Don't Muffle Your Drums without Watching This | Season Six, Episode 19
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- Опубликовано: 13 окт 2024
- Most drummers think about muffling in terms of the amount but this completely ignores the fact that there are actually two entirely different TYPES of muffling; restrictive and mass loading. We’ll demonstrate the opposite effects as well as the similarities and help you decide what the right approach is for desired sonic effect.
UPDATE: Unfortunately we didn’t see this one coming but it seems that a lot of people are watching this and thinking that internal mufflers are the only forms of restrictive muffling- that’s not the case though. Anything that’s able to press against the drumhead with more than the force of gravity is a restrictive muffling method. Felt strips, drum clips, active gate mufflers are all forms of restrictive muffling.
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Unfortunately we didn’t see this one coming but it seems that a lot of people are watching this and thinking that internal mufflers are the only forms of restrictive muffling- that’s not the case though. Anything that’s able to press against the drumhead with more than the force of gravity is a restrictive muffling method. Felt strips, drum clips, active gate mufflers are all forms of restrictive muffling.
well its a little missleading, i dont think internal mufflers are there to actualy put pressure to the head but just have the damping material slightly touch the head. also you add pressure to the head if you add waight. put something heavy on the head and the pitch will go up.
@teckendrums - interesting overview - the mass loading can be considered up to a point until the drum head can move freely, an overloaded head with added mass could be precieved more pitchy, since only bright atack would be present with no tone/overtones.
Hmmm, sorry you feel that it's misleading though we disagree. An internal muffler simply can't engage with the batter head without applying pressure. Otherwise it wouldn't be touching the drumhead. We engaged the muffler fully and use a relatively heavy form of mass-loading muffliing to make sure that the effect was as clear as possible for the sake of demonstration. As we demonstrated though, adding something to the batter head (mass-loading) and the pitch doesn't going up- it goes down.
@@SoundsLikeADrum place a full bottle of water on your drum. pitch goes up. internal muflers should be soft so they just touch the head a litle. thats why many dont use them becaue the material compresses over time and you ending up pushing it to hard. thats why most of them are bend etc. if you ad normal muffeling or a second head you lower the wave frequenzy of the head and so lower the tone.
@@teckendrums Not sure we've heard about the water bottle mufling hack before 😉 but this is pretty simple physics as demonstrated at 1:40 in this episode. Adding mass slows down the vibration and lowers the pitch. Restricting motion will generally raise the pitch.
what a fascinating deep dive. This explains why I like the sound of the built in muffler on my Acrolite. I kept getting frustrated with my rimshots until I removed all the "mass adding" muffling. turns out its just easier for me to achieve the sound I want with the internal muffler.
acrolite gang reporting in :) i use internal muffle with a magnetic leather weight on top - its been real good for my purposes!
I never understood why internal dampers went out of fashion. They always worked just fine to my ear, and taped-up heads are an eyesore IMO.
@@les-os Acrolite, present. I use leather right triangles binder clipped to the rim with the suede side resting on the head.
@@DrMackSplackem I think it's just down to simplicity. For the end user that won't use it (like me), it's fewer moving parts. For the manufacturer, it's less cost.
@@ItsABOUTflamTIME I suppose. However, 90% of session work (assuming close mic'ing) will require some head damping on at least the snare.
You guys are legitimate drum scientists, and is always 100% interesting.👍👍
The science behind your videos keeps me coming back for more. Fascinating stuff!
Interesting video! I feel like we're in a period of "Internal mufflers are okay!" again after like 30 years of most consumers/manufacturers spurning them.
Thanks! We've seen a handful of them pop up on snares but regardless of whether it's internal or external, the affect is still restricting muffling as opposed to mass loading.
@@SoundsLikeADrum I just added one to a Pearl Aluminum Sensitone to give it more of an old Acrolite vibe slash crispy-boy it up for some polka gigs. Not the first time I've had a spooky coincidence with this channel.
@@a.j.wilkes6352Well, 'tis the season, so you're doing something right apparently. 🤷🏻♂️😄😄😄
👻💀🎃👹👺☠🕷🕸
Found this channel a couple of days ago. Loving it! It's not this good this bad. It's what fits 4 what u want. Understanding the physics of what's happening and those opinions. As drummers we don't think like that. We just have crap marketed to us. Wonder tools buy buy buy.
internal muffler sounds so good, I love them.
Always awesome, immediately applicable insights.
You manage to consistently come up with things I have never even considered, but which are obvious once you've explained them -- and I'll definitely be trying the combination of a gel-pad AND an internal muffler for a particularly ringy snare.
Thank you!!
great to see a really clean old Acrolite!
I do my best to take care of it! -Ben
Well-done! I have a 1968 Acrolite that is nearly perfect... kept this one after 4 or 5 others. Start with a clean one, take care of it and it will impress for years to come.
Thanks brother, your snare tuning video helped immensely this past week when I had just a short time to get a drum sound dialed in. Really well made, well thought out videos, and the sounds are top notch. Great stuff!
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-Ben
Great video! Informative and well explained. I use Moongels on my snare, not because I think it's better, or worse, but only because my snare has no internal muffling device.🥁
I use the newer Sonor Benny Greb snare which has 2 internal mufflers!!!
I enjoy using both in different combinations but this video also explains how Benny gets his signature “crack” even with the mufflers turned on with the pitch remaining high… and perhaps why he used mass loading on his side snare for the fat doof sound.
For quiet gigs nothing beats a higher tuning with a tea towel 😂
(PS my drumming in no way resembles the amazing Benny)
Man as I was watching this I literally thought to myself “damn now I want the Benny Greb snare even more” 😂
Fantastic! Working closely with the sound professional at church - I quickly learned years ago that overtones are much stronger than I originally expected. I usually use some sort of light muffling depending on head choice to experiment every week. I have used both types & even together at times as demonstrated. Its incredible the combinations one can come up with. This channel has been essential with furthering my horizons. Thank you Sounds Like A Drum! 🤓
You're definitely on a path toward greater insight. Your realization that the microphones perceive a different sound (due to proximity) than our ears do is a great one. Also remember that not all FOH engineers are created equal - AND that every "tone" (roughly notes), or "overtone" (roughly harmonics) have an exact or relative frequency and, as such, can be accentuated or de-emphasized with judicious eq (or even with mic choice/ placement. Have fun exploring! 👊🏼🤘🏻
Great video that clearly show the pitch changing. I never use moon gel or gaff tape for mass loading but I have use Evans Dry heads (Genera Dry or HD Dry) and Kentville heavy (kangaroo skin) on different snare.
I have added 2 diy quick release internal mufflers to a ringy Sonor birch snare. One muffler has a woolly surface (best to use it light) with the other normal felt takes the pitch up better.
All of my drums are Ludwig, but they have the screw type internal mufflers, rather than the baseball bat. As I've said (probably countless times) before, I don't use it at all on my Super Sensitive snare. On the toms, though, I do employ them, to varying degrees, and also depending on what kinds of heads are on the drums. If I have Onyx heads on them, the mufflers aren't needed (in my opinion), since the whole purpose of Onyx heads is to reduce ring. Most of the time, I use either Pinstripe or G2 heads on the toms. The higher rack tom (10") always sounds pretty glorious and muffling dulls it enough that I don't usually use it. The lower rack tom (12") has enough ring on its own to want to be toned down just a bit. What I do there is bring the felt pad up so that it's just barely touching the batter head. I suppose that's restrictive, but I don't really notice any pitch change of difference of feel--it just rings a little less. On the floor tom (16") I usually get more aggressive with tightening the muffler. A little less so when I was following your example from a few years ago and putting 10 cotton balls in the drum, on the reso head. (I eventually took out the cotton balls because they had a tendency to form in a bunch at the edge of the head.)
As always, thank you guys for another fascinating deep dive. Love this channel!!
Baseball bat muffler fully engaged does push the head and distort it. Partially engaged does not. That is how I engage it. I also use a tiny piece of moongel and and a tama external rim clamped muffler just touching the head. I vary these according to the amount of dampening desired.
I would propose categorizing as "mass loading" and "damping". My reasoning is that you can get a similar "pressure muffling" sound without any pressure at all- holding a piece of acoustic foam an inch above the head will do it. The key is that the muffling material dissipates energy from the vibrating head.
We consider all of this to fall under the umbrella of damping or muffling. Of course, the argument could be made for it all being restrictive...regardless, the key is to understand how these different forms work, the sonic results they produce, and when to employ which techniques for a desired outcome. Cheers!
I try to tune the drum the best I can then tap around and find the “ugly” ringing lugs (while in tune some just have more of a ring to it) and put a 1/4 piece of moon gel there. I only have one or two spots, maybe a tiny bit of the internal muffler touching too if I want it really dry. On recordings and live it still has just a touch of ringing but not enough to really distract
There is a place for moon gel,.but,i,ll stick with internal muffling.i,m bias,i,like a wide open drum set for live.only muffins on bass drum, depending on acoustic,s on venue.my own experience.this topic is very informative.
Find the oldest, softest cotton t-shirt you own. Wash it 20 more times just for fun. Cut it into 6"x6" and 3"x6" pieces. Tie a shoe string between adjacent lugs on a side of the drum that won't be played. (Or will be, for softer cross stick sounds.) Flip the t-shirt scrap over the shoe lace so that an inch or two lay on the head. Pull more on for more damping, pull more off for less. If it makes a fluttering sound it's not soft enough yet. Sew it back together and wear it another decade.
"Sew it back together and wear it another decade." :-)))
This requires careful planning to coincide with that gig in 10 years, 2 weeks, 1day and 19 hours.
I wished there would be internal mufflingsystem around that with a soft surface like foam or kind of whool,like the benny greb snare,so that there is very less pressure needed to
have a effekt,and that the kontakt area is closer to the shell,for my feel,the standard internal mufflers are to far toward the center of the head.
Actually internal mufflers on toms are great too. Some Ludwig 60s & 70s kits have them
Agreed! They're quite common on Gretsch drums too. While we chose to demonstrate restrictive muffling with the internal muffler on this Acrolite, it's important to remember that it restrictive muffling can be internal OR external.
What's your opinion of Aquarian heads? (They add extra material around the rim built in from the factory as part of the construction.)
As a different perspective as a death metal drummer, I am not a fan of muffling at all. I believe if the kit is in a live scenario, let it sing. I use 1 old pillow in the bass drum barely touching both heads, and that’s it. I don’t use muffling on any other drum.
I have met drummers that fully load the bass drum up to the brim, and i think it sounds and plays awful.
I like the internals on my gretsch round badge kit, but seems no matter what i do the snare just sounds dead, it now sits on a shelf, would love to mail it to this man and have him do a video on how to make it sound good, shipping is on me!
Thanks for the excellent video! I knew that these two muffling methods were different, but this makes it clear the ways in which they are different. It seems to me that there is a third type of muffling, where the device sits on the head, bounces away during impact, and returns to the head just after impact. Do you find that these have a different effect with respect to the actual sound of the drum?
Thanks for the kind words! What you’re describing is what we would consider a “gated” form of mass-loading. Interestingly enough, everyone with a snare drum of any make/model has built-in adjustable restrictive muffling…the snare wires! There are all sorts of different systems of muffling under two overarching types shown here. We’ll likely do an episode specifically on gated muffling in the future. Cheers!
I have a basic rule with my main snare: if the over-tones don't play well in the room I'm in - slowly bring up the internal muffling until it sits nicely.
My other snares lack the internal muffling, so i am forever cutting down cheap external muffling so I can bring a relatively similar approach to them.
Do you ever adjust the tuning to affect the ofertones?
I feel some dismay at how often I see people trying to eliminate the ringy snare overtones that I've always wanted. Here I've been unable to get the sound I'd really like to have and apparently everyone else is getting it on accident!
Play a game because the word Muff has so many meanings….
Every time Cody says ‘Muffling’ you need to do a shot of tequila 🤙🏽
Enjoy your MUFFling session guys 😮💨
Hi, what is that (dark) string material you use to hold the snares to the head? Very good video.
Thanks! We used Puresound braided snare string.
Internal muffler and the studio sound ring and I'm good to go, between the two or both at once..
I dunno. I get those dollar store slap against the wall rubber hands and just add a finger to each Tom. Rings suck I miss my vistalites internal mufflers.
Hello cody, what about muffling the snare side head ? We got a benefice ?
Both of these principles apply to batter or reso heads. In fact, as we mentioned in last week's episode, everyone has a built in restrictive muffler on the snare drum reso...the snare wires! We've done a variety of episodes that touch on muffling as it relates to reso heads for snares, toms, and bass drums.
Of course a Ludwig acrolyte. Out of all the drums he could have picked.one of my favorite.
Fact?: the only way to do pressure based muffling is if your drum has a built-in muffler? So unless you’re playing Ludwig, you’re probably almost always top-loading any type of dampening…
Ok, I guess the felt strip counts too
Almost any internal mufflers change your pitch a lot more than mass loading (ud need to add a lot closer to the center to notice the difference)
I have an old LM400 and I actually removed the internal muffler (I never engaged) and the drum sounds a lot better than ever
It doesn’t even need to be an internal muffler! There are various forms of restrictive mufflers, one of which we featured last week in our snare episode: the snare wires! As for which changes pitch more, that’s tough to say since you’d need to measure the applied force and area of each form of muffling.
@@SoundsLikeADrum I’m not arguing!! I’ve got external mufflers too and agree they do the same thing love your tests and deep dives guys!
It’s worth pointing out the difference it made for me just obstructing the air in the drum, versus top mounted I certainly notice a better open sound now.
U can also apply that external muffler to the reso head to some cool affect depending on shortness ur after and other concerns, it can also be a quick way to adjust the whole pitch a bit or quick config to tune up if you needed on the batter
Oh we know you weren’t arguing- we just wanted to point out some important things to note based on your comment. Cheers!
Do many people seriously use internal mufflers? Not many modern drums have them.
A better pressure based muffler is the snare weight, with the size and position also being adjustable.
Internal mufflers are mostly bad imo.
They’re not quite as common in drums these days but this isn’t about internal mufflers - that’s just one example and we thought it would make for an excellent one to use opposing the EQ Pods. It’s been a while since I’ve spent some time with a Snare Weight but, as I recall, this would be mass loading and not restrictive unless you can apply pressure against the head (that wasn’t an option in the versions I’ve used). -Ben
What is the bronze colored snare drum on the second shelf below the light bulb?
ruclips.net/video/stZI4Y758J8/видео.html
@@SoundsLikeADrumThank you! Much appreciated!
Wow❤
Awesome video. I'm glad you went into detail with the difference between internal muffling and muffling on top of the head
Thanks! Just keep in mind that this isn't really about internal vs external but rather restrictive vs. mass loaded. Both can be done internally or externally.
@@SoundsLikeADrum awesome
I lovee my acrolite
Can I buy and add a baseball bat muffler to my snare? If so, are there different brands? Recommendation?
Not sure if there's anyone making internal systems for retrofitting drums but there are definitely external options out there that clip onto the hoop.
Canopus makes a nice one.
Search: Canopus Baseball Bat Internal Drum Muffler
I don't mind the Pearl threaded knob+bolt version. I glue some fleece material to the felt. Sometimes just a touch to take off some overtones. For polka band, I do like the "stiffer" feeling for rolls and stuff from the pressure muffler.
I my be crazy but my favourite was the wide open one lol
Not at all crazy though it's important to mention that each of these was more exaggerated than we would typically use for this particular tuning but we wanted it to be as clear as possible for viewers to hear the difference.
I want an acrolite all sudden like tho.
I prefer my snare sound natural.Dont like mufflers
You can do both! Muffling isn’t exactly a binary concept- you can use it subtly to shape tone and maintain a natural sound. The key is knowing which type of muffling will produce the desired results and then adding it incrementally to ensure that you don’t go overboard if that’s not your intention.
@@SoundsLikeADrum I used to think muffling was a binary concept for so long!! When I used to muffle my drums, I had the mentality that I either needed to use a lot to get a "clean" sound with multiple full sized moongels or o-rings. But when I started taking more time to fine tune my drums, and cutting small pieces, paying attention to how the drums sounded with different gel placements, I started to embrace the more natural sound, while still having it controlled to a level that I liked.
What about the wallet trick?
That would be an example of mass loading. Can you think of a common drum hack that exemplifies restrictive muffling?
Better use some O’Rings, the best mufflers.
What I'm going to say is cymbal related, but when I see tape or over tightened cymbals, I cringe
Learn how to tune a drum and what brand/type of heads you need to get YOUR sound! Muffling a tom is a sign that s.o. has no cue about drum tuning!
That’s yer problem. Yer buying those dumb squares. A finger will do. Like a slappy rubber hand that’s a dollar. Scissors not included
Problem? There’s no problem here. This is simply about understanding two two overarching types of muffling. Whether you’re using Evans EQ Pods, Moongel, Drumtacs, or slappy rubber hands, they’re all examples of mass loaded muffling.
@@SoundsLikeADrum I miss the internal ones. No. You’ve no problem. Pretty spot on. Can always cut heads for rings but I guess that is mass adding too. Damp it. It’s just dampening. Control heads and all kinds of gimmicky stuff. Depends on the gig tho just like you said. I do dislike how they want ten quid for a thing of rubber squares tho.
how early am I?
You’re right on time! ✨
Well, I wish you would actually hit the drum hard.
Well, sometimes a REALLY DEAD/MUFFLED sound is desired/wanted by UNQUALIFIED "sound engineers"! If you happen to meet such a WANNA-BE "sound-engineer" you better use a set of cardboard boxes for recording instead of spending thousands of bucks to get a great sounding set of drums and cymbals to get your personal sound!
PERSONAL SOUND? In times where "time is money" no recording engineer is willing to take the time to create an invidual drum sound!
Individual sound for an unknown drummer? Why spend all this time when the sound(s) of Steve Gadd, Vinnie Colajuta etc are still "on hand"?
LEARN HOW TO TUNE YOUR DRUMS and record your playing/sound in your own rehearsal room/studio before you go into a professional recording studio!
OK just my two cents.
Hey guys. Long-time watcher here. I enjoy the content of your videos. They're very thought provoking. However, I've got to say...I'm tired of watching your videos. I think it's because they all look the same and have the same monotone narration. Again, I respect the approach...but you've lost me. Literally even a wash of a different color flood light on each video would make for much more compelling videos. Perhaps even...gasp...some creative video editing to add an element of humor. But for now...I just can't anymore.