In my opinion, the Dexed sounds so close that arguing about it really isn't worth the trouble. I owned a DX7 for years and knew it inside-out. One *huge* advantage of the Dexed is that you can see all the edit parameters; on a DX7, you had to jump around from one to another on the LCD. I have Dexed and use it a *lot*. Great vsti!
i loaded DX 7 banks in a volca compatible with DX7. ALL are definitly close. But Hardware is allways a bit warmer. "out of the box" Blind test with 3 non keyboardist people with hardware through the same soundcard as the one used to run DeXed led to same conclusion. Dexed is one of my favorite tool though (with PG8X) but in term of sound, i often prefer the Volca and even TX. But i agree with you: it's closes, definitly! and it s more e fellowship than a competition; i think they can all give the best of both world! Owning the hardware without Dexed would definitly be a shame! and producing without a "real" DX is possible with this great and free instrument. For live i will allways prefer an harware instrument, with no computer though.
Yes. That one digital thing is a lot warmer and richer than that other digital thing. Do you hardware snobs even realise how dumb you sound at this point?@@lovecraftmusic8717
I've got Dexed and recently just bought a reface dx and honestly I think dexed sounds better. Not sure how a free VST can emulate a 30 year old keyboard better than Yamaha can but it blew my mind.
You sir, understood how an A/B test should be made. Great work! Just picked a Yamaha TX7, and now I know I can rely on Dexed for the patches. Thanks for the demo.
It's possibly a little easier with this comparison than, say, analog, because the patch libraries for the original exist and can be loaded onto the vst
I love that this is the most polite music channel where everyone seems reasonable and there's no trolling or Fanboy stuff going on. Hope I haven't Jinxed you with that Woody. Anyway, my 2 penneth is that the advantage of the real thing is when you're playing solo for yourself so that you'd notice the slight thinness/brightness of the VST and I agree there's a certain disconnect when playing via a VST. It's nice just to switch on a keyboard and play 'it'. Thanks for the video. 😎👍
Jackofalltrades what disconnect? It's all in the mind. You can construct your own module with a cheap computer set up to load your vst once you turn it on and with an ssd it will boot up in no time. Go watch Fairlight videos as that is the closest retro synth to the vst generation.
Funny thing is Yamaha did all this in software in 1983. The DX7 is purely digital and it's all software generated synthesis! One of the first to do so also. At least in the more affordable consumer space (Although it was quite expensive in 83, but not like a house)
@@jimbotron70 No. If so could you please explain which part were hardware assisted synthesis? Because that would mean some analog components like filters, LFOS etc would be involved. DX7 used FM and it was generated digitally to a 100%. Then every synth has to do a conversion via a DA to an analog outpout, but that isn't synthesis!
@@Magnus_Loov The 8-bit processor and the ASIC in DX 7 didn't have the processing power to handle the sound synthesis in real time, in fact the DX 7's FM relied upon "operators", or tone generators, this is why it's called hardware-assisted synthesis. In Dexed and other VSTs it's all done purely in sofware.
@@jimbotron70 Haha! "Operators" is the term still used in FM terminology. It is still software only. The fact that i was 100% software in the DX7 BUT not in real time still doesn't negate that it was software.
The real DX7 may have just an ever so slightly fuller sound ie a touch more mids to lows, but in a mix I'd challenge anyone to pick the real from the VST it is so slight. And besides, in a mix, you have so much competition for space in the "mud" range that the VST might actually function better in a mix because it is a very small touch clearer for lack of a better way to put it. I have an original DX7 from the early 80's. raised it from a pup. Loved it. Best keybed on a synth ever. Still works great, at least last time I fired it up, but that's been a while. I now use DEXED when I need those sounds, and there are thousands available free on the net, It is much easier and certainly the interface wins hands down over the little readout on the DX7 itself. It's a no brainer for me. I love Dexed. (Quick edit here: It just dawned on me that the original DX7 only responded up to 100 on velocity where as the DEXED can do either, so if you have it set to respond to the full scale, that might explain the ever so slightly brighter sound. Still, I doubt most would even hear the difference.)
From one of the first demonstrations back in the 80-ies I fell in love with this "totally different sound". In the store there also was a Jupiter 8, but it then sounded "lame" and "same" against the DX7. However: I never had the money to buy one and now I don't care too much about the little (imaginary?) differences in sound with the Dexed. Add to that the scary interface to program a sound on the DX7, I give the Dexed a triple thumbs-up. And the best thing is: I can afford it :-)
EQing down the highest highs a bit often helps to get digital emulations closer to analog sound. I've noticed that this "trick" applies to almost all digital modeling synths. Just cut the brightest highs a little bit. :)
@@bradylasserre9320 there is, but it's the very last stage of its sound output, which is where additional character comes in a more extreme example would be the sega mega drive, especially the later model 1 and earlier model 2 units with their strong low pass filter and not strong enough resistors after the DAC stage
@@ChrisNova777 People's ears would however pick up the sharper high end of DEXED even if they didn't recognize that it wasn't a real DX7. Depending on what you're mixing it into, that might be desirable or not. Personally, I prefer it in most contexts. I tend to like my FM to have a bit of sharpness to it, and DEXED manages to capture that without sounding thin, because the DX7 wasn't thin. I'm going to wager that DEXED does a good job of modeling the DX7 synth on a chip level, but doesn't model whatever output circuitry that the DX7 had, which was dulling the high frequencies.
I know this is an old comment, but it made my chuckle, a lot I(I must be going mental). I LOL-ed not because I disagree, but because it makes me think of a cheesy 90s commercial. [Middle aged man in sweater vest sits at a table filled with electronic components.] "I Just saved a lot of money by switching to Dexed". [eats a Yamaha YM2612 like a potato chip -- there's a whole bowl full of them] Announcer: "Dexed... so deliciously FM you can't tell the difference between what is real and what is vitual. Give it a try today!"
After owning a dx7s years ago along with the ii and iiFD which i regret selling all of them I was really glad when dexed came out, I now own the original dx7 and its brilliant that it can link together along with the volca fm with good old midi. The dexed creators deserve every accolade.
Dexed is a great synth. I remember when the DX7 came out. It was So different, so cool, so difficult to program :) The fact that you can stack as many as you want in your PC, and for free, is amazing. I finally understand my dad. Kids these days don't know how easy they have it lol.
Hi Woody, I rarely comment on YT vids. Just wanted to let you know I subscribed because of your great vids on these awesome retro synths and for the Dexed VST comparison in particular. I'm an 80s kid and am getting back into noodling around on some synthwavey stuff for fun. Getting stuck into Dexed now. Thanks for the inspiration boost and keep up the great work! Cheers
So very close - I listened on headphones very carefully, and Dexed (for the price) certainly can't be beat! Unfortunately, what adds to to the complication in evaluating them side by side is that in Woody's demos the Dexed output is just slightly quieter than the DX7's output, which will make the DX-7 sound more "lively", and Dexed more "thin" and set back in the mix. If they were at exactly the same level, I think the comparison would have been closer. Also, if instead of playing live he had played a Midi file into each, that would have eliminated slight differences in playing. When I get my own Dexed virtual synth into my mixing panel, I'll add effects and probably an equalizer to sweeten the whole thing. As to whether it's a "perfect" emulation, to my ears it's wonderful, easy to work with, DEAD-easy to edit (compared to working directly with the DX-7's multi-function buttons) plus it's compatible with all the DX-7 SYX files one could want to scrape out of the web. For the Nth degree of warmth (as far as the DX-7 can be said to be warm (maybe arguably warmer than Dexed), one could always create a patch in Dexed, save it as a .syx and send it down to the DX-7. Lastly, the way that old PCs powerful enough to run Dexed are dirt cheap these days, one could build up a cheap stack of small form-factor desktops running Dexed (and other virtual synths) and save the cost of trying to find a TX-816. Well done to whoever created Dexed, they have reinvigorated interest in FM synthesis for a whole new generation.
thx for the comment! yeah, it's real important to match the levels, but it's harder than you think to get the same perceived volume. i use my ears and vu meter, but due to differences in frequency spectrum between the two, the volume can sound different depending on what system you are listening too. people tend to prefer loudness so it's something i pay attention to when mixing these comparisons. the playing is identical on dexed as I recorded the midi as i played the dx7, then played midi into dexed :) agree with all your praise about the plugin :)
I think also there's bound to be a different in perception re: loudness since your DX-7 is a Mk1 model (for which midi velocity 100 is the absolute max) whereas Dexed most likely adheres to the current MIDI standard where 127 is the absolute max, so a Mk1 DX-7 should sound 127/100 (multiplied by your playing velocity) more "live". Effectively you'd have to strike the keys 27% more aggressively in DEXED for the filters to open up to the same extent as they do on a DX-7 Mk1. I'm sure I'd encounter that if I loaded a voice designed for a Mk1 into my DX7IID - I'd likely need to "relax" the filter and other velocity-tracked values to allow them to track all the way to 127 rather than stopping/maxing out their effect when played at veloicity of 100, so they don't stop their effect there but continue to track all the way to the DX7II's real max of velocity=127. I love your videos - you're dead keen and your enthusiasm is infectious.... and we both live in cold/cool Northern countries (Canada for me, Sweden for you). Cheers mate!
Hey, I love your videos, thanks for all the information and entertainment! Do you think the brighter dx7ii would sound more similar to the dexed plugin? I wonder how much of the sound difference comes down to the DACs in either device.
I've worked with the original DX7, DX7IIfd, SY and TG77, and now Dexed. They all sound 'slightly' different with the same patch loaded, but its so subtle as to be a non-issue. Working with Dexed has been a blast to the past and a joy 👍
I use both, depending on how much space I have. I've recorded stuff with Dexed and then gone back over with the DX7, and there's little difference. You'd only notice any minute differences in a direct head to head, and even then it's so subtle.
Dexed is extremely close for most patches, although there's a few where you can hear a bit of difference. Still, if it was a blind test, I don' think most people could tell reliably. I wonder if a bit-cruncher would make a difference? It would be easy to dial back Dexed's fidelity to 12-bit and that might make it grittier, dirtier and closer to the Mk1 original.
in the vst's settings, theres an option to make it to emulate the sound of the 12-bit mark 1's sound engine, and it makes it sound much closer to the original
Thank you Woody! While there will always be differences this is an excellent emulation overall. I really enjoy your yt videos as they are very educational. Best of luck to you!
I got Dexed purely because I wanted that tubular bell preset. I've loved that sound since I first heard it in the '80s. Used it, too, in a recent composition!
I've been searching for that for a long time, because I wanted that low "BONG" from the Top Gun anthem. And god damn here it is, and for free?! I thought I was going to have to spend over a hundred on the native instruments plugin.
I assume these are not presets that come with Dexed? I would love to get these sounds but I have no clue how to program this beast, so have been searching for some nice presets to download! Amazing VST!
Excellent comparison!! DEXED does the job, no doubt about it, but...there's something missing from the original. (I'm not a purist, I intensively use VSTs), maybe the 12 bit thang, and the fact that the original only reached 100 on velocity, and the plugin can make sounds brighter, passing this threshold...anyway, as good or even better than comparing an Oberheim with the OPXII VST. :) Cheers.
I'd like to hear Dexed bit reduced and run out through some external analog gear and a low pass filter. And then I note that free is not so free when one adds the computer and the rack gear. Happy medium? Experiment and program in Dexed, play on the DX7. :)
It is not just the number of bits, there is also the architecture of the DACs. Modern DACs use over-sampling to reconstruct the waveforms and get rid of "junk" in the high frequencies. They are also much more linear than the old direct conversion tech. I wonder if there is also a sample rate difference.
I have original DX7, DX7 II FD, TX802, Dexed and DX7 V. Although I did not do a detailed (awesome like Woody) comparison I can tell you that there is quite a bit of dirt, noise, and I guess "digital warmth" coming from the original hardware components. I don't think any software or hardware manufacturer is really going to try recreate that today, at least not to that extent. The software is close enough in most cases, and convenient to have on your laptop. That said, I'm not getting rid of the old hardware boxes ;-) If you can and if you are really into DX and FM, try to find at least one DX7 in a decent shape for a good price.
I tried out Dexed myself today and have to say quite impressed. I have a TX7 with some presets I made years ago and they sound a lot more like the TX in Dexed than the conversion to FM8, which I think doesn't quite get the envelopes right. Theres also a slightly more woody less hifi sound in dexed which is nearer to the DX than FM8 and even any of the later DX's which polished up the FM a bit. Possibly in FM8 they didn't model the 8bit oscillators and dac in a bid to cater for all the more modern 6op patches ?
Other than some slight audio things like maybe volume or equalizer settings, they sound extremely similar to me. Maybe it's my ears, maybe it's my speakers but they sound VERY close to one another to me.
Nice mix of tunage... went back to my childhood! :) I actually referenced this video for me getting an actual DX7IIFD for myself. Dexed is totally awesome if you don't want the hardware. I happen to like the hardware. First keyboard I ever recorded with. Thanks for the video!
@@jacoblee8181 I think Mesa meant Dexxed, there's no pre-installed cartridges when you install the plugin. It's just a completely empty plugin with 0 presets
Prepare yourselves for those elitist preaching how Dexed is not even close to the DX7. When THEY wouldnt even tell which is which in a mix. Things to remember: the original DX keyboard only recognized velocity up to 100. Dexed may be sounding brighter because the velocity is opening up the operator levels higher(brighter) than the DX7. Its also an extremely close...VERY close emulation that is FREE. The only one who could tell Dexed from a DX7 in a mix is Brian Eno. That is all.
i have a track using dexed coming out soon, and had i claimed it was a dx7 nobody would have questioned it. but those elitest do have a point, as a solo synth it does pack more power, dirt and warmth (you don't often hear that in the same sentence as dx7) than the vst. but making tracks with dexed is so much quicker and easier than with hardware, it's a tradeoff i'm willing to make!
john heath im not trying to be that guy, but i gotta say.. as far as the presets go i agree, dexed is satisfying enough. They are missing the raw dx edge, but they're as good as the dx7 if you want that classic sound. Sound design wise, ive owned a dx7 for ages and constantly compared it with fm7 fm8 px7 and one thing is for sure when you get serious into programming you just find certain "sweet spots" (ratios i guess) which just sound so much better on the dx7
The Dexed does sound thinner and it's not the velocity I'd say since the expression would be a lot different if you think about it, I'd say max velocity is maybe 100 on the old DX7 so 100=127 this means you get fewer steps ie. lower resolution.
KUPHSER Agreed. Ive used the PX7. And some great sounds can be had on it. And its more straight forward to see how FM works. But having the hardware classic in front of you. Leads to spontaneous inspiration. That you just cannot replace.
a DX7 costs money. if people prefer it enough to shell out cash, then maybe they have a reason. maybe it's like the difference between getting take out and dining out. same food, sleightly different experience. Why do "they" bother you? I have dexed, and after seeing this video, I actually want an original DX7. I'd play with it, service it, and if I got tired of it, pass it on to someone else who finds the object fun to play with. I'm visiting a friend who has an RX5 drum machine and it's provocative and puzzling. These machines seem to taunt us. "Can you figure us out or are you stupid?" These hardware machines and their emulations are miles apart in terms of the way that they command human brain and body processing times. Both have their virtues. There are more than one way to see these things than the data sheet.
After I discovered Dexed, I dumped my FM7 and maybe that's why Native Instruments dumped it by its own as well. There is yet a slight difference between the two, specially on E.PIANO which on the DX7 sounds with more presence. Maybe it's a mix between narrower bandwidth from the amplifiers and even a bit of distortion. Nevertheless the sound coming from the DX7 is very nice and then maybe our ear memory from the tons of tunes that had the E.PIANO makes us feel biased to that exact match coming from the real thing.
The most striking difference to me seems the analog filter on the DX7s (I've heard they have one), and it's emulation having a slightly higher cutoff(?) or just the fact that it's pretty darn difficult to properly emulate your average analog resonant filter in the computer domain (I'm studying Electronic Engineering and Digital Signal Processing is a big part of our curriculum). Or maybe it's something about the post-processing effects (reverb or sth). Apart from that, it's spot on and still seems very fun to play with.
When you have to wonder if you are really hearing a difference, I suppose then that it doesn't matter. I owned and still do, a DX7, still works just fine thank you. To my ear, and this is slight, but it seems the DX7 has a slightly warmer or fuller sound. The DEXED is slightly thinner with more edge. But this is so very slight. In a mix there would be very few that could pick out the real deal from the emulation. Whoever did this did a very good job indeed. But then, there's the ease of use which the emulation wins hands down. Just my two cents worth, but of course what with all the inflation we are experiencing, two cents won't buy much anymore lol!
I am so gratefull that there are some good people that make this kind of stuff free for us. It doesn't sound exactly the same but c'mon it's a FREE Digital representation of the original. And it sounds very good.
Woody Piano Shack Not that they made the sounds up. Freeware as in you don't have to pay for the plug-in.... Representation because it's digital you know 1s and 0s
2:48 - these two are the most noticeable for me. I agree there’s a flatness to the VST. Outside of the comparison I’d find it super hard to distinguish the two. One advantage of Dexed is probably the lack of self noise that most DX7s now have with age, however I think the noise can also be used as additional authenticity in tracks. (Or at the very least gated out during the silences)
Got both, use both. I primarily use Dexed to program patches to send to the hardware. They sound almost identical in most applications, but there are some areas where the DX7 performs better, at least as far as I'm concerned. Plus the DX7 allows portmanteau. I've spent hours looking over Dexed to find that feature.
I definitely hear a difference on the brass. The VST version sounds like the filter is quite a bit brighter. Might just be that the patch wasn't quite fine tuned and maybe if you lower the filter freq it will sound closer.
Only the VST even HAS a filter. The first few FM synths famously lacked any filter, believing that their more complex envelopes and algorithms could make up for it.
Real close, Many differences fixed with EQ- the DX7 has more low end on several patches, pretty obvious here. none the less, sold my DX7 ages ago. Moved on to SY77, then SY99, then XS8, then M08 and never looked back- no nostalgia here as the new keyboards cover the old sounds more than adequately.
Both sound awesome. What song is the fourth riff from (the one played on that nice spiky Wurlitzer type patch)? I particularly like that one. Great video!
Great video man! & fellow Howard Jone's lover (and The Stranglers) .... A younger me would have perhapes went for the plug-in for being cleaner and better sn ratio ... But now I love the 'whole' part of the sound being 100% original with the higher noise floor and digital aliasing girth.
i find the main advantage of plugin is much easier to work with when composing tracks, otherwise you are messing around with midi and audio cables and interfaces. glad you like the video and my taste in music :)
Through my monitors the DEXED made bright tones with HF content sound duller up the high end of the keyboard. But still a creditable facsimile. Whether that had to do with the different processing, bits and bobs etc, I couldn't say.
great thanks,i have been looking for a test like this since your video about dexed. i wonder if the this difference was not caused by the max velocity response (100 for the dx7 and 127 for dexed)
DX7 é um computador antigo que faz cálculos. E o vst é um plugin pra um computador moderno fazer os mesmos cálculos. A única diferença de qualidade se deve ao circuito analógico do DX7 ser diferente do circuito analógico de um computador moderno. Ou seja, a única diferença é na equalização.
Nice video! I love Dexed. I have a Yamaha TX802 and can use Dexed on the go to create and modify patches and then send them to the 802. Highly recommend this plugin.
They sound a bit different indeed, the question is.. is it worth getting a DX7 for that difference in sound? If programming a DX7 would be easy maybe, just maybe yes, but being almost impossible to program, i think I would go with Dexed, not only for price but also programability .
i eventually chose the software route, but really enjoyed my time with the dx7. they are cheap and easy to find, so i would still recommend trying out the real thing, it's a real pleasure to play.
Many thanks! I've just discovered your channel and love it! Keep up the great stuff. I feel inspired to get a DX7, had one some time ago and really loved its sound!
Really close in my opinion! Close enough for me at least. I will continue using this plugin for my music as always :). If the plugin sounds so close, why would I spend some money for the real thing, maybe that's just me. Yes I hear the difference, the plugin sounds a bit thinner then the DX7, but if you put it in a mix, you wouldn't even tell the different. By the way Woody, I have LOADS of sysex (DX7 Carts) to use for Dexed, even the very rare Toto cart! The owner of the original cart very kindly sent me the sysex files of those cartridges. I'm a big Toto fan, so that was AWESOME for me! If you want a bucket load of sysex patches to use or play around with, I'll send it to you :).
Sure no problem :). Here is the link: www.sendspace.com/file/hypsl3 The sysex's you see when you first open the zip file, those are my personal favorites. It has the factory presets, Toto presets, TX7 presets and more. Enjoy!
My father accidently broke his DX7. He was devastated. Then i recommended Dexed to him, and good lord he's so happy.
omg
Loool
You're a good son!
now recommend him Arturia DX 7 V
you just made me love your dad.
In my opinion, the Dexed sounds so close that arguing about it really isn't worth the trouble. I owned a DX7 for years and knew it inside-out. One *huge* advantage of the Dexed is that you can see all the edit parameters; on a DX7, you had to jump around from one to another on the LCD. I have Dexed and use it a *lot*. Great vsti!
i loaded DX 7 banks in a volca compatible with DX7. ALL are definitly close. But Hardware is allways a bit warmer. "out of the box" Blind test with 3 non keyboardist people with hardware through the same soundcard as the one used to run DeXed led to same conclusion. Dexed is one of my favorite tool though (with PG8X) but in term of sound, i often
prefer the Volca and even TX. But i agree with you: it's closes, definitly! and it s more e fellowship than a competition; i think they can all give the best of both world! Owning the hardware without Dexed would definitly be a shame! and producing without a "real" DX is possible with this great and free instrument. For live i will allways prefer an harware instrument, with no computer though.
Very apparent even from my smart TV is the lack of bass from the vst... It sounds thinner, nasal and more fake.
Yes. That one digital thing is a lot warmer and richer than that other digital thing.
Do you hardware snobs even realise how dumb you sound at this point?@@lovecraftmusic8717
I use both, a tx7 controlled by dexed. Some patches sound better dexed, nice to have the options.
Incredible. Just think about how incredible is that someone is able to give this to the world for free. Great video!!!
I've got Dexed and recently just bought a reface dx and honestly I think dexed sounds better. Not sure how a free VST can emulate a 30 year old keyboard better than Yamaha can but it blew my mind.
reface dx is only 4 operator, which is unfortunate
@@TheBBQify reface dx is not a dx7 remake and is amazing despite its limitations
@@zackhartmann yeah ngl i actually would love a reface, i just cant justify buying one when i already have dexed
@@TheBBQify i can justify it for u if u need
Reface can loop back to some operators to get close. It’s basically a dx9 upgraded or a CX5M.
You sir, understood how an A/B test should be made. Great work! Just picked a Yamaha TX7, and now I know I can rely on Dexed for the patches. Thanks for the demo.
It's possibly a little easier with this comparison than, say, analog, because the patch libraries for the original exist and can be loaded onto the vst
Crazy how good these sounds are. Still blows me away.
I love that this is the most polite music channel where everyone seems reasonable and there's no trolling or Fanboy stuff going on. Hope I haven't Jinxed you with that Woody. Anyway, my 2 penneth is that the advantage of the real thing is when you're playing solo for yourself so that you'd notice the slight thinness/brightness of the VST and I agree there's a certain disconnect when playing via a VST. It's nice just to switch on a keyboard and play 'it'. Thanks for the video. 😎👍
Jackofalltrades what disconnect? It's all in the mind. You can construct your own module with a cheap computer set up to load your vst once you turn it on and with an ssd it will boot up in no time. Go watch Fairlight videos as that is the closest retro synth to the vst generation.
Fuck you, you fucking moron. Nah, just kidding. Lol. Couldn't resist.
@@PaulTheSkeptic You actually concerned me for a bit, good job lol.
Yes you can hear here, the vst is lacking some body and also some shine on some presets (mainly body tho).
I think it's so cool how one can do all this synthesis purely in software nowadays. Technology sure has come a long way!
Funny thing is Yamaha did all this in software in 1983. The DX7 is purely digital and it's all software generated synthesis! One of the first to do so also. At least in the more affordable consumer space (Although it was quite expensive in 83, but not like a house)
@@Magnus_Loov No, the DX7 did it with hardware-assisted synthesis.
@@jimbotron70 No. If so could you please explain which part were hardware assisted synthesis? Because that would mean some analog components like filters, LFOS etc would be involved. DX7 used FM and it was generated digitally to a 100%. Then every synth has to do a conversion via a DA to an analog outpout, but that isn't synthesis!
@@Magnus_Loov The 8-bit processor and the ASIC in DX 7 didn't have the processing power to handle the sound synthesis in real time, in fact the DX 7's FM relied upon "operators", or tone generators, this is why it's called hardware-assisted synthesis. In Dexed and other VSTs it's all done purely in sofware.
@@jimbotron70 Haha! "Operators" is the term still used in FM terminology. It is still software only. The fact that i was 100% software in the DX7 BUT not in real time still doesn't negate that it was software.
The real DX7 may have just an ever so slightly fuller sound ie a touch more mids to lows, but in a mix I'd challenge anyone to pick the real from the VST it is so slight. And besides, in a mix, you have so much competition for space in the "mud" range that the VST might actually function better in a mix because it is a very small touch clearer for lack of a better way to put it. I have an original DX7 from the early 80's. raised it from a pup. Loved it. Best keybed on a synth ever. Still works great, at least last time I fired it up, but that's been a while. I now use DEXED when I need those sounds, and there are thousands available free on the net, It is much easier and certainly the interface wins hands down over the little readout on the DX7 itself. It's a no brainer for me. I love Dexed. (Quick edit here: It just dawned on me that the original DX7 only responded up to 100 on velocity where as the DEXED can do either, so if you have it set to respond to the full scale, that might explain the ever so slightly brighter sound. Still, I doubt most would even hear the difference.)
The DX7 sounds so spectacular still. FM synthesis is awesome. My first synth was a DX11.
Dexed is certainly close enough, obviously a bit cleaner and more HIFI. Great demo, thanks Woody!
Oh my god that's an impressive VST
What an amazing VST. I'm blown away by how true to the sound it is.
From one of the first demonstrations back in the 80-ies I fell in love with this "totally different sound".
In the store there also was a Jupiter 8, but it then sounded "lame" and "same" against the DX7.
However: I never had the money to buy one and now I don't care too much about the little (imaginary?) differences in sound with the Dexed.
Add to that the scary interface to program a sound on the DX7, I give the Dexed a triple thumbs-up.
And the best thing is: I can afford it :-)
EQing down the highest highs a bit often helps to get digital emulations closer to analog sound. I've noticed that this "trick" applies to almost all digital modeling synths. Just cut the brightest highs a little bit. :)
Works for a JV 2080 as well. And then run it through a Tube Preamp.
There is nothing "analog" about a DX7 lmao.
@@bradylasserre9320 Very interesting. Can you post a video showing your DX7 with digital output.
@@bradylasserre9320 there is, but it's the very last stage of its sound output, which is where additional character comes in
a more extreme example would be the sega mega drive, especially the later model 1 and earlier model 2 units with their strong low pass filter and not strong enough resistors after the DAC stage
THATS WHY SATURATION MAKE DIGITAL SHINES LIKE THE REAL THING
with a little EQ here and there i could just about make dexed sound close to the real thing. in any case I am sold .....
I was thinking the same thing
anyones ears would still pick the real dx7 witout the eq
How can you be sold when it's freeeeeeeee?
@@ChrisNova777
People's ears would however pick up the sharper high end of DEXED even if they didn't recognize that it wasn't a real DX7. Depending on what you're mixing it into, that might be desirable or not.
Personally, I prefer it in most contexts. I tend to like my FM to have a bit of sharpness to it, and DEXED manages to capture that without sounding thin, because the DX7 wasn't thin. I'm going to wager that DEXED does a good job of modeling the DX7 synth on a chip level, but doesn't model whatever output circuitry that the DX7 had, which was dulling the high frequencies.
How can you be sold if its free? ;)
where can i find these sounds preset? In dexed's library there aren't !!!
I was born in 1992, and I am proud to say that I recognized all the songs you played lol
I just saved a lot of money by switching to Dexed!
I know this is an old comment, but it made my chuckle, a lot I(I must be going mental). I LOL-ed not because I disagree, but because it makes me think of a cheesy 90s commercial.
[Middle aged man in sweater vest sits at a table filled with electronic components.]
"I Just saved a lot of money by switching to Dexed".
[eats a Yamaha YM2612 like a potato chip -- there's a whole bowl full of them]
Announcer: "Dexed... so deliciously FM you can't tell the difference between what is real and what is vitual. Give it a try today!"
After owning a dx7s years ago along with the ii and iiFD which i regret selling all of them I was really glad when dexed came out, I now own the original dx7 and its brilliant that it can link together along with the volca fm with good old midi. The dexed creators deserve every accolade.
Probably Dexed needs a little equalization to enhance the bass range.
exactly
Some tape
yes
Amazing!
Dexed is a great synth. I remember when the DX7 came out. It was So different, so cool, so difficult to program :) The fact that you can stack as many as you want in your PC, and for free, is amazing. I finally understand my dad. Kids these days don't know how easy they have it lol.
In some kind of things, yes, we have it cool, but in others.. but, i must say that to have this sort of things, for me, is a biblical gift.
Hi Woody, I rarely comment on YT vids. Just wanted to let you know I subscribed because of your great vids on these awesome retro synths and for the Dexed VST comparison in particular. I'm an 80s kid and am getting back into noodling around on some synthwavey stuff for fun. Getting stuck into Dexed now. Thanks for the inspiration boost and keep up the great work! Cheers
glad you dig the channel, thx for the sub, cheers and good luck with the hobby!
In the Kidsongs song "I Got Wheels", the Yamaha DX7 internal patches "Electric Piano 1" and "Bass 1" and Roland Juno-106 patch "Brass" were heard.
your playing skills are great and this makes any sound comes alive . i enjoy just listening you playing
awesome to hear this feedback, big thx
So very close - I listened on headphones very carefully, and Dexed (for the price) certainly can't be beat! Unfortunately, what adds to to the complication in evaluating them side by side is that in Woody's demos the Dexed output is just slightly quieter than the DX7's output, which will make the DX-7 sound more "lively", and Dexed more "thin" and set back in the mix. If they were at exactly the same level, I think the comparison would have been closer. Also, if instead of playing live he had played a Midi file into each, that would have eliminated slight differences in playing. When I get my own Dexed virtual synth into my mixing panel, I'll add effects and probably an equalizer to sweeten the whole thing. As to whether it's a "perfect" emulation, to my ears it's wonderful, easy to work with, DEAD-easy to edit (compared to working directly with the DX-7's multi-function buttons) plus it's compatible with all the DX-7 SYX files one could want to scrape out of the web. For the Nth degree of warmth (as far as the DX-7 can be said to be warm (maybe arguably warmer than Dexed), one could always create a patch in Dexed, save it as a .syx and send it down to the DX-7. Lastly, the way that old PCs powerful enough to run Dexed are dirt cheap these days, one could build up a cheap stack of small form-factor desktops running Dexed (and other virtual synths) and save the cost of trying to find a TX-816. Well done to whoever created Dexed, they have reinvigorated interest in FM synthesis for a whole new generation.
thx for the comment! yeah, it's real important to match the levels, but it's harder than you think to get the same perceived volume. i use my ears and vu meter, but due to differences in frequency spectrum between the two, the volume can sound different depending on what system you are listening too. people tend to prefer loudness so it's something i pay attention to when mixing these comparisons. the playing is identical on dexed as I recorded the midi as i played the dx7, then played midi into dexed :) agree with all your praise about the plugin :)
I think also there's bound to be a different in perception re: loudness since your DX-7 is a Mk1 model (for which midi velocity 100 is the absolute max) whereas Dexed most likely adheres to the current MIDI standard where 127 is the absolute max, so a Mk1 DX-7 should sound 127/100 (multiplied by your playing velocity) more "live".
Effectively you'd have to strike the keys 27% more aggressively in DEXED for the filters to open up to the same extent as they do on a DX-7 Mk1.
I'm sure I'd encounter that if I loaded a voice designed for a Mk1 into my DX7IID - I'd likely need to "relax" the filter and other velocity-tracked values to allow them to track all the way to 127 rather than stopping/maxing out their effect when played at veloicity of 100, so they don't stop their effect there but continue to track all the way to the DX7II's real max of velocity=127.
I love your videos - you're dead keen and your enthusiasm is infectious.... and we both live in cold/cool Northern countries (Canada for me, Sweden for you). Cheers mate!
Hey, I love your videos, thanks for all the information and entertainment! Do you think the brighter dx7ii would sound more similar to the dexed plugin? I wonder how much of the sound difference comes down to the DACs in either device.
I've worked with the original DX7, DX7IIfd, SY and TG77, and now Dexed. They all sound 'slightly' different with the same patch loaded, but its so subtle as to be a non-issue. Working with Dexed has been a blast to the past and a joy 👍
I use both, depending on how much space I have. I've recorded stuff with Dexed and then gone back over with the DX7, and there's little difference. You'd only notice any minute differences in a direct head to head, and even then it's so subtle.
I own both the real DX7 and the VST one. Both are fantastic. Love them
Dexed is extremely close for most patches, although there's a few where you can hear a bit of difference. Still, if it was a blind test, I don' think most people could tell reliably.
I wonder if a bit-cruncher would make a difference? It would be easy to dial back Dexed's fidelity to 12-bit and that might make it grittier, dirtier and closer to the Mk1 original.
in the vst's settings, theres an option to make it to emulate the sound of the 12-bit mark 1's sound engine, and it makes it sound much closer to the original
Thank you Woody! While there will always be differences this is an excellent emulation overall. I really enjoy your yt videos as they are very educational. Best of luck to you!
thanks goaway, couldn't agree more!
"Do They Know It's Christmas?"
Loved it!
I got Dexed purely because I wanted that tubular bell preset. I've loved that sound since I first heard it in the '80s. Used it, too, in a recent composition!
I've been searching for that for a long time, because I wanted that low "BONG" from the Top Gun anthem.
And god damn here it is, and for free?! I thought I was going to have to spend over a hundred on the native instruments plugin.
Watching this you realise how mammoth an impact the DX had.
I assume these are not presets that come with Dexed? I would love to get these sounds but I have no clue how to program this beast, so have been searching for some nice presets to download! Amazing VST!
Man your playing is superb and those tones
thanks paul, really made my day!
Thank you Woody! greetings from Brazil!
I found a soft brass, perfect for Wish You Were Here-Pink Floyd
Amazing how the VST is almost similar to the DX7 !!!
dexed was my favorite plug in before i even bothered to check what was a DX7.
Excellent comparison!! DEXED does the job, no doubt about it, but...there's something missing from the original. (I'm not a purist, I intensively use VSTs), maybe the 12 bit thang, and the fact that the original only reached 100 on velocity, and the plugin can make sounds brighter, passing this threshold...anyway, as good or even better than comparing an Oberheim with the OPXII VST. :)
Cheers.
I'd like to hear Dexed bit reduced and run out through some external analog gear and a low pass filter. And then I note that free is not so free when one adds the computer and the rack gear. Happy medium? Experiment and program in Dexed, play on the DX7. :)
Perhaps also the age of the electronics affect that. Maybe the Dexed is a "perfect" DX7 with pristine "DACs"
No new DX ever sounded that clean I do think it's part of the original design, it's funny how limitations and flaws sometimes add to the sound.
It is not just the number of bits, there is also the architecture of the DACs. Modern DACs use over-sampling to reconstruct the waveforms and get rid of "junk" in the high frequencies. They are also much more linear than the old direct conversion tech. I wonder if there is also a sample rate difference.
I have original DX7, DX7 II FD, TX802, Dexed and DX7 V. Although I did not do a detailed (awesome like Woody) comparison I can tell you that there is quite a bit of dirt, noise, and I guess "digital warmth" coming from the original hardware components. I don't think any software or hardware manufacturer is really going to try recreate that today, at least not to that extent. The software is close enough in most cases, and convenient to have on your laptop. That said, I'm not getting rid of the old hardware boxes ;-)
If you can and if you are really into DX and FM, try to find at least one DX7 in a decent shape for a good price.
I tried out Dexed myself today and have to say quite impressed. I have a TX7 with some presets I made years ago and they sound a lot more like the TX in Dexed than the conversion to FM8, which I think doesn't quite get the envelopes right. Theres also a slightly more woody less hifi sound in dexed which is nearer to the DX than FM8 and even any of the later DX's which polished up the FM a bit. Possibly in FM8 they didn't model the 8bit oscillators and dac in a bid to cater for all the more modern 6op patches ?
any chance to get the .sys presets used in this demo?
man, this demo is very helpful. thanks!!!
Other than some slight audio things like maybe volume or equalizer settings, they sound extremely similar to me. Maybe it's my ears, maybe it's my speakers but they sound VERY close to one another to me.
Please does anyone know from which cartridge the Piano 2 patch at 1:20 is from?
I have this presets collection everybody seems to have. Now how am I gonna find out which preset is which iconic sound?
i was waiting for something like this. thanks a lot!
Nice mix of tunage... went back to my childhood! :) I actually referenced this video for me getting an actual DX7IIFD for myself. Dexed is totally awesome if you don't want the hardware. I happen to like the hardware. First keyboard I ever recorded with. Thanks for the video!
could you PLEASE please share these patches or at least their locations? especially the one at 1:20 :O
vouchhh
I know it’s 2 years late but at 1:20 it’s preset 13 on the dx7 called guitar 2
@@jacoblee8181 I think Mesa meant Dexxed, there's no pre-installed cartridges when you install the plugin. It's just a completely empty plugin with 0 presets
@@ItsPonz It's possible to find it on some of the patches out there
Prepare yourselves for those elitist preaching how Dexed is not even close to the DX7. When THEY wouldnt even tell which is which in a mix. Things to remember: the original DX keyboard only recognized velocity up to 100. Dexed may be sounding brighter because the velocity is opening up the operator levels higher(brighter) than the DX7. Its also an extremely close...VERY close emulation that is FREE. The only one who could tell Dexed from a DX7 in a mix is Brian Eno. That is all.
i have a track using dexed coming out soon, and had i claimed it was a dx7 nobody would have questioned it. but those elitest do have a point, as a solo synth it does pack more power, dirt and warmth (you don't often hear that in the same sentence as dx7) than the vst. but making tracks with dexed is so much quicker and easier than with hardware, it's a tradeoff i'm willing to make!
john heath im not trying to be that guy, but i gotta say.. as far as the presets go i agree, dexed is satisfying enough. They are missing the raw dx edge, but they're as good as the dx7 if you want that classic sound. Sound design wise, ive owned a dx7 for ages and constantly compared it with fm7 fm8 px7 and one thing is for sure when you get serious into programming you just find certain "sweet spots" (ratios i guess) which just sound so much better on the dx7
The Dexed does sound thinner and it's not the velocity I'd say since the expression would be a lot different if you think about it, I'd say max velocity is maybe 100 on the old DX7 so 100=127 this means you get fewer steps ie. lower resolution.
KUPHSER
Agreed. Ive used the PX7. And some great sounds can be had on it. And its more straight forward to see how FM works. But having the hardware classic in front of you. Leads to spontaneous inspiration. That you just cannot replace.
a DX7 costs money. if people prefer it enough to shell out cash, then maybe they have a reason. maybe it's like the difference between getting take out and dining out. same food, sleightly different experience. Why do "they" bother you? I have dexed, and after seeing this video, I actually want an original DX7. I'd play with it, service it, and if I got tired of it, pass it on to someone else who finds the object fun to play with. I'm visiting a friend who has an RX5 drum machine and it's provocative and puzzling. These machines seem to taunt us. "Can you figure us out or are you stupid?" These hardware machines and their emulations are miles apart in terms of the way that they command human brain and body processing times. Both have their virtues. There are more than one way to see these things than the data sheet.
Now I have the DX7 in GarageBand. Great stuff. Thanks!
After I discovered Dexed, I dumped my FM7 and maybe that's why Native Instruments dumped it by its own as well. There is yet a slight difference between the two, specially on E.PIANO which on the DX7 sounds with more presence. Maybe it's a mix between narrower bandwidth from the amplifiers and even a bit of distortion. Nevertheless the sound coming from the DX7 is very nice and then maybe our ear memory from the tons of tunes that had the E.PIANO makes us feel biased to that exact match coming from the real thing.
The most striking difference to me seems the analog filter on the DX7s (I've heard they have one), and it's emulation having a slightly higher cutoff(?) or just the fact that it's pretty darn difficult to properly emulate your average analog resonant filter in the computer domain (I'm studying Electronic Engineering and Digital Signal Processing is a big part of our curriculum). Or maybe it's something about the post-processing effects (reverb or sth). Apart from that, it's spot on and still seems very fun to play with.
When you have to wonder if you are really hearing a difference, I suppose then that it doesn't matter. I owned and still do, a DX7, still works just fine thank you. To my ear, and this is slight, but it seems the DX7 has a slightly warmer or fuller sound. The DEXED is slightly thinner with more edge. But this is so very slight. In a mix there would be very few that could pick out the real deal from the emulation. Whoever did this did a very good job indeed. But then, there's the ease of use which the emulation wins hands down. Just my two cents worth, but of course what with all the inflation we are experiencing, two cents won't buy much anymore lol!
i remember playing on the dx7 in music class back in 83
You can tell the difference in comparison, but in a mix it would be difficult to tell unless it was the only instrument being played.
I am so gratefull that there are some good people that make this kind of stuff free for us. It doesn't sound exactly the same but c'mon it's a FREE Digital representation of the original. And it sounds very good.
omar, what's a free representation, what are you referring to?
Woody Piano Shack Not that they made the sounds up. Freeware as in you don't have to pay for the plug-in.... Representation because it's digital you know 1s and 0s
Close enough honestly, I'm certainly happy with it
Thanks for the compare and all your videos!
cheers Dan, thanks for the encouragement
The tuning is different between them. I think the Dexed version might be flatter Anyone else able to hear this?
FOCtv i was thinking the same! and lacks just a bit of midrange definition
FOCtv yes Dexed is definitely a bit flat relative to DX7 in this video. It is a bit jarring when you hear one after the other
Yes! You can hear it clearly on Toto - Africa.
I think it’s because the DX7 is tuned up a bit
2:48 - these two are the most noticeable for me. I agree there’s a flatness to the VST. Outside of the comparison I’d find it super hard to distinguish the two. One advantage of Dexed is probably the lack of self noise that most DX7s now have with age, however I think the noise can also be used as additional authenticity in tracks. (Or at the very least gated out during the silences)
Got both, use both. I primarily use Dexed to program patches to send to the hardware. They sound almost identical in most applications, but there are some areas where the DX7 performs better, at least as far as I'm concerned.
Plus the DX7 allows portmanteau. I've spent hours looking over Dexed to find that feature.
I definitely hear a difference on the brass. The VST version sounds like the filter is quite a bit brighter. Might just be that the patch wasn't quite fine tuned and maybe if you lower the filter freq it will sound closer.
Only the VST even HAS a filter. The first few FM synths famously lacked any filter, believing that their more complex envelopes and algorithms could make up for it.
Hey Woody! Great video! How can we get ahold of these presets? They're fantastic! :)
The brass at 0:48 is incredibly 80s, absolutely lovely! 😄
Jeez woody you're some player. Deadly stuff.
Excellent! The problem is how to get these very similar sounds in DEXED.
I really enjoyed this video. Your playing is very good too.
i appreciate the comment, thx
Excellent, wish you gave a list of patches used, I've got 3000 to wade through...
i'm not sure if they're custom patches, but he shows the vst and it says it at the top of the window
Anyone happy to make a list of the songs played?
Real close, Many differences fixed with EQ- the DX7 has more low end on several patches, pretty obvious here. none the less, sold my DX7 ages ago. Moved on to SY77, then SY99, then XS8, then M08 and never looked back- no nostalgia here as the new keyboards cover the old sounds more than adequately.
Hi, this is a fantastic demo. Are these presets available open-source anyway?
thanks, doubt they are open source but DX7 presets are available for download all over the net!
Had this on in the background and actually cracked up with the snippet from “Also sprach Zarathustra.” Not the riff I expected out of a DX7
Is that opening riff "Ghostbusters" or "I Want A New Drug"?
Yes.
@@spookypen No
I think it was “Ghostbusters“. It’s all in the left hand.
Huey isn’t allowed to talk about that.
Anyone know the name of the song at 1:17?
What A Fool Believes? ;)
I'd probably run the VST through some tape saturation plugin (FerricTDS is free as well) and it should help to create that full sound.
Very nice comparison.
Where can I download the "e.piano 1" sound for the Dexed?
I bought mine in 1984 at Sam Ash on 48th street... still works just fine! ;)
Does anyone know what CART this is from or is this the stock DX cart?
Excellent ! regardless of any criticism you can't argue with FREE, also surprised Arturia came so late to the FM party.
whats the song at 1:26 ?
HEYYYY it's The Doobie Brothers - What A Fool Believes
I've been searching for it for *MONTHS*, just stumbled upon it today
It would be Great if there was a List for all the Songs that you have Played!
Yeah, agreed.
@@GrijzePilion when i saw the 1 reply i thought it was the list
@@loserfaceproductions same
Both sound awesome. What song is the fourth riff from (the one played on that nice spiky Wurlitzer type patch)? I particularly like that one. Great video!
Holy Crap - Technology is unbelievable - Sometimes we don't even realize it.
Seriously. I was just thinking about that the other day.
This is awesome, how about a playlist?
Great video man! & fellow Howard Jone's lover (and The Stranglers) .... A younger me would have perhapes went for the plug-in for being cleaner and better sn ratio ... But now I love the 'whole' part of the sound being 100% original with the higher noise floor and digital aliasing girth.
i find the main advantage of plugin is much easier to work with when composing tracks, otherwise you are messing around with midi and audio cables and interfaces. glad you like the video and my taste in music :)
Very close, but not 100%.
A little bit of EQ and maybe some subtle tube saturation would get it closer i think.
absolutely! im blown away by it.
Through my monitors the DEXED made bright tones with HF content sound duller up the high end of the keyboard.
But still a creditable facsimile.
Whether that had to do with the different processing, bits and bobs etc, I couldn't say.
great video. You should of did the test blind just to show people they wouldn't know the difference between the 2.
thanks, interesting idea! something for the future maybe!
@@WoodyPianoShack Maybe repeat the video but play the sound of Dexed when you show the DX7 and vis-versa and see how many spot the switch :)
Does anybody else have trouble with DexEd constantly losing the patch setting and resetting to the default patch?
Yes, this is amazingly close. Cheers! S
great thanks,i have been looking for a test like this since your video about dexed.
i wonder if the this difference was not caused by the max velocity response (100 for the dx7 and 127 for dexed)
yeah, could be. i recorded the midi from the dx and re-played into the vst.
Well, I hear the plugin a little more opaque, and the DX7 sounds brighter and shiny, but you can solve it using the default Reaper EQ.
DX7 é um computador antigo que faz cálculos. E o vst é um plugin pra um computador moderno fazer os mesmos cálculos. A única diferença de qualidade se deve ao circuito analógico do DX7 ser diferente do circuito analógico de um computador moderno. Ou seja, a única diferença é na equalização.
Nice video! I love Dexed. I have a Yamaha TX802 and can use Dexed on the go to create and modify patches and then send them to the 802. Highly recommend this plugin.
They sound a bit different indeed, the question is.. is it worth getting a DX7 for that difference in sound? If programming a DX7 would be easy maybe, just maybe yes, but being almost impossible to program, i think I would go with Dexed, not only for price but also programability
.
i eventually chose the software route, but really enjoyed my time with the dx7. they are cheap and easy to find, so i would still recommend trying out the real thing, it's a real pleasure to play.
Many thanks! I've just discovered your channel and love it! Keep up the great stuff. I feel inspired to get a DX7, had one some time ago and really loved its sound!
Really close in my opinion! Close enough for me at least. I will continue using this plugin for my music as always :). If the plugin sounds so close, why would I spend some money for the real thing, maybe that's just me. Yes I hear the difference, the plugin sounds a bit thinner then the DX7, but if you put it in a mix, you wouldn't even tell the different.
By the way Woody, I have LOADS of sysex (DX7 Carts) to use for Dexed, even the very rare Toto cart! The owner of the original cart very kindly sent me the sysex files of those cartridges. I'm a big Toto fan, so that was AWESOME for me! If you want a bucket load of sysex patches to use or play around with, I'll send it to you :).
yeah, i have a track ready to publish made entirely with dexed, hope you like it!
Can't wait to hear it!
Xavier, sounds like those carts would be incredible, are you willing to share them with others?
Sure no problem :). Here is the link: www.sendspace.com/file/hypsl3
The sysex's you see when you first open the zip file, those are my personal favorites. It has the factory presets, Toto presets, TX7 presets and more. Enjoy!
thank you very much
whats the name of the song at 1:15? it feels so familiar
What's the song at 1:15?
I wonder if the output interpolation settings of the DAW, or interpolation in the vst-to-wav rendering step in the DAW is what effects the sound.
Most of the difference I hear is in the envelops