Should You Unplug Someone Else’s EV If They’ve Completed Charging? | Episode 260
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- Опубликовано: 28 сен 2024
- To plug or not unplug? That is the question. Join Francie, Kyle, Max, Jordan, and Jose from @riviantrackr as they talk about the electric vehicle charging debate of whether or not you should unplug someone else’s EV if they are done charging.
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Well, the proper etiquette is to unplug and move your car when it’s finished charging. The unplugging is just the reaction to the lack of this etiquette.
There is no etiquette. There must be signage, late fees and education.
@@ScubaSteveCanadaI agree with overcharging fees. I wouldn’t want someone if they unplug my charger or vice versa. If I can charged, 10$ overcharge fee then I deserve it
@verynick The problem is, you paying idle fee, and the company receiving that money does nothing to help the person that lost his valuable time waiting for you to recover that value.
That person unplugging you, helps him not lose time. Helps you avoid paying the fee and the company still get paid for selling power to both of you.
Unplugging seems like a much more sensible option. Why would you want to inflict pain on a stranger (making him wait) when you could benefit from not doing it?
I agree that unplugging is the more sensible option, but the situation is ripe for violence. In today’s world, the risk of personal injury is far too great. People are armed.
@@loriallen67 true but keep in mind the violence happens because we are not meeting the unreasonable expectations of a few bullies. Is it better to set policy and SOPs to meet their expectations or risk a few injuries to adjust those expectations to a better overall practice? If they see majority do it and it is an accepted practice, it probably won't result in violence. The transition is the difficult period.
I wouldn’t mind if someone unplugged my car if I was fully charged.
Me either as long as they are respectful, though a lot of people might feel violated, they treat an vehicle as an extension of themselves. If that bothers someone thought hey shouldn't leave it there after a full charge. We really just need a couple DCFC stalls with high idle fees and then a bunch of cheap Level 2 chargers.
Agree
Big flashing green light like supermarket self checkout to tell you that the charger is free. The light comes on after charging is complete. Sign that says that "Anyone can unplug any vehicle that has a green flashing light." If you don't want someone else unplugging your car then make sure you come back before charging is complete.
For fake sessions, absolutely remove cable, especially DCFC.For cars with a cable in car but no active charge session and owners faked a session to get a parking spot, I see no etiquette issues to remove plug. I have encountered this twice. Owner in this case is not paying anything but is actively blocking others from getting access to a sparse public resource.
Each charger should be equipped with a camera, a flashing light, a siren and a bazooka. If a vehicle is detected but not charging, take a photo first for a jackass hall of fame competition. After 5 minutes the flashing light comes on, another 5 the siren and next....... you get my drift.
As you can tell, I am not a big fan of supercharger setup where you can not tell creeps from the nice guys.
@@Tooradjsimple, just have the charger communicate and start the charge! It’s the way teslas do it
I have always been cautious to not unplug someone. But I have in the past when the situation warranted it. The one time was at hotel with a single lvl2 charger, I arrived and parked next to a bolt that was already at 100% at about 6pm. I started by leaving a note asking if they could share the charger. I then asked the front desk at about 8:30ish if they could inform the owner but were unwilling. At 11pm I just unplugged them so I could charge overnight and not detour 30+mins to the supercharger that also would have cost me money and more time to charge as the hotel charger was free. The next day watched him on sentry at about 7am return to his car and they didn't seem to care that I unplugged him. I also left a note on my windshield that they could unplug me at 6:30am if needed. They never even read it.
Some people just don't care. It's just them in their little world of NPCs.
Sounds like you did the right thing! Why would they say no if they were unwilling to do it themselves. Also too bad the hotel can’t say to owners “If another EV user needs to use the charger they have the right to unplug the FREE level 2 charger”. Any hotel/motel owners feel free to use my verbiage!
If it's completed charging and you need to charge why the hell not
Is the potential "charger rage" worth it?
It is the charge company being harmed, they need to handle it.
One doesn't have right to charge.
Exactly. If a gas car parked and blocked a pump, there would be no hesitation for another user to use the pump.
If you can use the cable to charge and there are no other spots available, unplugging, save the owner idle fees, and save you time.
On the other hand, if you can not use the cable or other spots available, unplugging is damaging to the company by taking away the idle fee revenue and robs the owner of a lesson they should be learning.
@Tooradj agreed, but I think they're really only discussing unplugging another vehicle so you can use the charger when another plug is unavailable.
@@Tooradj if you unplug someone, you may spare them the idling fees but cost them a worse parking ticket which you may inherit if they got you on camera.
I am in the same mindset as Kyle. Either move on to another charger or just wait for them to come back to their car and maybe try to politely educate them on ettiquette. While I would not personally care if someone unplugged my car once it completed its charge other will care and we live in a time where where people do not need a lot provocation to pull a gun and use it. Getting beat up or shot isn't worth it. Perhaps while we are waiting on the infrastructure to improve drivers of EVs that do not lock the CCs charger could be more forward thinking and leave a note on their car window that says it is ok to unplug their car if they are not back before the charging is complete that might help although it doesn't necessarily solve the problem of the cable potentially not being long enough to reach the car that needs to charge. This is why I tend to limit my time away from the car while charging to 10-15 minutes, especially if the only stall open when I arrived is a 350kw or a chademo spot since my Bolt can't fully utilize the 350 and I don't want to be that jerk lol.
But if you are charging to 100% in a Bolt and have to wait another 2 hours ... what then?
My car has a button that automatically unlocks the cable when charging is finished, or keeps it locked in place by default... Specifically so that when at home you can keep your cable in place (especially if using an EVSE) so it doesn't walk away on you, but when at a public charger you can keep your doors locked but automatically release the cable when finished.
It would be nice if car manufacturers would have some type of indicator near the charge port... Like a light that says "charging complete, OK to remove cable".
I had unplugged a completed BMW at a 8 unit EA location that was 100% busy. I did park in front of the car but of course sat in the car. Also I took a photo of the completed chargers screen before unplugging him.
Also at my workplace we have L2 charging that we have etiquette to unplug completed cars and plug in another car with port open. If people don’t like people touching their cars they need not use the chargers at my workplace.
At a large shopping mall in SW Florida, Tesla installed 16 SCs plus 16 destination J1772 chargers. If you want to spend 1-2 hours in the mall, their 9 kW chargers are excellent to avoid idle fees.
Initially, the destination chargers were only 2kW and no one used them. Once increase to 9k, they got far more use.
I was level 2 charging while skiing one time and another driver unplugged my car while mine was still actively charging. I have a tesla but was on an adapter. The charge cable for his spot had been damaged previously. The app notified me so I went down to the car and unplugged his and plugged mine back in. I also got an adapter lock to prevent this in the future.
Idle fees need to be scalable instead of a flat one based on the how busy that charging location is at that time of day. If only one car is charging, the standard idle fee applies ($1.00 per minute after grace period), if the station is full, go ahead and charge $5 per minute .
I drove an EV for 8 years. Recently changed to a PHEV. So many problems melt away. Still charge at home, have enough EV range for usual daily needs. 600 mile range = Zero range issues. Don't need public charging but can use if convenient. No required waiting. 8x less use of rare and flammable battery materials. Less impact from battery degradation. Slightly more maintenance. Similar vehicle cost. Larger service network. Battery replacement and upgrades much cheaper and easier, aftermarket batteries common. Handles cold weather better. Fewer emergency issues with insufficient energy. Vastly more energy sources available for refill. Charge times short and less energy required. Fast charging and infrastructure not required. Still learning about the many issues and limitations that were affecting life with an EV. Enjoying the PHEV flexibility and high level preparedness for the variability of life.
MX was L2 charging at 1 of only 4 chargers at an entire ski resort - left it plugged in for over 3 days. Guy pulled in same time as me to use the 1 next to it- he unplugged the MX so we could both charge. If you know the charger is being misused - 100% u can unplug it
I blocked an ICE BMW when desperate for a charge (8 years ago). Blocking was fully justified and security guard came and gave BMW a ticket.
This question always confused me until I realised J1772 was different. A type-2 plug has the locking mechanism in the *vehicle*, so you can't just pull the plug out. The vehicle has to let go of it.
Equip fast-charging stations with 4x as many cables as there are ac-dc converters, let people connect to those cables and register their payment details to get in queue, then let switchgear cycle through the queue. No fretting about people hogging any particular spot for 30min more than necessary.
Until and if, we have enough charge stations. The price you pay for getting you car to 90 percent should double. So 15.00 is now 30.00 at 91 percent, if you don't unplug and move on, on a busy station. And so free vw's turns to 15.00 over 90 percent.
Or charge more per kwh (5 buck a kwh) for topping off the charge, because it's slow... Make it too expensive to get that last 10 percent.
I am an id.4 owner that stops charging at 80% and has my car set to unlock at completed charging. Anyone is more than welcome to take my charging cable once I am done charging, just be respectful of my beautiful red pain job :). The is easy for me to say I charge at home 98% of the time.
About 15 years ago I worked at a company that had a row of Blink chargers, and we used to print out and laminate these little cards that would go around the evse cable, stating whether or not you were okay with other people unplugging you.
The signage needs to reflect that any EV can be unplugged once charging is completed. Same with 400V battery systems plugged into an 800V system. Without this sign, I would be very uncomfortable unplugging someone else's EV. It depends on my needs.
What signage? Signage at the charger? I haven’t ever seen a sign like that on a level 3.
Here in Europe, on Cupra Born (VW group) you can set up a car to unlock the charging port automatically when charging ends. So you can unplug the charger even if you don't have keys.
Excellent point Matt. In the UK one of our Supermarkets, Sainsbury’s, is about to install rapid chargers in all their sites. EVs will be able to charge almost fully whilst the owners shop. This is especially good if they do not have access to home charging.
I expect other supermarkets to follow suit soon.
If an EV owner has no access to home chargers, guess what charger they will use, grocery shopping or not?
USA focus is on DC fast even tho long trips are a minority of use. I'd like to have more L2 & L1 at long term parking, such as job parking.
@@rp9674
More L1 and L2 is definitely good. Although, it's usefulness tends to be very hit or miss. That is, you either happen to live or work at a place that offers L1 or L2 charging or you don't, and if you don't, changing that is usually beyond your control, unless you live in an owner-occupied house. For better or worse, DC fast charging has the nice property that you don't need to depend on your particular landlord or employer to choose install it, you just need somebody to do it within reasonable distance of you.
@@ab-tf5flall levels are needed. Fast for long trips & because there's not enough L1&2, semi-ironically. Ideally DC fast for tripping only, the hardware is more fragile & $$$, more suited for taking turns, L1&2 for mass charging
I have an Ioniq 5 and you can change the settings so the charge port won't unlock until you unlock the car as mentioned. Idk if that's a good idea since someone could try to pull it out regardless. Also I have free charging, and I don't think idle fees apply to free charging. At least I haven't ever seen idle fees, but I also unplug on time.
You have a credit card on file with EA as part of the whole new account process so if they wanted to enforce an idle fee they will on top of your free charging. It's just that not a lot of stations are doing them and I don't see why not to prevent things like this from happening since there aren't so many stations to begin with right now. Once we have like 3-5x the charging structure in the US then this shouldn't be an issue. It's more about having a lot more units at the existing ones vs a new charging location so much. It's less annoying to have to move to a different spot vs having to drive 5 miles or so to the next charging station.
I’m now on “team don’t unplug.” For example on the F-150 Lightning if you don’t know that you have to push the unlock button (therefore touch the car) you could damage the charge port.
“STOPPING CHARGING
Push the coupler unlock button on the light ring.
Press the latch on the charge coupler and remove it from the vehicle charge port.
Note: Do not attempt to remove the charge coupler before you unlock it. Do not use any kind of tool to try and remove a locked charge coupler. Doing so can lead to damage to your vehicle and the charge coupler.”
But count me in for plugging you in for level 2 charging if you park and open your charge port (or leave a note).
Sounds awful, I think I remember this when trying to helping a new Mustang owner on his first charge. I don’t do it, but don’t see why any really good reason that it shouldn’t be made easy to do on all makes and models.
If I’m finished note FINISHED! Then yeah take out my cable and use the station!
We have free charging at work. One charger that splits power with two cords. We unplug and plug each other’s cars when a car is done or when we are done. But the Audi’s lock the cord to the vehicle so some of the drivers aren’t happy when the Audi’s are done and they can’t remove the cord. We can’t leave work to go unplug our cars so this has created a little problem and the dayshift has a charger text chain to speak to each other.
How about having the charging stall sound alarm & or flash bright red light.
Someone needs to write an EV etiquette book
Not directly related, but funny "ooopps" story on my behalf.
I pulled into a set of EA chargers and for some reason, people were charging with the cords kind of weird...
What I mean is that when I pulled into the open spot, the charger next to me was actually charging the car on the other side and stretched... So I had to use the charger that was closer to their car and stretch it to mine..
I start charging and go get some snacks... I'm back in a bit and the vehicle (much larger battery than mine) is still charging, but I have a brain dead moment, walk up to the charger next to my car and hit stop... It stops charging... the other car...
So I restart the other charging session with my account to get them charging again...
Then I stop the proper one and unplug my car...
As I am finishing, the other driver walks up. I do my mean culpa and apologize profusely. Show him I restarted his charging session.
He was good with it and thanked me, but was really surprised that I was able to stop his charge...
As stated this would've been prevented if we had more stations along with high idle fees. If there isn't enough stations then the drivers should be aware of this and be considerate to others. I don't be going shopping for an hour knowing that my car is only going to take 15 mins to charge unless you are planning to come out to move your car latter. People shouldn't need to unplug other people cars if the owner was considerate in the first place. This isn't abour having the right chargers as the right location. All chargers should be upgraded to 350kW eventually if they aren't already.
Also there should be an official queue system within the EV station app if there isn't a physical line present. This could easily be done easily and would take the guessing game out of it especially during the busier weekends or so. Honestly EV stations should've been built like gas stations to begin with. You drive up to charge and stay in your car if possible. If it's gonna take long then sure go out and do something but just be considerate that's all. That could be asking a lot for some people unfortunately.
Ultimately would I unplug someone else's charger? No. Do I care if something else unplugs me? Yes but it will never get to the point for me as I would never be idling like that to begin with.
I unplugged someone once at a LVL2 hotel location. The EVSE charge light was off so they were done. I'd have no way to continue on to get to my destination without it (it was admittedly a risk, but I checked plugshare first). Otherwise I'd have to be a few hours late at least. I maybe could have found a 120V plug, but I don't think that would have been enough.
I charged for a couple hours before falling asleep and then went to plug their car back in. As soon as I woke up I saw their car was gone which was great as I plugged mine in to add a bit more free juice.
I didn't want to mess with their car and I felt a little bad about unplugging but I didn't have much of an option. I also knew they weren't charging anymore so I felt a little less guilty, and I was mindful not to touch their car with anything. It was a chevy bolt so no powered flap or anything to touch.
Don’t touch someone else’s car, first come first serve, leave as soon as you are done… idle fees are the best solution this issue
I had someone stop my charge session then unplug charger from my car while I was away. When I returned to my car I had some words for her, she said she needed to charge and I already had more than 80% soc.
I had a guy at the Tesla charger in Charleston come out and unplug his car to avoid the idle fee and run backin the mellow mushroom. Did. It move his car. Jackass!!
It's full. Public service to save the full ev overage fees.
I think people get upset because they don’t know what percent their car was charged to before it was unplugged.
A lot of small Ca cities offer free level 2 charging at city offices, banks, public areas etc. However to use them you have to get there at 5 am as folks show up with their EV's, plugin, jump in their wives Escalade and drive to work. they come back at 4 or 5 ( mt dash cam ran out of battery the days I tried to film this) and unplug and leave. This is par for the course. Most have cardboard placards that say something like---don't unplug----city employee or something. I have a Honda Clarity PHEV so good luck with free charging. No need to unplug because there's no place to park next to the EV charger. San Dimas doe not care as I have complained!
They should use a parking pad sensor and if it hasn't detected the car moving then continue to charge idle fees even it the cable has been disconnected to prevent people using the spaces.
Or ... I know this is far less expensive to the charging company ... just nail the customer with idle fees they won't forget.
Good idea but I don't need EV companies to spend any extra money for some drivers out there cause guess what they're gonna charge everybody more kW to make up for the cost.
I used to be so focused on getting the 350kw chargers for my Rivian, ive since learned to ev road trip better and now I find myself excited when EA warns me that theyre only giving 50kw, assuming ill have time for dinner, but then i plug in and it shoots right up to 217kw. Too fast!
I constantly get 180KW out of the 150KW Electrify Canada chargers (same company).
I always question what is the firmware setup on the car that is finished charging, my Kona can be selected to unlock or not after charging is completed. It would be embarrassing for me to try to pull the charger and have it locked, both for myself and for the other car. Why would you not have it unlocked after you are finished charging?!
If you set your car to 100% charge and walk away and it’s completed at 100% and you’re nowhere to be found?? That’s fair game you are absolutely getting unplugged if I need a charge and have to get somewhere!! That’s an inconsiderate POS so I say F them!! And if you’re charging to 100% on a public DCFC you’re also a major POS if it’s at a busy station with people waiting. And if you want to “fight me” when you get back that’s your issue not mine!!
The problem is the people leaving their car unattended and fully charged, not the people who have to react to it.
To keep customers happy how about idle fees get applied to the next customer if they plug in within three minutes? Make it worth the inconvenience for the customer left waiting.
If the charging is completed… then move the cable. That is a completely different issue than if the charge is in-progress.
The Ionic 5 has a lock setting.
Because of the chance of fire when charging, the charge ports must be attended by the owner continually during the charge. Just like conventional fuel stations. You stay with the vehicle as it fills.
For now, just wait or move on. Ultimately, the vendors are responsible. They should hide the charge status (as Kyle suggested) and gradually increase idle fees as time passes (for DC chargers only). I also think idle fees should be significantly higher at certain stations such as at 350kw+ stations (that are in high demand), at pull through trailer stations (specialty use), and ADA stations (where someone who needs it may have no other option).
Agree with Max - need “Urban superchargers” at malls and big box stores. 150kw+ chargers at gas stations and Starbucks.
I have no issues for someone to unplug my car if it's fully charred to plug theirs in, I would feel really bad if I got back to my car and it was fully charged and some else was waiting to charge. For people ready to say I shouldn't leave me car at the charger if it's fully charged , well unfortunately sometimes the toilet breaks are extended for uncontrolled reasons and there's a lot of reasons for someone to be delayed to get back to their car, that's why Tesla give you 10 minutes ... All cars/chargers should unlock automatically when the charging is complete so people can unplug ! But you can always put a sign on your windscreen stating please unplug me if I'm full :-)
Nothing is more rude than leaving your car sitting there fully charged and holding a charger. Leave a note and be careful, but a rude charger should not be able to be rude again by getting in someone’s face that wants to use the charger because why: They need to charge.
I am visiting South Korea and a large percentage of people have a sticker on their dash visible to anyone with their phone number on it. Be it ICE or eV type.
I'd be wondering how long that car had been sitting there since it can take hours to all day/night to charge from 90-100% (which you shouldn't be doing anyway, unless you're on a road trip)
I went to my usual rapid charger and found it ostensibly blocked by someone who's charge had finished. I seriously contemplated unplugging it but the chap was on his way. He unplugged after a friendly chat and drove off. I plugged in and fortunately stayed in the car to do some work because ten minutes later the charge stopped for no reason. If I'd unplugged the chaps car and he'd driven off but realised he didn't have the amount of charge he'd expected I could have been in serious bother. (Well, I'm in the uk so maybe not that serious🤔) In retrospect the screen had the wrong message on it when it cut out so I'm guessing the poor bloke only had a little charge. I was able to move to the other rapid charger and get enough juice.
Amazing video. I agree with suggestions given by Max and points made by Jordan. Amazing point brought up by Kyle. This is a very good topic to discuss Francie. Thank you so much for bringing this topic Jose and Francie.
Kyle's opinion assumes that he has sufficient range to reach another station, would you unplug if you were unable to travel to another charger?
Yes.
If my car is at 100% and someone needs to charge, I have no problem with someone unplugging my car to charge their vehicle--as long as the cable can be safely removed, my charging session has been completed (so that the next person doesn't charge on my account!) and they do not damage my car.
It benefited the unplugger by saving them idle fees and benefited the unplugee because they used it to charge their own car, instead of having to wait. It is a good thing that EV owners are probably more chill than ICE drivers.
USA needs to pull their head out of their butt and stop putting in charging networks in the wrong places! Put slow chargers at grocery stores hotels and shopping centers put fast chargers at rest stops and convenience stores!
Well, this makes me happy that I held off from going EV when i got a new vehicle a year ago. The infrastructure just isn't up to snuff. Once that changes, I'll reconsider...I don't hate EVs.
A cable will be locked to the car as long as the car is locked even if its done charging I'm pretty sure.
At least my e-Golf keep the cable locked even if its done.
Is this a CCS1 thing where the cable can be unplugged? Not going to work with CCS2 at least.
Now to be honest, a completed charge should be show on the charger and the car should also release the cable. At least if the charger have two parking lots able to use it.
One of the larger CPOs here in Norway have a minute fee on top above 80%, its around 6 USD/hour converted.
Interesting. My e-Golf will release the CCS2 plug when DC charging completes (but not with AC charging.)
I think, they would start paying idle fees anyway so just take it and use if you need it. But if you don't NEED it, don't touch it.
Imagine if someone did that to your vehicle at a gas station??? Just saying. Patience is a virtue.
How about this: If the charger is already charging idle fees to the fullly charged, unattended vehicle, then unplugging it should be 100% acceptable.
Otherwise, what's the idle timer showing? Over 5 minutes, maybe wait a minute to see if the other driver is on the way. If the car stops charging while you're looking at it, give it 5 minutes, then proceed.
That's how I see it, at least.
all charging stations should be set up like gas stations. 3 or 4 (or more) islands, 4 chargers per island (so you can pull in whichever one accommodates your port) and a convenience store. instead of having 10,000 apps just go into the store say hey i want 20 bucks at station such and such plug in charge and go
It should be just fine as long as you take over the payment
I think at a DC fast charger I think the owner charging SHOULD HAVE unplugged after 80% but why be made if your car was at 100% and you weren’t there to unplug it when you were done? I’d think of it as a favor.
I unplugged a volt at the airport (Dia) who wasn't even parked in the ev spot but stretched the cable to reach his volt. Didn't even feel bad about it. Even if they were parked in an ev spot hybrids shouldn't be taking up the limited chargers
My take on idle fees are that idle fees should increase as the length of time goes on. I get having a short grace period of 5-10minutes, then it should be $1/minute, then after a total of 30 minutes it should then increase to $5/minutes. Then at 60 minutes total idle it should go to $10/minute.
And the cost should be retroactive to the start of the idle time. So if you’re idle for 61 minutes, it should cost you $610. If you are idle for 35 minutes it should cost you $175. If you are idle for 15 minutes it should be $15. You lose the grace period once you exceed the grace period.
Your take is not realistic and is missing a key point. From the point of the user, what you said make complete sense, 100%. However, it is the charge point operator that sets up the facility as a profit making business, not you. As such, their goal is to maximize profit. So, if there are no idle fees, then it would be bad because they lose out to potential customers that cannot charge and thus lead to loss of revenue. However, if the idle fees are too onerous, then it would discourage potential people who are willing to pay the idle fees and thus also lead to loss of revenue. You see, a charge point operator does not have to care if a car is idling at the spot as long as they can make money equivalent to or more than another potential customer using the spot. So, it should be up to the charge point operator to decide, taking into considerations all factors.
@@callistoscali4344 I never said it was up to me, I said it was my take, but the only way to get people to not idle is to hit them in the wallet.
CPO’s want people charging. If they allow people to idle and people do then customers will stop using their stations and eventually they’ll have no customers. Making it a good charging experience is what encourages return use.
It depends on how much time you have to hang around.
Why does every RUclips video about a possible tense situation result in all the cowboys feeling like they need to post that they are packing 😂🤣😂. Never fails.
A problem that only people with more money than brains will suffer from.
I think that they do need to introduce Idol fees even if they are free for charging once they are complete charging the idol fees can be used to add more Chargers in the near future
I saw a woman at my office come out and unplug the level 2 charger shes was using so she wouldnt get parking fees and she left her car blocking the spot and went back inside. Its times like that I wish I had a Cyber Truck and and a tow chain 🤬
Absolutely. Here they unplug you even if you aren't finished charging. The cords are too long on Level 2's.
Often you can't remove the plug unless the car is unlocked, as many brands of car have a locking pin.
Welcome to the "charger rage"!
One wouldn't push someone's car off a pump. Just wait or go to next charger/pump.
If it’s completed charging, unplug them. Also, they may have saved them idle fees
For free EV BYOC wall charger, can i unplug the cable from the charger end and plug my own cable in to charge after the other car is fully charged? I will leave the car side remain plugged in
Lol, another charger... if I'm stopping with a leaf... I'm desperate 😂
You’re only touching the charger. Not the persons car. At work we have a ChargePoint level 2 charger. People sit there full all day with their Volts or Jeep 4xE which is wrong. I’m unplugging them if I’m low and can use the charge.
A lot of good points to not unplug, but I'm going to unplug. It's the risk someone takes for leaving their car unattended and fully charged. The chance of some kind of damage from someone unplugging their car is exceptionally small.
Someone may get upset but that's their problem. I'll remain calm and polite.
I’d be afraid of any damage as a result of you unplugging the charger even if the damage was in the computer module? It’s not worth going to court to argue that case. They could blame the damage from a voltage spike from unplugging it improperly.
Think it is very clear , do not touch someone else car .
Please people, don't mess with people's property, especially here in Texas, everyone is packing heat. Avoid confrontation at all cost. Self preservation is better than an act of aggression. Let's not turn road rage into charging rage. Charging station is supposed to be a peace and calm space where people follow proper etiquette. Charge to 80% and move, if you're a bolt owner, chage at home 😂😂😂😂😂, not just a joke. Charging to 100% at Dc fast charger should be restricted or submitted to a higher fee. It takes insanely too long.
Bolt owners have just as much right as anyone else. I see this type of fast charging elitism crap happening more and more. Taycan owners are going to feel like most ev's should charge at home, and on and on as technology improves. This issue is a need for more infrastructure, it has nothing to do with the vehicles.
@@patrick7228 No elitism here. I was just joking. Of course bolt owners have just as much rights as everyone else hog the chargers, 😂😂😂😂
If you unplug my car or any other car, gently close the orange cover and main cover. Yeah, that would be touching the car, but sealing it.
This assumes you know what you’re doing
Proper etiquette is to return to your vehicle by the time it is fully charged. If you cannot do that, expect someone who needs the charger to take it.
This is why we need more AC chargers and lower wattage DC chargers in parking areas.
Quoting unofficial etiquette is so quaint in 2024. If etiquette still happened there would be no road rage.
So if there were high idle fees after 5 minutes, at least people waiting would have some pleasure in knowing they are a ton of money to the charging network. That might reduce the rage. :D
it will not help the anxiety if you are in an automobile that will not have the power to move itself until you start plugging it into your own car...
Yasss more money for our corporate overlords 🤤
Idle fees should go to a national charging infrastructure fund. Otherwise it may give incentives to providers to increase the likelihood of you paying those fees.
I don't think that Porsche Taycan owner cares about a $20 idle fee.
I agree with Max. High idle fees are the best solution.
In a related scenario, Buc ees in my town has 200 plus fuel pumps, covered by awnings. Many times most of the pumps are blocked by cars whose owner is inside shopping, browsing or whatever. Yes, the huge parking lot is exposed to the blistering sun, as are, frequently, dozens of drivers waiting for a pump. Boils down to courtesy. Don't be a "Karen". When your car is fueled, move it.
High fees will help, but it won't prevent all blocking issues, nor will it help someone who is unable to travel to another station when all plugs at the location are in use or blocked
@@jamespaul2587 True. The only solution which will eliminate the problem is to convince every person on Earth to be considerate of everyone else's feelings and needs, and to stop thinking we are better and more important than every one else. Until then high fees and fines for the habitually inconsiderate.
@@oldgandy5355Don't need to convince everyone, just the majority of EV owners and right now, not too many people own EVs. And if somebody gets upset, so what? They're being a jerk already.
It is not their right to hog a charger after their use of it is over. Most definitely unplug that thing and use it. Your time is valuable.
Don't use the name Karen as a term of derision. There are lots of people named Karen who are not jerks. It's not cool to do that.
@@incognitotorpedo42 And there are a lot of jerks not named Karen. Who knows, you may be one.
EV charging rage happens, same as road rage, someone feels slighted by sometimes rude behavior. Politeness is often not first decision when someone is stressed by their personal situations. That said, being aware of others, using the Golden Rule should be top of mind. I've seen door knockers or hang tags used giving permission to remove plug if you need to... Very polite!
Agreed. Best response in the comments.
Whose rage are you talking about? The rage of the person whose car got unplugged, or the rage of the person who needs to charge and can't? The former is invalid, the latter is valid. Just unplug it. If they get mad, they're just being even more of a jerk than they already were.
I don’t recall having to touch my car when I unplug the CCS from it. When I open or close the little door, then I’m touching the car.
I say as long as you can 100% confirm the charging session is complete to the owners set value, the charger is open for use, regardless if it’s still plugged in.
I’m like Kyle and NEVER charge to 100% at a fast charger, and my car has never sat there without me, having finished charging.
I also have the pleasure of being a Bolt owner, so am very conscious of my slow charging speeds. I’ve actually moved chargers during a session when a fast charging car rolls in, helping them out to choose the correct unit to maximize their session.
Most (all?) of these chargers have a companion app. Would love to see a feature in the app where someone can request to unplug. An alert would then go out to everyone currently plugged in at that location that is currently at their charge limit. If they agree, a response goes back to requester that car at stall XYZ has agreed to be unplugged.
Heavy idle fees after a 5 min grace period max, like 25 dollars a min. people will be dragged to learn to be civil. Just like seatbelt, people don't like but they were taught and dragged to use them.
I do not mind if either my car is disconnected when full, or a DC fast charging above 80% if the station is needed. Got into a rough situation with (who else) a Bolt owner at an EA station with one station working and a line of 6 cars. The Bolt owner was in his hotel room wanting a full 100% charge. 6 others, me included, were on road trips just needing our 70% or 80% to get back on the road and be gone. One of the nicest owners of an ID4 had actually been in contact with the Bolt owner and had his cell. The bolt was over 80% so we asked the guy to unplug and allow others to get a charge and get going. He rudely and flat out refused. He did not care about ANYONE else. He had nowhere to go, but felt he was owed his 100% charge no matter what. So we decided together we were going to go ahead and disconnect (not touch his car, but disconnect) and once we all got our charges, we would reconnect him. He got angry, refused and came down. It was tense, but we got our charges while he grumbled, called the cops (they didn’t care and didn’t show) and we got our charges and when we were done to hand it back to him, he just got mad and left. I normally wouldn’t disconnect someone just out of convenience or something like that. This situation was just unfair and nuts and i took action I would normally not. Like I said, if it was reversed, i have no problem with someone doing that if I completed my fair charging.
People touch cars all the time, get over it. The cable doesn't belong to the car. If you're done charging you need to give the cable back. It's pretty simple really. I'm sorry your parents didn't raise you properly.
@@OpinionatedOG184 100% disagree . How in the hell does connecting a cable to your devic/car make it yours?? Every network you connect your phone to or charging cable you borrow now yours bc you connected to it? That’s not the way the world works. And btw, I stay ready, so I don’t have to get ready …
I think it's wrong to unplug someone else's. If you pay to charge 5% or 100%, they own that plug for that time. I would have probably tried to find another place to charge. Taking the plug out of someone's car and charging your car is bullying. They may not physically own the charger, but chances are, you don't either. If he was in the hotel and was charging there, it was probably paid with his stay.
Nobody has the right to unplug someone else's vehicle period. I don't feel there is any justification to disconnect anything but your vehicle. Secure locking is the answer. And to add enforcing idle fees.
@@guy7622 to clarify the situation. The next nearest DC fast charger was about 50 miles away for most of us. There was no other alternative as I said before I would normally not do this, but given that there was no other alternative, and we were facing an hour or two for this car to continue charging to 100% we collectively made the decision to do so. If you don’t agree, that’s your problem not mine.
What excuse is there other than being held up/forgetfulness (it happens) to leave your vehicle plugged in at 100% at any public charger? What if everyone wants to keep their battery warm overnight or ready to go the next morning? You know you are charging. Monitor the SOC. Once at 100%, return to your vehicle, unplug it, and move. You can return and plug up again if the charger is free. This is my practice. It's called being considerate of others.
@19:50 US have pretty said no to 3-phase charging with NACS so that is not going to happen. Because of this is also going to get a lot more expensive to set up rows of AC chargers at parking lots like we have here in Norway. The cable size and everything need to be pretty big, you basically need to install 64A certified cables and fuses to get 11kW at 240V.
Most likely you'll see more 7.2kW chargers with 40A equipment.
Here you get 400V 16-30A public AC chargers, so basically 11-22kW.
Unfortunately true, this is one of many mistakes made in the North American market. Let's hope these lessons are learned with the next generation of EVs and charging and a more comprehensive and holistic view is taken. This is an area where smart regulation is needed, something that is sorely lacking here.
But you don't need 3 phase for that. You can set up a row of AC chargepoints. It exist now in the USA. Actually, it is quite common.
SAE J3068 exists for 3-phase. Will only be used for trucks.
@@callistoscali4344 It's not impossible at all, just going to be more expensive due to the higher current. And I'm pretty sure 22kW is out. >90A is a lot of current.
Not that it matters yet, most EVs have a single 11kW on board charger anyway.
There are areas here with old 230V IT instead of 400V TN, and those are limited to 16-32A or 3.6-7.4kW.
I'm not 100% sure, but I think there is a regulation in place here now for public parking. It says at least 5-10% of new spaces must have a charger.
So basically municipalities have to add charging if they open up new parking areas.
I don't think it applies to like parking at malls and areas that are basically private ground.
YES. you should unplug and close the persons car flap. since charger do not tell people who go away from the car. and charge the car faster than what is shown on screen at start.
If you do not then this owner may not return for ages, it could be that the charge failed and the person does not know.
But blocking a charger when the owners car is charged is not right.
I use a timer on my phone to bring me back 10 min before it ends. and if I can I would come back half way through to check on charging.
As long as you treat the owners car with respect and close there flap so rain or bad weather can get in to the connector.
I have had some one unplug mine because it finished, but that is fine. it finished sooner than I thought and there was a que.
So I am fine with it. As long as the car has been fully charged etc. and the ccs releases when finished.
That's the same as laundry room etiquette in apartment buildings: When your wash is done, MAKE ROOM FOR THE NEXT PERSON. Now, yes, sometimes people just get distracted. But you have to learn to share.
Or, sit patiently and let the charger continue to bill a dollar per idle minute to penalize the charged car.
Since chargers are often linked to cell phones, why not have the charger text a 10 minute warning? And then get rabid about texting once the charge is done?
I think Tesla used to be great at this UNTIL they decided to power split at V2 chargers, the old system of first come first serve was a great idea, I don’t know which idiot decided to change the system to even power split. Now chargers have an incentive to prevent someone next to them from charging by either double parking and/or telling them the charger doesn’t work.
There's nothing like seeing the a-hole parked at a V2 with all their doors open so nobody can park next to them, I've seen it 3 or 4 times now.
Will be nice when all stations are converted to V3 or higher for reduced chances of charge limiting. It will be a while, but luckily I've been noticing more and more new V3 sites close to older V2 sites.
I think power splitting at V2 is still a better system than the shared cabinet just not working. Leaves less downtime chance waiting for those people to move. And shifting power from the car starting to taper or is barely charging to the one still at a lower SoC is going to be faster throughput. Otherwise you're just wasting potential available power.
Unless they changed V2 so that the newly plugged in car was at a very reduced rate of ~20kW or something just to get things initiated and keep heat/AC/pre-con going, and then would only start ramping as the 1st car started tapering. That way the 1st come 1st serve system isn't really affected.
It's a matter of: Who is being the lesser A-hole? If the cable can reach my car in another spot and I unplug your completed car, I am NOT TOUCHING your car. I am not legally obliged to respect your car's "personal space". I'm only obliged to not damage it. So, I would leave your flap open and let you close it. I would touch only the charger cable - which is NOT YOURS. You are being the bigger A-hole and holding up a scarce resource. Now, I get that it is an easy thing to do with chargers at a store. So, you should be fine with this, and if you're not - then get your A back to your car! Heck, I might even be doing you a favor and letting you avoid idle fees. It's a win/win.
We could completely solve this ethical dilemma by the chargers putting up a sign "settling the issue" in a way that provides the most benefit to everybody (including the company who owns them): "Others MAY Unplug You If Charging Is Complete". Making you aware of YOUR obligation.
And, then put the chargers somewhere that parking on all sides (left/right AND back/front) is available - since there's no consistency on charger port locations. Making it as likely as possible to keep the charger available as much as possible and still permitting people to charge and shop and park.