💥What is the Ultimate Bass Pickup? Are most pickup demos garbage?! (Metal Bass Monday Ep. 21)
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- Опубликовано: 12 сен 2024
- Metal Bass Monday! What is the Ultimate Bass Pickup? Are most pickup demos garbage?
* How do you find the perfect pickup?
* Why are pickup demos usually a waste of time? Are there any that are any good? Let's find out!
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I was eyeing a fgn bass with two p pickups for over a year. It has two Seymour Duncan quarter pounder pickups and everyone on forums were saying that they are shit pickups that dont cut in the mix or are too dark and too bright blah blah.
I read so many of these stories that I didn't get that bass and bought a fender player p instead. Year later and I just bought the fgn bass (last one on thomann, possibly last one in Europe cuz they aren't on the fgn website anymore). The pickups sound amazing , just my type of sound, nothing like the demos or how the internet "experts" say it sounds.
Funny how the stuff the internet "experts" hate winds up being gold, isn't it? I love it because i ignore them and get great deals😂
So.. for a long time Quarter Pounders were the “in” pbass pickup for rock music. Widely loved. Ive recorded with a Grammy nominated producer and he often liked me to track with his pbass.. which has SD QPs!! I’ve never been a huge fan TBH, I like the more mid-focused vintage style P sound, but my point is that many hit songs have been tracked on those, it’s just no longer the “flavor of the week” on bass forums. I’ve been steered wrong before too, always trust your ears and your hands first :)
Yeah, i had the same bass.
The pickups sounded very good.
Especially the rear pu isn't as close to the bridge llike on other basses.
I’ve been playing bass professionally 20 years and the single most important factor I’ve found for changing the sound of a bass I own... is strings. I’m not even kidding a little. I have four main basses. A vintage style P that I keep using the Fender stock string brand, a P/J I use with Dunlop super bright mediums, a 5 string jazz with light gauge DRs, and a short scale Mustang with heavier flats... I’m not using the same brand on any of them! Every one of those basses sounds SO different. I could swap one Pbass pup for another, but I promise you strings can make just as much difference or more and it’s way easier/cheaper to experiment with. And when you find what’s right for that specific guitar (and you), stick with it until you’re sick of it. Don’t just chase the gear lust ;)
Truth!
I can't tell you how many times over the years I've bought pickups only to end up putting the stock set back in!
You don't have to tell me, I've done it more than I'd like to admit!
I am in love with the EMG HZ passive line (aka GZR). I put them in a project and fell in love. Just ordered another PJ set and a single P to go in the Virgin and Warlock that I scooped up.
An excellent set!
Love what you said find your sound with the gear you have. Again I'm new to bass guitar world but I have been around drums for a little bit and you can make a cheap kit sound great yes over time i bought a high end kit but the sound is not to far off the cheaper kit bc the magic tool are your ears. So can get close to that sound you love but it take time and most of the time it's not other ppl's settings it's a just a starting point. So what Professor McG is saying it true take the time to find your tone learn your gear and the room you play,practice what ever it is will change ever thing so have fun find that magic setting lol. Sorry if I rattled on to much but Thx again for a great topic 🤘🔥😎
I have the same thought -I play guitar (and pretend to play bass) . Instead of having 6 different amps, multiple mics and a ton of guitars, I have stuck with the setup I have and fine tuned everything, including the recording process. I will probably never be 100% happy with the sound but I am a good 98% there. Far better to keep going with your setup, provided you have a reasonable level of quality. Great, refreshing and honest videos sir!!!
Spot on Rodney 👍 great informations again. The comparison of the two basses with identical pickups and setup should be mandatory for those who blindly deny the effect of wood on tone.
That's why I got disappointed when I bought a Darkglass B7k and upgraded to B7k Ultra (still disappointed),
Most demos weren't guitar to pedal and record,
They had split channels low and high, with entire production of compressors, eq etc.
I could never get those tones.
Exactly. Too many variables, and then there's also the issue that some people are doing more than a little bit of salesmanship. That's why I try and be as transparent as possible about my gear on the channel. If somebody got something because of me and it sounded Nothing Like the way it did when I played it, I'd feel pretty bad about that.
@@RodneyMcG Spot on Rodney.....I feel like like we have to have "confidence" in ANY person that we're getting tips from. & to that point.....I must say the Riot 5 sounds pretty close to what you posted about it & I'm STILL dialing it in. I'm really close to where I want it.....Salud
Glad you're digging it!
I'm not using Darkglass solely because everybody else uses it. Rebellious little rascal, that's me! :D
I've been contemplating purchasing a set of the Fishman Fluence pickups for my Stiletto. I've always kind of enjoyed tinkering with my basses, and they seem to be a little different than most other pick ups on the marketnin my opinion. Great video my friend. Your opinions and experience have definitely help me out in my playing. Thank you!
Report back with how they work out for you. The Fishman turned out to not be my grail tone, but it's a really versatile set. My biggest complaint was the wiring! Set aside an afternoon to solder those! Always glad to see you, and know i could help 🤘
@@RodneyMcG i definitely will. I had a feeling it would be a task to wire them up. Im not extremely experienced in that department though. I may swallow my pride and let a tech install them for me.
Lays guitar Akron Ohio... I sell them and install Fishman
@@PieCompanyGuitars that's not far from me at all
Sorry for pimping on your channel Rodney.
Wow the Hellraiser and Riot sounded so much different! I’m honestly a little surprised. Very informative vid!
Yeah, it's shocking, right?!
Again you are right, Rodney. Its the same, when I take the two basses that go with me on stage the most, both MusicMan StingRay 5 basses, both built in the mid of the 1990's, same setup, strings, preamp and ceramic pickups....
But two noticeable different tones. Both have the StingRay tone, but different mid timbre, the trans orange has more high end, the natural finished has more low end...
Not to mention the other two StingRays, that are newer and have different pickups and preamp. Its still StingRay, but some kind different.
I just don't mind, as this is something only my trained ear takes notice of.
The other musicians I work with just don't mind at all, they even do not notice. They are fine with my decisions as long as the tone is sitting in the mix and supports the overall sound.
A bass guitar is a system, made of not that much parts, but mostly made of natural components, that can differ in density and vibration behaviour. Even the caps and resistors of the preamp, in one preamp the cap may be at one end of the allowed spectrum of specifications, in the other preamp on the other end. This sure has influence on the tone.
I found that experienced bass players with a good technique are able to have a great tone on every instrument, no matter if there is an expensive bass, amp and cab. This supports the idea of "the tone is in the hands". What I believe, too.
I like my amps dialed in quite neutral, with a slight cut around 400 - 450 Hz and s slight boost in the high mids. I use lots of gain with tube preamps. This is it.
I have 4 MusicMan StingRay basses, three Precision style instruments and three Jazz Bass type basses.
Played by myself, without Band, you sure are able to recognize every single instrument, but in the mix.... not so much. It is my choice of Instrument, my preferrence, the nuances I want to have added to the particular tone of the band I am playing with, and in the end it gives something different, my tonal statement, to the music.
But the only thing I hear from the other bandmembers is maybe "you have to turn up, you need more volume with this white bass". Not noticing, that I changed from an active MusicMan to a passive Precision type instrument.
This comes from cork sniffing guitar afficionados that play only a special brand of guitar "because only XY guitars give me this feel and tone".... same with the Amp. It has to be hand wired, the tubes have to be new old stock Telefunken tubes for some "extra special tone". I am thinking that people that behave like this are just feeding their ego with their gear.
See, in the moment I have some amps of different Brands, with different cabs, I collected this stuff over 40 years. And I often play rental backlines. OK, just for beeing sure not to find some beaten up wreck of an amp on stage, I allways carry my Genzler Magellan 800 with me, but I'd play any old amp with pleasure anyway, as long as it works, because I know how to dial in my tone. If there is no tube in the preamp I am able to overdrive, I carry my B7k with me.
This is it.
A good player can nearly always get a good tone. Nailed it.😉
@@RodneyMcG
Every time I write one of those long comments to one of your videos I am waiting for a "tl;dr".
This are just subjects you can't answer in one sentence.
I always read them and enjoy, my friend!
A lot of great advice, especially the last 6 or 7 minutes..."Work with the gear you've got."
Very cool. I did an EMG shootout in my bass because A. It's so easy to swap them and B. That's the only way to truly know.
By the way, I decided on using a 40P in the neck position of course 😁
The P is hard to beat!
After having watched practically every demo that exists on RUclips for the latest/greatest preamp-DI pedals over the past few weeks, I kind of feel like everything you just said about pickups is just as true there. I'd even watch the same demo on different days and swear I heard different things in the playing each time. Nothing is apples to apples. Hell, I'd take apples to oranges at this point, but it's more like apples to orangutans! Different basses, amps, cabinets, DI, cabsim, etc. I kind of agonized about this and changed my mind at least a dozen times before finally making a decision, and still don't know what it's going to sound like when I get it (out for delivery today!).
On the pickup thing, I occasionally watch Phil McKnight's channel, and I thought his demos with that custom guitar with the hot-swappable pickup mounts are pretty great! Provides that frame of reference and allows him to go back and forth quickly for comparison.
Thanks very cool! I actually have a Schecter Hellraiser that I use solely for doing pickup comparisons that I routed the center out of so I could accommodate any form factor! It was the only way I could finally get to the bottom half of the stuff!
Rodney is all killer and no filler. Thank you for the breakdown. Well done Sir.
Thanks for checking in as always!
Preach on Rodney McG! Preach on!
I Got the geezer butler emg’s in my fender p bass and i really like them they sound really punchy
Great set!
I put 2 Fluence soapbar on a build and it's the best pickup sound I've ever gotten.
Congrats!
I love EMG. I have two 6 string guitars with 81 / 85 (BC rich and ibanez) in them and an 8 string schekter with 808's. All sound noticeably different (even when you ignore the lower two strings on the 8 string). You have to dial in a new sound for every instrument, totally agree!
In my custom guitar (neck-through, mahogany body and wings, ebony fretboard, fixed bridge), I initially had DiMarzio D-Activator X set. I ignored the warning that it might sound too bassy. Well, it indeed had a massive low end that overpowered the rest of the frequencies. With these pickups, guitar pushed to overdrive everything and anything. Following the advice of guitar tech, who's service I use on a regular basis, I had the set swapped for EMG 81 / 89 (bridge, neck). It started to sound like a completely different instrument. Despite all the claims of active PU-s sounding dead an lifeless, the instrument remained its character, but became way more balanced. And it sounded nothing like instrument with another instrument with the same combination of wood, hardware, strings and pickups. You are making an absolutely valid point, regarding demos, because when I was listening to the demos of my original pickups, they sounded nothing like they ended up sounding in my instrument. Thank you for the video !
Great commentary. Glad you got something from the video.
The correct answer is active EMG…just kidding…sort of. I have 3 main basses, all Fender (78 P, unknown origin J, 85 P/J), and I have EMG in all 3. Love those pickups for loud music. Can’t be beat in my mind
I do have a few other basses that are passive for when something else is needed
Very informative video Rodney. Appreciate it brother!
Great video Rodney. Very in depth and lots of useful info. Keep these videos coming mate, they are extremely helpful!
Thanks, Jay! Glad you enjoyed it.
What are a few of your recommendations for a good set of Jazz bass pickups?
I like the EMG jx series, and the Fender Geddy jazz the most. The Schecter Monster tone are really under rated as well.
@@RodneyMcG the monster tone set came stock in my J-4. I agree with you. They sound great. A little thicker tone than most single coils I've played but not muddy.
@@RodneyMcG Thanks! I have the EMG J-X in a Geddy MIJ and it sounds great. I also just installed a Darkglass Tone Capsule in an old Fender Deluxe with a dying preamp and that's been pretty good as well. Thanks for the recommending the Schecter. I just found your channel and have really enjoyed the content. You're like the Myth Buster of Bass BS. Sometimes the bass community can be rather short-sided and dogmatic. You can't put boundaries and rules around music. There should be none...that's hoe all of the greats achieved their greatness. Thanks for blowing up a lot of these misconceptions. Cheers!
The Myth Buster of Bass BS😂😂 I love that! Glad you're enjoying the content. The Schecter are great if you want a little more meat than the usual. I talked with the bassist from All Hail The Yeti. He has a great tone and is a fellow schecter player. He gutted all of his and had the Schecter J's put in it. He liked the thickness over his other models.
Solid advice. Very much appreciate your taking the time to really explain the why things may not be as they appear in pickup vids. I love it here!!! Thanks Uncle Rodney!!!
What is you opinion on capacitors?
Glad it helped, and glad to have you!
It will definitely, need to get some cash together to experiment :)
Meaning tone caps?
@@RodneyMcG yes. I have a passive fretless SX Jazz. Replaced the pickups and did a complete rewire with CTS pots for tone and volume, pan pot and an orange drop. I like it but seems to be missing something the cheap stuff had. Probably part of the situation is replacing everything at once. But it's not a huge deal, I roll off the tone knob a little and it's pretty good. This also enforces your saying you need to know how to get your tone. That tone knob tweak did it. I am going to be looking at getting an eq pedal as soon as I can. I'm getting into playing around with different circuits once I get my work bench sorted.
I watched demos on Spectors - Aguilars on the Ethos and Fishman's on the Dimension. The Ethos/Aguilar definitely sounded better on demos. Finally got to a shop that actually had them. The Ethos/Aguilars didn't sound anything like the demo. The shop also had a Spector RST with Aguilars. Sounded like the Ethos - modern, too modern for me. Tried the Dimension/Fishmans which I had disliked on demos. In the shop it sounded just what I wanted. Bought the Dimension and all's been good. If remotely possible (for me in regional Australia it's not easy) try before you buy.
True. You have to hear it in your hands for the final verdict.
Imagine, doing some research first lol. Luckily I never had that fever to chase pickups. My opinion is if you have good basses and decadent equipment and knowledge you can be just fine. It’s such a big topic surely. Wonderful insight on a beautiful MBM. Thank you
Thanks for the good word. It really can apply to a lot of things. The more you develop yourself, the less you need outside help.
Besides saving a lot of money I totally agree. A simple thing like when people see me moving my picking-plucking hand around the body for different sound say why do you do that 😆
The nuances is the ultimate factor ....you can play on your buddies bass rig.....same bass...strings ...pickups ...same settings ...same strap ...and it just doesn’t sound like the same way when they are playing. I fell into that buy this new thing and didn’t like it .....As someone who spent better part of 2 years updating gear I made a few bad purchases for whatever reason wasn’t to my liking ....Was it the gear? Most likely not ...it was more likely I didn’t hear what I heard in my skull or how the product as presented to me.
Exactly!
about 11:30 - great point. every demo is made by DI or preamp but... for first way is still processed to moke the video, youtube make another process and with second way? everyone have different amps, so at the and with both ways, whe you plug your guitar with desired pickup to your amp - still sounds different. this should be 101 of buying pickups or guitars after seeing ONE demo. always compare to others.
great vid as always (;
Thanks, riesabass. Good to see you!
Always very honest and informative, thumbs up Rod! Any plans to make a video about bass strings for rock/metal? Cheers!
Thanks, DD. I may get into strings at some point. Maybe i'll just do a live chat on it.
Have you done a shootout between the EMG40 and Seymour Duncan blackouts?
I haven't. I tried the SD a long while ago, but haven't heard much since then. They haven't been the most responsive about things.
Great advice I’ve recently started using EMG pick ups after being on passive humbuckers and I’m really enjoying them got a HZ23B in the bridge and a HZ35N in the neck. I’m only running that through my Behringer Ultrabass BX2000H and having great time dialling in different tones.
I have a metal zone In Front of my Marshall 6100, persevered with the sound and have managed to get a 98% satisfactory result. Totally going against all the online guidance. I recorded dry D.I. signal and then reamped so I could focus fully on manipulation of the sound instead of stop/start playing with tiny variations in my playing. Made a huge difference! Also the EQ from you desk / DAW will equally influence the final product. Superb guidance and honest advice, thank you sir! Best wishes from the UK, Cheers Ade.
I find reamping allows me to focus more on the tone as well. Well done. Thanks for the kind words, All the best from the US!
however, i can relate on the guitar aspect. Especially when you said to avoid trendy things. I remember i got a guitar with Shitman Flatulence pickups thinking these would be nicer than EMG’s because they are the new big thing. I still get nightmares about how those pickups sound. 3 of my 5 guitars now have EMG 81’s and wouldn’t swap em out for anything else.
Awesome shirt!
Thanks!
Are you sure both basses had the same pickups? According to Shecter they come with different pickups and preamps, and also one is 9v and the other 18v. Maybe you installed both with matching pickups and pream, but that didn't come across in the video? I don't men to attack you or anything but talking about "tonewood" hits a nerve since it's been proven not to exist when talking about electric instruments. Again, i apologise if i come cross as aggressive. I'm just trying to dig deeper to where the tones really come from. Thanks for making great videos.
I used the same pickups in both. I also bypassed the preamp in both.Tone wood talk can be a lot fo BS for sure, but not completely. It has not been proven not to exist at all. Even 2 pieces of the same type of wood will often sound different, hence my results. I don't take offense to your comments, the discussion is what were here for. Thanks for watching.
Thanks 4 the recommendation & info on the Schecter Riot 5, it really is a killer Bass. The only thing that is taking me a bit to get used to it, is that the body is bigger than the Basses I've been using the ladt several yrs (Ibanez ergos & Schecter Stiletto series).
13:30 P & J set up**
Are you asking if it's P and J? Mine is double P
So U switched the J out?
@@geogarcia4065 Yeah, I love the PJ tone, but for my main tone, I like the double P just a little more. I keep 3 double P and two PJ in the stable.
Testing pickups is like trying out different ingredients to make a top notch chef meal. Great video, Rod 🤘
Perfectly said!
Bertolini MMK series double coil. Can tap them and still hum cancel. Warm tone, tons of top end. Very versatile... Great pickup...
Not familiar, but i hear good things.
Basically a music man replacement pickup but I love them...
I put Bartolini in every one of my builds and my personal basses. P, J, MM, they're all consistent and sound very similar to each other, which is important if you play multiple basses in any given situation.
On the other hand, it's very hard to get a sound equivalent to the radical geometry of something like a Dingwall!
Let’s not also forget that RUclips itself « modifies and transforms » the sound quality of any videos you listen to! You also have to take into account the speakers or headphones (hopefully not those from your phone) you are listening the sound through... shitty speakers on your side of things will make anything sound shitty!
I remember finding your channel several years ago, when I was looking for info on Lace Alumitone bass pickups. No one else had a demo at that time and got the idea that they're quite clear sounding (I'm still on the fence on buying those for a heavy-as-all-hell LTD 8-string bass with Esp-made pickups). Are the Alumitones worth the improvement in weight and sound?
The Alumitones are good pickups. It really depends on what you are looking to get out of your tone. If you want very hi-fi and the direct sound of your bass, they should work for you. The weight difference won't be massive. If you want to get more clarity, but also with some baked in tone, something like EMG would be a better bet. I hope that helps.
@@RodneyMcG Thanks you! It's a LTD B-208FM model, and I can't dial in a clear yet full sound without getting muddy - the preamp isn't helping either (maybe they boost/cut the wrong frequencies for an 8 string). But curiously I love the sound of it unplugged. The stock pickups are the same size of a EMG 40 , and since it's an 8 string, I think the pickup needs to be a bar or rail magnet type. Maybe EMG 40J?
@@feorwine 40J could be a good choice
true. demos aren't good examples.
Thanks for all these advice man! I have a Schecter hellreiser extreme 5 and i have been searching for months for a suitable pickup upgrade for my taste and i still cant decide. The characteristics i dont like about its tone is that it has too much lows and lack of mids... I usually like jazz bass tones so i am using both pickups as single coils and i boost the mids from the bass preamp. The thing is i dont know if those massive lows are because of my instrument or the pickups.. what would you suggest me to do ?
Giannis- I have a couple of those basses myself.I didn't notice them being too dark. One thing you could look into easily could be strings. Strings on bass can have a massive difference in tone. Maybe try something brighter than what you are using, or also, go to a lighter gauge. They can add much more detail and clarity. That's usually the most inexpensive and easy route to start adjusting tone. I would think looking at your amp settings and considering if they still work for you, or if you need to change them to better fit that bass could help as well. Hope that helps!
@@RodneyMcG Thank you so much for the reply man, I really appreciate it! Truth is i am using 55-135 so i should probably try at least 50 -130. Plus i am thinking of getting the darkglass b7k ultra so that should also help a lot in shaping the tone
6:15 was it Catzilla stomping around? :D
She has been known to make her presence felt!
I have a Shecter Bass Stealth for 3 years and the sound is SO BORING with their brand P-Ups. will be installing EMG's or Seymour D. Very soon.
Wow! This was a very well explained video. Excellent work, my friend.
Glad you enjoyed it!
so how do you tell if your bass is deep or tinny or needs help in the middle, and how do you know what boost the stock pickups are providing. seems like maybe its easier to just get what your bass sound hero used and dial in with other settings.
It doesn't matter where you are starting, it matters what you want out of it. If your bass tone sounds scooped, then listen to a demo with your same pickup compared to others. Do the others sound like the direction you want to go? You found a good example. Just dialing in your hero won't get you the same sound. Again, your hero isn't using your exact bass, string, amp, etc.
@@RodneyMcG i meant like if you want a newstead sound just grab his pickups and adjust levels to dial in his sound. changes in rooms and venues and pa's mean we are always tweaking to get our sounds right everywhere we go. my bass is an epiphone accu bass custom from 1995, original everything except pickguard and knobs. not sure what those pickups would even compare with for a sound.
i have never been unhappy with my sound though so never had the urge to change the pickups, but if i did ever i was just gonna grab emg passive cause i like that newstead sound and its what i have set already. the only problem i have with my bass is it needs to be shielded and im just too lazy to do it lol
Tbh your demo of FIshman Fluence bass pickups pretty much sold me on Evil Twin 5 and I don't think I will be buying new bass any time soon. Or ever for that matter...
Love that! And I'm sure that it gave you a general characteristic of the sound, but our sounds are pretty different, am I right? And that's my point. I can show the features of a pickup, and whether it's an overall good or bad tone and general direction, but if you are searching for a specific sound it's all on you to discover. Glad I could help you find one that works for you!
Schecter has been coming out with some amazing guitars and basses lately. Highly underrated in my opinion.
delano sounds clear af
Great Tee shirt today... lol
I dickslapped the like button. \m/
😂😂😂🤘
i think my ears are unexperienced with bass cause they both sounded similar to my ear.
They are similar for sure, but not exactly the same. The difference may not be something you are listening for, i'm sure you're experienced enough to hear differences in areas that might matter more to your taste.
The crate be 2x15 cabinet that i got for 109 was an eye opener, i sat down in a shop and tried at least 11 or 12 cabs with my carvin bass head prepared spend a significant amount of money, i tried ampeg hartke peavey galien krueger you name it and nothing had that magic thing, then i see this big old carpet covered monstrosity with the name plate ripped off the front and say why not, ive come this far might as well try it and as soon as I plugged in the tone was there it had the thump and the body i was looking for. I got this big stupid grin on my face and said you bet im paying 109 for this and walked out of the store with it and never looked back. The wheels on it are a godsend because the sheer weight of the thing is ridiculous, its built like a brick shit house.
DUDE! Yes! The Crate 2x15! I played one in a rehearsal spot and it dropped my jaw. a gorgeous thick low mid i had tried to replicate a ton of times. I'm moving to a new studio with more room, and i'm definitely gonna go on a hunt for one. Great choice!
It's just got so much tone and you can find them so cheap, ive been toying with the idea of getting a second one