I’ve been a long term subscriber Joe, but never commented….your delivery to camera these days is second to none and the quality of the edits superb. Your passion for these type of cars shines through in every video. Keep up the good work!
I own an FL5 and I don’t really consider it a ‘hatchback’. Yes the boot opens with a hatch, but otherwise it feels like a ‘saloon’ to me. The rear seating is roomier than the BMW 3 series I had. For those that doubt it’s worth £50k, you might change your mind if you ever drive one. It feels like a special car, the gear box is an absolute masterpiece. Then factor in the rarity and what it represents at this point in the history of cars. You could get more power or luxury for the money, but not much that will be revered as much as this car in years to come. I plan to keep mine long term, as my final car from the manual / petrol era.
yOU SIR HAVE ROSE TINTED SPECS ON , driven this FL5 and owned the model before , nothing like a £50k car and the fact you have over paid for one does not make it worth that money . 2024 THESE will be low £40's
@@gavinarber8802 well I paid £47k new so ‘low 40s’ is really not that bad depreciation. However looking at prices online right now, I am really not that worried about resale value. So tell me, you have £50k to buy a new car. Petrol, manual, fun to drive, fits 4 passengers. What you buying?
This car punches way above it’s weight. I see some many people taking it’s over priced alot of cars are better! BS as a drivers car there’s no other car that performs like this for the money none! It performs better then many that are over 100k. FWD that’s irrelevant to use now when it’s killing RWD and AWD on track worth more money. Drive one before you say it’s not worth it. This thing drives literally like Porsche GT cars cayman GT4 911 GT3 with tad less power 350hp in this car is dangerous for other car makers FL5 is a serious machine and I personally feel it has the best manual gear box put in car! Even better then a Porsche!.
The black rear seats are a feature from the original type r. It’s to make the car appear as if the rear seats are stripped out. It was more affective when rear headrests weren’t included.
Great review Joe. Thought I'd watched most online content on these before I purchased mine - but I never heard anyone mention the width. The size, yes, but not the width. Having picked mine up two months ago I can say I'd sort of noticed the width but now you've mentioned it's wider than a 5-series it's all falling into place! Yes it is wide, but as you say it's also so much fun and I can't wait until I finally run mine in and can really let it off the leash! Hoping to take it on tour with me in 2024 when no doubt it'll be keeping G82 M2's company - that will be a bunch of fun I reckon. Safe travels in 🇧🇷 buddy 👍.
@@baoquoc3710 it's like saying: "take an uglier girl and just spend 15K of surgery mods later". I have driven both. Both are good and great value for money, CTR is just on a bit higher level at every single moment: driving feel, gearbox feel (this alone worth any money), chassis feel, body rigidity feel, etc...
@@preludeh22a57 "that alone worth any money" you're that type of person who probably fell for starfield hype and spend $100 for early copy, and here you willing to spend $20K more on a slightly better handling and performance, you're brainwashed zombie NPC 🤣
Great video. Been waiting for this for a long time . I am a life long honda fan . Had them all prelude, S2000, type r , am not surprised by the review. Love the honda racing Heritage. Only one thing wrong it for me only 2 rear seats!! Anyway enjoying driving my new M3 comp. G80 xdrive.
Great review Joe. I love my FL5. In Aus they are $70k which seems like great value to me. I’m going to keep it long term for sure. Handles like a dream. Fun on the weekends and can do the school run and shopping etc. Dog crate even fits in the boot.
They are actually $74k in Australia now brand new. Saw one for the first time at a Honda dealership last weekend. Nice car but there are so many other cars I'd buy for $74k before this. And the used prices will drop just like the FK8 has. You can pick one up for just under $40k now.
@@hassyg4083 I totally agree. For $13k less I would buy the Rallye (circuit pack) GR Yaris new. Or we could look at the used market where the choice is immense.
So I was all set to buy one of these... and then they announced the price. Now I get it, Honda can sell all they're going to make at £50k so why wouldn't they? Problem with getting one second hand is there's some *serious* competition at that price point, especially if you're going to daily drive one. I'm sure everyone will have their favourites but for that money you can easily get a six month old ex-demo M240i which is comfortably in the next tier of fast or, to my astonishment if I'm honest, an eighteen month old 840i with less than 20k miles and all the 'must have' options ticked (seriously, the depreciation on those things is ridiculous and might just be the best bang for the buck out there right now). Eh, I know I'm being a grumpy old man here, sorry, but to me it does feel like this Type R is far more an occasional use sports car where mileage matters to preserve the value rather than the daily driven delight the previous couple of generations have been. Somewhat ironic that shift happened in probably the most refined version of the Type R there's ever been but I guess that's the world we live in these days. Now if you'll excuse me there's a cloud outside I need to go shout at....
@@gurpreetsarang8929either car on this planet is a better buy than a 50k type-r. FFS, due to dv.mb ppl like you Honda is asking such money amounts for is overpriced shi.tbox.
@@ThrottleBodyCouple of things: 1) In what universe is a M240i not a rival for one of the top tier hot hatches given that this very channel has pitched it against an RS3 and 2) as I made *very* clear this is my own personal preference and both are / were serious contenders for my next car purchase so.... yeah, they're comparable. Now that might not be the case to you and that's valid too but please do others the courtesy of allowing their own subjective views the same weight as yours.
@@smiddlehurst1 typically, people are buying hot hatches of this size due to the practicality credentials that come with it..otherwise, you may as well buy a sports car. An m240i won’t suit that crowd. The 840i is even further down that route and doesn’t have the driving dynamics that a hot hatch offers. You are an exception to the rule, which is fine. Even the RS3 is dubious because they’re 10-15k more, 100bhp morethan the civic etc. Overall, people looking for a hot hatch aren’t looking for a heavy, luxury coupe. I have no issues with the cars themselves. When I’m looking at civics, I’m looking at golf Rs/GTIs, Mercedes a35s, Audi s3s, bmw m135i etc. Those are the direct rivals.
The civic type r use to be for the European and japanese market and not sold in North America. But with the last gen they sold it in the USA and now it seems like thay is their target market with so few sold in the Uk. Prehaps it has more to do with EU emissions restrictions.
The gearbox location in the EP3 gen Type R (2005) is more fun! Superfast quick short shifts, second gear to 60mph.... lol....exact same matt metal gear knob too! 😂
Great review 👍🏻Although half of the comments here are hilarious, people crying about the price, even though they've not driven one, let alone sat in one...... I'll be honest, i was expecting a £39k price tag and it was a hard pill to swallow to see my order through at £48k..... i almost cancelled...so glad i didn't! I'm lucky enough to have had a lot of great cars, i actually 'downgraded' from a new porsche to the fl5 and the honda is honestly a better more rewarding, and more useable car, better build quality too, and that is high praise indeed!
Its crazy that I own an FL5 and still continue to watch reviews. I agree with everything you said, obviously this is a race/track/sports car but the road noise is so damn loud. Another is the fake engine noise, at first through reviews and my first few drives, I loved the sound. Now, after awhile it gets annoying and a bit too much where I just want the real engine sound instead of the fake audio. Besides that I absolutely love the car.
Road noise is entirely the specced tires. Simply get the Acura Specced PS4s tires or just the standard aftermarket PS4s and you'll lose a lot of the road noise. I don't know what about the Honda spec compound that makes it so loud.
U gotta remember its a track car so u gonna hear and feel bumps way more but like the comment above go change ur damn tires first then see the difference if u haven’t already
I'm the same. Own an FL5 but watch reviews like this. Just love the car. And reviewers love it too. Really don't get why people bring up the price increase. Even standard commuter cars have increased in price significantly. Especially all new models. So why wouldn't the best hot hatch on the planet? Confused
@@everymangamer1608 Look at the price when the Fk8 was released. Then the price jump when the 2020 refresh was released. Then another price jump on the FL5. Then the average markup on the FL5. This is as an FL5 owner who contacted about 100 dealers about a year before the FL5 was released to find one who put the least (wasn't able to get MSRP) amount on markup on it. It wasn't part of the initial 100 dealers that I ended up going with since none of those pre-release dealers honored their agreement. But now it's almost irrelevant. As if you really sniff around you can find the Integra Type-S for MSRP if you live in the America's and are willing to wait a little bit.
@Vermonstered yeah that's fair enough and I get it. Where I live there's no markups and the msrp increased but not as much as UK or US. This just shows how much of an absolute bargain the fk8 was. My country has fixed prices so there was no downside to buying early on. Otherwise I would've ignored hype and bought years later, they don't get worse the more time goes on.
Cracking car, big fan. If you can’t get one (because it’s very very expensive), I’d at least go and test drive a face lift i30N. They’re ridiculously capable, make an awesome noise and with a small tune would be nearly as quick. Bonus - it’s the same weight and a bit narrower! I’ve just got rid of mine after a fun year of ownership to go back to BMW though (I missed RWD) 🫣
Owned quite a few type r's through the years all the way back to the ek9 and followed the development of the FL5 from the start deciding that it was going to be my next car. Then the price was announced and the fact the UK wasn't getting a decent allocation, Meaning the price likely wont come down to a sensible figure anytime soon if ever. I love a type r but its not worth £50k.
What a great looking type R. In my view far nicer than the last model. I’m surprised at how expensive they are in the UK. £50k is about 100k NZ dollars here in New Zealand, that’s huge money. There’s a few almost new ones I’ve seen advertised for around £35K. I’m quite tempted but I’d need to upgrade the wheels to perhaps slightly smaller size such as 18” and thicker tyres plus a full size spare. The state of roads here is shocking, almost 3rd world, even highways are littered with potholes. Lots of wheels get ruined here.
Be interested to drive one of these, I’ve got the fk2 mapped to 370hp so I’d be interested to know the real world differences. Mine was 20k with low mileage. It seems risky to spend 50k on a civic, it’s niche. I agree with the looks of the fl5 though it’s stunning.
25 years ago I got my first BMW and I promised myself that I'd never have another FWD car, and I've stuck to that. The latest Civic Type R is an appealing package but I'd like to have heard more about traction through (and out of) corners, when pulling away swiftly from junctions, and whether the car's cornering dynamics can be tuned by driving through the throttle.
I think you’d love my hot hatch Joe!… 1205kg, 4 door hatch, big boot, massage seats, 300bhp, great fuel consumption, 380mm Alcon brakes as standard plus a Torsen manual diff! Oh and did I say it’s a manual car too!? What is the car?…
Enjoyed that review joe very interesting , I always wanted an FK8 but ended up buying a Mk 3 focus rs. , the rs is a great car but I still end up thinking of getting a FK8
7:55, I reviewed the Type-R as well and the screen probably feels like that because you've been used to the centre being tilted towards you. Otherwise it felt normal to me
Thanks for a great review! Would you take a FL5 over an OG M2 or the latest RS3? I have the RS3 now and have owned both M2 and FK8. What I miss in the FK8 compared to the other two cars was engine sound and acceleration grip. I also felt that FK8 engine was quite laggy. But turn in and steering feel from FK8 was really good!
I can relate to your comment. My FK8 is my daily with a few bolt ons and 380 hp. Out of tight corners u struggle with grip compared to an AWD car like my evo 8. But what always put me of from german cars if its BMW , Audi,Seat or even an Hyundai I30 N is the emotionless driving feedback. The only other FWD car with proper Feedback in my opition is the Megane RS Trophy. But i haven't tried an RS3 yet. Only S3 Models. A Modern RS3 is just too expensive for me. They do everything good to perfectr for daily driving but i dont see them to be actually drivers cars. Even if they are faster on paper. And i am german.
@@leer9951not to that amount. It is the exagerared greed of manufacturers such as Honda. edit. as long as Hyundai can still make I30N for 30k, it is just the greed of Honda. Ppl who are dv.mb enough to pay Honda's asking prices breath our air and consume our planet's resources for nothing.
Great car that would make me swap from my Suzuki Swift Sport, but the footprint of the Swift is such a joy, you can play on the road with different lines while staying in your lane! And it's 400kg lighter.
I have to disagree with you on the selling price of this car as it's following through the years justifies the price partly as well as it being an awesome car. With regards it holding onto it's value I have the Civic Sport Plus and it seems to be holding onto its value as well. I think partly it is because they are bullet proof and have a reputation for reliability. I drove the Mk 1 version of the Civic Type R and always dreamed of having one and nearly did but bought my 1st Land Rover as I was shooting and fishing more than racing. Sadly as the price increased the stars never aligned again but I have the lesser model to follow on from my Accord ownership nearly 25 years ago. The floppy back parcel shelf is in my car also and it works a treat. Another great review of a really good car.
FK8 owner here as welll. I have never heard about this problem. Even not from other FK8 drivers. That sounds like an enviorment problem if u drive on dirty streets with stones and gravel.
Another great episode I drove the last model and it was fantastic but I was not sure of the looks.This version is a cracker👍 just bought my ticket for BOTB🤞
I’ve always wanted Honda and Porsche as a duo to either development a relationship to manufacture a transmission for the TypeR Utilizing the Germans AWD system from the 911 - but honda may have it’s own reason why AWD may not be for the future but I beg the differ and believe this could possibly push honda further into the future with a co-development with the Germans for a new AWD system for the TypeR without compromising its agility. Ya been thinking about this for years now 😅😅😅
I mean honda already has a prett great awd system they use on acuras. I just think the added weight is no idea for the cost or vision of a civic type R. It is present in the TLX type s.
I hear people here in the US are switching out the control module for the dampers to the integra type S one, its supposed to be so much better. On tracks around me I think most guys do not use the R mode on the dampers. I believe that sliding cover was already on the FK8 gen. I didn't realize the car was so wide I have only seen one in passing once, is the Fk8 narrower?
Interestingly here in Australia where cars a flipping expensive these, even at 74k AUD, these look like value. If you compare up range to premium sports cars that are 150k and an M2 is 100k then not too bad… reliable, useful and quick enough. My next car in addition to my 20 year old Boxster…
I find it utterly alarming that a Honda Civic would cost in excess of £50k. I wouldn't care if it had a Rolls Royce jet engined strapped under the bonnet, that is disgusting!!!!! The motorist is being taken for a fool in this day and age but yet people keep buying the cars at these inflated prices which makes it the norm.
@@JoeAchilles1that is probably a fact regarding the handling 😂😂😂 On the plus side I don't need to tell folk I own a Civic 😅 However I do also have a 66 plate M135i in the garage after watching your videos from yesteryear, keep up the good work
Hi @Joe i had the chance to sit inside a FK8 and FL5. With my left foot fully on the clutch pedal, i was able to shift the gear lever to 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 6th but couldn’t get it into 5th. Is it not full to the right and up? (Or all the way left and up for right hand drive)
Imagine if it had a porsche badge, got a feeling this machine would command a price in the region of 80 to 100k, thing is it would still be worth every penny just for the drive sensation alone considering renault charge 70k for their megane trophy r thats not even in the same league when it comes to usability just high end performance smh honda truly smashed it
I'd really like someone to explain the type r to me, u just don't get it as I never got the previous model. If i spent 50k on purchasing this car id just struggle looking back at it in the car park thinking what have I got for my money
Ive owned . Ek9 . Ep3 . Fd2 . Fk2 ... waited for a fl5 . Saw the price and thaught fuck that .... bought a gr yaris for 36k . Will never own another type R . Its not worth 50k.. and had loads af warranty issues with my fk2 . Had to argue with dealership to get new alloys after bubbling at 8k . Water in rear spoiler
my mate Alistair raves about these. He sadly has a megane at the moment. 1.2 litre with a door hanging off.But he raves about this alot. I have to agree after watching this,looks fantastic and sounds great. Maybe when I win the euros I will treat him so he can race me in my spyder 😂❤ good video as usual joe.
The only downside to this vehicle is actually finding one, and you can't even test drive one to decide if you want to buy it. I own a GR Corolla, and both are hit or miss on the dealer's parking lot.
It could be the best drive around, but I can't get past the styling of the car. Sure, it's less ugly than before, but It is still hideous to look at. I also dislike overly large proportions in a hot hatch. The achilles heel is that the price tag is insane.
Taste differs i guess. People here in germany compliment my FK8 from time to time. And i am not talking about car meets. Randomly at the super market or gas stations. It stands out quite a bit with all the boring average german cars here.
@@VxO4fame Yes, tastes do differ, but I think this car is particularly divisive. Some people might love it, but I personally think it looks horrific and the interior is every bit as garish to me as the outside with all that bright red carpet inside. Some red trim on the seats or mat would have been tasteful. But the whole thing? Yuck!
For £50.000 you could get a used M140i which already more capable than a type r plus better suspension, plus a stage 1 tune and still have money left over
🤣🤣🤣 As someone who owned an M140i and did lots with it (suspension, brakes and ECU wise), the FL5 is on a totally different level, it's handling, braking, feel, gearbox and practicality are in a different league.
@@JoeAchilles1 😂 And I have to agree with you again. Never owned an M140i but drove a few M140i and M135i. For me the FK8 has more feedback. The M140I is not considered a proper M model with the open diff and stuff.
I can't recall seeing a car vid with less information per minute. You spend more time telling us what you haven't actually bothered to find out than you do giving actual facts. I don't expect I'll be watching much more of this channel.
I've got a late 2019 FK8 Type R and had considered the new one but that jump in new price from £37.5k to £50k rules it out. The older car was lower road tax as well being under the stealth tax the UK government imposed on new cars over £40k for the first 5 years of ownership. Disgusting. Will be holding onto mine for a while longer. Only issue with it is stones getting stuck in between the brake pad and disc. Horrible sound.
I have a m2 , was looking at a fk8 type r at the time too.. I think honestly we have the last era of reasonably priced, great cars. Everything now is ridiculously expensive geared towards lease and zero ownership
And here I am finding myself mind bubbling, to buy for my next car, either RS4, or the Type R! 🤔 😂 both cars are massively great for each different reasons
As a former Type-R owner, I love the idea of owning another one, but agree with Joe about the back end (the stupid wing looks atrocious) and the red seats are a bit garish. Also, after several Audi and BMWs I now prefer paddle shifters over manual transmission.
I think this is where things will trip up, when you’re paying 50k for a used civic you immediately open it up to huge used competition. New for new kid of stood up as an argument. Used vs used no way
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I’ve been a long term subscriber Joe, but never commented….your delivery to camera these days is second to none and the quality of the edits superb. Your passion for these type of cars shines through in every video. Keep up the good work!
I own an FL5 and I don’t really consider it a ‘hatchback’. Yes the boot opens with a hatch, but otherwise it feels like a ‘saloon’ to me. The rear seating is roomier than the BMW 3 series I had.
For those that doubt it’s worth £50k, you might change your mind if you ever drive one. It feels like a special car, the gear box is an absolute masterpiece. Then factor in the rarity and what it represents at this point in the history of cars.
You could get more power or luxury for the money, but not much that will be revered as much as this car in years to come.
I plan to keep mine long term, as my final car from the manual / petrol era.
Always loved a Honda gearbox manual, so, so good.
yOU SIR HAVE ROSE TINTED SPECS ON , driven this FL5 and owned the model before , nothing like a £50k car and the fact you have over paid for one does not make it worth that money . 2024 THESE will be low £40's
@@gavinarber8802 well I paid £47k new so ‘low 40s’ is really not that bad depreciation. However looking at prices online right now, I am really not that worried about resale value.
So tell me, you have £50k to buy a new car. Petrol, manual, fun to drive, fits 4 passengers. What you buying?
I did I bought an M4 CS
@@gavinarber1033 yeah, they cost a bit more than £50k brand new.
FL5 truly is a masterpiece of engineering by Honda❤
Agreed 👊🏻👍🏻
Couldn't be more pleased to see this pop up. The last video barely showed you in this car. This is a proper video! I am dying to drive one.
This car punches way above it’s weight. I see some many people taking it’s over priced alot of cars are better! BS as a drivers car there’s no other car that performs like this for the money none! It performs better then many that are over 100k. FWD that’s irrelevant to use now when it’s killing RWD and AWD on track worth more money. Drive one before you say it’s not worth it. This thing drives literally like Porsche GT cars cayman GT4 911 GT3 with tad less power 350hp in this car is dangerous for other car makers FL5 is a serious machine and I personally feel it has the best manual gear box put in car! Even better then a Porsche!.
Amen well said 👍🏻👊🏻
The black rear seats are a feature from the original type r. It’s to make the car appear as if the rear seats are stripped out. It was more affective when rear headrests weren’t included.
Great review Joe. Thought I'd watched most online content on these before I purchased mine - but I never heard anyone mention the width. The size, yes, but not the width. Having picked mine up two months ago I can say I'd sort of noticed the width but now you've mentioned it's wider than a 5-series it's all falling into place! Yes it is wide, but as you say it's also so much fun and I can't wait until I finally run mine in and can really let it off the leash! Hoping to take it on tour with me in 2024 when no doubt it'll be keeping G82 M2's company - that will be a bunch of fun I reckon. Safe travels in 🇧🇷 buddy 👍.
I've seen two FL5's in person and the first thing I noticed is how wide the car is. The Type R sits lower than an M3 and about as wide as an M5.
A hatchback dimensionally bigger than a saloon is baffling to me
£50K for a Type R is just unchartered territory
They said the same thing about the NSX when it came out. ‘£50k for a Honda?!’ Yet the dynamically inferior Ferrari 348 was way more expensive.
@@MIK23458 the NSX at least feels like £50k well spent. This? Elantra N and 15k of mods later, I called it a day.
@@baoquoc3710 it's like saying: "take an uglier girl and just spend 15K of surgery mods later". I have driven both. Both are good and great value for money, CTR is just on a bit higher level at every single moment: driving feel, gearbox feel (this alone worth any money), chassis feel, body rigidity feel, etc...
@@baoquoc3710 $15K? Way less than that
@@preludeh22a57 "that alone worth any money" you're that type of person who probably fell for starfield hype and spend $100 for early copy, and here you willing to spend $20K more on a slightly better handling and performance, you're brainwashed zombie NPC 🤣
Great video. Been waiting for this for a long time . I am a life long honda fan . Had them all prelude, S2000, type r , am not surprised by the review. Love the honda racing Heritage. Only one thing wrong it for me only 2 rear seats!! Anyway enjoying driving my new M3 comp. G80 xdrive.
M3 xdrive love them, your a lucky guy.
@@shane6115 Honda always had the build quality over BMW
Great review Joe. I love my FL5. In Aus they are $70k which seems like great value to me. I’m going to keep it long term for sure. Handles like a dream. Fun on the weekends and can do the school run and shopping etc. Dog crate even fits in the boot.
You got rorted champ
That is only £36,000 pounds you lucky Aussie bastard 😂😂❤️👍
They are actually $74k in Australia now brand new. Saw one for the first time at a Honda dealership last weekend. Nice car but there are so many other cars I'd buy for $74k before this.
And the used prices will drop just like the FK8 has. You can pick one up for just under $40k now.
@@whatwoulddarrendo1325 i wouldn't pay nowhere near that for FWD. FWD are cheaper to build. type r has slow 0-60 than most old cars
@@hassyg4083 I totally agree. For $13k less I would buy the Rallye (circuit pack) GR Yaris new.
Or we could look at the used market where the choice is immense.
So I was all set to buy one of these... and then they announced the price. Now I get it, Honda can sell all they're going to make at £50k so why wouldn't they? Problem with getting one second hand is there's some *serious* competition at that price point, especially if you're going to daily drive one. I'm sure everyone will have their favourites but for that money you can easily get a six month old ex-demo M240i which is comfortably in the next tier of fast or, to my astonishment if I'm honest, an eighteen month old 840i with less than 20k miles and all the 'must have' options ticked (seriously, the depreciation on those things is ridiculous and might just be the best bang for the buck out there right now).
Eh, I know I'm being a grumpy old man here, sorry, but to me it does feel like this Type R is far more an occasional use sports car where mileage matters to preserve the value rather than the daily driven delight the previous couple of generations have been. Somewhat ironic that shift happened in probably the most refined version of the Type R there's ever been but I guess that's the world we live in these days. Now if you'll excuse me there's a cloud outside I need to go shout at....
840 and a M240i are no where near as much fun. The 840i will continue to drop like a stone even if bought at 50k.
@@gurpreetsarang8929either car on this planet is a better buy than a 50k type-r. FFS, due to dv.mb ppl like you Honda is asking such money amounts for is overpriced shi.tbox.
You’re comparing cars that aren’t comparable. The argument is void.
@@ThrottleBodyCouple of things: 1) In what universe is a M240i not a rival for one of the top tier hot hatches given that this very channel has pitched it against an RS3 and 2) as I made *very* clear this is my own personal preference and both are / were serious contenders for my next car purchase so.... yeah, they're comparable. Now that might not be the case to you and that's valid too but please do others the courtesy of allowing their own subjective views the same weight as yours.
@@smiddlehurst1 typically, people are buying hot hatches of this size due to the practicality credentials that come with it..otherwise, you may as well buy a sports car. An m240i won’t suit that crowd. The 840i is even further down that route and doesn’t have the driving dynamics that a hot hatch offers. You are an exception to the rule, which is fine. Even the RS3 is dubious because they’re 10-15k more, 100bhp morethan the civic etc. Overall, people looking for a hot hatch aren’t looking for a heavy, luxury coupe. I have no issues with the cars themselves. When I’m looking at civics, I’m looking at golf Rs/GTIs, Mercedes a35s, Audi s3s, bmw m135i etc. Those are the direct rivals.
Don't think there's a better hot 'hatch' out there than these things. Absolute monsters.
The Fl5 sgrade would be better
It won at Nurburgring
fk8 would also be better in roll races
Good reviews i really love this new type R sleek and elegant looks
It’s expensive but at least it’s reliable!
Great vlog and you were spot on 👍🏻👊🏻 I love my 24 sonic Grey Pearl FL5 . I actually like it more than my previous 22 m240i in all areas .
As a daily, would you get the Type R over the new M2?
The civic type r use to be for the European and japanese market and not sold in North America. But with the last gen they sold it in the USA and now it seems like thay is their target market with so few sold in the Uk. Prehaps it has more to do with EU emissions restrictions.
The gearbox location in the EP3 gen Type R (2005) is more fun! Superfast quick short shifts, second gear to 60mph.... lol....exact same matt metal gear knob too! 😂
Great review 👍🏻Although half of the comments here are hilarious, people crying about the price, even though they've not driven one, let alone sat in one...... I'll be honest, i was expecting a £39k price tag and it was a hard pill to swallow to see my order through at £48k..... i almost cancelled...so glad i didn't! I'm lucky enough to have had a lot of great cars, i actually 'downgraded' from a new porsche to the fl5 and the honda is honestly a better more rewarding, and more useable car, better build quality too, and that is high praise indeed!
Its crazy that I own an FL5 and still continue to watch reviews. I agree with everything you said, obviously this is a race/track/sports car but the road noise is so damn loud. Another is the fake engine noise, at first through reviews and my first few drives, I loved the sound. Now, after awhile it gets annoying and a bit too much where I just want the real engine sound instead of the fake audio. Besides that I absolutely love the car.
Road noise is entirely the specced tires. Simply get the Acura Specced PS4s tires or just the standard aftermarket PS4s and you'll lose a lot of the road noise. I don't know what about the Honda spec compound that makes it so loud.
U gotta remember its a track car so u gonna hear and feel bumps way more but like the comment above go change ur damn tires first then see the difference if u haven’t already
I'm the same. Own an FL5 but watch reviews like this. Just love the car. And reviewers love it too.
Really don't get why people bring up the price increase. Even standard commuter cars have increased in price significantly. Especially all new models. So why wouldn't the best hot hatch on the planet? Confused
@@everymangamer1608 Look at the price when the Fk8 was released. Then the price jump when the 2020 refresh was released. Then another price jump on the FL5. Then the average markup on the FL5. This is as an FL5 owner who contacted about 100 dealers about a year before the FL5 was released to find one who put the least (wasn't able to get MSRP) amount on markup on it. It wasn't part of the initial 100 dealers that I ended up going with since none of those pre-release dealers honored their agreement.
But now it's almost irrelevant. As if you really sniff around you can find the Integra Type-S for MSRP if you live in the America's and are willing to wait a little bit.
@Vermonstered yeah that's fair enough and I get it. Where I live there's no markups and the msrp increased but not as much as UK or US. This just shows how much of an absolute bargain the fk8 was. My country has fixed prices so there was no downside to buying early on. Otherwise I would've ignored hype and bought years later, they don't get worse the more time goes on.
300hp 4cyl £50,000 “Bargain?!” Lol Sure
😂🤣😂
😂
Golf r's touching 70k on auto trader new
dont forget the "Used" for 50K not even new
@@neilmorris6719The golf r is also overpriced
Love this Joe! Car you drove is badged 52 later than mine!
Nice review Joe and good to see something non-German on the channel. 👍
Cracking car, big fan. If you can’t get one (because it’s very very expensive), I’d at least go and test drive a face lift i30N. They’re ridiculously capable, make an awesome noise and with a small tune would be nearly as quick. Bonus - it’s the same weight and a bit narrower! I’ve just got rid of mine after a fun year of ownership to go back to BMW though (I missed RWD) 🫣
Enjoyable video chap.
Do I spy Harry's twisty bit of road?!
I noticed that too!
I am lucky to have owned and driven some dream cars........but this is one of the best cars I have driven.
Owned quite a few type r's through the years all the way back to the ek9 and followed the development of the FL5 from the start deciding that it was going to be my next car. Then the price was announced and the fact the UK wasn't getting a decent allocation, Meaning the price likely wont come down to a sensible figure anytime soon if ever. I love a type r but its not worth £50k.
It's worth what people are willing to pay. People are clearly willing to pay it!
What a great looking type R. In my view far nicer than the last model.
I’m surprised at how expensive they are in the UK. £50k is about 100k NZ dollars here in New Zealand, that’s huge money. There’s a few almost new ones I’ve seen advertised for around £35K. I’m quite tempted but I’d need to upgrade the wheels to perhaps slightly smaller size such as 18” and thicker tyres plus a full size spare.
The state of roads here is shocking, almost 3rd world, even highways are littered with potholes. Lots of wheels get ruined here.
Be interested to drive one of these, I’ve got the fk2 mapped to 370hp so I’d be interested to know the real world differences. Mine was 20k with low mileage. It seems risky to spend 50k on a civic, it’s niche. I agree with the looks of the fl5 though it’s stunning.
25 years ago I got my first BMW and I promised myself that I'd never have another FWD car, and I've stuck to that. The latest Civic Type R is an appealing package but I'd like to have heard more about traction through (and out of) corners, when pulling away swiftly from junctions, and whether the car's cornering dynamics can be tuned by driving through the throttle.
Can bot accounts own cars in real life?
Joe, please test the GR86, you would like it. There are some still available to buy.
I think you’d love my hot hatch Joe!… 1205kg, 4 door hatch, big boot, massage seats, 300bhp, great fuel consumption, 380mm Alcon brakes as standard plus a Torsen manual diff! Oh and did I say it’s a manual car too!? What is the car?…
The French always did hot hatches best 👍
I've got an FK2 ATM, and love the FL5!
Nothing better than manual gear box in a Honda Type r BMW never managed to get the manuals right . But FWD sucks for 0-60
this Viagra Blue color, ROCKS!!!
Fantastic video Joe 👏😁😁👏
Enjoyed that review joe very interesting , I always wanted an FK8 but ended up buying a Mk 3 focus rs. , the rs is a great car but I still end up thinking of getting a FK8
7:55, I reviewed the Type-R as well and the screen probably feels like that because you've been used to the centre being tilted towards you. Otherwise it felt normal to me
I really, really want one, my neighbour has one and it's relatively subtle in the flesh.
Really like that you are reviewing non German cars Joe and giving them a fair shake.
Great review. A lot of current cars have small fuel tanks. Guess it's a weight saving measure.
Hi Joe. If you have a choice as a daily in a wet city. Would you rather the ctr or 2023 m240i?
Thank you
I almost bought an FK8 until I heard about the gear grind issues.
I know a very reputable Honda specialist and I was shocked when he told me about the reliability issues of later Type R’s. He even said French like.
that was early fk8's goimg into 2nd gear. That was resolved a few years ago with the midlife refresh fk8.
Thanks for a great review! Would you take a FL5 over an OG M2 or the latest RS3? I have the RS3 now and have owned both M2 and FK8. What I miss in the FK8 compared to the other two cars was engine sound and acceleration grip. I also felt that FK8 engine was quite laggy. But turn in and steering feel from FK8 was really good!
I have an OG M2.. I love it, such a great car for £30k I bought it approved used too
M2 is just a superior car almost everywhere. Rs3 is also way superior, specially the new one, but different, the fl5 is a little more fun to drive
Honda is better quality if thats what you mean
RS3 for all year round performance.
CTR for fun.
M2 for a half way house between the 2
I can relate to your comment. My FK8 is my daily with a few bolt ons and 380 hp.
Out of tight corners u struggle with grip compared to an AWD car like my evo 8.
But what always put me of from german cars if its BMW , Audi,Seat or even an Hyundai I30 N is the emotionless driving feedback. The only other FWD car with proper Feedback in my opition is the Megane RS Trophy. But i haven't tried an RS3 yet. Only S3 Models. A Modern RS3 is just too expensive for me.
They do everything good to perfectr for daily driving but i dont see them to be actually drivers cars. Even if they are faster on paper. And i am german.
£50K though! 🤯
EP3 in 2001 £16,000. FN2 in 2007 £20,000. FK2 in 2015 £35,000 Fk8 in 2018 £38,000, and then latest model FL2 50K. There is something wrong here.
🎯💯
Money became worthless
@@leer9951 exactly, well put.
@@leer9951not to that amount. It is the exagerared greed of manufacturers such as Honda.
edit. as long as Hyundai can still make I30N for 30k, it is just the greed of Honda. Ppl who are dv.mb enough to pay Honda's asking prices breath our air and consume our planet's resources for nothing.
FK8 wasn’t £38k, I bought a top spec for £34k in 2020. Makes the FL2 even worse!
50k!!! If it's anything like the previous generations of Honda's it'll be a Type Rust in ten years 😂
Great car that would make me swap from my Suzuki Swift Sport, but the footprint of the Swift is such a joy, you can play on the road with different lines while staying in your lane! And it's 400kg lighter.
Still the fastest front wheel drive 4 cylinder - Yes, the prices have jumped up though - got mine for $45k new. I love this car.
I have to disagree with you on the selling price of this car as it's following through the years justifies the price partly as well as it being an awesome car. With regards it holding onto it's value I have the Civic Sport Plus and it seems to be holding onto its value as well. I think partly it is because they are bullet proof and have a reputation for reliability. I drove the Mk 1 version of the Civic Type R and always dreamed of having one and nearly did but bought my 1st Land Rover as I was shooting and fishing more than racing. Sadly as the price increased the stars never aligned again but I have the lesser model to follow on from my Accord ownership nearly 25 years ago. The floppy back parcel shelf is in my car also and it works a treat. Another great review of a really good car.
I had an 15:04 FK8, what a drivers car. Problem was stones were always getting caught in the front brakes which Honda didn’t have an answer for.
Whatttt stones really would get caught up in the brakes??
FK8 owner here as welll. I have never heard about this problem. Even not from other FK8 drivers.
That sounds like an enviorment problem if u drive on dirty streets with stones and gravel.
@@VxO4fame alright cooo haha I was like wtfff
I've got the FL4 and love it, covered 26000mi in a year. I can't imagine how much better the FL5 handles.
Prices on these are crashing in Canada right now. They got as high as $90,000 CDN, but are currently crashing back to reality.
How much now?.
@@shane6115 $73K
Wheres Canada...
Another great episode I drove the last model and it was fantastic but I was not sure of the looks.This version is a cracker👍 just bought my ticket for BOTB🤞
Those red seats are on of the best things about this machine 👌
I’ve always wanted Honda and Porsche as a duo to either development a relationship to manufacture a transmission for the TypeR Utilizing the Germans AWD system from the 911 - but honda may have it’s own reason why AWD may not be for the future but I beg the differ and believe this could possibly push honda further into the future with a co-development with the Germans for a new AWD system for the TypeR without compromising its agility. Ya been thinking about this for years now 😅😅😅
I mean honda already has a prett great awd system they use on acuras. I just think the added weight is no idea for the cost or vision of a civic type R. It is present in the TLX type s.
It has a great stance on the road.
I hear people here in the US are switching out the control module for the dampers to the integra type S one, its supposed to be so much better. On tracks around me I think most guys do not use the R mode on the dampers. I believe that sliding cover was already on the FK8 gen. I didn't realize the car was so wide I have only seen one in passing once, is the Fk8 narrower?
The type s is just a better version for a daily tbh
on paper the FK8 is 1 cm narrower :D so not really
Interestingly here in Australia where cars a flipping expensive these, even at 74k AUD, these look like value. If you compare up range to premium sports cars that are 150k and an M2 is 100k then not too bad… reliable, useful and quick enough. My next car in addition to my 20 year old Boxster…
I find it utterly alarming that a Honda Civic would cost in excess of £50k.
I wouldn't care if it had a Rolls Royce jet engined strapped under the bonnet, that is disgusting!!!!!
The motorist is being taken for a fool in this day and age but yet people keep buying the cars at these inflated prices which makes it the norm.
It would handle like a mustang with a Rolls jet engine, thankfully it has a very effective 2L turbocharged unit 👌
@@JoeAchilles1that is probably a fact regarding the handling 😂😂😂
On the plus side I don't need to tell folk I own a Civic 😅
However I do also have a 66 plate M135i in the garage after watching your videos from yesteryear, keep up the good work
@@mykiman5955 You probably think the GR Yaris is just the same as Aunt Brenda's Yaris as well
@@4Kandlezthanks for your assumption
Do you use the same road as Harry’s garage, roads look the same. I have a FK8 in the same blue and will be keeping it forever ❗️😊👍🏻
Hi @Joe i had the chance to sit inside a FK8 and FL5. With my left foot fully on the clutch pedal, i was able to shift the gear lever to 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 6th but couldn’t get it into 5th. Is it not full to the right and up? (Or all the way left and up for right hand drive)
Imagine if it had a porsche badge, got a feeling this machine would command a price in the region of 80 to 100k, thing is it would still be worth every penny just for the drive sensation alone considering renault charge 70k for their megane trophy r thats not even in the same league when it comes to usability just high end performance smh honda truly smashed it
How is the steering feel compared to the BMW M2 Competition?
Michelin man back with another banger
was looking to mk8 ended up with New i30N DCT the best hot hatch on market no way i will change for that
I'd really like someone to explain the type r to me, u just don't get it as I never got the previous model.
If i spent 50k on purchasing this car id just struggle looking back at it in the car park thinking what have I got for my money
An incredible drivers car..
@@philiphawkins4684 Sure, but so is the i30N for 25K€ less or a used M2 for the same money.. Its just too expensive for what it is.
impossible to explain, sporty Hondas in general can only be understood by those who drive them accordingly.
Type R is a special machine. I pay that money for it in a heart beat. 🫡
I driven an Integra Type R DC2, and it's one of those things you don't truly appreciate until you experience it for yourself.
Ive owned . Ek9 . Ep3 . Fd2 . Fk2 ... waited for a fl5 . Saw the price and thaught fuck that .... bought a gr yaris for 36k . Will never own another type R . Its not worth 50k.. and had loads af warranty issues with my fk2 . Had to argue with dealership to get new alloys after bubbling at 8k . Water in rear spoiler
Yep, my FN2 had loads of build quality issues. Probably why they have not allocated many of these to the UK.
How's the M2 coming along, Joe?
😂 went to their favourite customers. Lol. The dealer were even flipping the bloody cars.
£50k is the new £30k. People need to stop living in the '00s.
Saw one of these one road yesterday looked massive.
That’s not living in 00s that is inflation, people’s salaries are not going up as quick as the goods they want to buy, especially cars,
my mate Alistair raves about these. He sadly has a megane at the moment. 1.2 litre with a door hanging off.But he raves about this alot. I have to agree after watching this,looks fantastic and sounds great. Maybe when I win the euros I will treat him so he can race me in my spyder 😂❤ good video as usual joe.
The only downside to this vehicle is actually finding one, and you can't even test drive one to decide if you want to buy it. I own a GR Corolla, and both are hit or miss on the dealer's parking lot.
It could be the best drive around, but I can't get past the styling of the car. Sure, it's less ugly than before, but It is still hideous to look at. I also dislike overly large proportions in a hot hatch. The achilles heel is that the price tag is insane.
lol
Taste differs i guess. People here in germany compliment my FK8 from time to time. And i am not talking about car meets. Randomly at the super market or gas stations.
It stands out quite a bit with all the boring average german cars here.
@@VxO4fame Yes, tastes do differ, but I think this car is particularly divisive. Some people might love it, but I personally think it looks horrific and the interior is every bit as garish to me as the outside with all that bright red carpet inside. Some red trim on the seats or mat would have been tasteful. But the whole thing? Yuck!
There are quite a few for sale now
Joe, it looks like this car makes you happier than the M2c 😂.
Not with the N55 M2 though.
Awesome content
Thought my 2.0 polo gti had a small tank at 40 litres 😮 47 l in a car like thar seems small , 265 tyres all round that a wide tyre for a hatch !
I own one and struggle to get in 38 litres! Apart from that it’s a superb daily driver 👍
@paulthresher8198 yes of the 40l tank 5 litres on fuel light ! 😄
For £50.000 you could get a used M140i which already more capable than a type r plus better suspension, plus a stage 1 tune and still have money left over
🤣🤣🤣 As someone who owned an M140i and did lots with it (suspension, brakes and ECU wise), the FL5 is on a totally different level, it's handling, braking, feel, gearbox and practicality are in a different league.
TheDoll69 is like most youtubers who talk out of their arse
@@JoeAchilles1
😂 And I have to agree with you again. Never owned an M140i but drove a few M140i and M135i.
For me the FK8 has more feedback. The M140I is not considered a proper M model with the open diff and stuff.
No matter how good it is, it ceetainly isn't a bargain
Looks a really nice car
50k????? fuck that id rather get an old civic or integra
I've got a modified FK8 that i've put 3k into after buying the car for 27k and it'll EAT this thing up 😂🤣
Why do you review the i30N DCT so you can see why there is an 11k difference?
You havent showed space in the back and rear seat practicality.
How does it compare to Renault Megane RS?
It's an all round hero and future classic, an intelligent Dad's hot hatch take mates and luggage around tracks and it won't break
This is the equivalent of a 37gbp car in Australia. You pay a lot for a vehicle in the UK.
I can't recall seeing a car vid with less information per minute. You spend more time telling us what you haven't actually bothered to find out than you do giving actual facts. I don't expect I'll be watching much more of this channel.
I’d love one of these even at crazy money and they won’t disintegrate after a couple of months like the Germans either
This car is about £38k brand new in Australia.. it’s so expensive in uk thanks for taxes
I've got a late 2019 FK8 Type R and had considered the new one but that jump in new price from £37.5k to £50k rules it out. The older car was lower road tax as well being under the stealth tax the UK government imposed on new cars over £40k for the first 5 years of ownership. Disgusting. Will be holding onto mine for a while longer. Only issue with it is stones getting stuck in between the brake pad and disc. Horrible sound.
I have a m2 , was looking at a fk8 type r at the time too.. I think honestly we have the last era of reasonably priced, great cars. Everything now is ridiculously expensive geared towards lease and zero ownership
Ive got the fk8, but for £50k im getting either bmw/audi/merc/vw. Honda been smokin some stuff to come up with that price
Then you’ve missed the point and it isn’t aimed at you
And here I am finding myself mind bubbling, to buy for my next car, either RS4, or the Type R! 🤔 😂 both cars are massively great for each different reasons
Rs4 no question
@@Jordandacosta25 type r more fun, a lot more reliable and better on a country road and I'm speaking from experience
Joe, why don't you compare Honda to their past products?
In my eyes that’s a £35k car.
So start a car company and make a similar car and sell it for £35k
It is a £35k car, looks & feels really cheap. I would say more Chinese than Japanese! If you know, you know.
@@darkhorse4774 and you know you know.
As a former Type-R owner, I love the idea of owning another one, but agree with Joe about the back end (the stupid wing looks atrocious) and the red seats are a bit garish. Also, after several Audi and BMWs I now prefer paddle shifters over manual transmission.
I think this is where things will trip up, when you’re paying 50k for a used civic you immediately open it up to huge used competition. New for new kid of stood up as an argument. Used vs used no way
Be careful to watch out for Harry in the Twisties.
I wish thay had left the seats black