3 things. These engines are complex to maintain. Producing the fuel is very energy inefficient as a large amounts of energy is needed. Currently deployed transaction batteries do not use cobot. One major concern is the fuel is very explosive, much more than petrol. Currently batteries used in vehicles look to have a life span vastly more than expected , looking to the 500.000 mile range. Fueling electric vehicles involves easier to deploy solar infrastructure which can be used by the general householder.
Hydrogen wull only work when produced on site (at the filling station) and with a primary source of energy that is unusually inexpensive. This is because its round trip efficiency is roughly 30%. A good example of a low-cost primary sourcr of energy is in places where volcanic activity is close enough to the surface to make low-cost geothermal energy possible. Batter-electric is only practical in the long run only with a robust recycling industry and the rejection of the urban automobile as a primary transportation system. This, I am convined, is the scary reality.
@@bobcornwell403 - electricity has a similar issue, where centrally provided electricity can’t do fast charging of EV’s, so inverters & batteries must be deployed at car charging stations. H2 tanks at point of filling is so much less complex than batteries & inverters at point of charging. (Those charging station batteries will have to be constantly replaced, even more quickly than car batteries.)
On April 24, 2003, Iceland became the first nation to open a public hydrogen filling station in conjunction with Shell Oil Company. The technology for hydrogen fuel cell vehicles is over two decades old. All of the major auto manufacturers have been experimenting with various forms of alternative fuel sources for years. Perhaps Toyota can be the first to bring this technology to the Main Street showroom at an affordable price? The problem isn't the automobile's technology; rather, the infrastructure needed to be able to reliably refuel anywhere. This is where the free market comes into play. Let the public decide which energy source is best.
It's like the video ignores the real issues. Infrastructure- there is a reason there is no Infrastructure. Storage is expensive as keeping stable is different and expensive. Density- is the biggest issue not mentioned. In order on the same footings as other EV tech, hydrogen has to be compressed to extreme levels ie 10,000 psi which produce heat which is not hydrogen's friend. These are technology issues that have not been solved to where costs are in the same hemisphere as other technology. These are completely ignored in the video. As a bonus combustion hydrogen is even more expensive than EV Hydrogen in every way manufacturing and operating costs.
“Infrastructure” - pipe line natural gas. Various natural gas lines have been reused for hydrogen and existing natural gas lines already pipe a percentage of hydrogen. We take existing natural gas lines, continue adding H2 as a percentage, and increase percentage as infrastructure needs replacement. “Storage” - it is cheap & various, ranging to expensive for space travel. H2 is held in tanks. There is not only one tank pressure, different PSI for different applications, thus different costs. “Compression… heat” - electricity has the same problem, where transmission sees energy lost in heat along electrical lines. Because heat is generated at a central location, heat generated in H2 compression can be captured & reused as central excess heat is reused around urban centers today, vs heat lost across the globe in electricity transfer. - the true benefit of hydrogen is cheap & simple storage in comparison to electricity. Today, EV charging stations must deploy huge batteries & inverters, just to charge cars with huge batteries & inverters. Producing H2 in offshore windmills, pipe H2 to the mainland, and supplement additional existing distribution facilities is a huge win. Transition from burning H2 to fuel cell can be done over time. Engines today can work on H2 & gas, with the changing of injectors & software. Fuel cells today can work on natural gas or H2. Warehouses around the world use natural gas & H2 forklifts today, because performance is more predictable than battery… and transition from natural gas [with H2] to pure H2 is evolutionary, not revolutionary like battery / electrical infrastructure. Honestly, H2 is not that heavy a lift, from where we are today.
@@DavidHalko ah, natural gas and hydrogen can flow in the same pipe for a hot minute but hydrogen will break down most natural gas pipes making them brittle, that is a NO. Storage is not cheap. To store hydrogen, temperature control with hydrogen has to be accounted. The higher the pressure the more temperature control has to be accounted for in both the filling of the vehicle and the storage facility that is distributing the gas. You need the high pressure to get any kind of comparable range with hydrogen, so storage is expensive if you want to compare apples to apples. Compression Heat, is not the same as electricity. Yes it’s true there is heat loss on electrical lines but it’s a small percentage of total energy. Hydrogen is not efficient. It cost 3x to have the equivalent hydrogen density 10k psi as gas. Then when you pump 10k psi into a tank it heats up but hydrogen expands and heats the tank more under hot conditions making it dangerous. Hence again why storage is so expensive as temperatures increase in a hydrogen tank it most be kept cool or consistent, so you can either cool it or release some of the gas. Not ideal. I wish what you were saying was true but it’s not. The solution most likely will be a combination of H2 and other combustion materials that work together as I don’t see how H2 by itself will work unless you are in one of the Arctic circles.
@@marvinfrankel9019 - Embrittlement is only a problem with the wrong pipes. Temperature is really only a problem with liquid H2. California, US has been transporting H2, for use in automobile filling stations, for decades. H2 is already transported in natural gas pipelines, along natural gas natural gas. Natural gas has percentages of H2, today. Increasing the quantity of H2 in already existing natural gas pipelines has already been successfully done in UK, with some small scale (community) tests. Germany started converting some Natural Gas pipelines in 2023, projecting completion in 2025. Some natural gas pipelines had already been converted to transport pure H2 today, in Texas, US. Existing natural gas generators had already been successfully tested to run on pure H2 in Georgia, US. The concerns over H2 are not show stoppers, merely FUD transmitted by various propagandists. Ukraine has long been seen as a potential partner to supply H2 to Europe, and the Russians don’t like it one bit, conducting 2 invasions in a short period of time, with the latest invasion hopefully coming to an end, sooner than later.
This is the dumbest idea. Having a H2 car means you will pay for the whole infrastructure of producing H2. It's a vastly inefficient process so you will consume so much more electricity than a current EV car, pollute much more than the equivalent to a battery. I think Toyota is betting on classical H2 production based on methane which produce a lot of co2 as a byproduct putting all this green talk to trash. H2 is a tiny molecule so the tank has to be very thick and replaced often. This lead to a huge car to support a huge tank but a small tank range. Also, good luck finding a gas station that supports H2. Battery innovation keep making improvement in capacity and price, a tank of H2 will never get better over time. Toyota just hasn't realize the current EV revolution and will be left behind unless it reacts quickly
@@thomasjalabert658 - EV’s are the dumbest idea. Have EV car means you have to pay for the additional infrastructure to produce the electricity & transport the electricity over electrical lines The EV batteries pollute the environment much more than the H2 fuel cell cars since nearly everything to create H2 fuel cell cars exist in the current supply chain, rare earths from catalytic converters would merely be moved to fuel cell production The EV cars pollute much more than H2 cars during crashes, EV cars explode producing poisonous gases from combusting batteries, while H2 merely escapes from containers & whizzes away from the crash site into the atmosphere EV cars pollute the environment much more than H2 cars during recycling, since lithium batteries are mostly (90+%) disposed of in landfills today, links of lithium in water to autism have been observed in scientific studies, degrading the human population EV cars consume so much more electricity than H2 cars, since there is loss on long distance electrical lines, loss in inversion to be stored in batteries at charging stations, loss in inversion from batteries to charge cars, loss in inversion to charge the batteries in the car, lost in inversion to drive the wheels of a car. So much electric loss. H2 is a tiny molecule which is found to store well in tanks, being done so for decades in California, getting fast fill ups, and getting great distance traveled on a tank of gas… while people have to sit around for electric cars to charge & travel a short distance. The tank technology has been perfected for H2, while battery technology is still immature, there is so much more that needs to be done to make EV’s safe. Brainwashed masses just have not figured out that H2 fits transportation lifestyle better for humanity, although they are still uses for the glorified golf carts, like playing clean golf, and making short trips to the grocery store. People just have not realized that the degree their EV dreams have poisoned and will continue to poison the environment and their children will suffer the consequences with brain damage.
@@DavidHalko Wow I didn’t realise I would trigger a H2 fan! For the sake of it I will answer you because you seems genuinely interested in newer form of energy storage. "Have EV car means you have to pay for the additional infrastructure to produce the electricity & transport the electricity over electrical lines " => Do you realise that EV are not the only physical object using electricity? Infrastructure cost is shared between all consumers, this is not the case for H2 cars that will have to pay for it alone. "The EV batteries pollute the environment much more than the H2 fuel cell cars since nearly everything to create H2 fuel cell cars exist in the current supply chain, rare earths from catalytic converters would merely be moved to fuel cell production." => Of course because you externalise the pollution elsewere when you produce H2. Doubling the electricity production does comes with ecological burden. "EV cars pollute the environment much more than H2 cars during recycling, since lithium batteries are mostly (90+%) disposed of in landfills today, links of lithium in water to autism have been observed in scientific studies, degrading the human population." => Actually you don’t really mind of the EV car. You only seems to focus on the battery. Did you know other battery technologies exists? Anyway, it's true that less than 10% of the li-ion battery are recycled but 95% could be and should be. As lithium become more expensive the recycle business will become more and more attractive. In any case, this should convince you to push for more regulations and recycle norm because the landfills are already here. Have you seen literal mountains of car tires in landfills? They are the perfect place for mosquito and malaria and when it burns... well, it's not pretty. However, I don’t think you will promote the ban of cars, will you? "EV cars consume so much more electricity than H2 cars, since there is loss on long distance electrical lines, loss in inversion to be stored in batteries at charging stations, loss in inversion from batteries to charge cars, loss in inversion to charge the batteries in the car, lost in inversion to drive the wheels of a car. So much electric loss." => Did you know H2 cars are technically EV cars? You *need* to produce electricity if you want H2 which means all this loss you describe here also apply for H2 cars. But you also have an *EV motor*, which means you have to convert your H2 back to electricity! And H2 battery does a terrible job at producing electricity, with a ~50% efficiency, meaning they lost half of the energy producing nothing but heat. This is compared to li-ion battery that does the exact same thing (converting electricity to chemical to electricity) but at least they are good at it with ~90% efficiency. This is why H2 is so much worse, for the same trip with the same car, you have to produce twice as much electricity as the EV. "H2 is a tiny molecule which is found to store well in tanks, being done so for decades in California, getting fast fill ups, and getting great distance traveled on a tank of gas… while people have to sit around for electric cars to charge & travel a short distance." => Good luck to pay the bills each time you need to repair the tank! This short distance thing was a thing 5 years ago, current Tesla models have about the same range as ICE and supercharger is really fast with about 50% of the gas cost. ""The tank technology has been perfected for H2, while battery technology is still immature, there is so much more that needs to be done to make EV’s safe. Brainwashed masses just have not figured out that H2 fits transportation lifestyle better for humanity, although they are still uses for the glorified golf carts, like playing clean golf, and making short trips to the grocery store. People just have not realized that the degree their EV dreams have poisoned and will continue to poison the environment and their children will suffer the consequences with brain damage." => You have no idea how dumb it sound. Keep dreaming man, EV are not perfect but they are real.
@@thomasjalabert658 - I didn’t realize that I would trigger an EV bigot! LOL! “EV’s are not the only physical object using electricity? Infrastructure cost is shared across all consumers…” And you identified the actually problem. My battery bank in my house, which is a small portion of of a Ford Mach-E battery pack, will run my house for a day, while not on solar panels. A full Mach-E battery pack, with 2 cars per house, would take multiple times more electrical energy to charge the cars than the house normally takes during the week! The charge is a fast charge. This incredible boost in electrical grid capacity & peak requirements is massive. Just massive. And it will raise the cost of living for people who just want to live their lives & use mass transit. Massive inflation. And this is an inadvertent regressive tax on the poor. “Externalize pollution elsewhere when you produce H2.” All energy is dirty, as is electricity. H2 has the potential to be the cleanest of all. Since a battery holds electrical energy, as tanks hold H2… the energy container for energy like H2 is far better than a battery. When H2 is made by cracking water off-shore at windmills, piped to mainland for temporary storage before final distribution- the solution is far less resource intensive than converting to electricity, conducting it to the mainland, where it must be stored temporarily in toxic batteries, which must be constantly replaced. “Lithium… recycle” Lead acid batteries are recycled, nearly 100%. Lithium should be recycled, in a similar fashion because both elements cause brain damage in children. Any battery shipped should be serialized and received back from the manufacturer, period, from any consumer. “Mountains of car tires… ban of cars” That’s why they should be mixed into the concrete & asphalt during road construction. Better yet, move to flying cars driven by ducted fans. Flying cars by some small manufacturers are being produced at 1-2 a month, this needs to be increased and get people off the roads, so they can fly over them, and reduce tire waste. H2 can go a long way to making this occur. “Did you know H2 cars are technically EV cars?” Not necessarily. One can change the injectors in a standard car & burn H2 in existing engines today. This means that the movement to H2 can start, with century old technology, using existing supply chains. The next phase could be hybrid EV, using H2 for longer trips, fast filling in a minute, batteries for regenerative breaking. “All the loss you describe apply to EV cars” Not if H2 is transported similarly to gas or natural gas, today. A secondary & tertiary transportation for energy is always preferable to overburdening & overloading existing infrastructure. It is called redundancy. Redundancy saves the lives of people when a catastrophic failure occurs to a single infrastructure that supplies everything. “H2 battery does a terrible job at producing electricity, with a ~50% efficiency” An H2 battery is called a tank. The H2 remains in the tank & takes no energy while it is idle, unlike chemical batteries which suffer from self discharge. Conversion of H2 into linear motion can occur in a fuel cell / motor combination or direct combustion. Efficiency is only a problem if the cost of the energy in the less efficient solution is more than the cost of the energy in more efficient solution. Gas & Diesel vehicles are a fine example. Efficiency is essentially irrelevant unless there is a cost implication. “H2… bills each time you need to repair the tank” An auto H2 tank typically carries a 15 year warranty. The cost is about $1k. This is cheap. Considering the life expectancy of an auto is 20 years in nations like the United States… a tank is a lot cheaper to replace than a battery. “Short distance… 5 years ago thing” Still is. I travel across the country to see family, in two different directions, requiring a quick fill-up along the way. These trips get extended with EV’s. Waiting in queue. Waiting for charge. Trips that take 12 hours will wind up taking more, requiring a night stay somewhere. It sux. H2 fillips are quick, like gas & diesel. Also, during previous administration, I ran the numbers, and using a fast charger was about the same cost as gas. Sure, gas is more expensive now, but it comes down. I look forward to producing H2 in my own home. “EV’s are not perfect, but they are real” Yes, and warehouses like Walmart & Amazon are replacing battery powered forklifts with natural gas & transitioning to hydrogen powered forklifts… because the benefits are real. No battery sag issues, less maintenance, higher reliability. As soon as I finish my recycled solar array at my home, with my recycled EV batteries as a temporary power store… I will move toward designing H2 system to replace those batteries. Recycled H2 fuel cells are here, today. H2 has been used as an energy store for over a century. Even the Soviets used to fly airplanes on H2. The question will be how to make better use of the H2 I will produce, rather than only to generate electricity. I’ll have to get some Bosch injectors! 😀
Video tells me everything I need to know to short Toyota.
this has been done before.. I wonder if this time we'll make it to commercial availability 😂
3 things. These engines are complex to maintain. Producing the fuel is very energy inefficient as a large amounts of energy is needed. Currently deployed transaction batteries do not use cobot. One major concern is the fuel is very explosive, much more than petrol. Currently batteries used in vehicles look to have a life span vastly more than expected , looking to the 500.000 mile range. Fueling electric vehicles involves easier to deploy solar infrastructure which can be used by the general householder.
Hydrogen wull only work when produced on site (at the filling station) and with a primary source of energy that is unusually inexpensive. This is because its round trip efficiency is roughly 30%. A good example of a low-cost primary sourcr of energy is in places where volcanic activity is close enough to the surface to make low-cost geothermal energy possible.
Batter-electric is only practical in the long run only with a robust recycling industry and the rejection of the urban automobile as a primary transportation system.
This, I am convined, is the scary reality.
@@bobcornwell403 - electricity has a similar issue, where centrally provided electricity can’t do fast charging of EV’s, so inverters & batteries must be deployed at car charging stations.
H2 tanks at point of filling is so much less complex than batteries & inverters at point of charging. (Those charging station batteries will have to be constantly replaced, even more quickly than car batteries.)
On April 24, 2003, Iceland became the first nation to open a public hydrogen filling station in conjunction with Shell Oil Company. The technology for hydrogen fuel cell vehicles is over two decades old. All of the major auto manufacturers have been experimenting with various forms of alternative fuel sources for years. Perhaps Toyota can be the first to bring this technology to the Main Street showroom at an affordable price? The problem isn't the automobile's technology; rather, the infrastructure needed to be able to reliably refuel anywhere. This is where the free market comes into play. Let the public decide which energy source is best.
It's like the video ignores the real issues. Infrastructure- there is a reason there is no Infrastructure. Storage is expensive as keeping stable is different and expensive.
Density- is the biggest issue not mentioned. In order on the same footings as other EV tech, hydrogen has to be compressed to extreme levels ie 10,000 psi which produce heat which is not hydrogen's friend. These are technology issues that have not been solved to where costs are in the same hemisphere as other technology.
These are completely ignored in the video. As a bonus combustion hydrogen is even more expensive than EV Hydrogen in every way manufacturing and operating costs.
“Infrastructure” - pipe line natural gas. Various natural gas lines have been reused for hydrogen and existing natural gas lines already pipe a percentage of hydrogen. We take existing natural gas lines, continue adding H2 as a percentage, and increase percentage as infrastructure needs replacement.
“Storage” - it is cheap & various, ranging to expensive for space travel. H2 is held in tanks. There is not only one tank pressure, different PSI for different applications, thus different costs.
“Compression… heat” - electricity has the same problem, where transmission sees energy lost in heat along electrical lines. Because heat is generated at a central location, heat generated in H2 compression can be captured & reused as central excess heat is reused around urban centers today, vs heat lost across the globe in electricity transfer.
- the true benefit of hydrogen is cheap & simple storage in comparison to electricity. Today, EV charging stations must deploy huge batteries & inverters, just to charge cars with huge batteries & inverters. Producing H2 in offshore windmills, pipe H2 to the mainland, and supplement additional existing distribution facilities is a huge win. Transition from burning H2 to fuel cell can be done over time. Engines today can work on H2 & gas, with the changing of injectors & software. Fuel cells today can work on natural gas or H2. Warehouses around the world use natural gas & H2 forklifts today, because performance is more predictable than battery… and transition from natural gas [with H2] to pure H2 is evolutionary, not revolutionary like battery / electrical infrastructure.
Honestly, H2 is not that heavy a lift, from where we are today.
@@DavidHalko ah, natural gas and hydrogen can flow in the same pipe for a hot minute but hydrogen will break down most natural gas pipes making them brittle, that is a NO.
Storage is not cheap. To store hydrogen, temperature control with hydrogen has to be accounted. The higher the pressure the more temperature control has to be accounted for in both the filling of the vehicle and the storage facility that is distributing the gas. You need the high pressure to get any kind of comparable range with hydrogen, so storage is expensive if you want to compare apples to apples.
Compression Heat, is not the same as electricity. Yes it’s true there is heat loss on electrical lines but it’s a small percentage of total energy. Hydrogen is not efficient. It cost 3x to have the equivalent hydrogen density 10k psi as gas. Then when you pump 10k psi into a tank it heats up but hydrogen expands and heats the tank more under hot conditions making it dangerous. Hence again why storage is so expensive as temperatures increase in a hydrogen tank it most be kept cool or consistent, so you can either cool it or release some of the gas. Not ideal.
I wish what you were saying was true but it’s not. The solution most likely will be a combination of H2 and other combustion materials that work together as I don’t see how H2 by itself will work unless you are in one of the Arctic circles.
@@marvinfrankel9019 - Embrittlement is only a problem with the wrong pipes.
Temperature is really only a problem with liquid H2.
California, US has been transporting H2, for use in automobile filling stations, for decades.
H2 is already transported in natural gas pipelines, along natural gas natural gas. Natural gas has percentages of H2, today.
Increasing the quantity of H2 in already existing natural gas pipelines has already been successfully done in UK, with some small scale (community) tests.
Germany started converting some Natural Gas pipelines in 2023, projecting completion in 2025.
Some natural gas pipelines had already been converted to transport pure H2 today, in Texas, US.
Existing natural gas generators had already been successfully tested to run on pure H2 in Georgia, US.
The concerns over H2 are not show stoppers, merely FUD transmitted by various propagandists. Ukraine has long been seen as a potential partner to supply H2 to Europe, and the Russians don’t like it one bit, conducting 2 invasions in a short period of time, with the latest invasion hopefully coming to an end, sooner than later.
This is the dumbest idea.
Having a H2 car means you will pay for the whole infrastructure of producing H2. It's a vastly inefficient process so you will consume so much more electricity than a current EV car, pollute much more than the equivalent to a battery. I think Toyota is betting on classical H2 production based on methane which produce a lot of co2 as a byproduct putting all this green talk to trash.
H2 is a tiny molecule so the tank has to be very thick and replaced often. This lead to a huge car to support a huge tank but a small tank range.
Also, good luck finding a gas station that supports H2.
Battery innovation keep making improvement in capacity and price, a tank of H2 will never get better over time.
Toyota just hasn't realize the current EV revolution and will be left behind unless it reacts quickly
@@thomasjalabert658 - EV’s are the dumbest idea.
Have EV car means you have to pay for the additional infrastructure to produce the electricity & transport the electricity over electrical lines
The EV batteries pollute the environment much more than the H2 fuel cell cars since nearly everything to create H2 fuel cell cars exist in the current supply chain, rare earths from catalytic converters would merely be moved to fuel cell production
The EV cars pollute much more than H2 cars during crashes, EV cars explode producing poisonous gases from combusting batteries, while H2 merely escapes from containers & whizzes away from the crash site into the atmosphere
EV cars pollute the environment much more than H2 cars during recycling, since lithium batteries are mostly (90+%) disposed of in landfills today, links of lithium in water to autism have been observed in scientific studies, degrading the human population
EV cars consume so much more electricity than H2 cars, since there is loss on long distance electrical lines, loss in inversion to be stored in batteries at charging stations, loss in inversion from batteries to charge cars, loss in inversion to charge the batteries in the car, lost in inversion to drive the wheels of a car. So much electric loss.
H2 is a tiny molecule which is found to store well in tanks, being done so for decades in California, getting fast fill ups, and getting great distance traveled on a tank of gas… while people have to sit around for electric cars to charge & travel a short distance.
The tank technology has been perfected for H2, while battery technology is still immature, there is so much more that needs to be done to make EV’s safe.
Brainwashed masses just have not figured out that H2 fits transportation lifestyle better for humanity, although they are still uses for the glorified golf carts, like playing clean golf, and making short trips to the grocery store.
People just have not realized that the degree their EV dreams have poisoned and will continue to poison the environment and their children will suffer the consequences with brain damage.
@@DavidHalko Wow I didn’t realise I would trigger a H2 fan!
For the sake of it I will answer you because you seems genuinely interested in newer form of energy storage.
"Have EV car means you have to pay for the additional infrastructure to produce the electricity & transport the electricity over electrical lines "
=> Do you realise that EV are not the only physical object using electricity? Infrastructure cost is shared between all consumers, this is not the case for H2 cars that will have to pay for it alone.
"The EV batteries pollute the environment much more than the H2 fuel cell cars since nearly everything to create H2 fuel cell cars exist in the current supply chain, rare earths from catalytic converters would merely be moved to fuel cell production."
=> Of course because you externalise the pollution elsewere when you produce H2. Doubling the electricity production does comes with ecological burden.
"EV cars pollute the environment much more than H2 cars during recycling, since lithium batteries are mostly (90+%) disposed of in landfills today, links of lithium in water to autism have been observed in scientific studies, degrading the human population."
=> Actually you don’t really mind of the EV car. You only seems to focus on the battery. Did you know other battery technologies exists? Anyway, it's true that less than 10% of the li-ion battery are recycled but 95% could be and should be. As lithium become more expensive the recycle business will become more and more attractive. In any case, this should convince you to push for more regulations and recycle norm because the landfills are already here. Have you seen literal mountains of car tires in landfills? They are the perfect place for mosquito and malaria and when it burns... well, it's not pretty. However, I don’t think you will promote the ban of cars, will you?
"EV cars consume so much more electricity than H2 cars, since there is loss on long distance electrical lines, loss in inversion to be stored in batteries at charging stations, loss in inversion from batteries to charge cars, loss in inversion to charge the batteries in the car, lost in inversion to drive the wheels of a car. So much electric loss."
=> Did you know H2 cars are technically EV cars? You *need* to produce electricity if you want H2 which means all this loss you describe here also apply for H2 cars.
But you also have an *EV motor*, which means you have to convert your H2 back to electricity! And H2 battery does a terrible job at producing electricity, with a ~50% efficiency, meaning they lost half of the energy producing nothing but heat. This is compared to li-ion battery that does the exact same thing (converting electricity to chemical to electricity) but at least they are good at it with ~90% efficiency. This is why H2 is so much worse, for the same trip with the same car, you have to produce twice as much electricity as the EV.
"H2 is a tiny molecule which is found to store well in tanks, being done so for decades in California, getting fast fill ups, and getting great distance traveled on a tank of gas… while people have to sit around for electric cars to charge & travel a short distance."
=> Good luck to pay the bills each time you need to repair the tank! This short distance thing was a thing 5 years ago, current Tesla models have about the same range as ICE and supercharger is really fast with about 50% of the gas cost.
""The tank technology has been perfected for H2, while battery technology is still immature, there is so much more that needs to be done to make EV’s safe.
Brainwashed masses just have not figured out that H2 fits transportation lifestyle better for humanity, although they are still uses for the glorified golf carts, like playing clean golf, and making short trips to the grocery store.
People just have not realized that the degree their EV dreams have poisoned and will continue to poison the environment and their children will suffer the consequences with brain damage."
=> You have no idea how dumb it sound. Keep dreaming man, EV are not perfect but they are real.
@@thomasjalabert658 - I didn’t realize that I would trigger an EV bigot! LOL!
“EV’s are not the only physical object using electricity? Infrastructure cost is shared across all consumers…”
And you identified the actually problem. My battery bank in my house, which is a small portion of of a Ford Mach-E battery pack, will run my house for a day, while not on solar panels. A full Mach-E battery pack, with 2 cars per house, would take multiple times more electrical energy to charge the cars than the house normally takes during the week! The charge is a fast charge. This incredible boost in electrical grid capacity & peak requirements is massive. Just massive. And it will raise the cost of living for people who just want to live their lives & use mass transit. Massive inflation. And this is an inadvertent regressive tax on the poor.
“Externalize pollution elsewhere when you produce H2.”
All energy is dirty, as is electricity. H2 has the potential to be the cleanest of all. Since a battery holds electrical energy, as tanks hold H2… the energy container for energy like H2 is far better than a battery. When H2 is made by cracking water off-shore at windmills, piped to mainland for temporary storage before final distribution- the solution is far less resource intensive than converting to electricity, conducting it to the mainland, where it must be stored temporarily in toxic batteries, which must be constantly replaced.
“Lithium… recycle”
Lead acid batteries are recycled, nearly 100%. Lithium should be recycled, in a similar fashion because both elements cause brain damage in children. Any battery shipped should be serialized and received back from the manufacturer, period, from any consumer.
“Mountains of car tires… ban of cars”
That’s why they should be mixed into the concrete & asphalt during road construction. Better yet, move to flying cars driven by ducted fans. Flying cars by some small manufacturers are being produced at 1-2 a month, this needs to be increased and get people off the roads, so they can fly over them, and reduce tire waste. H2 can go a long way to making this occur.
“Did you know H2 cars are technically EV cars?”
Not necessarily. One can change the injectors in a standard car & burn H2 in existing engines today. This means that the movement to H2 can start, with century old technology, using existing supply chains.
The next phase could be hybrid EV, using H2 for longer trips, fast filling in a minute, batteries for regenerative breaking.
“All the loss you describe apply to EV cars”
Not if H2 is transported similarly to gas or natural gas, today.
A secondary & tertiary transportation for energy is always preferable to overburdening & overloading existing infrastructure. It is called redundancy. Redundancy saves the lives of people when a catastrophic failure occurs to a single infrastructure that supplies everything.
“H2 battery does a terrible job at producing electricity, with a ~50% efficiency”
An H2 battery is called a tank. The H2 remains in the tank & takes no energy while it is idle, unlike chemical batteries which suffer from self discharge.
Conversion of H2 into linear motion can occur in a fuel cell / motor combination or direct combustion. Efficiency is only a problem if the cost of the energy in the less efficient solution is more than the cost of the energy in more efficient solution.
Gas & Diesel vehicles are a fine example. Efficiency is essentially irrelevant unless there is a cost implication.
“H2… bills each time you need to repair the tank”
An auto H2 tank typically carries a 15 year warranty. The cost is about $1k. This is cheap. Considering the life expectancy of an auto is 20 years in nations like the United States… a tank is a lot cheaper to replace than a battery.
“Short distance… 5 years ago thing”
Still is. I travel across the country to see family, in two different directions, requiring a quick fill-up along the way. These trips get extended with EV’s. Waiting in queue. Waiting for charge. Trips that take 12 hours will wind up taking more, requiring a night stay somewhere. It sux. H2 fillips are quick, like gas & diesel.
Also, during previous administration, I ran the numbers, and using a fast charger was about the same cost as gas. Sure, gas is more expensive now, but it comes down. I look forward to producing H2 in my own home.
“EV’s are not perfect, but they are real”
Yes, and warehouses like Walmart & Amazon are replacing battery powered forklifts with natural gas & transitioning to hydrogen powered forklifts… because the benefits are real.
No battery sag issues, less maintenance, higher reliability.
As soon as I finish my recycled solar array at my home, with my recycled EV batteries as a temporary power store… I will move toward designing H2 system to replace those batteries. Recycled H2 fuel cells are here, today.
H2 has been used as an energy store for over a century. Even the Soviets used to fly airplanes on H2. The question will be how to make better use of the H2 I will produce, rather than only to generate electricity. I’ll have to get some Bosch injectors! 😀