If you are looking for a legitimate disc golf coach, look elsewhere. DG Spindoctor does not possess the qualifications or the integrity to earn your support. Not only does he, at times, present information that is incorrect, he actively seeks to censor and remove anyone who questions him or presents facts that disprove his statements. He lacks a clear understanding of the terminology as it relates to disc golf, which is a KEY FUNDAMENTAL when teaching someone. It would also appear that he jumps on here and argues his false points on other accounts, which shows an even further lack of integrity. He is doing everyone who takes his word literal an injustice, and he should not be supported. This comment will likely be deleted, because of course, he lacks integrity and seeks to censor those who show him to be wrong. If you are trying to do yourself a favor by seeking knowledge so that your game can grow, you’d be better served literally anywhere else.
I think you're mistaken. I'm not commenting on other accounts unless I like the content. Also, only clearly hateful and unstable comments get deleted, and all these years, there have been only a handful. If you're writing comments that RUclips deems inappropriate, they don't show even to me unless I look for them. I found some of your comments under the banned tab because you called other commenters names. There is a reason why your comments get banned, and the reason is your hateful demeanour. I also encourage everyone to unsubscribe from me and follow others if that helps them feel better. I believe everyone is entitled to do what suits them best, and it would make me unhappy to know people listen to me without their consent. If you feel RUclips is a zero-sum game, please support others and avoid wasting your time on content you feel bad about.
I personally use about 25 fewer throws per round these days and thats because of these videos. If I were rich, I would give him a million, because of him I no longer rage on the course, but laugh and smile. Maybe this channel just isn't for you. There's OT disc golf, trebuchet disc golf, Leon Sonnleitner, Seabas22, etc. Check those channels, maybe you like those more. Good luck mate.
You just completely described the solution to the problem that I solved about 1 month ago after I recorded myself driving. I 100% agree with you, it should not be called a reach back. I went from throwing high 300' to mid 400's within two weekends after making the adjustments you described in your video. 👍😊
Yours and Scott Stokelys videos are hands down the best form/advice videos out there. Every time I watch one of ur posts I always come away feeling like I learned at least one very important piece of knowledge.
As an older player I can’t thank you enough for this video. The ravages of time make it difficult to get through a round at times. Doing it the wrong way invariably takes more energy. You helped me do more of my favorite activity. 🤠
I want to thank you for this video. I’ve been waiting for my “ah ha!” moment and you delivered it to me on a silver platter. I was reaching out far on my “reach back” to make myself longer and it was causing my timing to be off. I was trying to get over my lead foot too fast before I braced and I couldn’t fix it because I was off balance. I shortened my “reach back” today and I was throwing farther with much less effort. It made it sooo much easier to brace before I threw! Thank you again for this video 💪
I also had the same thought that it would force a hyzer, I'll have to do some field work and see how it goes. I can tell you that I replicated your tilt & twist while I was standing in front of the computer and I felt it all the way through my core (which I hadn't before.) I'm kinda stuck at about 320ish feet and I know I'm missing something...I'm hoping this helps :) BTW, thanks for your instruction videos. I always find them helpful!
One has to love how you keep demolishing the foundational concepts of disc golf! By 'demolishing' I mean showing how the concepts were fundamentally incorrect -- and showing how to re-think the very basics of the game. (By 'incorrect' I mean that the techniques shown were probably right but the concepts themselves were explained using incorrect language [such as reachback, which caused me to lean back], which led people like myself to misinterpret them). I am in the process of unlearning years of learning of misleading and incorrect concepts and learning how to fix my form. I find your videos perhaps the most informative -- and ground-breaking -- that are out there. Have also found a lot of help from the Overthrow videos. There are other occasional useful ones, but yours are certainly the most consistently transformative. Then there are lots of videos I wish I had never seen and followed when beginning my journey -- but then again, you were not around yet at that time.
Y’all are so lucky to get these kind of quality videos now. When I started they taught everything wrong, and when you start off wrong and continue it for 4-5 years, it’s damn near impossible to change. Great video 👏
Right! I started in 2000, and I had a VHS tape of home videos some of our local heroes had filmed in tournaments in Finland and the U.S., Climo, Barry, Stokely. I learned to watch it in slow motion, pressing pause/play, pause/play. Blurry as hell. Didn't matter, I kinda got the right ideas I think. Then I learned all the wrong things about starting the lawn mower. Nobody talked about bracing or the follow through. Fast Forward 20 years and I started teaching, because nobody else would. At that point I had ruined my game enough to know that I will never get to the top, not even top my prime of 970-980 average. But I'm happy to help others avoid all the mistakes that made my game so bad. Thank you for commenting, and good luck!
Coming from tennis (backhand mechanism) this made sense to me and works best out of maybe 6 different methods I have tried from youtube. Edit: subscribed
The cues "reach back", "pull through", and "start the lawnmower" have caused more harm than good for many (if not most) players starting to learn how to throw.
Sadly so. I work with language as a writer. For me the tiny nuances make big differences, and I totally believe our brain makes such connections with words and concepts. They do matter.
@@dgspindoctor Yessir! A lot of people learn to throw without any assistance from others. They watch a few videos and do their best. I'm just glad the disc golf coaching scene has gotten so much better on this platform. You and the others are helping turn this ship around!
Fantastic Video, I did the coil and my freaking knees moved all by themselves! I always thought you had to force move them to generate the twisting action from the coil. Turns out I just have never coiled before now. I cannot wait to try this out! Thank you!
It's crazy, but it wasn't until like 3/4 of the way through this video that I realized it wasn't about golf lol. Everything you just said applies to both sports and for the exact same reason, so for those trying to create power in a golf swing this is an excellent video as well about how to coil properly. Great stuff!
Brotha I've made like 6 videos in my life and I just KNOW you spent a stupid amount of time making that echo on "COIL" work. Great video thanks man! Just to nitpick, that Eagle shot is clearly a hyzer-flip, but that doesn't mean you're not 100% right anyways (that shot is IMO the single most amazing shot ever caught on camera!).
Pure gold as usual! That body position also makes a lot of space for the disc to whip through the pocket. Big points here are keeping your weight center and creating a coil between hips and shoulders. I think one issue some folks have with learning how to do this is that they tend to reach out too far without getting the disc back in which can lead to shoulder stretch injuries. No matter how far away from the body the disc is on the reach out (back) make sure it comes back enough so your elbow gets back into the 90 degree angle before final release.
Thank You! This was both greatly informative and also slightly crushing, corrected an unrealized major error but also highlighted how I've been practicing bad form and have some retraining to do. I appreciate your effort and thank you for the different perspective.
Thanks for all the video, DG! The only thing I'd like to see here is a breakdown of how this would be integrated into the X-Step/a tee-off throw. What is the timing of the coil? When should it happen? As soon as your lead foot starts coming off the ground, or more as you're in the middle of coming forward with the lead foot (but not yet planting), or right before the planting of that lead foot? It would also be great to see the sequence show how the coil creates that "reach" (what is the throwing arm doing as you're coil and how is it getting to that reach point as you're coiling). Stuff like that. Just a slow breakdown of the progression and implementation in an actual throwing sequence. Thanks again for the content!
Thanks. I haven't touched this topic because it's very individual and not that important. I have made a video highlighting the fact, that whatever you do, try to reach a certain position right before the actual throw. That's it, really.
I’ve been doing the coil with my torso but I’ve never thought about leaning forward a bit I feel like that would help reduce hitting my chest during the power pocket phase of the throw great video I’m glad you put these out without charging
I am happy to share my belief that knowledge is free and abundant and that it is not something to be owned but rather a gift to be shared. Every person is a vessel through which it can travel to pass it on to others.
I just recently understood what coil really meant, after 18 months of excessively reaching back. For me a good cue was to rotate the left shoulder towards the target.
I really appreciate your explanation of this! I have been struggling when learning to throw nose-down to not throw a late release anhyzer shot and this feels like just the thing fix all 3 of these errors! I don't have these errors when throwing a mid-low power standstill shot (not engaging much more than my arm and shoulders) so this really seems like it might be my issue.
I thank you, and think you're right. Late release annies are most often a symptom of standing up during the swing, or not keeping the swing plane level like a hoola-hoop. This might fix that problem.
Honestly, this tip/video is probably the best bit of advice and explanation I've ever seen (as far as throwing discs is concerned). It makes SO much sense, much more so than any other explanation I've seen so far. Clear (very), concise, straight to the point, at seems at least to be exactly on point............fantastic. Your title says that it really is simple, and it is..........but I've never seen anyone else lay it out so. THANK YOU for posting this. I've never subscribed or followed any channels before....this is the first time ever that has tempted me. I will absolutely be checking out all your other content for sure, at the very least.
Thanks for new and more perspectives of form!!! :-) Would be lovely to hear your coil viewpoints on what angle difference between hips and shoulders make to your control and power ("rubber effect"). Eagle is one that is extreme in it. Tiger Woods in ball golf, for example, was well known for this ability. Can you make a video on this? ;-) Thanks again for good videos!
❤ kinda mad at how long I've been playing and I'm finally actually learning to throw. hopefully between you and OT no one else will spend 7 years playing before they actually understand how to move a disc.
This could just be the thing that unlocks my throwing potential. I have always done the "lean on to the back leg" thing before instead of coiling and gotten 200ft at most.
Just came back from field practice. Implemented what you said for the first time. Feels like pro form now. Achieved my max distance with less effort and more consistency. After more practice, I think I’ll add more distance, too. Thanks! 👍🏼🥏
Like the lesson. Telling ppl what to do never works, but letting ppl visualize it does. One note though, that Eagle shot didn't really look like an anhizer but more of a hyzer flip. He might have thrown the disc somewhat flat but certainly not with right on it.
@dgspindoctor I'm sorry, but for it to an "anhyzer" it has to be thrown on an anhyzer angle. That's what makes it an anhyzer. If it's thrown with hyzer and flips over it's called a hyzer flip. Here's Innovas definition: Anhyzer. An angle of release where the outside edge or left edge of the disc is tilted upward for a RHBH thrower. It mentions only the angle of release bc that's the only thing that matters for it to be an anhyzer.
Then I guess Gannon and Drew are not throwing anhyzers in their videos for Seekr and Overthrow. Even the best pros don't know how to throw. You should probably go teach them?
This is critical for me to hear right now, thank you. I have been playing poorly for over forty years. I love the game, but I have a brain I jury that makes uncoiling my body almost impossible, as the act of rotating my body causes vertigo, and the whole world begins spinning wildly. I'm currently forearm dominant. However, I would like to add a back hand to my repertoire. I think this less spinny style might work. Critically, I need to keep my head facing the same direction. I'm in my sixties, so flexibility is an issue. This might sound like a lot of whining, but I'm just working towards my personal best. Thank you for helping!
Hey man, go ahead and whine if you feel like it. We need to do that every once in a while, we are not machines or monks here. I hope this version of a coil helps you get some torque to your throws.
I've been practicing the backhand in slo-mo today. I think I can do this. It feels right. I look where I'm going to throw while reaching back to just past my waist. Then I uncoil keeping the disc close to my body until my core rotation extends my arm forward to the final snap. If you looked at that uncoiling from above, as you move forward, it looks like a spiral in reverse, finishing in the tight coil snap. At least, that's the visualization that works for me. I can't really do a run-up, but I can at least take a step. My dream throw would be 300'. Again, thanks for the inspiration!
I could, but I try to avoid all the minutiae and focus on the big picture to let individual bodies work without forced positions. Thanks for the suggestion, though!
Jist got into this sport. So ofcourse i have been watching a lot of videos. And there is so much contradictions between different youtubers its crazy. Thing im gonna stick to this one tho
That turnover that Eagle threw was a hyzer flip that turned over. But still, I agree with your overall assessment of the coil. I just also think that mastering the hyzer is what truly unlocks real shot shaping, since the hyzer can be the foundation of all shot shapes, disc depending.
@@dgspindoctor sure it did. But the angle it was released on was hyzer. As you know, the disc being understable is what caused it to flip over and then commit to the turn.
To be honest, it's not that much of a hyzer. And if Eagle throws hyzer flips, it's not necessarily bad. And yes, I might have heard about the hyzer flip before 😏.
@@dgspindoctor😆 vai ei ollu paljoo hyzer mut oli kuitenki mitä toi meinaa? Tai no siis hyzer kulmassa. Vai eks vaa huomannu eka et oli hyzer flippi nii laitoit. En tiiä ehkä ignooraa tää mun kommenti en tiiä paljoo vielä.
Good info. I've been forgetting that down/forward first move in the coil. That's where I get messed up. Good stuff. Sorry, I can't do emojis. I'm of a certain age and we think those things are a little tootie fruity ah Rudy. No offense.
4:11 and pause "looking at right picture" if you held your body still and pulled through with arm the release point would be like 2oclock vs 10oclock.. what i did was put my right foot more to the right so almost like im throwing slightly left of my target but in reality its not bcuz now my pull through line is actually straight bcuz ive shown more back to 10oclock vs you more like a out in and out motion! this tweak has my lines incredibly accurate at nearly any distance with any wind condition! lmk what you think about that realization hoping its not just a me thing but something that is legit for everyone..?
I'm not sure if I read you correctly, but yes, straight line for feet is my ideal. I can't do it, because I have the mobility of a crowbar, but I would if I could.
What are your thoughts on getting maximum spin? I know more spin equates to more distance. However, I dont see any tell tell signs of top players doing the same things to achieve it. Am I supposed to curl my wrist around the disc more? If so, exactly where...pre pocket, the pocket, etc.? A video of your thoughts would be great. I'm 60 and have been playing for about a year, and with the use of your videos, I'm hitting 300 feet consistently, but I believe I can hit 350-400. Keep em coming. Thanks!
I don't believe you actually can pop the wrist to create spin. You can put the disc deeper into your palm and then grip it harder with the index so that it spins around the tip of the finger at the release. Also the deep pocket might add some spin, too. Just don't open the wrist too early or tense it, and it will work just fine.
thanks for the video. I will give it a try on my next practice. The thing I disagree is the video of Eagle McMahon. He is throwing a hyzerflip, not an anhyzer.
Do you coil against the front leg or back leg? When I do it, my front leg hasn't landed yet, so I have nothing to coil against, unless I use the back leg, and that causes timing issues. 😂
Great vid, agree with everything except the bit about Eagles anhyzer shot shape I think could've used some additional context to clarify release angle vs shot shape. The Eagle example is an anhyzer shape but not an anhyzer release (I assume this is why you said "shape"); the release was a decent amount of hyzer but it flipped up and turned so much since he throws so friggin hard, lol. I do think it's best to prioritize teaching and learning hyzer release angles and posture though since hyzer release angles are so much more useful. Many of the drives commentators call anhyzers, or turn overs are released on some combination of hyzer, speed, disc, wind combination that causes the turn. Sometimes though they have to release on anhyzer or close to flat (for more immediate turn) to force more anhyzer early on and there are some differences in the posture used, although the posture still looks a lot more like hyzer posture than many people probably think if asked to recall it from memory and it's still possible to start more fully in a hyzer posture and transition into more anhyzer posture. It's actually hard to find example shots from Eagle, since hyzer release angle is so much more common, but this is a good comparison and it's still probably a tiny hyzer release angle: i.imgur.com/KDWRsYb.png ruclips.net/video/l7A6MfuUsQI/видео.html
His hinge creates the illusion that it’s a hyzer but Brian Earheart in the very clip discussed explains he’s throwing a turnover. Look at the peak of eagles reach back, he’s clearly trying to force the disc over. Look at the arc of his shot, flattish reach back, flat release, follows through lower than the release angle, that’s a forced turn over. A hyzer flip starts with a low reach back, a hyzer release, and a high follow through, the under stability of the disc does all the work, that’s not at all what happened in eagles 700 foot shot. C-line dd3’s aren’t a nuke OS, but still one of the more stable molds out there, they aren’t hyzer flip discs even for a guy like Eagle.
@@lankstadiscs Despite all of this you can clearly see (see pics linked below) when you go frame by frame that the disc is released on over 20 degrees of hyzer, the follow through perfectly matches the amount of hyzer (his arm blocks the disc perfectly for a few frames on the same hyzer angle), and the disc even after it's been blocked for a few frames remains on quite a bit of hyzer once it is visible again before it starts flipping and turning: i.imgur.com/3rlzm5B.png If he had closer to a flat releaes angle or on any anhyzer with all else equal (disc, wind, speed, etc.), the disc would have never come out of the anhyzer. It still makes sense for people to call it a turnover because that is the most obvious shot shape you see when you watch it in real time. People don't watch it frame by frame so they don't see it. If you watch it frame by frame it's actually a hyzer flip to a late turn S curve shape. His form is clearly not his flat release angle / anhyzer form: i.imgur.com/KDWRsYb.png This is the same type of release angle + shot shape thrown in distance competitions. Nearly every throw in distance comps is on a lot of hyzer on release to avoid turn and burn but hopefully get the perfect amount of turn.
Heitin uuden pituusennätyksen(kaksi kertaa) tästä ja aikaisemmasta(best way to brace) videosta poimituilla vinkeillä. Sain aikaan todellisen ahaa elämyksen kentällä. Ps. Liekkö ois saanut parannettua vieläkin useammin, nuo oli vaan kaksi viimeistä heittoa, kun sattui pari nopeampaa kiekkkoa olemaan mukana puttereiden ja midareiden lisäksi.
@@dgspindoctor All I'm saying is that his release angle is in hyzer and I believe you talked about every release angle being available from that same coil posture with minor adjustments. I guess it's semantics, but to me Eagle's shot is a turn over, meaning hyzer that turns over into anhyzer. I actually tried to find some video about the coiling postures for different release angles and found a very good one from Seekr Disc Golf YT channel. There is a 3 minute clip of Gannon Buhr throwing every angle with every disc type and the lean angle changes dramatically from hyzer to anhyzer. I know this is a topic where opinions differ and it might change from thrower to thrower, but to me that Gannon clip was pretty interesting and very much in line with what I expected to see.
That Seekr clip is gold, for sure! And these kids, they are SO mobile and lanky they can do whatever they want with their torso. I have to turn my hips a lot more with the shoulders, as do many of us. I believe a slight hyzer tilt is the easiest, most balanced way to throw and then the angles are made with the arm and the wrist, and follow through and all. This is what I teach, any way.
I hear a lot of people get stuck on that. Funny, though. That's one of the biggest obstacles people face when learning. For example, you want to get the disc to fly from left to right (right-hander) and glide 700 feet in an Annie, but you won't want to learn that because it's not a legit Anhyzer release. Am I right? Thanks for the comment!
It's actually very rare to throw pure anhyzer the way Internet disc golfers describe it. If the angle has to be anhyzer at the release, most discs flip over and burn to the ground.
How about 100%? It's not about not being on your back leg (at some point) but to not lean on it. And the percentage is 100% at one point, and it should also be 100% on the front at one point.
For RHBH, if you lean back (to the left) does that cause you to relase the disc high up into the air? Also how you do coil and not throw on a hyzer? Ive tried something like this and couldnt get the disc flat.
Thanks for watching! First question: Not necessarily; it just means you get slow and sway your upper body instead of letting it rotate. Second question: no, not at all, as I said in the video. You need to find a way to throw it flat or annie. That happens, usually by tweaking the arm path and following through.
They are Groundies, which, I think are cheaper but I like them as much. These have no friction on the bottom, so they are street shoes, but I've used only Vivos for a few years and will not go back. I was sponsored by them, but not anymore, so I have incentive to endorse them, other than... I like 'em.
4:25 "Longest greatest anhyzer" ... That was not even an anhyzer throw; it was released on a notable hyzer and turned over into an annie. It was a sweet turnover shot, dgmr, but not really great at alleviating concerns about your technique resulting in throwing on a hyzer.
@@dgspindoctor I did have a look through some of the comments but couldn't spot it discussed, my bad for missing them I guess. If the subject keeps popping up, maybe instead of worthless responses you should pin one of the comments where it was discussed so it's easy to find , or put a explanation in the description. If you felt the subject has been done to death and not worth addressing, which you clearly did, you could have just ignored the comment and saved the time of replying.
Yeah, sorry. It's just that I get a bit frustrared hearing the exact same thing pointed at me, and sometimes, as a content creator, it feels a bit unnecessary to keep getting the same comments. Especially when all I try to do is help people get better at disc golf, for free, and this is the thanks I get for that.
I hear a lot of people get stuck on that. Funny, though. That's one of the biggest obstacles people face when learning. For example, you want to get the disc to fly from left to right (right-hander) and glide 700 feet in an Annie, but you won't want to learn that because it's not a legit Anhyzer release. Am I right? Thanks for the comment!
What? 😂 All I'm saying is that was a bad example of an anny. If that was an very overstable disc, it would have been just a hyzer. Like I said, would you call a flex shot with an overstable disc a hyzer?
@@Pronto90 Why would you throw a 700ft flex with a very overstable disc? I'm trying to say: learn to throw a shot that flies 700ft from left to right, and you don't even care what name of a shot you threw.
Come on, the point is not how far the disc flies. It was just a bad example of an anhyzer because it was clearly a hyzer flip. Just like you would not demonstrate a hyzer by releasing something overstabe on an anny and letting it dump left.
4:30 Not actually Anhyzer, it's a Hyzer flip. You can see the disc on Hyzer as it leaves Eagles lair... but flips up and over to Anhyzer for its main flight. (agree with all that is said. just not the best example used). 🗑 🌳 🤾 💖
This video totally screwed up my game. Why? Because now I have to re-learn which discs to use. Why? Because now they all go farther than they used to with the same amount of effort! Why? Proper mechanics. Thank you Doctor!!
If you are looking for a legitimate disc golf coach, look elsewhere. DG Spindoctor does not possess the qualifications or the integrity to earn your support. Not only does he, at times, present information that is incorrect, he actively seeks to censor and remove anyone who questions him or presents facts that disprove his statements. He lacks a clear understanding of the terminology as it relates to disc golf, which is a KEY FUNDAMENTAL when teaching someone. It would also appear that he jumps on here and argues his false points on other accounts, which shows an even further lack of integrity. He is doing everyone who takes his word literal an injustice, and he should not be supported.
This comment will likely be deleted, because of course, he lacks integrity and seeks to censor those who show him to be wrong. If you are trying to do yourself a favor by seeking knowledge so that your game can grow, you’d be better served literally anywhere else.
I think you're mistaken.
I'm not commenting on other accounts unless I like the content.
Also, only clearly hateful and unstable comments get deleted, and all these years, there have been only a handful. If you're writing comments that RUclips deems inappropriate, they don't show even to me unless I look for them. I found some of your comments under the banned tab because you called other commenters names. There is a reason why your comments get banned, and the reason is your hateful demeanour.
I also encourage everyone to unsubscribe from me and follow others if that helps them feel better. I believe everyone is entitled to do what suits them best, and it would make me unhappy to know people listen to me without their consent.
If you feel RUclips is a zero-sum game, please support others and avoid wasting your time on content you feel bad about.
Get a life dude
Lol triggered much? Don’t let the door hit you….
I personally use about 25 fewer throws per round these days and thats because of these videos. If I were rich, I would give him a million, because of him I no longer rage on the course, but laugh and smile. Maybe this channel just isn't for you. There's OT disc golf, trebuchet disc golf, Leon Sonnleitner, Seabas22, etc. Check those channels, maybe you like those more. Good luck mate.
I didn't know you could delete comments. I've always wondered why there are almost no negetive comments on disc golf training videos.
You just completely described the solution to the problem that I solved about 1 month ago after I recorded myself driving.
I 100% agree with you, it should not be called a reach back. I went from throwing high 300' to mid 400's within two weekends after making the adjustments you described in your video.
👍😊
Fantastic! This is goes to show that it's usually a very small fix that has the biggest impact.
This is the best explanation and demonstration of the coil and reach back I have seen. Bravo!
Yours and Scott Stokelys videos are hands down the best form/advice videos out there. Every time I watch one of ur posts I always come away feeling like I learned at least one very important piece of knowledge.
Glad you like them! I think Scott is one of the best, too, if not THE best. He seems to make everything easy to understand.
As an older player I can’t thank you enough for this video.
The ravages of time make it difficult to get through a round at times.
Doing it the wrong way invariably takes more energy.
You helped me do more of my favorite activity. 🤠
Thank you! This is the reason I make the videos. Help people enjoy their free time a little more. Keep it up!
Your teaching on tilting a little bit to the front and then coiling was a light bulb to me! It feels very right! Now to the field😊
Excellent! Go for it!
I want to thank you for this video. I’ve been waiting for my “ah ha!” moment and you delivered it to me on a silver platter. I was reaching out far on my “reach back” to make myself longer and it was causing my timing to be off. I was trying to get over my lead foot too fast before I braced and I couldn’t fix it because I was off balance. I shortened my “reach back” today and I was throwing farther with much less effort. It made it sooo much easier to brace before I threw! Thank you again for this video 💪
Wow! That is quite something! Glad you got it solved!
I also had the same thought that it would force a hyzer, I'll have to do some field work and see how it goes. I can tell you that I replicated your tilt & twist while I was standing in front of the computer and I felt it all the way through my core (which I hadn't before.) I'm kinda stuck at about 320ish feet and I know I'm missing something...I'm hoping this helps :)
BTW, thanks for your instruction videos. I always find them helpful!
That is the way to coil even if you throw annies. The body angle is not everything. See the thumbnail, for instance :)
I hope this works for you!
I struggle to get my backhand form right…your explanation/lesson has helped a lot.
Five minutes and forty seconds of pure and precise information. Thank you.
Glad you enjoyed it!
One has to love how you keep demolishing the foundational concepts of disc golf! By 'demolishing' I mean showing how the concepts were fundamentally incorrect -- and showing how to re-think the very basics of the game. (By 'incorrect' I mean that the techniques shown were probably right but the concepts themselves were explained using incorrect language [such as reachback, which caused me to lean back], which led people like myself to misinterpret them). I am in the process of unlearning years of learning of misleading and incorrect concepts and learning how to fix my form. I find your videos perhaps the most informative -- and ground-breaking -- that are out there. Have also found a lot of help from the Overthrow videos. There are other occasional useful ones, but yours are certainly the most consistently transformative. Then there are lots of videos I wish I had never seen and followed when beginning my journey -- but then again, you were not around yet at that time.
Thank you! I also like Overthrow, they make good videos!
This is one i will watch many times...well, I watch most of your videos many times. Thanks so much!
Glad you enjoy it!
Y’all are so lucky to get these kind of quality videos now. When I started they taught everything wrong, and when you start off wrong and continue it for 4-5 years, it’s damn near impossible to change.
Great video 👏
Right! I started in 2000, and I had a VHS tape of home videos some of our local heroes had filmed in tournaments in Finland and the U.S., Climo, Barry, Stokely. I learned to watch it in slow motion, pressing pause/play, pause/play. Blurry as hell. Didn't matter, I kinda got the right ideas I think.
Then I learned all the wrong things about starting the lawn mower. Nobody talked about bracing or the follow through.
Fast Forward 20 years and I started teaching, because nobody else would. At that point I had ruined my game enough to know that I will never get to the top, not even top my prime of 970-980 average. But I'm happy to help others avoid all the mistakes that made my game so bad.
Thank you for commenting, and good luck!
Coming from tennis (backhand mechanism) this made sense to me and works best out of maybe 6 different methods I have tried from youtube.
Edit: subscribed
Glad it helped!
I averaged 1.5-2 less throws on each basket at my local course after practicing your video!
Crazy how much it already helped me 👏👏
The cues "reach back", "pull through", and "start the lawnmower" have caused more harm than good for many (if not most) players starting to learn how to throw.
Sadly so. I work with language as a writer. For me the tiny nuances make big differences, and I totally believe our brain makes such connections with words and concepts. They do matter.
@@dgspindoctor Yessir! A lot of people learn to throw without any assistance from others. They watch a few videos and do their best. I'm just glad the disc golf coaching scene has gotten so much better on this platform. You and the others are helping turn this ship around!
We do our best to make a small difference in our beloved sport. Thanks for being a part of it!
Fantastic Video, I did the coil and my freaking knees moved all by themselves! I always thought you had to force move them to generate the twisting action from the coil.
Turns out I just have never coiled before now. I cannot wait to try this out! Thank you!
Glad you enjoyed it!
It's crazy, but it wasn't until like 3/4 of the way through this video that I realized it wasn't about golf lol. Everything you just said applies to both sports and for the exact same reason, so for those trying to create power in a golf swing this is an excellent video as well about how to coil properly. Great stuff!
Crazy how similar they are! But I guess having GOLF in the name is not a coincidence, huh? 🫡
Brilliant! Great explanation.... thank you.
I'll give this a go tomorrow. Just started playing disc golf this summer, the throwing is a lot harder than what I thought it would be.
Ha, yeah, it looks SO EASY. But is not. Enjoy the journey!
Brotha I've made like 6 videos in my life and I just KNOW you spent a stupid amount of time making that echo on "COIL" work. Great video thanks man!
Just to nitpick, that Eagle shot is clearly a hyzer-flip, but that doesn't mean you're not 100% right anyways (that shot is IMO the single most amazing shot ever caught on camera!).
Haha, yeah, I spent the whole year's budget on the echo.
Pure gold as usual! That body position also makes a lot of space for the disc to whip through the pocket. Big points here are keeping your weight center and creating a coil between hips and shoulders. I think one issue some folks have with learning how to do this is that they tend to reach out too far without getting the disc back in which can lead to shoulder stretch injuries. No matter how far away from the body the disc is on the reach out (back) make sure it comes back enough so your elbow gets back into the 90 degree angle before final release.
Words of wisdom.
great video man and cool for you to keep it free for the ppl out there!
Always!
Thank You! This was both greatly informative and also slightly crushing, corrected an unrealized major error but also highlighted how I've been practicing bad form and have some retraining to do. I appreciate your effort and thank you for the different perspective.
Thank you for watching and commenting! Good luck for your practice!
Spin Dr hits another one out of the park, well done!!!
🫶 Good content. I’ll work on it. That shot by Eagle was poetry in motion 🦅
He is so good!
❤ Thanks for your videos, they have added 100-150’ to my drives over the past year.
That is awesome! Big progress right there.
Can't wait to try and incorporate these tips in the field. Thanks!
Have fun!
Thank you for this..trying it tomorrow and will report back here results 🤙🏽
Thank you and please!
Thanks for all the video, DG! The only thing I'd like to see here is a breakdown of how this would be integrated into the X-Step/a tee-off throw. What is the timing of the coil? When should it happen? As soon as your lead foot starts coming off the ground, or more as you're in the middle of coming forward with the lead foot (but not yet planting), or right before the planting of that lead foot? It would also be great to see the sequence show how the coil creates that "reach" (what is the throwing arm doing as you're coil and how is it getting to that reach point as you're coiling). Stuff like that.
Just a slow breakdown of the progression and implementation in an actual throwing sequence.
Thanks again for the content!
Thanks. I haven't touched this topic because it's very individual and not that important. I have made a video highlighting the fact, that whatever you do, try to reach a certain position right before the actual throw. That's it, really.
I’ve been doing the coil with my torso but I’ve never thought about leaning forward a bit I feel like that would help reduce hitting my chest during the power pocket phase of the throw great video I’m glad you put these out without charging
I am happy to share my belief that knowledge is free and abundant and that it is not something to be owned but rather a gift to be shared. Every person is a vessel through which it can travel to pass it on to others.
❤️ great video, and I heard my question in your video! Going to try the down and coil method tomorrow.
Hope you like it! If you get too hyzer, lift the arm, tilt the disc. Eagle throws basically all his shots from this kind of posture.
Thank you sir
You're most welcome!
Really good video that makes coiling easy and that Eagle shot is one of my favourite shots of all time but I think it might be a hyzer flip
Thanks. Check the release closely. Not that much of a hyzer, and still, does it matter? The disc flew to the right with a glide.
Great explanation!❤
Thank you!! Just the tip I needed to be more consistent. Would love see a video with Jacky Chen and show case the local disc golf scene
I just recently understood what coil really meant, after 18 months of excessively reaching back. For me a good cue was to rotate the left shoulder towards the target.
Whatever works for you, that is the key. Glad you figured it out!
I'll have to try to do this and see how it feels. I only throw standstills though.
♥ You always explain everything out.
Well, I try to at least.
Best teaching vids by far !! ❤
Wow, thank you!
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🫀 good things!
I really appreciate your explanation of this! I have been struggling when learning to throw nose-down to not throw a late release anhyzer shot and this feels like just the thing fix all 3 of these errors! I don't have these errors when throwing a mid-low power standstill shot (not engaging much more than my arm and shoulders) so this really seems like it might be my issue.
I thank you, and think you're right. Late release annies are most often a symptom of standing up during the swing, or not keeping the swing plane level like a hoola-hoop. This might fix that problem.
❤️ Great stuff
Glad you like it!
Excellent ! Thank you !
Thank you too!
Honestly, this tip/video is probably the best bit of advice and explanation I've ever seen (as far as throwing discs is concerned). It makes SO much sense, much more so than any other explanation I've seen so far. Clear (very), concise, straight to the point, at seems at least to be exactly on point............fantastic. Your title says that it really is simple, and it is..........but I've never seen anyone else lay it out so. THANK YOU for posting this. I've never subscribed or followed any channels before....this is the first time ever that has tempted me. I will absolutely be checking out all your other content for sure, at the very least.
Oh thank you for your words! Very kind of you. And I'm honored to be among your very few subscribed channels.
Luv!!!!
Thanks for new and more perspectives of form!!! :-) Would be lovely to hear your coil viewpoints on what angle difference between hips and shoulders make to your control and power ("rubber effect"). Eagle is one that is extreme in it. Tiger Woods in ball golf, for example, was well known for this ability. Can you make a video on this? ;-) Thanks again for good videos!
WELL DONE VIDEO
❤ kinda mad at how long I've been playing and I'm finally actually learning to throw. hopefully between you and OT no one else will spend 7 years playing before they actually understand how to move a disc.
Hey, I've spent nearly 25 years and I am slowly beginning to have a hunch.
@@dgspindoctor touche! Fair enough brother. Thanks for what you do.
Great video! Thanks for the very helpful information and perspective!
Glad it was helpful!
This could just be the thing that unlocks my throwing potential. I have always done the "lean on to the back leg" thing before instead of coiling and gotten 200ft at most.
You got this!
@@dgspindoctor Thx for the response/cheer! Little extra motivation for training. :D
You're making the competition better which I don't like. . Jk excellent as always.
Always good concise explanations.
Glad you like them!
❤. Thank you!
You are so welcome!
Thanks for the good tips!!!❤❤
Any time!
Just came back from field practice. Implemented what you said for the first time. Feels like pro form now. Achieved my max distance with less effort and more consistency. After more practice, I think I’ll add more distance, too. Thanks! 👍🏼🥏
This is fabulous news! Thank you for letting me know!
Like the lesson. Telling ppl what to do never works, but letting ppl visualize it does.
One note though, that Eagle shot didn't really look like an anhizer but more of a hyzer flip. He might have thrown the disc somewhat flat but certainly not with right on it.
Pros almost never throw their "anhyzers" in an "anhyzer" angle. But yeah, thanks!
@dgspindoctor I'm sorry, but for it to an "anhyzer" it has to be thrown on an anhyzer angle. That's what makes it an anhyzer. If it's thrown with hyzer and flips over it's called a hyzer flip.
Here's Innovas definition: Anhyzer. An angle of release where the outside edge or left edge of the disc is tilted upward for a RHBH thrower.
It mentions only the angle of release bc that's the only thing that matters for it to be an anhyzer.
Then I guess Gannon and Drew are not throwing anhyzers in their videos for Seekr and Overthrow. Even the best pros don't know how to throw. You should probably go teach them?
Good stuff thanks!
This is critical for me to hear right now, thank you. I have been playing poorly for over forty years. I love the game, but I have a brain I jury that makes uncoiling my body almost impossible, as the act of rotating my body causes vertigo, and the whole world begins spinning wildly.
I'm currently forearm dominant. However, I would like to add a back hand to my repertoire. I think this less spinny style might work. Critically, I need to keep my head facing the same direction. I'm in my sixties, so flexibility is an issue.
This might sound like a lot of whining, but I'm just working towards my personal best. Thank you for helping!
Hey man, go ahead and whine if you feel like it. We need to do that every once in a while, we are not machines or monks here.
I hope this version of a coil helps you get some torque to your throws.
I've been practicing the backhand in slo-mo today. I think I can do this. It feels right. I look where I'm going to throw while reaching back to just past my waist. Then I uncoil keeping the disc close to my body until my core rotation extends my arm forward to the final snap.
If you looked at that uncoiling from above, as you move forward, it looks like a spiral in reverse, finishing in the tight coil snap.
At least, that's the visualization that works for me. I can't really do a run-up, but I can at least take a step. My dream throw would be 300'.
Again, thanks for the inspiration!
@@SoloBattles You got this, I'm sure!
💚Thank you sir
Could you do a video on elbow position, ulnar deviation, wrist supination? Basically, the biomechanics of the throwing arm. Thanks Doc!
I could, but I try to avoid all the minutiae and focus on the big picture to let individual bodies work without forced positions. Thanks for the suggestion, though!
Jist got into this sport. So ofcourse i have been watching a lot of videos. And there is so much contradictions between different youtubers its crazy. Thing im gonna stick to this one tho
Get the disc far out from your body and you're got to go, or throw!
okay Eagle has the manliest huck face in the game. didn't expect that.
Great video.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Great vid as always ❤
Glad you enjoyed!
💟 coil>reach back
Right!
That turnover that Eagle threw was a hyzer flip that turned over. But still, I agree with your overall assessment of the coil. I just also think that mastering the hyzer is what truly unlocks real shot shaping, since the hyzer can be the foundation of all shot shapes, disc depending.
But the disc flew like it was anhyzer, which is the point. And yes, hyzer is the easiest, the foundation.
@@dgspindoctor sure it did. But the angle it was released on was hyzer. As you know, the disc being understable is what caused it to flip over and then commit to the turn.
To be honest, it's not that much of a hyzer. And if Eagle throws hyzer flips, it's not necessarily bad. And yes, I might have heard about the hyzer flip before 😏.
@@dgspindoctor😆 vai ei ollu paljoo hyzer mut oli kuitenki mitä toi meinaa? Tai no siis hyzer kulmassa. Vai eks vaa huomannu eka et oli hyzer flippi nii laitoit. En tiiä ehkä ignooraa tää mun kommenti en tiiä paljoo vielä.
@@dgspindoctorstill its not an anhyzer release angle
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Good stuff
Appreciate it, thanks!
Good info. I've been forgetting that down/forward first move in the coil. That's where I get messed up. Good stuff. Sorry, I can't do emojis. I'm of a certain age and we think those things are a little tootie fruity ah Rudy. No offense.
No worries!
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4:11 and pause "looking at right picture" if you held your body still and pulled through with arm the release point would be like 2oclock vs 10oclock.. what i did was put my right foot more to the right so almost like im throwing slightly left of my target but in reality its not bcuz now my pull through line is actually straight bcuz ive shown more back to 10oclock vs you more like a out in and out motion! this tweak has my lines incredibly accurate at nearly any distance with any wind condition! lmk what you think about that realization hoping its not just a me thing but something that is legit for everyone..?
I'm not sure if I read you correctly, but yes, straight line for feet is my ideal. I can't do it, because I have the mobility of a crowbar, but I would if I could.
What are your thoughts on getting maximum spin? I know more spin equates to more distance. However, I dont see any tell tell signs of top players doing the same things to achieve it. Am I supposed to curl my wrist around the disc more? If so, exactly where...pre pocket, the pocket, etc.? A video of your thoughts would be great. I'm 60 and have been playing for about a year, and with the use of your videos, I'm hitting 300 feet consistently, but I believe I can hit 350-400. Keep em coming. Thanks!
I don't believe you actually can pop the wrist to create spin. You can put the disc deeper into your palm and then grip it harder with the index so that it spins around the tip of the finger at the release. Also the deep pocket might add some spin, too. Just don't open the wrist too early or tense it, and it will work just fine.
@@dgspindoctor Thanks!
thanks for the video. I will give it a try on my next practice.
The thing I disagree is the video of Eagle McMahon. He is throwing a hyzerflip, not an anhyzer.
Yea, people get stuck on the immediate release angle. That is why people don't learn, but I'm fine with that.
Mcbeth is on his back leg the whole time! Barela as well. They all are. Then they transfer their weight
The WHOLE time? So they jump on one leg? Jeesh, I need to watch closer.
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Do you coil against the front leg or back leg? When I do it, my front leg hasn't landed yet, so I have nothing to coil against, unless I use the back leg, and that causes timing issues. 😂
The back leg is the one on the ground, but I try not to lean on it. The coil is done over the front side.
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Great vid, agree with everything except the bit about Eagles anhyzer shot shape I think could've used some additional context to clarify release angle vs shot shape. The Eagle example is an anhyzer shape but not an anhyzer release (I assume this is why you said "shape"); the release was a decent amount of hyzer but it flipped up and turned so much since he throws so friggin hard, lol.
I do think it's best to prioritize teaching and learning hyzer release angles and posture though since hyzer release angles are so much more useful. Many of the drives commentators call anhyzers, or turn overs are released on some combination of hyzer, speed, disc, wind combination that causes the turn.
Sometimes though they have to release on anhyzer or close to flat (for more immediate turn) to force more anhyzer early on and there are some differences in the posture used, although the posture still looks a lot more like hyzer posture than many people probably think if asked to recall it from memory and it's still possible to start more fully in a hyzer posture and transition into more anhyzer posture.
It's actually hard to find example shots from Eagle, since hyzer release angle is so much more common, but this is a good comparison and it's still probably a tiny hyzer release angle:
i.imgur.com/KDWRsYb.png
ruclips.net/video/l7A6MfuUsQI/видео.html
Good comment! I genuinely believe Eagles approach to release angles is the easiest to teach and seems like it works for him, too!
His hinge creates the illusion that it’s a hyzer but Brian Earheart in the very clip discussed explains he’s throwing a turnover. Look at the peak of eagles reach back, he’s clearly trying to force the disc over. Look at the arc of his shot, flattish reach back, flat release, follows through lower than the release angle, that’s a forced turn over.
A hyzer flip starts with a low reach back, a hyzer release, and a high follow through, the under stability of the disc does all the work, that’s not at all what happened in eagles 700 foot shot. C-line dd3’s aren’t a nuke OS, but still one of the more stable molds out there, they aren’t hyzer flip discs even for a guy like Eagle.
@@lankstadiscs
Despite all of this you can clearly see (see pics linked below) when you go frame by frame that the disc is released on over 20 degrees of hyzer, the follow through perfectly matches the amount of hyzer (his arm blocks the disc perfectly for a few frames on the same hyzer angle), and the disc even after it's been blocked for a few frames remains on quite a bit of hyzer once it is visible again before it starts flipping and turning:
i.imgur.com/3rlzm5B.png
If he had closer to a flat releaes angle or on any anhyzer with all else equal (disc, wind, speed, etc.), the disc would have never come out of the anhyzer.
It still makes sense for people to call it a turnover because that is the most obvious shot shape you see when you watch it in real time. People don't watch it frame by frame so they don't see it. If you watch it frame by frame it's actually a hyzer flip to a late turn S curve shape.
His form is clearly not his flat release angle / anhyzer form: i.imgur.com/KDWRsYb.png
This is the same type of release angle + shot shape thrown in distance competitions. Nearly every throw in distance comps is on a lot of hyzer on release to avoid turn and burn but hopefully get the perfect amount of turn.
Heitin uuden pituusennätyksen(kaksi kertaa) tästä ja aikaisemmasta(best way to brace) videosta poimituilla vinkeillä. Sain aikaan todellisen ahaa elämyksen kentällä. Ps. Liekkö ois saanut parannettua vieläkin useammin, nuo oli vaan kaksi viimeistä heittoa, kun sattui pari nopeampaa kiekkkoa olemaan mukana puttereiden ja midareiden lisäksi.
Nonni! Melkosia juttuja! Upee homma, kiitos kun kerroit!
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Eagles throw was in hyzer, but otherwise another banger from doctor.
Well, rarely do the hyzers glide from left to right past 700ft.
@@dgspindoctor All I'm saying is that his release angle is in hyzer and I believe you talked about every release angle being available from that same coil posture with minor adjustments. I guess it's semantics, but to me Eagle's shot is a turn over, meaning hyzer that turns over into anhyzer.
I actually tried to find some video about the coiling postures for different release angles and found a very good one from Seekr Disc Golf YT channel. There is a 3 minute clip of Gannon Buhr throwing every angle with every disc type and the lean angle changes dramatically from hyzer to anhyzer.
I know this is a topic where opinions differ and it might change from thrower to thrower, but to me that Gannon clip was pretty interesting and very much in line with what I expected to see.
That Seekr clip is gold, for sure! And these kids, they are SO mobile and lanky they can do whatever they want with their torso. I have to turn my hips a lot more with the shoulders, as do many of us.
I believe a slight hyzer tilt is the easiest, most balanced way to throw and then the angles are made with the arm and the wrist, and follow through and all. This is what I teach, any way.
4:30 that is a turn-over ..leaves the hand hyzer.
I hear a lot of people get stuck on that. Funny, though. That's one of the biggest obstacles people face when learning. For example, you want to get the disc to fly from left to right (right-hander) and glide 700 feet in an Annie, but you won't want to learn that because it's not a legit Anhyzer release. Am I right?
Thanks for the comment!
@@dgspindoctor I'm only pointing out that he threw a hyzer.. that turned over.
not a anhyzer.. it went right on a "turn" not "Annie".
It's actually very rare to throw pure anhyzer the way Internet disc golfers describe it. If the angle has to be anhyzer at the release, most discs flip over and burn to the ground.
How would you transfer weight without putting 80% on your back leg this is improper mechanics
How about 100%? It's not about not being on your back leg (at some point) but to not lean on it. And the percentage is 100% at one point, and it should also be 100% on the front at one point.
For RHBH, if you lean back (to the left) does that cause you to relase the disc high up into the air?
Also how you do coil and not throw on a hyzer? Ive tried something like this and couldnt get the disc flat.
Thanks for watching!
First question: Not necessarily; it just means you get slow and sway your upper body instead of letting it rotate.
Second question: no, not at all, as I said in the video. You need to find a way to throw it flat or annie. That happens, usually by tweaking the arm path and following through.
Are those vivos? If so, how do you like them for DG?
They are Groundies, which, I think are cheaper but I like them as much. These have no friction on the bottom, so they are street shoes, but I've used only Vivos for a few years and will not go back. I was sponsored by them, but not anymore, so I have incentive to endorse them, other than... I like 'em.
@@dgspindoctor I just started wearing Vivo.. I love their knit FG shoes. Great for disc golf
@@BloodofEli I feel weird not wearing barefoot while throwing.
@@dgspindoctor same
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Do you have any drills you would recommend to work on this? ❤
Hmm, no I don't think I have. I will think about them and make a video if I come with any.
this is NOT what sling shot guy told me!!!/s
Try it out anyway, and see if it works for you.
4:25 "Longest greatest anhyzer" ... That was not even an anhyzer throw; it was released on a notable hyzer and turned over into an annie. It was a sweet turnover shot, dgmr, but not really great at alleviating concerns about your technique resulting in throwing on a hyzer.
Wow, never heard this argument before! (By the way, I'm being sarcastic.)
What an amazingly pointless response.
@@abc_def-55 Read the 20 other comments saying exactly what you did, and come tell me about being pointless.
@@dgspindoctor I did have a look through some of the comments but couldn't spot it discussed, my bad for missing them I guess.
If the subject keeps popping up, maybe instead of worthless responses you should pin one of the comments where it was discussed so it's easy to find , or put a explanation in the description.
If you felt the subject has been done to death and not worth addressing, which you clearly did, you could have just ignored the comment and saved the time of replying.
Yeah, sorry. It's just that I get a bit frustrared hearing the exact same thing pointed at me, and sometimes, as a content creator, it feels a bit unnecessary to keep getting the same comments. Especially when all I try to do is help people get better at disc golf, for free, and this is the thanks I get for that.
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That is not an anhyzer. Just like a flexshot with an overstable disc is not a hyzer. Good stuff otherwise though
I hear a lot of people get stuck on that. Funny, though. That's one of the biggest obstacles people face when learning. For example, you want to get the disc to fly from left to right (right-hander) and glide 700 feet in an Annie, but you won't want to learn that because it's not a legit Anhyzer release. Am I right?
Thanks for the comment!
What? 😂 All I'm saying is that was a bad example of an anny. If that was an very overstable disc, it would have been just a hyzer. Like I said, would you call a flex shot with an overstable disc a hyzer?
@@Pronto90 Why would you throw a 700ft flex with a very overstable disc?
I'm trying to say: learn to throw a shot that flies 700ft from left to right, and you don't even care what name of a shot you threw.
Come on, the point is not how far the disc flies. It was just a bad example of an anhyzer because it was clearly a hyzer flip. Just like you would not demonstrate a hyzer by releasing something overstabe on an anny and letting it dump left.
Fair enough. Are you saying this reachback type is wrong, even with Annies?
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4:30 Not actually Anhyzer, it's a Hyzer flip. You can see the disc on Hyzer as it leaves Eagles lair... but flips up and over to Anhyzer for its main flight.
(agree with all that is said. just not the best example used).
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Excellent! thank you!
Glad it was helpful!
This video totally screwed up my game. Why? Because now I have to re-learn which discs to use. Why? Because now they all go farther than they used to with the same amount of effort! Why? Proper mechanics. Thank you Doctor!!
Also quite expensive to buy new discs. Shit happens.