"Faith is an extraordinary thing, I'd like to have some but I don't..." This is a powerful statement. My athiest BF says the same thing and is a fan of Joss. I think its a hard and elusive form of pride.
I LOVE the way Joss appropriately and respectably talks about his opinions. Religion is an especially touchy subject that, if you plan on making ANY real headway at all, you have to tread lightly and be confident in every step your taking. He has a fantastic way of sharing his opinion. -A Catholic :)
It's funny how it doesn't work both ways though, isn't it? So many religious people disrespect others simply for being gay or atheists, yet we're expected to "tread lightly" when being critical of the lack-of-logic and sanity in your religion. The Catholic church is fucking despicable, hiding pedophiles (as a victim of pedophilia) is beyond reprehensible, and your last pope did it. and was caught and wasn't arrested BECAUSE OF UNDUE RESPECT THAT IS DIVVIED OUT TO YOUR BULLSHIT RELIGION. What religion has done to me, what pedophilia has done to me is beyond forgiveness and what your religion has done to countless other children is the same shit that has been done to me.... Let's not forget the Catholic Church's helping the progression of AIDS in Africa by telling newly-converted, under-educated 3rd worlders that condoms are bad, among not even allowing AIDS treatment meds to be shipped into certain areas. Fuck your church and your religion. Thank fuck it's dying out like all religion in the face of rationality and science. And look at the extreme religious types out there. Every single one of them follows tenants of those holy books, and they do horrific things i nthe name of them and their god. Even the moderates such as yourself, even if you are tolerant of gays, atheists, etc. There are so many Catholics that aren't that aren't tolerant, at all, let alone alone Christian sects like Mormonism or Baptists, they just think that they are helping us by preaching and threatening us with hell or beatings or whatever else. I've never had atheists, agnostics, rationalists and the educated ever act that way towards myself or my gay brother. But I had to spend years using boxing that was supposed to stay in the ring on dumb fuck bigots who like to beat people in the name of Jesus. Tools. So why should I respect your religion at all? It certainly doesn't have a history of respecting myself or anyone like me.
Joe Cannabyte In fact, I'll tell you what. I won't use Bentio Mussolini as my prime example of Atheists as long as you don't do something similar to me or any individual regardless of their beliefs.
It's hard to tread lightly when so many people are so infatuated with the notions of an afterlife, a celestial monitor and consultant, and even a person that intervenes in human affairs for them to be able to take criticism and questioning. Source: experiences with evangelical and emotionally-driven and illogical Christians.
***** I'm sorry to hear about how your experience with Christians has gone. I hope I can at least convince you that not all of them are like that. I, for one, am also infatuated with such notions (who wouldn't be? even you have to admit their rather attractive ideas to strive for) but I also feel criticism is an absolutely essential part of my well being. I actually really like engaging in friendly discussion and debate with atheists (key word being friendly) because I feel like whether I win or lose said debate, I come out of it a little bit smarter. I realize the notion of God isn't for everyone. Even if I WERE to convince you, the only way your devotion can mean anything is if you whole heartedly embrace the divine by your own merit. If God didn't care about how it is you come to him, he might as well have never given you your critical mind.
That's exactly what I understood him to be saying. Thanks for sharing- it's nice to see that there are tolerant people across the whole belief spectrum.
In regards to your original statement, that an event seems unlikely to have occurred does not make it significant, as it is easy to determine the probability of an event after it has occurred. Richard Feynman illustrated this when he said: Tonight I came in through the parking lot, and you won't believe what happened. I saw a car with the license plate ARW 357. Can you imagine? Of all the millions of license plates, what was the chance that I would see that particular one tonight? Amazing!
For a long time I fought my increasing atheistic thoughts. That episode he just mentioned was one of the first times I ever accepted my being atheist was a good thing. Thanks, Joss.
Just when I thought Joss Whedon couldn't get any cooler. "The only reality is the way we treat each other. The morality comes from the absence of any grander scheme, not from the presence of any grander scheme." My views in a nutshell. I applaud you Joss, I really do.
What I find particularly interesting, and perhaps Joss would too, is that so much of what he has written speaks to my faith. It's partly why I love Whedon's work so much. The other part is that he's just brilliant.
Joss Whedon responded as he did because he holds no contempt for religion. He said himself, faith is an extraordinary thing. You on the other hand, your desire to call the questioner as you have is the very thing that begged his question.
This comes from the the Extras on the Australian DVD of Serenity. Some of the extras were released on the Special Edition of Serenity (and the Blu-Ray) but not this. It was a Q&A session with the audience after the pre-release screening. He mentions "this show" at one point and he is referring to Firefly.
Because I love reading (& writing) various Glee fanfics, but didn't want to struggle to try to read this one in Spanish, which is not *that* easy for me, unless someone wanted me to translate it for them into English - & this way I got to read a good fanfic AND provide a way for a bunch of non-Spanish speakers who otherwise would be missing out on it to read it. ;) I like using my native English speaker knowledge to help non-native speakers, like helping this author share her fic with the world.
Seriously. We need more people like this guy. on both sides. Atheist and Christians. I'm Christian but it's not my place to judge. We can get along when all the crazies on both ends of the spectrum just shut up. Love this guy so much! :D
Lol it's fine. Thanks for being so polite. And thanks. I'll read the rant later when I have time. I'm busy translating a Glee fanfiction story from Spanish into English right now haha!! :P
"I don't have anything against anybody unless their belief precludes everybody else's." This view itself precludes those who disagree with that statement!
I don't think it was when he was given the Humanist Chaplaincy at Harvard and the Harvard Secular Society's 2009 Outstanding Lifetime Achievement Award in Cultural Humanism. But another great example of Whedon as a champion for secularism and humanism.
That was a well spoken thought process. I appreciate that he could share that with people, and he didn't need to get defensive or offensive about anything. I'm a christian, and I think you are allowed to have your own thoughts and opinions and beliefs. If they contradict mine, I'm just going to love you for who you are, and you'll be curious about why I love you. If you ask me, then I'll tell you that it's because God is awesome and He made you!
Thanks very much for your reply. An example of a statement of faith would be, "Although I can't explain, in scientific terms, how the universe came to be as it is, I have faith that my god is responsible for it." Whilst you did preface your sentence with "Do we believe", which can definitely be interpreted as a statement of faith, you then discuss the likelihood of an event; how do you determine the likelihood/probability of the existence of an unexplained, supernatural, creator being?
Big fan of Whedon. And I respect his opinion. I don't have a religion, but most of my beliefs are of Christianity. Definitely believe there is a creator, or higher being. Sometimes seeing isn't always believing ....thats the way I look at life. To each his own, and I wish nothing but love and happiness for everyone on this planet.
February (and even of the publication of his Origin of Species in November), along with calls for the general public to do the same, is rapidly becoming something of an annual ritual, even in some “churches”. One might even say that this modern Atheistic commemoration is being ‘celebrated’ with greater fervour and passion than many longstanding religious rituals. 7) Material: The material dimension of religion, says Smart, includes all the physical things created by a religion such as art and
The most accepted way to determine a religion is by looking for the "Seven Dimensions of Religion," as set forth by Ninian Way. This is broadly accepted to cover every religion without focusing on each specific one. 1) Narrative. A story of where we came from, with important figures for the belief involved (IE, Evolution and Darwin, Adam and Eve, etc) 2) Experiential; 2 types; the experience of people before they formed the religion (IE, Darwin reading his Grandfathers "Zoonomania," the
Again I think most people are fairly tolerant, I'd say even the people here would have a decent conversation with you if they met you in person and had this chat down the pub rather than on internet-land By the way I just realized what your screen name is: I love it! I am slightly obsessed with Dr. Who, I get very excited whenever I met another fan of the show!
Kirkegaard, so far I've been told, has always wondered, even since he started philosophizing was what does it mean to have faith, but I don't know if everyone agrees with that evaluation of himself.
Like I said I'm not interested in debating, but if you insist on debating me, please do so in a private message. If you choose to do so, I will give my answer there.
My problem with anonymity is not so much a sense of bravado, but I forget that these people are more than just their comments, much like I am more than just mine. If we all met in person in a pub and got to know eachother and had these discussion we would probably pass some enjoyable hours exchaging (sometimes heated) views. But here in internetland, I find it hard to view the other commenter as a person, As I say I am working on it, and I am glad you pulled me up on where I am still lacking
yeah, that episode really hit the nail on the head. i personally believe that there is some higher power out there (though no real idea as to what) but it's irrelevant in the scheme of things. because living life is about being a good person. it's not about who believes in a god and who doesn't.
To explain it simply, an atheist's morality comes from the basic principle that if we don't advocate for humanity, nothing will. We should strive to make this world a better place, because this world is all we have, though it's quite far from nothing. And I didn't flag your comments.
They would say must the same about us, I find when you are open minded towards them, they tend to be open minded towards you, and then every one can learn from each-other.
In doing so, they formed the branch of Atheism known as Secular Humanism. By and large, Atheists believe and adhere to the things written in the Humanist Manifesto, even if they don’t know the specifics of the document. After all, many Atheists do want to do what is good. The doctrines, ethics and goals outlined in the Humanist Manifesto, while being atheistic and accepting evolution as true, are opposite of what would be expected if they were solely derived from the evolutionary narrative...
My ultimate rejection of organized religion was a very significant moment in my life. It's what forced me live life and try to improve the standing of mankind. So I wouldn't call it nothing. And on my deathbed, I hope it will be a beautiful and poetic end to a life well lived regardless of an afterlife. I hope yours will be too. I don't understand how another person's death would be "funny as heck".
Joss' opening riposte was tongue-in-cheek; the questioner was serious and asked an egregious loaded question, which was answered by Joss with more respect than it deserved. A lot of believers who like the Whedonverse simply cannot accept Joss' atheist credo. Accept it and get over it: there is no God, merely faith.
(Finishing rant) The kinship and competition of all living creatures can be used as a reason for being insanely cruel or insanely sentimental; but not for a healthy love of animals. … The main point of Christianity was this: that Nature is not our mother: Nature is our sister. We can be proud of her beauty, since we have the same father; but she has no authority over us; we have to admire, but not to imitate.”
"Assholes aren't exclusive to one belief" I am an Irish Catholic, and that has to be the greatest thing I have ever heard/read about belief ever. I am a nice Catholic, I don't believe all gays are going to hell and I don't like paedophiles (which I feel is always a plus with whoever you met), similarly I have also met nice Atheist who do not call the way I view the world a fairytale, or my god a spaghetti monster. When I meet such people I learn from them and I hope they learn from me.
The MAIN tenet of every legitimate religion. Whether you admit it, LIKE it, accept it or not, these ALL came from a history of your ancestor's religious beliefs.
Here's the thing though. I don't know what religion I am, I haven't decided yet, so don't get on my case about being an atheist, both my parents are catholic. As an atheist, one can still celebrate Christmas if it is not about god. It can be about coming together as a human family, or love, or caring for others and many other positive messages without involving god. That is what a lot of my friends do.
Faith and religion are two different things. You need to have faith to live day to day. You just don't have to have religion to validate your faith. Joss has faith; faith in writing, his Muse, his thoughts, decency, etc.
(Part 4) But just because atheists have a LOT in common with religious people including even de-conversion experiences paralleling conversion experiences (I personally know exactly what you mean, I did feel some sort of weight lifting off my shoulders and eyes opening, enlightenment kind of "religious experience" once I fully accepted being an atheist myself after being raised Catholic and being unsure of what I believed & claiming I was "agnostic" for years), it doesn't mean it's a religion.
It also depends on how those with faith approach the topic with someone who doesn't. I do not have faith but I am not atheist, I question things to much and there are flawless in everything on both sides. A lot of it we may never know or understand until death, or perhaps there is nothing to understand. Or maybe the divine design of it all is a concept the human mind will never comprehend in one life time.
Nobody is perfect. ESPECIALLY Christians. We have the same hangups that everyone else does. There is 1 difference between those messed up believers and non-believers. The believers who really believe and try to follow Christ are watched by non-believers. My atheist and agnostic friends are always keeping an eye on me to see how I react to situations. My job is to try not to fail them when I go through my life. I try my best to love everybody, but it's harder than it looks. I'm not there yet.
6) Ritual: Ritual is the only dimension which on the surface might appear to be absent from the religion of Atheism. In some religions, rituals have meanings attached to them, such as Passover commemorating the Israelites’ escape from Egypt. Because Atheism is a relatively recent movement, it doesn’t have much of a history to commemorate. In other religions, rituals such as sacrifices and dances are done to appease the gods or the spirits. Because Atheism denies the existence of gods and...
I was a Christian (Mormon) for about 13 years of my life, and I believed it just as fervently as anyone. Coming to terms with the facts of reality, primarily the lack of consistent evidence, was the reason I stopped believing. I've always been a skeptic who refuses to believe something just because I want it to be true.
@Simon4948 I don't understand the connection your drawing between his attitude towards human beings or the working class and his atheism. You seem to suggest that this makes his atheism pure? I assume you mean that in a negative way? As in he doesn't seem to have much hope or optimism? I can't have "faith" in humanity but I can have hope for humanity. Faith would imply that I believe everything will be alright by virtue of our qualities, but I don't know that is true, so.
@syrensounds I'm not sure how interested you are in the subject, but I was going to tell you that there has been decades and decades of scholarly research into the type of things you're talking about. Lots of it is in obscure academic papers, but there are a few books out there that are geared toward your every day person. The trick is finding something that's hopefully from an academic standpoint, and not swayed by faith based beliefs. I like some of Bart D. Ehrman's stuff.
spirits, it doesn’t have the second type of ritual either. Many Atheists do practice “secular rituals” such as their birthday celebrations, or the ‘ritual holidays’ of other religions such as the Christmas and Easter public holidays of Christianity, but this is usually to simply maintain the tradition of a public holiday, and the original meaning of the celebrations are rejected. It’s noteworthy that in recent years, the atheists’ public commemoration of the anniversary of Darwin’s birth each
Most people (Atheist or not) inherently know that systems that lead to such atrocities must be wrong, but Atheists cannot give a logical reason for why it is wrong. This contradiction was highlighted by Dawkins when he said “I’m a passionate Darwinian when it comes to science, when it comes to explaining the world, but I’m a passionate anti-Darwinian when it comes to morality and politics.” It was also graphically shown when two evolutionists
exactly what a missionary of any religion hopes to do. Many scientists are high up on the social hierarchy of Atheism because their research enhances their understanding of the world. Particularly honoured are those scientists who write extensively about evolution. Because of this, many scientists include a little about evolution in their research papers, even when there is little or no relevance. 4) Doctrinal: Doctrines are the beliefs and philosophies that develop out of a religion
For example, the Christian doctrine of the Trinity, while not directly stated in the Bible, is logically derived from it. Contemporary Atheism gained popularity in the 18th and 19th centuries, after the “enlightenment”. In 1933, some prominent Atheist philosophers realised the effects the lack of a belief in a god would have on the morals of society and wrote what they believed would be a suitable set of beliefs and goals for a secular society in the 20th century...
I don't believe the reply button was around when I made that comment. Either that or I just didn't know how to use it. :P But in any case, I was responding about a comment that all atheists are socially awkward, or something like that.
(Part 5) I took an Introduction to Religion/Comparative Religions class in college (I studied at Boston University, undergrad) and they told us on the first day what makes a religion a religion. I think it was pretty similar to what you've spelled out here, but I simply still disagree on the idea that atheism fits those defining characteristics in the way that you want them to. Humanism you maybe can argue is a religion. Atheism itself - no. I'm sorry but I'm not going to be convinced otherwise.
(Part 2 of my reply this time) not nothing, it's not "just semantics" - as a Linguist I'm well aware that semantics matter. Words have definitions, and language also evolves. How words are used, even if it starts as a mistake or misuse, can become a real definition. And the word in question right now, is "religion". I still believe atheism is not a religion according to how the word religion is typically used, and it is a mistake for a religious person to think atheism is just another religion.
Fair enough! I imagine I would probably do something similar, if I was any good with languages...I have a vague grasp of German, but I can't hold a fluent conversation in it. XD Well, good luck and have fun! :)
You may find comfort believing in the illusion that an invisible man is always there to listen to you, but what makes us atheists is that we require evidence of a thing to accept that it exists, and to put it plainly, there is no evidence of a god. In any case, I personally find comfort in knowing that when nobody else is around, I am truly alone with my thoughts. The point I was making is that in the event that @elementaleel wants to bond with others that aren't delusional, we exist.
The meaning of the word “faith” is usually twisted to make it mean things it doesn't. In Christianity, faith is logical, being defined in Hebrews 1:11 as “being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see.” This isn't blindly believing the impossible, but rather trusting the promises of God, whose past promises have all been fulfilled. Atheism requires “faith” that the laws of chemistry, physics and biology were once disobeyed and life rose from non-life via chemical evolution...
I prefer my name Emily, I think it's prettier sounding than Em. I might be a bit biased because my abusive mother liked to call me Em - but some teachers who liked me in school and stuff nicknamed me that too, and when I know people mean well when they say it, it's okay. I still don't think it's appropriate to give a nickname to someone who hasn't asked to be nicknamed unless you know them really well tho. ;) How I grew up, adding an extra word like "Sir" or "Miss" isn't required for politeness.
Cap is a USA patriot, which has no meaning at all to a spanish guy like me, I'm not even a spanish patriot, so I don't take his opinions very seriously... and I think Joss anticipated this. He wanted the character to be liked beyond the USA, so being this film in the present, he developed him as he is, an american christian from the 40's, so everybody can see that he's "old-fashioned" in his way of thinking and say "Hey he said there's only one God, but well, he's from the 40's, never mind"
TL;DR? Not sure what that means. Too long maybe is the TL part - lol probably for a response to me in a YT comment, yes. I read most of it, in some random order, I'm kinda busy replying to comments on my own videos and getting distracted by other things at the moment - the wind from this massive northeast of the USA winter storm is literally blowing inside my house despite no windows being open or anything - we have a crack in the door apparently. :P I think...we're debating semantics, which is
well Captain America did have a line where he said "There's only one God mam, and I'm pretty sure he doesn't dress like that" Captain America is a believer, but Whedon didn't need to include that in there. Nor was any sort of religion shown in Captain America: The first avenger. I'm not trying to start an argument, I am just stating something
Thanks for the love and all that. Problem is: there is a difference between talking about love and Acting in a loving way. Believers spread lies about how much they care for you, yet they are ALWAYS the first to commit prejudice against others who are not like them. Or con them out of their money. Or beg for forgiveness when they commit horrors. Open up the papers, there's a new pedophile priest caught every day! So much hypocrisy that it's hard to trust "good" believers. Peace.
This is because Humanism also makes the assumption that humans are basically good. In 1973 however, the Humanist Manifesto was updated because of the atrocities that humans inflicted upon other humans during the intervening years (specifically mentioned are Nazism and communist police states). 5) Ethical: Atheism is a morally relativist religion. Most Atheists adhere to one ethical system or another, but in Atheism there is ultimately no foundation for morality,
Jainism, which holds that every living thing is sacred because it is alive, or the Mayans who worshiped the sun itself as a deity rather than a deity associated with the sun. They also fail to include religions like Taoism which focus almost exclusively on how you should live, and the little they say about the supernatural, like the existence of an afterlife, is very vague. There are also religions concerned with UFOs, which believe that aliens are highly advanced, but not supernatural, beings.
"Faith is an extraordinary thing, I'd like to have some but I don't..."
This is a powerful statement. My athiest BF says the same thing and is a fan of Joss. I think its a hard and elusive form of pride.
I LOVE the way Joss appropriately and respectably talks about his opinions. Religion is an especially touchy subject that, if you plan on making ANY real headway at all, you have to tread lightly and be confident in every step your taking. He has a fantastic way of sharing his opinion.
-A Catholic :)
It's funny how it doesn't work both ways though, isn't it? So many religious people disrespect others simply for being gay or atheists, yet we're expected to "tread lightly" when being critical of the lack-of-logic and sanity in your religion. The Catholic church is fucking despicable, hiding pedophiles (as a victim of pedophilia) is beyond reprehensible, and your last pope did it. and was caught and wasn't arrested BECAUSE OF UNDUE RESPECT THAT IS DIVVIED OUT TO YOUR BULLSHIT RELIGION.
What religion has done to me, what pedophilia has done to me is beyond forgiveness and what your religion has done to countless other children is the same shit that has been done to me.... Let's not forget the Catholic Church's helping the progression of AIDS in Africa by telling newly-converted, under-educated 3rd worlders that condoms are bad, among not even allowing AIDS treatment meds to be shipped into certain areas.
Fuck your church and your religion. Thank fuck it's dying out like all religion in the face of rationality and science. And look at the extreme religious types out there. Every single one of them follows tenants of those holy books, and they do horrific things i nthe name of them and their god. Even the moderates such as yourself, even if you are tolerant of gays, atheists, etc. There are so many Catholics that aren't that aren't tolerant, at all, let alone alone Christian sects like Mormonism or Baptists, they just think that they are helping us by preaching and threatening us with hell or beatings or whatever else.
I've never had atheists, agnostics, rationalists and the educated ever act that way towards myself or my gay brother. But I had to spend years using boxing that was supposed to stay in the ring on dumb fuck bigots who like to beat people in the name of Jesus. Tools. So why should I respect your religion at all? It certainly doesn't have a history of respecting myself or anyone like me.
Joe Cannabyte dude, vent your anger somewhere else. I really don't feel like starting a religious debate.
Joe Cannabyte In fact, I'll tell you what. I won't use Bentio Mussolini as my prime example of Atheists as long as you don't do something similar to me or any individual regardless of their beliefs.
It's hard to tread lightly when so many people are so infatuated with the notions of an afterlife, a celestial monitor and consultant, and even a person that intervenes in human affairs for them to be able to take criticism and questioning.
Source: experiences with evangelical and emotionally-driven and illogical Christians.
***** I'm sorry to hear about how your experience with Christians has gone. I hope I can at least convince you that not all of them are like that. I, for one, am also infatuated with such notions (who wouldn't be? even you have to admit their rather attractive ideas to strive for) but I also feel criticism is an absolutely essential part of my well being. I actually really like engaging in friendly discussion and debate with atheists (key word being friendly) because I feel like whether I win or lose said debate, I come out of it a little bit smarter. I realize the notion of God isn't for everyone. Even if I WERE to convince you, the only way your devotion can mean anything is if you whole heartedly embrace the divine by your own merit. If God didn't care about how it is you come to him, he might as well have never given you your critical mind.
This answer is why I love this man.
No you don't
That's exactly what I understood him to be saying. Thanks for sharing- it's nice to see that there are tolerant people across the whole belief spectrum.
Great answer from one of the greatest tv producers of our time. Proves you can be polite, kind and confident in your own opion.
Your comment aged terribly xD
In regards to your original statement, that an event seems unlikely to have occurred does not make it significant, as it is easy to determine the probability of an event after it has occurred. Richard Feynman illustrated this when he said: Tonight I came in through the parking lot, and you won't believe what happened. I saw a car with the license plate ARW 357. Can you imagine? Of all the millions of license plates, what was the chance that I would see that particular one tonight? Amazing!
For a long time I fought my increasing atheistic thoughts. That episode he just mentioned was one of the first times I ever accepted my being atheist was a good thing. Thanks, Joss.
Just when I thought Joss Whedon couldn't get any cooler. "The only reality is the way we treat each other. The morality comes from the absence of any grander scheme, not from the presence of any grander scheme." My views in a nutshell. I applaud you Joss, I really do.
You know I had wondered about this exact same thing, and now that you say that, it makes total sense.
What I find particularly interesting, and perhaps Joss would too, is that so much of what he has written speaks to my faith. It's partly why I love Whedon's work so much. The other part is that he's just brilliant.
I love how as soon as he mentioned Angel at 2:21 I knew exactly what moment in the show he was talking about
Thank you x
Joss Whedon responded as he did because he holds no contempt for religion. He said himself, faith is an extraordinary thing.
You on the other hand, your desire to call the questioner as you have is the very thing that begged his question.
This is so good
great video.
i
This comes from the the Extras on the Australian DVD of Serenity. Some of the extras were released on the Special Edition of Serenity (and the Blu-Ray) but not this. It was a Q&A session with the audience after the pre-release screening. He mentions "this show" at one point and he is referring to Firefly.
Because I love reading (& writing) various Glee fanfics, but didn't want to struggle to try to read this one in Spanish, which is not *that* easy for me, unless someone wanted me to translate it for them into English - & this way I got to read a good fanfic AND provide a way for a bunch of non-Spanish speakers who otherwise would be missing out on it to read it. ;) I like using my native English speaker knowledge to help non-native speakers, like helping this author share her fic with the world.
Seriously. We need more people like this guy. on both sides. Atheist and Christians. I'm Christian but it's not my place to judge. We can get along when all the crazies on both ends of the spectrum just shut up. Love this guy so much! :D
Lol it's fine. Thanks for being so polite. And thanks. I'll read the rant later when I have time. I'm busy translating a Glee fanfiction story from Spanish into English right now haha!! :P
"I don't have anything against anybody unless their belief precludes everybody else's."
This view itself precludes those who disagree with that statement!
I don't think it was when he was given the Humanist Chaplaincy at Harvard and the Harvard Secular Society's 2009 Outstanding Lifetime Achievement Award in Cultural Humanism.
But another great example of Whedon as a champion for secularism and humanism.
I like him more than ever after this.
yes sir, indeed... thanks for the conversation sir... hope atheists realize the truth and enlighten them... take care :) God Bless
That was a well spoken thought process. I appreciate that he could share that with people, and he didn't need to get defensive or offensive about anything. I'm a christian, and I think you are allowed to have your own thoughts and opinions and beliefs. If they contradict mine, I'm just going to love you for who you are, and you'll be curious about why I love you. If you ask me, then I'll tell you that it's because God is awesome and He made you!
Thanks very much for your reply.
An example of a statement of faith would be, "Although I can't explain, in scientific terms, how the universe came to be as it is, I have faith that my god is responsible for it." Whilst you did preface your sentence with "Do we believe", which can definitely be interpreted as a statement of faith, you then discuss the likelihood of an event; how do you determine the likelihood/probability of the existence of an unexplained, supernatural, creator being?
Well said!
Big fan of Whedon. And I respect his opinion. I don't have a religion, but most of my beliefs are of Christianity. Definitely believe there is a creator, or higher being. Sometimes seeing isn't always believing ....thats the way I look at life. To each his own, and I wish nothing but love and happiness for everyone on this planet.
That was a really quick hop from Avengers cast and production interviews to 'Celebrities on Atheism'.
Well said my friend.
That actually makes sense as to why so many people are coming forward with allegations against him.
February (and even of the publication of his Origin of Species in November), along with calls for the general public to do the same, is rapidly becoming something of an annual ritual, even in some “churches”. One might even say that this modern Atheistic commemoration is being ‘celebrated’ with greater fervour and passion than many longstanding religious rituals.
7) Material: The material dimension of religion, says Smart, includes all the physical things created by a religion such as art and
The most accepted way to determine a religion is by looking for the "Seven Dimensions of Religion," as set forth by Ninian Way. This is broadly accepted to cover every religion without focusing on each specific one.
1) Narrative. A story of where we came from, with important figures for the belief involved (IE, Evolution and Darwin, Adam and Eve, etc)
2) Experiential; 2 types; the experience of people before they formed the religion (IE, Darwin reading his Grandfathers "Zoonomania," the
Again I think most people are fairly tolerant, I'd say even the people here would have a decent conversation with you if they met you in person and had this chat down the pub rather than on internet-land
By the way I just realized what your screen name is: I love it! I am slightly obsessed with Dr. Who, I get very excited whenever I met another fan of the show!
"It's not Christianity, it's just YOU". Brilliant!
@twiztidlestat ..Well.. re-writing parts of it... and probably filming the ending.
But I'm not sure if he did much.. I could be wrong.
What is this from? can I see the whole q and a anywhere?
Kirkegaard, so far I've been told, has always wondered, even since he started philosophizing was what does it mean to have faith, but I don't know if everyone agrees with that evaluation of himself.
Joss handles this incredibly well, answering respectfully and seriously but also cracking fun at the guy for his stupid and irrelevant question.
Like I said I'm not interested in debating, but if you insist on debating me, please do so in a private message.
If you choose to do so, I will give my answer there.
Amazing
My problem with anonymity is not so much a sense of bravado, but I forget that these people are more than just their comments, much like I am more than just mine. If we all met in person in a pub and got to know eachother and had these discussion we would probably pass some enjoyable hours exchaging (sometimes heated) views.
But here in internetland, I find it hard to view the other commenter as a person,
As I say I am working on it, and I am glad you pulled me up on where I am still lacking
yeah, that episode really hit the nail on the head. i personally believe that there is some higher power out there (though no real idea as to what) but it's irrelevant in the scheme of things. because living life is about being a good person. it's not about who believes in a god and who doesn't.
To explain it simply, an atheist's morality comes from the basic principle that if we don't advocate for humanity, nothing will. We should strive to make this world a better place, because this world is all we have, though it's quite far from nothing.
And I didn't flag your comments.
They would say must the same about us,
I find when you are open minded towards them, they tend to be open minded towards you, and then every one can learn from each-other.
I also just wanted to say that I respect your views, regardless of what they are. Good Luck again
Yeah, you are, that's the whole point about faith, WE are never alone while you always will be...
Luv ya Joss. Huge fan!
In doing so, they formed the branch of Atheism known as Secular Humanism. By and large, Atheists believe and adhere to the things written in the Humanist Manifesto, even if they don’t know the specifics of the document. After all, many Atheists do want to do what is good. The doctrines, ethics and goals outlined in the Humanist Manifesto, while being atheistic and accepting evolution as true, are opposite of what would be expected if they were solely derived from the evolutionary narrative...
My ultimate rejection of organized religion was a very significant moment in my life. It's what forced me live life and try to improve the standing of mankind. So I wouldn't call it nothing.
And on my deathbed, I hope it will be a beautiful and poetic end to a life well lived regardless of an afterlife. I hope yours will be too. I don't understand how another person's death would be "funny as heck".
exactly. nuff said
No problem.
I believe in the Powers That Be.
Joss' opening riposte was tongue-in-cheek; the questioner was serious and asked an egregious loaded question, which was answered by Joss with more respect than it deserved. A lot of believers who like the Whedonverse simply cannot accept Joss' atheist credo. Accept it and get over it: there is no God, merely faith.
(Finishing rant)
The kinship and competition of all living creatures can be used as a reason for being insanely cruel or insanely sentimental; but not for a healthy love of animals. … The main point of Christianity was this: that Nature is not our mother: Nature is our sister. We can be proud of her beauty, since we have the same father; but she has no authority over us; we have to admire, but not to imitate.”
"Assholes aren't exclusive to one belief"
I am an Irish Catholic, and that has to be the greatest thing I have ever heard/read about belief ever.
I am a nice Catholic, I don't believe all gays are going to hell and I don't like paedophiles (which I feel is always a plus with whoever you met), similarly I have also met nice Atheist who do not call the way I view the world a fairytale, or my god a spaghetti monster. When I meet such people I learn from them and I hope they learn from me.
you have a point... i think your theory is right sir... forcing them to church but never explain to them well the important of faith
@Roper122
And Cap, he's writing that as well
The MAIN tenet of every legitimate religion. Whether you admit it, LIKE it, accept it or not, these ALL came from a history of your ancestor's religious beliefs.
Here's the thing though. I don't know what religion I am, I haven't decided yet, so don't get on my case about being an atheist, both my parents are catholic. As an atheist, one can still celebrate Christmas if it is not about god. It can be about coming together as a human family, or love, or caring for others and many other positive messages without involving god. That is what a lot of my friends do.
Love is the Law!
Faith and religion are two different things. You need to have faith to live day to day. You just don't have to have religion to validate your faith. Joss has faith; faith in writing, his Muse, his thoughts, decency, etc.
(Part 4) But just because atheists have a LOT in common with religious people including even de-conversion experiences paralleling conversion experiences (I personally know exactly what you mean, I did feel some sort of weight lifting off my shoulders and eyes opening, enlightenment kind of "religious experience" once I fully accepted being an atheist myself after being raised Catholic and being unsure of what I believed & claiming I was "agnostic" for years), it doesn't mean it's a religion.
Reason...good one. No holier-than-thou attitude or ego from you!!
It also depends on how those with faith approach the topic with someone who doesn't.
I do not have faith but I am not atheist, I question things to much and there are flawless in everything on both sides.
A lot of it we may never know or understand until death, or perhaps there is nothing to understand.
Or maybe the divine design of it all is a concept the human mind will never comprehend in one life time.
Nobody is perfect. ESPECIALLY Christians. We have the same hangups that everyone else does. There is 1 difference between those messed up believers and non-believers.
The believers who really believe and try to follow Christ are watched by non-believers. My atheist and agnostic friends are always keeping an eye on me to see how I react to situations. My job is to try not to fail them when I go through my life. I try my best to love everybody, but it's harder than it looks. I'm not there yet.
6) Ritual: Ritual is the only dimension which on the surface might appear to be absent from the religion of Atheism. In some religions, rituals have meanings attached to them, such as Passover commemorating the Israelites’ escape from Egypt. Because Atheism is a relatively recent movement, it doesn’t have much of a history to commemorate. In other religions, rituals such as sacrifices and dances are done to appease the gods or the spirits. Because Atheism denies the existence of gods and...
I think him being an atheist is what made The Avengers so fucking cool
Likewise.
I was a Christian (Mormon) for about 13 years of my life, and I believed it just as fervently as anyone. Coming to terms with the facts of reality, primarily the lack of consistent evidence, was the reason I stopped believing. I've always been a skeptic who refuses to believe something just because I want it to be true.
@Simon4948 I don't understand the connection your drawing between his attitude towards human beings or the working class and his atheism. You seem to suggest that this makes his atheism pure? I assume you mean that in a negative way? As in he doesn't seem to have much hope or optimism?
I can't have "faith" in humanity but I can have hope for humanity. Faith would imply that I believe everything will be alright by virtue of our qualities, but I don't know that is true, so.
The question posed to Joss was the apex of presumption so typical of Christians, and it was big of Joss not to call the questioner a fuck wit.
A great, big "huh?" Your belief does preclude everybody else's, Joss.
@syrensounds I'm not sure how interested you are in the subject, but I was going to tell you that there has been decades and decades of scholarly research into the type of things you're talking about. Lots of it is in obscure academic papers, but there are a few books out there that are geared toward your every day person. The trick is finding something that's hopefully from an academic standpoint, and not swayed by faith based beliefs. I like some of Bart D. Ehrman's stuff.
spirits, it doesn’t have the second type of ritual either. Many Atheists do practice “secular rituals” such as their birthday celebrations, or the ‘ritual holidays’ of other religions such as the Christmas and Easter public holidays of Christianity, but this is usually to simply maintain the tradition of a public holiday, and the original meaning of the celebrations are rejected. It’s noteworthy that in recent years, the atheists’ public commemoration of the anniversary of Darwin’s birth each
Most people (Atheist or not) inherently know that systems that lead to such atrocities must be wrong, but Atheists cannot give a logical reason for why it is wrong. This contradiction was highlighted by Dawkins when he said “I’m a passionate Darwinian when it comes to science, when it comes to explaining the world, but I’m a passionate anti-Darwinian when it comes to morality and politics.” It was also graphically shown when two evolutionists
likewise
exactly what a missionary of any religion hopes to do.
Many scientists are high up on the social hierarchy of Atheism because their research enhances their understanding of the world. Particularly honoured are those scientists who write extensively about evolution. Because of this, many scientists include a little about evolution in their research papers, even when there is little or no relevance.
4) Doctrinal: Doctrines are the beliefs and philosophies that develop out of a religion
Same here.
For example, the Christian doctrine of the Trinity, while not directly stated in the Bible, is logically derived from it. Contemporary Atheism gained popularity in the 18th and 19th centuries, after the “enlightenment”. In 1933, some prominent Atheist philosophers realised the effects the lack of a belief in a god would have on the morals of society and wrote what they believed would be a suitable set of beliefs and goals for a secular society in the 20th century...
I don't believe the reply button was around when I made that comment. Either that or I just didn't know how to use it. :P But in any case, I was responding about a comment that all atheists are socially awkward, or something like that.
It didn't seem mocking to me in the movie. He seems polite in this video, too.
(Part 5) I took an Introduction to Religion/Comparative Religions class in college (I studied at Boston University, undergrad) and they told us on the first day what makes a religion a religion. I think it was pretty similar to what you've spelled out here, but I simply still disagree on the idea that atheism fits those defining characteristics in the way that you want them to. Humanism you maybe can argue is a religion. Atheism itself - no. I'm sorry but I'm not going to be convinced otherwise.
(Part 2 of my reply this time) not nothing, it's not "just semantics" - as a Linguist I'm well aware that semantics matter. Words have definitions, and language also evolves. How words are used, even if it starts as a mistake or misuse, can become a real definition. And the word in question right now, is "religion". I still believe atheism is not a religion according to how the word religion is typically used, and it is a mistake for a religious person to think atheism is just another religion.
Fair enough! I imagine I would probably do something similar, if I was any good with languages...I have a vague grasp of German, but I can't hold a fluent conversation in it. XD Well, good luck and have fun! :)
You may find comfort believing in the illusion that an invisible man is always there to listen to you, but what makes us atheists is that we require evidence of a thing to accept that it exists, and to put it plainly, there is no evidence of a god. In any case, I personally find comfort in knowing that when nobody else is around, I am truly alone with my thoughts. The point I was making is that in the event that @elementaleel wants to bond with others that aren't delusional, we exist.
@theironmongoose
I am a Christian and I approve this comment!
...and Joss!
The meaning of the word “faith” is usually twisted to make it mean things it doesn't. In Christianity, faith is logical, being defined in Hebrews 1:11 as “being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see.” This isn't blindly believing the impossible, but rather trusting the promises of God, whose past promises have all been fulfilled. Atheism requires “faith” that the laws of chemistry, physics and biology were once disobeyed and life rose from non-life via chemical evolution...
Science is obsessively fixated on the why, actually. The big difference is that the scientific community isn't content with a bullshit answer.
Fuck. He's awesome.
I prefer my name Emily, I think it's prettier sounding than Em. I might be a bit biased because my abusive mother liked to call me Em - but some teachers who liked me in school and stuff nicknamed me that too, and when I know people mean well when they say it, it's okay. I still don't think it's appropriate to give a nickname to someone who hasn't asked to be nicknamed unless you know them really well tho. ;) How I grew up, adding an extra word like "Sir" or "Miss" isn't required for politeness.
Cap is a USA patriot, which has no meaning at all to a spanish guy like me, I'm not even a spanish patriot, so I don't take his opinions very seriously... and I think Joss anticipated this. He wanted the character to be liked beyond the USA, so being this film in the present, he developed him as he is, an american christian from the 40's, so everybody can see that he's "old-fashioned" in his way of thinking and say "Hey he said there's only one God, but well, he's from the 40's, never mind"
TL;DR? Not sure what that means. Too long maybe is the TL part - lol probably for a response to me in a YT comment, yes. I read most of it, in some random order, I'm kinda busy replying to comments on my own videos and getting distracted by other things at the moment - the wind from this massive northeast of the USA winter storm is literally blowing inside my house despite no windows being open or anything - we have a crack in the door apparently. :P
I think...we're debating semantics, which is
I like Joss even more now
Bring on the Avengers!
well Captain America did have a line where he said "There's only one God mam, and I'm pretty sure he doesn't dress like that"
Captain America is a believer, but Whedon didn't need to include that in there. Nor was any sort of religion shown in Captain America: The first avenger. I'm not trying to start an argument, I am just stating something
OK.
Thanks for the love and all that. Problem is: there is a difference between talking about love and Acting in a loving way. Believers spread lies about how much they care for you, yet they are ALWAYS the first to commit prejudice against others who are not like them. Or con them out of their money. Or beg for forgiveness when they commit horrors. Open up the papers, there's a new pedophile priest caught every day! So much hypocrisy that it's hard to trust "good" believers. Peace.
This is because Humanism also makes the assumption that humans are basically good. In 1973 however, the Humanist Manifesto was updated because of the atrocities that humans inflicted upon other humans during the intervening years (specifically mentioned are Nazism and communist police states).
5) Ethical: Atheism is a morally relativist religion. Most Atheists adhere to one ethical system or another, but in Atheism there is ultimately no foundation for morality,
Jainism, which holds that every living thing is sacred because it is alive, or the Mayans who worshiped the sun itself as a deity rather than a deity associated with the sun. They also fail to include religions like Taoism which focus almost exclusively on how you should live, and the little they say about the supernatural, like the existence of an afterlife, is very vague. There are also religions concerned with UFOs, which believe that aliens are highly advanced, but not supernatural, beings.
What is this from?