What I love about Lovecraft's writing is it inspires more than readers and writers. I know many metal musicians who drawl a great deal of inspiration from him.
Might be interesting to point Joshi toward some of the contemporary thinking on the part of current physicists and philosophers re: the possible evolutionary nature of the universe, new ideas re consciousness as a fundamental, and, in particular, the ideas of intrinsic value and Platonic principles embedded in the fiber of the universe as suggested by people like Phillip Goff and Stuart Hameroff and Roger Penrose, to name a few..
The Bible contains similar scenes to Lovecraftian horror. At Daniel 7:1-28 you find a person troubled by dreams (like a Lovecraftian character) wherein huge creatures are seen. Rev. 13 also has such visions. This isn't an attempt to convince one way or the other about God, just to mention that the parallel of Lovecraft to this ancient literature (if you wish to see it that way) is interesting.
Lovecraft being a classical scholar of sorts, makes sense that he would take inspiration from ancient literature. Angels were never the pretty chubby things the Renaissance represented them as. For instance, in Ezekiel 10:12 you have a description of some: "Their entire bodies, including their backs, their hands and their wings, were completely full of eyes, as were their four wheels." That's horrifying and worthy of a Lovecraftian monster.
Lovecraft supported Mussolini in the 30s as well; he was and remained a fascist, defending things like the Italian occupation of Ethiopia, which is obvious in his correspondence with Howard. And of course fascism and socialism are compatible. Mussolini himself started as a Marxist and called himself a socialist, although he later probably was more inspired by Hegel than by Marx. Lenin sent Mussolini a telegram congratulating him to his seizing of power in 1922, and at the end of his reign, Mussolini wished to return to the social revolutionary roots of his party. If Joshi does not want to see this, it's because he is himself sympathetic to socialism. And of course there is and can be no "cultural racism"; Joshi is being intellectually dishonest, as is also shown in his biography of Lovecraft, where he stereotypically accuses Lovecraft of racism for criticising foreigners taking over New England cities, which is a reality. He confounds, and I think consciously so, facts with values, and like all leftists, he makes use of political lies. He probably would reject the fact of the current Islamisation of Europe too, although there is enough evidence of that, accusing everyone stating these facts of "racism". His treatment of Lovecraft's views on this subject is truly a black mark on his scholarship.
Um. It's not that HPL pointed out or criticizing immigration policies of the day... it's his vitriolic and personal language against those poor people which garners the label of "racist". He hated actual people he never met, the definition of a bigot.
Lots of things are comfortable with socialism. You could have socialist programs properly voted for in a free society, or dictated to the people by a dicktator or something.
Leo doubt it. He later was married. His feelings towards society and his childhood pain most likely caused his reclusive nature and there from depression.
Lovecraft was, essentially, a loser. He could establish excellent atmosphere in a story, for the most part, was terrible at dialog, had minimal character development, and little plot development. In the majority, he was a hack, with some measure of ability to establish mood.
Whilst I would agree that the characterisation of protagonists in Lovecraft's fiction is somewhat limited, I feel you are missing the main point of his fiction. In any mere material and terrestrial terms even Lovecraft categorised himself as not of his time and thus a 'loser'. But his fiction is about the unseen things. The cosmos beyond humanity and outer extra-terrestrial chaos. Beyond trivial earthbound notions of success, failure or snappy dialogue. That is the 'atmosphere' as you call it, and I find this guiding force behind his writings quite profound.
In his Notes on Weird Fiction Lovecraft Writers that his sole purpose was creating a mood. Your criticism is irrelevant sinds you're asking for something Lovecraft doesn't aim for. It's like calling a Chinese restaurant lousy because they don't serve pizza.
So you saying that the whole idea of a cosmos beyond the mere form of humanity and human morality, which is a key Lovecraftian idea and a guiding principal behind his later fiction, is completely irrelevant? I feel you also miss the point. Lovecraft was a modest man. In comparing himself to his hero's he would write 'There are my Poe stories, my Dunsany stories, but...alas...where are my Lovecraft stories?', just because he sought to deprecate himself to a mere writer of mood doesn't mean he wasn't aiming for something more and, in my opinion, he achieved this. So a comparing fiction to a Chinese restaurant uis a complete misnomer I'm afraid.
Not so. The mood is exactly that of the completely alien, indifferent nature of the Cosmos. HPL used his 'gods' and langauge as means to achieve these moods. I'm missing no point at all. I'm merely questioning now whether I have replied to the right comment, as it seems oud disagreement rests on a misunderstanding.
This is my favorite interview ever and this dude mentions my favorite authors like Bierce, Machen , and Dunsany... Fascinating work fellas
Refreshingly intelligent and well-informed interview. Thanks!
What I love about Lovecraft's writing is it inspires more than readers and writers. I know many metal musicians who drawl a great deal of inspiration from him.
Great interview. Thanks for posting.
Thanks for this engrossing interview!
Good interview, including on some of the touchier subjects.
Many thankx for posting this. I have a number of live video interviews with S. T. Joshi on my RUclips channel.
A.T. joshi is always a great interview. Great stuff.
What about S.T. Joshi, his brother.
Matthew McVeagh lol .
Disco. He was crazy for it. He'd hit the clubs after dark and get down till the dawn. He was esp. fond of the Bee Gees.
Might be interesting to point Joshi toward some of the contemporary thinking on the part of current physicists and philosophers re: the possible evolutionary nature of the universe, new ideas re consciousness as a fundamental, and, in particular, the ideas of intrinsic value and Platonic principles embedded in the fiber of the universe as suggested by people like Phillip Goff and Stuart Hameroff and Roger Penrose, to name a few..
The Bible contains similar scenes to Lovecraftian horror. At Daniel 7:1-28 you find a person troubled by dreams (like a Lovecraftian character) wherein huge creatures are seen. Rev. 13 also has such visions. This isn't an attempt to convince one way or the other about God, just to mention that the parallel of Lovecraft to this ancient literature (if you wish to see it that way) is interesting.
Lovecraft being a classical scholar of sorts, makes sense that he would take inspiration from ancient literature. Angels were never the pretty chubby things the Renaissance represented them as. For instance, in Ezekiel 10:12 you have a description of some: "Their entire bodies, including their backs, their hands and their wings, were completely full of eyes, as were their four wheels." That's horrifying and worthy of a Lovecraftian monster.
Other god? There is no other god than the Ancient ones. (Joke :P)
The fool says in his heart “There is a God”
@@neilbarker3873
The fool may do that. The superior man openly and loudly blasphemes against the Holy Spirit.
Cosmic indifferentism goes beyond the redundancy of athiesm.
How is atheism redundant?
Look carefully, he's a background extra in the movie Saturday Night Fever!
Fascinating talk about a fascinating, if flawed, man.
Ego doesn't come into it. But reincarnated time traveling Gothic writers from New England do!
See thoo loo :P
NOT H.P. Lovecraft in interview
Yeah that bastard never shows up for his interviews anymore.
Tough room!
Lovecraft supported Mussolini in the 30s as well; he was and remained a fascist, defending things like the Italian occupation of Ethiopia, which is obvious in his correspondence with Howard. And of course fascism and socialism are compatible. Mussolini himself started as a Marxist and called himself a socialist, although he later probably was more inspired by Hegel than by Marx. Lenin sent Mussolini a telegram congratulating him to his seizing of power in 1922, and at the end of his reign, Mussolini wished to return to the social revolutionary roots of his party. If Joshi does not want to see this, it's because he is himself sympathetic to socialism. And of course there is and can be no "cultural racism"; Joshi is being intellectually dishonest, as is also shown in his biography of Lovecraft, where he stereotypically accuses Lovecraft of racism for criticising foreigners taking over New England cities, which is a reality. He confounds, and I think consciously so, facts with values, and like all leftists, he makes use of political lies. He probably would reject the fact of the current Islamisation of Europe too, although there is enough evidence of that, accusing everyone stating these facts of "racism". His treatment of Lovecraft's views on this subject is truly a black mark on his scholarship.
So what you're saying is he would fit right in with the culture of today?
Um. It's not that HPL pointed out or criticizing immigration policies of the day... it's his vitriolic and personal language against those poor people which garners the label of "racist".
He hated actual people he never met, the definition of a bigot.
Are you seriously claiming he wasn't racist?!
Lots of things are comfortable with socialism. You could have socialist programs properly voted for in a free society, or dictated to the people by a dicktator or something.
Social aristocracy... In America?
A nervous breakdown when a teenager ?. Could have been he realized he was gay?. What are your thoughts ?
Leo doubt it. He later was married. His feelings towards society and his childhood pain most likely caused his reclusive nature and there from depression.
Lovecraft was, essentially, a loser. He could establish excellent atmosphere in a story, for the most part, was terrible at dialog, had minimal character development, and little plot development. In the majority, he was a hack, with some measure of ability to establish mood.
Whilst I would agree that the characterisation of protagonists in Lovecraft's fiction is somewhat limited, I feel you are missing the main point of his fiction. In any mere material and terrestrial terms even Lovecraft categorised himself as not of his time and thus a 'loser'. But his fiction is about the unseen things. The cosmos beyond humanity and outer extra-terrestrial chaos. Beyond trivial earthbound notions of success, failure or snappy dialogue. That is the 'atmosphere' as you call it, and I find this guiding force behind his writings quite profound.
In his Notes on Weird Fiction Lovecraft Writers that his sole purpose was creating a mood. Your criticism is irrelevant sinds you're asking for something Lovecraft doesn't aim for. It's like calling a Chinese restaurant lousy because they don't serve pizza.
So you saying that the whole idea of a cosmos beyond the mere form of humanity and human morality, which is a key Lovecraftian idea and a guiding principal behind his later fiction, is completely irrelevant? I feel you also miss the point. Lovecraft was a modest man. In comparing himself to his hero's he would write 'There are my Poe stories, my Dunsany stories, but...alas...where are my Lovecraft stories?', just because he sought to deprecate himself to a mere writer of mood doesn't mean he wasn't aiming for something more and, in my opinion, he achieved this. So a comparing fiction to a Chinese restaurant uis a complete misnomer I'm afraid.
Not so. The mood is exactly that of the completely alien, indifferent nature of the Cosmos. HPL used his 'gods' and langauge as means to achieve these moods. I'm missing no point at all. I'm merely questioning now whether I have replied to the right comment, as it seems oud disagreement rests on a misunderstanding.
AH yes, I was replying tot Jeffersondinedalone, not to belatedcommiseration.