Thank you, that is a very kind thing to say! In their defense, their goals are very different than mine, and their content and production values are very good.
Once again, you have produced an excellent presentation. Thank you for the deep dive into the details of these historic weapons. I had no idea that these type weapons were the ones used on Wake island to sink the Japanese ship! Keep the great work coming sir!
another incredible video and so detailed, detailed enough i'm sure to be worthy of a full training manual, i wonder how long it took for crews to learn their trades, even though all of this is divided between many crew members doing different tasks, i wonder if a crew could do the job as well after watching your videos, albeit the bosses would have to know there trades, read the numbers and pass them down the chain of command, fairly easy to the crews to do as they are told, turn and wind the gun to whatever direction and elevation, load and fingers in ears i have been fortunate to fire a large variety of weapons, the largest was only a .50 cal, but it still makes me wonder what the noise must have been like even though most crews might be locked away behind the breach with no huge shock wave coming back at them, still be interesting, may Texas one day will get to fire a few blanks, and break some windows haha
What a presentation. I've read some of your responses to some of the questions in the comments and I can only ask, how do you know all of this stuff? Incredible knowledge. Thank you.
Thank you, that is a very nice thing to say. I have three things going for me. I have had very good access to the ship for more than 20 years, allowing me to actually see and touch things so that they very real to me and not just pictures and descriptions. Second, I don't have to answer questions live, but can take whatever time I need to formulate an answer before giving it. Last, I am retired and can spend more time that is healthy studying the ship and her systems.
Hi Tom, I met you when I was there for the dock tour in July. I have a question about the amidships Fire Control Tower that is shown at Timestamp 8:30. The one just aft of the stack. The red arrow is pointing at the lower window bank facing starboard. My question is just above that, is a round "cupola", with windows and a radar antenna mounted on top. What was inside there? I am guessing it maybe was an Optical Rangefinder for the main battery? Like those stereoscopic telescopes with mirrors inside that determines range when both mirrored images coincide to be in focus. Do you know if there is anything still inside there today? Just curious. Thanks and it was a pleasure meeting you and talking about my friends Bill and Konrad Werzner who helped me obtain some stuff for our historic ships back in Oregon! Jerry
I remember you! I'm glad that you enjoyed the tour. Yes, that is the aft main battery fire control position that contained an optical director for the 14" guns. The director contained a range finder as you said, but it also had computing capabilities that allowed it to correct issues like cross level that could affect readings and calculate range rate, which was the speed that a target moves toward or away.
Tom, any numbers available as to the accuracy of this system on BB-35 in MOA or other metric? Also, how might they compare to the main battery in accuracy? Thanks for the upload!
I don't have any hard data on that. I don't think there was a substantial difference in accuracy between the basic guns and sighting systems. However, there were pretty big differences in fire control capabilities that directly affected accuracy. By WWII, the 14" used the Mk III fire control radar to establish range and bearing, corrected to provide range rate, to the Ford Mk1, Mod11 range keepers that in turn cranked out solutions. The 5" used an optical director that did not have the radar's accuracy to determine corrected range, bearing and range rate. I think, but not sure without checking, that it also used the old Ford MkII (Baby Ford) range keeper to output much simpler solutions. However, it is possible that most of the superiority of the 14" system would be offset by the simple fact that the 5" would more likely be used at 1/2 the ranges of the 14".
Are they being restored to "short of being able to fire a 5" round" as you said, or "short of having 5" rounds, charges, and primers to fire"? If the restoration is to a deactivated state, could you give any details on what has been done to affect the deactivation?
I generally assume the term "round" to include shell, charge and primer. Even if that is not the case, one cannot fire a 5" round without a charge and primer. Nothing has been done to either the 5" or 14" guns on Texas to demilitarize them or intentionally render them inoperative. Theoretically, all could be restored back to operating condition, but it would be a complete waste of the immense amount of money and effort required to do the work. There also be some significant legal issues involved in firing projectiles from any of them, and the ship has not been in a location since 1948 where anything more than firing very small blank charges could be safely done. Regardless of all of that, there are two major issues that would require attention on all of them to restore them to full operating condition. The recoil buffers are absolutely critical to gun operation and none have been restored, nor have breech plugs been restored to the degree needed for proper operation. Most importantly, the barrels' bores are not in good enough condition to have shells fired through them and would require relining. The shop facilities, furnaces and shrinking pits no longer exist that would be needed to do the work.
Are the 6 surviving 5 inch guns that are still on Texas her original 5" guns or were they added to her in the 1940s? What year were these six guns installed on her?
@@tomscotttheolderone364 Were the 5" guns rebarreled in-house at the dock fairly quickly while in drydock/refit during WWII? That is amazing how she didn't have to switch out the gun barrels like she had to do with the 14" guns (I am so thankful that she was reunited with 9 out of 10 of her original 1914 14" guns in late 1944).
@@nogoodnameleft As I said in my previous reply, the 5" barrels were replaced at least once during WWII. The much smaller size and weight of 5" barrels, as opposed to 14" barrels, made it relatively easy work and could be done quickly at a shipyard. While I don't know the specific method used, there are two that I can think of. What makes most sense was the method very recently used by Battleship Texas Foundation when they were removed for restoration. The barrel and slide assembly was disconnected at the trunnions and they were lifted out through the gun ports using slings and a crane. 3 of the 6 have been reinstalled in the ship using the same method in reverse. You can see short videos and photos of this being done by doing a search in Battleship Texas Foundation's Facebook group.
I imagine that it would be pretty hard to hit something in heavy seas. Even more so, before upgrades, shooting out of sponsons, in heavy seas, when sea water keeps pouring in and out.
Water was a problem for the four mounts closest to the bow and the stern mounted gun. Those were removed by January 1918. Large turret mounted guns were difficult to deal with in heavy seas since their mass didn't allow fast changes to pointing and training them. This meant that they remained pretty stationary, so firing had to be timed to the precise moment that the ship was level. That's pretty hard to do in heavy seas. However, smaller mounts like these 5" guns could be pointed and trained very quickly. Thus, the pointer and trainer took advantage of it with the "continuous aim" technique that had been developed at the turn of the century. That required them to continuously move the gun with the movement of the ship to keep it on target at all times. While they couldn't be completely successful, it kept the gun much more closely aimed than any other technique. The pointer, who elevated the gun, had the hardest job and he was also the one who fired it. So, as he cranked back and forth to try to keep the elevation on target. It still swung up and down some, so he simply timed when to fire by watching the target through his sight. The sight would swing up above the target, then as it fell, he closed the firing key just as his crosshair passed through it. The method proved to be about 10 times more effective than every previous one.
That is an often told story and while it may be true, no one has ever given a reliable source that confirms it. I would really like for it to be a fact, but I and others have looked for documentation and haven't found any.
Mr.Scott's knowledge about BB35 is impressive !! Thanks for another great video !
Once again, technical detail that you just don't get anywhere else. Thanks. I wish I could give it all the likes it deserves.
As a ex USN Gunners Mate Guns I found this presentation simply OUTSTANDING! Thank you, well done!
Thank you! Compliments coming from guys with your qualifications mean a lot to me!
I went on this ship in the 5th or 6th grade in school on a history club trip.I was impressed.
I've toured Texas many times through the years. I was always fascinated by the 5" casemate guns. Excellent presentation here.
Fascinating video! I'm just going to touch on one bit though. The photo of the barefooted Gun Crew..
Tough dang feet, jeez!😬
I like your videos even more than the ones from the Battleship Texas team. Kudos!
Thank you, that is a very kind thing to say! In their defense, their goals are very different than mine, and their content and production values are very good.
It was good to see you and BB35 in person and listen the story live! Thanks for your time and effort.
Well, thanks for coming! Your interest and participation is important!
Once again, you have produced an excellent presentation. Thank you for the deep dive into the details of these historic weapons. I had no idea that these type weapons were the ones used on Wake island to sink the Japanese ship! Keep the great work coming sir!
Thank you! Those are very kind things to say!
Another excellent informative video from Mr Scott!!! Thank you
Nice 👍 work. Great video thank you 😊 ❤
If they ever create the position of ambassador for the USS Texas, you would be the obvious choice for a lifetime appointment.
another incredible video and so detailed, detailed enough i'm sure to be worthy of a full training manual, i wonder how long it took for crews to learn their trades, even though all of this is divided between many crew members doing different tasks, i wonder if a crew could do the job as well after watching your videos, albeit the bosses would have to know there trades, read the numbers and pass them down the chain of command, fairly easy to the crews to do as they are told, turn and wind the gun to whatever direction and elevation, load and fingers in ears
i have been fortunate to fire a large variety of weapons, the largest was only a .50 cal, but it still makes me wonder what the noise must have been like even though most crews might be locked away behind the breach with no huge shock wave coming back at them, still be interesting, may Texas one day will get to fire a few blanks, and break some windows haha
awesome
Amazing engineering for the time. Great video, thanks.
Great job as always! Thanks.
Thanks, Bob! It's good to hear from you!
Great video, Tom!
What a presentation. I've read some of your responses to some of the questions in the comments and I can only ask, how do you know all of this stuff?
Incredible knowledge. Thank you.
Thank you, that is a very nice thing to say. I have three things going for me. I have had very good access to the ship for more than 20 years, allowing me to actually see and touch things so that they very real to me and not just pictures and descriptions. Second, I don't have to answer questions live, but can take whatever time I need to formulate an answer before giving it. Last, I am retired and can spend more time that is healthy studying the ship and her systems.
@@tomscotttheolderone364 You are amazing. Seriously.
Hi Tom, I met you when I was there for the dock tour in July. I have a question about the amidships Fire Control Tower that is shown at Timestamp 8:30. The one just aft of the stack. The red arrow is pointing at the lower window bank facing starboard. My question is just above that, is a round "cupola", with windows and a radar antenna mounted on top. What was inside there? I am guessing it maybe was an Optical Rangefinder for the main battery? Like those stereoscopic telescopes with mirrors inside that determines range when both mirrored images coincide to be in focus. Do you know if there is anything still inside there today? Just curious. Thanks and it was a pleasure meeting you and talking about my friends Bill and Konrad Werzner who helped me obtain some stuff for our historic ships back in Oregon! Jerry
I remember you! I'm glad that you enjoyed the tour. Yes, that is the aft main battery fire control position that contained an optical director for the 14" guns. The director contained a range finder as you said, but it also had computing capabilities that allowed it to correct issues like cross level that could affect readings and calculate range rate, which was the speed that a target moves toward or away.
Tom, any numbers available as to the accuracy of this system on BB-35 in MOA or other metric? Also, how might they compare to the main battery in accuracy? Thanks for the upload!
I don't have any hard data on that. I don't think there was a substantial difference in accuracy between the basic guns and sighting systems. However, there were pretty big differences in fire control capabilities that directly affected accuracy. By WWII, the 14" used the Mk III fire control radar to establish range and bearing, corrected to provide range rate, to the Ford Mk1, Mod11 range keepers that in turn cranked out solutions. The 5" used an optical director that did not have the radar's accuracy to determine corrected range, bearing and range rate. I think, but not sure without checking, that it also used the old Ford MkII (Baby Ford) range keeper to output much simpler solutions. However, it is possible that most of the superiority of the 14" system would be offset by the simple fact that the 5" would more likely be used at 1/2 the ranges of the 14".
@@tomscotttheolderone364 thank you sir
Are they being restored to "short of being able to fire a 5" round" as you said, or "short of having 5" rounds, charges, and primers to fire"?
If the restoration is to a deactivated state, could you give any details on what has been done to affect the deactivation?
I generally assume the term "round" to include shell, charge and primer. Even if that is not the case, one cannot fire a 5" round without a charge and primer.
Nothing has been done to either the 5" or 14" guns on Texas to demilitarize them or intentionally render them inoperative. Theoretically, all could be restored back to operating condition, but it would be a complete waste of the immense amount of money and effort required to do the work. There also be some significant legal issues involved in firing projectiles from any of them, and the ship has not been in a location since 1948 where anything more than firing very small blank charges could be safely done. Regardless of all of that, there are two major issues that would require attention on all of them to restore them to full operating condition. The recoil buffers are absolutely critical to gun operation and none have been restored, nor have breech plugs been restored to the degree needed for proper operation. Most importantly, the barrels' bores are not in good enough condition to have shells fired through them and would require relining. The shop facilities, furnaces and shrinking pits no longer exist that would be needed to do the work.
Are the 6 surviving 5 inch guns that are still on Texas her original 5" guns or were they added to her in the 1940s? What year were these six guns installed on her?
Yes, they are 6 of the original 21 5" guns that were installed on Texas when she was built. They were rebarreled at least once, during WWII.
@@tomscotttheolderone364 Were the 5" guns rebarreled in-house at the dock fairly quickly while in drydock/refit during WWII? That is amazing how she didn't have to switch out the gun barrels like she had to do with the 14" guns (I am so thankful that she was reunited with 9 out of 10 of her original 1914 14" guns in late 1944).
@@nogoodnameleft As I said in my previous reply, the 5" barrels were replaced at least once during WWII. The much smaller size and weight of 5" barrels, as opposed to 14" barrels, made it relatively easy work and could be done quickly at a shipyard. While I don't know the specific method used, there are two that I can think of. What makes most sense was the method very recently used by Battleship Texas Foundation when they were removed for restoration. The barrel and slide assembly was disconnected at the trunnions and they were lifted out through the gun ports using slings and a crane. 3 of the 6 have been reinstalled in the ship using the same method in reverse. You can see short videos and photos of this being done by doing a search in Battleship Texas Foundation's Facebook group.
@@tomscotttheolderone364 Thank you very much. Sorry for my misunderstanding.
I imagine that it would be pretty hard to hit something in heavy seas. Even more so, before upgrades, shooting out of sponsons, in heavy seas, when sea water keeps pouring in and out.
Water was a problem for the four mounts closest to the bow and the stern mounted gun. Those were removed by January 1918. Large turret mounted guns were difficult to deal with in heavy seas since their mass didn't allow fast changes to pointing and training them. This meant that they remained pretty stationary, so firing had to be timed to the precise moment that the ship was level. That's pretty hard to do in heavy seas. However, smaller mounts like these 5" guns could be pointed and trained very quickly. Thus, the pointer and trainer took advantage of it with the "continuous aim" technique that had been developed at the turn of the century. That required them to continuously move the gun with the movement of the ship to keep it on target at all times. While they couldn't be completely successful, it kept the gun much more closely aimed than any other technique. The pointer, who elevated the gun, had the hardest job and he was also the one who fired it. So, as he cranked back and forth to try to keep the elevation on target. It still swung up and down some, so he simply timed when to fire by watching the target through his sight. The sight would swing up above the target, then as it fell, he closed the firing key just as his crosshair passed through it. The method proved to be about 10 times more effective than every previous one.
@@tomscotttheolderone364 Thanks.
The 5" guns on Wake Island came from the Texas. See video from History guy.
That is an often told story and while it may be true, no one has ever given a reliable source that confirms it. I would really like for it to be a fact, but I and others have looked for documentation and haven't found any.
Fast loader
Not quite point and shoot.