Like a lot of us I grew up playing hockey. I remember being a kid and one of my friends that lived a couple doors down was a great hockey player. I still remember asking him questions on how to do certain dekes, or how to shoot as accurately and with as much power. I always thought it was odd that a lot of times he would simply say "I'm special, I'm gifted". As a kid I didn't really understand what that meant. Fast forward a decade and a bit later I'm having some drinks with my old man and he asks "How about so and so that lived down the street- how did he turn out?" to which I said that I lost contact with him and that I hadn't ever seen him at parties or anything. I mentioned how he always use to say how he was special and gifted and my old man cut me off almost immediately and said "Yeah, that was his parents. They use to talk non stop about how good their kid was and that he was going to the NHL." I thought that was interesting because... he didn't. He didn't even make it to the OHL or any similar high level league. So here's a kid who by contrast to an NHL'er is a mediocre hockey player at best... and he was told his entire life how good he was. I cannot imagine the ego some of these hockey players have from being idolized by kids, envied by their friends, and babied by their parents. It's no wonder some of them fly off the handle and do ugly ass shit and expect to get away with it. They think they're gods. They think they're immune to the law.
For real. I played triple A summer hockey 2 years (spent the rest of my time around single A) and it was the best experience I had in hockey. Nobody got babied. You delivered or you got benched. We were 10-11 years old and it felt like we were treated like adults who needed to be responsible. Of course we were still kids who danced, giggled, and whatnot off the ice. There was one kid with a shit attitude who’s parents were friends with the coach. The coach dropped him for year 2 even though he was skilled because he thought “I’m the shit” and barely tried in practice. The team had a beauty unit, and we won 5/6 tourneys that year. I couldn’t have imagined if just cause “we were highest level” we got treated like royalty. It was quite the opposite. We were taught that it was a privilege and that we needed to work hard to maintain and keep our spot, to keep winning. Our coaching staff was fantastic for such young kids haha.
As long as there is huge amount of money involved they try to make these things disappear and it sucks. On the positive note, absolutely beautiful shirt!
All he said was he doesn’t know athletes personal and that he doesn’t worship them which is pretty doormat level of thinking everyone thinks like that for the most part
@@Mitch-ui8ps I think the point is that all too often fans will vehemently defend their favorite athletes personally and die on that hill even when their fave is notorious
With Kane yes he has a gambling problem. When you owe that much coin to a casino you have a problem. On the other side of the of the coin when the court grants you full custody of you child especially in Commiefornia that speaks volumes about him and his ex
This is not just a Hockey Canada problem, or a hockey problem. Or a sports problem. It’s society as a whole. The fact is that people in power (social, economic, political, etc.) use their status as a protection to get away with doing despicable things. Is every famous person a scumbag? No. But we need to stop putting everyone whose product we like up in a pedestal.
@@threethrushes yep perfect example is Epstein/Maxwell trial. That list sadly will never see the light of day because of course numerous rich/powerful people are on that list. Life isnt fair, if you have money and power you get away with awful crimes.
Absolutely right Shannon, especially in the case of narcissistic personalities (which a decent sized proportion of athletes are), the private and behind closed doors behaviors can be atrocious and its another example of how backwards the world is.
Well said, Shannon. This is an unfortunate situation for everyone involved and I would imagine that this is just the tip of the ice-berg in regards to similar stories and further accusations coming out.
The problem also persists towards our justice system. It is very hard to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that sexual assault has taken place. Which is reasonable when considering how our law in constructed but devastating for victims. Something has to change and it’s bigger than sports.
The secret slush fund absolutely BLEW my mind. That's MAFIA kind of shi* .. ALL the heads of Hockey Canada need to be FIRED immediately & investigated for criminal activity. Covering-up crimes IS A FKN CRIME! #awfulEverything
You also have to make sure you don't start a witch hunt where you burn guys just on mere accusations. There have been enough false accusations in recent cases that I'm not believing anyone is guilty on the basis of an accusation without strong evidence to back up the accusation. The days of just believing the accuser should be over.
Thank you for covering these stories and giving them the weight they deserve. It's not easy to hear and even harder to talk about openly. This is a hockey problem, it's been seen time and again. But more than that it is a sports problem and a societal problem. It would not surprise me if athletes have a higher rate of sexual assault than others outside of sports but this is what happens when you treat people like living gods, they start believing they can do whatever they want.
The language we use to talk about this stuff matters and it’s really disheartening to keep hearing “they’re teenagers they’re gonna make dumb mistakes” and things like that. Rape and sexual assault is not some frivolity of youth. It’s not a “dumb” thing you do when you’re a kid. It’s a crime and needs to be treated as such. Chaperones to step in if they see something? Fine, but only because it might save some victim from further trauma, not because “well boys will be boys and we better wag our finger at them when they get to acting up.” Then those players that are stopped should be immediately reported to the police of something happened. Or, if it was stopped prior to happening they should immediately be expelled from hockey Canada.
@@Deadboyking2 by willing to pay the woman to be quiet, and now are reopening the investigation they more than likely paid to be shut, they basically admitted that it happened and they didn't want it coming out. They also admitted they have received at last one or two allegations of sexual assault by players over the last 5 or 6 years. That's disgusting. How come they have a fund to cover up, but won't pay to educate this kids to knock it the fuck off.
@@JarradBruessel32 every sport pays women who says they've been sexually assaulted look at Deshaun Watson, he's saying he's innocent yet he paid 25 women millions of dollars just because they wanted not to have the bad publicity. Who knows what happened the judge and police obviously thought there wasn't enough evidence to find the hockey players guilty so who the hell are you to say there guilty its just unproven accusations
It’s way more prevalent in young people in Hockey. We all know at the pro level anything can happen. Look at Magic Johnson and plenty others, we know it’s there. But go find a story of Lebron James in high school gang raping a girl with the starting 5 at that age. Hockey players seem way more reckless and desensitized. Imo there is a culture problem in hockey at youth levels.
So much of it is entitled hockey parents, who teach their kids that they’re perfect and can do no wrong. Of course, it’s not all parents, and not all hockey players. A lot of the best people I know played hockey, as well as a lot of the biggest assholes I’ve known. It all comes down to parenting.
100% I come from a small town and a few of my buddies have made it to AHL and NHL. And of those 3 guys in our small town their parents were exactly how you described. Its definitely part of the culture.
@@zanec1780 in middle school and high school, I knew this prick who had the worst kind of hockey parents you can think of. He was a goalie, and had a early growth spurt. You bet he believed he was above everyone else, and can do no wrong. An all around bully, and an spoiled, entitled asshole in every sense, and his parents wouldn’t shut up about how he would be the next big NHL goalie, even though he was a child. He played in the OHL, aged out at 21, didn’t even get drafted. He has few other skills, spent more time in the rink than in school. Yet none of this is really his fault.
The NHL has such a different vibe to it. I feel like NBA/MLB and NFL players are so different in their culture. I hate to say it, but it is a white person’s game. That’s why the culture is so different.
Jesus just searched up Victoriaville. These cases just pop up daily now. This is disgusting, and this needs to start making people really question their admiration for athletes and celebrities.
The only way this stops (or slows, there will always be predators) is if these young players learn there are consequences for their actions. The reason it's been so rampant is because they know they will get away with it. We need strong, clear consequences.
Thank you for your coverage on this,. Even if there isn't major justice, things need to change and the players responsible need to held accountable for their actions.
What I really don't like about Hockey Canada is they have a fund to pay off sex crime settlements but they don't fund prevention such as education (can't believe this is needed) to teach players to not assault women.
@@DogdaPebba I'm a hardcore conservative, economic and socially. But I also prefer women to not be raped and a national sports organization to not use taxpayer money to settle the cases. If that makes me 'woke' so be it.
@@politicalbandwagon4989 Fair enough, then Hockey Canada needs to institute a policy - you rape (and its proven) = lifetime ban from national teams. No World Cup, no Olympics, no Spengler Cup.
One thing to note: entities other than the criminal justice system do not have to act by the standards of the criminal justice system. Being blackballed from playing for your country does not necessarily require "guilt beyond a reasonable doubt". Playing for your country and playing professionally are privileges, not rights; Hockey Canada, the NHL, and other similar organizations have the right to investigate and mete out punishment on a standard more like "preponderance of evidence". Remember that Kenesaw Mountain Landis made the Black Sox permanently ineligible even though they were found not guilty in court.
@@KobeLoverTatum Slava Voynov? The Slava Voynov that played in six games during the 2014-15 season, and still got his full salary? The Voynov that went to jail for 2 months (July and August of 2015), got out, signed a contract with the KHL, and THEN had his contract terminated with the Kings? :DD lmfao get the fuck outta here. Again, no teams wants to do this, because they're all gonna wait for the actual, political, real life jury to decide, and once they're deemed guilty, THEN THEY let him go. Yeah the NHL suspended him for that season, good on them, but the Kings held out hope.
This was very thoughtful commentary. I appreciate you saying that it’s difficult to watch the NFL sometimes. In the States, that is never considered, fans let every awful behavior just wash away.
When you consider how all the Chicago Blackhawk leaders denied knowing anything about the Kyle Beach incident, why would you expect anything better from entitled junior players? But the lack of leadership at Hockey Canada is nauseating. Doubtless, they'll reassure us they will implement real change to ensure this never happens again. The sleaze and lack of accountability is disgusting. Prosecute everyone involved.
Shannon, I know you probably don't enjoy these more heavy topics, but you capture and articulate these issues so incredibly well. Being in love with the game of hockey should not feel like it comes with social baggage, and it feels like every year it gets heavier because of these kinds of incidents. Hopefully this is a tipping point and we see some positive shifts moving forward.
@@threethrushes My son currently plays on a travel team of HS age players in NE Ohio and since he started traveling without us to chaperone I have talked to him about 2 subjects. First, if anyone tries to haze him by having him do anything sexual in nature he is to resist and report it immediately to the coaches or another adult. Second, women are to be respected and under no circumstances will you become involved in anything with your teammates involving girls. We have raised him to respect woman anyways, but the peer pressure at this age in tremendous, especially on a hockey team. I hope this helps.
@@keithjordan7805 Thank you for sharing those practical tips. I tutor a hockey boy in Finland and I'm looking into teaching him ethics and how to conduct himself as a leader on, and off, the ice.
I knew a few guys at a previous job who played some level of juniors as teenagers. One of them said the coach told him, at 15, he would never make it so he might as well start drinking now and handed him a beer. I knew him in his 20s and he definitely seemed to have a problem with drinking.
The fact TSN and Sportsnet barely posted anything about the Darryl Katz situation is suspect. Other news outlets had it covered extensively, why are Canada's two prominent sport's channels not covering that? If it's cause they are afraid of losing access or preferential treatment from a team, then it's pretty shameful.
Great video Shannon, I think it's very important for people to understand what you said here. Guilty people deny what they did all the time, and just because a player hasn't released a statement yet denying being involved that doesn't mean they did it. Also the context behind Bettman saying it isn't an issue in hockey, knowing that he had to say that regardless of what his personal opinion is because he's beholden to the owners is also important. I totally understand that what happened was abhorrent and I hope the players responsible are punished and Hockey Canada is reformed, but the public is firing bullets at people in all directions and some of it is misfounded.
lol everyone saying as a canadian citizen this as a canadian citizen that. This shit happens in all walks of life ppl need to get over themselves. The ego trip will never go away shannon given how extremely hard it is to make the NHL they are better than millions of ppl but they just have to realise theyre not above the law.
If you think this happens only in Canada I don't know what to tell ya, I'm the same damn thing is happening with USA hockey. It's not just a Canada problem it's a world problem!
While that may be true, it does say something that all of this is coming out for Canadian players, and that the US program hasn’t had issues like this recently (as of now) but people need to stop making this a nationality issue. I agree
looking at the years involved, this kind of places the Logan Mailloux story in perspective with the culture that is present. with the difference that his case was not muted and he kinda took responsibility compared to other unnamed players
Youngsters+alcohol+drugs+partying/clubbing= DISASTER. These places are RIPE for sexual assailt and rape. They are also ripe for FALSE accusations of rape and sexual assault.
It's so cynical and so accurate to talk about the NHL needing a plan and just knowing that it will do absolutely nothing. I would love to be proven wrong about their "investigation" on the 2018 Hockey Canada issue, but I won't be surprised if absolutely nothing from them comes out without that video being leaked
Absolute 🔥 of a jersey! Love it! Agree 100% with your take of hockey and sports in general. Sports does and continue to have a problem. Until they admit it and can up with how to address it. NBA,MLB and now NFL ,sorry to say. NFL makes me want to puke how fast they have regressed.but yeah,hockey too, unfortunately. 😢
THANK YOU FOR THE WORDS YOU CHOOSE FOR THE FIRST 60 SECONDS!!! THANK YOU!!! Many people dont know this and never were told, I guess! YOU DONT KNOW THE FAMOUS PERSONS!!! (GOOD as well as BAD!)
As painful as these things are, I take it as a good sign this stuff is even coming out. There is no doubt it has always been there, and this is just the tip of the iceberg. The fact we are even talking about sexual assault and harassment means the world is slowly changing. At the same time, focusing and speculating too much on individual cases is not necessarily the healthiest things us fans can do.
This is a fair and honest take on the subject. Shining light on a sad reality of the world not just the sporting world. Hopefully it's taken very seriously and solutions to scary problems are found.
I agree wholeheartedly with your opinion that the denials should be disregarded. Here in the U.S., we have constructed rituals for how to deal with public relations crises. It's all about generic statements to the media. They are carefully written to avoid admitting to any civil liability. The Pavlovian news media attend the press conferences and then spend endless hours discussing the statements: who delivered them, how that person looked and sounded, did they strike the correct tone, was the statement given "too late," what promises were made, and so forth. By the time any action can be taken, everyone has moved on to the next scandal, so no action needs to be taken. Finally, the stories die when the guilty parties settle out of court and non-disclosure agreements are signed. No one rich and powerful has been severely inconvenienced and then it's business as usual. I am skeptical that 24/7 news media and social media are more likely to hold the offenders accountable, since they have helped to shorten our attention spans.
Canada should absolutely still play at the world Juniors. Why punish kids who did nothing wrong for the *alleged* wrongdoings of others? At most you can make them compete under "athletes of Canada" or something similar like Russia in the Olympics.
Theres good things in sports that should stay like on court/ ice/ field rivals being friends off it and bad stuff like this and ego massaging that needs to be binned off
Hockey has always had a culture problem. But its not just hockey, a lot of team sports have these issues. For every step forward (Luke Prokop) there are a lot of steps back. I really do think hockey culture has improved a lot in the 20+ years I have watched, but its not enough.
@@name-vi6fs several of those players are on the Sens now- Drake Batherson to name one. Good guys on our team who haven’t come out and said they had nothing to do with the assault….
us as members of HC shouldn't pay HC their fees this season. all the moneys from players across Canada should not pay the fees and HC should except that. no more money should go to them until they right their structure.
10000% agree with the whole not hero worshipping atheletes🙌 I support the team and the sport, I like certain players who are skilled as hell but I dont obsess over them because I only see what they want me to see through social media.
I've been saying this for 20 years at some point in the future this will bankrupt some professional sports League. From concussive head injuries in football, To hazing and sexual abuse in junior hockey, To the type of scandals our host is discussing. It's a ticking time bomb that eventually will bring down an entire league.
It's definitely a societal problem. But, that doesn't mean nothing should be done about it in hockey. Cleaning up their own little corner of the World would be a good start in fixing society's overall problem.
Funding to Hockey Canada should be permanently frozen. Our tax money should not be going to fund millionaires that are also involved in sexual assaults, likely human trafficking for purpose of sexual exploitation. No Canadian tax money should go to this organization, it will only enable them.
Just an update: Virtanen was found not guilty yesterday. But as you said, conviction rates are very low. Hockey Canada could definitely be doing more to help the issue. As someone that has worked with youth, you just know teenagers are prone to doing dumb stuff so you put processes and education in place to minimize risks.
Never forget that Mario’s teammate raped a girl in a hotel room while he was there, and when #66 was asked about it, he said he didn’t hear anything. And there’s people who actually think he’s better than Wayne. Those people aren’t very intelligent.
1. Hockey players are more likely to be sexually assaulted themselves than to be wrongfully accused. 2. Members of those teams could inform the investigation or public about the issues. - Not being an inactive bystander is an option
It’s funny how the paradigm has switched. Back in the day the drunk driving, speeding, and partying was publicized but the domestic abuse, sexual assaults, and drug crimes were kept hush-hush. Now in current times it’s the opposite - the domestic abuse, sexual assaults, and drug crimes are brought to the forefront and the drunk driving, speeding, and partying is kept hush-hush.
I had noticed that if you drive to Katz' gated home on top of a cliff overlooking Edm, before you get to it (not a private street), his armed thugs in black SUVs will let their presense be known. It resembles a drug kingpins setup. No normal person does this. But hey, hes an untouchable so no consequences for he.
My opinion: Team Canada should not be at the WJC, it's going to be a horrible look if they're there. The other crappy part of this whole thing is that Hockey Canada isn't just the men's team. It's the women's team, and other facets. At least one sponsor has said they'll continue supporting the women's team, etc but that is a lot of funding that is, at least for now, gone.
Sexual assault... both years (2003 and 2018) apparently involved multiple players assaulting one girl...and in the first incident it was 6 players assaulting one girl who was unresponsive in a hotel room. Horrific stuff.
What i hope happens but almost surely won't happen, is not only for the people committing the crimes gets a punishment BUT also people who kept the silence all this time. For the 2018 hockey canada thing that happened, it got discovered from a financial investigation. Nobody reported it. Nobody talked ( as far as we know ) . This has to change.
The slush fund is not just for paying off legal cases. The problem with junior hockey is you send 16, 17, 18, 19, 20 year old kids to go live away from home, with essentially no rules. living an entitled life, partying every night, and have girls throwing themselves at them non stop. They have no guidance, no rules and learn they can do whatever, whenever they want. If you want to change it, you should make the minimum age for junior hockey 18, where they can be consenting adults, have finished school, and they are under the control of the team. Not some random family that allows them to do anything what, whenever. They live in a fantasy world for 5 years.
They say no tax goes to settlements but even if that's true if they need more tax money cuz they used the other money for settlements that's the same thing as using it
I really don't like that a very small percentage of people who made very bad decisions turn the opinion on the culture of this sport into something that is not representative of the vast majority of it. Hockey definitely has found itself in a position that is relatable to a lot of other social issues.
I slightly disagree. While it is a small percentage of people who made very bad decisions, it is a fundamental hockey culture problem. Using the Chicago/Kyle Beach situation, that was an organizational cover-up that dozens and dozens of people participated in, including the League and the Union. Same with the Hockey Canada fund. Would love to say it's just those few bad apples, but so many steps along the way help keep these people protected and sweep these things under the rug.
Seems like these stories come out more and more now people still have the Blackhawks fresh in there memory and clearly looks like serious problem at every level
What needs to happen is people need to be accountable for their actions both the Predators and the Prey! 30+ years ago I went to a rock concert with some friends. After the concert, our group of friends started going their separate ways to the gates leading out. 1 of the girls (16yr. old) in our group begged me to go with her to see if she could get some autographs from the band as they were making their way back to their tour bus. Reluctantly, I agreed after much begging ensued. I was there to play the "white knight" and help protect her in case something got out of hand. Well, she was fairly attractive and she ended up getting the attention of 1 of the roadies and he asked her to go with him to meet the band. I refused to let her go with him which annoyed her, but I told her that I didn't trust him and neither should she. The roadie rolled his eyes and told her to stay put and he will be right back with a surprise. Sure enough 5 minutes later the roadie was back with 1 of the members of the band. She got all excited and gave him a hug and asked for an autograph. He invited her into the tour bus (without me) and she could get autographs from the whole band. I told her that was beyond stupid dangerous but she said "OK" and started to leave. I grabbed onto her arm and said "Don't go, they are strangers and you're going to regret it!" She tried to break free of my grasp. I started pulling her away saying "Let's talk about this first" She said "Let go!" I kept pulling her back. She turned around and kicked me in the groin, and Yelled "You don't own me! Leave me alone! Go home!" She disappeared into the crowd of buses. I left pissed off and hurt that she wouldn't listen to me. The next morning, I got a call from her sister. She was in the hospital with multiple bruises across her face and arms. I found out later she had been raped by every member of the band and at least 2-3 roadies before they let her out of the bus. They dumped her in a town about an hour out of the city that we lived in. She was so weak she could barely stand and she was naked except for her panties and a broken bra. They all laughed as they drove away. She managed to flag down a passing motorist about 15 minutes later and was able to make a phone call home from a pay phone. (This was in the late 80's so no cell phones back then) I never did talk to her directly again, as she said she was too ashamed to face me again. I found out later she tried to press charges and it was settled out of court before it became public. She developed PTSD and Depression and needed counselling for years after. So long and the short of it, Whenever I see these types of reports, that is the first thing I think of when someone puts themselves into a bad situation.
Not sure what point you are trying to make about the prey needing to be held responsible; just because your friend did not listen to you does not mean getting beaten and assaulted was warranted. I can't speak to what was going through her head, but I'm assuming she was excited and did not want to believe one of her favorite bands was going to beat and assault her. Also, what would holding her accountable even look like? You said yourself she has PTSD and other trauma from the event. Do you want her to feel guilty on top of that for not listening to you? If so, it feels like you are making what happened to your friend about you and not about what really happened: musicians in a position of power/influence taking horrible advantage of a fan who wanted an autograph. I understand teaching people to be aware of unsafe situations, I do. But blaming "prey" as you call them seems so cruel. Teach people to be safe because we live in an unsafe world, don't "hold them accountable" for the trauma they've already endured.
@@LTeeeeeeeee you misunderstood what I was getting at. I’m not saying they deserved what happened to them. I’m trying to say, That they should have their guard up and listen to their gut feelings when putting themselves in risky situations. Certain people think it’s worth the risk to party or meet “celebrities” and then cry victim when they end up regretting it. Like really, why would a celebrity invite a stranger into a room/house or w/e for no reason. There is usually an ulterior motive. Even someone like Ellen Degeneres who seems like a kind wonderful person has her dark days and many employees report she is very mean to them some days.
Ok I been watching your videos for a while and finally subscribed because I want to say someting. Hockey is like anything in life its a organiztion divided into groups, ages, and overal human beings enjoying life just like dance, policitcs, music, theater, or even becoming a doctor or lawyer. 99.9 percent of hockey players and parents in Canada should not be put into this situation because they are just ordinary people who love the sport and are bright up the right way to treat and respect all indivuals in Canada and World wide. So this black eye on hockey in Canada is not there problem so dont put them in this situation. Is there a problem in hockey in Canada well of course there is but so is everything else in life, trying to get rid of the bad apples in life is like trying to fix humanity and good luck with that, But dont blame everyone else for a few bad apples.
Uhm, that doesn't really fit with Benning resigning Virtanen and thus letting Tofolli walk tho. If they wanted to get rid of him that should've been the time, no?
Last time you made a video about this, I said we would probably never know who was involved. Boy, was I wrong. With everybody trying to protect their back, we will easily be able to pin point who are the culprit. I kind of hope that none of them are in the NHL, but that is probably a pious wish.
send a girl home in the cab the next day and they are super insulted and get pissed off....but i also dont doubt jake was aggresive being as drunk as he was. im curious to see the ruling on this one.
Hockey Canada (or any other sports governing body) has/had the least effect on the moral development of that nation's international tournament players. Parents, family, neighbors, schools, and the culture-at-large all had more influence. Hockey Canada just has deeper pockets, which is why they are targeted.
I think part of the problem is bad parenting. Hockey moms and dads are a special kind... (in general). The super strong competitive, ruthless and driving environment around these kids might turn them into narcissistic personal disorder. I have noticed that second generation young "stars" seems to have more social and psychological issues than other players (in general). Liam Andersson, Lemuix, Dahlen, Tkuchuks, Nylander, etc.
This is a problem and needs to be addressed somehow. Not just in sports and more over the problem with justice systems in the world over and how cases like this are handled. Its hard to prove in court and adversely when someone is falsely accused their reputation and career can be ended. very complex social issue as a whole. However clearly in sports the leagues need to step up and make some stronger policies to handle this at their own level and I agree mentoring from older players needs to be there. hopefully the older players doing the mentoring are good role models though. Very though topic to tackle. There isn't a shortage of cases involving athletes in pretty much every sport right now too....
Like a lot of us I grew up playing hockey. I remember being a kid and one of my friends that lived a couple doors down was a great hockey player. I still remember asking him questions on how to do certain dekes, or how to shoot as accurately and with as much power. I always thought it was odd that a lot of times he would simply say "I'm special, I'm gifted". As a kid I didn't really understand what that meant.
Fast forward a decade and a bit later I'm having some drinks with my old man and he asks "How about so and so that lived down the street- how did he turn out?" to which I said that I lost contact with him and that I hadn't ever seen him at parties or anything. I mentioned how he always use to say how he was special and gifted and my old man cut me off almost immediately and said "Yeah, that was his parents. They use to talk non stop about how good their kid was and that he was going to the NHL."
I thought that was interesting because... he didn't. He didn't even make it to the OHL or any similar high level league. So here's a kid who by contrast to an NHL'er is a mediocre hockey player at best... and he was told his entire life how good he was. I cannot imagine the ego some of these hockey players have from being idolized by kids, envied by their friends, and babied by their parents. It's no wonder some of them fly off the handle and do ugly ass shit and expect to get away with it. They think they're gods. They think they're immune to the law.
Well said. That also sums up American high school culture for football players.
For real. I played triple A summer hockey 2 years (spent the rest of my time around single A) and it was the best experience I had in hockey. Nobody got babied. You delivered or you got benched. We were 10-11 years old and it felt like we were treated like adults who needed to be responsible. Of course we were still kids who danced, giggled, and whatnot off the ice. There was one kid with a shit attitude who’s parents were friends with the coach. The coach dropped him for year 2 even though he was skilled because he thought “I’m the shit” and barely tried in practice. The team had a beauty unit, and we won 5/6 tourneys that year. I couldn’t have imagined if just cause “we were highest level” we got treated like royalty. It was quite the opposite. We were taught that it was a privilege and that we needed to work hard to maintain and keep our spot, to keep winning. Our coaching staff was fantastic for such young kids haha.
As long as there is huge amount of money involved they try to make these things disappear and it sucks. On the positive note, absolutely beautiful shirt!
It goes both ways though as long as a huge amount of money is involved there will be people doing anything to get some
The first 45 seconds of this video should be required viewing for all sports fans.
All he said was he doesn’t know athletes personal and that he doesn’t worship them which is pretty doormat level of thinking everyone thinks like that for the most part
Then whats with all the Evander Kane slander? Cause all we know of him really then is just that he gambles and thats about it
@@Mitch-ui8ps I think the point is that all too often fans will vehemently defend their favorite athletes personally and die on that hill even when their fave is notorious
@@anonymousperson3023 good point
With Kane yes he has a gambling problem. When you owe that much coin to a casino you have a problem. On the other side of the of the coin when the court grants you full custody of you child especially in Commiefornia that speaks volumes about him and his ex
This is not just a Hockey Canada problem, or a hockey problem. Or a sports problem. It’s society as a whole.
The fact is that people in power (social, economic, political, etc.) use their status as a protection to get away with doing despicable things.
Is every famous person a scumbag? No. But we need to stop putting everyone whose product we like up in a pedestal.
Well said
Correct.
In every walk of life I have met narcissists - male and female.
I believe that ethics should be taught at school.
@@threethrushes yep perfect example is Epstein/Maxwell trial. That list sadly will never see the light of day because of course numerous rich/powerful people are on that list. Life isnt fair, if you have money and power you get away with awful crimes.
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Always love your honest takes on hard stuff like this.
Thanks again man!
Absolutely right Shannon, especially in the case of narcissistic personalities (which a decent sized proportion of athletes are), the private and behind closed doors behaviors can be atrocious and its another example of how backwards the world is.
Well said, Shannon. This is an unfortunate situation for everyone involved and I would imagine that this is just the tip of the ice-berg in regards to similar stories and further accusations coming out.
100%
That is part of the problem, Hockey Canada had a slush fund that they used to settle accusations. They have no responsibility to report on anything.
The problem also persists towards our justice system. It is very hard to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that sexual assault has taken place. Which is reasonable when considering how our law in constructed but devastating for victims. Something has to change and it’s bigger than sports.
The secret slush fund absolutely BLEW my mind. That's MAFIA kind of shi* .. ALL the heads of Hockey Canada need to be FIRED immediately & investigated for criminal activity. Covering-up crimes IS A FKN CRIME!
#awfulEverything
Punishment needs to be swift and severe. It doesn’t ever seem like it’s enough of a deterrent. There needs to be serious consequences to actions.
I bet the actual suspects are shaking in their boots
You also have to make sure you don't start a witch hunt where you burn guys just on mere accusations. There have been enough false accusations in recent cases that I'm not believing anyone is guilty on the basis of an accusation without strong evidence to back up the accusation. The days of just believing the accuser should be over.
Thank you for covering these stories and giving them the weight they deserve. It's not easy to hear and even harder to talk about openly. This is a hockey problem, it's been seen time and again. But more than that it is a sports problem and a societal problem. It would not surprise me if athletes have a higher rate of sexual assault than others outside of sports but this is what happens when you treat people like living gods, they start believing they can do whatever they want.
The language we use to talk about this stuff matters and it’s really disheartening to keep hearing “they’re teenagers they’re gonna make dumb mistakes” and things like that. Rape and sexual assault is not some frivolity of youth. It’s not a “dumb” thing you do when you’re a kid. It’s a crime and needs to be treated as such. Chaperones to step in if they see something? Fine, but only because it might save some victim from further trauma, not because “well boys will be boys and we better wag our finger at them when they get to acting up.” Then those players that are stopped should be immediately reported to the police of something happened. Or, if it was stopped prior to happening they should immediately be expelled from hockey Canada.
whatever happened to innocent until proven guilty?
@@mithex8414 hockey canada has admitted it happened in 2018.. just not who it was..
@@JarradBruessel32 can you send me a link to were they admitted it cause i have yet to see anything beyond allegations
@@Deadboyking2 by willing to pay the woman to be quiet, and now are reopening the investigation they more than likely paid to be shut, they basically admitted that it happened and they didn't want it coming out. They also admitted they have received at last one or two allegations of sexual assault by players over the last 5 or 6 years. That's disgusting. How come they have a fund to cover up, but won't pay to educate this kids to knock it the fuck off.
@@JarradBruessel32 every sport pays women who says they've been sexually assaulted look at Deshaun Watson, he's saying he's innocent yet he paid 25 women millions of dollars just because they wanted not to have the bad publicity. Who knows what happened the judge and police obviously thought there wasn't enough evidence to find the hockey players guilty so who the hell are you to say there guilty its just unproven accusations
The amount of victim shaming I've seen on social media since the 2018 allegations were made has been beyond appalling.
It's a complicated issue man, you can't just say "girl good, guys bad"
@@back2byte That may be true. But the amount of people I've seen saying it's ALL the victims fault has been stomach churning.
@@shaynekempton3368 how do you know shes the victim were they found guilty?
Very well presented talk on a sad,sleazy aspect of sports.
you mean a sad, sleazy, aspect of LIFE
This isn’t a “hockey” thing. From the beginning of time, people with money, power, fame have a different set of rules than everyone else.
THIS
It’s way more prevalent in young people in Hockey. We all know at the pro level anything can happen. Look at Magic Johnson and plenty others, we know it’s there. But go find a story of Lebron James in high school gang raping a girl with the starting 5 at that age. Hockey players seem way more reckless and desensitized. Imo there is a culture problem in hockey at youth levels.
All started with the Roman Empire. As they say, money is the root of all evil. That's where the deadly sin known as Greed comes into play.
@@LeylaDerben well the nfl is worse than the nhl by far and not just rich kids play in the nfl
Rick Westhead on the SDPN was a hard listen.
So much of it is entitled hockey parents, who teach their kids that they’re perfect and can do no wrong. Of course, it’s not all parents, and not all hockey players. A lot of the best people I know played hockey, as well as a lot of the biggest assholes I’ve known. It all comes down to parenting.
100% I come from a small town and a few of my buddies have made it to AHL and NHL. And of those 3 guys in our small town their parents were exactly how you described. Its definitely part of the culture.
@@zanec1780 in middle school and high school, I knew this prick who had the worst kind of hockey parents you can think of. He was a goalie, and had a early growth spurt. You bet he believed he was above everyone else, and can do no wrong. An all around bully, and an spoiled, entitled asshole in every sense, and his parents wouldn’t shut up about how he would be the next big NHL goalie, even though he was a child.
He played in the OHL, aged out at 21, didn’t even get drafted. He has few other skills, spent more time in the rink than in school. Yet none of this is really his fault.
The NHL has such a different vibe to it. I feel like NBA/MLB and NFL players are so different in their culture. I hate to say it, but it is a white person’s game. That’s why the culture is so different.
Amen
Hockey Cananda also feeds the entitlement. They are given super star status
Jesus just searched up Victoriaville. These cases just pop up daily now. This is disgusting, and this needs to start making people really question their admiration for athletes and celebrities.
The only way this stops (or slows, there will always be predators) is if these young players learn there are consequences for their actions. The reason it's been so rampant is because they know they will get away with it. We need strong, clear consequences.
Fair. It'd be nice if they were raised with morals and chose to be good.
Thank you for your coverage on this,. Even if there isn't major justice, things need to change and the players responsible need to held accountable for their actions.
*everyone involved. This isn’t just a player issue. It’s a white upper class male issue.
@@EveryTimeIDavid tf are you talking about
@@EveryTimeIDavid ah yes the old race card. A tradition as old as time.
@@darthvader3742 not just race. Class and power.
@@EveryTimeIDavid please go outside
What I really don't like about Hockey Canada is they have a fund to pay off sex crime settlements but they don't fund prevention such as education (can't believe this is needed) to teach players to not assault women.
@@DogdaPebba I'm a hardcore conservative, economic and socially. But I also prefer women to not be raped and a national sports organization to not use taxpayer money to settle the cases. If that makes me 'woke' so be it.
I think most of them may have already been told that it’s not okay to rape people at some point in their lives.
@@politicalbandwagon4989 If the allegations are proven, then unfortunately they're not listening.
@@mattblom3990 Well that’s on the players. If you tell them again their just not going to listen again.
@@politicalbandwagon4989 Fair enough, then Hockey Canada needs to institute a policy - you rape (and its proven) = lifetime ban from national teams. No World Cup, no Olympics, no Spengler Cup.
One thing to note: entities other than the criminal justice system do not have to act by the standards of the criminal justice system. Being blackballed from playing for your country does not necessarily require "guilt beyond a reasonable doubt". Playing for your country and playing professionally are privileges, not rights; Hockey Canada, the NHL, and other similar organizations have the right to investigate and mete out punishment on a standard more like "preponderance of evidence". Remember that Kenesaw Mountain Landis made the Black Sox permanently ineligible even though they were found not guilty in court.
except no hockey team, organization, franchise, league, whatever they may be, wants to do this.
@@csanadhorvath Billy Coutu, Slava Voynov.
@@KobeLoverTatum Slava Voynov? The Slava Voynov that played in six games during the 2014-15 season, and still got his full salary? The Voynov that went to jail for 2 months (July and August of 2015), got out, signed a contract with the KHL, and THEN had his contract terminated with the Kings? :DD lmfao get the fuck outta here. Again, no teams wants to do this, because they're all gonna wait for the actual, political, real life jury to decide, and once they're deemed guilty, THEN THEY let him go. Yeah the NHL suspended him for that season, good on them, but the Kings held out hope.
This was a really thoughtful analysis. Great job, THG.
This was very thoughtful commentary. I appreciate you saying that it’s difficult to watch the NFL sometimes. In the States, that is never considered, fans let every awful behavior just wash away.
When you consider how all the Chicago Blackhawk leaders denied knowing anything about the Kyle Beach incident, why would you expect anything better from entitled junior players? But the lack of leadership at Hockey Canada is nauseating. Doubtless, they'll reassure us they will implement real change to ensure this never happens again. The sleaze and lack of accountability is disgusting. Prosecute everyone involved.
Shannon, I know you probably don't enjoy these more heavy topics, but you capture and articulate these issues so incredibly well.
Being in love with the game of hockey should not feel like it comes with social baggage, and it feels like every year it gets heavier because of these kinds of incidents. Hopefully this is a tipping point and we see some positive shifts moving forward.
I do love that you adress these heavy topics, it needs attention.
At the same time, if you "drop the gloves" in a bar, you will get arrested......
i know who could've guessed in related news if you put on boxing gloves and start punching people in the street you will be arrested lmao
This is absolutely the best video you've ever created. A message most people in the hockey world don't want to hear or refuse to discuss. Good on ya 👍
Great video! It is important to cover the dark side of hockey; my son is a Jr player and I have counseled him on these matters.
Any tips you can share?
@@threethrushes My son currently plays on a travel team of HS age players in NE Ohio and since he started traveling without us to chaperone I have talked to him about 2 subjects. First, if anyone tries to haze him by having him do anything sexual in nature he is to resist and report it immediately to the coaches or another adult. Second, women are to be respected and under no circumstances will you become involved in anything with your teammates involving girls. We have raised him to respect woman anyways, but the peer pressure at this age in tremendous, especially on a hockey team. I hope this helps.
@@keithjordan7805 Thank you for sharing those practical tips.
I tutor a hockey boy in Finland and I'm looking into teaching him ethics and how to conduct himself as a leader on, and off, the ice.
I knew a few guys at a previous job who played some level of juniors as teenagers. One of them said the coach told him, at 15, he would never make it so he might as well start drinking now and handed him a beer. I knew him in his 20s and he definitely seemed to have a problem with drinking.
If anyone looks into the actual details of the story, just a warning that it’s pretty disgusting
The fact TSN and Sportsnet barely posted anything about the Darryl Katz situation is suspect. Other news outlets had it covered extensively, why are Canada's two prominent sport's channels not covering that? If it's cause they are afraid of losing access or preferential treatment from a team, then it's pretty shameful.
Great video Shannon, I think it's very important for people to understand what you said here. Guilty people deny what they did all the time, and just because a player hasn't released a statement yet denying being involved that doesn't mean they did it. Also the context behind Bettman saying it isn't an issue in hockey, knowing that he had to say that regardless of what his personal opinion is because he's beholden to the owners is also important. I totally understand that what happened was abhorrent and I hope the players responsible are punished and Hockey Canada is reformed, but the public is firing bullets at people in all directions and some of it is misfounded.
lol everyone saying as a canadian citizen this as a canadian citizen that. This shit happens in all walks of life ppl need to get over themselves. The ego trip will never go away shannon given how extremely hard it is to make the NHL they are better than millions of ppl but they just have to realise theyre not above the law.
If you think this happens only in Canada I don't know what to tell ya, I'm the same damn thing is happening with USA hockey. It's not just a Canada problem it's a world problem!
While that may be true, it does say something that all of this is coming out for Canadian players, and that the US program hasn’t had issues like this recently (as of now) but people need to stop making this a nationality issue. I agree
Kyle Beach proves there is a huge problem in professional sports
This is amature
You mean Kyle Beach?
@@jamesgentry13 human lives are fragile and it doesn’t take much to ruin someone’s life. Heck yeah u got a huge problem in the NHL
@@sabertooth_shark8374 yeah but he wasn’t the first victim Theo Fleury and a lot of others were hurt as well.
No,Q's and Bowman's lack of support for the kid does,remember,the creep left,went to Mich. ,and that kid offed himself.....sad
looking at the years involved, this kind of places the Logan Mailloux story in perspective with the culture that is present. with the difference that his case was not muted and he kinda took responsibility compared to other unnamed players
Youngsters+alcohol+drugs+partying/clubbing= DISASTER. These places are RIPE for sexual assailt and rape. They are also ripe for FALSE accusations of rape and sexual assault.
It's so cynical and so accurate to talk about the NHL needing a plan and just knowing that it will do absolutely nothing. I would love to be proven wrong about their "investigation" on the 2018 Hockey Canada issue, but I won't be surprised if absolutely nothing from them comes out without that video being leaked
Absolute 🔥 of a jersey! Love it!
Agree 100% with your take of hockey and sports in general. Sports does and continue to have a problem. Until they admit it and can up with how to address it. NBA,MLB and now NFL ,sorry to say. NFL makes me want to puke how fast they have regressed.but yeah,hockey too, unfortunately. 😢
As the old saying goes Shannon "never meet your heroes"
THANK YOU FOR THE WORDS YOU CHOOSE FOR THE FIRST 60 SECONDS!!!
THANK YOU!!!
Many people dont know this and never were told, I guess!
YOU DONT KNOW THE FAMOUS PERSONS!!! (GOOD as well as BAD!)
Love how reasonable/analytical you are.
As painful as these things are, I take it as a good sign this stuff is even coming out. There is no doubt it has always been there, and this is just the tip of the iceberg. The fact we are even talking about sexual assault and harassment means the world is slowly changing. At the same time, focusing and speculating too much on individual cases is not necessarily the healthiest things us fans can do.
This is a fair and honest take on the subject. Shining light on a sad reality of the world not just the sporting world. Hopefully it's taken very seriously and solutions to scary problems are found.
The only player still in the NHL from the 03 canada juniors would be Fleury if i remember correctly
I agree wholeheartedly with your opinion that the denials should be disregarded. Here in the U.S., we have constructed rituals for how to deal with public relations crises. It's all about generic statements to the media. They are carefully written to avoid admitting to any civil liability. The Pavlovian news media attend the press conferences and then spend endless hours discussing the statements: who delivered them, how that person looked and sounded, did they strike the correct tone, was the statement given "too late," what promises were made, and so forth. By the time any action can be taken, everyone has moved on to the next scandal, so no action needs to be taken. Finally, the stories die when the guilty parties settle out of court and non-disclosure agreements are signed. No one rich and powerful has been severely inconvenienced and then it's business as usual. I am skeptical that 24/7 news media and social media are more likely to hold the offenders accountable, since they have helped to shorten our attention spans.
Fotball players cant hide behind a lawyer firm in EU no matter how talented he/she is Mendy in Manchester City is one of many severe cases.
Canada should absolutely still play at the world Juniors. Why punish kids who did nothing wrong for the *alleged* wrongdoings of others? At most you can make them compete under "athletes of Canada" or something similar like Russia in the Olympics.
Theres good things in sports that should stay like on court/ ice/ field rivals being friends off it and bad stuff like this and ego massaging that needs to be binned off
Sick sweater my man
i’ve been waiting for this video
Hockey has always had a culture problem. But its not just hockey, a lot of team sports have these issues. For every step forward (Luke Prokop) there are a lot of steps back. I really do think hockey culture has improved a lot in the 20+ years I have watched, but its not enough.
curbing the intake of alcohol for underage teenagers would be a start; not just a sports issue, but societal.
As a Sens fan… the silence by players on the team in relation to the world juniors assault is damning….
Do you mean the silence from the players who were on the world juniors team?
@@name-vi6fs several of those players are on the Sens now- Drake Batherson to name one. Good guys on our team who haven’t come out and said they had nothing to do with the assault….
@@QellOmnyhydrax so, yes.
Maybe they’ve been told to not say anything until the investigation is completed.
@@name-vi6fs do you get tired living your life 🤣🤡
us as members of HC shouldn't pay HC their fees this season. all the moneys from players across Canada should not pay the fees and HC should except that. no more money should go to them until they right their structure.
10000% agree with the whole not hero worshipping atheletes🙌 I support the team and the sport, I like certain players who are skilled as hell but I dont obsess over them because I only see what they want me to see through social media.
I've been saying this for 20 years at some point in the future this will bankrupt some professional sports League.
From concussive head injuries in football,
To hazing and sexual abuse in junior hockey,
To the type of scandals our host is discussing.
It's a ticking time bomb that eventually will bring down an entire league.
"its a joke between myself and myself" haha love it. I'm freakin hilarious if you ask me
It's definitely a societal problem. But, that doesn't mean nothing should be done about it in hockey. Cleaning up their own little corner of the World would be a good start in fixing society's overall problem.
Funding to Hockey Canada should be permanently frozen. Our tax money should not be going to fund millionaires that are also involved in sexual assaults, likely human trafficking for purpose of sexual exploitation. No Canadian tax money should go to this organization, it will only enable them.
Just remember the presumption of innocence. It's of ultimate importance.
Just an update: Virtanen was found not guilty yesterday. But as you said, conviction rates are very low. Hockey Canada could definitely be doing more to help the issue. As someone that has worked with youth, you just know teenagers are prone to doing dumb stuff so you put processes and education in place to minimize risks.
Never forget that Mario’s teammate raped a girl in a hotel room while he was there, and when #66 was asked about it, he said he didn’t hear anything. And there’s people who actually think he’s better than Wayne. Those people aren’t very intelligent.
1. Hockey players are more likely to be sexually assaulted themselves than to be wrongfully accused.
2. Members of those teams could inform the investigation or public about the issues.
- Not being an inactive bystander is an option
It’s funny how the paradigm has switched. Back in the day the drunk driving, speeding, and partying was publicized but the domestic abuse, sexual assaults, and drug crimes were kept hush-hush. Now in current times it’s the opposite - the domestic abuse, sexual assaults, and drug crimes are brought to the forefront and the drunk driving, speeding, and partying is kept hush-hush.
I had noticed that if you drive to Katz' gated home on top of a cliff overlooking Edm, before you get to it (not a private street), his armed thugs in black SUVs will let their presense be known. It resembles a drug kingpins setup.
No normal person does this.
But hey, hes an untouchable so no consequences for he.
My opinion: Team Canada should not be at the WJC, it's going to be a horrible look if they're there. The other crappy part of this whole thing is that Hockey Canada isn't just the men's team. It's the women's team, and other facets. At least one sponsor has said they'll continue supporting the women's team, etc but that is a lot of funding that is, at least for now, gone.
Is it Darryl "Kates"? I always thought it was Darryl "Cats" haha, I live in Europe so you never hear anyone speak his name here.
Katz
Both Katz and the dancer have denied the allegations. They are part of a case she has brought against her former instructor and his wife.
Glenn Anderson.
A backyard pool.
Wtf, comes to mind...
What happened? I do not know what the 2018 "incident" was or what the current allegations are. ?
Sexual assault... both years (2003 and 2018) apparently involved multiple players assaulting one girl...and in the first incident it was 6 players assaulting one girl who was unresponsive in a hotel room. Horrific stuff.
Finally. Was worried whether you weren't even going to comment on this.
19 years later here about
..big furor when the Habs drafted Millieux....will the "gang bangers" from 2003 be outed or will the league cover stuff up..
Champions are Champions when you can set a high bar for others to look up to and not go dumpster diving in the trashiest landfill
What i hope happens but almost surely won't happen, is not only for the people committing the crimes gets a punishment BUT also people who kept the silence all this time. For the 2018 hockey canada thing that happened, it got discovered from a financial investigation. Nobody reported it. Nobody talked ( as far as we know ) . This has to change.
The slush fund is not just for paying off legal cases. The problem with junior hockey is you send 16, 17, 18, 19, 20 year old kids to go live away from home, with essentially no rules. living an entitled life, partying every night, and have girls throwing themselves at them non stop. They have no guidance, no rules and learn they can do whatever, whenever they want. If you want to change it, you should make the minimum age for junior hockey 18, where they can be consenting adults, have finished school, and they are under the control of the team. Not some random family that allows them to do anything what, whenever. They live in a fantasy world for 5 years.
What are the allegations in these cases?
It would be silly to believe when you get this much money at play there wouldn’t be something in place to protect investments.
They say no tax goes to settlements but even if that's true if they need more tax money cuz they used the other money for settlements that's the same thing as using it
You know Shannon is serious when the board is practically empty
Imagine saying "this whole thing is about money and attention." when the issue revolves around Jake Virtanen.
I can't say anything further but just be prepared to hear the name Joffery Lupul likely come up in the news in the coming weeks/months.
I really don't like that a very small percentage of people who made very bad decisions turn the opinion on the culture of this sport into something that is not representative of the vast majority of it. Hockey definitely has found itself in a position that is relatable to a lot of other social issues.
I slightly disagree. While it is a small percentage of people who made very bad decisions, it is a fundamental hockey culture problem. Using the Chicago/Kyle Beach situation, that was an organizational cover-up that dozens and dozens of people participated in, including the League and the Union. Same with the Hockey Canada fund. Would love to say it's just those few bad apples, but so many steps along the way help keep these people protected and sweep these things under the rug.
What is the statute of limitations when looking at the 2003 team? I'm not familiar with the law in Canada
Seems like these stories come out more and more now people still have the Blackhawks fresh in there memory and clearly looks like serious problem at every level
all I know is that Joffrey Lupul was definitely involved
What needs to happen is people need to be accountable for their actions both the Predators and the Prey!
30+ years ago I went to a rock concert with some friends. After the concert, our group of friends started going their separate ways to the gates leading out. 1 of the girls (16yr. old) in our group begged me to go with her to see if she could get some autographs from the band as they were making their way back to their tour bus. Reluctantly, I agreed after much begging ensued.
I was there to play the "white knight" and help protect her in case something got out of hand. Well, she was fairly attractive and she ended up getting the attention of 1 of the roadies and he asked her to go with him to meet the band. I refused to let her go with him which annoyed her, but I told her that I didn't trust him and neither should she. The roadie rolled his eyes and told her to stay put and he will be right back with a surprise.
Sure enough 5 minutes later the roadie was back with 1 of the members of the band. She got all excited and gave him a hug and asked for an autograph. He invited her into the tour bus (without me) and she could get autographs from the whole band. I told her that was beyond stupid dangerous but she said "OK" and started to leave.
I grabbed onto her arm and said "Don't go, they are strangers and you're going to regret it!" She tried to break free of my grasp. I started pulling her away saying "Let's talk about this first" She said "Let go!" I kept pulling her back. She turned around and kicked me in the groin, and Yelled "You don't own me! Leave me alone! Go home!" She disappeared into the crowd of buses.
I left pissed off and hurt that she wouldn't listen to me. The next morning, I got a call from her sister. She was in the hospital with multiple bruises across her face and arms. I found out later she had been raped by every member of the band and at least 2-3 roadies before they let her out of the bus.
They dumped her in a town about an hour out of the city that we lived in. She was so weak she could barely stand and she was naked except for her panties and a broken bra. They all laughed as they drove away.
She managed to flag down a passing motorist about 15 minutes later and was able to make a phone call home from a pay phone. (This was in the late 80's so no cell phones back then) I never did talk to her directly again, as she said she was too ashamed to face me again. I found out later she tried to press charges and it was settled out of court before it became public. She developed PTSD and Depression and needed counselling for years after.
So long and the short of it, Whenever I see these types of reports, that is the first thing I think of when someone puts themselves into a bad situation.
Not sure what point you are trying to make about the prey needing to be held responsible; just because your friend did not listen to you does not mean getting beaten and assaulted was warranted. I can't speak to what was going through her head, but I'm assuming she was excited and did not want to believe one of her favorite bands was going to beat and assault her. Also, what would holding her accountable even look like? You said yourself she has PTSD and other trauma from the event. Do you want her to feel guilty on top of that for not listening to you? If so, it feels like you are making what happened to your friend about you and not about what really happened: musicians in a position of power/influence taking horrible advantage of a fan who wanted an autograph. I understand teaching people to be aware of unsafe situations, I do. But blaming "prey" as you call them seems so cruel. Teach people to be safe because we live in an unsafe world, don't "hold them accountable" for the trauma they've already endured.
@@LTeeeeeeeee you misunderstood what I was getting at. I’m not saying they deserved what happened to them. I’m trying to say, That they should have their guard up and listen to their gut feelings when putting themselves in risky situations. Certain people think it’s worth the risk to party or meet “celebrities” and then cry victim when they end up regretting it. Like really, why would a celebrity invite a stranger into a room/house or w/e for no reason. There is usually an ulterior motive. Even someone like Ellen Degeneres who seems like a kind wonderful person has her dark days and many employees report she is very mean to them some days.
There is plenty more to uncover I think.
Ok I been watching your videos for a while and finally subscribed because I want to say someting. Hockey is like anything in life its a organiztion divided into groups, ages, and overal human beings enjoying life just like dance, policitcs, music, theater, or even becoming a doctor or lawyer. 99.9 percent of hockey players and parents in Canada should not be put into this situation because they are just ordinary people who love the sport and are bright up the right way to treat and respect all indivuals in Canada and World wide. So this black eye on hockey in Canada is not there problem so dont put them in this situation. Is there a problem in hockey in Canada well of course there is but so is everything else in life, trying to get rid of the bad apples in life is like trying to fix humanity and good luck with that, But dont blame everyone else for a few bad apples.
Uhm, that doesn't really fit with Benning resigning Virtanen and thus letting Tofolli walk tho. If they wanted to get rid of him that should've been the time, no?
He had a piss poor season before the allegations became public. That made it easier to just dump him.
Last time you made a video about this, I said we would probably never know who was involved. Boy, was I wrong. With everybody trying to protect their back, we will easily be able to pin point who are the culprit. I kind of hope that none of them are in the NHL, but that is probably a pious wish.
send a girl home in the cab the next day and they are super insulted and get pissed off....but i also dont doubt jake was aggresive being as drunk as he was. im curious to see the ruling on this one.
If any of them said yes their lawyers would kill them, this is just logic.
certain players you can get a pretty good read on such as beliveau ratelle etc very classy
Not a good summer for Canadian hockey.
Hockey Canada (or any other sports governing body) has/had the least effect on the moral development of that nation's international tournament players. Parents, family, neighbors, schools, and the culture-at-large all had more influence. Hockey Canada just has deeper pockets, which is why they are targeted.
I think part of the problem is bad parenting. Hockey moms and dads are a special kind... (in general). The super strong competitive, ruthless and driving environment around these kids might turn them into narcissistic personal disorder. I have noticed that second generation young "stars" seems to have more social and psychological issues than other players (in general). Liam Andersson, Lemuix, Dahlen, Tkuchuks, Nylander, etc.
Agree with this 100%, parents, peers and friends often give these guys complexes. Seen it first had with guys I played with who went NCAA and beyond.
This is a problem and needs to be addressed somehow. Not just in sports and more over the problem with justice systems in the world over and how cases like this are handled. Its hard to prove in court and adversely when someone is falsely accused their reputation and career can be ended. very complex social issue as a whole. However clearly in sports the leagues need to step up and make some stronger policies to handle this at their own level and I agree mentoring from older players needs to be there. hopefully the older players doing the mentoring are good role models though. Very though topic to tackle. There isn't a shortage of cases involving athletes in pretty much every sport right now too....