@KiljiArslan .. What's even more interesting.. there were Americans.. in Polish Army... dropping the bombs... "literally " . .... read about Merian Caldwell Cooper .. and Kościuszko Squadron ..which supported the Polish Army in the Polish-Soviet War
добро је рекао мој брат, нема више рата. Међутим, 1920 у Варшави је нападнут. У ствари, Пољаци и Руси попут августа, али ми се не свиђа наше владе. Поздрављам вас све и Србије. Ја не знам да ли је право звучи, ја сам користио Гоогле Транслатор :)
@licicaviki I'm gonna buy it for sure :3 and can't wait to see scenes that were cut off XD the "French help" should be hilarious those should be included on dvd O.o right?
This looks like a very well done film.I had a great respect for Polish film making,most of the ones I've seen were good.This story reminds me a great deal of "1920 Wojna i Milosc " .That's not a bad thing though,I thought that was a fine series.
@licicaviki mi się wydaje, że jeśli ktoś dobrze bądź nieco pobieżnie zna wydarzenia tamtego okresu - to film jest niezwykle spójny :) a kilka niezamkniętych wątków tylko dodaje uroku, gdyż wolę "otwartą niedopowiedzianą historię" niż "wszystko skończyło się dobrze tak i tak" XD poza tym - trzeba na niego iść przygotowanym na to, iż jest to "Polska produkcja" i wyjdzie się potem zadowolonym :D jak ktoś oczekuje ideału - to oczywiste, że się zawiedzie czegokolwiek by nie pokazali :D
@Kretek właśnie dlatego ja go oceniam po obejrzeniu :) a o jakości filmu według mnie lepiej się wypowiadać po jego obejrzeniu-choćby częściowym tak więc jeśli nie w kinie, to polecam choćby potem w domu samodzielne się zapoznanie film bardzo dobry jak na historyczny gdyż nie ma w nim tego ah-jakze-heroicznego amerykanskiego podejscia i czerni i bieli a oddaje całkiem nieźle brutalność i brak piękna wojny dodatkowo nie mamy tu cholernego romansu non stop a jest to tylko watek-bardziej poboczny
@Gryfin546 No zobaczymy. Ja naprawdę chciałem, żeby ten film się udał, a jak wyszło? Ocenię jak zobaczę. Ale do kina na to nie pójdę :) Poczekam jak będą w telewizji puszczać.
@brbgrl1 because in this movie Poles speak in Polish Russian speak in Russian and each other nation speak in it's language but the subtitles translate it all into language of the audience it's a good movie - which means that you won't find everyone speaking English like some kind of universal language XD but their own native languages
@petrsonnk 11.11.1918 we regained our independence. Poland was not a communist state back then and we just wanted to regain our lands taken from us during the Partitions. We were fighting for freedom, independence and former glory. After 1945 when the Red Army took its revenge we became a communist state, and there was no one left to stop that process (our elites were murdered by bolsheviks in Katyń). Thats a short version of Polands history in XXth century. I hope it helps.
@101Restoration Denikin was a halph Pole after his mother. Tsar Nicolas IInd has already agreed to the independence of Poland with his official declaration to Poles. His premier Sazonov planned to establish Poland's western frontier on Odra with Szczecin on Polish side, East Prussia was to fall into Russian rule. Under the new circumstances though, new Pol-Rus border further to east was expected.
327 [ Rok 1920 ] Kwartale pierwszy, z trzech pomieszanych na siłę barw, znowu powstała jedna , biało-czerwona , mieszać dalej nie trzeba , nasza , właściwa , polska ona. Kwartale drugi, kolor ciemno-różowy, próbuje wmieszać się w paletę barw, która już zaschnięta , ukończona , kolor ten odcień psuje , barwa zagrożona. Kwartale trzeci, prawie doszło do przebarwienia w czerwień krwistą , rodzime i tamtych kolory niemieszalne , sierpnia piętnastego stało się to sprawą oczywistą. Kwartale czwarty, już na stałe zaschło, a w posiadaczach koloru, radość, zadowolenie , biało u góry, czerwono na dole , takie przez pół na zawsze podzielenie.
@Gryfin546 er.. no wiesz :D mi się wydawało, że właśnie o to chodziło, że oni zawsze szli gdzieś w tamtej wojnie XD a nie siedzieli non stop w jednym miejscu :D zwłaszcza czerwoni - szli na warszawę :P
@licicaviki Hope DVD will be in Slovakia in 3 months not 3 years like always or I will take some big tomatoes and eggs to cinema... Can't wait to see it in 2D HD extended version. Hope it will be as good as "With fire and sword" or better
@licicaviki I can not rule out such a scenario. But even if so, if that was a preventative strike, it was the one poorly designed and ineffective, causing more losses than gains.That's the worst way to get ready for a defencive war. By the way, why Pilsudski refused critical military aid to Poznan and Lwow defenders ?
@mcszot One gun one man you mean. The other rule about 1 gun 3 men was in the tsarist army. And if you can, please send me links to any articles about those wars on PM, as I didn't even hear of them. I will have to analyze them etc. then i will respond to you with my opinion about them
@kryokori No cóż, gusta to rzecz subiektywna. Co do osoby która mnie przed tym filmem ostrzegała to nasze gusta filmowe są dość zbliżone. Na umiejętnościach reżyserskich pana Hoffmana ostatnimi czasy się nie raz zawiodłem, a Potop został nakręcony wieki temu. Trudno oceniać film po zaledwie kilku scenach jakie się widziało, ale dobrego wrażenia one na mnie nie zrobiły. I nie mówię tu tylko o trailerze. Wybacz, ale to, że tematyka filmu jest ciekawa nie musi przekładać się na jego jakość.
@PolsheVik It was mostly Polish people from other major cities that wanted to help rebuild our capital. Russians just mostly designed the new Warsaw in Communist boring architecture which we didn't want. We wanted to rebuild Warsaw to its original state but u didn't let us do it. And took most of our money that we should have got from Germany and just put one small piece of it to put some square blocks of lego with windows everywhere.
@Beaststa197 you succeeded XD we won't understand it - but still a chaos is a chaos and Polish language is one of biggest mess ever to non slavic people :P (and they said "Klingon" was hard XD) wait till you hear it in the movie XD you might either have a headache or just love it :D
@101Restoration I agree with both your statements directed to me, but I am not sure why are you announcing them. BTW there also was 8.5 thousand men Russian contingent on the Polish side under the former Russian premier Boris Savinkov , but they've got into combat after the Polish-Soviet truce, though. More Russians were ready to volunteer fighting on the Polish side.
@PolsheVik Anti-Katyn (also sometimes counter-Katyn) - a term used by historians to describe the Soviet and Russian propaganda campaign, which aims to relativization of the Katyn massacre by linking it with the high mortality rate among Soviet POWs in Polish captivity (1919-1921), allegedly caused by crimes committed against prisoners.
@ChillDudelD Capitalists wouldn't even bother rebuilding the city, they would just sell what has remained of it. And those "lego blocks" are very profitable both for economy and for environment, as they don't take a lot of space, and are cheaper to build than just semi-detachable one family houses. Thanks to communism, even Polish cities have a lot of greenery. British cities almost don't have any green colours in them...
@wladys678 Pilsudski was a left leaning socialist to be sure; so too was Petliura. With regards to Denikin, the Volunteer army was an All-Russia army whose goal was to establish a non-communist Russia within the boundaries of the old tsarist empire
@TequilAndLime It's Rus'. Just like Kiev, the cradle of Rus'=Russia. What have your troops lost there in 1920? Do you want to ignore that Pilsudski wanted to restore the 17th century Polish empire?
@fallout444 Did I say something factual wrong? Weren't the Russians occupied with domestic civil war? Didn't Polish forces use imported French and British machinge guns, artillery? Didn't the Russians drove them back all the way from Kharkov. Why Warsaw was a lost battle is another story. Stalin's false decisions and mistakes don't reduce the bravery of the ordinary Russian soldiers, but they reduce the "glory" of the Polish soldiers making the outcome pretty much simple luck.
@licicaviki True Petliura allied with Pilsudski to secure an independent Ukraine, not to revive the old Rzeczpospolita. I wonder if Hoffman will show Petliura's troops at the battle of Zamosc and Warsaw in the film or the struggles between the forces of the Ukrainian Galician Army fighting against the Polish army to liberate Western Ukraine. Any mention in the film of General Grekov routing the western/French equipped and trained Polish army back to Lviv? LOL
You got Volynia movie and that should be enough you were no heroes you were killing, torturing and eating civilians. You should be ashamed of Stepan Bandera
@mcszot Why do you put random numbers in your statement, and say that this is the number of people "killed" by communists? The only people killed by communists were fascists in 2nd world war, and some Poles in battle of Warsaw. The biggest enemy from the east was the enemy of the Polish bourgeoisie, not of the Polish people. "Polish workers and peasants are our brothers. Right now, they are having the same struggle as we have had in 1917. They are our brothers, remember that!" - V.I. Lenin.
@MaximusProteus Don't forget that Prussia took control of Slilesia by way of war and this illegal title was passed on to Germany in 1871. I dont know of any plans of population transfers in 1919 and I doubt there were any. If you raise the legality question, you should also answer whether forced germanisation, Hakata laws etc were legal ?
@MaximusProteus I should have said 1916. Also consider almost 2 million Poles deported from their land by Germany in 1939-40, regions of Pomorze,Poznan,Lodz, Ciechanow,Gorny Slask_ were they "natural" or "fake".
@wladys678 Yes, now i see, maybe accidentally but the idea on the west is similar. I wonder what Sazonow thought about the population here and there. On the east it was already done long before lord Curzon proposed that unwanted demarcation line, more or less in the third partition. With eception of Red Ruś, which Sazonow also wanted. So now it seems Moscow has no more territorial claims to us, but who knows, Germany for the other hand...
@kryokori A no to chyba, że tak. Obawiałem się, że może być zbyt wiele żałosnej patetyczności. Obejrzeć na pewno obejrzę. Ale jak już wspomniałem, nie w kinie.
@PolsheVik So if you say that Katyn was the act of germans... Then why did Soviets, very likely made up the story about Strzalkowo. Now you got cough by your own counter attack.
Also, after the war. Germany was supposed to pay back the money for war damage to the winning allied countries. But because Poland was under communist occupation after the WW2. We didn't get the money, becayse Soviet because they controlled us. So they got their war money and Polish war money. They took more than 2/3 of what should go to Poland. But just took 1/3 of it to rebuild Warsaw.
@BENNYSIEGEL90 .. I'm not quite convinced to what You said... what makes You think so....? ... watch : "The Capitalist Conspiracy (1969) by G. Edward Griffin " You may find it interesting...
@DerWULT Of course they wanted to regain the rightfully polish lands. And you're wrong about polish population in "eastern Poland". The numbers varied. The battle itself is important in worlds history whether you like it or not. Read some "Edgar Vincent D'Abernon, The Eighteenth Decisive Battle of the World: Warsaw" or "J. F. C. Fuller, The Decisive Battles of the Western World" to understand why. Peace.
@licicaviki Thank you for the link, but as I said it does not justify the irresponsible Kiev raid, undertaken in blatant violation of Poland's interest. You did not answer my other questions, though.
i agree your suggestion, polish people are brothers fu** politics, I will not forget the history of the Russian and Polish war, however, no hard feelings
@ChillDudelD Then the we fought to overthrow Communism until 1989 where we succeeded and gained our independence again. We were Soviets satellite country.
@DerWULT For invasion of Kiev 4/1920 are personally responsible Pilsudski and his Berlin sponsors but not Polish nations or Sejm, never supporting this decision. Dont mix it or confuse with heroic Polish defencive war against one million strong Soviet army. Make no mistake, Pilsudski invaded Kiev as agent of Berlin. Poland dumped Pilsudski to retreat after that war.
@Vegsiol Really you can't? I had Russian in school, then or 20 years I had not used it, and recently it was enough to get 2 months or so and in Russia I undrstood almost everything -- it was wrose with speaking though :) In fact I think that If you'd donate some of your time to learn Russian, you would quickly achieve level to talk with people on the streets.
@PolsheVik According to Russian historian Inessy Jażborowskiej anti-Katyn issue is associated with fear of explaining the Katyn massacre and its recognition of the responsibility for the Soviet party-state managers, uses it to Russia's communist and nationalist groups.
@licicaviki Perhaps a noble cause, but only in theory. In reality he did not achieve it, mainly because of lack of popular support in Kiev, even though they had a chance to liberate themselves from bolshevik oppression. Instead he mortally exposed the freshly won independence of Poland. And all of that was easy to predict .In result thousands of Poles and Russians lost their life and a new open wound never healed until now.
@PernatyZmey Do me a favour.. check.. at least in Wiki.. the maps from . from Polish-bolshevik war .. Poles weren't in Kharkow.. we stopped our offensive.. in Kijev.... but after.. we were invaded by Soviets.. come on... it's like to say.. Russia invaded Germany.. because.. Russians were in Berlin in 1945..
Katyn massacre? And before you say “how many Bolsheviks died in Polish Pow camps” think of the mass rape the Soviets committed against Poland. Polish Soviet War, WW2 and after.
@arczello1 What the hell are you talking about? russian was NEVER the official language in Poland. People in Poland had to learn russian in schools during the communist occupation. lol, get your facts straight before posting such asinine comments.
@TequilAndLime Pilsudski wanted Poland in the borders of 1792. It means including East Slavic lands. East Slavs always fought against Polish discrimination against Orthodoxy, against economic enslavement by the Szlachta. There were dozens of uprisings. Your "Commonwealth" was a hell for Ukrainians. I think that in was correct to reunite all Ukrainian and Belorussian lands in 1939. Ethnic Polish lands begin to the west of Bug.
@AldaronV hahaha :D I hate 3D too :P it hurts my eyes, makes everything blurry XD especially with shitty cinema-3D-glasses, you might as well watch it through a key hole than in panoramic XD but - unfortunately - 3D is what made best advertisement for this movie abroad :/
@wladys678 Law is legal if it goes for the obvious, but in the practice only natural law of force matters, paper will take anything. I`m not rising a question of that. Same way you can dispute any peace treaty, but whatever the outcome of a war is and border changes, such a social engeering on civillians is just wrong. Germanisation was also not a case in Silesia at that time anymore and i assure you i`m not an advocate of any German case. What i care more about is the other side.
@arczello1 Wtf?! As far as I know I don't speak Russian... In school I had only English and Spanish... And so all my friends... Your opinion is a bit strange...
@PernatyZmey In my opinion it belongs to the Ukraine... not Russia ...... and remember we still talk about Soviet Union... No Piłudski didn't want to... restore "Polish Empire"... first of all we don't call.. XVII century Poland an "Empire".. it was... Commonwealth of Poland.. watch this.. ruclips.net/video/bbQIu6V-rIU/видео.html and find the difference between Poland and Russia the difference between free country and an Empire..
@Gryfin546 No cóż, każdy ma swoje zdanie na ten temat. Jak dla mnie muzyka jest delikatnie mówiąc przeciętna, nijaka po prostu. Natomiast szarża wygląda słabo. A szkoda, bo sama tematyka filmu jest ciekawa. Sam trailer jest fatalny moim zdaniem. Już lepiej zmontowane zajawki widziałem zrobione przez amatorów. Ten jest totalnie chaotyczny. Hoffman jak dla mnie już dawno się wypalił i teraz robi słabe filmy które po prostu się łatwo sprzedadzą w Polsce. No ale w 3D!!! :-\
@mcszot A good capitalist is a bankrupting capitalist, being overthrown by the people. Seriously now, wishing death to another human being is a bit sick don't you think so? I belong to Communist party(Bolshevik). And do you have any problem with that? Did I do anything to you? No. P.S. It was Poland who attacked Kiev first, SR was just counter attacking.
@DerWULT Edgar Vincent D'Abernon and J.F.C Fuller, yep their surnames sound totally polish, it has to be polish propaganda! I wish you could learn some history, from other sources than Bildzeitung.
@wladys678 Was a Muscovite by his choice. Don`t be naive, the promises of Nickolas grew as fast as the German armies were advancing, they also promised, made some midget puppet, Austrians the same. Habsburgs were breeding sons to become rulers of Poland, Ukraine or whatever they`ll make up. Border on Odra.. and who between these borders? Where Lwów, Wilno, Grodno? Don`t you see the borders and population transfers after WWII are fake?
@PolsheVik It's not thanks to communism we have much greenery... We had even greenery before the war. Every major street had trees on the sidewalk, open green areas in the center of the city. I'm going to Warsaw each summer, and I'm deeply sorrow how the city looks today compared to before. Now Warsaw is the Europa's ugliest city. But i can't blame the Russians for it, because it was Hitlers orders... as a revenge for the Warsaw Uprising /watch?v=nrHfHtzCl7s
@wladys678 Again you seems to mistake me for a German defender and take thier wicked crimes as an explanation for the other`s deeds. Belive me i`m considering Teutons, but not only them and first of all i`ve got my own nation to worry about. The last of my interest is that if an enemy has a skull or a star on a cap. Let Germans think about thier precious "vertreibene" and Muscovites about mythical Ruś, i`ll never forget the sight of kids in Pahlevi and what we left behind.
@arczello1 Good joke, LOL. Where did you get to know that nonsense that Russian is an official language in Poland? We speak Polish and Polish is an official language in Poland. Polish is not even similar to Russian that much - for example I can't understand when someone speaks Russian to me, only few words are understandable. Russian was obligatory in schools only during communistic times. Review your source of information about Poland, because it's a simply wrong one.
@MaximusProteus Don't quote me on Austrian promisses, cs I didn't evaluate them. We'll never know how tsar's promisses woud test in reality, but they were rooted in some centuries old trends of Russian policy, unlike those made by teuton kaisers. Lwow-naturally would be Polish by reason of simple fact it never was in Russia. Don't you understand that Austria&Germany financed ukrainian rebels and murderers.
@PernatyZmey ... what's your problem... it's not about who was better .. who was worse .. who lost.. and who won... this is part of our history... which me need to remember... and we weren't the ones who invaded You.. You were the ones who invaded us.... and You lost... that's all.... My grandfather fought in this war... he was wounded twice... .. well... if I hate Russian People... no... `I can say even more.. i like Russian people..
Exactly man we don't give a shit what you think of us we really don't care - you can hate us all you want:) We are Russians and we don't live in the past :) goodbye!
Previously to Warsaw, the hungry and ill-equipped Russians who were in the middle of the Civil War kicked Polish imperialists ("od morza do morza") with all their French und British machine guns and artillery all the way back from Kharkov to Warsaw. This is what deserves my deepest admiration. And Polish propaganda films make me laugh.
As if Poland did not win the 1920 Battle of the whole of Europe was threatened by the Bolsheviks. Glory Poles battling in the Battle of Warsaw!
It wouldn't have done anything, remember the Soviets took Poland in 1939?
transylvanian wtf? why are you spreading some piece of shit? Fascism was an anti-democratic ideology
They however failed to deal with 1939 Soviet advance
@@SubidubidubiDu1 bo zaatakowała nas III Rzesza A ZSRR nas napadło 17 dni później. Zaatakowały nas 2 najsilniejsze wtedy państwa na świecie.
The greatest moment of Poland!
Alex Hayes another nazi nationalist
Dude the Reich shouldn't never start war against Poland.. It was pointless.
@transylvanian Calm down bolshevik.Stalin murdered about 100 million people.And the second devil Lenin a lot more.
@@rafalmm technically lenin killed all the people that ussr killed
Beautiful! how i never heard of this awesome movie before!?
Gdzie mozna znalesc caly film w internecie?
My grandfather fought in this war...
Po jakiej stronie 😅
@KiljiArslan .. What's even more interesting.. there were Americans.. in Polish Army... dropping the bombs... "literally " . .... read about Merian Caldwell Cooper .. and Kościuszko Squadron ..which supported the Polish Army in the Polish-Soviet War
Does anyone know where I can see/download/buy this movie with English subtitiles??
This looks great, will it get a UK release?
@TequilAndLime Are you sure you were not the invaders? How come you were in Kharkov?
I love the literal dropping of bombs from planes. It actually did happen.
добро је рекао мој брат, нема више рата. Међутим, 1920 у Варшави је нападнут. У ствари, Пољаци и Руси попут августа, али ми се не свиђа наше владе. Поздрављам вас све и Србије. Ја не знам да ли је право звучи, ја сам користио Гоогле Транслатор :)
Pozdrowienia dla Serbskich braci!
@licicaviki I'm gonna buy it for sure :3
and can't wait to see scenes that were cut off XD the "French help" should be hilarious
those should be included on dvd O.o right?
Great polska!
@MaximusProteus So many love is here. I like that :) My favourite sentence is "halt die klappe" :D
Regards from Poland.
This looks like a very well done film.I had a great respect for Polish film making,most of the ones I've seen were good.This story reminds me a great deal of "1920 Wojna i Milosc " .That's not a bad thing though,I thought that was a fine series.
Now to actually talk about the movie. I am hoping that the existance of an English trailer means that this will be available in canada at some point
@licicaviki mi się wydaje, że jeśli ktoś dobrze bądź nieco pobieżnie zna wydarzenia tamtego okresu - to film jest niezwykle spójny :) a kilka niezamkniętych wątków tylko dodaje uroku, gdyż wolę "otwartą niedopowiedzianą historię" niż "wszystko skończyło się dobrze tak i tak" XD
poza tym - trzeba na niego iść przygotowanym na to, iż jest to "Polska produkcja" i wyjdzie się potem zadowolonym :D
jak ktoś oczekuje ideału - to oczywiste, że się zawiedzie czegokolwiek by nie pokazali :D
@Kretek właśnie dlatego ja go oceniam po obejrzeniu :)
a o jakości filmu według mnie lepiej się wypowiadać po jego obejrzeniu-choćby częściowym
tak więc jeśli nie w kinie, to polecam choćby potem w domu samodzielne się zapoznanie
film bardzo dobry jak na historyczny gdyż nie ma w nim tego ah-jakze-heroicznego amerykanskiego podejscia i czerni i bieli a oddaje całkiem nieźle brutalność i brak piękna wojny
dodatkowo nie mamy tu cholernego romansu non stop a jest to tylko watek-bardziej poboczny
@Gryfin546 No zobaczymy. Ja naprawdę chciałem, żeby ten film się udał, a jak wyszło? Ocenię jak zobaczę. Ale do kina na to nie pójdę :) Poczekam jak będą w telewizji puszczać.
@brbgrl1 because in this movie
Poles speak in Polish
Russian speak in Russian
and each other nation speak in it's language
but the subtitles translate it all into language of the audience
it's a good movie - which means that you won't find everyone speaking English like some kind of universal language XD but their own native languages
@petrsonnk 11.11.1918 we regained our independence. Poland was not a communist state back then and we just wanted to regain our lands taken from us during the Partitions. We were fighting for freedom, independence and former glory. After 1945 when the Red Army took its revenge we became a communist state, and there was no one left to stop that process (our elites were murdered by bolsheviks in Katyń). Thats a short version of Polands history in XXth century. I hope it helps.
@101Restoration Denikin was a halph Pole after his mother.
Tsar Nicolas IInd has already agreed to the independence of Poland with his official declaration to Poles. His premier Sazonov planned to establish Poland's western frontier on Odra with Szczecin on Polish side, East Prussia was to fall into Russian rule. Under the new circumstances though, new Pol-Rus border further to east was expected.
@owerfull Może na dvd nie będzie, podobno mają wydać rozszerzoną wersję, a przecież zostało sporo świetnego materiału :)
327 [ Rok 1920 ]
Kwartale pierwszy, z trzech pomieszanych na siłę barw,
znowu powstała jedna , biało-czerwona ,
mieszać dalej nie trzeba ,
nasza , właściwa , polska ona.
Kwartale drugi, kolor ciemno-różowy, próbuje
wmieszać się w paletę barw, która już zaschnięta , ukończona ,
kolor ten odcień psuje ,
barwa zagrożona.
Kwartale trzeci, prawie doszło
do przebarwienia w czerwień krwistą ,
rodzime i tamtych kolory niemieszalne ,
sierpnia piętnastego stało się to sprawą oczywistą.
Kwartale czwarty, już na stałe zaschło,
a w posiadaczach koloru, radość, zadowolenie ,
biało u góry, czerwono na dole ,
takie przez pół na zawsze podzielenie.
@Gryfin546 er.. no wiesz :D
mi się wydawało, że właśnie o to chodziło, że oni zawsze szli gdzieś w tamtej wojnie XD a nie siedzieli non stop w jednym miejscu :D
zwłaszcza czerwoni - szli na warszawę :P
This is one of the most expensive movies in Polish film history XD
@licicaviki Hope DVD will be in Slovakia in 3 months not 3 years like always or I will take some big tomatoes and eggs to cinema... Can't wait to see it in 2D HD extended version. Hope it will be as good as "With fire and sword" or better
@licicaviki I can not rule out such a scenario. But even if so, if that was a preventative strike, it was the one poorly designed and ineffective, causing more losses than gains.That's the worst way to get ready for a defencive war.
By the way, why Pilsudski refused critical military aid to Poznan and Lwow defenders ?
@mcszot
One gun one man you mean. The other rule about 1 gun 3 men was in the tsarist army.
And if you can, please send me links to any articles about those wars on PM, as I didn't even hear of them. I will have to analyze them etc. then i will respond to you with my opinion about them
@kryokori No cóż, gusta to rzecz subiektywna. Co do osoby która mnie przed tym filmem ostrzegała to nasze gusta filmowe są dość zbliżone. Na umiejętnościach reżyserskich pana Hoffmana ostatnimi czasy się nie raz zawiodłem, a Potop został nakręcony wieki temu. Trudno oceniać film po zaledwie kilku scenach jakie się widziało, ale dobrego wrażenia one na mnie nie zrobiły. I nie mówię tu tylko o trailerze. Wybacz, ale to, że tematyka filmu jest ciekawa nie musi przekładać się na jego jakość.
@ChillDudelD My parents and grandparents don't even want to talk about the communist era in Poland, they say it was very bad back then.
"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it" - George Santayana
Isn't that why Russians make movies like "1612"?
@PolsheVik It was mostly Polish people from other major cities that wanted to help rebuild our capital. Russians just mostly designed the new Warsaw in Communist boring architecture which we didn't want. We wanted to rebuild Warsaw to its original state but u didn't let us do it. And took most of our money that we should have got from Germany and just put one small piece of it to put some square blocks of lego with windows everywhere.
@Beaststa197 you succeeded XD
we won't understand it - but still a chaos is a chaos and Polish language is one of biggest mess ever to non slavic people :P (and they said "Klingon" was hard XD)
wait till you hear it in the movie XD you might either have a headache or just love it :D
@101Restoration I agree with both your statements directed to me, but I am not sure why are you announcing them.
BTW there also was 8.5 thousand men Russian contingent on the Polish side under the former Russian premier Boris Savinkov , but they've got into combat after the Polish-Soviet truce, though. More Russians were ready to volunteer fighting on the Polish side.
@PolsheVik Anti-Katyn (also sometimes counter-Katyn) - a term used by historians to describe the Soviet and Russian propaganda campaign, which aims to relativization of the Katyn massacre by linking it with the high mortality rate among Soviet POWs in Polish captivity (1919-1921), allegedly caused by crimes committed against prisoners.
@ChillDudelD
Capitalists wouldn't even bother rebuilding the city, they would just sell what has remained of it. And those "lego blocks" are very profitable both for economy and for environment, as they don't take a lot of space, and are cheaper to build than just semi-detachable one family houses.
Thanks to communism, even Polish cities have a lot of greenery. British cities almost don't have any green colours in them...
@wladys678 Pilsudski was a left leaning socialist to be sure; so too was Petliura. With regards to Denikin, the Volunteer army was an All-Russia army whose goal was to establish a non-communist Russia within the boundaries of the old tsarist empire
@TequilAndLime It's Rus'. Just like Kiev, the cradle of Rus'=Russia. What have your troops lost there in 1920? Do you want to ignore that Pilsudski wanted to restore the 17th century Polish empire?
@fallout444 Did I say something factual wrong? Weren't the Russians occupied with domestic civil war? Didn't Polish forces use imported French and British machinge guns, artillery? Didn't the Russians drove them back all the way from Kharkov. Why Warsaw was a lost battle is another story. Stalin's false decisions and mistakes don't reduce the bravery of the ordinary Russian soldiers, but they reduce the "glory" of the Polish soldiers making the outcome pretty much simple luck.
@licicaviki True Petliura allied with Pilsudski to secure an independent Ukraine, not to revive the old Rzeczpospolita. I wonder if Hoffman will show Petliura's troops at the battle of Zamosc and Warsaw in the film or the struggles between the forces of the Ukrainian Galician Army fighting against the Polish army to liberate Western Ukraine. Any mention in the film of General Grekov routing the western/French equipped and trained Polish army back to Lviv? LOL
You got Volynia movie and that should be enough you were no heroes you were killing, torturing and eating civilians. You should be ashamed of Stepan Bandera
@mcszot
Why do you put random numbers in your statement, and say that this is the number of people "killed" by communists? The only people killed by communists were fascists in 2nd world war, and some Poles in battle of Warsaw. The biggest enemy from the east was the enemy of the Polish bourgeoisie, not of the Polish people. "Polish workers and peasants are our brothers. Right now, they are having the same struggle as we have had in 1917. They are our brothers, remember that!" - V.I. Lenin.
did you smoke to much active measures from Andropov?
@MaximusProteus Don't forget that Prussia took control of Slilesia by way of war and this illegal title was passed on to Germany in 1871. I dont know of any plans of population transfers in 1919 and I doubt there were any. If you raise the legality question, you should also answer whether forced germanisation, Hakata laws etc were legal ?
8/10
The one and only location in Poland where in fact the official language is the Russian language is White Russia, but not forever;)
@MaximusProteus I should have said 1916. Also consider almost 2 million Poles deported from their land by Germany in 1939-40, regions of Pomorze,Poznan,Lodz, Ciechanow,Gorny Slask_ were they "natural" or "fake".
@TequilAndLime I put it wrong... I should say... "it's like to say... Germany invaded Russia.. because Russians were in Berlin in 1945.... "
@arczello1 nope russian is not an official language in Poland :D haha
@wladys678 Yes, now i see, maybe accidentally but the idea on the west is similar. I wonder what Sazonow thought about the population here and there. On the east it was already done long before lord Curzon proposed that unwanted demarcation line, more or less in the third partition. With eception of Red Ruś, which Sazonow also wanted. So now it seems Moscow has no more territorial claims to us, but who knows, Germany for the other hand...
@Kretek the movie was great
someone lied to you or that person just have no taste
watch it yourself, then you can comment however you like
@kryokori A no to chyba, że tak. Obawiałem się, że może być zbyt wiele żałosnej patetyczności. Obejrzeć na pewno obejrzę. Ale jak już wspomniałem, nie w kinie.
This video 👍🏼🇵🇱🎵☺️❤️💟🤗
@PolsheVik So if you say that Katyn was the act of germans... Then why did Soviets, very likely made up the story about Strzalkowo. Now you got cough by your own counter attack.
Also, after the war. Germany was supposed to pay back the money for war damage to the winning allied countries. But because Poland was under communist occupation after the WW2. We didn't get the money, becayse Soviet because they controlled us. So they got their war money and Polish war money. They took more than 2/3 of what should go to Poland. But just took 1/3 of it to rebuild Warsaw.
@BENNYSIEGEL90 .. I'm not quite convinced to what You said... what makes You think so....? ... watch : "The Capitalist Conspiracy (1969) by G. Edward Griffin " You may find it interesting...
@DerWULT Of course they wanted to regain the rightfully polish lands. And you're wrong about polish population in "eastern Poland". The numbers varied. The battle itself is important in worlds history whether you like it or not. Read some "Edgar Vincent D'Abernon, The Eighteenth Decisive Battle of the World: Warsaw" or "J. F. C. Fuller, The Decisive Battles of the Western World" to understand why. Peace.
@licicaviki Thank you for the link, but as I said it does not justify the irresponsible Kiev raid, undertaken in blatant violation of Poland's interest.
You did not answer my other questions, though.
@szopen76
But, as you said, you HAD Russian classes in the past ;). I have never had them.
@PernatyZmey ...Kharkov....? On the first place... it doesn't belong to Russia... it's UKRAINE... .. and I don't know what You talking about....
@licicaviki Cuba is more my cup of tea.
And similar thing on smaller scale... happened... in Iraq.... Libia... .. now Syria... and finally it may happen in Iran... ans Iran is main target...
i agree your suggestion, polish people are brothers fu** politics, I will not forget the history of the Russian and Polish war, however, no hard feelings
Bij Bolszewika !
@Gryfin546 A więc jednak lipa. Tego się obawiałem :(
@ChillDudelD Then the we fought to overthrow Communism until 1989 where we succeeded and gained our independence again. We were Soviets satellite country.
@PernatyZmey And I bet You didn;t see this movie... it doesn't portrait Russians ... as You think it does... so maybe first watch it... than talk...
@DerWULT For invasion of Kiev 4/1920 are personally responsible Pilsudski and his Berlin sponsors but not Polish nations or Sejm, never supporting this decision. Dont mix it or confuse with heroic Polish defencive war against one million strong Soviet army. Make no mistake, Pilsudski invaded Kiev as agent of Berlin. Poland dumped Pilsudski to retreat after that war.
@Vegsiol
Really you can't? I had Russian in school, then or 20 years I had not used it, and recently it was enough to get 2 months or so and in Russia I undrstood almost everything -- it was wrose with speaking though :) In fact I think that If you'd donate some of your time to learn Russian, you would quickly achieve level to talk with people on the streets.
@PolsheVik
According to Russian historian Inessy Jażborowskiej anti-Katyn issue is associated with fear of explaining the Katyn massacre and its recognition of the responsibility for the Soviet party-state managers, uses it to Russia's communist and nationalist groups.
@licicaviki Perhaps a noble cause, but only in theory. In reality he did not achieve it, mainly because of lack of popular support in Kiev, even though they had a chance to liberate themselves from bolshevik oppression. Instead he mortally exposed the freshly won independence of Poland. And all of that was easy to predict .In result thousands of Poles and Russians lost their life and a new open wound never healed until now.
@PernatyZmey Do me a favour.. check.. at least in Wiki.. the maps from . from Polish-bolshevik war .. Poles weren't in Kharkow.. we stopped our offensive.. in Kijev.... but after.. we were invaded by Soviets.. come on... it's like to say.. Russia invaded Germany.. because.. Russians were in Berlin in 1945..
Red Forever!
Katyn massacre? And before you say “how many Bolsheviks died in Polish Pow camps” think of the mass rape the Soviets committed against Poland. Polish Soviet War, WW2 and after.
@arczello1
What the hell are you talking about? russian was NEVER the official language in Poland.
People in Poland had to learn russian in schools during the communist occupation.
lol, get your facts straight before posting such asinine comments.
@licicaviki Castro isn't even part of the government any more.
we give a fuck waht you think about this movie ... its a polish movie for polish people to show our brave ancestors recue our country !!!
East Slav is NOT like the western Slav. 21st century war will begin with Topol M instead of cavalry, guys :))
@baltasvilkas NATO will desintegrate soon, together with decaying and declining Western capitalism!
commie rethoric is strong in this one
i hope its better than the russian movie Stalingrad, that was fcking horrible.
This movie is exactly the polish equivalent of the Stalingrad movie.
@TequilAndLime Pilsudski wanted Poland in the borders of 1792. It means including East Slavic lands. East Slavs always fought against Polish discrimination against Orthodoxy, against economic enslavement by the Szlachta. There were dozens of uprisings. Your "Commonwealth" was a hell for Ukrainians. I think that in was correct to reunite all Ukrainian and Belorussian lands in 1939. Ethnic Polish lands begin to the west of Bug.
@AldaronV hahaha :D
I hate 3D too :P
it hurts my eyes, makes everything blurry XD especially with shitty cinema-3D-glasses, you might as well watch it through a key hole than in panoramic XD
but - unfortunately - 3D is what made best advertisement for this movie abroad :/
@wladys678 Law is legal if it goes for the obvious, but in the practice only natural law of force matters, paper will take anything. I`m not rising a question of that. Same way you can dispute any peace treaty, but whatever the outcome of a war is and border changes, such a social engeering on civillians is just wrong. Germanisation was also not a case in Silesia at that time anymore and i assure you i`m not an advocate of any German case. What i care more about is the other side.
@arczello1
You don't know much, do you?
@arczello1 Wtf?! As far as I know I don't speak Russian... In school I had only English and Spanish... And so all my friends... Your opinion is a bit strange...
@PernatyZmey In my opinion it belongs to the Ukraine... not Russia ...... and remember we still talk about Soviet Union...
No Piłudski didn't want to... restore "Polish Empire"... first of all we don't call.. XVII century Poland an "Empire".. it was... Commonwealth of Poland.. watch this.. ruclips.net/video/bbQIu6V-rIU/видео.html and find the difference between Poland and Russia
the difference between free country and an Empire..
@licicaviki Daj sobie spokój, to troll. Nie warto ;)
@Gryfin546 No cóż, każdy ma swoje zdanie na ten temat. Jak dla mnie muzyka jest delikatnie mówiąc przeciętna, nijaka po prostu. Natomiast szarża wygląda słabo. A szkoda, bo sama tematyka filmu jest ciekawa. Sam trailer jest fatalny moim zdaniem. Już lepiej zmontowane zajawki widziałem zrobione przez amatorów. Ten jest totalnie chaotyczny. Hoffman jak dla mnie już dawno się wypalił i teraz robi słabe filmy które po prostu się łatwo sprzedadzą w Polsce. No ale w 3D!!! :-\
@Giru69 Nie będzie Niemiec pluł mi w twarz ;)
Również pozdrawiam
@mcszot
A good capitalist is a bankrupting capitalist, being overthrown by the people.
Seriously now, wishing death to another human being is a bit sick don't you think so? I belong to Communist party(Bolshevik). And do you have any problem with that? Did I do anything to you? No.
P.S. It was Poland who attacked Kiev first, SR was just counter attacking.
@DerWULT Edgar Vincent D'Abernon and J.F.C Fuller, yep their surnames sound totally polish, it has to be polish propaganda! I wish you could learn some history, from other sources than Bildzeitung.
@wladys678 Was a Muscovite by his choice.
Don`t be naive, the promises of Nickolas grew as fast as the German armies were advancing, they also promised, made some midget puppet, Austrians the same. Habsburgs were breeding sons to become rulers of Poland, Ukraine or whatever they`ll make up.
Border on Odra.. and who between these borders? Where Lwów, Wilno, Grodno? Don`t you see the borders and population transfers after WWII are fake?
@PolsheVik It's not thanks to communism we have much greenery... We had even greenery before the war. Every major street had trees on the sidewalk, open green areas in the center of the city. I'm going to Warsaw each summer, and I'm deeply sorrow how the city looks today compared to before. Now Warsaw is the Europa's ugliest city. But i can't blame the Russians for it, because it was Hitlers orders... as a revenge for the Warsaw Uprising /watch?v=nrHfHtzCl7s
@wladys678 Again you seems to mistake me for a German defender and take thier wicked crimes as an explanation for the other`s deeds. Belive me i`m considering Teutons, but not only them and first of all i`ve got my own nation to worry about. The last of my interest is that if an enemy has a skull or a star on a cap. Let Germans think about thier precious "vertreibene" and Muscovites about mythical Ruś, i`ll never forget the sight of kids in Pahlevi and what we left behind.
👍🏼🇵🇱👏🏽✌🏼☺️🎵❤️💟
@arczello1
Good joke, LOL. Where did you get to know that nonsense that Russian is an official language in Poland? We speak Polish and Polish is an official language in Poland. Polish is not even similar to Russian that much - for example I can't understand when someone speaks Russian to me, only few words are understandable. Russian was obligatory in schools only during communistic times. Review your source of information about Poland, because it's a simply wrong one.
@MaximusProteus Don't quote me on Austrian promisses, cs I didn't evaluate them. We'll never know how tsar's promisses woud test in reality, but they were rooted in some centuries old trends of Russian policy, unlike those made by teuton kaisers. Lwow-naturally would be Polish by reason of simple fact it never was in Russia. Don't you understand that Austria&Germany financed ukrainian rebels and murderers.
@PernatyZmey ... what's your problem... it's not about who was better .. who was worse .. who lost.. and who won... this is part of our history... which me need to remember... and we weren't the ones who invaded You.. You were the ones who invaded us.... and You lost... that's all.... My grandfather fought in this war... he was wounded twice... .. well... if I hate Russian People... no... `I can say even more.. i like Russian people..
Exactly man we don't give a shit what you think of us we really don't care - you can hate us all you want:) We are Russians and we don't live in the past :) goodbye!
Previously to Warsaw, the hungry and ill-equipped Russians who were in the middle of the Civil War kicked Polish imperialists ("od morza do morza") with all their French und British machine guns and artillery all the way back from Kharkov to Warsaw. This is what deserves my deepest admiration. And Polish propaganda films make me laugh.
@PernatyZmey than again... who invaded Poland.. on September 17th.. 1939... together with Hitler...? Don't You feel just a little bit of shame....?
@licicaviki Good thing, Cuban doesn't follow a utopian ideology.