I don't know whether it makes it more or less horrifying to see those who crave authoritarianism as just being very kinky and sadly unwilling to a) acknowledge that it is a kink and b) adopt SSC or RACK protocols so no one actually gets hurt by their fucked-up mental wiring from their childhood and sociopolitical and other trauma. But seriously, I've seen so, SO much from fash/alt-right/conservative types that totally just screams of repressing themselves so much they've bought into the delusion that their kink is actually a healthy way to live and one everyone should do. It's kind of like seeing the alternative health quackery people that have convinced themselves their obsession with enemas and laxatives isn't because it makes them feel good psychosexually, but that EVERYONE needs to turn their colon into a powerwasher for the sake of their optimum health. Except, for the most part, those people only harm themselves or sometimes, sadly, someone in their immediate control that they drag into it. Authoritarianism fetishizers rule society as it is, and that's terrifying.
Watching these videos has me thinking about how many young cops grew up watching these shows. They talk about violence on TV effecting youth, but they don't talk about how policing has been changed by the overwhelming amount of television shows featuring cops who consider themselves "outside the law". We've been led to believe that violence on TV is turning kids into criminals, but perhaps it's just turning children into cops who have the wrong idea about the job.
Honestly shit like this makes me want to make a realistic cop outside the law novel where its has the tropes but with realistic twists. Chases a guy through the streets and accidently runs innocents over, shoots at a guy feeling the scene of the crime and tags random people nearby. Beats up a suspect to get information and it turns out that was the wrong guy and he had a family that he can no longer care for. Point being that the outside the law cop hurts alot of people in his movie fantasy.
@@thewhitewolf58 There was just a road rage incident that took place near me. An off duty trooper got mad that a family going to see Christmas lights tried passing him so when they passed him he flipped and drove on the shoulder to pass them nearly side swiping a tow truck. Then he slammed him brakes on and the family just barely missed a concrete embankment and went off into some grass. They tried getting off at the exit and he pulled up ahead of them and there was a gunshot and he was screaming commands at them. Once he found out they called the cops he fled. He was booked on $20,000 bail and put on unpaid leave (not fired). I was arrested with $80 of drugs and given $50,000 cash only bail (no 10%) in the same area, he only needed $2000 to get out. Glad to see where their priorities lie.
I honest to god dont understand this take, like i watched the shield as a kid(probably a little to young), and not even for a millisecond did i think to myself, "why yes, should i ever become a cop, i too should indiscrimately murder and steal". Truly if you come away from watching that show thinking anything but "this is fucked" you are a lost cause and this show didnt make you a bad person. It so explicitly shows how fucked the system and the people participating in it are, youd have to be blind to see anything else.
being autistic myself, vic having autistic kids and that being used to justify his instances of police brutality is especially horrifying to me. 50% of the victims of police brutality are mentally ill and/or neurodivergent. liam long is still in the hospital in kentucky. when i got arrested at a protest, i told the cops that i'm autistic and because of that i lose memories while stressed, and the response was "oh well" and a threat that if i leave out information about what i have on my person then they'll add more charges. cops don't care about us
@@cpi3267 I think they meant that in some stressful situations people are likely focused on safety. Like if someone recounts having a gun in their face- their going to remember the gun and not person who put it there.
@@cpi3267 1. Googling ‘stress memory’ will give you plenty of results about how stress can impact memory formation and storage. This information is easy to find, and although it’s an area of neuroscience (complex and with a lot of emerging research) there are plenty of articles aimed at a general readership. 2. Neurodivergence (shockingly!) involves people processing stimuli differently to neurotypical people, including things like hormone responses to stress or brain functions like memory. I don’t know about the interaction between memory, stress and autism myself, and there would be variation in experience anyway, but the claim is not one you can just dismiss off hand. 3. Which brings me to: if you respond to someone saying “this is how I experience the world” with “lol, whatever, no you don’t” you are being an ignorant arsehole.
pretty big assholes. to anyone reading this who doesnt know, in many countries you can just deny your statement. it wont help you to talk to the cops they will only try to manipulate you. try to speak as little as possible to them. it will help you.
You are allowed to leave out any information you want to when talking with the cops. They weren't just ignoring your handicap -- they were outright lying to you to try to make you voluntarily provide them evidence against you. It is called the 5th Amendment. The only thing you should ever, ever say to the cops when arrested for any reason is that you will not answer questions without your attorney present.
I mean him murdering people made me dislike him but something about throwing your extremely loyal friend under the bus to get away scot free even though you've done all that he has and worse feels even more reprehensible because the people he kills are random people we barely get to know while the person he betrayed you get to understand just how messed up it is
I was glad he did it, because Ronny deserved prison, and that goes for everyone in the Strike team, as well as other cops in the Barn. Vic escaped, but his life was in shambles.
Same. Dude is a selfish, arrogant criminal with a badge which makes him a hypocrite. I thought the show was going to be about bringing him down, I assumed he was the villain, lol.
I wanted him to, for lack of a better word, repent. I knew that was never going to happen, but Vic's disgusting traits sat side by side with some powerful good characteristics. It almost seemed like maybe he'd reform. He was willing to risk himself for greater goods. He was loyal. He was, selectively, sympathetic or even kind at times. What I enjoyed was the tension between these traits and the eventual deconstruction of the idea of Vic as anti-hero. In the end, the show made it unambiguous. Vic's actions - good or bad - were always in service of his ego. Vic wanted & needed to be the action hero. He was driven by the desire for dominance, power & adoration. Even his grand gestures of kindness or heroism served his ego. In another job or role, maybe that could have been channeled in another direction. But as a cop, well Vic's vices were always going to be well fed. I loved the ending. Sure, he got away with it. But his family managed to get free of him. The same cops who adored him, hate him. Even those who might have looked past his crimes hate him for turning on Ronnie. His new boss intends to make him pay. He betrayed Ronnie. He got Lem & Shane killed. He cheated on his wife and used her to protect himself. He threatened.He tortured. He murdered. He stole. He framed people. In the first episodes, we might have said "He's bad but . . ." But by the end, all we can say is "He's bad".
What I like about the show is that it never feels like anything is forgotten. Terry's death in episode one remains relevant from episode one to the finale.
@@PoggoMcDawggo actually, I think it only seems that way because the introduction is almost exactly the same as the previous video's introduction. Unless of course, he released this video, deleted it, the re-uploaded it a week later before releasing any other videos.
I think the conflict of pro-police vs being critical of the police is going to always fall short in one way or another simply because telling an accurate, critical story of police with the police as main characters. These arent reporters or people in the communities they are writing about (a flaw in the approach to be sure) but if they have to choose between writing a compelling narrative and portraying something in an accurately critical way, I think most writers will try to find that compelling story before making those other considerations. Its a very tough spot to be in, and I think this is certainly something that needs to be addressed in the future, but as he said, who else was talking about some of these issues to as big of an audience as they had in 2006? Great video and am really looking forward to what comes next on this channel!
This is such a good series, probably one of the best series of video essays I’ve ever seen; I can’t wait to see your tales on spooky tv shows and criminal minds and profiling. Truly some great stuff.
I am loving this video series! Even though The Shield is a show I’ve never seen and have no interest in, I’m fascinated by your analysis of it and the general idea of copaganda. Looking forward to the next video!
The reason that Vic is such a popular character is because the show, at it's heart, is a male power fantasy. That's why despite being horrific and wrong, the violence and action are still cool af and why he is the main protagonist. And the ending, when he gets punished for his crimes, doesn't actually have him lose, as such. He's alive. He only has to do some time, and only for the 9-5 grind. He still gets paid. He still has a pension. He still has a badge. Everything that he actually lost, he can replace. The only thing he's learned is to be more careful next time.
“Al Capone with a Badge.” An interesting quote considering the Sicilian Mafia was essentially a private law enforcement agents that realized the real money is in controlling crime the way Vic does.
Nicely nuanced piece. I read the show through a personality type perspective: Vic displays intensity-seeking, black-and-white-thinking, survival and control are always at stake for him, he values practical competency and direct action, distrusts abstract systems and institutions, values personal relationships. (This would be a type 8 in the Enneagram.) The show presents the negative sides like the self-righteousness, the impulsiveness and aggression, and the tendency for stubborn denial and hypocrisy while giving a lot of space for the good things like loyalty, commitment, effectiveness and autonomy. The show presents those two psychological sides and thereby presents a compelling character, but it's presentation of social reality is quite warped by its protagonist's perspective. Viewing it like that - a chance to inhabit such a perspective - made it easier to enjoy it despite its sociological crudeness.
There is a strong positive correlation between how much a "reader" spends time with the main character of a "text"--yes, my background comes more from the literary world, but the terminology can transfer over--and how much the reader sympathizes with that character. Anti-heroes become back door heroes.
Thank you for this video! The Shield is my favorite show of all time! I disagree with some of your criticism, as the show does have other incidents of criminals who have reformed. But I agree with your overall analysis. While I personally felt the urge to root for Vic, I always knew that this was a TV show, and that I'd never root for this type of cop in reality. I also knew that ultimately, Vic would have to go down in some fashion for his sins.
I remember when this show first aired. I'm not sure if I stop watching after the first episode but it was very early on. Maybe second or third episode. I've never been a huge fan of 'antiheros'.
@@RandomSkyeRoses Usually it's just code for a completely unlikable asshole who gets everything he wants. You can say all you like that they aren't supposed to be likeable but that's like saying a character is supposed to be annoying... it's still annoying, and I have no interest in watching it.
Like your series even tho I haven't watched any show because as a minority surrounded by cops I have no interest in glorification or dealing with an audience dead set on glorifying them. Yeah gangster movies/shows do the same but the difference is there is no Gov't claim of protection nor mass protection from the Gov't even when on the take. And I say this as someone whose never had a bad run in with cops but they're open in how they perceive me and all it takes is 1 to see a Black nerd as a "threat" to do as they please.
I so nearly bailed on The Shield after the first episode, but was pleased I stuck with it as those final seasons where it all circles in on the squad is incredibly tense. It’s good to see one of the producers aware that while there’s good in the show, it’d have to be handled differently. It feels like a lot of showrunners have difficulty putting a critical eye on their past successes.
I think it's because Shawn Ryan wasn't the sole reason The Shield was great. Don't forget, for the first 6 seasons he also had Scott Brazil, Kurt Sutter, Glen Mazzara as well as other writers by his side. Their work as a group is what made the show as good as it is. Think about EL Camino and why that turned out to be sub par. Yeah, sure Vince Gilligan (the alleged mastermind behind BB) was making it but again he wasn't the sole reason Breaking Bad was excellent. He didn't have Peter Gould, Thomas Schnauz and the other writers with him to make that movie.
Just watched part 1 last night so I'm pretty psyched to get part 2 the very next day! After the copaganda series, I would love to see you do something on a show you tangentially mentioned in this episode: The Good Place.
I remember finishing this series a decade ago and from the start, I prayed for their downfall from Episode one. That ending enraged me because he technically for away with it leaving a wake of death and destruction in his path
I can’t believe this channel actually said it’s a great ending. It’s a complete disappointment of an ending. Vic literally getting away with every single thing he ever did and also being a massive sociopath means that’s losing everything and everyone he ever had isn’t even a punishment for him. He’ll just turn into another type of human garbage and probably still be able to get away with it. Calling the ending a de facto 3 year prison sentence is, ironically in itself, copaganda that this channel chose to praise.
Your videos are absolutely awesome brother, as soon as I find a job I'mma have to slide on over to patreon, the quality of these are too high. Do you plan to do more political stuff after this though? I think you mentioned in one episode you normally do like examinations of film, so is copaganda a one off or do you think you enjoy analyzing how a show portrays a real world system?
Just had to pause the video to chime in and say HELL YEAH you brought up one of my favorite nonfiction books of all time, Difficult Men. Highly recommend it.
Every time I watch one of these videos I get reminded of the speech at the end of team america. May not be algorithm friendly but I feel like that movie, and especially that speech, deserves your attention as well.
I've been going through the series one after another (mainly watching on Nebula and then hopping over here to comment) and finally went over to the Patreon - this is really quality stuff. The system that enables people like Vic should not be allowed to exist, I think is the key-est point. Vic without a badge wouldn't have nearly the reach to cause the harm he did that Vic with a badge is.
Interesting videos addressing the Shield. The anti-hero characters were so well written, developed and portrayed by the actors that it became hard not to root for them on some level, even if you knew they were essentially amoral, or certainly immoral people. For the show to have given a happy ending to them - Vic and Shane for sure - would have sat ill with me, despite the fact that bad people don't always get the end they deserve irl, so why should they in a work of fiction? Of course, not every character in the show received the attention to detail that Vic and Shane got, so it's easier to dismiss them as stereotypical bad guys, with no or little nuance. I think that's the nature of the beast though, as a fast-moving plot and character driven drama. It's tough to think of any show featuring a large number of ancillary characters that does it otherwise, off the top of my head. I get what is being said about the way street gangs, the drug trade and attitudes towards suspects and criminals is portrayed, I'd say that the show is largely presented from the perspective of the police, the bad, the good and the in-between, so those attitudes are probably consistent with the way law enforcement views those other groups, particularly non-whites. The show depicts Shane for example as being inherently racist and there is a disconnect between almost all the officers and any Spanish-speaking citizens they run into. The police department in Farmington is very much depicted as something alien to the community they oversee and there are elements of it being an occupying semi-military presence - particularly the Strike Team. Obviously, guys like Captain Aceveda relate to the Latinx community, though he's a social climber using those connections as a base with which to propel his own political career. So, I'm not sure I agree that the show is putting those concepts over to the audience as such, but moreso depicting in a non-obvious way how the police characters see their world. It's kind of the same with The Sopranos, where the show's worldview is set by the Mob characters, with very few viewpoints originating from outside of that perspective. The difference with the Shield is that it emerges from a genre which almost exclusively had portrayed the world of policing in a positive light, so despite Vic murdering a "good" cop at the end of the first episode (interestingly portrayed by the actor who had played the generally likeable and charismatic detective Kellerman in the outstanding show Homicide a few years earlier) it was still tough for most people to break away completely from that mindset until quite late on in the series. For me, that was an impressive feat by the writers and the actor playing Vic (and Shane, too).
Sort of like Punisher or Batman as cops - except for that even Punisher is more moral. But the similarity with vigilante stories, and the rogue hero cop, breaking all rules.
First and foremost, I love these series. And I love your take on television and society in general! I have recommended your channel to quite some people which I will continue to do. Keep up this great content! ❤ Having said that, I started watching The Shield based on your recommendation and have just decided not to continue watching anymore after second seasons' second episode. And not just for what the creators would have liked done differently if they had the chance. Although the blatend discrimination throughout the series didn't help in trying to make me appreciatie it. I don't care if some characters are portrayed that way, but I'm talking about how the series seem to accept those as a bigger truth. Afro-Americans who got shot by white criminals for instance questioning the possibility of white gangs. As if white people can't get impoverished and/or as if race would determine criminal behavior. Which brings me to my biggest interest within television: psychology and sociology. Something I recognize in your take on media as well. What bothers me most in most American television, including The Shield, is the urge to create superhero movies/series out of any genre. As you rightfully analyzed an urge to hyperfocus on the main characters flows and strengths which makes their counterparts one-dimensional. But I see the same tendencies go much broader. Allow me to explain myself with what I've seen so far within The Shield. Vic himself gets portrayed as the typical main hero superhero. He even has his (supposedly) comic sidekicks. His superhuman strengths are a complete understanding of the city and the criminal underworld, a full bar of power and strength and like most American superheros complete control over handling fireweapons or any meelee weapon. Vic strikes me as the character with a degree in 'world' martial arts as Southparks Team America would call it. Name a discipline and he'll own it. Not just him, his goons are indestructible as well. As far as I've seen in the series, no cop in general got killed/hurt by people out strengthening them. Only on a cowards way they could get harmed by non-supernatural beings. Like many superhero's, Vic gets portrayed with weaknesses as well. Amongst them the weakness to misuse his powers. Although it's remarking what a huge level of control the creators still want to give him. Imo it's sad how they want to portray Vic as a person that happens to question himself on the 'right' moments, rather then the villain who needs to lay low in order to avoid getting detected. I know the first episode shows him liquidating a 'good' cop who tried to get close to him. But after that, Vic seems to be overly self aware. Both about the fact he's just a criminal as strangely somehow how he would be the biggest saint of all. The last bit even convincing 'good' cops about his supposed good nature. Because the further the season goes on, the more we learn how all people have their flaws and weaknesses. But how despite the rest, Vic seems to be the only one in total control of himself which makes his flaws forgivable. Even 'calculated' errors. Not just Vic though. Just like in many super-hero films, the main character is not the only supernatural being. I'm not going to analyse all characters, I'll just pick one. Dutch is the character I came to love and hate the most. Since he's bringing mostly psychology to the table. Or at least, when it's his time to shine as the superhero he's. In contrast to Vic, he doesn't have super national fighting skills. He's limited to be 'just' perfect with any fireweapon. Although he doesn't need to. He's supernatural his own way. He's got psychic super powers. Reading everyone in a blip, almost completely cracking cases that would take the FBI ten years in... one day. And eventually in what, after 2-3 weeks one other day? What I loved about his character is how most of what he says makes sense. The scene where he was 'mind battling' with the serial child molester was done very well. Both in logic as in credibility (if we would disregard how the scene ended). On the other hand the fact he seems to have been part of the force for quite a while, seems to makes it strange how Dutch seems to have suddenly developed his talent, only since we the viewer joined into the bigger narrative. Even though he claims to have studied criminology and higher studies, his own collogues seem as surprised as us how perfectly accurate he gets with his theories. Just like Vic or any superhero however, he's cursed with his own talent as well. Since he seems to lack the social skills in matching up with the people he could read too good which makes him some kind of social outcast. Something that does hold some ground in reality, since objectifying other people only helps with better reading them. But then again, his social awkwardness doesn't seem to match that. Even though he can perfectly read how dangerous people are and understand how he's perceived a beta by the alpha's, he's not afraid of anybody... Which brings us imo to the eventual biggest flaw to the series. Since Dutch has perfect human reading skills, he should have known the 'real' Vic from the start. He should haven been the one to bring this to captain Acavedo (with the special strength of being ethical perfect and reasonable, to the point where crimes and torture gets portrayed as ethically solid solutions in situations where those are 'required'). But not just that. Dutch should have as a bare minimum called out Vic for the shit in his desk as a way to ridiculise the seriousness of Vics job/responsibility. In order to deviate attention away from his criminal priorities. In the first place towards Vic himself, in the second towards the goons he needs to run his gang with and lastly towards Vic's colleagues (including Dutch) who seem only aware about the fact he doesn't like to follow the rules of the books. Not about his side-business initially. Because perfect team-player (and firearms specialist obviously) officer Danni doesn't accept this as a possibility. Sadly, as a woman, she can't overcome the weaknesses that came with her superhuman package. If only she was more male... The reason why I probably hate the whole superhero urge in American media so much, is because it completely contradicts the Donner Kruger scale. Which gives imo one of the best explanations about what's going wrong in the world today. In the world we live in, confidence is everything. The one who claims to know it all 'must' been given total control as soon as possible. Only to find out time and time again how they eventually turned out to be a massive scam. The Dunner Kruger effect learns us how people with plenty of confidence in some strength don't have a proper understanding of this skill. The better you master/understand a subject, the less confident you get about the possibility to ever be able to master it comletely during the short lifespan you have. If there would be such thing as a superhero, by nature this person would have had much more modest then incapable human counterparts who just have been initiated to that subject. American superhero movies claim how top confidence (and the urge to show that off) matches total understanding. With the sole (and theoretically logical) risk of hubris potentially getting in the way of complete succes. Something humanly impossible and as said hugely contradicting. Superheromovies are secretly (and obviously unknownlingy) propagating for con artists like Bernie Maddov, Donald Trump and (I know it's still deemed too soon to call it, but why not) Elon Musk. I would love to see you make a series about the superhero-mindset of American cinema. Probably Anglo-Saxon media in general. It wouldn't surprise me if there would be a theological link to that as well since the UK is in essence religiously fundamentalist (especially the claim how their king/queen would be some deity), while the US deems religion to be massively important as well. Which might make the catholic bible (and its deviations) probably the most popular and cultivated superhero story within the Anglo-Saxon world. And thus a huge inspiration towards superhero-minded authors and screenwriters.
The fact that the people root for Vic Mackey should have been a hint that they would seek those same qualities in a "higher authority" in a post-9/11 America...i.e. a President of the United States...
When I started to watch The Shield, I was in college and the show had been done for about 2 years at point. I was never really on Vic's side b/c he did do so much bad stuff. I was never really on his side and this was probably b/c I didnt watch the show when it was on rather in retrospect. It was more of the mindset of what is going to happen to Vic and how will he pay for his sins? I knew Vic wasn't going down in the first season for stealing drugs and my first thought was "How is he going to get out of this?" Great show and the one lesson I learned from it was that it doesnt pay to be a follower.
I watched a few episodes when it first came out, and I was well aware that Vic was a villain. Before I saw it, I read a book about the Rampart cops exploiting adolescent girls and bragging about statutory rape, among many other things.
@@catsmom129 At least Vic never did anything exploiting children. He even broke an underage sex ring early on in the series. But he did some much other bad stuff it almost doesnt matter he didnt do that imparticular.
I'd like to see your analysis of _The Closer,_ particularly in light of Deputy Chief Brenda Leigh Johnson's relationship with oversight and investigations into her conduct.
Out of all the people Vic Mackey could have pushed someone's face on a burning stove, he definitely picked the right guy with Amadilo. He was pure evil.
Nice vid. One of my favorite series' of all time and I'm glad there are more people checking it out now and having serious viewpoints on it. I do think a lot of people who watched it when it aired kind of just liked it because it was really violent and edgier than other stuff on TV
I never watched The Shield, but now I'm going to have to! Unfortunately that meant I couldn't watch the last part of this vid', so thanks for the spoiler warning! I watched the first episode, but this episode reveals the finale, so I had to stop! I just stumbled on this Copaganda series yesterday, and it's really good! Well researched, and offers some interesting (and IMO, spot on) insights.
I think one problem is at The Shield isn't really a cop show in the traditional sense. Yes the main characters are cops but the law enforcement setting is really just a backdrop for our typical drama of an almost Aristotelian nature. It is Cain and Abel, it is Faust, it is myth. Chopping it up just to pro cop propaganda, and analyzing it through a kind of weird modernist lens of social critique is both missing the point and doing a tremendous disservice to the exceptional writing and characterization throughout. It's a show worth watching even for someone who hates literally every single police officer on earth.
Oh cool. I really enjoyed learning things and hearing your takes in part 1 of this presentation so I'm really glad I get to watch part 2 so soon. Soon as in i only discovered your channel this morning. I don't have time to watch this now, but I'll just go ahead and drop a comment and a like anyway, by way of supporting a creator of thoughtful, high quality content and then come back and watch it later! If I genuinely like this one too after watching it i will also subscribe....
Superb analysis. Really enjoying your videos! One thing, though: I'm so sick of seeing commentators fall all over themselves to apologize for or to justify spoilers. The Shield concluded in 2008. If you've got somebody watching your video about The Shield who now, more than a decade on, hasn't yet watched the show, they simply are not permitted to complain about spoilers. They should be slapped! They've already had their chance-many, many years' worth of a chance-to watch it spoiler-free.
I find it really sad that people cheer for to police to beat assault and murder "thugs" and "criminals" and then go on to sit on their couches and cheer and empathize for monsters like Tony soprano or walter white. For a lot of people its not about what's right or wrong it's about who can wield the most power and how that pper can be used to kick someone's ass.
People align themselves with those with the most power generally. Of course we're encouraged to root for Tiny Soprano and Walter White because you see things from their point of view. They are fully developed and realised characters. The thugs and criminals in these scenarios are generally faceless and uncharacterised.
If you think about the strike team as a street gang, and look at how they are treated, you will find the anti-cop show you are looking for. From being presumed guilty based on reputation and without any evidence, to being hounded down and hunted and having their families squeezed and trying to turn them against each other. They are used whenever it benefits the careers of people and tossed aside when it doesn't. Towards the later seasons of the show, the strike team aren't even making money, they are just in a vicious cycle trying to stay alive and free.
I already understood when seeing the trailer that Vic was a truly evil man. And, when I watched the pilot of season 1 for Breaking Bad, I knew that Walter White was a monster who would destroy his entire family, his reputation, and his own soul. And with Walter White, I felt that Bryan Cranston was a great actor, but Walter was the character I despised the most since I saw him hide for almost the entire show behind the lie that he was turning to drug dealing to help his family when he was gone. This was especially made clear when his former best friend Elliot Schwartz and Elliot's wife Gretchen (who used to be Walt's girlfriend before Skyler), offered to make amends by having Walt as a member of their company "Gray Matter" so that he could get the medical care he needed for his cancer and the cash flow that would help secure his family's future. Instead, Walt's ego and narcissism did not allow for such a thing and resulted in Walt going further down the path to drug dealing and becoming the sociopathic monster that could murder anybody.
I know you only review tv shows on this channel like the MCU, but I'm curious if you've seen Training Day and what you think about that movie and how it contrasts with the Shield and maybe addresses some of the problems the Shield has
I wonder how you squeeze the Walter white/vic “but they’ve got good reasons!” lemon. How to give the audience an off ramp from the rose colored lenses.
The most interesting datum is Shawn Rya's realization about the audience. Just as in real life, the people always root for evil cops. A few people with puzzled faces asked me how the Nazis could have happened in the most enlightened culture in the world at the time. I respond, "You've answered your own question." One good reason that they fail to critique the bad behavior at the core of the show is that *nobody ever does.* I can't think of any prominent commentators who criticize injustice _per se._ It's always a critique from a particular perspective that functions within a pre-existing narrative. I listened to NPR after the killing of George Floyd to see if they would ever mention Kent State. As far as I know, they only did so once, and only to claim it was totally different. Kent State, at the time, fit into the narrative of the Minority Youth Culture Against the Establishment, which went away after they started to grow up and discovered cocaine, tax-free municipal bonds, and neoliberalism. Now it just bounces off people's heads because it doesn't fit the narrative of pan-racism. Even Rya says the show now would have to have voices "from the communities that are being affected by the police" in dialectical opposition to "white middle-aged guys." It can't happen here, folks. Not to *us.* That Martin Niemöller was such a joke! Surely Hitler only wants the Sudetenland Jews.
Woo, looking forward to having my heart broken when we take a critical eye to my favorite overpowered cinnamon roll! Seriously though, this is an incredible series!
About the war movie quote; I'd love to see a piece about "The Thin Red Line" When I saw it as a kid I thought it was pro war, now I watch it again I get a distinct anti war message. A message that war is a pointless endeavour as only nature survives.
educate them correctly, progressives are the worse at that, imo as a poc whos dealt with popo my whole life from my daddy and me stomped before i can speak to my homies rip for poppin back and funny times i madem laugh and they just made me poor my beer
I'm not a wealthy person. I hate civil asset forfeiture & would love to learn more about this show without having to spend weeks walking The Shield. Knowing that there's a video from you about that season would be really cool though.
Vic: I took something for Me Walter: I did it for Me I liked it two sides of the same balding mid-life crisis (is there anything sort of fiction out there that you would say shows examples of good policing? Do you think is it at all possible for the police to reform or would you think it's too corrupt to be anything other than a corruptive expressive influence?)
I disagree with the notion that it's somehow impossible to portray cops accurately/critically/negatively without "accidentally" doing copaganda, just as I disagree with the assertion that it's somehow impossible to make a genuine anti-war film (example: "Johnny Got His Gun"). It's just impossible to get pro-crooked cop networks and advertisers to air it.
The point about that the show was written by middle aged white guys is so true and poignant. In one episode where Claudette gives a lecture to a young black kid about the N word and knowing it wasn't written by a Black writer made it come off really appropriative
Maybe i was biased by then. But the arch in thia show seemed to be for the audience. We collectively thought this guy was an anti hero... until we realized he was a monster.
Is there anything in all the series or in source that focuses on the word "shield" as used by so many cop shows and movies? Who/what gives the shield and what its function is other than an identifying article -- what does it shield against?
I've already came across this François Truffaut quote before (at 11:20) and I actually think I've since encuntered a movie that shows war without being pro-war: Sicario Day of the soldado While there is a lot of clichés on the surface, the plot literally being a republican wet dreams at first (islamist terrorists passing through the mexican border), the violence in it is so raw in the sense that it's not embellish with cool effects or dramatized. People take bullets and instantly fall like big potato bags. Personally I was feeling bad when the movie ended, I just wanted the cartel war to end. However this might really only be my opinion because all the scenes of the movies posted on youtube are filled with americans and mexicans alike comments cheering the death of criminals.
Yes, this does happen, but I think one of the problems that police are facing in the smaller towns is, there’s not a lot of oversight. You have the sheriff, under sheriff, and then maybe 10 deputies and a dispatcher. Take Sherif Trujillo in New Mexico. I believe that sheriffs department only had about eight deputies. When you have a very small department, everyone feels like it’s the bad boys club, it’s a real tight group, and especially since most of the city officials were corrupt, no wonder they felt like they could get away with a lot of things. But if you take a slightly bigger city with civilian auditors, no, I don’t mean those idiots with cameras who are just looking for a city lawsuit I mean appointed civilian auditors that investigate police actions within the police department. And then you have the internal affairs division, which usually consist of college educated lieutenants and then you have the district attorney in the mayors office that keeps the close eye on the officers and their actions. I’m not saying that there are not problems there, but the problems are fewer. Then we have to think of the man or woman who takes the job as a police officer
“Badge Daddy” is a horrifying phrase to me, lol.
I don't know whether it makes it more or less horrifying to see those who crave authoritarianism as just being very kinky and sadly unwilling to a) acknowledge that it is a kink and b) adopt SSC or RACK protocols so no one actually gets hurt by their fucked-up mental wiring from their childhood and sociopolitical and other trauma.
But seriously, I've seen so, SO much from fash/alt-right/conservative types that totally just screams of repressing themselves so much they've bought into the delusion that their kink is actually a healthy way to live and one everyone should do. It's kind of like seeing the alternative health quackery people that have convinced themselves their obsession with enemas and laxatives isn't because it makes them feel good psychosexually, but that EVERYONE needs to turn their colon into a powerwasher for the sake of their optimum health. Except, for the most part, those people only harm themselves or sometimes, sadly, someone in their immediate control that they drag into it. Authoritarianism fetishizers rule society as it is, and that's terrifying.
Questionable Backyard That’s an interesting way to think about it. Dang!
0_0
dadge baddie
Get people to replace “police” with “badge daddy” in their vocabularies and they will crumble¡
Watching these videos has me thinking about how many young cops grew up watching these shows. They talk about violence on TV effecting youth, but they don't talk about how policing has been changed by the overwhelming amount of television shows featuring cops who consider themselves "outside the law". We've been led to believe that violence on TV is turning kids into criminals, but perhaps it's just turning children into cops who have the wrong idea about the job.
Such an interesting point 🙌
Woah.
Honestly shit like this makes me want to make a realistic cop outside the law novel where its has the tropes but with realistic twists. Chases a guy through the streets and accidently runs innocents over, shoots at a guy feeling the scene of the crime and tags random people nearby. Beats up a suspect to get information and it turns out that was the wrong guy and he had a family that he can no longer care for. Point being that the outside the law cop hurts alot of people in his movie fantasy.
@@thewhitewolf58 There was just a road rage incident that took place near me. An off duty trooper got mad that a family going to see Christmas lights tried passing him so when they passed him he flipped and drove on the shoulder to pass them nearly side swiping a tow truck. Then he slammed him brakes on and the family just barely missed a concrete embankment and went off into some grass. They tried getting off at the exit and he pulled up ahead of them and there was a gunshot and he was screaming commands at them.
Once he found out they called the cops he fled. He was booked on $20,000 bail and put on unpaid leave (not fired). I was arrested with $80 of drugs and given $50,000 cash only bail (no 10%) in the same area, he only needed $2000 to get out. Glad to see where their priorities lie.
I honest to god dont understand this take, like i watched the shield as a kid(probably a little to young), and not even for a millisecond did i think to myself, "why yes, should i ever become a cop, i too should indiscrimately murder and steal". Truly if you come away from watching that show thinking anything but "this is fucked" you are a lost cause and this show didnt make you a bad person. It so explicitly shows how fucked the system and the people participating in it are, youd have to be blind to see anything else.
being autistic myself, vic having autistic kids and that being used to justify his instances of police brutality is especially horrifying to me. 50% of the victims of police brutality are mentally ill and/or neurodivergent. liam long is still in the hospital in kentucky. when i got arrested at a protest, i told the cops that i'm autistic and because of that i lose memories while stressed, and the response was "oh well" and a threat that if i leave out information about what i have on my person then they'll add more charges. cops don't care about us
you, "lose memories" when you get stressed? LOL ok
@@cpi3267 I think they meant that in some stressful situations people are likely focused on safety. Like if someone recounts having a gun in their face- their going to remember the gun and not person who put it there.
@@cpi3267 1. Googling ‘stress memory’ will give you plenty of results about how stress can impact memory formation and storage. This information is easy to find, and although it’s an area of neuroscience (complex and with a lot of emerging research) there are plenty of articles aimed at a general readership.
2. Neurodivergence (shockingly!) involves people processing stimuli differently to neurotypical people, including things like hormone responses to stress or brain functions like memory. I don’t know about the interaction between memory, stress and autism myself, and there would be variation in experience anyway, but the claim is not one you can just dismiss off hand.
3. Which brings me to: if you respond to someone saying “this is how I experience the world” with “lol, whatever, no you don’t” you are being an ignorant arsehole.
pretty big assholes. to anyone reading this who doesnt know, in many countries you can just deny your statement. it wont help you to talk to the cops they will only try to manipulate you. try to speak as little as possible to them. it will help you.
You are allowed to leave out any information you want to when talking with the cops. They weren't just ignoring your handicap -- they were outright lying to you to try to make you voluntarily provide them evidence against you. It is called the 5th Amendment. The only thing you should ever, ever say to the cops when arrested for any reason is that you will not answer questions without your attorney present.
I wonder how many people were more upset that he testified against other cops that that he murdered people
I mean him murdering people made me dislike him but something about throwing your extremely loyal friend under the bus to get away scot free even though you've done all that he has and worse feels even more reprehensible because the people he kills are random people we barely get to know while the person he betrayed you get to understand just how messed up it is
I was glad he did it, because Ronny deserved prison, and that goes for everyone in the Strike team, as well as other cops in the Barn. Vic escaped, but his life was in shambles.
Loyalty is highly valued among people and people despise traitors.
@@TheThing4444 Loyalty is particularly valuable to those who have little of their own, because we often assume others to have our own values.
you spelled "snitch" wrong.
I appreciate how you're still covering America's police brutality even when the Black Lives Matter movement is not necessarily what is trending.
THIS.
@cyotee doge which riots?
@cyotee doge the insurrectionists who were cops and were let in by cops to kill and maim unsuspecting cops?
Is that what you're referring to?
@cyotee doge black people: Please stop killing us.
You: DuRrR dAtS CuMnIsM
@cyotee doge only sane skip intro viewer
I was against Vic from ep 1. Pretty unambiguous how evil he was. I can't believe so many people supported him til the end.
Same. Dude is a selfish, arrogant criminal with a badge which makes him a hypocrite.
I thought the show was going to be about bringing him down, I assumed he was the villain, lol.
I wanted him to, for lack of a better word, repent.
I knew that was never going to happen, but Vic's disgusting traits sat side by side with some powerful good characteristics. It almost seemed like maybe he'd reform.
He was willing to risk himself for greater goods. He was loyal. He was, selectively, sympathetic or even kind at times.
What I enjoyed was the tension between these traits and the eventual deconstruction of the idea of Vic as anti-hero.
In the end, the show made it unambiguous. Vic's actions - good or bad - were always in service of his ego. Vic wanted & needed to be the action hero. He was driven by the desire for dominance, power & adoration. Even his grand gestures of kindness or heroism served his ego.
In another job or role, maybe that could have been channeled in another direction. But as a cop, well Vic's vices were always going to be well fed.
I loved the ending. Sure, he got away with it. But his family managed to get free of him. The same cops who adored him, hate him. Even those who might have looked past his crimes hate him for turning on Ronnie. His new boss intends to make him pay.
He betrayed Ronnie. He got Lem & Shane killed. He cheated on his wife and used her to protect himself. He threatened.He tortured. He murdered. He stole. He framed people.
In the first episodes, we might have said "He's bad but . . ." But by the end, all we can say is "He's bad".
He was terrible but what made me root for him was the fact for the most part he did more good then bad
Me too i hated Vic since i find out of the shield theres somenting exceptionally evil in him at difference of other antihero protagonists
We route for him because he is the protagonist. Its the same with Walter White and other like characters. It's the syndrome of narrative
What I like about the show is that it never feels like anything is forgotten. Terry's death in episode one remains relevant from episode one to the finale.
Bruh why doesn't this series have more views
I'm pretty sure this is a re-upload. I remember seeing this video a week ago and it had more views.
@@PoggoMcDawggo actually, I think it only seems that way because the introduction is almost exactly the same as the previous video's introduction. Unless of course, he released this video, deleted it, the re-uploaded it a week later before releasing any other videos.
I think the conflict of pro-police vs being critical of the police is going to always fall short in one way or another simply because telling an accurate, critical story of police with the police as main characters. These arent reporters or people in the communities they are writing about (a flaw in the approach to be sure) but if they have to choose between writing a compelling narrative and portraying something in an accurately critical way, I think most writers will try to find that compelling story before making those other considerations. Its a very tough spot to be in, and I think this is certainly something that needs to be addressed in the future, but as he said, who else was talking about some of these issues to as big of an audience as they had in 2006?
Great video and am really looking forward to what comes next on this channel!
BTW This has been a great series of video essays
IKR too bad Shift Intro is censoring his comments like a child.
@@Frankovelli Censoring what, exactly?
This is such a good series, probably one of the best series of video essays I’ve ever seen; I can’t wait to see your tales on spooky tv shows and criminal minds and profiling. Truly some great stuff.
I am loving this video series! Even though The Shield is a show I’ve never seen and have no interest in, I’m fascinated by your analysis of it and the general idea of copaganda. Looking forward to the next video!
The reason that Vic is such a popular character is because the show, at it's heart, is a male power fantasy. That's why despite being horrific and wrong, the violence and action are still cool af and why he is the main protagonist.
And the ending, when he gets punished for his crimes, doesn't actually have him lose, as such. He's alive. He only has to do some time, and only for the 9-5 grind. He still gets paid. He still has a pension. He still has a badge. Everything that he actually lost, he can replace. The only thing he's learned is to be more careful next time.
It's pretty interesting how Michael Chiklis played a nice, kind-hearted good guy cop on The Commish
Don't forget the Lovable "Don't Do Drugs'" Ben Grimm/ The Thing in Fantastic 4.
“Al Capone with a Badge.” An interesting quote considering the Sicilian Mafia was essentially a private law enforcement agents that realized the real money is in controlling crime the way Vic does.
Nicely nuanced piece.
I read the show through a personality type perspective: Vic displays intensity-seeking, black-and-white-thinking, survival and control are always at stake for him, he values practical competency and direct action, distrusts abstract systems and institutions, values personal relationships. (This would be a type 8 in the Enneagram.) The show presents the negative sides like the self-righteousness, the impulsiveness and aggression, and the tendency for stubborn denial and hypocrisy while giving a lot of space for the good things like loyalty, commitment, effectiveness and autonomy.
The show presents those two psychological sides and thereby presents a compelling character, but it's presentation of social reality is quite warped by its protagonist's perspective. Viewing it like that - a chance to inhabit such a perspective - made it easier to enjoy it despite its sociological crudeness.
Civil forfeiture is a big issue in the usa so i'd love to hear about that...or on patreon, whatever lol
There is a strong positive correlation between how much a "reader" spends time with the main character of a "text"--yes, my background comes more from the literary world, but the terminology can transfer over--and how much the reader sympathizes with that character. Anti-heroes become back door heroes.
Thank you for this video! The Shield is my favorite show of all time!
I disagree with some of your criticism, as the show does have other incidents of criminals who have reformed. But I agree with your overall analysis. While I personally felt the urge to root for Vic, I always knew that this was a TV show, and that I'd never root for this type of cop in reality. I also knew that ultimately, Vic would have to go down in some fashion for his sins.
Yeah for a show that happened years ago and talks about more meaningful subjects than any cop show now
I remember when this show first aired. I'm not sure if I stop watching after the first episode but it was very early on. Maybe second or third episode. I've never been a huge fan of 'antiheros'.
Why don't you like antiheros?
@@RandomSkyeRoses Usually it's just code for a completely unlikable asshole who gets everything he wants. You can say all you like that they aren't supposed to be likeable but that's like saying a character is supposed to be annoying... it's still annoying, and I have no interest in watching it.
@@Disthron I never thought of it that way. Sometimes, I start questioning anti-heroes and how they created more entitled people
Like your series even tho I haven't watched any show because as a minority surrounded by cops I have no interest in glorification or dealing with an audience dead set on glorifying them. Yeah gangster movies/shows do the same but the difference is there is no Gov't claim of protection nor mass protection from the Gov't even when on the take.
And I say this as someone whose never had a bad run in with cops but they're open in how they perceive me and all it takes is 1 to see a Black nerd as a "threat" to do as they please.
I so nearly bailed on The Shield after the first episode, but was pleased I stuck with it as those final seasons where it all circles in on the squad is incredibly tense. It’s good to see one of the producers aware that while there’s good in the show, it’d have to be handled differently. It feels like a lot of showrunners have difficulty putting a critical eye on their past successes.
The biggest question I have about The Shield is how come Shawn Ryan was never able to make a decent show after
Although Lie to Me wasn't bad
Terriers!
@@chromatos7428 it was ok, flopped badly though
I think it's because Shawn Ryan wasn't the sole reason The Shield was great. Don't forget, for the first 6 seasons he also had Scott Brazil, Kurt Sutter, Glen Mazzara as well as other writers by his side. Their work as a group is what made the show as good as it is.
Think about EL Camino and why that turned out to be sub par.
Yeah, sure Vince Gilligan (the alleged mastermind behind BB) was making it but again he wasn't the sole reason Breaking Bad was excellent. He didn't have Peter Gould, Thomas Schnauz and the other writers with him to make that movie.
The Night Agent new released by Shawn Ryan, maybe that is the next bread maker.
i love this series. if i wasnt a poor id definitely drop into your patreon, soon come tho
Just watched part 1 last night so I'm pretty psyched to get part 2 the very next day! After the copaganda series, I would love to see you do something on a show you tangentially mentioned in this episode: The Good Place.
omg, I'm so dumb. Not only have you already done something on The Good Place, but I've watched & liked it. sick memory, I have lol
I remember finishing this series a decade ago and from the start, I prayed for their downfall from Episode one. That ending enraged me because he technically for away with it leaving a wake of death and destruction in his path
I can’t believe this channel actually said it’s a great ending. It’s a complete disappointment of an ending. Vic literally getting away with every single thing he ever did and also being a massive sociopath means that’s losing everything and everyone he ever had isn’t even a punishment for him. He’ll just turn into another type of human garbage and probably still be able to get away with it. Calling the ending a de facto 3 year prison sentence is, ironically in itself, copaganda that this channel chose to praise.
I love these essays. I can't wait for the next installment, but I do understand that such quality work takes time!
I rewatched the end of this episode before watching the next!
I watched the Shield without seeing the last season and was shocked at Shane's ending.
Your videos are absolutely awesome brother, as soon as I find a job I'mma have to slide on over to patreon, the quality of these are too high.
Do you plan to do more political stuff after this though? I think you mentioned in one episode you normally do like examinations of film, so is copaganda a one off or do you think you enjoy analyzing how a show portrays a real world system?
Just had to pause the video to chime in and say HELL YEAH you brought up one of my favorite nonfiction books of all time, Difficult Men. Highly recommend it.
I've been waiting for this. You do great work
Every time I watch one of these videos I get reminded of the speech at the end of team america. May not be algorithm friendly but I feel like that movie, and especially that speech, deserves your attention as well.
To prote©t and $erve.
I've been going through the series one after another (mainly watching on Nebula and then hopping over here to comment) and finally went over to the Patreon - this is really quality stuff.
The system that enables people like Vic should not be allowed to exist, I think is the key-est point. Vic without a badge wouldn't have nearly the reach to cause the harm he did that Vic with a badge is.
I am so glad you mentioned NYPD Blue. I hope to be able to join your Patreon so that I can send you a DM with my thoughts about NYPD Blue.
SUCH a great series!! I'd really love that bonus video btw- especially since I didn't realize that was a thing (though I'm not surprised).
Interesting videos addressing the Shield. The anti-hero characters were so well written, developed and portrayed by the actors that it became hard not to root for them on some level, even if you knew they were essentially amoral, or certainly immoral people. For the show to have given a happy ending to them - Vic and Shane for sure - would have sat ill with me, despite the fact that bad people don't always get the end they deserve irl, so why should they in a work of fiction? Of course, not every character in the show received the attention to detail that Vic and Shane got, so it's easier to dismiss them as stereotypical bad guys, with no or little nuance. I think that's the nature of the beast though, as a fast-moving plot and character driven drama. It's tough to think of any show featuring a large number of ancillary characters that does it otherwise, off the top of my head.
I get what is being said about the way street gangs, the drug trade and attitudes towards suspects and criminals is portrayed, I'd say that the show is largely presented from the perspective of the police, the bad, the good and the in-between, so those attitudes are probably consistent with the way law enforcement views those other groups, particularly non-whites. The show depicts Shane for example as being inherently racist and there is a disconnect between almost all the officers and any Spanish-speaking citizens they run into. The police department in Farmington is very much depicted as something alien to the community they oversee and there are elements of it being an occupying semi-military presence - particularly the Strike Team. Obviously, guys like Captain Aceveda relate to the Latinx community, though he's a social climber using those connections as a base with which to propel his own political career.
So, I'm not sure I agree that the show is putting those concepts over to the audience as such, but moreso depicting in a non-obvious way how the police characters see their world. It's kind of the same with The Sopranos, where the show's worldview is set by the Mob characters, with very few viewpoints originating from outside of that perspective. The difference with the Shield is that it emerges from a genre which almost exclusively had portrayed the world of policing in a positive light, so despite Vic murdering a "good" cop at the end of the first episode (interestingly portrayed by the actor who had played the generally likeable and charismatic detective Kellerman in the outstanding show Homicide a few years earlier) it was still tough for most people to break away completely from that mindset until quite late on in the series. For me, that was an impressive feat by the writers and the actor playing Vic (and Shane, too).
Fantastic content man.
Well thought out & expertly presented.
The Shield is and will remain my favorite show of all time.
Sort of like Punisher or Batman as cops - except for that even Punisher is more moral. But the similarity with vigilante stories, and the rogue hero cop, breaking all rules.
i don't understand how these could be underperforming, easily one of my favourite series from breadtube ever
First and foremost, I love these series. And I love your take on television and society in general! I have recommended your channel to quite some people which I will continue to do. Keep up this great content! ❤
Having said that, I started watching The Shield based on your recommendation and have just decided not to continue watching anymore after second seasons' second episode. And not just for what the creators would have liked done differently if they had the chance. Although the blatend discrimination throughout the series didn't help in trying to make me appreciatie it. I don't care if some characters are portrayed that way, but I'm talking about how the series seem to accept those as a bigger truth. Afro-Americans who got shot by white criminals for instance questioning the possibility of white gangs. As if white people can't get impoverished and/or as if race would determine criminal behavior.
Which brings me to my biggest interest within television: psychology and sociology. Something I recognize in your take on media as well. What bothers me most in most American television, including The Shield, is the urge to create superhero movies/series out of any genre. As you rightfully analyzed an urge to hyperfocus on the main characters flows and strengths which makes their counterparts one-dimensional. But I see the same tendencies go much broader. Allow me to explain myself with what I've seen so far within The Shield.
Vic himself gets portrayed as the typical main hero superhero. He even has his (supposedly) comic sidekicks. His superhuman strengths are a complete understanding of the city and the criminal underworld, a full bar of power and strength and like most American superheros complete control over handling fireweapons or any meelee weapon. Vic strikes me as the character with a degree in 'world' martial arts as Southparks Team America would call it. Name a discipline and he'll own it. Not just him, his goons are indestructible as well. As far as I've seen in the series, no cop in general got killed/hurt by people out strengthening them. Only on a cowards way they could get harmed by non-supernatural beings. Like many superhero's, Vic gets portrayed with weaknesses as well. Amongst them the weakness to misuse his powers. Although it's remarking what a huge level of control the creators still want to give him. Imo it's sad how they want to portray Vic as a person that happens to question himself on the 'right' moments, rather then the villain who needs to lay low in order to avoid getting detected. I know the first episode shows him liquidating a 'good' cop who tried to get close to him. But after that, Vic seems to be overly self aware. Both about the fact he's just a criminal as strangely somehow how he would be the biggest saint of all. The last bit even convincing 'good' cops about his supposed good nature. Because the further the season goes on, the more we learn how all people have their flaws and weaknesses. But how despite the rest, Vic seems to be the only one in total control of himself which makes his flaws forgivable. Even 'calculated' errors. Not just Vic though. Just like in many super-hero films, the main character is not the only supernatural being.
I'm not going to analyse all characters, I'll just pick one. Dutch is the character I came to love and hate the most. Since he's bringing mostly psychology to the table. Or at least, when it's his time to shine as the superhero he's. In contrast to Vic, he doesn't have super national fighting skills. He's limited to be 'just' perfect with any fireweapon. Although he doesn't need to. He's supernatural his own way. He's got psychic super powers. Reading everyone in a blip, almost completely cracking cases that would take the FBI ten years in... one day. And eventually in what, after 2-3 weeks one other day? What I loved about his character is how most of what he says makes sense. The scene where he was 'mind battling' with the serial child molester was done very well. Both in logic as in credibility (if we would disregard how the scene ended). On the other hand the fact he seems to have been part of the force for quite a while, seems to makes it strange how Dutch seems to have suddenly developed his talent, only since we the viewer joined into the bigger narrative. Even though he claims to have studied criminology and higher studies, his own collogues seem as surprised as us how perfectly accurate he gets with his theories. Just like Vic or any superhero however, he's cursed with his own talent as well. Since he seems to lack the social skills in matching up with the people he could read too good which makes him some kind of social outcast. Something that does hold some ground in reality, since objectifying other people only helps with better reading them. But then again, his social awkwardness doesn't seem to match that. Even though he can perfectly read how dangerous people are and understand how he's perceived a beta by the alpha's, he's not afraid of anybody... Which brings us imo to the eventual biggest flaw to the series. Since Dutch has perfect human reading skills, he should have known the 'real' Vic from the start. He should haven been the one to bring this to captain Acavedo (with the special strength of being ethical perfect and reasonable, to the point where crimes and torture gets portrayed as ethically solid solutions in situations where those are 'required'). But not just that. Dutch should have as a bare minimum called out Vic for the shit in his desk as a way to ridiculise the seriousness of Vics job/responsibility. In order to deviate attention away from his criminal priorities. In the first place towards Vic himself, in the second towards the goons he needs to run his gang with and lastly towards Vic's colleagues (including Dutch) who seem only aware about the fact he doesn't like to follow the rules of the books. Not about his side-business initially. Because perfect team-player (and firearms specialist obviously) officer Danni doesn't accept this as a possibility. Sadly, as a woman, she can't overcome the weaknesses that came with her superhuman package. If only she was more male...
The reason why I probably hate the whole superhero urge in American media so much, is because it completely contradicts the Donner Kruger scale. Which gives imo one of the best explanations about what's going wrong in the world today. In the world we live in, confidence is everything. The one who claims to know it all 'must' been given total control as soon as possible. Only to find out time and time again how they eventually turned out to be a massive scam. The Dunner Kruger effect learns us how people with plenty of confidence in some strength don't have a proper understanding of this skill. The better you master/understand a subject, the less confident you get about the possibility to ever be able to master it comletely during the short lifespan you have. If there would be such thing as a superhero, by nature this person would have had much more modest then incapable human counterparts who just have been initiated to that subject. American superhero movies claim how top confidence (and the urge to show that off) matches total understanding. With the sole (and theoretically logical) risk of hubris potentially getting in the way of complete succes. Something humanly impossible and as said hugely contradicting. Superheromovies are secretly (and obviously unknownlingy) propagating for con artists like Bernie Maddov, Donald Trump and (I know it's still deemed too soon to call it, but why not) Elon Musk.
I would love to see you make a series about the superhero-mindset of American cinema. Probably Anglo-Saxon media in general. It wouldn't surprise me if there would be a theological link to that as well since the UK is in essence religiously fundamentalist (especially the claim how their king/queen would be some deity), while the US deems religion to be massively important as well. Which might make the catholic bible (and its deviations) probably the most popular and cultivated superhero story within the Anglo-Saxon world. And thus a huge inspiration towards superhero-minded authors and screenwriters.
The fact that the people root for Vic Mackey should have been a hint that they would seek those same qualities in a "higher authority" in a post-9/11 America...i.e. a President of the United States...
When I started to watch The Shield, I was in college and the show had been done for about 2 years at point. I was never really on Vic's side b/c he did do so much bad stuff. I was never really on his side and this was probably b/c I didnt watch the show when it was on rather in retrospect. It was more of the mindset of what is going to happen to Vic and how will he pay for his sins? I knew Vic wasn't going down in the first season for stealing drugs and my first thought was "How is he going to get out of this?" Great show and the one lesson I learned from it was that it doesnt pay to be a follower.
I watched a few episodes when it first came out, and I was well aware that Vic was a villain. Before I saw it, I read a book about the Rampart cops exploiting adolescent girls and bragging about statutory rape, among many other things.
@@catsmom129 At least Vic never did anything exploiting children. He even broke an underage sex ring early on in the series. But he did some much other bad stuff it almost doesnt matter he didnt do that imparticular.
What an insanely well done series
Just discovered your vids, loving them. A lot of great insights tied to perfectly illustrated real world examples. Keep it up my guy!
Next up watch "Bones". I'd be interested in of the effect of the more absurd depictions of police procedurals.
Binge The Shield, then watch The Unicorn, for the ultimate actor whiplash.
Another well done,well reaserched video in this amazing series!
I'd like to see your analysis of _The Closer,_ particularly in light of Deputy Chief Brenda Leigh Johnson's relationship with oversight and investigations into her conduct.
Out of all the people Vic Mackey could have pushed someone's face on a burning stove, he definitely picked the right guy with Amadilo. He was pure evil.
Nice vid. One of my favorite series' of all time and I'm glad there are more people checking it out now and having serious viewpoints on it. I do think a lot of people who watched it when it aired kind of just liked it because it was really violent and edgier than other stuff on TV
I never watched The Shield, but now I'm going to have to! Unfortunately that meant I couldn't watch the last part of this vid', so thanks for the spoiler warning! I watched the first episode, but this episode reveals the finale, so I had to stop! I just stumbled on this Copaganda series yesterday, and it's really good! Well researched, and offers some interesting (and IMO, spot on) insights.
I think one problem is at The Shield isn't really a cop show in the traditional sense. Yes the main characters are cops but the law enforcement setting is really just a backdrop for our typical drama of an almost Aristotelian nature.
It is Cain and Abel, it is Faust, it is myth. Chopping it up just to pro cop propaganda, and analyzing it through a kind of weird modernist lens of social critique is both missing the point and doing a tremendous disservice to the exceptional writing and characterization throughout.
It's a show worth watching even for someone who hates literally every single police officer on earth.
Best series on RUclips! Thank you!
Oh cool. I really enjoyed learning things and hearing your takes in part 1 of this presentation so I'm really glad I get to watch part 2 so soon. Soon as in i only discovered your channel this morning. I don't have time to watch this now, but I'll just go ahead and drop a comment and a like anyway, by way of supporting a creator of thoughtful, high quality content and then come back and watch it later! If I genuinely like this one too after watching it i will also subscribe....
Superb analysis. Really enjoying your videos! One thing, though: I'm so sick of seeing commentators fall all over themselves to apologize for or to justify spoilers. The Shield concluded in 2008. If you've got somebody watching your video about The Shield who now, more than a decade on, hasn't yet watched the show, they simply are not permitted to complain about spoilers. They should be slapped! They've already had their chance-many, many years' worth of a chance-to watch it spoiler-free.
"its better than vic deserves"
have you worked an office job?
I find it really sad that people cheer for to police to beat assault and murder "thugs" and "criminals" and then go on to sit on their couches and cheer and empathize for monsters like Tony soprano or walter white. For a lot of people its not about what's right or wrong it's about who can wield the most power and how that pper can be used to kick someone's ass.
People align themselves with those with the most power generally. Of course we're encouraged to root for Tiny Soprano and Walter White because you see things from their point of view. They are fully developed and realised characters. The thugs and criminals in these scenarios are generally faceless and uncharacterised.
If you think about the strike team as a street gang, and look at how they are treated, you will find the anti-cop show you are looking for. From being presumed guilty based on reputation and without any evidence, to being hounded down and hunted and having their families squeezed and trying to turn them against each other. They are used whenever it benefits the careers of people and tossed aside when it doesn't. Towards the later seasons of the show, the strike team aren't even making money, they are just in a vicious cycle trying to stay alive and free.
I already understood when seeing the trailer that Vic was a truly evil man. And, when I watched the pilot of season 1 for Breaking Bad, I knew that Walter White was a monster who would destroy his entire family, his reputation, and his own soul. And with Walter White, I felt that Bryan Cranston was a great actor, but Walter was the character I despised the most since I saw him hide for almost the entire show behind the lie that he was turning to drug dealing to help his family when he was gone. This was especially made clear when his former best friend Elliot Schwartz and Elliot's wife Gretchen (who used to be Walt's girlfriend before Skyler), offered to make amends by having Walt as a member of their company "Gray Matter" so that he could get the medical care he needed for his cancer and the cash flow that would help secure his family's future. Instead, Walt's ego and narcissism did not allow for such a thing and resulted in Walt going further down the path to drug dealing and becoming the sociopathic monster that could murder anybody.
Anti war films are possible, but very hard. The three standout antiwar films are Das Bout, Come and See, and MASH.
Fascinating series. I can't wait for additional videos.
Badge Daddy, while a good point, got a full minute of displeased "hmmmmmssss" out of me.
I know you only review tv shows on this channel like the MCU, but I'm curious if you've seen Training Day and what you think about that movie and how it contrasts with the Shield and maybe addresses some of the problems the Shield has
I wonder how you squeeze the Walter white/vic “but they’ve got good reasons!” lemon. How to give the audience an off ramp from the rose colored lenses.
Breathtakingly elegant analysis/&dissection📽👑
The most interesting datum is Shawn Rya's realization about the audience. Just as in real life, the people always root for evil cops. A few people with puzzled faces asked me how the Nazis could have happened in the most enlightened culture in the world at the time. I respond, "You've answered your own question."
One good reason that they fail to critique the bad behavior at the core of the show is that *nobody ever does.* I can't think of any prominent commentators who criticize injustice _per se._ It's always a critique from a particular perspective that functions within a pre-existing narrative. I listened to NPR after the killing of George Floyd to see if they would ever mention Kent State. As far as I know, they only did so once, and only to claim it was totally different. Kent State, at the time, fit into the narrative of the Minority Youth Culture Against the Establishment, which went away after they started to grow up and discovered cocaine, tax-free municipal bonds, and neoliberalism. Now it just bounces off people's heads because it doesn't fit the narrative of pan-racism. Even Rya says the show now would have to have voices "from the communities that are being affected by the police" in dialectical opposition to "white middle-aged guys." It can't happen here, folks. Not to *us.* That Martin Niemöller was such a joke! Surely Hitler only wants the Sudetenland Jews.
Woo, looking forward to having my heart broken when we take a critical eye to my favorite overpowered cinnamon roll!
Seriously though, this is an incredible series!
About the war movie quote; I'd love to see a piece about "The Thin Red Line"
When I saw it as a kid I thought it was pro war, now I watch it again I get a distinct anti war message. A message that war is a pointless endeavour as only nature survives.
07:09 You can add 45 to that list
As people turn themselves into Pretzels to make excuses for him
I hope , The next show in these series of essays is Justified. Would love to see how do you interpret it.
Really is the best series of critique videos
Whats the song at 1.35? I know that piano from somewhere
Detective “Wagon-baucht” is the best character
Dutch Wagenbachian.
How in the hell are we supposed to protect people if we're always worring about human rights?
educate them correctly, progressives are the worse at that, imo as a poc whos dealt with popo my whole life from my daddy and me stomped before i can speak to my homies rip for poppin back and funny times i madem laugh and they just made me poor my beer
loving this series!
I'm not a wealthy person. I hate civil asset forfeiture & would love to learn more about this show without having to spend weeks walking The Shield. Knowing that there's a video from you about that season would be really cool though.
This show is pretty underrated. I never see Vic Mackey come up in conversations about amazing characters like Tony Soprano or Walter White do
Maybe that's a good sign.
How do you do two videos about The Shield and not mention the time Dutch, the Good Cop, strangles a cat on his porch?! Great videos though.
You really should make an episode about oz
Vic: I took something for Me
Walter: I did it for Me I liked it
two sides of the same balding mid-life crisis
(is there anything sort of fiction out there that you would say shows examples of good policing? Do you think is it at all possible for the police to reform or would you think it's too corrupt to be anything other than a corruptive expressive influence?)
I disagree with the notion that it's somehow impossible to portray cops accurately/critically/negatively without "accidentally" doing copaganda, just as I disagree with the assertion that it's somehow impossible to make a genuine anti-war film (example: "Johnny Got His Gun"). It's just impossible to get pro-crooked cop networks and advertisers to air it.
Unrelated to cop shows but related to difficult men and women , could you do a take on Marty byrde and Wendy on Ozark
thank you massivly for all of these : D
A society that can only be defended by brutality is not worth defending.
Can you do Agent of SHIELD?
The point about that the show was written by middle aged white guys is so true and poignant. In one episode where Claudette gives a lecture to a young black kid about the N word and knowing it wasn't written by a Black writer made it come off really appropriative
The Shield was AMAZING. Man, I wish the Golden Age would come back...
Good job
The problem with cops is that humans exist as long as one person has power over others than known systems can be fair.
with a the badge
Maybe i was biased by then. But the arch in thia show seemed to be for the audience. We collectively thought this guy was an anti hero... until we realized he was a monster.
_Spread this, algorithm!_
Is there anything in all the series or in source that focuses on the word "shield" as used by so many cop shows and movies? Who/what gives the shield and what its function is other than an identifying article -- what does it shield against?
Dexter has done far more damage than any other series imo and I hope a more robust analysis and critique are in the works
America is closer to Judge Dredd then it is than Andy Griffith when it comes to policing
Mayberry was a small town without 50 people living in it. Andy Taylor never had to fight an AK-47 wielding gang leader:
@@jimtreebob2096 Most cops will also never encounter an "AK-47 wielding gang leader."
I've already came across this François Truffaut quote before (at 11:20) and I actually think I've since encuntered a movie that shows war without being pro-war: Sicario Day of the soldado
While there is a lot of clichés on the surface, the plot literally being a republican wet dreams at first (islamist terrorists passing through the mexican border), the violence in it is so raw in the sense that it's not embellish with cool effects or dramatized. People take bullets and instantly fall like big potato bags.
Personally I was feeling bad when the movie ended, I just wanted the cartel war to end.
However this might really only be my opinion because all the scenes of the movies posted on youtube are filled with americans and mexicans alike comments cheering the death of criminals.
Great video!
Yes, this does happen, but I think one of the problems that police are facing in the smaller towns is, there’s not a lot of oversight. You have the sheriff, under sheriff, and then maybe 10 deputies and a dispatcher.
Take Sherif Trujillo in New Mexico. I believe that sheriffs department only had about eight deputies.
When you have a very small department, everyone feels like it’s the bad boys club, it’s a real tight group, and especially since most of the city officials were corrupt, no wonder they felt like they could get away with a lot of things.
But if you take a slightly bigger city with civilian auditors, no, I don’t mean those idiots with cameras who are just looking for a city lawsuit I mean appointed civilian auditors that investigate police actions within the police department. And then you have the internal affairs division, which usually consist of college educated lieutenants and then you have the district attorney in the mayors office that keeps the close eye on the officers and their actions. I’m not saying that there are not problems there, but the problems are fewer.
Then we have to think of the man or woman who takes the job as a police officer