Perhaps for this and future tests, having a standard loop you fly on a sunny or cloudy day would allow for comparisons as things are updated and changed, that way even legacy FPV items could be compared directly. Thanks for doing all these tests
I'm really happy that Walksnail appear to be actively working on this trying to make it better all the time, shows some dedication at least. There most definitely is an improvement in quality especially with regards to the blockiness of the ground. If DJI didn't exist, then this would be absolutely amazing coming from analogue. However, it just isn't near as good as DJI yet... Unfortunately it will always be compared to DJI, that's just the nature of things. But good to see improvements at a fairly good rate so far 🙂 Thanks for the vid JB 👍👍
DJI: Y'all competing with my old tech.😏 Fat shark: We're getting better though.🤷🏾 DJI: Ok,give me a few more weeks and I'll show yall whos ya daddy.😉😆🤣
Yup, the are trying to get close to the level of the V2s for a much higher price now and the goggles 2 are about to be released. I can't see this going very well for FS/ws unless they cut the price by 50% once the goggles 2 are released.
Thanks for the side-by-side Joshua! It's pretty obvious that the DJI system remains the clear winner, and I expect it to stay that way unless Walksnail has some absolute magic to pull out.
MrJoshua, first of all, I thank you for the content you make in my case, I have learned thanks to this content, I am a user of walksneil, I changed it to dji, knowing from these contents that it was worse, but to adapt perfectly to my face, I see a lot of attacks on people who he does his job honestly whoever wants to buy dji should buy it and whoever wants to buy walksnail should buy it is his money and does what he thinks best the last word is in the consumer those who criticize him thinking that he receives money from companies if it were true they would do it instead
Djinis definitely doing better going around your property. Less loss of details in less area and also look at the ms specifically. Dji never really goes above 40ms and walksnail regularly seems to spike to the 60ms area . It's not doing bad or horrible but if we are comparing that's what I'm seeing. I also prefer the image on dji overall to fly and see. Has great dynamic range.
Thanks for the effort on putting all these updates on this matter doing a fair comparison. I can see your frustration and mine too cause we have high hopes for this system to compete on pair with Dji. I am sure it will get better soon. Let's see with the next updates. Keep going and thanks again!
I am glad there are pilots who still prefer analog system over digital. IMHO, I think there is still no point for me throwing away my HDO2. However, if I was a new pilot in this hobby I would probably go with a digital system. Thanks for sharing with us Joshua. Take care. Cheers.
Thanks for this video. I'm just in the situation where I have HDO 1 goggles and to start FPV I'm thinking on buying HD ones but not sure which one... or DJI... but I would prefer Fatshark Avatar. For now I practice with HDO ones on simulator and I will watch what will come in the next few weeks. It's really not cheap and not easy to do the good choice.
I recommend using vtx screws. In my case, it was mounted on a 3M tape. During the first service of the drone, it turned out that the vtx is in two parts and the USB socket was torn out.
Is anyone flying multiple quads on the Walksnail system? I haven't done a lot of testing or tested in other environments yet, but just flying around my home in the vacant lots next door, I notice my walksnail-converted Babyhawk 2 has almost no smearing while my 5" is more like Bardwell's video (at approximately the same speeds). Only thing I can think of is the stock walksnail TX antennas shielding might be at fault. On my 5", the antennas do run alongside some esc wires and main power leads (can't get around it on that quad, but the actual active part of the antenna is raised up above the top-plate. On the Babyhawk, I had more room to get away from the ESC wires and the power leads come out the front. Also, has anyone tried other antennas on the quad or have recommendations? Currently running 4 AXII omnis on the goggles, but ordering some patch antennas today.
Would about setting up a big big patch antenna on a tripod with a connection cable to the googles. I am talking about like 0.5 m2 of antenna area. Whouldn't that capture way more signal and improve everything? Or even better if you only fly in a certain direction, a parabolic mirror like a satellite dish would work even better.
Flying Analog reminds me of when I was a child trying to watch Sesame Street on an old tv with rabbit ears. We didn’t have cable we could only get a few channels through the antenna. The picture was always fuzzy and lines were going up and down the screen. I just can’t see when flying in anything other than what DJI has I recommend using DJI technology for every FPV quad. I don’t know how people can fly with a fuzzy picture
Serious Question.. do i get this walksnail goggle or the HDO2 goggle? both now are almost the same price.. only advantage im looking at HDO2 is the HDMI input so i can fly in PC sim for practice
Very well organized information and presented in a systematic way. It is not only entertaining to watch but also easy to listen to. As much as Fatshark/Walksnail are making strides in the direction of improvement, they are small steps. These small steps are adding up quickly but I wonder how much of a lead DJI will take in their anticipated newer goggle...
I'm waiting for my avatars to arrive while watching all this drama about dji vs everyone eternal battle xdd love ur vids Joshua, thanks for teaching us so much. Love from Spain
At the end yes walksnail will be good but why should I switch from Dji at the moment. Vistas, Airunits, goggles are available and the v2 goggle looks like it’s also backwards compatible.
Fatshark introduced some really nasty contrast scaling which makes the picture darker and shadow definition terrible. They did improve the greasy texture somewhat; you can still see the ground texture issue especially mid center screen while moving forward. At least it’s better than it was but nowhere on par with DJI. If they have to fix it with darkening the contrast there are bigger issues here. Have to wait and see.
Wow, this is really eye-opening. I really appreciate your very scientific approach to comparing in real-world situations. Also, I certainly retract my previous statement regarding this secretly being a DJI product. It wouldn't be flyable for me. I don't think I could rely on it to maintain visual clarity of small details. I'd end up seriously eating shit the way that image smears randomly. Great comparison, Bardwell! Thank you!!!
I think there is another point worth to mention. We're silently assuming that hardware design level is similar as DJI. You're saying you have different antennas and other things are slightly different, however what can make big change is quality of design. What components are chosen, how PCB is routed, even how PCB is manufactured. 5.8GHz is not easy thing and signal quality inside the googles be impacted in many ways. I'm waiting for DJI next generation FPV staff. Lets see what they bring up to the table. I'm afraid Walksnaill's HW V2 may be what will be worth to buy :/
Price for price, the walksnail/fatshark system still isn't on level with DJI. If the WS/FS system was half to 2/3 the price of the DJI equpiment, it would be worth it. It still seems to be an inferior system. I think botgrinder is great, but he isn't very subjective when it comes to his reviews. He hates dji, he hates rotorriot, and lets all of that taint his reviews on products.
You mean it the other way around, he is very subjective, not very objective, when you watch his reviews thats what you should expect I guess, its very clear
@@paulhope3401 I 1,000% agree. I was going to get a pair of the v2s this week but ended up getting the entire dji fpv combo with the quad, controller, goggles, and one battery on amazon the other night for $840 brand new. The goggles and controller will work with the avata as well. Why would someone get the ws goggles lol??? Granted I did have to apply for an amazon prime visa which gave me a $150 gift card to use towards the purchase but in a couple hours I'll have something flyable today not next year. Or maybe never. Yeah, DJI sucks as a company but so do all the rest. Let's not fool ourselves.
I m afraid that Software will not and cannot solve hardware issues by the end. Can t imagine the actual pressure on developpers to release quickly new firmwares... My respect to them. But Bad camera, noisy and saturated vtx/Rx, fpga bound program, bad antennas, burning vtx, bad jst connectors soldering .... The list of hardware issue cannot be reduced like magic.
I think this tech was a massive challenge from the beginning. A dedicated hardware technology will likely see it happen, EVENTUALLY. This is no mean feat give the complexity of the challenge.
The shadow detail is definitely a problem in this firmware. There are like black holes where all other cameras would adjust. You can see it as you looked back at your self. I also find that the 50Mbps mode is interesting in the sense there is no dramatic improvement like DJI. This firmware is much better with regards to overall compression performance however it still needs work. It’s getting there though.
I suspect the contrast with less dynamic range was purposely done to make the compression easier. This leads me to suspect that it's fine tuning from here and no more major leaps as far as signal quality and compression are concerned
The central question here is: why should anyone buy the WS/FS system when the DJI digital FPV system is better, more stable, more reliable, arguably still provides better video quality, and is now significantly less expensive? While DJI haters can argue endlessly that the digital FPV system had many issues at launch that weren't resolved for about a year, that completely avoids the fact that it was the very *first* digital FPV system, and was doing something that many thought was impossible. For the WS/FS to have those issues at launch *now* - more than two years later - is absolutely inexcusable. The market has moved on, and consumers rightly expect a solid and reliable digital system. *No one wants to failsafe and for their quad to just fall out of the sky because the link just dies - that's a huge safety hazard.* For everyone claiming that DJI hates FPV and is going to imminently exit the market, they're ignoring that DJI has done more to revolutionize FPV than any other company, and it is Fat Shark that completely abandoned their first attempt at a digital FPV system. Do you really think Walksnail is going to keep their expensive manufacturing lines open and continue to spend on R&D and development when the OG DJI system is available at a much lower price? Or, presumably just weeks or months from now, DJI makes the O3 Air Unit available to work with the DJI Goggles 2 and provides true 1080p while presumably being more stable and reliable - owning the high end of the market for the money-is-no-object enthusiasts? HDzero is a completely different market, catering to racers who want at least slightly better video quality than analog with fixed latency, or for use with 1S whoops. HDzero absolutely deserves a place in the FPV market. *But why should WS/FS exist when their product is unquestionably worse and more expensive than the best available option?*
With the O3 air unit costing $250 to $300 per quad i think i'll pass regardless of how cheap the V2 goggles become. $150-$170 per quad was expensive enough for a VTX and camera, i'm not ready to start giving damn near $300 per quad to DJI. I'll get the HDZero goggles when it comes out then I'll have the option of using HDZero or AvatarHD if the prices drop when they come out with a VRX. Will not ever spend $250/quad for VTX and cam just will not do it.
@@AndyDreadFPV You don't have to buy the O3 Air Unit? You can continue to buy the Air Unit, remaining Vista Units, and the Runcam Link (which is the Vista under a different name). I would suggest that those products may even see a price reduction once the O3AU drops.
@@TheDiegoAranda Those products are not going to be phased out eventually? DJI is going to continue making them into the future or will I be stuck buying 03 air units at some point in the the future for all my future builds when they eventually stop making those? Seems like the HDZero goggles would be the better bet because then i'll have access to both HDZero and AvatarHD going forward so i could build whatever quad and still use the same goggles for both digital systems and analog and digital whoops etc.
@@AndyDreadFPV I would absolutely agree with you that HDzero is the better option than Walksnail/Fat Shark. As to the question of product longevity, I can't answer that. *But I would be willing to bet money that DJI will be around a lot longer than Walksnail, that's for sure.* If they continue to sell the V2 Goggles, why not continue to sell VTX units for it if they can continue to make a profit off their sale?
@@TheDiegoAranda DJI being a billion dollar corporation will be around. sure. Will they be around in FPV? I don't know what their threshold for profits are and whether they will continue. As I understand it FPV is a tiny fraction of what they do, Their survival does not depend on the FPV market. Will Walksnail and HDZero be around? I have no idea. Their survival does depend on the FPV market that is for sure and they are first and foremost about FPV. Now are their products currently better than DJI in image quality? I say no. My main thing though is the cost per vehicle and future flexibility to fly more than one digital systems via one pair of goggles. If DJI can lower the cost per vehicle then i would consider it but $250/vehicle going forward is certainly out of the question for me. With the HDZero goggles i can fly HDZero and AvatarHD and still get the best ever analog experience from just one set of goggles. Maybe DJI should produce a HDMI VRX also, that would be great.
i do not understand, why the compression logic does not differentiate between the center of vision, bottom and everything else. Even with a low bitrate it could be possible to maintain flyability, but not updating the boundaries as much as the really critical regions of the videostream. Just a thought, that may be beneficial for FPV and worth submitting to the people involved in the development of these goggles. As you have a quite good position in the community, it may be your part to submit ideas like this to the correct destination.
That's what "Focus Mode" does in DJI, and "Focalize Mode" in Walksnail. The edges get blurry while the center stays sharp. It's a feature that's existed since the DJI FPV system was released. Personally, I prefer to fly with it off but some like it.
Dji is the best! i think when someone enter now in the market, have to realese better than what's on the market. DJI make 1 big update and done for the last year or more, but is the "first" do digital flyable, now everyone enter on market have to better than it is behind and yes make updates later, not this....
By making the video darker and lowering the contrast, there might be more overall black/dark spots and also less color variance in the video making it far easier for the codec?
Walksnail/Fatshark are on the right track for sure. They obviously rushed the release and need to do more testing. I'm on the same page as Bardwell where I really want them to succeed going forward, but I don't have the confidence to make the investment yet. If they had just put more time into the software, they would have a very compelling product. (BTW, I love the shirt)
Let's be clear. The reason why people switched from Analog to HD more than 2 years ago was that DJI could deliver a stable link. I personally believe that the WalkSnail system is a step backwards, especially having the DJI2 system around the corner also not a very wise investment.
To be honest the DJI is flawless with break ups in stock form through a lot of stuff far better then analog but in stock form my walksnail(newer set with the 2 walksnail pathes) with a 1s vtx is closer to analog/hd zero range then DJI but honestly that is fine. My biggest complaint about Walksnail is probably their goggles feel like I'm looking through two key holes vs the DJI v2s. I have some Skyzone 04Xs coming to see if this is how most high end setups are and I'm really hoping it's not and I'm also hoping DJIs new goggles 2 optics are larger then they look but I fear this is common. How is it that everyone isn't complaining about Walksnails tiny binocular look vs DJI v2s? I feel like I'm the only one who is seeing this.
Are you sure you're seeing all my content? My last video was a review of the HOTA S6 charger. Before that, a spreadsheet I made to evaluate lipo charger specs. Before that, a review of the Runcam Thumb Pro 4k. Before that, a review of the Mobula6 HDZero version. Before that, a tutorial about EdgeTX internal module missing. Of my last 9 videos, 2 related to Walksnail. 2 related to DJI. And the remaining 5 were about something else.
Hello, guys! I have a question that I couldn't solve: why can DJI drones go so far without video loss and FPV drones can't, even with DJI's digital system?
different applications and transition system for the video feed. speed/weight/battery capacity. Most DJI camera drones are light and slow when compare to FPV DYI. .
You mentioned in the video that the delay is about 5-10 ms off, I wonder if the delay is just not including the delay added from the switching of the display and camera processing aand just giving like a link delay
Man, I'm so sorry to have to say this, but months ago, when I first heard that there was a new digital FPV system coming from Fatshark, I was so excited and happy. But all I have seen from these goggles so far is such a big disappointment. They said it was gonna be 1080p, OMG, mind blown! But nope, can't even use it well in 1080p, gotta use 720p instead, so no advantage over DJI's v2 goggles and even when it's working properly, 1080p just doesn't look great with the encoding settings they're using. Yes, HDMI-Out is nice, but at the moment, this and their form factor whould be the only things that these goggles got going for them imho and for me personally, that just isn't enough. At this point, DJI's image transmission just looks better and is more reliable, and that's the most important thing for me. And we haven't even seen yet, what those DJI Goggles 2 are capable of...
@@WickedWaysfpv7087 Almost as crazy as calling the new Fatsharks the "Dominator HD" after having already had the Dominator HD, Dominator HD2 and Dominator HD3 - non of which were "HD" btw... :D Yeah, naming conventions of companies are just weird sometimes. At least they didn't call the second generation the "DJI Goggles 360" and then the third generation the "DJI Goggles One", LOL. :D
As I've told many people it's like a game console. Anyone can make a ps5 game bit not just anybody can code for the system like a top tier studio. Imo the heavy introduction of contrast and lack of dynamic range is a last ditchbeffort to make it easier on the algorithm. As for link quality I doubt it will be much improved. Seems to hit a very clear limit
@@anthonyfpvminiquad1728 im not as pessimistic on it. While I believe you are right with the programming I believe the link quality will improve. They may need to hire better programmers though. 25mbit should be able to handle full 1080p with out degradation. MY worry is that the goggles may not have the processing power for h265, and if possible would perform better with h264. Not only that, but youtube absolutely trashes on h265, original footage looks significantly better than RUclips. This is my first goggle setup, at this time, I am satisfied with them. Granted as a noob, I may outgrow them soon enough, and with the price reductions on DJI walksnail may be dead in the water. and with slowing sales means less money for programmers, which if the hardware can support it, may could still compete with next gen DJI with skilled programmers, who knows.
Although a considerable improvement, it does seem like the video compression smearing is still prevalent in clear LOS or is that not the case? Damn! I'd love to give this new beta firmware a try.
Great comparisons. So far, DJI 720 is greater than Walksnail 720p, which is arguably better than Walksnail 1080p. My primary reason to upgrade would be 1080p,...so,... Waiting on those DJI Goggles 2 reviews,...
I was lucky enough to be there for Botgrinders testing of the new firmware and its definitly better then the videos before had shown. Its pretty damn good,as a former dji pilot that went back to analog i can say it feels on par if not a tad better then dji. If they could a fixed latency mode it would probably be perfect imo.
I feel like we didn't both watch the same video here. DJI was always better in every test that Joshua did. Not just from a visual perspective, but latency, studder, smearing and signal quality. Walksnail has improved but its far from being on par with DJI let alone better than it. The only real advantage is better customization of its UI.
Botgrinder's video: ruclips.net/video/ZRoqsS-8IGs/видео.html&ab_channel=BOTGRINDERFPV
Where's Chris Rosser's video?
As always great content it is obvious you spent time editing the footage and thought through your response as any good reviewer would 👍
Perhaps for this and future tests, having a standard loop you fly on a sunny or cloudy day would allow for comparisons as things are updated and changed, that way even legacy FPV items could be compared directly. Thanks for doing all these tests
Makes you really appreciate DJI's focus mode.
I'm really happy that Walksnail appear to be actively working on this trying to make it better all the time, shows some dedication at least. There most definitely is an improvement in quality especially with regards to the blockiness of the ground. If DJI didn't exist, then this would be absolutely amazing coming from analogue.
However, it just isn't near as good as DJI yet... Unfortunately it will always be compared to DJI, that's just the nature of things. But good to see improvements at a fairly good rate so far 🙂
Thanks for the vid JB 👍👍
DJI: Y'all competing with my old tech.😏
Fat shark: We're getting better though.🤷🏾
DJI: Ok,give me a few more weeks and I'll show yall whos ya daddy.😉😆🤣
Yup, the are trying to get close to the level of the V2s for a much higher price now and the goggles 2 are about to be released. I can't see this going very well for FS/ws unless they cut the price by 50% once the goggles 2 are released.
Thanks for the side-by-side Joshua! It's pretty obvious that the DJI system remains the clear winner, and I expect it to stay that way unless Walksnail has some absolute magic to pull out.
Great comparison video. Definite improvement, but still needs to cook a little longer. 👍🤓
MrJoshua, first of all, I thank you for the content you make in my case, I have learned thanks to this content, I am a user of walksneil, I changed it to dji, knowing from these contents that it was worse, but to adapt perfectly to my face, I see a lot of attacks on people who he does his job honestly whoever wants to buy dji should buy it and whoever wants to buy walksnail should buy it is his money and does what he thinks best the last word is in the consumer those who criticize him thinking that he receives money from companies if it were true they would do it instead
Djinis definitely doing better going around your property. Less loss of details in less area and also look at the ms specifically. Dji never really goes above 40ms and walksnail regularly seems to spike to the 60ms area . It's not doing bad or horrible but if we are comparing that's what I'm seeing. I also prefer the image on dji overall to fly and see. Has great dynamic range.
accurate observation
You can just adjust the camera settings on the Walksnail.
my dji actually never goes above 30 ms its that good.
mostly around 23 to 28
Walksnail went almost 400ms just before he pulled up at end of the road and almost 500ms just before he failsafes.
@@MRdeLaat with WTFOS at 30Mbps I still get 21 - 28ms
Thanks for the effort on putting all these updates on this matter doing a fair comparison. I can see your frustration and mine too cause we have high hopes for this system to compete on pair with Dji. I am sure it will get better soon. Let's see with the next updates. Keep going and thanks again!
I am glad there are pilots who still prefer analog system over digital. IMHO, I think there is still no point for me throwing away my HDO2. However, if I was a new pilot in this hobby I would probably go with a digital system. Thanks for sharing with us Joshua. Take care. Cheers.
Walksnail breakup looks like a Mushroom space trip🍄🍄
Bootgrinder its my light on the darkness
Guillllllllermo!
yeah image is real dark! Can't wait to see Avata performance!
Thanks for this video. I'm just in the situation where I have HDO 1 goggles and to start FPV I'm thinking on buying HD ones but not sure which one... or DJI... but I would prefer Fatshark Avatar. For now I practice with HDO ones on simulator and I will watch what will come in the next few weeks. It's really not cheap and not easy to do the good choice.
I recommend using vtx screws. In my case, it was mounted on a 3M tape. During the first service of the drone, it turned out that the vtx is in two parts and the USB socket was torn out.
Right on JB🤘🏻👊🏻
I think DJI is so good that it's gonna be very hard to beat.
Specially at their new low price !
Great comparison. Thanks for the updates, JB!
Happy i got my V2's :)
I need that kind of neighbour!
FightTime 😂I really hope this was deliberate!
Is anyone flying multiple quads on the Walksnail system? I haven't done a lot of testing or tested in other environments yet, but just flying around my home in the vacant lots next door, I notice my walksnail-converted Babyhawk 2 has almost no smearing while my 5" is more like Bardwell's video (at approximately the same speeds). Only thing I can think of is the stock walksnail TX antennas shielding might be at fault. On my 5", the antennas do run alongside some esc wires and main power leads (can't get around it on that quad, but the actual active part of the antenna is raised up above the top-plate. On the Babyhawk, I had more room to get away from the ESC wires and the power leads come out the front.
Also, has anyone tried other antennas on the quad or have recommendations? Currently running 4 AXII omnis on the goggles, but ordering some patch antennas today.
Why get walksnail when the DJI v2 are cheaper and better why
Excellent video, Joshua! Thanks for the honestly! 😊
Stay safe there with your family! 🖖😊
Would about setting up a big big patch antenna on a tripod with a connection cable to the googles. I am talking about like 0.5 m2 of antenna area. Whouldn't that capture way more signal and improve everything? Or even better if you only fly in a certain direction, a parabolic mirror like a satellite dish would work even better.
Flying Analog reminds me of when I was a child trying to watch Sesame Street on an old tv with rabbit ears. We didn’t have cable we could only get a few channels through the antenna. The picture was always fuzzy and lines were going up and down the screen. I just can’t see when flying in anything other than what DJI has I recommend using DJI technology for every FPV quad. I don’t know how people can fly with a fuzzy picture
Shoutout to the neighbor for being cool
can only get better
Serious Question.. do i get this walksnail goggle or the HDO2 goggle? both now are almost the same price.. only advantage im looking at HDO2 is the HDMI input so i can fly in PC sim for practice
Very well organized information and presented in a systematic way. It is not only entertaining to watch but also easy to listen to. As much as Fatshark/Walksnail are making strides in the direction of improvement, they are small steps. These small steps are adding up quickly but I wonder how much of a lead DJI will take in their anticipated newer goggle...
Is the walksnail quad badly tuned or is it the walksnail system causing that video shudder? Its hard to watch
is that a crop in fhd? It looks like they just blow up the 720p signal in the goggles lol
Grotbinder ❤️
Analog still my jam haha
"This isn't even my final firmware" - Frieza
The ground still looks like mush half the time which is the biggest turn off for me.
🔥🔥
I'm waiting for my avatars to arrive while watching all this drama about dji vs everyone eternal battle xdd love ur vids Joshua, thanks for teaching us so much. Love from Spain
At the end yes walksnail will be good but why should I switch from Dji at the moment. Vistas, Airunits, goggles are available and the v2 goggle looks like it’s also backwards compatible.
DJI are releasing the Avatar drone on August 25, 9.00am Aus EDT
Fatshark introduced some really nasty contrast scaling which makes the picture darker and shadow definition terrible. They did improve the greasy texture somewhat; you can still see the ground texture issue especially mid center screen while moving forward. At least it’s better than it was but nowhere on par with DJI. If they have to fix it with darkening the contrast there are bigger issues here. Have to wait and see.
Wow, this is really eye-opening. I really appreciate your very scientific approach to comparing in real-world situations. Also, I certainly retract my previous statement regarding this secretly being a DJI product. It wouldn't be flyable for me. I don't think I could rely on it to maintain visual clarity of small details. I'd end up seriously eating shit the way that image smears randomly. Great comparison, Bardwell! Thank you!!!
thanks for the great and balanced (non-biased) review...!
Josh I don't think an RF expert is smarter than you. You've been helping our small RC community for years now in many ways. Thanks
Still not quite there yet. Going to be sticking with my DJI setup.
I think there is another point worth to mention. We're silently assuming that hardware design level is similar as DJI. You're saying you have different antennas and other things are slightly different, however what can make big change is quality of design. What components are chosen, how PCB is routed, even how PCB is manufactured. 5.8GHz is not easy thing and signal quality inside the googles be impacted in many ways. I'm waiting for DJI next generation FPV staff. Lets see what they bring up to the table. I'm afraid Walksnaill's HW V2 may be what will be worth to buy :/
It looks to me like it's still got a ways to go to even be as good as dji. Especially in 50mbps mode
Price for price, the walksnail/fatshark system still isn't on level with DJI. If the WS/FS system was half to 2/3 the price of the DJI equpiment, it would be worth it. It still seems to be an inferior system. I think botgrinder is great, but he isn't very subjective when it comes to his reviews. He hates dji, he hates rotorriot, and lets all of that taint his reviews on products.
You mean it the other way around, he is very subjective, not very objective, when you watch his reviews thats what you should expect I guess, its very clear
Totally agree. If the Walksnail system is 2/3 dji, i will give them a try.
@@___echo___ ok
Exactly how I see it.. with DJI dropping prices on the V2' s its making the Walksnail system looking not so far off double overpriced.
@@paulhope3401 I 1,000% agree. I was going to get a pair of the v2s this week but ended up getting the entire dji fpv combo with the quad, controller, goggles, and one battery on amazon the other night for $840 brand new. The goggles and controller will work with the avata as well. Why would someone get the ws goggles lol??? Granted I did have to apply for an amazon prime visa which gave me a $150 gift card to use towards the purchase but in a couple hours I'll have something flyable today not next year. Or maybe never. Yeah, DJI sucks as a company but so do all the rest. Let's not fool ourselves.
now you have footage to compare to the new dji system which I have a feeling you may have already lol
The video was not negative..
It was just honest joshua 👏
Call it how it is!!
I m afraid that Software will not and cannot solve hardware issues by the end. Can t imagine the actual pressure on developpers to release quickly new firmwares... My respect to them.
But Bad camera, noisy and saturated vtx/Rx, fpga bound program, bad antennas, burning vtx, bad jst connectors soldering ....
The list of hardware issue cannot be reduced like magic.
Its not an fpga its artyosyn
Botgrinder is my fav pro pilot
Analog and DJI ftw
Since only one antenna transmits on the walksnail goggles, wouldn't you get more use out of the patch antenna if it was on that port?
It is. I moved the wires inside the goggle so the left front plug is the tx radio.
@@JoshuaBardwell gotcha, is it pretty simple to do that?
It's not too difficult to open the goggles. You can see me do it in my "unbrick walksnail" video
Good test JB. I like the darker look of the Walksnail. But I think they need to go a long way to get the system running like the DJI system.
why don't you use the same antennas, controller and receiver for a test like this? this would make it a real comparison of the two video systems...
thanks for all your hard work, dji for the win still!
I just like that they keep making it better. It shows potential and response to custy feedback.
You have cool neighbors....
I think this tech was a massive challenge from the beginning. A dedicated hardware technology will likely see it happen, EVENTUALLY. This is no mean feat give the complexity of the challenge.
The shadow detail is definitely a problem in this firmware. There are like black holes where all other cameras would adjust. You can see it as you looked back at your self. I also find that the 50Mbps mode is interesting in the sense there is no dramatic improvement like DJI. This firmware is much better with regards to overall compression performance however it still needs work. It’s getting there though.
I suspect the contrast with less dynamic range was purposely done to make the compression easier. This leads me to suspect that it's fine tuning from here and no more major leaps as far as signal quality and compression are concerned
Hey Joshua, what HD system to buy in 2024, if I'm still on analog?
ruclips.net/video/TMOeIQ4VRX4/видео.html&ab_channel=JoshuaBardwell
Thank god you have friendly neighbors, I crash landed a rc plane and someone stopped, picked it up, and stole it.
What happened 11:22 with the picture it was like ghosting .
If there's a 1s compatible whoop vtx that beats hdzero I'm in. Otherwise sticking to dji.
I am glad Walksnail is here to compete with DJI, I am sure their quality will improve over time but for now....DJI just looks so much better.
The central question here is: why should anyone buy the WS/FS system when the DJI digital FPV system is better, more stable, more reliable, arguably still provides better video quality, and is now significantly less expensive? While DJI haters can argue endlessly that the digital FPV system had many issues at launch that weren't resolved for about a year, that completely avoids the fact that it was the very *first* digital FPV system, and was doing something that many thought was impossible. For the WS/FS to have those issues at launch *now* - more than two years later - is absolutely inexcusable. The market has moved on, and consumers rightly expect a solid and reliable digital system. *No one wants to failsafe and for their quad to just fall out of the sky because the link just dies - that's a huge safety hazard.* For everyone claiming that DJI hates FPV and is going to imminently exit the market, they're ignoring that DJI has done more to revolutionize FPV than any other company, and it is Fat Shark that completely abandoned their first attempt at a digital FPV system. Do you really think Walksnail is going to keep their expensive manufacturing lines open and continue to spend on R&D and development when the OG DJI system is available at a much lower price? Or, presumably just weeks or months from now, DJI makes the O3 Air Unit available to work with the DJI Goggles 2 and provides true 1080p while presumably being more stable and reliable - owning the high end of the market for the money-is-no-object enthusiasts? HDzero is a completely different market, catering to racers who want at least slightly better video quality than analog with fixed latency, or for use with 1S whoops. HDzero absolutely deserves a place in the FPV market. *But why should WS/FS exist when their product is unquestionably worse and more expensive than the best available option?*
With the O3 air unit costing $250 to $300 per quad i think i'll pass regardless of how cheap the V2 goggles become. $150-$170 per quad was expensive enough for a VTX and camera, i'm not ready to start giving damn near $300 per quad to DJI. I'll get the HDZero goggles when it comes out then I'll have the option of using HDZero or AvatarHD if the prices drop when they come out with a VRX. Will not ever spend $250/quad for VTX and cam just will not do it.
@@AndyDreadFPV You don't have to buy the O3 Air Unit? You can continue to buy the Air Unit, remaining Vista Units, and the Runcam Link (which is the Vista under a different name). I would suggest that those products may even see a price reduction once the O3AU drops.
@@TheDiegoAranda Those products are not going to be phased out eventually? DJI is going to continue making them into the future or will I be stuck buying 03 air units at some point in the the future for all my future builds when they eventually stop making those? Seems like the HDZero goggles would be the better bet because then i'll have access to both HDZero and AvatarHD going forward so i could build whatever quad and still use the same goggles for both digital systems and analog and digital whoops etc.
@@AndyDreadFPV I would absolutely agree with you that HDzero is the better option than Walksnail/Fat Shark. As to the question of product longevity, I can't answer that. *But I would be willing to bet money that DJI will be around a lot longer than Walksnail, that's for sure.* If they continue to sell the V2 Goggles, why not continue to sell VTX units for it if they can continue to make a profit off their sale?
@@TheDiegoAranda DJI being a billion dollar corporation will be around. sure. Will they be around in FPV? I don't know what their threshold for profits are and whether they will continue. As I understand it FPV is a tiny fraction of what they do, Their survival does not depend on the FPV market. Will Walksnail and HDZero be around? I have no idea. Their survival does depend on the FPV market that is for sure and they are first and foremost about FPV. Now are their products currently better than DJI in image quality? I say no. My main thing though is the cost per vehicle and future flexibility to fly more than one digital systems via one pair of goggles. If DJI can lower the cost per vehicle then i would consider it but $250/vehicle going forward is certainly out of the question for me. With the HDZero goggles i can fly HDZero and AvatarHD and still get the best ever analog experience from just one set of goggles. Maybe DJI should produce a HDMI VRX also, that would be great.
How far away is that ridge Josh? A mile ?
About 600 meters.
i do not understand, why the compression logic does not differentiate between the center of vision, bottom and everything else. Even with a low bitrate it could be possible to maintain flyability, but not updating the boundaries as much as the really critical regions of the videostream. Just a thought, that may be beneficial for FPV and worth submitting to the people involved in the development of these goggles. As you have a quite good position in the community, it may be your part to submit ideas like this to the correct destination.
That's what "Focus Mode" does in DJI, and "Focalize Mode" in Walksnail. The edges get blurry while the center stays sharp. It's a feature that's existed since the DJI FPV system was released. Personally, I prefer to fly with it off but some like it.
1:54 Is there another place I can watch your videos other than RUclips?
dji looks smoother
126ms delay wen u got behind the tree :O
ISPs wont give me youtube at 1440p anywhere I can freely fly a drone.
Dji is the best! i think when someone enter now in the market, have to realese better than what's on the market. DJI make 1 big update and done for the last year or more, but is the "first" do digital flyable, now everyone enter on market have to better than it is behind and yes make updates later, not this....
By making the video darker and lowering the contrast, there might be more overall black/dark spots and also less color variance in the video making it far easier for the codec?
Makes sense... there would be little reason to do it otherwise.
My thoughts exactly.
Exactly... They are on the hardware limit , fpga speed. So trading of with different parameters. I m afraid noisy RF signals can t be solved anyway.
@@fpvfun922 Wait .. what?
They use an FPGA in those things? Not an ASIC?
Walksnail/Fatshark are on the right track for sure. They obviously rushed the release and need to do more testing. I'm on the same page as Bardwell where I really want them to succeed going forward, but I don't have the confidence to make the investment yet. If they had just put more time into the software, they would have a very compelling product. (BTW, I love the shirt)
They could have had an early release price 🤷♂️
@@benargee beta tester price lol
Let's be clear. The reason why people switched from Analog to HD more than 2 years ago was that DJI could deliver a stable link. I personally believe that the WalkSnail system is a step backwards, especially having the DJI2 system around the corner also not a very wise investment.
To be honest the DJI is flawless with break ups in stock form through a lot of stuff far better then analog but in stock form my walksnail(newer set with the 2 walksnail pathes) with a 1s vtx is closer to analog/hd zero range then DJI but honestly that is fine. My biggest complaint about Walksnail is probably their goggles feel like I'm looking through two key holes vs the DJI v2s. I have some Skyzone 04Xs coming to see if this is how most high end setups are and I'm really hoping it's not and I'm also hoping DJIs new goggles 2 optics are larger then they look but I fear this is common. How is it that everyone isn't complaining about Walksnails tiny binocular look vs DJI v2s? I feel like I'm the only one who is seeing this.
can you also please make some other contents except walksnail... like the old days
Are you sure you're seeing all my content? My last video was a review of the HOTA S6 charger. Before that, a spreadsheet I made to evaluate lipo charger specs. Before that, a review of the Runcam Thumb Pro 4k. Before that, a review of the Mobula6 HDZero version. Before that, a tutorial about EdgeTX internal module missing.
Of my last 9 videos, 2 related to Walksnail. 2 related to DJI. And the remaining 5 were about something else.
I'm starting to doubt that they'll fix it in future.
How to fix for compete with dji v3(v2 goggles)?
Hello, guys! I have a question that I couldn't solve: why can DJI drones go so far without video loss and FPV drones can't, even with DJI's digital system?
different applications and transition system for the video feed. speed/weight/battery capacity. Most DJI camera drones are light and slow when compare to FPV DYI. .
latency
Should I buy the current DJI system to get into digital, or wait to see what they release? I'm ready to move past analog.
Maybe you should compare to the original DJI Airunit. This has two antennas like Fatsnail so it would be more comparable wrt system performance level.
Yeah, they've fixed it! Lol.
DJI winner
You mentioned in the video that the delay is about 5-10 ms off, I wonder if the delay is just not including the delay added from the switching of the display and camera processing aand just giving like a link delay
Almost but not quite, watch Mads Tech and he explains it.
Man, I'm so sorry to have to say this, but months ago, when I first heard that there was a new digital FPV system coming from Fatshark, I was so excited and happy. But all I have seen from these goggles so far is such a big disappointment. They said it was gonna be 1080p, OMG, mind blown! But nope, can't even use it well in 1080p, gotta use 720p instead, so no advantage over DJI's v2 goggles and even when it's working properly, 1080p just doesn't look great with the encoding settings they're using. Yes, HDMI-Out is nice, but at the moment, this and their form factor whould be the only things that these goggles got going for them imho and for me personally, that just isn't enough. At this point, DJI's image transmission just looks better and is more reliable, and that's the most important thing for me. And we haven't even seen yet, what those DJI Goggles 2 are capable of...
you mean goggles 3 cause the v3 versions is what is coming
@@WickedWaysfpv7087 Nope, they are gonna be called the Goggles 2, so no goggles 3 or v3
@@woltervandenberg oh shit lol I wasn't aware of that. That just makes no sense lol
@@WickedWaysfpv7087 Almost as crazy as calling the new Fatsharks the "Dominator HD" after having already had the Dominator HD, Dominator HD2 and Dominator HD3 - non of which were "HD" btw... :D Yeah, naming conventions of companies are just weird sometimes. At least they didn't call the second generation the "DJI Goggles 360" and then the third generation the "DJI Goggles One", LOL. :D
They need AV1 encoders.
I truly believe that they are not handling the codec properly, and im on the beta version as well.
As I've told many people it's like a game console. Anyone can make a ps5 game bit not just anybody can code for the system like a top tier studio. Imo the heavy introduction of contrast and lack of dynamic range is a last ditchbeffort to make it easier on the algorithm. As for link quality I doubt it will be much improved. Seems to hit a very clear limit
@@anthonyfpvminiquad1728 im not as pessimistic on it. While I believe you are right with the programming I believe the link quality will improve. They may need to hire better programmers though. 25mbit should be able to handle full 1080p with out degradation. MY worry is that the goggles may not have the processing power for h265, and if possible would perform better with h264. Not only that, but youtube absolutely trashes on h265, original footage looks significantly better than RUclips.
This is my first goggle setup, at this time, I am satisfied with them. Granted as a noob, I may outgrow them soon enough, and with the price reductions on DJI walksnail may be dead in the water. and with slowing sales means less money for programmers, which if the hardware can support it, may could still compete with next gen DJI with skilled programmers, who knows.
Holy cow man… That looks incredible!!! I think Walksnail looks better than DJI personally.
Great review! Looks like it's coming along, though. Looks promising...
What I really want to know; is the Cine(mon roll) Whoop props in or props out?
Either way it is frosting on!
Although a considerable improvement, it does seem like the video compression smearing is still prevalent in clear LOS or is that not the case? Damn! I'd love to give this new beta firmware a try.
freeze screen is terrible then hdzero , hdzero at least can see some things
🤣
Whaha if botgrinder thinks it better im interested.🤟🤣
Great comparisons. So far, DJI 720 is greater than Walksnail 720p, which is arguably better than Walksnail 1080p. My primary reason to upgrade would be 1080p,...so,... Waiting on those DJI Goggles 2 reviews,...
I was lucky enough to be there for Botgrinders testing of the new firmware and its definitly better then the videos before had shown. Its pretty damn good,as a former dji pilot that went back to analog i can say it feels on par if not a tad better then dji. If they could a fixed latency mode it would probably be perfect imo.
I feel like we didn't both watch the same video here. DJI was always better in every test that Joshua did. Not just from a visual perspective, but latency, studder, smearing and signal quality.
Walksnail has improved but its far from being on par with DJI let alone better than it. The only real advantage is better customization of its UI.
@@ender-gaming I'm going on what i saw flying it not this video
And why am I spending my money? I haven’t seen anything too impressive come out yet