. Thank you for being so thorough. It will be interesting to see how all of this affects standards and tech moving forward.
Shimano, TRP and Microshift all sent flowers to SRAM with a great big thank you written on the card.
Have you seen this? wheelbased.com/2022/09/28/rear-derailleur-by-shimano/
That said that new TRP group looks great.
Insane ...... SLX and be done with it.
Would love a wireless derailleur but not when it cost more than my current bike brand new.
I have SRAM NX on my FS (UDH equipped) bike, Eagle AXS XX1 on my HT (non-UDH) bike. They’re both great!
I’ve had Eagle AXS for four years and I can’t wait to try ET. Up to now, the only thing 12spd. Shimano XTR does better is shifting under power. If ET durability is as good as Eagle AXS AND it shifts well under full power, then it seems worth the money. The flattop chain and cassette will probably last a looooong time, btw. My Eagle AXS chain and cassette are still going!
I get that this isn’t for everyone. Racers will fund the development of lower cost versions, if history repeats. Until then, enjoy what you have, even if it’s a $400 NX group set.
OK why is this good thing? Regardless of price the whole goal of the der hanger is to be sacrificial - ie they break and this is a good thing. So now we have a very rigid der tied right into the dropout, and when we crash and we all crash how is this going to go?
They wanna see some broken bikes...
so you give sram more 🤑🤑 when you crash because you need to buy a whole new derailleur instead of a $15 hanger
Would love an update if you start getting a feel for how much shorter the battery life is on this new transmission compared to the older SRAM wireless systems.
I chew through at least 2 cassettes a year. No way the $600 cost of this cassette is 10x long lasting than a $60 cassette.
The previous model year lasted 4 chains for me compared to the 2 I usually make it through. Srams cassettes are great for durability, but yeah they're not cheap
interesting that Sram comes out with this on the high end while shimano seems to be focusing on the low-end with their new universal 9 to 11 speed drivetrains.
Because Sram has given up the fight against Shimano in the mid and lower groups and is leaving this field to them. OEMs prefer Shimano there. In addition, Sram would have to face the growing numbers of smaller manufacturers from Taiwan and China there. If you look at Srams development like this, then they have eliminated everything "unsporty" in the last few years and are now mainly concentrating on the market for sporty ambitious riders.
Shimano has always owned the low-end market, globally.
@@CycloTourist this makes sense, I am relatively new to cycling as sport so not really knowledgeable about market segments in a historical perspective. Thanks for the addition. You're right, there's also some interesting chinese manufacturers coming with shimano competitors (like Ltwoo)... I hope more competition will translate to better offer for us on the "lower" end of the spectrum and faster trickle-down of technology.
I can't even bother to swap out my hg freehub to run a gx cassette on my bike because the nx are massively cheaper, So this is insane 😂
Nice one Neil
Is my calendar off. Is it actually April 1st?
My intention is putting it on a Yuba Mundo. Hopefully that will work with that.
We need more comments like this one. s#%t's getting too serious.
magic pulley is on the xx and the xx sl versions.
the engineering is super cool and functionality with etap is nice but I cannot see it worth the price tag or the full component commitment. I don't want to drop $2k or whatever just to compensate for my bad shifting technique...
Thank you for still drinking actual beer.
Why not loose the derailleur all together? Belt drive hub gear that actually perform & lightweight will be ideal
$600 for a cassette, oh my......
$600 for a wear item indeed.
and 200$ for the chain 😁 dentist's groupset
Right. It's a set of cogs, ffs! These should cost no more than 40 buckaroos.
Hold on, we're going back to direct mount derailleurs?
Yes. People love the sound of broken carbon! Lol!
@@rafaeldegiacomoaraujo8778 if I could afford carbon I'd buy titanium
@@seanflorian4653 Me too
Would it work with the Tailfin Aeropack Axle quick release mount?
No, but I spoke to Tailfin and they mentioned they have something in the works. This spring.
May be I missed this info but does this set work with a mountain bike from 2009?
If I wanted to run Transmission on my 142mm (non-boost) gravel frame, what kind of chainline and crankset do I need? My current Eason EC90SL has a 47mm chainline, which I assume will not be optimal.
Let me get this strait, when you crash the derailleur will now bork your frame? Also, frame manufactures rely on the loose tolerances allowed by derailleur hangers and through-axle surfaces are rarely perfect, since this derailleur lacks the adjustment allowed by the hanger it will need some other kind of adjustment mechanism, which isn't immediately apparent. I'm usually a SRAM fan, but this looks like a very poorly thought out design.
see peak torque video on these criticisms
Some promising new tech there, but call me back when it applies to a mechanical drivetrain.
I imagine that wouldn't be possible.
Its been almost a year now since this video came out. I acquired this transmission, with the purchase of an Epic Evo. Love the bike but I'm not bonding with the transmission. No way I'd race with it just yet. It might be for sale, if i can get comfortable with it.
Just pointing out here that if we compare an EAGLE transmission XO level at $1600 to the outgoing EAGLE AXS XO1 groupset at $1900 I'm having a hard time with the CONSTANT statements that it comes at a higher price point.... it's literally cheaper... a lot cheaper. That is all folks.
Please tell me that it is compatible with SRAM Red Axis chain rings and shifters. I have a specialized crux with a UDH hanger and want to set this up with as a mullet!!!! But wound need a 40-44 tooth chain ring up front. Will that work??? Please say yes or if not do they offer a bigger chain rings with the eagle xx SL? Very excited about this possibility
How can I put a 42 or 44 tooth chain ring on this group set. Is any thing else compatible? They don’t sell anything bigger then a 36 on there web Page. Thanks for your help.
The hanger is the failure point by design. I'd rather break a hanger than a derailleur or worst, dropout. I'm confused as to what problem does this design solve? And that gimmick of the derailleur moving in is... not impressive. Any impact higher and it won't matter...
a sale boost problem I think
I hate the direction bikes are going... The only thing I find impressive is the jocky wheel that will still spin if something gets in it's spokes. I will always ride a bike that doesn't need batteries for operation, even if I have to stock up on parts for the hopefully 20 or so years I have left breathing. I miss the 9-speed Shimano days, where everything can be mixed & matched.
With these pricing policies, the eentire biking business needs a shakeup in the form of most of the companies setting these prices going out of business. It's like they're trying to match the price of e-bikes for pedal bikes.
My next bike - and my current - is/will be aluminum with mechanical derailleur and a hanger. And I’ll put that more-than-great Shimano XT LinkGlide drive train on it for fast, smooth shifting under load … for $330. And I’ll replace the chain for $30 every year or so and the cassette for $160 every 3 yrs. Thanks all the same …
An app to adjust the derailleur😂 I’m waiting to upgrade until they offer neural implants for completely hands free shifting.. And I’m gonna need some lasers on there somewhere.
No, thanks. I'll stick to my affordable mechanical stuff. Oh, and by the way, there are rumors circulating around Campagnolo sticking to mechanical groupos, because they do understand that there's huge market of old bicycles that need to be maintained. Just saying ;)
Will it fit a gravel bike?
If the gravel bike uses UDH, likely yes. For example, Fezzari has created a UDH version of their Shafer frame and is offering it with SRAM Transmission.
I pulled a steel Shimano Eagle derailleur out of the derailleurs bin, and it's silent and flawless on the five speed. Course, you do need to be able to discern the chain being centered on cog. Which means you might have to leave your damn noisy smartphone on the dresser. For a change. Jesus.
This is what happened to Volvo after the 240 got phased out.
Holy cow, 200$ for a chain!!??
yes ! watched it twice
You lost me at electronics and batteries.
I'm a mechanic and machinist, bicycles are simple things and that is their beauty.
In my opinion electronic shifting is less about innovation and consumer advantages and (if not now, eventually) more about locking the consumer into a manufacturers ecosystem and planned forced obsolescence. What happens when sram (or shimano, etc.) decide not to produce the battery for your system in a compatible package, to no longer support the app on the version of phone / mobile os that you use, not offering replacement parts at a price point that makes sense, etc. At that point you will probably have no recourse other than to upgrade, which could be a whole drivetrain and shifting replacement.
Just my two shifts on what could happen. Time will tell.
Sram's been using the same battery since etap's release in 2015, there's also quite the aftermarket support for them.
Shimano is on its 3rd battery now, iirc.
@@cosinus_square that may be the case, but ultimately the one that controls the firmware, software and supply chain of replacement parts ultimately owns the system, and can do what they like regardless of what would be in the best interest of the end consumer.
@@cosinus_square Yeah that is 2015. My bike for the city is from 1990-2000 and I can still get parts. Do you think they are going to be updating the app for 30+ years?
@@chuckyfox9284 why does it need constant updating? We have cars from the '80's working fine on their original software. It only needs to shift gears, which works without an app.
@@sean6417 I'm not worried at all. People have been re-cell'ing their shimano batteries for ages, easy to 3d print a common battery cell holder into a Sram form factor battery.
Getting rid of the hanger makes no sense. Peak Torque nails it on his review.
So, at the end of the day, what problem did we solve? What did we improve to justify these prices? Slightly better shifting performance that hardly anyone was complaining about in the first place? Minimal compatibility for (dare i say the "majority") most of the viewers of Bikepacking that ride oddball bikes. Oh greedy Sram.
Let me add that bike/component manufacturers are just making it harder and harder to introduce people to the sport with the constant uptick in prices. I realize life is getting more expensive, but the price increases of bike stuff is way beyond unison to other increases in life. I remember just a few years ago, it was hard to get people to jump over that $500 mark for an entry level bike. Now, $1000 still only gets you a very heavy bike with a crappy drivetrain. 😕
The gizmos are designed to last 1 season. Keep lapping it up
I just built a new cargo fatbike with 2x11 Di2. The truly wireless setup of SRAM is soooo sexy, but it just doesn't give me the range a 2x setup can, and I'm too old and fat now to go bikepacking with 1x. 😅
38/28 and 11-46 gives some pretty good range, and I think I can get away with a couple more teeth on the big ring, and/or a couple smaller on the small ring. Since the Di2 system makes sure I never run big-big or small-small, there is just extra capacity since the extreme limits are never reached.
40/26 with an 11-46 cassette anyone?
lol I love your gear range. I feel like a dork with my 3x9 but its a pleasure to just spin up hills.
@@joevuch7981 for real. I can't stand on the pedals for 5+ minutes up a hill cranking it out at low RPM's like I used to.
You can get SRAM wireless 2x though... SRAM AXS XPLR, Rival, Force, Red, etc all offer 2x setups.
@@spencergiles72 and they'll clear an 11-46 cassette? Even with a Wolftooth Goatlink my GRX and Ultegra rear der's will only clear a 40 tooth reliably. With an XT rear der I didn't have to get a longer link to clear a 46, and it controls the front mech shifting automatically so I only have to use a single shifter. Not saying SRAM doesn't have 2x, I just didn't find a combination that had the same range in 2x, and as a matter of personal preference I do like 11 speed over 12 for durability. I'm no SRAM lineup expert, and it's possible I missed a combination of components that will work flat bar or drop bar 2x with that range and automatic front der shifting, and maybe my less than great experience with 12 speed SRAM Eagle GX durability was just bad luck.
I also have other 11 speed Shimano equipped bikes, so the benefits of building with some common components is of value to me as well.
I want 50/34 with a 10-52 cassette and drop bar shifters. Then I can do fast and light road rides and slog up a hill with a fully loaded weekend setup.
Maybe a GRX... nothing below. Build cost would price it out...
i ride my epic to hard on single track. No thanks, my mechanical and cables do just fine for me. love my EPIC
So its much heavier and twice as expensive as its predecessor. A derailleur hanger is not expensive or difficult to replace. Where is the benefit ?
When the total package price.drops to $100 I'm in!
Is that a singlespeed joke, Lol.
As a roadie, this means absolutely nothing.
These prices are just ridiculus...i stay with mechanical as long they are available..
Planned Obsolescence, on many levels . . . very sad in my opinion.
What used to be a great entry point for learning basic mechanics is now captured by over-engineering, with its' attendant consumer-dependency drafting so closely behind that many won't see it until they've already irrevocably bought-in.
I prefer technologies that are more holistically beneficial to the human side of the equation. We all have our quirks. I happily claim this as one of mine.
Price is shocking
First Ride? Did not see any in the video.
Woof… that’s pretty heavy considering the price.
6:57 Use #438 of a reusable chopstick. As for the drive train, not even remotely interested. This mess is for people that use Apple computers. Ecosystem electronics suck.
This is a fantastic, let me repeat myself, because this is what I really am thinking this is a fantastic set up!! Why do I like that. But you didn’t mention how long the battery lasts you know worst case scenario what’s the least amount of time the battery would last.
why does the "cheapest" crankset look the best🤔... whatever, if you want one you better get the cash now befote your bank is gone ✌️
I'm already hoarding older drivetrain components and parts as I'm slowly nailing down some nice steel and titanium forever frames to drape them from. Electronic drivetrains only benefit the manufacturers in that they are the equivalent of fast fashion, making riding bikes both cost prohibitive and unsustainable.
How much your having a laugh, that will be no thanks !
There is nothing earth shattering with the new rear derailleur to me, just a massive waste of money before gearbox systems arrive, I hope. The thing is, I rather go back to more simpler/older mtb tech than adopt the overpriced crap we are marketed to buy.
Bye bye $30 mech hanger, hello brand new bike from a snapped dropout/chain stay!!
Yeah, mate, I hear ya. This newfangled SRAM product reeks on disposable.
@tweed0929 let alone a whole new derailleur to go along with it, maybe they'll offer a monthly insurance (subscription) plan in the event the derailleur snaps or it snaps your bike?? Would be very kind and thoughtful of them no?? And for the sake of having "MORE reliable" shifting, I dont think they've come this far having "less reliable" shitty shifting all of these years. It sure is starting to look like people in the bike world should start buying and stocking up on their favorite cable actuated groupsets before everything goes digital and they make us pay a monthly cost for "MORE reliable" shifting
@@wheelzandgillz not to mention that when the new groupset will be released, they'll stop producing batteries for their old stuff, thusly making the stuff obsolete again. This vicious circle will never end.
I'm stocking my nice mechanical, cable-actuated stuff from now on.
This is not improvement. Just making user maintenance inaccessible/impossible. If you want your LBS to evolve into an Apple Store type vibe, go for it!
I hate it. Last thing I want on my bike is another battery. I feel like the industry is shoving us all into this electronic shifting and I want not part of it. I want a simple system and if I bend a hanger... I bend a hanger. Big deal. I guess I just start buying spares and shifters.
그래도 행어가 따로 있는게 좋을꺼 같은대 .....
🤔
Sounds good, but I think 90% of this groupset is for maketing hype lol
They really scrap the end of the barrel of finding "innovations", finding expensive solutions on minor problems.
Waste of money, designed for LazE bikes and are too expensive and heavy
Not with my money !
More batteries and expensive gadgets for the wealthy cyclist!
yeah again sram forcing a new standard lel
anyway this is ridiculous from my stand point 3x9 sufficient for my need
it’s not a lag, it’s a feature, lmao