Those Makima simps always bring up that weak ass mind control in this argument. Literally by that logic she solos Goku, because she believes she's superior like bruh.
I don't even think it's plausible Makima could come back from Hollow Purple. Blood that ate her up faster than she could regenerate was enough to kill her, destroying her on an atomic level is for sure going to be enough.
Power’s blood isn’t the sole reason she died. She died because Denji didn’t view what he was doing as an attack and as a result didn’t transfer the damage he did. Her blood was just to make sure she wasn’t able to fight back from becoming food.
No, powers blood only restricted her, it wasn't really destroying anything, denji cutting her up was what merked the people and him bypassing her contract is what k!lled her
This battle is an interesting match up if you look at it on a narrative level. Like yeah Gojo won due to hax and his stats like the video said but Gojo’s own nature is meant to destroy Makima’s nature. Makima is the control devil, she bend others to her will and manipulate the world to her bidding, taking advantage of every flaws and loopholes she could find about the world’s system and order. But that’s the thing, she still need an order to maintain control. Sure she bends the system to her benefits and act against the rule here and there but at the end of the day the overall order of the world is still maintain by her and it’s what gives her power. You can’t control a world of chaos. Gojo however, is the personification of the destruction of order. His birth shift the world’s balance completely. His nature is to go against the system and to do as he wish, the complete counter to Makima’s nature. He perform feats that breaks the rules of his world(using RCT to restore his curse energy, an impossible feats since it’s basically you trying to fill up gas by burning more gas, and changing the rule of his domain on a whim). Everything about Gojo is the perfect counter of Makima’s nature. Gojo is the destruction of order, the one who obey to none.
This is such a great way of explaining why gojo would win outside of the technicalities. If you love both series you obviously knows makima had no chance.
Horrible answer, not all opinions are equal, and the number of similar opinions does not validate that opinion. You have to debate the two characters, give feats and statements and validate your character's power to be superlative then the other.
@godslayerreginald Because thats the point of a formal debate? I think anyone who dodges that notion doesn't believe in ther opinion to be correct enough to confidentally argue why its correct. A lack of rhetoric = lack of convincingness
There is quite literally no way that makima can hurt/damage nor touch Gojo while Gojo can. It will take a few hits and kills for Gojo to realize that she keeps regenerating from his attacks and then activates domain expansion, waits it out and finishes her for good this time .
@@jackaboynaylor9273So? Her contract is with the prime minister of Japan so she dosent have an infinite number of lives and since she can't hurt gojo he can keep killing her until she runs out
@@avamious5978 Doesn’t matter. It takes at least over 0.2 seconds to kill somebody and what’s 120 MILLION times 0.2? Bruh it’s gonna take nine months for it to affect her with the bare minimum time 💀
@@avamious5978 And she can. Blood manip doesn’t just attack you directly but from the inside out. It also has regen neg as it was used against Makima’s contract meaning RCT won’t work.
the thing about this matchup is that a lot depends on the situation. are we talking about a world where makima only has her base powers (control and bang?) or a world where she has all the devil powers from the ones that died (like during the gun devil arc)? is makima aware of gojo's abilities before the fight, or is gojo aware of hers? stuff like this really changes the fight. most people don't really talk about her ability to counter both mental and physical attacks OR her ability to move around and be summoned (with the spider devil or with animals). there's so many different factors that can change the outcome of this fight tbh and i don't feel like we talk about makima's powers enough either.
@@ChrisPBacon-zf5gm it helps only with cursed techniques and cursed energy, the six eyes. The onlybenefit of them to Gojo would be sensing her from behind or smthn and that's all probably
Saying gojo isnt affected by being a citizen of Japan is like saying makima wont be effected by domain expansion because she doesn't have cursed energy. If your going to equalise verses do it properly
Gojo has a different prime minister that’s not the same thing Gojo doesn’t rely on cursed energy to hit someone within his domain everything except him gets hit that being anyone with a brain
@@tastedivinefury2198 it attacks perception and anyone who isn’t touched by himself in the domain this is like Jogo’s domain that burns everyone in from the extreme heat
People seem to underestimate that Makima would have already present contracts with present devils where she has temporary access to another devils power. If she had Special 5 Division at her disposal she would give Gojo a hard time. Plus it is shown Makima's telekinetic ability ranges from getting her target in her line of sight. Her death stare is enough to blitz her opponent's insides as shown when she confronted the Yakuza
@@gravy4708actually not true she has the same ability but stronger this one will make you say Halloween for the rest of your life,all she has to say is Halloween 3times and it’s over
@@WhosgivesaFuck And all Gojo has to do is use a domain in 0.2 seconds and it's all over. And he could definitely do it faster with a lil practice as well.
It was actually a good point that giving Makima the Citizen Contract over Gojo would imply she has both verse’s Japan Citizens as her fodder, which would be unfair. Would have been a good loophole win condition though.
If we were to assume that these two were to fight in the same ‘arena’ it’d make sense to assume that they’d exist in the same universe. So that Makima would and should have access to ALL her abilities.
i'm pretty sure the cosmos devil didn't do that because it was implied makima would resist the attack. but idk man it's been awhile since i read the manga
@@achmahnsch Not necessarily. Considering how dangerous and fast Makima, if the Cosmos Devil actually had tried that Makima would easily have killed her in a split second. It practically requires a charge up, even if for a few seconds, but more than enough for Makima to realise what is happening and act accordingly.
A more plausible way of explain that end bit is that even if Makima’s transferred the effects of Unlimited Void to Gojo through her ability it wouldn’t work cause UV doesn’t affect Gojo or anyone he’s touching.
Huh? What does that have to do with anything she has a contract with japan every time Gojo uses his domain some random person in japan is going to tank it and die or turn into comatose victim.
@@jmb47kkamikaze80 makima's death avoiding contract is more specific then what toaster made it out to be it's "any attack that would harm or kill her is changed to an appropriate illness or accident to a random citizen of japan" due note it has to be considered "an attack" its why dinji was able to beat makima as him cutting her up and eating her wasnt done as an attack but an act of love, its how she really died. putting someone in a zone where infinite info is put into their head isnt really an attack that can kill or injure innately so even if it as considered an attack it cant be transfered as its nether harming her killing her. even if it did its stated his own domain doesnt work on him (for why cosmos couldnt do the same its most likely due to makima viewing cosmos as below her) contracts are strictly held word for word so paraphrasing or using vague terms cannot be used when trying to argue about it.
@@azurephantom100if it’s considered an attack by the person dishing it out, it will be transferred to someone else, gojo is clearly using it as an attack, not an act of love, so it wouldn’t work.
@@lolllymollly9769and then it would go to every person in Japan until she had no one else to transfer that infinite info to. Then the only place it could go is in her brain, since transferring it to Gojo (on the very slim chance that makima’s regeneration contract applies to him as well) wouldn’t work as he’s immune to his own domain’s effects. If Gojo lands infinite void, Makima loses outright. There’s no way around it.
@@mistah3687 Bit of a gap of logic first of yes he's immune to his domian but thats because its ignoring him not because hes immue to any and all mental attacks we can assume this since it also applies to anyone he's touching also why would infinte void transfer to "all" citizens and not just one its a contuinuse attack for example makima getting her head cut of there are mutliple things a person could die from having there head cut off yet it only transfred to one person makima would need to view it as multiple attacks for it to transfer to multiple people
When it comes to jjk character vs other anime, people almost always forget about how BROKEN domain expansion is. Domain isn't just like a cage. It's more like a different dimension with different rules of time and space. The idea of Domain is basically to throw enemies into another dimension where their power are useless, so they can be killed easily. The only two ways to deal with domain are either use domain expansion or break its barrier from outside(assuming it's not barrierless)
Jjk verse loses to any mage the ascension mage especially if they used domain expansion. A mage can literally take over and control there entire domain from lack of paradox.
Domain are onky broken when you cath everyone in it as Domains are weak from the outside. It's literally a class dome .Makima would just summon her victims out side and have them smash the domain from the outside . If gojo than recast it and strengths the outside well now the inside is weak and Makima has telekinesis so bro is just getting slamed out of his domain as all the information gets transferred to a random in japan so Makima doesn't have to deal with the brain lag and damage from information overload.
@@jmb47kkamikaze80She still suffers the damage dumbass if you shoot Makima point blank with a pistol like we've seen in the show her muffcap still gets blown off only afterwards the damage is transferred to another Japanese citizen so information overload from UV will still effect her Also I don't think you know how Domain expansion works or Unlimited Void for that matter once Makima gets caught in it she's paralyzed with her brain overloaded with infinite information she is getting stomped bro
Bro why do so many people forget how broken the very concept of Infinite void or hollow purple are cause almost everybody from other verses would be considered a normal human and be incapacitated in 0.2 seconds and you can't scale Gojo's purple based on destruction because anything that it touches gets destroyed on the moleculer level and the only thing that stops it from being straight up Planetary is only the limited range it has because of the CE it takes how do people forget how broken that is
Gojo charges purple up and only destroyed *part* of a city. The author didn't take into account all these scientific possibilities, so Gojo is not as strong as these theoretical scientific explanations of limitless
@@bignoob2726 like i said the only thing that stopped it from destroying more was range and how much CE he put into that attack if that is the only limit that is stopping that attack from being Planetary it is still a very broken ability
@@amaidiot u misunderstood the author then. Gojo put the maximum CE output that he as a sorcerer can output. This is literally explained during Ryu vs Yuta. Yuta has so much CE that he should be able to just nuke Ryu and insta win. But, he can't, there's a limit to how much CE a sorcerer can output regardless of how much CE they have. Thus, Ryu despite having less CE than Yuta can give Yuta a good fight because Ryu has abnormal CE output
@@bignoob2726 im saying that what limits purple is its range which can be fixed by more CE you misunderstood me and the fact he made it more of a bomb rather than a laser also limited its strength because it wasn't a concentrated beam
@@amaidiot how is it this a country or planet destroying thing then? Gojo opened the battle with a chant, full power, amped by an amping CT purple. Why didn't it vaporize the city? Probably because it can't. Gojo can't one shot a city or county or planet. He can spam purple over and over until eventually he destroys a nation by himself. Gradually destroying city after city. There's a hard limit to how CE energy he can put into one purple. Sure he could do like a 100 full power purples or something. But he can't put all that power into a single purple. He's being overestimated here
The ppl that think makima wins for some reason think all her abilities are instantaneous, And her control will work through gojo's auto rct that runs 24/7 on his brain.
Ive watch most makima vs gojo debates they never bring up makimas bang ability. Which is able to bypass the darkness devils protective barrier (similar to infinity). Or simplying blasting gojo to space. I really need a second opinion on this debate.
Neutral Infinity isn't a physical barrier, it's literally just Gojo manifesting infinite space between him and another object. Blasting Gojo to space wouldn't really work either since he can TELEPORT.
Makima speed is actually above *Mach 1458* She causally reacted to Gun Devil bullet, before it hit her in 1 second, 500 km away... 128.1 million lives to regenerate from, if she gets hit in the vital spots. She can also regenerate by drinking a drip of blood. 6:12 Bruh, Curse Naoya blitz Maki at Mach 3 is *Attack Speed* and his normal speed (combat speed) is *Supersonic* Maki couldn't dodge it, meant her combat & reaction speed aka overall speed is below *Mach 3* at that moment. Fan calculations before this feat is useless/outlier for the series. In the manga, Hakari never dodge lightning, Kashimo lightnings always hit him before Hakari could even react to it. Gojo's DE is one direct attack, it won't work on Makima, due to Makima immortality. DE attack also won't fully work on any entity, other than humans, it was stated in the last chapter of JJK. When Gojo used it on Sukuna & Gojo can't use DE for 128.1 million times. Lol Makima slams... Gojo is OVERRATED and ppl don't understand his infinity. Ppl don't even remember the words Gojo stated in his backstory, that attack that doesn't have any speed, mass, shape and no CE, can bypass infinity
First off maki had a massive amp during that fight. she was not even close to toji at that point but after that amp they became equals also JJK speed scaling is really inconsistent. Also it fully works on curses it just isn’t as effective and you can’t use that logic for devils since they are not the same thing. Gojo domain isn’t one direct attack its just what ever is in the domain will get flooded with information. Also gojo arguably can use domain expansion as much as he want since six eyes allows him to reuse the curse energy so much so he looses infinitesimal amount of curse energy which mean he looses so little curse energy it’s practically zero. Also the reason he said that is because he allowed things that are no danger towards him so he can just change that so nothing can get through. Also hakari did react to lightning.
Gojo wipes the floor, let me debunk some of your claims All speed statements about Naoya are inconsistent asf. Naoya when at his top speed in human form is stated to reach subsonic speed and breaks the sound barrier, but even without going all out he perception blitzes Yuji despite him reacting to supersonic attacks in weaker forms (piercing blood). It is way more consistent and makes more sense with what is presented if we consider that Naoya’s speed statements refer to his movement speed, with his combat and reaction speed being above that In chapter 186 and 188 Hakari is seen reacting to lightning, since he moved his head out of the way once and healed faster than lightning could kill on the other instance. The lightning hit him in chapter 186 because, as you said, it has a sure hit, but doesn’t change the fact that Hakari reacted to it Gojo can also be scaled to FTL via being above Kenjaku, who can react to a black hole before its gravity rips him We literally see Gojo’s domain working on multiple curses, but they can recover faster than humans because their brains are different (explained by Gege himself). Malina wouldn’t be immune to it, Gojo’s domain forces the enemy to do EVERY action and thus he can’t do anything, it’s not just information Gojo’s Hollow Purple can erase concepts, since it erases curses who are made out of abstract concepts and it’s made out of imaginary mass (chapter 75) that can affect concepts (chapter 205), and since Makima can’t recover from nothingness her regen and abstract existence would be useless
I believe Gojo could also win through "hollow purple 🟣" since from what I've seen Makima's body still has to be intact in some way in order for her to come back even if it cut into pieces, but hollow purple erases space on an atomic level so if her inter body was hit by it she would have no way of coming back thus making her contact null and void.
His attacks don’t work on the atomic level. It’s said he can control his cursed energy on the atomic level in order to control space. And mind telling me the ch where it is stated to erase matter or space?
@@amity4600 that would only apply if Makima's entire body wasn't caught up in it, but if she did than hollow purple 🟣 would completely erase Makima's body to the point where she wouldn't be able to come back from.
Nah, it's not stated in series thats bow that works, and looking at other devils with pretty extreme hax, it's harder to state she needs her body more than naught
@@victorkaranja1420 after Denji ate every piece of Makima she dead and ended up getting reincarnated, therefore Makima needs her body in order to survive.
Ok i was with you, you was talking logic, and then you said its not the same japan which is confusing. Because when you do versus battles like this then its assumed they are in the same world. Otherwise if not then gojo’s domain wouldnt even work since makima doesnt have curse energy in her verse which changes the results.
Probably but unlikely she can do the same with a shrine and the mountain it’s on. While she can teleport to a shrine it’s not very practical her teleportation and would require a major distraction.
@@ToasterXDcan you explain to us how they fumble their research? Just curious since you are one of the big believer in a Gojo W in the matchup prior to death battle.
His current feats proves he loses. He can only use domain expansion five times before his brain is fried. Meanwhile Makima has roughly 126 million expendable lives lool
Probably should give her weapon devils and all the devil hunters and devils she controls. Most of her abilities comes from them anyway, like how she utilize their powers and one-shot the gun devil in 7 seconds. She is the control devil, she should be able to control and use others abilities, you can't bring a necromancer into a fight and expect him to not use his undead summons.
This is FACTS, but then again the narrative is that Gojo needs to win. A lot of people can’t seem to understand that Makima is simply the GOAT and is far superior to Gojo when her full arsenal is being utilized it’s not to shit on Gojo, but it’s a fact.
I think gojo is stronger than makima for these reasons listed below. 1.Sukuna is at meteor lifting strength at 15 fingers due to the way he interacted with jogo's meteor during shibuya, and he punches yugi ( A very strong and durable jujustu sorcerer within jjk) through multiple buildings with just a casual punch. Plus we know at this time, megumi was also holding back a lot of sukuna's power due to yugi being able to tank sukuna's cursed technique without dying and sukuna stating that megumi was holding back his power. 2.CSM does do a similar feat to this by kicking quanxi so hard it launches her through multiple buildings, but we also see that CSM had lauched itself along with quanxi, not just doing a simple punch like sukuna. Plus, we have to include the fact that megumi was holding back some of sukunas power during his fight with yugi. 3. Once Sukuna gains 4 more fingers plus tengens head which should make him stronger then his 15 finger self, we see gojo not only match him in power ( even when sukuna got past his infinity via domain applification and sukuna disabling gojos infinity with his domain) we still see gojo casually matching sukuan in punches and then destroying a building pretty casually while fighting each other. In the recent chapter, gojo was capable of not only overpowering sukuna in strength but also being capable of fatally harming him with just his punches alone, resulting in sukuna calling for mahoraga to save him. 4. My point is that the curent CSM that makima fights is not stronger than gojo or sukuna due to the multiple strength feats we have for them. Even though CSM did lauch quanxi through those multiple buildings and lifting up a huge piece of rubble in his weakned state, sukuna and gojo just have better strength feats overall, especially sukunas meteor feat despite only being at 15 fingers at the time, and we also know gojo should scale above sukuna in strength at 20 fingers due to kenjacku giving sukuna tengen's head in order to match the power of his 20 finger state. 6. I think we can all agree that a full armor pochita is stronger than makima, and even when CSM was weakened in the final battle, it still slightly had the edge against makima, and likely would have won if not for her regeneration. So since we know gojo and sukuna are slightly stronger or masively stronger depending on how you scale the fingers, then a full armor pochita, they should both by default be stronger than makima. And if you check my other statement in the comments, makima doesnt scale near the gun devil in terms of strength, due to her needing to use more powerful devils to be capable of actually defeating the gun devil. TLDR Makima just doesn't have any strength showings that put her on gojo's or sukuna's level. They constantly have feats that scale them above pochita while makima was shown massively struggling against pochita in both his weakened and armored form. Without her regeneration, both forms of pochita would have defeated her.
Gojo has limits to infinite, attacks that come from inside of gojo will not be blocked, makima has 4 attacks that cannot be blocked by infinite, bang is able to be blocked but her say the name of person to kill would, being that it's a feeling first, gojo at his age would have a id that makima can access with her rank, makima can also apply pressure to anyone with a stare, gojo keeping up reverse curse and infinite will drain him quickly, makima can also use the powers of other devils, 1 of which uses light based attacks or just sending gojo to hell, makima being able to kill the gun devil and her being a 4 horsemen, she's fully capable of killing gojo, it's more of a question of who can attack quicker, gojo or makima, both have an instant kill move to the other.
@coma2726 Now I do agree that if makima sends gojo to hell, she will win via incon, but the problem is that it requires a sacrifice from someone who is contracted with the hell devil, makima her self was only capable of using tue hell devil because tolka or santa claus had a contract with it, makima herself has never actually used the hell devil in any way in most of her battles except against when she fought the darkness devil. She likely needs tolka or someone who can interact/has a contract with the hell devil to use that ability in the first place. Gojo could just kill the person makima tries to sacrifice, which would stop the activation of her ability, because most of her hax abilities require another person to be right next to her or connected to her chains before she can actually use their abilities.Even if makima completely controls the person she wants to sacrfice, like what she did with thr hybrids, gojo could just kill them before they activate a ability or gojo could catch makima in his domain before makima kills her sacrifice. If gojo uses red or blue that would be enough to easily kill anyone that makima has control over. If gojo destroys their body, makima won't be able to use their abilites because she still needed aki hayakawa's body to have a contract with the future devil, she needes tolkas body to have a contract with the hell devil. If gojo completely destroys tolkas head and prevents from talking via infinity, she will not be able to use the hell devil as a result. Now on to my next point The problem with the bang argument, is that makima's bang has a limit to it. So lets consider each time it was used against someone. First it was used against the darkness devil who started bleeding afterwards, then it was used to kill power and to dmg her in her blood devil state, we also see her use it against herself and against chainsaw man. So I personally do not think makima would aim for gojos head at all seeing she has only used her ability on the body parts of other devils, makima has never onced used the bang ability on someones head. She never aimed the ability at powers head, or chainsaw man's head, so gojo could just regenerate from the attack via reversed curse technique. Also the bang ability clearly has limits. It didn't do any massive dmg against CSM or Darkness Devil, however to be fair, darkness just regenerated from the attack. This shows that if someone has a high durability they can resist and negate the effects of makima's bang. Notice how bang only one shot power, because she was in her fiend state, but as soin as she entered her devil state, makima could not one shot her, but only take some of her limbs. Now think how this ability would affect someone like gojo who has way more durability than makima, and his durability is likely on the same level as full armor pochita or even higher based on his feats against sukuna. Gojo should be able to pretty easily tank makima's bang ability and even if it damages him, he can regenerate with rct Now about makima sending CSM to space. The Problem with using this against gojo is that CSM was tooken massively in the air by reze and then stabbed by the spear devil which launched him even further in the air before makima even uses her bang ability on CSM. This shows that makima can not just bang her opponets to space, because she also needs the use of reze and spear devil in order to do it. Makima needs to get gojo at a certain angle to send him to soace via bang, but she likely would not be able to because of his durability and because of the fact that gojo can use infinity to either bring himself back down or he can use infinity to prevent reze and spear devil from ever touching him. Makima needs to get her opponents at a certain position, while having reze lift them up into sky and having spear devil lift them up even higher, but gojo could easily speed biltz them or teleport away based on gojo having way better speed feats then makima, and if gojo uses his domain makima will be unable to move or use any of her abilities because of the information overiding her body. And I doubt she is as quick thinking as sukuna to come up with a plan to escape gojos domain. Sukuna has better knowledge about gojos domain and his abilities, so he was able to counter it, makima likely woulf likrly be overwhelmed and confused the moment gojo uses his domain on her. Using the logic I used above, makima's death stare likely woukd not affect gojo, because we see this ability only ever kill extremely weak humans. You never see her use this ability against the hybrids or power, which indicates that just like bang, this ability has less of a effect on beings who have more durability then the avergae human. Plus gojo could just use rct to heal any damage that is done to him. We also see that this is not a passive ability so if gojo uses unlimited void on her, She may not be able to even use her stare ability on him, because of the information clouding her thoughts. To add on to this makima will need to lock eyes on gojo. Gojo constantly has shown way better reaction speeds then makima, who for the most part is unable to react to a bullet. So makima will likely be unable to track gojo long enough for her ability to work, plus it likely would not kill him anyways. Finally, the problem with the shrine argument, is that makima needs a massive amount of prep time to use it. We also see that this ability only works in normal humans without supernatural abilities, she never uses this ability on hybrids or any devils * just normal humans .* gojo is not just a nornal human, he has way more durability then a normal human, gojo is a sorcerer who has the 6 eyes technique and he should be able to tank this ability as well because gojo scales far above any of the people makima kills with this ability. We also even see someone like geto tank something arguably more lethal then this. When togi says fall to geto, we see a huge massive crater left in the ground, while geto is smashed and crushed against the ground just like how makima crushes her victims with her shrine ability, but geto someone who is far weaker then gojo at this point, not only tanks this attack but also is able to get back up and continue his fight with yuta. This attack left a massive cratwr on the ground, while makima's attack did not. Also makima's shrine attack only lasts for a short amount of time, and the moment the effects go off, gojo will simply continue moving just like geto. Conclusion: Makima's shrine attack and all of her other hax abilities has never killed someone who has a higher durability then gojo, so gojo should just be able to tank the attack. To add on to this makima will not able to attack gojo within his own domain. *** Makima is never shown using the mold devil, she is never shown using the curse devil and most of her more dangerous abilites require the use of a devil hunter. Like how she needed aki to use the future devil and akane to use the snake devil, if gojo destroys their bodies, makima should no longer have those abilities at her disposal. **** Also when makima was using the shrine why didn't she use it on any of the hybrids or even akane herself? I simply believe gojo would just tank the ability, just like how geto tanked being slammed to the ground and crushed by togi's abilities. Sure the shrine may temporarily stop gojo from moving, but he would likely just get back up and continue moving the moment the shrine's effects wear off.
@@coma2726 also makima only killed the gun devil because she was controlling the body of devil hunters who were contracted to powerful devils. Without those devil hunters she controlled, makima realistically scales nowhere near the gun devil. Plus even if makima pulled the same trick on gojo, Gojo could simply teleport away or his infinity would block any of the attacks that makima used against the gun devil. 1.Gojo's infinity blocks anything that has speed, shape, form, or cursed energy. 2. The devils makima uses and their attacks for the most part have speed (because we see it take time for the devils to kill the gun devil) and we know these devils have a physial form (because we see kobeni capable of interacting with and seeing the snake devil, so this should also apply to the punishment devil as well, due to us being able to see its form.) 3. Gojo would either tank makima's attacks or simply block the attack of anyone she controls via infinity.
Strength feats here don't matter, if they did, makima would just use her other hax which are far more effective, also you are talking about a pochita that never tried bar maybe his flinging himself back to earth or when he defended kobeni
(Part1) So now I will be going over makima's and gojo's win conditions against each other and I will br explaining which one works and which one does not. 1. Makima has never shown any use of cosmos's abilities in any way and cosmos has never been shown using her ability on her. Even though cosmos does say halloween before makima kills her, we say cosoms constally say halloween to other people and they dont affected by her ability, or they are still capable of some level of speaking normally, this could just be cosmo saying halloween as a form of communication instead of actually using her abilities. We also know that cosmos needs time to charge up her attack in order for her to completly mentally destroy santa claus. Personally I believe that her abilities have less affect on supernatural enitities like devils, fiends, or hybrids because her halloween ability is never shown working on a devil, fiend or hybrid, only in normal humans. I believe gojo could resists the passive effects of her ability because of him being a six eye user and jujustu sorcer who are slightly different from humans due to the way they channel curse energy and the huge power difference between humans and sorcerers. And to add on to this makima has never used cosmos abilities and we have never seen her controlling cosmos in any way, we only see makima kill her and thats it. So makima will not be able to resist unlimited void and she will be affected by it. 2. Now even though I believe unlimited void works on makima, I dont think that will completely mentally break her, since it's only implied that gojo would mentally break humans but we never see any permant mental dmg to cursed spirits. I believe gojo's unlimited void works as a form of paralysis that stops his target from moving inside his domain. We know jogo was completely unable to move because of unlimited void but we never had the chance to see its effects to the fullest because gojo touched and tore off jogo's head while he was still conchess and he deactivated his domain, so as a result jogo was fine. Sukuna was also able to react and trade places with mahoraga while being affected by infinity, but in this case, we never got to see gojo mentally break any curses he went against because his opponets would react to his domain like sukuna before the affects kicked in or gojo would be over confindent against jogo allowing him to recover due to gojo touching jogo and him decativating his domain before any serious effects came in from unlimited void happened. Keep in mind that gojo wasn't completely trying to kill jogo, because he was trying to gather info from him about the other curses like him, and how jogo got so strong. You can't really gather information from a charcter who is mentally broken and unable to speak. Also sukuna was able to switch places with mahoraga before any serious effects of unlimited void kicked in. I believe that makima could be mentally okay within Gojo's domain for a little while, but she will be unable to move, howver if gojo doesnt deactivate his domain or touch makima, I believe makima will end up like santa claus and becomse mentally broken, I just believe that gojos unlimted void takes time to kick in, but luckily for him he could just keep spamming unlimited against makima since makina doesn't have a domain or ability that would be fast enough to counter gojos domain unlike sukuna who has ten shadows and he has a domain of his own. I dont think makima would be able to escape or do anything withing gojos domain becasue makima needs a person to sacfrice in order to send gojo or herself to CSM hell. And makima's teteportation techniques have a long wind up and doesn't seem to be as fast as sukuna's. Also sukuna has lots of knowledge about gojos domain plus his other abilities and he has extremely good reaction speed and battle IQ, makima has never shown the same level of reaction speed as sukuna and she isn't that smart in terms of combat compared to gojo and sukuna who are extremely quick thinking in combat and are capable of coming up with multuple stratigies against their oponents on the spot. Makima doesnt really compare to them, since she similar to kenjacku needs prep time against her enemies and she relies on other people to fight for her. She was easily outsmarted by denji and pretty easily caught off guard agaisnt power. Overall, I believe gojo could simply spam unlimited void on makima, and she would simply not be able to escape or react quick enough to avoid the more damaging effects that unlimited void would have on her over time. Plus gojos domain activated in just 0.2 so makima would likely not be able to react to that because she couldn't react to a bullet and she doesn't have any good speed feats that suggest she could move fast enough to escape. Makima is shown constantly getting caught off guard by bullets and being unable to dodge them. If Makima doesn't know about gojos abilities she likely would not react and would be in a state of confusion on what was going on, just like ehen she fought power who caught her of guard. Even if makima has the future devil, She still wouod not able to comprehend or be fast to enough to react to gojos domain due to just how fast it activates. Aki could only see a few seconds into the future, and was unable to dodge rezes bombs due to their aoe and aki was unable to react or comprehend being sent to hell by santa claus, I believe makima would be in a similar boat, she would not be fast enough to react to gojos domain due to its aoe and quick startup. She also would be surprised and would not comprehend what was happening within the furure, due to her never facing a ability like gojos domain before, and before she can react or do anything gojo would have caught her within his domain, plus if someone trys to break his domain he can harden it or continue to spam it. This is why I think gojo could beat makima via unlimited void.
1. Santa Claus is a devil and Cosmo ability worked on her. Cosmo ability won't work on beings like Makima, DD & Falling Devil, due to them already have all those info in their brain and they also remember erased concepts that Pochita ate. 2. I think these guys forgot about Makima saying that any damage that she have, will just transfer to a random Japanese person as an illness or an accident. So Gojo DE is useless against Makima. Yep, this guy speed read CSM MANGA. Makima doesn't need to make a contract with Hell Devil, to send someone into hell dimension. In the manga, Makima control Prinz and told Prinz to send her to Hell to face Darkness Devil. So, Makima can teleport ppl or herself to hell by using Prinz. Why are ppl still using the anti feat of Makima not dodging gun bullets in the train? 😂 This scene is a cliffhanger in the manga and make the readers wonder if Makima is truly dead. Because At that time, no one knew about Makima contract with the Japanese federation, which gives her extra immortality. After that, Makima speed blitz Quanxi, who can move at Mach 200. Which is slower than 0.2 second, Gojo DE. Makima reacted to Mach 1458 GD bullet, which is slower than 0.2 second, Gojo DE. If you read Chainsaw man manga, u would know that Aki can only see in the future for 5 seconds, due to FD made a contract with him and made Aki see only 5 seconds in the future. So Aki can react to Reze punches and Reze can blitz him while he can see 5 seconds in the future. Means that Reze is faster than Aki and both of them are still faster than Gojo. When you try and calc Aki seeing the future for 5 seconds and can react to Reze speed, who is easily High Hypersonic+ to MHS. MOVING ON... Future Devil was able to see many months in the future, when he saw Aki death. Makima took fully control of FD powers, so she easily can see that many far in the future.
@@chiaki.hayakawa18 It is never confirmed or stated that primal devils or makima have all the knowledge of the universe in their brains. It is only stated that santa claus was given knowledge abour darkness fron the darkness devil nothing else, what you saying is pure head canon. Even cosmos states that the knowledge santa claus has on darkness does not even fill one page of her libary. Saying makima has this much knowledge or any other primal devil is quite literally pure head canon or just straight up wanking. 😄 Makima is also unable to dodge the gun devil's bullet, and she is unable to dodge getting shot by the anti - makima squad, there are plenty of other feats showing that makima is unable to dodge bullets. Most of this info your getting is purely speculative or is never stated once within the actual series. 😇 When people do vs battles they usually rely on Feats, statements, and they don't just downplay the character they have a personal bias against. 🫡 🤗 But hey, if you want to convince gojo, or just jjk fans in general that makima is stronger, don't just downplay one character for sake of your argument. That's clearly bias!
@@chiaki.hayakawa18 🧐 Also just because it was a cliffhanger, still doesn't change the fact that makima did not react or dodge the bullet The statement it was just a cliffhanger does not in any way change makima's feats. This is purely your own interpretation on the author's work and it is not a stated by a character within the series so it is a anti - feat.😊
@@chiaki.hayakawa18 🤔 Again you are using pure head canon when talking about prinz teleportating any one else other then makima to hell. Prinz has never once teleported any one other than makima to hell, so gojo will not be affected by this, since we never see prinz teleport any one else other then Makima to hell. 🤔Also why didn't makima use prinz again to teleport everyone out of hell? Again your only speculating what makima can do, but not giving actual feats or statements thay justify your claims. Also calcs wilp not counted since most calcs can be wanked to the extreme due to certian mangas not keeping consistinency with their battles or power scaling. [So to summarise] PRINZ CAN ONLY TELEPORT MAKIMA TO HELL 🥰 makima has never teloported anyone other then herself to hell without the use of a contract. Also makima using prinz to teleport to hell is a one time thing, since prinz shortly dies afterwards and makima never uses that ability again as far as we know.
@@luksalter8200 alright buddo. There is is factor called “= power systems” that we have to take into account. If you want it to be that way, that means, just like Denji eating Makima, cursed energy wouldn’t count as an attack and wouldn’t trigger her contract. So she was die in one single attack.
@@TheBlunder-00.0 Verse equalization only applies if a person beats the other over a technicality (for example Logias beating Goku because he does not have Haki), so it does not apply in this one. Makima would simply be as Toji in this regard, so immune to sensing and DE.
1. Dont u have to hit kill her for her contract with the president to go down and it goes down by 1/like millions. 2. Bro mentions makima has an ability that doesnt travel distance(the ability where the points at the devil and it started bleeding out) and completely didnt talk about it in the battle. Infinity is an ability that creates infinite distance between urself and the attacker. So an ability that doesn’t travel bypass infinity. So makima wins
Except that ability is only a City-block level attack. With Gojo's Mountain+ durability, be doesn't even need to turn on infinity. This attack would be a slight breeze to him.
@@CommentPositionInformer Gojo is *Large Town lvl* AP/Durability. lol Makima AP scales to Planetary lvl, due to her scaling to Falling Devil and the other primal devils. Anyways, Makima negs with her control abilities, as soon as the fight starts.
@@chiaki.hayakawa18 Suuure buddy. First: Makima is the Control Devil, she isn't a primal, and doesn't scale to one. Her strongest attack sent Chainsaw Devil to space, which is a Multi-City Block feat. Second: The first shown primal, a.k.a Darkness Devil, no-diffed her, and she would've been destroyed has she remained in hell for even a bit longer. Third: Primals Devils aren't Planetary. Falling Devil's biggest feat is "causing Landslides all over the world". Landslides *aren't* earthquakes, so this vague feat is Country level at best, Town level most likely. And even if they were Earthquakes, it still would be only a Multi-Continental feat, nowhere near Planetary. Fourth: Makima's Control is trash. She couldn't control Power, couldn't control Chainsaw Man during the final battle, couldn't control the Chainsaw Devil in his full form, couldn't control the Angel Devil, couldn't even control *human* Denji as he was chopping her up for dinner. Let alone Gojo, who is much stronger than the Chainsaw Devil, as well as everyone else Makima has failed to control together. Fifth: You're thinking of Teen Gojo. Teen Gojo was Town via damaging Toji. Current Gojo is overwhelmingly more powerful than that, and has been confirmed superior to several Montain level opponents, such as Kenjaku in Geto's body, Yuta and Jogo with Coffin of the Iron Mountain. Sixth: Combine Gojo's superior durability with his regeneration, and his two abilities that can either one-shot or paralyze Makima, then her internal damage attack won't do much.
I know right, despite that statement from Gege is true then. Hollow purple is stated as an imaginary mass and in real life imaginary mass, can move faster than the speed of light also has property of a black hole. Yet people are still debunking about that statement, then why did mfs even agree on Mach 3 just because gege said so, while imaginary mass is stated by Gege himself but still disregarded as false
@@thiccboi3812Imaginary mass doesnt exist, nothing can travel at superluminal speed. But fiction has its own set of physics and rules so thats cool. Atleast the author knows some cool stuff
@@thiccboi3812funny thing is jjk fans only have HP to brag anout while Makima has a lot of arsenals and superior haxes that jjk fans refused to acknowledge due to the fact that Gojo got nothing to counter it, he weak compared to Makima veryyy weak.
@@nursenurse7454It’s hilarious too; you’ll hear every gojo stan spread dumb headcanons like hp being matter erasure; its like they don’t even read their own series
Love all the research that was taken into account. Ultimately a fight between these two characters would come down to whether or not Makima would be able to view Satoru as “lower than her.” If she can, then she automatically wins. But if she can’t, Satoru automatically wins. Between Six Eyes and Limitless this would make him invincible (via Infinity) and would allow him to one-shot Makima (via Hollow Purple), all while expending virtually no cursed energy whatsoever. Even if Makima could find a way to effectively damage Satoru physically, Satoru can used his reversed-curse energy technique to heal himself. If it comes down to it, Satoru could even use Domain Expansion: Unlimited Void to make the fight even easier. This would allow Satoru to effectively cancel out all of Makima’s “helpers,” and give Hollow Purple a 100% chance of hitting Makima whilst she’s within the Unlimited Void Domain. But none of Satoru’s abilities matter at all if Makima can directly control him. What especially doesn’t help Satoru is his lack of mind-control immunity/resistance. So honestly, unless we could officially confirm whether or not Makima would be able to control Satoru, I’d have to call this fight a tie between them.
This is honestly an amazing analysis on the two's abilities considering people "she thinks she's inferior to" is an interesting statement but somewhat vague.
The strongest in Jjk both sukuna and gojo have this immense presence that others can sense so I don’t think she’s gonna just feel that and think he’s a normal human
@@andrewbell6561 in chapter 233 the whole cast got tense feeling gojo’s presence before he went to fight sukuna and in chapter 224 sukuna was able to feel gojo’s immense presence across an entire city so I don’t think makima is gonna sit there and ignore that
You know, Makima can summon other devils, right? We've seen her do it and its kind of a big deal. Every devil/contract holder she came across (dead or alive because we've seen her abuse the power and contracts of corpses) she has in her inventory. She could just summon the (corpse) of the Cosmos fiend, trick Gojo into saying Halloween, and instantly make him mentally challenged. Devil powers themselves aren't rooted in physics, they encroach logic itself. She obviously has many devils under her control (which she can summon) that can disable various aspects of Gojo's mind.
Opponent: Hey, say this sudden, strange word which has no correlation or meaning in context of this fight which totally isn't an obvious trap. Gojo: Okay!! that doesnt make sense does it?
@@Kaifunsiuunlimited void instantly beats all the other devils, which Gojo has historically considered when faced with multiple Special Grades. Really, Makima’s only win con is if she can mind control Gojo.
Here’s me scaling her well over island level. As a presumption, I’m saying it’s bullets weigh tens of kilos due to them being truly massive for a bullet. The gun showed to be able to hit Makima in 0.3333 seconds from 500 km away, and we know this time as a result of their being an actual timer on the panels during it havoc with one second only passing after three panels, meaning each panel has an average time of 0.3333 secs with the gun beginning fire on the second. Calculating the speed 500,000 m ÷ 0.3333 = 1,500,000 m/s (Mach 4,373 MHS+) now using the formula for kinetic energy K.E. = 1/2 m v ² we can get its energy and thereby its tier. 10 × 1,500,000 ² = 22,500,000,000,000 joules (town level) The gun devil's dura scales to this because of Newton’s third law, “Every action has an equal on opposite reaction.” This is only for one bullet and because we can see on panel the gun’s bullets being very close to each other, that means that its firing rate must be comparable to the bullet's velocity and the number of bullets fired as a result. So Times the energy we got for one bullet by the number of bullets fired per second for a total energy the gun devil must withstand every second. 22,500,000,000,000 × 1,500,000 = 3.375e19 joules (island level) Angel’s weapons crippled the gun devil in seconds, so they scale well above this. For speed, she perception blitzed Quanxi who’s calced around high hypersonic to Mach 200 by manifestedfavour putting her combat speed around the MHS to MHS+ ranges. Her bang has also been calced at MHS+ which you can find just by typing “Makima Bang calc” But I’ll copy and paste it here regardless. The feat Basically, Makima with a couple of Bangs, sent Denji into space. Calculation • Red Line: 94px = around 200km the distance between Toyama and Shizouka. • Blue Line: 1153px • Distance: (200)*(1153)/((94)*2tan(70/2deg)) Distance: 1752 km denji is first sent out of the building, so the other 3 Bangs sent him in space, I will assume each bang being equally strong, so the distance the last bang need to travel at least would be 2/3 of the total one. • Distance travelled by last Bang: 1752 km*2/3 = 1116 km • Timeframe: 2s, 3s, 5s (it happens really fast in one panel, note this is only for the last bang) Makima "Bang" speed High-End: 1116000m/2s = 1116000m/s mach 1860 (MHS+) Mid-End: 1116000m/3s = 558000m/s mach 1240 (MHS+) Low-End:1116000m/5s = 223200m/s mach 744 (MHS) Addressing Maki’s bullet feat, it was literally stated that Mai uses rubber bullets that have a muzzle velocity of 60 m/s rather than supersonic 330+ m/s for most bullets. In addition, the feat itself is hard to calc the exact distance she actually moved along with the bullet also changing dimensions in the next panel, making it an unreliable feat. Hakari’s “Lightning dodge” calc for one has the HUGE problem of acting like the electricity (which is only being used to calc the timeframe) only moved the small distance to his face when it blatantly travels all the way to his arm, which significantly increases the timeframe and thereby slowing the speed. Here’s the part I’m referring to: blue (Hakari's head)= 187.59px (16.6cm) red (distance)= 57px (57/189.59)*100= 30.0648768395 30.0648768395% of 16.6= 4.99076955536cm There isn’t actually anything to suggest it had the same speed as cloud to ground lightning besides it being called lightning, which, by definition, without a cloud it blatantly isn’t and all the properties you mentioned that supports it being lightning and thereby having the same speed are also properties of electricity. Static electricity is a thing, Y’know? And people dismiss the Naoya feat because of “travel speed” but if it was just her travel speed that didn’t scale to Naoya then why couldn’t she have dodged it with her combat speed like she does midair later in the fight? (It’s almost like she just didn’t scale to his full speed at all.) Now ways, Makima can bypass his infinity. She has shown to be able to control the people she’s killed or have been killed along with their powers, like The hybrids Aki and many others. She has shown to have control over power’s corpse granting her blood manip which she can amp either by feeding power blood or the flesh of a strong devil (like Makima herself) Which would allow her to attack Gojo directly along with nullify his RCT regeneration just like how Denji nullified hers. Furthermore, she also has general body manip and similar powers without that anyway, like causing the darkness devil to violently haemorrhage blood, briefly stopping its godly regeneration. Other things that can work: She can create angel portals that could bypass the distance. Attack while his CT is burnt out or out last him in a fight where he has to constantly heal his CT. Blitz/stealth his detection (he talks about detecting things as if it’s a prerequisite for his automatic infinity) we’ve seen him struggle to track Toji and was unable to detect Hanami so this is possible. Etc. Concerning unlimited void, it wouldn’t actually affect her because Gojo admits that it harms people like when he said “You’re inside the limitless. Perception. Communication. The actions you take in life forced upon you infinitely. Ironic, isn’t it? Given everything, but unable to do anything. Dying slowly.“ so since Gojo acknowledges he sure-hit as a form of Attack which would be transferred by Makima’s contract, meaning she herself would be fine. And potentially, she can escape the domain via one of her slaves attacking the outside or by teleporting. She could also just not be in range in the first place and snipe him at the beginning of the fight or blitz with her amped punishment devil that even caught the GUN DEVIL who at full power has relativistic Hawaii scaling and other feats putting it comfortably at MHS to well in MHS+ TL;DR she has ways to bypass his infinity along with RCT and ways to survive some of his attacks, plus just scales higher. She negs (Btw, don’t ask me to debate on discord. I don’t have it or intend to use it for the foreseeable future.)
Imma add insult to injury to help further implicate that Makima truly has win cons here. Edit: I’ve written this comment six times already and I don’t feel like rewriting it. Since the creator of the video goes over Gojo’s abilties and why he would win this, I’m going to go over why I believe he is wrong and properly challenge his statement based off of Makima’s abilities alone. (Also calcs don’t scale higher than statements from the author directly, calc scaling is kind of bias in terms of interpretation on said statements and the information that is presented, therefore I will only state her abilities and provide a conditional hypothetical on how I believe they would effect Gojo if both universes were to meet) Statement(s): Remember she can still come back due to her contract with the prime minister of Japan the only way to fully kill her is to be eaten by another devil so that she may be reincarnated so hollow purple wouldn’t even work. Secondly whenever she does die she retains to information and skill set of the killer and she’s able to utilize that memory in order to find a loophole in her opponents skill set, the ONLY reason she lost to Denji was quite literally because she wanted to in a sense. She’s already died twenty-six times in her own verse. She can alter the memories and perception of those she comes into contact with, unless the six eyes and or limitless gives Gojo memetic resistance and compulsion resistance then he will simply become a slave to Makima without even realizing it. Let’s say that he can resist her, the huge issue isn’t that he can’t be touched but how many times can he kill her before she finds a way to absolutely destroy him. Her ability to sacrifice and instant-kill someone else is definitely a win-con because it has no suggestions to have any restrictions towards distance, time and or the laws of relativity, we know this because Makima used these abilities on Denji a being who scales higher than a being that was darkness incarnate and quite literally existed on a plane higher than any mortal comprehension, and a higher plane of existence entirely, there are multiple statements from the manga to support this as well. She just has too many win cons going into this and so many hax abilities similar to Gojo but unlike Gojo, Makima can afford to make multiple mistakes and actually grow from making them, where as to Gojo he can grow in battle and adapt to his opponent but it still strains him to do so and if pressured enough he’ll become a sort of glass cannon. In the current manga [SPOILER ALERT] When Gojo battled against Sakuna we’ve seen when he battles a being similar enough in power or just that much more superior he struggles to keep up with them and is put against the ropes, I mean in the manga now he’s utilizing every avenue he has, but only because Sakuna isn’t going all out yet and because Sakuna is choosing to embarrass Gojo during their battle. I’ll list off some of her more unknown abilties: Teleportation (She can teleport the people she has control over via her chain links) Memory Resistance (She could literally remember people erased from history) Dimensional Travel (She can utilize the spider devil to transport her to hell) Pain Manipulation (She doesn’t respond to her limbs being blown off or lethal harm being inflicted upon her) Organic Manipulation (Without touching her opponent she’d be able to utilize the Mold Devil which would in turn cause literal decay and mold to began spreading throughout Gojo’s body) It hasn’t been shown but she most likely can utilize the ghost devil’s intangibility or Incorporeality (This would make it so that Gojo can’t hurt or touch Makima to begin with at least by conventional means) She can utilize the stone devils Pretrification (Gojo goes to grab or punch Makima and the stone devil would be utilized and summoned, thus turning Gojo to stone) Information Manipulation and Madness Manipulation (The cosmos devil can literally instill the total understanding of the universe into an opponent, driving them completely insane) Makima having control over such a devil would make her resistance by such means of attack near impenetrable unless you believe Gojo’s domain expansion has some higher grade of universal understanding which is highly doubtful and unlikely, seeing as how the cosmos devil is literally as old as the cosmos itself and therefore has literally been there since the beginning..this means Gojo’s domain expansion simply wouldn’t work. Now lastly…TIME MANIPULATION (The Eternity Devil can cut the flow of time or even manipulate it in such ways on a scale to where to the outside world time isn’t truly effected, this level of time manipulation could quite literally destroy Gojo’s limitless abilities and therefore make it so that Makima can box with him) Now I’ve said all of this to say this..Makima if in a fight with Gojo and having all of this knowledge would view him as completely inferior to herself as it is in character for her to do so, therefore if she simply perceived him as lower status than herself then she could quite literally control him or at the very least manipulate him. With everything I’ve covered, it’s not to shit on Gojo. I’m sure everyone knows about Satarou Gojo’s abilities by this point, it’s only to educate others that Makima is not a slouch and has multiple hax abilities and summonings which she could utilize in knowledge and physical prowess to not only gain the edge in battle against our beloved sorcerer..but destroy him entirely.
The amount of misformation is wild broo.. if gojo isnt a japanese citizen then gojos domain expansion DONT EVEN WORK. Makima has no cursed energy thus making his domain expansion nulled due to heavenly restriction
idk how Gojo could deal with mind control so idk how this would go. but if Gojo manages to hit hollow purple Makima is pretty much gone (And i think the only way Gojo can kill Makima is using hollow purple).
Remember she can still come back due to her contract with the prime minister of Japan the only way to fully kill her is to be eaten by another devil so that she may be reincarnated so hollow purple wouldn’t even work, and whenever she does die she retains to information and skill set of the killer and she’s able to utilize that memory in order to find a loophole in her opponents skill set, the ONLY reason she lost to Denji was quite literally because she wanted to in a sense. She’s already died twenty-six times in her own verse. She can alter the memories and perception of those she comes into contact with, unless the six eyes and or limitless gives Gojo memetic resistance and compulsion resistance then he will simply become a slave to Makima without even realizing it. Let’s say that he can resist her, the huge issue isn’t that he can’t be touched but how many times can he kill her before she finds a way to absolutely destroy him. Her ability to sacrifice someone else is definitely a win con because it has no suggestions to have such restrictions towards distance, time and or law of resistance, we know this because Makima used this ability or a variation of it on a being who defeated a being that was darkness incarnate and quite literally existed on a plane higher than any mortal comprehension, there are multiple statements from the manga to support this as well. She just has too many win cons going into this and so many hax abilities similar to Gojo but unlike Gojo, Makima can afford to make mistakes and actually grow from making them. In the current manga [SPOILER ALERT] When Gojo battled against Sakuna we’ve seen when he battles a being similar enough in power or just that much more superior he struggles to keep up with them and is put against the ropes, I mean in the manga now he’s utilizing every avenue he has, but only because Sakuna isn’t going all out yet and because Sakuna is choosing to embarrass Gojo during their battle. I’ll list off some of her more unknown abilties: Teleportation (She can teleport the people she has control over via her chain links) Memory Resistance (She could literally remember people erased from history) Dimensional Travel (She can utilize the spider devil to transport her to hell) Pain Manipulation (She doesn’t respond to her limbs being blown off or lethal harm being inflicted upon her) Organic Manipulation (Without touching her opponent she’d be able to utilize the Mold Devil which would in turn cause literal decay and mold to began spreading throughout Gojo’s body) It hasn’t been shown but she most likely can utilize the ghost devil’s intangibility or Incorporeality (This would make it so that Gojo can’t hurt or touch Makima to begin with at least by conventional means) She can utilize the stone devils Pretrification (Gojo goes to grab or punch Makima and the stone devil would be utilized and summoned, thus turning Gojo to stone) Information Manipulation and Madness Manipulation (The cosmos devil can literally instill the total understanding of the universe into an opponent, driving them completely insane) Makima having control over such a devil would make her resistance by such means of attack near impenetrable unless you believe Gojo’s domain expansion has some higher grade of universal understanding which is highly doubtful and unlikely, seeing as how the cosmos devil is literally as old as the cosmos itself and therefore has literally been there since the beginning..this means Gojo’s domain expansion simply wouldn’t work. Now lastly…TIME MANIPULATION (The Eternity Devil can cut the flow of time or even manipulate it in such ways on a scale to where to the outside world time isn’t truly effected, this level of time manipulation could quite literally destroy Gojo’s limitless abilities and therefore make it so that Makima can box with him) Now I’ve said all of this to say this..Makima if in a fight with Gojo and having all of this knowledge would view him as completely inferior to herself as it is in character for her to do so, therefore if she simply perceived him as lower status than herself then she could quite literally control him or at the very least manipulate him. With everything I’ve covered, it’s not to shit on Gojo. I’m sure everyone knows about Satarou Gojo’s abilities by this point, it’s only to educate others that Makima is not a slouch and has multiple hax abilities and summonings which she could utilize in knowledge and physical prowess to not only gain the edge in battle against our beloved sorcerer..but destroy him entirely.
@@loneli_ Denji killed her, everything denji eats is erased from existence, so makima ´´died``. so yea im pretty sure hollow purple can ´´kill`` she is just coming back as nayuta but Makima dies. and Again i have no idea how Gojo deals with mind control and related abilities. if he cant deal with them then Makima wins, if he can and use hollow purple he could win.
@@onyx6774She wouldn’t have support but can still use all the people and entities she has under her control because it’s how she fights. Not giving her all her slaves is nerfing her.
A. Makima WOULD find Gojo immediately inferior to her. She views all humans as immediately inferior to her. This is shown all the time. Controlling people is often her go to move. She usually doesn't engage people in hand to hand lol. This is definitely the most consistent view. Burden is on you to prove she would immediately see Gojo as her equal/better? B. .2 seconds is a stated non fatal amount to normal humans. So let's see what what it would take if .2 was fatal for maximum charitiablity, we can calculate123,000,000 as the popular of japan, multiplied by .2 for the number of seconds. 123,000,000 * .2 = 24600000 To hours that's 6833.3333333333 AKA 284 days. Prove that Gojo can maintain his domain for 284 days straight. C. Ritual wouldn't work because it's a 1 on 1 match? So you put the battle in a universe with no people and broke all of makima's existing contracts? If you don't she could obvisously just make a new contract with any random person to do it, especially considering she can teleport. If you did, that's just weird.
I think she would definitely see gojo a threat and not inferior to her simply because of his presence. In the manga there were multiple times that humans felt an immense presence emanating from gojo. For your second point, I’m honestly thinking that gojo could probably just destroy Japan as a whole with his cursed ability. This would kill all of japans citizens, and I’m pretty sure he would do something like this as he is an arrogant person with apathetic feelings to weak people. On top of that, it’s not his japan, so why would he care. At this point in my theory she won’t have any more lives so then he uses his domain expansion and rips her head off like jogo. And as for her ritual, where she uses humans as sacrifice to kill her targets only being able to be used with the targets first and last name. I don’t think that’s ever gonna happen cause if gojo is in her earth, there would be no way for her to know his first and last name unless he tells her which is something he will not do
@@jager8168from what I can understand, they feel gojo’s presence because every human is born with an usually small amount of cursed energy (with obvious exceptions), so they feel Gojos pressure. Makima is neither human nor a cursed energy haver
@@jager8168 Just got rerecommended this video. What example are you referring to where a human with no cursed energy sense "immense presence emanating from gojo." Give me a chapter and I'll explain why you're confused. Also I can offer the counter example of just chapter 1 of JJK, where Yuji a human with no experience with cursed energy questions whether Gojo can handle 1 finger sukuna, giving no indication that gojo is anything special besides yuji just telling him.
The Makima disrespect is crazy, she could literally make contracts with all the world leaders and have billions of lives, the only reason she doesn't is because Japan's population is enough to reach her goal. She could literally take over the world if she wanted to but doesn't because her goal is to erase the devils. If the argument of "it's not the same Japan" is in effect than she just simply makes a contract with Gojo's prime minister. Another thing is that purple isn't imaginary mass its virtual mass so no it would not erase her and as for Gojo's domain it would either have no effect or effect some random person in Japan. She could also just say "bang" and kill him, infinity wouldn't work because there's nothing to stop or slow down (remember infinity is conceptual it either works or it doesn't). She could also squish Gojo or control him then kill him before his brain refresh's. And yes, Makima can control Gojo because she views all humans as lesser than herself, she's lived since the beginning of time, knows the secrets of the universe, and is immortal (having many lives and the ability to reincarnate), to her Gojo is just another human will die of old age and won't live to see the end of times and hasn't lived to experience its beginning.
I don't think Makima can touch Gojo if his reverse curse nullifies any mind control. Also I'm not too sure about Gojo's domain expansion (didn't read manga), if it will affect Makima mentally as she didn't get affected by Cosmos halloween. Then again once Gojo figures out the regenerative contract with the citizens, I'm not sure he would be willing to massacre normal citizens. I think if Gojo vaporizes Makima with purple he may kill Makima, but she will be reincarnated as another control devil. I think only Pochita can truly defeat the devils themselves
But at the end of the day that new Control Devil wouldn’t be Makima, so it would still count as Gojo killing Makima and thus as far as VS Battles are concerned it would be a victory for Gojo.
Makima can’t land a hit on gojo and if he uses his domain she he wins or purple which literally erases things most people say she comes back from hell but it’s the control devil that comes back not makima meaning gojo wins the fight and also you can’t permanently kill a jujutsu sorcerer unless you finish them off with cursed energy or the will just come back as a vengeful spirit even stronger or heal
@@jhiancarlosclemente6168 when you do cross verse battles you have to have verse equalization, cause what happens if we put ichgio against someone? So Ichigo automatically wins cause the other person can’t see him? See how that makes no sense? Like why even have a cross verse battle if you aren’t gonna have verse equalization
I feel like if Makima says gojo is inferior to her bro would just give 0 fucks and shit talk her like how he did to sukuna and kenjaku after his released from the prison realm.
If your gonna use “gojo isint from csm universe so he wouldn’t be affected by the contract” you could do the same for makima as she doesn’t have cursed energy so De can’t lock on to her. Also using the statistic that gojo could kill makima twice each second it would still take two years for every citizen in Japan to die while not accounting for its growing birth rate
Gojo has been stated several times to be capable of killing the entire country of Japan by himself, alongside this imbuing things with cursed energy that previously had none has been shown countless times in the shoe
@@inclitus-sulaThat was never stated, at a time is bs, overtime might be but not in one attack, the statement of special grades being able to destroy a country is bs.
Gojo just showed he’s better at hand to hand combat than even sukuna can spam domain expansions and heal from even sukuna’s malevolent shrine speed is the only thing makima contends him with but I don’t she her doing anything after being hit by domain expansion
@@jackaboynaylor9273ey, can you tell me what you think would happen if gojo simply used Unmesurable Void? Wouldnt the exact same thing that happened in the Cosmo Devil vs Doll Devil fight? Except with every singular citizen in the CSM's japan instead of all dolls under the control of santa all over the world, and with Makima instead of Santa? Gojo is the type of guy to just use his strongest move when his Six Eyes tell him the opponent is strong Edit: btw english aint my first language, pardon me for any mistakes
@@xammerezekielmarco4406 Wont state all but the biggest misinformation is that Gojo’s hollow purple is an imaginary mass, which is a mistranslation for Virtual mass, the kanji for purple was utilized to describe virtual mass, which is a concept of quantum mechanics that describes an object like it has a certain mass and it behaves like it does but it actually has a complete different mass. This debunking the argument of “tachyons travel at light speed and makima cant dodge🤓” and he said that Hollow purple deleted concept and is existence erasure(?????) which is never stated and not even hinted in the course of the series.
@@xammerezekielmarco4406 Besides, why did he only one side Gojo? Why didn’t he go deeper on Makima which has far more op hax, infinity is almost the same as the eternity devil. Why doesn’t Cosmo utilize Halloween on Makima? Makima says that she is far superior to Cosmo and even its ability halloween which is the same as unlimited void “transfer infinite information to a brain making it useless” Makima can: 1. Throw it to a random japanese citizen which wouldn’t cause any loss to her 2. The infinity devil to absorb it Gojo’s domain is almost the same as Halloween but Gojo’s domain is a one shot only, which would mean Gojo has to activate his domain 123,104,834 times, which we see he can’t because in the domain clash with Sukuna he struggled and had to blow his brains off to keep up with the domain clash and limitless which is an overdo on his CE which is not near enough unlimited to keep up with Makima’s constant reviving
Its definitely not even close. Unlimited Void would do her in. Also she could try transferring it to someone else, but that wouldn't work, as its literally infinite.
@@Silver-Sparrow_XDWhy do people say that as if it’s a good thing of Gojo? If the battle takes place on JJKs earth and not a neutral one there’s no way for him effect her Japan. And we know the contract works from any distance because she used it in hell.
No. Y'all need to stop downplaying Makima. This is like the 3rd clip where regarding this topic where y'all say the same thing and no new context. If you read the latest chapters, Primordial Devils once they set foot on Earth they automatically set half of the planet in ruins, and she scales w/ them so that makes her multi-continental lvl. It also won't matter much of what Gojo does since that worm that Denji & Asa were running from destroying Tokyo yet Nayuta w/ no combat experience and physically weaker was able to control its mind. Also MKM's contract, Domain Expansion wouldn't do nothing to CSM's JPN lives but give them sickness or injuries, not Deaths. She also got Future Devil contract to avoid getting caught in the Expansion if she wants. Makima gauges out Gojo's Eyes w/ his own blood due to her Blood Devil contract and does the Bang to separate his head from his shoulders. Makima solos him & the JJK verse.
Edit: I’ve written this comment six times already and I don’t feel like rewriting it. Since the creator of the video goes over Gojo’s abilties and why he would win this, I’m going to go over why I believe he is wrong and properly challenge his statement based off of Makima’s abilities alone. (Also calcs don’t scale higher than statements from the author directly, calc scaling is kind of bias in terms of interpretation on said statements and the information that is presented, therefore I will only state her abilities and provide a conditional hypothetical on how I believe they would effect Gojo if both universes were to meet) Statement(s): Remember she can still come back due to her contract with the prime minister of Japan the only way to fully kill her is to be eaten by another devil so that she may be reincarnated so hollow purple wouldn’t even work. Secondly whenever she does die she retains to information and skill set of the killer and she’s able to utilize that memory in order to find a loophole in her opponents skill set, the ONLY reason she lost to Denji was quite literally because she wanted to in a sense. She’s already died twenty-six times in her own verse. She can alter the memories and perception of those she comes into contact with, unless the six eyes and or limitless gives Gojo memetic resistance and compulsion resistance then he will simply become a slave to Makima without even realizing it. Let’s say that he can resist her, the huge issue isn’t that he can’t be touched but how many times can he kill her before she finds a way to absolutely destroy him. Her ability to sacrifice and instant-kill someone else is definitely a win-con because it has no suggestions to have any restrictions towards distance, time and or the laws of relativity, we know this because Makima used these abilities on Denji a being who scales higher than a being that was darkness incarnate and quite literally existed on a plane higher than any mortal comprehension, and a higher plane of existence entirely, there are multiple statements from the manga to support this as well. She just has too many win cons going into this and so many hax abilities similar to Gojo but unlike Gojo, Makima can afford to make multiple mistakes and actually grow from making them, where as to Gojo he can grow in battle and adapt to his opponent but it still strains him to do so and if pressured enough he’ll become a sort of glass cannon. In the current manga [SPOILER ALERT] When Gojo battled against Sakuna we’ve seen when he battles a being similar enough in power or just that much more superior he struggles to keep up with them and is put against the ropes, I mean in the manga now he’s utilizing every avenue he has, but only because Sakuna isn’t going all out yet and because Sakuna is choosing to embarrass Gojo during their battle. I’ll list off some of her more unknown abilties: Teleportation (She can teleport the people she has control over via her chain links) Memory Resistance (She could literally remember people erased from history) Dimensional Travel (She can utilize the spider devil to transport her to hell) Pain Manipulation (She doesn’t respond to her limbs being blown off or lethal harm being inflicted upon her) Organic Manipulation (Without touching her opponent she’d be able to utilize the Mold Devil which would in turn cause literal decay and mold to began spreading throughout Gojo’s body) It hasn’t been shown but she most likely can utilize the ghost devil’s intangibility or Incorporeality (This would make it so that Gojo can’t hurt or touch Makima to begin with at least by conventional means) She can utilize the stone devils Pretrification (Gojo goes to grab or punch Makima and the stone devil would be utilized and summoned, thus turning Gojo to stone) Information Manipulation and Madness Manipulation (The cosmos devil can literally instill the total understanding of the universe into an opponent, driving them completely insane) Makima having control over such a devil would make her resistance by such means of attack near impenetrable unless you believe Gojo’s domain expansion has some higher grade of universal understanding which is highly doubtful and unlikely, seeing as how the cosmos devil is literally as old as the cosmos itself and therefore has literally been there since the beginning..this means Gojo’s domain expansion simply wouldn’t work. Now lastly…TIME MANIPULATION (The Eternity Devil can cut the flow of time or even manipulate it in such ways on a scale to where to the outside world time isn’t truly effected, this level of time manipulation could quite literally destroy Gojo’s limitless abilities and therefore make it so that Makima can box with him) Now I’ve said all of this to say this..Makima if in a fight with Gojo and having all of this knowledge would view him as completely inferior to herself as it is in character for her to do so, therefore if she simply perceived him as lower status than herself then she could quite literally control him or at the very least manipulate him. With everything I’ve covered, it’s not to shit on Gojo. I’m sure everyone knows about Satarou Gojo’s abilities by this point, it’s only to educate others that Makima is not a slouch and has multiple hax abilities and summonings which she could utilize in knowledge and physical prowess to not only gain the edge in battle against our beloved sorcerer..but destroy him entirely.
She lost to Denji due to a combination of The regen neg power’s chainsaw granted and the fact her contract only transfers attacks and because Denji didn’t view eating as an attack but as a form of love she didn’t revive. Purple would also work assuming it erases matter (still haven’t been given the ch where it is stated to do that) because of the fact that she has to “transfer” the attack and if she’s erased there would be nothing to transfer.
I love you(no homo), and completely agree with every single word you just stated. Gojo is mad overhyped because his arsenal only works against flying bricks. And not even good bricks at that. And people like to sleep on makima abs act like she isn't absolutely busted. Not to mention that if she really needed to, she could just make contract with other devils with abilities that can defeat gojo (hell devil, darkness devil, etc)
I feel like this would honestly be a trial and error kind of match up. Makima has shown better travel speed feats but the six eyes grant alot of insight I'd say gojo has some better attack+ reaction speeds. Makima's brain chemistry is different so unlimited void wouldn't be as effective as on humans and its not infinite at once (0.2 de = months of knowledge), meaning its most likely infinite exponential growth in the quantity of knowledge. Given makima and how she dealt with the halloween attack and her intelligence, it wouldn't be to crazy for her to try to study DE in general, with attacks from the outside being a prominent weak point. If you remove the "what if" interactions of their hax, then I feel as though makima may win the stamina/endurance battle more often then not. Both have insane regen tho so we'll see gojos upper limits in upcoming chapters.
No bro, you're giving makima prep time to study on gojo, and jjk verse is def faster than csm verse, and makimas brain doesn't really matter it still gets overwhelmed, it's not just knowledge but it's the sensation of feeling everything all at once
@@ajrockss1282 Im not giving makima prep time. Its just the natural course of trial and error when you got millions of lives to spare. Also bro the travel speed in jjk is actually slow considering mach 3 is considered impressive. The reaction speed can be argued up to maybe 1/3 sol on a highball
@@1sosukeaizen1gojo is just slower than makima flat out. Also we are currently seeing gojo doesnt have unlimited stamina and seeing the effects of him restoring his CT and it hasnt even been one day. 86400 seconds in a day and makima has 125 million lives
@@franksarria9693 you must be reading another manga. Bro gojo can teleport instantly also he has indeed infinite stamina but he hurt the part of his brain that releases barrier techniques, you can already see him still fighting with no issues except no domains
obviously lol. dont think he can use domain expansion cause domains dont work against non curse users but his physical prowess and his other hax would blitz makima
Nobody talks about the fact she has a contract with so many devil's like the curse devil that will have a guarantee 1 shot after 3 hits and the fox devil and future sight too and who knows how many more
@@nothingness4068 yeah, it could bypass Infinity but it also has a condition to have it work. On top of that, there are too many "What If" and "Maybe" for this fight
I think it's actually very likely Makima thinks Gojo is inferior to her. She stated that she adores humans like humans adore dogs. So she'd probably think Gojo is inferior. Though even if she does think he's inferior I don't think she would for long because she wouldn't automatically control him(she'd have no reason to), when he engages with her she'd realize how powerful he is and sh'ed most likely realize he's definitely not inferior. One thing I don't agree on though is your Maki mach 19 statement. Awakened Maki is not faster than cursed spirit Naoya, her and Toji's physical stats are honed to a point that they have precognition. If pre awakened Maki has reaction time of mach 19 then awakened Maki should have had a MUCH easier time with cursed spirit Naoya.
Makima wouldn't think of Gojo as inferior. As others will point out, he's kind of just built different. Beyond his birth changing the fate of the world and whatnot, his mere presence is enough to have a significant effect on non-jujutsu sorcerers, like Makima. Kind of hard to feel superior when you are metaphorically under Gojo's weight.
This is a tough match up because of how unknown Makima's power's are but most likely Gojo would win with Hollow Purple as erasing Makima from reality is a good way to take her out, now domain exspasion might not work you could compare it to the ability of the Cosmos devil which is almost the same just with a spooky twist and she tried it on Makima right before she died and it didn't work. EDIT: let it be known this comment is very outdated
Nothing in the manga stated that HOLLOW PURPLE is existence eraser. It's just a normal destructive attack. Makima will just tanked HP and if she gets hurt somehow, the damage will automatically transfer to a random Japanese person as an illness or an accident and she will regenerate
@@chiaki.hayakawa18 I sware I heard that hollow purple is an existence eraser somewhere, guess not. Does that mean Gojo has no win con because infinite void doesne't work because of the cosmos devil and Gojo isn't going to kill all of Japan just to kill Makima it isn't in character for him to do so
@@glitch-xegaThat is what that means yes, literally the only reason she lost is because Denji truly did love her even if she didn't notice the actual him. The man viewed eating her as an act of love so he could become one with her which was a loop hole to her contract.
@@nathancurnutt8074 bitter sweet ending for part one of chainsaw man but it's really sad to see dispite all Makima put Denji through he loved her cause she gave him a home and a family even if her intentions where not what he realized at first, I love that manga so much
@@glitch-xega Yeah it really is beautiful, especially since we get to watch as Denji matures over the course of the story into becoming a good father to Nayuta at the very end
even if makima could get the ritual off with a sacrifice, i still don't think makima's telekinesis would have the AP to kill gojo, makiam has at most large town level AP. and while i don't really agree with island level gojo since high ranking jujutsu officials considered Rika' curse to be a gojo/geto level threat, and followed up by saying rika was capable of destroying a city, this is not long before gojo performs the hollow purple feat, also i have seen "some" people calc hollow purple at large town level. i do think gojo is at least large mountain level+(to me), so makima is still not even close to gojo's level of power. also i think the mach 4000 lightning calc is a bit wanky, since i have seen people calc this feat more around mach 500 to 900, but again thats just me, like mach 4760 seems a little high considering Hakari barely even dodged the lighting anyway, and there i have seen calc of other characters from different verses that can completely blitz or out speed lightning barely being calc'ed around mach 2000.
The only way Makima can win is by controlling him(which has really low chance of working cause of sex eyes), And that depends on her confidence of being better(superior )than the one being controlled If she saw him flying, teleporting, one shotting strongest devils she will definitely lose confidence And then it's over, at best it would be a tie, gojo can kill her with purple/de though
But if she didn’t see him use his powers, the moment the battle would begin, Gojo would already be under her control, because to Makima he’s just a regular human for all she knows
@@kbthegoatw no, I meant if she didn’t see him use his powers. I’m not taking away his powers dumbass, I’m saying that if makima just saw him just standing there or whatever
Ok with some of the newer info we have we know that Gojo domain expansion does burn through his cursed energy and inside your domain you cant use your cursed technique. So like the mental dmg that is being done to her gets transferred and if that keeps her down due to the process theirs a good chance that the amount of time it would take infinity to kill all 125+million people of japan would be way to long for gojo to keep his domain up even with the ability to heal his burned out curse technique since we know infinity does do a lot of mental dmg. Assuming it kills a person every sec which it wouldnt it would take over 4 years to kill every person in japan which is way longer then gojo can keep up his domain or fight for since gojo is still human and needs to eat drink ect. Outside of domain like her telekinetic ability might be a internal attack which bypasses gojo infinity and she simply uses that to dmg his brain which causes him to not be able to use his cursed technique and he simply dies.
More realistically tbh its going to take much longer then 1 sec per person since it would be how long it takes her to die and she is a lot mentally tougher then normal people so it could take longer then gojo has natural life span for him to kill her perma through her mental durability depending if ya think her mental durability would be destroyed by the domain ect
@@josephvaccariello4181 Not at all. It takes 0.2 seconds for the damage to become irreversible. Likely 0.5 is enough to killed. And Gojo can just regenerate using Reverse. Add this to his Mountain+ durability, and there is no damage that she can cause him that he can't regenerate from.
Ok so I'm not sure where you got the information that it burns through his cursed energy, the six eyes literally make the use of cursed energy so efficient that he will literally never run out of cursed energy.(as stated by Yuta several times) Now what I assume your referring to is him not having a cursed technique after his domain is broken, if a domain is broken then the user has to wait a certain amount of time before they can use their technique again, but that's only if the domain is broken, and his domain took hits from a full powered Sukuna from the outside(which is the weakest part of the barrier) before it broke, so it's not like a car hitting it could break it, it has to be something of an insanely high damage output to break the barrier from the outside.
Based take It's funny to me because Makima 100% would just view Gojo as inferior (unlike what Toaster said), simply because he's human. Not only that, but Halloween Devil has an ability similar to Gojo's Unlimited Void, and people still don't think it'd work on her.
@@CH1C4N0444from your logic she can even beat Goku or even many DBZ characters that are humans isn't it? What a logic. Plus his brain is always keeps refreshing on it's own so even if he's caught with mental control it would snap back immediately. But that's considering if it bypasses infinity at first place.
What even makes this whole debate rediculous is that GojoTards do not even know how hollow purple works 😂. Thry keep saying that "Gojo will erase makima from existence with hollow purple". Hollow purple only disintegrate things at the atomic level and out of the physical world. It doesnt take of existence, such as souls and spirits 🤣🤣🤣. Makima continues to exist as long as theres the fear of control in the world, thats what makes her. These gojotards are just rediculous 😂😂😂
One thing I'd argue is Gojo, even if he had his Domain Expansion on foe 0.2 seconds essentially stunned everyone in the vicinity for at least 2 months even powerful curses were adfected. I think Makima would be affected by that as well.
Problem comes to Makima herself not seeing. Or devils of her calibre don't remember faces. In her final fight, Dennis basically tells us that she doesn't see/remember human faces. Only how they smell, which is further solidified by the recent chapter showing us that this can also be extended to stronger enemies like devils (famine devil says that the war devil couldn't tell the two forms of Denji and Pochita apart). Back to Makima, she says that anyone she sees is inferior to her. She can't see him. Boring way to end it, but Makima would win (unless Gojo isn't a human and is some kinda cursed entity? Idk, I'm not too well read on JJK)
@@kryptonight63 She don’t beat him in a fight directly but if she sees herself above him yeah she takes control of him ( saitama). Gojo gets stomped no diff.
@@kryptonight63 yeah, she does, but since Saitama is just THAT GUY, he'd probably have some gag like he's too dumb to be controlled, or a sneeze would release the mind control while destroying everything in the vicinity
Good point, but there's a few other things for consider. As dumb as it sounds, does Gojo even have a scent? He's surrounded by a barrier of infinite distance which he has full control over, so would whatever scent he has be able to travel that distance? Obviously it's a dumb point, but there is actual reason to believe Gojo could counter the whole mind control thing. Unless there's specific statements contradicting me here, Makima's ability to control people is reliant on them hearing her. That sounds very similar to Cursed Speech to me, a well known cursed technique in the JJK verse with Gojo having a student that uses it. Gojo without a doubt would be able to protect himself from Cursed Speech, even without his infinity barrier as Cursed Speech can be countered by protecting the ears and brain with cursed energy. You might argue that Gojo wouldn't be doing that be default and wouldn't be able to tell that Makima has an ability like cursed speech since she lacks the markings for it, there are counters to this too. 1: the Six Eyes being able to recognise cursed techniques just by looking at a person. Whether you think this applies to other abilities is up to you, however I'd personally argue that they should. 2: Gojo has insanely fast reaction speeds, so protecting himself like this the moment he realises something is wrong should be easy for him. Gojo was able to keep up with Toji after his awakening as a teenager, dodging all his attacks with ease. Toji is insanely fast himself, so Gojo's reaction speed scaling above Toji's speed is a pretty strong feat. Another example (spoilers for recent JJK chapters, skip to next paragraph if you care about that) is Gojo vs Sukuna. In their most recent domain clash, Sukuna is behind on his domain by less than 0.01 seconds and that time difference was enough for Gojo to be able to win the domain clash. This means that, in the last few domain clashes, Gojo and Sukuna were opening their domains within less than 0.01 seconds of the other opening theirs and reacting to it with their own. There's all sorts of other arguments as to why Gojo wouldn't just seem like a regular human to Makima, such as cursed energy being something most characters can sense just by being near a character using large amounts of it (example being Yuji noticing Yuta nearby based on just sensing his cursed energy). There's also the example of Kishibe who, from what i know of CSM, is immune (or was immune, quite a bit behind on the manga) to Makima's control because she doesn't believe she is stronger than him. Again, my CSM manga knowledge is lacking so I don't remember exact wording, but my understanding is that she needs to believe without doubt that she is stronger than whoever she is trying to control in order to control them, so with characters that have any sort of inhuman powers, it's up for debate as to whether she would immediately believe she is superior or not and there's no point getting into head canon debates. This fight is kinda boring because honestly, one side wins outright depending on where you stand. Either Makima can control Gojo and that's it, game over, or Gojo is immune to control for one reason or another and Makima just has no options to even touch him. Regardless of what side you're on, both are great characters from great mangas and are both insanely strong in their own universe. Sorry for my rant and have a good one!
@@Greninja9001 This is a copy comment I’ve made multiple times so excuse the error of dialogue in the beginning, I just didn’t feel like retyping it a 5th time. You can skip through most of it up until Makima’s abilties. Remember she can still come back due to her contract with the prime minister of Japan the only way to fully kill her is to be eaten by another devil so that she may be reincarnated so hollow purple wouldn’t even work, and whenever she does die she retains to information and skill set of the killer and she’s able to utilize that memory in order to find a loophole in her opponents skill set, the ONLY reason she lost to Denji was quite literally because she wanted to in a sense. She’s already died twenty-six times in her own verse. She can alter the memories and perception of those she comes into contact with, unless the six eyes and or limitless gives Gojo memetic resistance and compulsion resistance then he will simply become a slave to Makima without even realizing it. Let’s say that he can resist her, the huge issue isn’t that he can’t be touched but how many times can he kill her before she finds a way to absolutely destroy him. Her ability to sacrifice someone else is definitely a win con because it has no suggestions to have such restrictions towards distance, time and or law of resistance, we know this because Makima used this ability or a variation of it on a being who defeated a being that was darkness incarnate and quite literally existed on a plane higher than any mortal comprehension, there are multiple statements from the manga to support this as well. She just has too many win cons going into this and so many hax abilities similar to Gojo but unlike Gojo, Makima can afford to make mistakes and actually grow from making them. In the current manga [SPOILER ALERT] When Gojo battled against Sakuna we’ve seen when he battles a being similar enough in power or just that much more superior he struggles to keep up with them and is put against the ropes, I mean in the manga now he’s utilizing every avenue he has, but only because Sakuna isn’t going all out yet and because Sakuna is choosing to embarrass Gojo during their battle. I’ll list off some of her more unknown abilties: Teleportation (She can teleport the people she has control over via her chain links) Memory Resistance (She could literally remember people erased from history) Dimensional Travel (She can utilize the spider devil to transport her to hell) Pain Manipulation (She doesn’t respond to her limbs being blown off or lethal harm being inflicted upon her) Organic Manipulation (Without touching her opponent she’d be able to utilize the Mold Devil which would in turn cause literal decay and mold to began spreading throughout Gojo’s body) It hasn’t been shown but she most likely can utilize the ghost devil’s intangibility or Incorporeality (This would make it so that Gojo can’t hurt or touch Makima to begin with at least by conventional means) She can utilize the stone devils Pretrification (Gojo goes to grab or punch Makima and the stone devil would be utilized and summoned, thus turning Gojo to stone) Information Manipulation and Madness Manipulation (The cosmos devil can literally instill the total understanding of the universe into an opponent, driving them completely insane) Makima having control over such a devil would make her resistance by such means of attack near impenetrable unless you believe Gojo’s domain expansion has some higher grade of universal understanding which is highly doubtful and unlikely, seeing as how the cosmos devil is literally as old as the cosmos itself and therefore has literally been there since the beginning..this means Gojo’s domain expansion simply wouldn’t work. Now lastly…TIME MANIPULATION (The Eternity Devil can cut the flow of time or even manipulate it in such ways on a scale to where to the outside world time isn’t truly effected, this level of time manipulation could quite literally destroy Gojo’s limitless abilities and therefore make it so that Makima can box with him) Now I’ve said all of this to say this..Makima if in a fight with Gojo and having all of this knowledge would view him as completely inferior to herself as it is in character for her to do so, therefore if she simply perceived him as lower status than herself then she could quite literally control him or at the very least manipulate him. With everything I’ve covered, it’s not to shit on Gojo. I’m sure everyone knows about Satarou Gojo’s abilities by this point, it’s only to educate others that Makima is not a slouch and has multiple hax abilities and summonings which she could utilize in knowledge and physical prowess to not only gain the edge in battle against our beloved sorcerer..but destroy him entirely. I guess it is all subjective and you could scale them entirely close to one another even with current Gojo versus Makima full power.
9:22 Domain Expansion targets beings with cursed energy, as proven by the Maki fight. So you disregard the the "Gojo is apart of Japan" equalization but apply equalization so Gojo can get a Domain Expansion off lmao This dude is a clown.
Verse equalization wouldn’t include something’s that’s not part of her base kit and it’s out-verse. Verse equalization is saying they have the same power system. Saying gojo would be affected due to being a Tokyo citizen is a knowledge claim as CSM author needs authority over jjk universe as these are separate universes with separate Tokyo citizens and prime ministers. This is also nlf btw. You’d get eaten up in a debate with that statement
@@XKIRA376 I don't care about verse equalization. Take Goku for example. If you were to pit him against Asta from Black Clover, would you argue that Asta can negate his ki techniques? When Asta negates Magic specifically? That's stupid and illogical. As per the rules established within JJK itself, Domains target cursed energy. Makima does not have that, so it isn't working.
Easiest argument would be that gojo kills himself by using Limitless Void on Makima. If a normal human can “withstand” 0.2 seconds of it, then a full limitless void would technically kill makima every 0.21seconds, hence killing Japanese, and eventually kill Gojo via the contract. Note, although Gojo is exempted by Limitless Void, Makima’s contract states that a random illness or death. So yeh. Gojo kills himself on this one.
Makima solos. Reasons :- 1. Gojo is a human. Makima can control humans easily as she perceives them lesser than herself (as dogs) and doesn’t have to use her force manipulation [by words/chain] (which she used on hybrids and devils) 2. Mind control isn’t a type of attack. So gojo cannot heal/recover with rct. 3. Now if your gonna say Makima couldn’t control Gojo like Kishibe then your wrong. Makima didn’t even try to control Kishibe because he was one of the first devil hunters and one of the most respected ones in the hunting department. His sole motive was to protect humanity and not beat some other devils just cuz they attacked him. She left him because he was one of strongest humans humanity can offer and didn’t held any personal grudge against any specific devils.
I'm not really into the vs battle community that much.. but personally, I believe Gojo wins this match up with little difficulty. The problem with makima controlling gojo is that, people who are weaker then her like angel and power can pretty easily break out of it through strong emotion. Makima's control also needs to meet special conditions before she can actually control someone. Notice how with most of the hybrids she had to beat them first and then she controls them. The same thing applies to chainsawman however, you could make the case that makima didn't control them because she was simply toying with her victims or because they are hybrids. But I personally believe that in order for makima to control someone 1. She needs to be 100% sure they are weaker then her by likely beating them in battle. 2. She needs to break them down and make sure they are mentally weak in order for her to control them. We see her usually control her victims when they are at their weakest moments mentally. She controlled Aki when he was desperate to protect power and denji. She controlled quanxi some time later after quanxi was begging for makima to save her girls, quanxi even said she will do anything for makima if she spares her girls, indicating quanxi herself viewed makima has superior to her and was emotionally broken down by makima. The same goes for reze and likely all the other hybrids. So if a person either view makima as superior to themselves or if they are emotionally and mentally weak, makima can control them 3. Makima can also use her chains in order to control people who likely don't have much interaction or knowledge of her. During the fight with Chainsaw Man and makima, we ser her controlling devil hunters who may or may not have passed away using her chains. We also see nayuta control war, who she likely had no prior knowledge of course before fami told nayuta her about yoru identity and potential. Why I think gojo can't be controlled by makima 1. In character Makima when she firsts goes against gojo likely may not try to control depending on the situation but even if she does, I don't think she would be able to control him for long. She needs to make sure that her opponent is weaker then her completely and depending on how the battle starts, she may quickly change her opion on gojo. So let's say makima uses her control on gojo the first time they meet. I believe gojo would break out of it similar to angel and power. Gojo has a really big ego and against his fight with sukuna, he is able to fortify his mind from feeling any sadness when seeing sukuna using megumi's body as his vessel. I believe makima may control gojo or catch him off guard for a short amount of time, but similar to the situation with Hanami, gojo will immediately break out of makimas control due to his strong emotions and fortified mind. I don't this is too much of a stretch because gojo scales far above power and angel and he has a pretty big ego similar to power, who also able to break out of makima's control. 2. I Belive for reason stated above, gojo will be immune to this form of control from makima because makima has no way of really emotionally manipulating current gojo due to the fortification of his mind. And I doubt makima will convince gojo that she is stronger then him, due to gojo ego. Gojo saw sukuna as a mere challenger to his title when they met again, which shows just how big his ego is. 3. Finnaly, I actually do believe if makima uses her chains on gojo she could control him/manipulate his memories, but before she does that there are some things to consider. Gojo is extremely faster then makima, makima has no realy speed feats other then slicing the head of a non transformed quanxi who was not even trying to fight bach against her. Quanxi didn't run or do anything against makima she just stood in the same spot until makima killed her. Secondly, Makima should scale no where to the gun devil in speed (Don't listen to chiaki hayakawa's wack scaling, they constally high ball and wank characters to the extreme based on their biased opions. They manipulate the narrative in order to get charcters at those speeds and we can easily wank gojo to FTL+ just like how chiaki wanked makima over mach 1458. In order for this to be a fair and honest fight we never should wank characters to oblivion just becasue we have a personal bias for them. Since most battles, I see on gojo are a high balled makima vs a low ball gojo, I never see a high ball gojo vs a high ball makima. I respect Chiaki as creator very much, I enjoyed and have watched many of their shorts, but they usually leave out facts or information when it comes to gojo vs makima and they usually have a clear bias for not just makima but other characters as well in their vs battles.) because makima literally stood there the whole time, not moving for her spot at all until the gun devil shot her in the head, in which she then used the ability of other devil hunters to kill the gun devil, which isn't really a speed feat but also not that good of a reaction feat when you realize she was also using the future devil in order to gain and catch the gun devil off guard, who wasn't moving away from makima's attack at all, it kinda just stood there and took it. So, now the real question is how fast are the chains? Honestly we don't really know, we may have to rely on the anime for this one, but I personally don't belive the chains are faster than gojo since we know makima's slower then gojo and when ever nayuta or makima uses the chains on someone they are either incapacitated, caught off guard or our extremely slow in reaction speed and general speed, yoru didn't dodge nayutas chains because of her reaction speed and because she was caught off guard. Personally even if you give the chains the benefit of the doubt of going through gojos infity, I believe gojo would immediately react to it and doge simply before it reaches him, since no really character in CSM other than the gun devil actually has lighting or ftl sped attacks or feats. I'm not saying gojos FTL but he should definitely be around or slightly lower then the speed of lighting which should be far above makima who doesn't have any really good speed feats, also makima seems to have terrible reaction speed and doesnt really have that many good speed feats, and is constantly getting shot in the head and being unable to dodge simple bullets. She reacted to the gun devil attacking because she was using the future devil (notice how makima didn't dodge any of the gun devil's bullets.) TLDR I don't think makima can control gojo unless she uses the future devil to catch him off guard with the chains, but even then gojo's six eyes allowed him to perceive things far greater then the average human and he has extremely good reaction speed, since he should scale above hakari who reacted to a lightning based attack. Makima may be in a similar situation to aki, where even though she can see the future, she may not be able to even catch, let alone react to gojo, who has countless speed feats throughout the manga unlike gojo. Also I wouldn't say makima scales above the gun devil, because she need to use other powerful devils to defeat it and she had many hax based devil at her disposal like future and angel to be able to counter the gun devil. We never see her control this version of the gun devil until after she defeats it, and we never she her use the bang ability in the gun devil, which should indicate that makima could not defeat the gun devil on her own without the assistance and contracts of the people she controlled. I just don't think makima can control gojo because of how many good speed feats we get for gojo and how many anti speed feats we get for makima.
There's quite a lot of issues with your comment. You said "Makima has really no speed feats"First of all Gojo has terrible speed feats lol. In terms of speed the JJK verse is insanley slow in compariosn to the chainsawman verse. Maki is outright stated to be slightly faster than mach 3 and she was able to land hits on a 15 finger sukuna. Based on what the official japanese translations said, sukunas speed was not nerfed in this fight due to megumi holding sukuna back. So Sukuna can get hit by mach 3 level punches. That same sukuna was able to jump in and save kenjaku from gojo. So Gojo was blocked by a character who is slightly faster than mach 3. So a mach 3 character is relative to gojo. You say hakari reacted to lighting attacks. This is false. Hakari is shown to be far slower than lighting attacks. We see him get blitzed by lighting multiple times which shows he is nowhere even close to the speed of lighting. Makima is shown to be on par or faster than pochita in the graveyard in just hand to hand combat. This version of pochita took out every hybrid devil including devil form quanxi. Human quanxi performed a mach 6 feat with her devil form being much faster so makima is easily over mach 10 based on other feats. I could get her much faster but ive proved my point. Also you seem to have misunderstood some parts of chainsawman. Makima can control someone even if they arent at their lowest point. Aki has been under makimas control for all of chainsawman. This is because Aki keeps saying he loves Makima and she saved her life but we know this is all false. Just before meeting makima we see Aki confused about why he loves makima. This is makimas control ability at work on him. The only time makima needed to break someone down to control them is with denji. And thats because she needed to unleash pochita by breaking denjis contract. This isnt anything to do with her ability lol. Also you said this : "And I doubt makima will convince gojo that she is stronger then him, due to gojo ego." Im confused by your point here, it seems like you dont understand makimas control ability. It does not matter what gojo thinks of himself, all that matters is what makimas thinks. If she thinks she's stronger than gojo, and gojo thinks hes stronger than makima then makimas abilty would work and she gains control of gojo. We litterally see multiple times where she controls people she just met, she doesnt need to defeat them to control them. She only had to do this with the gun devil and Pochita. 2 extremely OP beings so of course makima needs to beat them in a fight first. Also are you seriously comparing Makimas control ability to Hanamis flower mind relax ability lol? Hanamis flower ability was so weak that even Yuji and Todo were affected by it but were able to break out almost instantly. So gojo breaking out of it is a terrible way to show he is resistant to mind control. He heals his brain with RCT but thats it. This shows his RCT does not make him more immune to mind attacks since yuji was able to do the same thing and break out of the mind control. Whereas, Makimas mind control is so powerful she can control entire characters for the entire manga and change and alter their past like she did with Aki. The only character who resisted the mind control was angel but he was under control for years and years before he broke free, and then makima just mind controled her again 5 seconds later lol. So breaking out of her mind control isnt even that helpful since she has shown she can just control you again even if you have shown you can break free. So makima would control gojo, order him to disable infinity and then she'd either throw him in hell and let the primal fears tear him apart or she'd just launch him into space like we saw with pochita.
@@yadafty7671 1. For makima's speed feats She is never stated to be anywhere near mach 3 or above and she has no statements that put her above transformed quanxi. Pochita in his weakned state was able to catch quanxi off guard but keep in mind, before CSM slices her head she is not moving anywhere near her top speeds. We can still see and easily observe this from the panel quanxi is on. Quanxi lossed to CSM because she doesn't have the same level of regenration as makima, makima may be able to react to a weakened pochita, but that is only after pochita attacks her, she never blocks or dodges any of CSM attacks, she only regenerates from them. Also maki in her fight with cursed spirit naoya is later capable of not only blitzing naoya but easiky dodging most his attacks, keep in mind that if curse spitit naoya uses his cursed technique that easily puts him above mach 3 due to the frame rule. Also quanxi doesn't have any feats that would put her significantly above mach 3 unless you signifigantly wank her and high ball through calcs which you can also easily do eith the jjk verse to get to ftl or lightning speed feats. Hakari himself may not be lightning speed in terms of travel speed, but he was still able to react to a lightning based attack which puts his reaction speed far above any of the characters in CSM who have extremely sluggish reaction speed in comparison. Santa claus some we know who should slower than gojo or sukuna, was capable of reacting to all of quanxi's arrows. Also maki shoulf be far above mach 3 due to her growing in power and speed after fighting naoya. You could also make the argument that sukuna was caught off guard by maki or sukuna wasn't going all out against maki. We also know that gojo is on the same level of a 19 finger sukuna plis tengen's head, so he should easily be above not only the speed of maki, but he should also have a quicker reaction time then hakari, but we may have tow ait for the kashimo vs sukuna fight to prove this. However it sgould be noted that gojo is argubaly faster than this version of sukuna and he is even faster via teleportation. Quanxi and no CSM other then the gun devil should actually scale above mach 1 or higher, especially when there is no feats that put them there in the first place unless you wank their calcs. If you are going to high ball a character like makima or quanxi to or above makis speed, you might as well highball or wank gojo to lightning or FTL speed, since gojo is not onky faster but also stronger than maki by a wide margin. Personally I think gojo is around hypersonic and even faster via teleportarion, unless you wank or lowball him. The problem with saying that CSM characters ae faster, is that they have no speed feats that justify this, no CSM character has ever reacted to lightning type attacks, and makima has lots of anti feats, like how bullets which were confirmed to be normal by makima herself, were easily capable of tagging her, and CSM in his weakened and full armot form is stronger and faster then makima, keep in mind makima is never shown dodging any attack that is faster than gojo or is even equal to his speed. Makima has no feats that show her reaction speed is anywhere near as high as gojo. Makima is personaly subsonic at best, and that is if you rely on statements rather then feats.
How am I wanking Makima speed? 🤔 when she literally reacted before the Gun Devil bullet hit her in the manga. She reacted to it, but she didn't bother to dodge it. Also, Makima didn't have *Future Devil* at the moment, she used Future Devil after she got hit by the bullet. It's literally show u in the manga. - You are using Makima anti feats of not dodging normal guns bullets, when that moment occurred way back in 4th arc of CSM. Makima *Mach 1458* speed feat is in 7th arc of CSM. Also Makima didn't even dodge the gun bullets in Katana Man arc, because she made a contract with Japanese federation, which gives her extra immortality and that moment in the manga/anime was a cliffhanger and making us wondering if Makima is really dead. Gun Devil at 20% power reacted to Makima *Mach 1458* attack in gun devil arc and you're saying he's below lightning speed. GD blitz Hawaii country in 0.4 second in the manga and I calc it at Sub Relativistic/+ speed. Also, if Makima doesn't have any speed feats, how was she able to fire attacks and reacted before Pochita can move during mid air, mind u Pochita scale higher than GD in speed. Can also see Pochita getting sentt into outer space at very fast velocity.
@@chiaki.hayakawa18 The main issue was you acted like Makima is slower than gojo which is just dumb. Gojo is max Mach 10 in terms of speed. The JJK verse has very bad speed feats so when you said gojo is FTL I laughed lol. Makima is faster than anyone in the verse by a massive margin.
@@jkillerlioncat3241. Makima was able to react to Angel Devil movements in Gun Devil Arc. Angel Devil can react to Gun bullets and was calc at *Supersonic+* speed. Long, one of Quanxi girlfriend, was able to react to Gun bullets two times and it was calculate at Mach 3.6 by ManifestedFavor. This is very consistent with the low tier characters of CSM VERSE (Speed) Since Kobeni, Long and Angel was able to react and dodge bullets. 2. Makima blitz, kill Base Quanxi with a sword in international association arc. Base Quanxi did a zig zag blitz on Dolls and Humans in milli seconds, and it was calc at Mach 200+ by ManifestedFavor and many other anime scaling content creator. 3. Makima reacted to Gun Devil bullet, that move at Mach 1458 speed. 4. Makima fought Denji in the graveyard, latest chapter of CSM confirms this. Denji exchanging blows on Makima and Quanxi at one point was able to react to Denji, would just upscale both Quanxi & Denji in Devil form to Makima speed. 5. Curse Naoya normal speed is *Supersonic* When he's using his CT, his speed caps at Mach 3. 6. You guys can't wank the JJK verse speed, since JJK CHARACTERS haven't shown any FTL and Lightning speed and Gege also wrote that Mach 3 statement. Where as Fujimoto gave us timeframe and how far characters are from each other. So, we use calculate it and get their speed. Other characters would upscale to this, base on feats in the manga. 7. Hakari doesn't travel at Lightning speed, he didn't react to lightning and nobody in JJK are faster than lightning speed, lightning speed or close to lightning speed. 8. Teleportation is hax, it's not raw speed. So Gojo raw speed doesn't improve. 9. Chainsaw man concept that got weaker and still was able to react to Makima, it just upscale him to Makima. We literally see Pochita true form got Weakened by Makima tactics and Makima still says that Pochita still have enough power, strength and speed to dodge Makima/Angel Devil attack. Normal Angel Devil attack weapon was able to blitz Gun Devil and this Angel Devil attack that Makima used was amp up by 1000x
Naaaaaaaahhhhhhh calling bs on the control ability not working, she's basically seen everything he's done in her own verse, that would not deter her from looking down on him
the ability she used against the darkness devil can bypass gojo's infinity 100%. It comes from inside, she points and makes people bleed and die from the inside instantly without any projectiles,. she can use cosmo's devil and then use the ability, he wouldn't be able to heal mimself. she literally has his domain expansion
an interesting counter to Gojo's domain expansion is that one of Quaxi's side chicks has a power that literally fills your head with infinite knowledge to the point where you only say "Halloween" and even with that ability, Makima pretty much is on higher scale than that devil even with a broken hax like that; she also like no diffs the darkness devil and that devil was manipulating the entire Hell's landscape and was even stated transcendent
As far as i'm aware, the ability you're referencing doesn't fill their head with infinite information, only every piece of information in the universe. That's still a lot, but it's not even close to infinite since, well, nothing is close to infinity other than itself. I forget the exact wording of the ability but since everything in the universe < infinity, unlimited void is infinitely stronger and more potent of an ability. Even if i'm wrong and the ability you mentioned IS infinite information, there's also the fact that unlimited void works by using infinite stimuli repeated infinitely, so the person effected is experiencing simultaneous infinite infinities of information, making unlimited void still infinitely better. It's a point i've seen on this debate before, and everyone seems to forget just how potent gojo's domain really is in comparison. Spoilers for JJK Ch.228 (i think) onwards, but Gojo has also shown that he can decrease the range of his domain to be about the size of a tennis ball (or around that, i forget the exact but it was some sports ball), and by doing so he increases the potency of his domain's effects. Point is that unlimited void is gonna work on Makima regardless of how she compares to the halloween ability you mentioned.
I see this every time in a csm vs jjk debate and it is very rather annoying at this point. Even if cosmos ability “Halloween” technique is on par with Gojos hollow purple (which it isn’t on a HUGE massive scale in terms of potential and potency wise) cosmo as a character is very MID at best in the csm verse and has literally no feats or scaling other than using the ability at Santa Claus in the manga Before dying to Makima who practically no diff her and her fiend friends and quanxi herself without no sweat or hesitation to do so. Putting these two characters in a 1v1 verses match is extremely very one sided. Do you actually think cosmo can hit Gojo with her long ass wait time Halloween technique and could get Gojo off guard some how? Gojo would stand there after she did her technique and then Gojo would just speedblitz her beyond perception and rip her head off clean. NO DIFFICULTY Honestly this is just pure copium on the csm side rather than csm vs Jjk debate. There is no character in csm that can even remotely touch Gojo . It is not based on my opinion nor any sort of head cannon or biased on anything else. It is just on facts and pure measurement data. It is what it is end of story.
@@november4196 she does, Makima didn't even fight it properly and wasn't attacking back, if this was THAT serious she'd be running to that corpse. She couldn't go all out due to her circumstances or even stay to fight due to the environment, his DE is not infinite information but repetitive and stuff like that which Makima can easily withstand.
Makima instantly controls him and wins no diff. She will just smell him as a human and she doesn’t care about looks or appearances. ( confirmed by fami in chapter 135).
This is a fact but most wouldn’t take this, they don’t understand that by her being a primordial devil of her caliber and already being stronger than multiple devils that already outscale Gojo by simply existing, she would decide immediately that he is inferior and therefore he would become susceptible to her abilities and manipulation.
@@loneli_ That’s what I’m saying but people dismiss it because they’re biased and don’t want to admit that her control ability can end fights before it starts. Plus it’s jjk fans. Biased is their middle name when it comes to power scaling.
I feel like you're missing something... there's a difference between the humans in CSM and Sorcerers. Even though sorcerers are technically humans you cannot put them in the same category as CSM's normal humans cuz that would be the same as putting fiends in the same level as primal fears...in reality both of them are devils but very different from each other. Sorcerers have supernatural abilities, they can exorcise curses, heal injuries, use powerful techniques etc. Meanwhile the humans in CSM are naturally weak and when it comes to devil hunters they have to rely on contracts with devils cuz they don't have powers of their own. That's what makes those humans inferior to Makima but when it comes to gojo its a whole different story. When makima senses his immense energy coming from him, with his stupid OP HAX to stop any sort of attack coming towards plus the fact that he would be flying in the sky above her that would just prove to her that he is not like most humans and she won't be able to control him on sight. There's also the fact that in JJK manga angel mentioned that jujutsu sorcerers are capable to resist and counter the effects of the merger with tengen which in my opinion that is a very big feat (even bigger than Makima's control) cuz were talking about an apocalyptic event that can end humanity and sorcerers are immune to that. Now imagine how immune gojo would be to a less threatening ability such as Makima's control.
@@aaronbrown125 That’s the problem though. Socerer’s don’t exist in csm. As you said they are technically human. Because of that his scent would be human to her and she would see herself as above him then take control of him.
Gojo’s immense presence that was sensed by sukuna in ch222 would have makima shitting herself Jjk sorcerers aren’t normal humans let alone the strongest sorcerer
When he said gojo puts on his domain expansion and waits something out, what does he mean? Also I don’t get why he never mentioned making using the thing where she points and says bang. On top of that why can’t we say that gojo is a Japanese citizen and have attacks eventually reflect on to him. I just want anyone to explain cuz I’m kinda confused.
unless he immediately destroys her entire body with purple, which isn't even confirmed to be enough to stop her from coming back to life, he literally cannot win. While it's true that infinite void and all of his abilities can definitely kill her, Gojo is literally a citizen of Japan. Meaning that at some point, even if every human in Japan dies, Gojo will inevitably become a sacrifice for her to come back to life. The sacrifice is instant, meaning that no amount of reversal is going to bring him back
@@ToasterXD You are such an obvious di ck rider and biased JJK fanboy that debating you would just be a weste of my precious time. Life in your delusion where you think Gojo can beat Makima. And even if he could, the Darkness Devil /Falling Devil duo solo the JJK verse low diff, so you are only really debating sloppy seconds.
when people somehow misunderstood Makima's power in that one panel shown in the start of the vid and start saying she gonna get clapped every vsbattle (mostly because that one mistranslation). I even have to view the source material (I can read japanese, gladly) to confirm her power, bruh.
Pin cuz why not
Goated reason.
ok
*cope* 🤣
@@deonjoyner960ZA WARUDO… OVAHEAVEN HEAVEN! ⚡️
@@jaydenm5228that was kinda corny man..
Man people would argue Ichigo loses to Makima because hes a Japanese citizen.
Lol 😂 fr some simps be wilding
@@aaronbrown125 the funny part is that Ichigo would just come back as a soul and kick her ass since he'd be pronounced dead
@@shirothr5384thing is, she wouldn’t even see Ichigo 😭
Those Makima simps always bring up that weak ass mind control in this argument. Literally by that logic she solos Goku, because she believes she's superior like bruh.
Gojo would clap ichigo
I don't even think it's plausible Makima could come back from Hollow Purple. Blood that ate her up faster than she could regenerate was enough to kill her, destroying her on an atomic level is for sure going to be enough.
Power’s blood isn’t the sole reason she died. She died because Denji didn’t view what he was doing as an attack and as a result didn’t transfer the damage he did.
Her blood was just to make sure she wasn’t able to fight back from becoming food.
@@jackaboynaylor9273So, if Gojo eats Makima he wins?
@@guilha1506he won't get the chance to and also gojos attack damage would just get transferred to someone else
@@erenyeager6210 Not really she was still healing powers blood just nerfed her regen.
No, powers blood only restricted her, it wasn't really destroying anything, denji cutting her up was what merked the people and him bypassing her contract is what k!lled her
Fujimoto wanted to write a good story and he did, without giving a shit about powerscaling
This battle is an interesting match up if you look at it on a narrative level. Like yeah Gojo won due to hax and his stats like the video said but Gojo’s own nature is meant to destroy Makima’s nature. Makima is the control devil, she bend others to her will and manipulate the world to her bidding, taking advantage of every flaws and loopholes she could find about the world’s system and order. But that’s the thing, she still need an order to maintain control. Sure she bends the system to her benefits and act against the rule here and there but at the end of the day the overall order of the world is still maintain by her and it’s what gives her power. You can’t control a world of chaos. Gojo however, is the personification of the destruction of order. His birth shift the world’s balance completely. His nature is to go against the system and to do as he wish, the complete counter to Makima’s nature. He perform feats that breaks the rules of his world(using RCT to restore his curse energy, an impossible feats since it’s basically you trying to fill up gas by burning more gas, and changing the rule of his domain on a whim). Everything about Gojo is the perfect counter of Makima’s nature. Gojo is the destruction of order, the one who obey to none.
Theres a comment on another video like this, "If Makima tells Gojo to meow, he would simply bark instead"
This is such a great way of explaining why gojo would win outside of the technicalities. If you love both series you obviously knows makima had no chance.
Toji and sukuna have that mindset as well but the real question is
What about takaba ?
It all depends on who’s fans are more dedicated to spread their opinions.
Horrible answer, not all opinions are equal, and the number of similar opinions does not validate that opinion. You have to debate the two characters, give feats and statements and validate your character's power to be superlative then the other.
That's called being bias.
@@resolvedfate9999 A debate is an unbiased resolution
@@WhatTheDogDoin0493how did you come to that conclusion
@godslayerreginald Because thats the point of a formal debate? I think anyone who dodges that notion doesn't believe in ther opinion to be correct enough to confidentally argue why its correct. A lack of rhetoric = lack of convincingness
There is quite literally no way that makima can hurt/damage nor touch Gojo while Gojo can. It will take a few hits and kills for Gojo to realize that she keeps regenerating from his attacks and then activates domain expansion, waits it out and finishes her for good this time .
Her contract will just transfer the information due to Gojo viewing the sure-hit as a form of attack and has even acknowledged that it harms people.
@@jackaboynaylor9273So? Her contract is with the prime minister of Japan so she dosent have an infinite number of lives and since she can't hurt gojo he can keep killing her until she runs out
@@avamious5978 Doesn’t matter.
It takes at least over 0.2 seconds to kill somebody and what’s 120 MILLION times 0.2?
Bruh it’s gonna take nine months for it to affect her with the bare minimum time 💀
@@avamious5978 And she can. Blood manip doesn’t just attack you directly but from the inside out.
It also has regen neg as it was used against Makima’s contract meaning RCT won’t work.
@@jackaboynaylor9273 makima hasn't controlled power so she doesn't have blood manipulation as proven when power disobeyed makima when being questioned
the thing about this matchup is that a lot depends on the situation. are we talking about a world where makima only has her base powers (control and bang?) or a world where she has all the devil powers from the ones that died (like during the gun devil arc)? is makima aware of gojo's abilities before the fight, or is gojo aware of hers? stuff like this really changes the fight. most people don't really talk about her ability to counter both mental and physical attacks OR her ability to move around and be summoned (with the spider devil or with animals). there's so many different factors that can change the outcome of this fight tbh and i don't feel like we talk about makima's powers enough either.
Idk much about makima but six eyes helps gojo gather information on an opponent very quickly
why would you give one side the opportunity to prepare and not the other? lmao. in a 1v1 with no info gojo wins
@@suren123abut Makima could use the future devil to see the future and gain info on gojo
Well, it'd be fun to see how the fight would change with variables tweaked. @@suren123a
@@ChrisPBacon-zf5gm it helps only with cursed techniques and cursed energy, the six eyes. The onlybenefit of them to Gojo would be sensing her from behind or smthn and that's all probably
Saying gojo isnt affected by being a citizen of Japan is like saying makima wont be effected by domain expansion because she doesn't have cursed energy. If your going to equalise verses do it properly
Gojo has a different prime minister that’s not the same thing
Gojo doesn’t rely on cursed energy to hit someone within his domain everything except him gets hit that being anyone with a brain
@@DgSeznwhat did he hit that doesn’t have ce lol
@@tastedivinefury2198 it attacks perception and anyone who isn’t touched by himself in the domain this is like Jogo’s domain that burns everyone in from the extreme heat
@@DgSezn bro thinks gojo can hit maki with domain expansion
@@nothingness4068 he can’t trap her but it hits everything inside a domain expansion even Megumi’s soul
People seem to underestimate that Makima would have already present contracts with present devils where she has temporary access to another devils power. If she had Special 5 Division at her disposal she would give Gojo a hard time.
Plus it is shown Makima's telekinetic ability ranges from getting her target in her line of sight. Her death stare is enough to blitz her opponent's insides as shown when she confronted the Yakuza
finally someone mentions how she can use other devils' powers. that makes her wayy more op than people seem to think
Use spider devil to summon Darkness Devil.
Leave.
Why do people keep bringing up useless abilities??? Gojo can just use Domain and it will be finished. She literally can't do shit.
@@gravy4708actually not true she has the same ability but stronger this one will make you say Halloween for the rest of your life,all she has to say is Halloween 3times and it’s over
@@WhosgivesaFuck And all Gojo has to do is use a domain in 0.2 seconds and it's all over. And he could definitely do it faster with a lil practice as well.
It was actually a good point that giving Makima the Citizen Contract over Gojo would imply she has both verse’s Japan Citizens as her fodder, which would be unfair. Would have been a good loophole win condition though.
If we were to assume that these two were to fight in the same ‘arena’ it’d make sense to assume that they’d exist in the same universe. So that Makima would and should have access to ALL her abilities.
If Gojo could use domain expansion on her then why didn’t the cosmos devil do the same to makima. It’s basically the same ability just stronger
i'm pretty sure the cosmos devil didn't do that because it was implied makima would resist the attack. but idk man it's been awhile since i read the manga
@@capybara_fan that’s what I was getting at. If the attack could work on makima they would have done it
@@achmahnsch Not necessarily. Considering how dangerous and fast Makima, if the Cosmos Devil actually had tried that Makima would easily have killed her in a split second. It practically requires a charge up, even if for a few seconds, but more than enough for Makima to realise what is happening and act accordingly.
@@alexanderhunt88Isn't it stated in the manga that makima is completely immune to the cosmo devil's ability due to some other contracts?
@@Taozyhe I don't recall. I can't think of a reason for it.
Well, we will soon see what death battle thinks about this matchup
Death battle is almost never right dawg 😭
A more plausible way of explain that end bit is that even if Makima’s transferred the effects of Unlimited Void to Gojo through her ability it wouldn’t work cause UV doesn’t affect Gojo or anyone he’s touching.
Huh? What does that have to do with anything she has a contract with japan every time Gojo uses his domain some random person in japan is going to tank it and die or turn into comatose victim.
@@jmb47kkamikaze80 makima's death avoiding contract is more specific then what toaster made it out to be it's "any attack that would harm or kill her is changed to an appropriate illness or accident to a random citizen of japan" due note it has to be considered "an attack" its why dinji was able to beat makima as him cutting her up and eating her wasnt done as an attack but an act of love, its how she really died. putting someone in a zone where infinite info is put into their head isnt really an attack that can kill or injure innately so even if it as considered an attack it cant be transfered as its nether harming her killing her. even if it did its stated his own domain doesnt work on him (for why cosmos couldnt do the same its most likely due to makima viewing cosmos as below her) contracts are strictly held word for word so paraphrasing or using vague terms cannot be used when trying to argue about it.
@@azurephantom100if it’s considered an attack by the person dishing it out, it will be transferred to someone else, gojo is clearly using it as an attack, not an act of love, so it wouldn’t work.
@@lolllymollly9769and then it would go to every person in Japan until she had no one else to transfer that infinite info to. Then the only place it could go is in her brain, since transferring it to Gojo (on the very slim chance that makima’s regeneration contract applies to him as well) wouldn’t work as he’s immune to his own domain’s effects.
If Gojo lands infinite void, Makima loses outright. There’s no way around it.
@@mistah3687 Bit of a gap of logic first of yes he's immune to his domian but thats because its ignoring him not because hes immue to any and all mental attacks we can assume this since it also applies to anyone he's touching also why would infinte void transfer to "all" citizens and not just one its a contuinuse attack for example makima getting her head cut of there are mutliple things a person could die from having there head cut off yet it only transfred to one person makima would need to view it as multiple attacks for it to transfer to multiple people
When it comes to jjk character vs other anime, people almost always forget about how BROKEN domain expansion is.
Domain isn't just like a cage. It's more like a different dimension with different rules of time and space.
The idea of Domain is basically to throw enemies into another dimension where their power are useless, so they can be killed easily.
The only two ways to deal with domain are either use domain expansion or break its barrier from outside(assuming it's not barrierless)
Jjk verse loses to any mage the ascension mage especially if they used domain expansion. A mage can literally take over and control there entire domain from lack of paradox.
Domain are onky broken when you cath everyone in it as Domains are weak from the outside. It's literally a class dome .Makima would just summon her victims out side and have them smash the domain from the outside . If gojo than recast it and strengths the outside well now the inside is weak and Makima has telekinesis so bro is just getting slamed out of his domain as all the information gets transferred to a random in japan so Makima doesn't have to deal with the brain lag and damage from information overload.
@@jmb47kkamikaze80if she knew how it worked.
And wasn’t having her senses deepfried
@@jmb47kkamikaze80i feel you forget the actual threat of gojos domain and focused too much on the trapping part 💀💀
@@jmb47kkamikaze80She still suffers the damage dumbass if you shoot Makima point blank with a pistol like we've seen in the show her muffcap still gets blown off only afterwards the damage is transferred to another Japanese citizen so information overload from UV will still effect her
Also I don't think you know how Domain expansion works or Unlimited Void for that matter once Makima gets caught in it she's paralyzed with her brain overloaded with infinite information she is getting stomped bro
Bro why do so many people forget how broken the very concept of Infinite void or hollow purple are cause almost everybody from other verses would be considered a normal human and be incapacitated in 0.2 seconds and you can't scale Gojo's purple based on destruction because anything that it touches gets destroyed on the moleculer level and the only thing that stops it from being straight up Planetary is only the limited range it has because of the CE it takes how do people forget how broken that is
Gojo charges purple up and only destroyed *part* of a city. The author didn't take into account all these scientific possibilities, so Gojo is not as strong as these theoretical scientific explanations of limitless
@@bignoob2726 like i said the only thing that stopped it from destroying more was range and how much CE he put into that attack if that is the only limit that is stopping that attack from being Planetary it is still a very broken ability
@@amaidiot u misunderstood the author then. Gojo put the maximum CE output that he as a sorcerer can output.
This is literally explained during Ryu vs Yuta. Yuta has so much CE that he should be able to just nuke Ryu and insta win. But, he can't, there's a limit to how much CE a sorcerer can output regardless of how much CE they have. Thus, Ryu despite having less CE than Yuta can give Yuta a good fight because Ryu has abnormal CE output
@@bignoob2726 im saying that what limits purple is its range which can be fixed by more CE you misunderstood me and the fact he made it more of a bomb rather than a laser also limited its strength because it wasn't a concentrated beam
@@amaidiot how is it this a country or planet destroying thing then? Gojo opened the battle with a chant, full power, amped by an amping CT purple. Why didn't it vaporize the city? Probably because it can't. Gojo can't one shot a city or county or planet. He can spam purple over and over until eventually he destroys a nation by himself. Gradually destroying city after city. There's a hard limit to how CE energy he can put into one purple. Sure he could do like a 100 full power purples or something. But he can't put all that power into a single purple. He's being overestimated here
can't really think you're better than someone if you physically can't touch them
The ppl that think makima wins for some reason think all her abilities are instantaneous, And her control will work through gojo's auto rct that runs 24/7 on his brain.
Ive watch most makima vs gojo debates they never bring up makimas bang ability. Which is able to bypass the darkness devils protective barrier (similar to infinity). Or simplying blasting gojo to space. I really need a second opinion on this debate.
It's not the same
Gojo just doesn't have a barrier he has a infinite space between him and the person
Neutral Infinity isn't a physical barrier, it's literally just Gojo manifesting infinite space between him and another object. Blasting Gojo to space wouldn't really work either since he can TELEPORT.
Gojos Barrier isn't a physical one.
Its not physical dude.
Makima speed is actually above *Mach 1458*
She causally reacted to Gun Devil bullet, before it hit her in 1 second, 500 km away...
128.1 million lives to regenerate from, if she gets hit in the vital spots.
She can also regenerate by drinking a drip of blood.
6:12 Bruh, Curse Naoya blitz Maki at Mach 3 is *Attack Speed* and his normal speed (combat speed) is *Supersonic*
Maki couldn't dodge it, meant her combat & reaction speed aka overall speed is below *Mach 3* at that moment.
Fan calculations before this feat is useless/outlier for the series.
In the manga, Hakari never dodge lightning, Kashimo lightnings always hit him before Hakari could even react to it.
Gojo's DE is one direct attack, it won't work on Makima, due to Makima immortality.
DE attack also won't fully work on any entity, other than humans, it was stated in the last chapter of JJK.
When Gojo used it on Sukuna
& Gojo can't use DE for 128.1 million times. Lol
Makima slams...
Gojo is OVERRATED and ppl don't understand his infinity.
Ppl don't even remember the words Gojo stated in his backstory, that attack that doesn't have any speed, mass, shape and no CE, can bypass infinity
W debunk
First off maki had a massive amp during that fight. she was not even close to toji at that point but after that amp they became equals also JJK speed scaling is really inconsistent. Also it fully works on curses it just isn’t as effective and you can’t use that logic for devils since they are not the same thing. Gojo domain isn’t one direct attack its just what ever is in the domain will get flooded with information. Also gojo arguably can use domain expansion as much as he want since six eyes allows him to reuse the curse energy so much so he looses infinitesimal amount of curse energy which mean he looses so little curse energy it’s practically zero. Also the reason he said that is because he allowed things that are no danger towards him so he can just change that so nothing can get through. Also hakari did react to lightning.
What would you scale pochita, falling, and darkness to?
Gojo wipes the floor, let me debunk some of your claims
All speed statements about Naoya are inconsistent asf. Naoya when at his top speed in human form is stated to reach subsonic speed and breaks the sound barrier, but even without going all out he perception blitzes Yuji despite him reacting to supersonic attacks in weaker forms (piercing blood). It is way more consistent and makes more sense with what is presented if we consider that Naoya’s speed statements refer to his movement speed, with his combat and reaction speed being above that
In chapter 186 and 188 Hakari is seen reacting to lightning, since he moved his head out of the way once and healed faster than lightning could kill on the other instance. The lightning hit him in chapter 186 because, as you said, it has a sure hit, but doesn’t change the fact that Hakari reacted to it
Gojo can also be scaled to FTL via being above Kenjaku, who can react to a black hole before its gravity rips him
We literally see Gojo’s domain working on multiple curses, but they can recover faster than humans because their brains are different (explained by Gege himself). Malina wouldn’t be immune to it, Gojo’s domain forces the enemy to do EVERY action and thus he can’t do anything, it’s not just information
Gojo’s Hollow Purple can erase concepts, since it erases curses who are made out of abstract concepts and it’s made out of imaginary mass (chapter 75) that can affect concepts (chapter 205), and since Makima can’t recover from nothingness her regen and abstract existence would be useless
@@guilha1506 Hollow purple doesn’t erase concepts it erases matter. Makima got mold and blood manipulation any way. She slams that overwanked fodder.
I believe Gojo could also win through "hollow purple 🟣" since from what I've seen Makima's body still has to be intact in some way in order for her to come back even if it cut into pieces, but hollow purple erases space on an atomic level so if her inter body was hit by it she would have no way of coming back thus making her contact null and void.
His attacks don’t work on the atomic level. It’s said he can control his cursed energy on the atomic level in order to control space.
And mind telling me the ch where it is stated to erase matter or space?
Hollow purple doesn't negate regeneration abilities. That has been debunked
@@amity4600 that would only apply if Makima's entire body wasn't caught up in it, but if she did than hollow purple 🟣 would completely erase Makima's body to the point where she wouldn't be able to come back from.
Nah, it's not stated in series thats bow that works, and looking at other devils with pretty extreme hax, it's harder to state she needs her body more than naught
@@victorkaranja1420 after Denji ate every piece of Makima she dead and ended up getting reincarnated, therefore Makima needs her body in order to survive.
Ok i was with you, you was talking logic, and then you said its not the same japan which is confusing. Because when you do versus battles like this then its assumed they are in the same world. Otherwise if not then gojo’s domain wouldnt even work since makima doesnt have curse energy in her verse which changes the results.
He's a biased fanboy. Didn't you listen to him at all?
Couldn’t Makima just summon a human sacrifice. She summons 4 people back from the dead during the gun devil arc after all
Probably but unlikely she can do the same with a shrine and the mountain it’s on.
While she can teleport to a shrine it’s not very practical her teleportation and would require a major distraction.
When do makima need the shrine to do that insta kill attack,she do there because she dont want anyone to see that
Now the death battle version of this debate happened. What's your thoughts about it?
It’s alright. They did fumble on a few of the takes in typical Death Battle fashion but overall a good video. I do agree overall though!
@@ToasterXD 😎👍 your a good sport
@@ToasterXDcan you explain to us how they fumble their research? Just curious since you are one of the big believer in a Gojo W in the matchup prior to death battle.
Very good video! It reminds of a swagkage vs battle video especially with the Itachi OST in the background.
Gojo definitely takes this fight pretty fucking easy, especially with his current feats. 😂
His current feats proves he loses. He can only use domain expansion five times before his brain is fried. Meanwhile Makima has roughly 126 million expendable lives lool
@@jirenthegray5776But would Gojo even need domain expansion at all , Just keep blasting her with red.
@@RishabJagota Which he's not going to do due to her contract.
@@jirenthegray5776 it's not much of a verses battle if you're bringing morality into this lol
This aged badly
Probably should give her weapon devils and all the devil hunters and devils she controls. Most of her abilities comes from them anyway, like how she utilize their powers and one-shot the gun devil in 7 seconds. She is the control devil, she should be able to control and use others abilities, you can't bring a necromancer into a fight and expect him to not use his undead summons.
This is FACTS, but then again the narrative is that Gojo needs to win.
A lot of people can’t seem to understand that Makima is simply the GOAT and is far superior to Gojo when her full arsenal is being utilized it’s not to shit on Gojo, but it’s a fact.
“But it’s not a 1v1 then 🤓”
Sorry Naruto guess you’re not allowed to use your clones.
@@jackaboynaylor9273that’s different naruto clones are a abilities he can do just like a necromancer ability to control the dead
@@therealboi3454 Just like makima’s ability to take control of others and make them fight for her.
@@therealboi3454 So is Makima’s control! But apparently she can’t use it because it wouldn’t be a “1v1 🤓”
I think gojo is stronger than makima for these reasons listed below.
1.Sukuna is at meteor lifting strength at 15 fingers due to the way he interacted with jogo's meteor during shibuya, and he punches yugi ( A very strong and durable jujustu sorcerer within jjk) through multiple buildings with just a casual punch. Plus we know at this time, megumi was also holding back a lot of sukuna's power due to yugi being able to tank sukuna's cursed technique without dying and sukuna stating that megumi was holding back his power.
2.CSM does do a similar feat to this by kicking quanxi so hard it launches her through multiple buildings, but we also see that CSM had lauched itself along with quanxi, not just doing a simple punch like sukuna. Plus, we have to include the fact that megumi was holding back some of sukunas power during his fight with yugi.
3. Once Sukuna gains 4 more fingers plus tengens head which should make him stronger then his 15 finger self, we see gojo not only match him in power ( even when sukuna got past his infinity via domain applification and sukuna disabling gojos infinity with his domain) we still see gojo casually matching sukuan in punches and then destroying a building pretty casually while fighting each other. In the recent chapter, gojo was capable of not only overpowering sukuna in strength but also being capable of fatally harming him with just his punches alone, resulting in sukuna calling for mahoraga to save him.
4. My point is that the curent CSM that makima fights is not stronger than gojo or sukuna due to the multiple strength feats we have for them. Even though CSM did lauch quanxi through those multiple buildings and lifting up a huge piece of rubble in his weakned state, sukuna and gojo just have better strength feats overall, especially sukunas meteor feat despite only being at 15 fingers at the time, and we also know gojo should scale above sukuna in strength at 20 fingers due to kenjacku giving sukuna tengen's head in order to match the power of his 20 finger state.
6. I think we can all agree that a full armor pochita is stronger than makima, and even when CSM was weakened in the final battle, it still slightly had the edge against makima, and likely would have won if not for her regeneration. So since we know gojo and sukuna are slightly stronger or masively stronger depending on how you scale the fingers, then a full armor pochita, they should both by default be stronger than makima. And if you check my other statement in the comments, makima doesnt scale near the gun devil in terms of strength, due to her needing to use more powerful devils to be capable of actually defeating the gun devil.
TLDR
Makima just doesn't have any strength showings that put her on gojo's or sukuna's level. They constantly have feats that scale them above pochita while makima was shown massively struggling against pochita in both his weakened and armored form. Without her regeneration, both forms of pochita would have defeated her.
Gojo has limits to infinite, attacks that come from inside of gojo will not be blocked, makima has 4 attacks that cannot be blocked by infinite, bang is able to be blocked but her say the name of person to kill would, being that it's a feeling first, gojo at his age would have a id that makima can access with her rank, makima can also apply pressure to anyone with a stare, gojo keeping up reverse curse and infinite will drain him quickly, makima can also use the powers of other devils, 1 of which uses light based attacks or just sending gojo to hell, makima being able to kill the gun devil and her being a 4 horsemen, she's fully capable of killing gojo, it's more of a question of who can attack quicker, gojo or makima, both have an instant kill move to the other.
But Makima has hordes of real-life men barking for her.
@coma2726 Now I do agree that if makima sends gojo to hell, she will win via incon, but the problem is that it requires a sacrifice from someone who is contracted with the hell devil, makima her self was only capable of using tue hell devil because tolka or santa claus had a contract with it, makima herself has never actually used the hell devil in any way in most of her battles except against when she fought the darkness devil. She likely needs tolka or someone who can interact/has a contract with the hell devil to use that ability in the first place. Gojo could just kill the person makima tries to sacrifice, which would stop the activation of her ability, because most of her hax abilities require another person to be right next to her or connected to her chains before she can actually use their abilities.Even if makima completely controls the person she wants to sacrfice, like what she did with thr hybrids, gojo could just kill them before they activate a ability or gojo could catch makima in his domain before makima kills her sacrifice. If gojo uses red or blue that would be enough to easily kill anyone that makima has control over. If gojo destroys their body, makima won't be able to use their abilites because she still needed aki hayakawa's body to have a contract with the future devil, she needes tolkas body to have a contract with the hell devil. If gojo completely destroys tolkas head and prevents from talking via infinity, she will not be able to use the hell devil as a result.
Now on to my next point
The problem with the bang argument, is that makima's bang has a limit to it. So lets consider each time it was used against someone. First it was used against the darkness devil who started bleeding afterwards, then it was used to kill power and to dmg her in her blood devil state, we also see her use it against herself and against chainsaw man. So I personally do not think makima would aim for gojos head at all seeing she has only used her ability on the body parts of other devils, makima has never onced used the bang ability on someones head. She never aimed the ability at powers head, or chainsaw man's head, so gojo could just regenerate from the attack via reversed curse technique. Also the bang ability clearly has limits. It didn't do any massive dmg against CSM or Darkness Devil, however to be fair, darkness just regenerated from the attack. This shows that if someone has a high durability they can resist and negate the effects of makima's bang. Notice how bang only one shot power, because she was in her fiend state, but as soin as she entered her devil state, makima could not one shot her, but only take some of her limbs. Now think how this ability would affect someone like gojo who has way more durability than makima, and his durability is likely on the same level as full armor pochita or even higher based on his feats against sukuna.
Gojo should be able to pretty easily tank makima's bang ability and even if it damages him, he can regenerate with rct
Now about makima sending CSM to space. The Problem with using this against gojo is that CSM was tooken massively in the air by reze and then stabbed by the spear devil which launched him even further in the air before makima even uses her bang ability on CSM. This shows that makima can not just bang her opponets to space, because she also needs the use of reze and spear devil in order to do it. Makima needs to get gojo at a certain angle to send him to soace via bang, but she likely would not be able to because of his durability and because of the fact that gojo can use infinity to either bring himself back down or he can use infinity to prevent reze and spear devil from ever touching him. Makima needs to get her opponents at a certain position, while having reze lift them up into sky and having spear devil lift them up even higher, but gojo could easily speed biltz them or teleport away based on gojo having way better speed feats then makima, and if gojo uses his domain makima will be unable to move or use any of her abilities because of the information overiding her body.
And I doubt she is as quick thinking as sukuna to come up with a plan to escape gojos domain. Sukuna has better knowledge about gojos domain and his abilities, so he was able to counter it, makima likely woulf likrly be overwhelmed and confused the moment gojo uses his domain on her.
Using the logic I used above, makima's death stare likely woukd not affect gojo, because we see this ability only ever kill extremely weak humans. You never see her use this ability against the hybrids or power, which indicates that just like bang, this ability has less of a effect on beings who have more durability then the avergae human. Plus gojo could just use rct to heal any damage that is done to him. We also see that this is not a passive ability so if gojo uses unlimited void on her,
She may not be able to even use her stare ability on him, because of the information clouding her thoughts. To add on to this makima will need to lock eyes on gojo. Gojo constantly has shown way better reaction speeds then makima, who for the most part is unable to react to a bullet. So makima will likely be unable to track gojo long enough for her ability to work, plus it likely would not kill him anyways.
Finally, the problem with the shrine argument, is that makima needs a massive amount of prep time to use it. We also see that this ability only works in normal humans without supernatural abilities, she never uses this ability on hybrids or any devils * just normal humans .* gojo is not just a nornal human, he has way more durability then a normal human, gojo is a sorcerer who has the 6 eyes technique and he should be able to tank this ability as well because gojo scales far above any of the people makima kills with this ability. We also even see someone like geto tank something arguably more lethal then this. When togi says fall to geto, we see a huge massive crater left in the ground, while geto is smashed and crushed against the ground just like how makima crushes her victims with her shrine ability, but geto someone who is far weaker then gojo at this point, not only tanks this attack but also is able to get back up and continue his fight with yuta. This attack left a massive cratwr on the ground, while makima's attack did not. Also makima's shrine attack only lasts for a short amount of time, and the moment the effects go off, gojo will simply continue moving just like geto.
Conclusion:
Makima's shrine attack and all of her other hax abilities has never killed someone who has a higher durability then gojo, so gojo should just be able to tank the attack. To add on to this makima will not able to attack gojo within his own domain.
***
Makima is never shown using the mold devil, she is never shown using the curse devil and most of her more dangerous abilites require the use of a devil hunter. Like how she needed aki to use the future devil and akane to use the snake devil, if gojo destroys their bodies, makima should no longer have those abilities at her disposal.
****
Also when makima was using the shrine why didn't she use it on any of the hybrids or even akane herself? I simply believe gojo would just tank the ability, just like how geto tanked being slammed to the ground and crushed by togi's abilities. Sure the shrine may temporarily stop gojo from moving, but he would likely just get back up and continue moving the moment the shrine's effects wear off.
@@coma2726 also makima only killed the gun devil because she was controlling the body of devil hunters who were contracted to powerful devils. Without those devil hunters she controlled, makima realistically scales nowhere near the gun devil.
Plus even if makima pulled the same trick on gojo, Gojo could simply teleport away or his infinity would block any of the attacks that makima used against the gun devil.
1.Gojo's infinity blocks anything that has speed, shape, form, or cursed energy.
2. The devils makima uses and their attacks for the most part have speed (because we see it take time for the devils to kill the gun devil) and we know these devils have a physial form (because we see kobeni capable of interacting with and seeing the snake devil, so this should also apply to the punishment devil as well, due to us being able to see its form.)
3. Gojo would either tank makima's attacks or simply block the attack of anyone she controls via infinity.
Strength feats here don't matter, if they did, makima would just use her other hax which are far more effective, also you are talking about a pochita that never tried bar maybe his flinging himself back to earth or when he defended kobeni
"In all of heaven and earth only I am the honored one. In all of heaven and earth, only I am strong"
THE STREETS NEEDED THIS!!! THANK YOU!!!!😭😭🔥🔥🔥
(Part1) So now I will be going over makima's and gojo's win conditions against each other and I will br explaining which one works and which one does not.
1. Makima has never shown any use of cosmos's abilities in any way and cosmos has never been shown using her ability on her. Even though cosmos does say halloween before makima kills her, we say cosoms constally say halloween to other people and they dont affected by her ability, or they are still capable of some level of speaking normally, this could just be cosmo saying halloween as a form of communication instead of actually using her abilities. We also know that cosmos needs time to charge up her attack in order for her to completly mentally destroy santa claus. Personally I believe that her abilities have less affect on supernatural enitities like devils, fiends, or hybrids because her halloween ability is never shown working on a devil, fiend or hybrid, only in normal humans. I believe gojo could resists the passive effects of her ability because of him being a six eye user and jujustu sorcer who are slightly different from humans due to the way they channel curse energy and the huge power difference between humans and sorcerers. And to add on to this makima has never used cosmos abilities and we have never seen her controlling cosmos in any way, we only see makima kill her and thats it. So makima will not be able to resist unlimited void and she will be affected by it.
2. Now even though I believe unlimited void works on makima, I dont think that will completely mentally break her, since it's only implied that gojo would mentally break humans but we never see any permant mental dmg to cursed spirits. I believe gojo's unlimited void works as a form of paralysis that stops his target from moving inside his domain. We know jogo was completely unable to move because of unlimited void but we never had the chance to see its effects to the fullest because gojo touched and tore off jogo's head while he was still conchess and he deactivated his domain, so as a result jogo was fine. Sukuna was also able to react and trade places with mahoraga while being affected by infinity, but in this case, we never got to see gojo mentally break any curses he went against because his opponets would react to his domain like sukuna before the affects kicked in or gojo would be over confindent against jogo allowing him to recover due to gojo touching jogo and him decativating his domain before any serious effects came in from unlimited void happened. Keep in mind that gojo wasn't completely trying to kill jogo, because he was trying to gather info from him about the other curses like him, and how jogo got so strong. You can't really gather information from a charcter who is mentally broken and unable to speak. Also sukuna was able to switch places with mahoraga before any serious effects of unlimited void kicked in.
I believe that makima could be mentally okay within Gojo's domain for a little while, but she will be unable to move, howver if gojo doesnt deactivate his domain or touch makima, I believe makima will end up like santa claus and becomse mentally broken, I just believe that gojos unlimted void takes time to kick in, but luckily for him he could just keep spamming unlimited against makima since makina doesn't have a domain or ability that would be fast enough to counter gojos domain unlike sukuna who has ten shadows and he has a domain of his own. I dont think makima would be able to escape or do anything withing gojos domain becasue makima needs a person to sacfrice in order to send gojo or herself to CSM hell. And makima's teteportation techniques have a long wind up and doesn't seem to be as fast as sukuna's. Also sukuna has lots of knowledge about gojos domain plus his other abilities and he has extremely good reaction speed and battle IQ, makima has never shown the same level of reaction speed as sukuna and she isn't that smart in terms of combat compared to gojo and sukuna who are extremely quick thinking in combat and are capable of coming up with multuple stratigies against their oponents on the spot. Makima doesnt really compare to them, since she similar to kenjacku needs prep time against her enemies and she relies on other people to fight for her. She was easily outsmarted by denji and pretty easily caught off guard agaisnt power.
Overall, I believe gojo could simply spam unlimited void on makima, and she would simply not be able to escape or react quick enough to avoid the more damaging effects that unlimited void would have on her over time. Plus gojos domain activated in just 0.2 so makima would likely not be able to react to that because she couldn't react to a bullet and she doesn't have any good speed feats that suggest she could move fast enough to escape. Makima is shown constantly getting caught off guard by bullets and being unable to dodge them. If Makima doesn't know about gojos abilities she likely would not react and would be in a state of confusion on what was going on, just like ehen she fought power who caught her of guard. Even if makima has the future devil, She still wouod not able to comprehend or be fast to enough to react to gojos domain due to just how fast it activates. Aki could only see a few seconds into the future, and was unable to dodge rezes bombs due to their aoe and aki was unable to react or comprehend being sent to hell by santa claus, I believe makima would be in a similar boat, she would not be fast enough to react to gojos domain due to its aoe and quick startup. She also would be surprised and would not comprehend what was happening within the furure, due to her never facing a ability like gojos domain before, and before she can react or do anything gojo would have caught her within his domain, plus if someone trys to break his domain he can harden it or continue to spam it.
This is why I think gojo could beat makima via unlimited void.
1. Santa Claus is a devil and Cosmo ability worked on her.
Cosmo ability won't work on beings like Makima, DD & Falling Devil, due to them already have all those info in their brain and they also remember erased concepts that Pochita ate.
2. I think these guys forgot about Makima saying that any damage that she have, will just transfer to a random Japanese person as an illness or an accident.
So Gojo DE is useless against Makima.
Yep, this guy speed read CSM MANGA.
Makima doesn't need to make a contract with Hell Devil, to send someone into hell dimension.
In the manga, Makima control Prinz and told Prinz to send her to Hell to face Darkness Devil.
So, Makima can teleport ppl or herself to hell by using Prinz.
Why are ppl still using the anti feat of Makima not dodging gun bullets in the train? 😂
This scene is a cliffhanger in the manga and make the readers wonder if Makima is truly dead.
Because At that time, no one knew about Makima contract with the Japanese federation, which gives her extra immortality.
After that, Makima speed blitz Quanxi, who can move at Mach 200.
Which is slower than 0.2 second, Gojo DE.
Makima reacted to Mach 1458 GD bullet, which is slower than 0.2 second, Gojo DE.
If you read Chainsaw man manga, u would know that Aki can only see in the future for 5 seconds, due to FD made a contract with him and made Aki see only 5 seconds in the future.
So Aki can react to Reze punches and Reze can blitz him while he can see 5 seconds in the future.
Means that Reze is faster than Aki and both of them are still faster than Gojo.
When you try and calc Aki seeing the future for 5 seconds and can react to Reze speed, who is easily High Hypersonic+ to MHS.
MOVING ON...
Future Devil was able to see many months in the future, when he saw Aki death.
Makima took fully control of FD powers, so she easily can see that many far in the future.
@@chiaki.hayakawa18 It is never confirmed or stated that primal devils or makima have all the knowledge of the universe in their brains. It is only stated that santa claus was given knowledge abour darkness fron the darkness devil nothing else, what you saying is pure head canon. Even cosmos states that the knowledge santa claus has on darkness does not even fill one page of her libary. Saying makima has this much knowledge or any other primal devil is quite literally pure head canon or just straight up wanking. 😄
Makima is also unable to dodge the gun devil's bullet, and she is unable to dodge getting shot by the anti - makima squad, there are plenty of other feats showing that makima is unable to dodge bullets. Most of this info your getting is purely speculative or is never stated once within the actual series. 😇
When people do vs battles they usually rely on Feats, statements, and they don't just downplay the character they have a personal bias against. 🫡
🤗 But hey, if you want to convince gojo, or just jjk fans in general that makima is stronger, don't just downplay one character for sake of your argument. That's clearly bias!
@@chiaki.hayakawa18😇 also makima has never once been shown to resist a mental attack, so again your just taking statements out of proportion
@@chiaki.hayakawa18 🧐 Also just because it was a cliffhanger, still doesn't change the fact that makima did not react or dodge the bullet
The statement it was just a cliffhanger does not in any way change makima's feats. This is purely your own interpretation on the author's work and it is not a stated by a character within the series so it is a anti - feat.😊
@@chiaki.hayakawa18 🤔 Again you are using pure head canon when talking about prinz teleportating any one else other then makima to hell. Prinz has never once teleported any one other than makima to hell, so gojo will not be affected by this, since we never see prinz teleport any one else other then Makima to hell. 🤔Also why didn't makima use prinz again to teleport everyone out of hell?
Again your only speculating what makima can do, but not giving actual feats or statements thay justify your claims. Also calcs wilp not counted since most calcs can be wanked to the extreme due to certian mangas not keeping consistinency with their battles or power scaling.
[So to summarise] PRINZ CAN ONLY TELEPORT MAKIMA TO HELL 🥰 makima has never teloported anyone other then herself to hell without the use of a contract. Also makima using prinz to teleport to hell is a one time thing, since prinz shortly dies afterwards and makima never uses that ability again as far as we know.
Makima is very dangerous, if Gojo does not understand her power he can lose, depending on the scenario.
Well Gojo can see his opponents abilities with six eyes
@@TheBlunder-00.0makima doesnt have curses energy,There is no energy to be read CSM because that's not how the contract system works
@@luksalter8200 alright buddo. There is is factor called “= power systems” that we have to take into account. If you want it to be that way, that means, just like Denji eating Makima, cursed energy wouldn’t count as an attack and wouldn’t trigger her contract. So she was die in one single attack.
@@TheBlunder-00.0see this guy gets it why can't others get the same thing.
@@TheBlunder-00.0 Verse equalization only applies if a person beats the other over a technicality (for example Logias beating Goku because he does not have Haki), so it does not apply in this one. Makima would simply be as Toji in this regard, so immune to sensing and DE.
1. Dont u have to hit kill her for her contract with the president to go down and it goes down by 1/like millions.
2. Bro mentions makima has an ability that doesnt travel distance(the ability where the points at the devil and it started bleeding out) and completely didnt talk about it in the battle. Infinity is an ability that creates infinite distance between urself and the attacker. So an ability that doesn’t travel bypass infinity.
So makima wins
Correct, but he ignores that and also her contract and says some stupid shit “the Japans aren’t the same cause I say so🤓”
Except that ability is only a City-block level attack.
With Gojo's Mountain+ durability, be doesn't even need to turn on infinity. This attack would be a slight breeze to him.
@@CommentPositionInformer
Gojo is *Large Town lvl* AP/Durability. lol
Makima AP scales to Planetary lvl, due to her scaling to Falling Devil and the other primal devils.
Anyways, Makima negs with her control abilities, as soon as the fight starts.
@@CommentPositionInformer
Also, that Makima's will bypass infinity and hurt Gojo from the inside.
It's like a dura neg attack.
@@chiaki.hayakawa18 Suuure buddy.
First: Makima is the Control Devil, she isn't a primal, and doesn't scale to one. Her strongest attack sent Chainsaw Devil to space, which is a Multi-City Block feat.
Second: The first shown primal, a.k.a Darkness Devil, no-diffed her, and she would've been destroyed has she remained in hell for even a bit longer.
Third: Primals Devils aren't Planetary. Falling Devil's biggest feat is "causing Landslides all over the world". Landslides *aren't* earthquakes, so this vague feat is Country level at best, Town level most likely. And even if they were Earthquakes, it still would be only a Multi-Continental feat, nowhere near Planetary.
Fourth: Makima's Control is trash. She couldn't control Power, couldn't control Chainsaw Man during the final battle, couldn't control the Chainsaw Devil in his full form, couldn't control the Angel Devil, couldn't even control *human* Denji as he was chopping her up for dinner.
Let alone Gojo, who is much stronger than the Chainsaw Devil, as well as everyone else Makima has failed to control together.
Fifth: You're thinking of Teen Gojo. Teen Gojo was Town via damaging Toji. Current Gojo is overwhelmingly more powerful than that, and has been confirmed superior to several Montain level opponents, such as Kenjaku in Geto's body, Yuta and Jogo with Coffin of the Iron Mountain.
Sixth: Combine Gojo's superior durability with his regeneration, and his two abilities that can either one-shot or paralyze Makima, then her internal damage attack won't do much.
Saying that "they are 2 different Japans" is major copium. You are biased.
Nah I thought that was dumb atupid
I love when people say Mach 3 is max speed in JJk when we have people like Gojo and Sukuna running around
I know right, despite that statement from Gege is true then. Hollow purple is stated as an imaginary mass and in real life imaginary mass, can move faster than the speed of light also has property of a black hole. Yet people are still debunking about that statement, then why did mfs even agree on Mach 3 just because gege said so, while imaginary mass is stated by Gege himself but still disregarded as false
@@thiccboi3812Imaginary mass doesnt exist, nothing can travel at superluminal speed. But fiction has its own set of physics and rules so thats cool. Atleast the author knows some cool stuff
@@thiccboi3812funny thing is jjk fans only have HP to brag anout while Makima has a lot of arsenals and superior haxes that jjk fans refused to acknowledge due to the fact that Gojo got nothing to counter it, he weak compared to Makima veryyy weak.
@@nursenurse7454It’s hilarious too; you’ll hear every gojo stan spread dumb headcanons like hp being matter erasure; its like they don’t even read their own series
Makima:- I can manipulate people
Gojo:- I can manipulate the spacetime continuum
Love all the research that was taken into account. Ultimately a fight between these two characters would come down to whether or not Makima would be able to view Satoru as “lower than her.” If she can, then she automatically wins. But if she can’t, Satoru automatically wins. Between Six Eyes and Limitless this would make him invincible (via Infinity) and would allow him to one-shot Makima (via Hollow Purple), all while expending virtually no cursed energy whatsoever. Even if Makima could find a way to effectively damage Satoru physically, Satoru can used his reversed-curse energy technique to heal himself. If it comes down to it, Satoru could even use Domain Expansion: Unlimited Void to make the fight even easier. This would allow Satoru to effectively cancel out all of Makima’s “helpers,” and give Hollow Purple a 100% chance of hitting Makima whilst she’s within the Unlimited Void Domain. But none of Satoru’s abilities matter at all if Makima can directly control him. What especially doesn’t help Satoru is his lack of mind-control immunity/resistance. So honestly, unless we could officially confirm whether or not Makima would be able to control Satoru, I’d have to call this fight a tie between them.
Aight I don't know much about either series so what would prevent her from saying "yeah I'm better than this dude"
@@Flyingboy25 Gojo has to also see himself as weaker to her. Gojo’s entire character is having a huge ego, so it’s unlikely.
@@toxicfox1729 oooohh ok that makes a lot more sense
@@Flyingboy25I'm assuming it's a flight or fight response.
@@Flyingboy25"Nah, I'd Win" 🔴 + 🔵 = 🟣
Makima: 💀
This is honestly an amazing analysis on the two's abilities considering people "she thinks she's inferior to" is an interesting statement but somewhat vague.
She cocky but not stupid shed think he’s on her level.
@@andrewbell6561 She wouldn’t she would sense him as a human( his scent) and take control over him.
The strongest in Jjk both sukuna and gojo have this immense presence that others can sense so I don’t think she’s gonna just feel that and think he’s a normal human
He is literally an anomaly that changed the world completely just by his presence alone so yeah, no.
@@andrewbell6561 in chapter 233 the whole cast got tense feeling gojo’s presence before he went to fight sukuna and in chapter 224 sukuna was able to feel gojo’s immense presence across an entire city so I don’t think makima is gonna sit there and ignore that
saw u in seths stream this morning. w video
W
Well the death battle kinda took care of that.
You know, Makima can summon other devils, right? We've seen her do it and its kind of a big deal. Every devil/contract holder she came across (dead or alive because we've seen her abuse the power and contracts of corpses) she has in her inventory. She could just summon the (corpse) of the Cosmos fiend, trick Gojo into saying Halloween, and instantly make him mentally challenged.
Devil powers themselves aren't rooted in physics, they encroach logic itself. She obviously has many devils under her control (which she can summon) that can disable various aspects of Gojo's mind.
And you think gojo will let that happen?
Opponent: Hey, say this sudden, strange word which has no correlation or meaning in context of this fight which totally isn't an obvious trap.
Gojo: Okay!!
that doesnt make sense does it?
@@domicson4587Key word “Trick”
@@Kaifunsiuunlimited void instantly beats all the other devils, which Gojo has historically considered when faced with multiple Special Grades. Really, Makima’s only win con is if she can mind control Gojo.
@@francisjomergallardo4593 ??? What are you waffling currently
Here’s me scaling her well over island level.
As a presumption, I’m saying it’s bullets weigh tens of kilos due to them being truly massive for a bullet.
The gun showed to be able to hit Makima in 0.3333 seconds from 500 km away, and we know this time as a result of their being an actual timer on the panels during it havoc with one second only passing after three panels, meaning each panel has an average time of 0.3333 secs with the gun beginning fire on the second.
Calculating the speed 500,000 m ÷ 0.3333 = 1,500,000 m/s (Mach 4,373 MHS+) now using the formula for kinetic energy K.E. = 1/2 m v ² we can get its energy and thereby its tier.
10 × 1,500,000 ² = 22,500,000,000,000 joules (town level)
The gun devil's dura scales to this because of Newton’s third law, “Every action has an equal on opposite reaction.”
This is only for one bullet and because we can see on panel the gun’s bullets being very close to each other, that means that its firing rate must be comparable to the bullet's velocity and the number of bullets fired as a result.
So Times the energy we got for one bullet by the number of bullets fired per second for a total energy the gun devil must withstand every second.
22,500,000,000,000 × 1,500,000 = 3.375e19 joules (island level)
Angel’s weapons crippled the gun devil in seconds, so they scale well above this.
For speed, she perception blitzed Quanxi who’s calced around high hypersonic to Mach 200 by manifestedfavour putting her combat speed around the MHS to MHS+ ranges.
Her bang has also been calced at MHS+ which you can find just by typing “Makima Bang calc” But I’ll copy and paste it here regardless.
The feat
Basically, Makima with a couple of Bangs, sent Denji into space.
Calculation
• Red Line: 94px = around 200km the distance between Toyama and Shizouka.
• Blue Line: 1153px
• Distance: (200)*(1153)/((94)*2tan(70/2deg))
Distance: 1752 km
denji is first sent out of the building, so the other 3 Bangs sent him in space, I will assume each bang being equally strong, so the distance the last bang need to travel at least would be 2/3 of the total one.
• Distance travelled by last Bang: 1752 km*2/3 = 1116 km
• Timeframe: 2s, 3s, 5s (it happens really fast in one panel, note this is only for the last bang)
Makima "Bang" speed
High-End: 1116000m/2s = 1116000m/s mach 1860 (MHS+)
Mid-End: 1116000m/3s = 558000m/s mach 1240 (MHS+)
Low-End:1116000m/5s = 223200m/s mach 744 (MHS)
Addressing Maki’s bullet feat, it was literally stated that Mai uses rubber bullets that have a muzzle velocity of 60 m/s rather than supersonic 330+ m/s for most bullets. In addition, the feat itself is hard to calc the exact distance she actually moved along with the bullet also changing dimensions in the next panel, making it an unreliable feat.
Hakari’s “Lightning dodge” calc for one has the HUGE problem of acting like the electricity (which is only being used to calc the timeframe) only moved the small distance to his face when it blatantly travels all the way to his arm, which significantly increases the timeframe and thereby slowing the speed. Here’s the part I’m referring to: blue (Hakari's head)= 187.59px (16.6cm)
red (distance)= 57px
(57/189.59)*100= 30.0648768395
30.0648768395% of 16.6= 4.99076955536cm
There isn’t actually anything to suggest it had the same speed as cloud to ground lightning besides it being called lightning, which, by definition, without a cloud it blatantly isn’t and all the properties you mentioned that supports it being lightning and thereby having the same speed are also properties of electricity. Static electricity is a thing, Y’know?
And people dismiss the Naoya feat because of “travel speed” but if it was just her travel speed that didn’t scale to Naoya then why couldn’t she have dodged it with her combat speed like she does midair later in the fight? (It’s almost like she just didn’t scale to his full speed at all.)
Now ways, Makima can bypass his infinity.
She has shown to be able to control the people she’s killed or have been killed along with their powers, like The hybrids Aki and many others. She has shown to have control over power’s corpse granting her blood manip which she can amp either by feeding power blood or the flesh of a strong devil (like Makima herself) Which would allow her to attack Gojo directly along with nullify his RCT regeneration just like how Denji nullified hers.
Furthermore, she also has general body manip and similar powers without that anyway, like causing the darkness devil to violently haemorrhage blood, briefly stopping its godly regeneration.
Other things that can work:
She can create angel portals that could bypass the distance.
Attack while his CT is burnt out or out last him in a fight where he has to constantly heal his CT.
Blitz/stealth his detection (he talks about detecting things as if it’s a prerequisite for his automatic infinity) we’ve seen him struggle to track Toji and was unable to detect Hanami so this is possible.
Etc.
Concerning unlimited void, it wouldn’t actually affect her because Gojo admits that it harms people like when he said “You’re inside the limitless. Perception. Communication. The actions you take in life forced upon you infinitely. Ironic, isn’t it? Given everything, but unable to do anything. Dying slowly.“ so since Gojo acknowledges he sure-hit as a form of
Attack which would be transferred by Makima’s contract, meaning she herself would be fine.
And potentially, she can escape the domain via one of her slaves attacking the outside or by teleporting. She could also just not be in range in the first place and snipe him at the beginning of the fight or blitz with her amped punishment devil that even caught the GUN DEVIL who at full power has relativistic Hawaii scaling and other feats putting it comfortably at MHS to well in MHS+
TL;DR she has ways to bypass his infinity along with RCT and ways to survive some of his attacks, plus just scales higher. She negs
(Btw, don’t ask me to debate on discord. I don’t have it or intend to use it for the foreseeable future.)
Dude you're always in this debate videos defending makima.
@@aaronbrown125 It’s a goal of mine to appear in as many as possible.
@@aaronbrown125 Because makima is underrated in power scaling.
Imma add insult to injury to help further implicate that Makima truly has win cons here.
Edit: I’ve written this comment six times already and I don’t feel like rewriting it.
Since the creator of the video goes over Gojo’s abilties and why he would win this, I’m going to go over why I believe he is wrong and properly challenge his statement based off of Makima’s abilities alone.
(Also calcs don’t scale higher than statements from the author directly, calc scaling is kind of bias in terms of interpretation on said statements and the information that is presented, therefore I will only state her abilities and provide a conditional hypothetical on how I believe they would effect Gojo if both universes were to meet)
Statement(s):
Remember she can still come back due to her contract with the prime minister of Japan the only way to fully kill her is to be eaten by another devil so that she may be reincarnated so hollow purple wouldn’t even work.
Secondly whenever she does die she retains to information and skill set of the killer and she’s able to utilize that memory in order to find a loophole in her opponents skill set, the ONLY reason she lost to Denji was quite literally because she wanted to in a sense.
She’s already died twenty-six times in her own verse. She can alter the memories and perception of those she comes into contact with, unless the six eyes and or limitless gives Gojo memetic resistance and compulsion resistance then he will simply become a slave to Makima without even realizing it.
Let’s say that he can resist her, the huge issue isn’t that he can’t be touched but how many times can he kill her before she finds a way to absolutely destroy him.
Her ability to sacrifice and instant-kill someone else is definitely a win-con because it has no suggestions to have any restrictions towards distance, time and or the laws of relativity, we know this because Makima used these abilities on Denji a being who scales higher than a being that was darkness incarnate and quite literally existed on a plane higher than any mortal comprehension, and a higher plane of existence entirely, there are multiple statements from the manga to support this as well.
She just has too many win cons going into this and so many hax abilities similar to Gojo but unlike Gojo, Makima can afford to make multiple mistakes and actually grow from making them, where as to Gojo he can grow in battle and adapt to his opponent but it still strains him to do so and if pressured enough he’ll become a sort of glass cannon.
In the current manga [SPOILER ALERT]
When Gojo battled against Sakuna we’ve seen when he battles a being similar enough in power or just that much more superior he struggles to keep up with them and is put against the ropes, I mean in the manga now he’s utilizing every avenue he has, but only because Sakuna isn’t going all out yet and because Sakuna is choosing to embarrass Gojo during their battle.
I’ll list off some of her more unknown abilties:
Teleportation (She can teleport the people she has control over via her chain links)
Memory Resistance (She could literally remember people erased from history)
Dimensional Travel (She can utilize the spider devil to transport her to hell)
Pain Manipulation (She doesn’t respond to her limbs being blown off or lethal harm being inflicted upon her)
Organic Manipulation (Without touching her opponent she’d be able to utilize the Mold Devil which would in turn cause literal decay and mold to began spreading throughout Gojo’s body)
It hasn’t been shown but she most likely can utilize the ghost devil’s intangibility or Incorporeality (This would make it so that Gojo can’t hurt or touch Makima to begin with at least by conventional means)
She can utilize the stone devils Pretrification (Gojo goes to grab or punch Makima and the stone devil would be utilized and summoned, thus turning Gojo to stone)
Information Manipulation and Madness Manipulation (The cosmos devil can literally instill the total understanding of the universe into an opponent, driving them completely insane)
Makima having control over such a devil would make her resistance by such means of attack near impenetrable unless you believe Gojo’s domain expansion has some higher grade of universal understanding which is highly doubtful and unlikely, seeing as how the cosmos devil is literally as old as the cosmos itself and therefore has literally been there since the beginning..this means Gojo’s domain expansion simply wouldn’t work.
Now lastly…TIME MANIPULATION (The Eternity Devil can cut the flow of time or even manipulate it in such ways on a scale to where to the outside world time isn’t truly effected, this level of time manipulation could quite literally destroy Gojo’s limitless abilities and therefore make it so that Makima can box with him)
Now I’ve said all of this to say this..Makima if in a fight with Gojo and having all of this knowledge would view him as completely inferior to herself as it is in character for her to do so, therefore if she simply perceived him as lower status than herself then she could quite literally control him or at the very least manipulate him.
With everything I’ve covered, it’s not to shit on Gojo. I’m sure everyone knows about Satarou Gojo’s abilities by this point, it’s only to educate others that Makima is not a slouch and has multiple hax abilities and summonings which she could utilize in knowledge and physical prowess to not only gain the edge in battle against our beloved sorcerer..but destroy him entirely.
@@loneli_ shit bro writing novels 😂
The amount of misformation is wild broo.. if gojo isnt a japanese citizen then gojos domain expansion DONT EVEN WORK. Makima has no cursed energy thus making his domain expansion nulled due to heavenly restriction
I just started watching your channel some hours ago and this is the first video I agree on
idk how Gojo could deal with mind control so idk how this would go. but if Gojo manages to hit hollow purple Makima is pretty much gone (And i think the only way Gojo can kill Makima is using hollow purple).
Remember she can still come back due to her contract with the prime minister of Japan the only way to fully kill her is to be eaten by another devil so that she may be reincarnated so hollow purple wouldn’t even work, and whenever she does die she retains to information and skill set of the killer and she’s able to utilize that memory in order to find a loophole in her opponents skill set, the ONLY reason she lost to Denji was quite literally because she wanted to in a sense.
She’s already died twenty-six times in her own verse. She can alter the memories and perception of those she comes into contact with, unless the six eyes and or limitless gives Gojo memetic resistance and compulsion resistance then he will simply become a slave to Makima without even realizing it.
Let’s say that he can resist her, the huge issue isn’t that he can’t be touched but how many times can he kill her before she finds a way to absolutely destroy him.
Her ability to sacrifice someone else is definitely a win con because it has no suggestions to have such restrictions towards distance, time and or law of resistance, we know this because Makima used this ability or a variation of it on a being who defeated a being that was darkness incarnate and quite literally existed on a plane higher than any mortal comprehension, there are multiple statements from the manga to support this as well.
She just has too many win cons going into this and so many hax abilities similar to Gojo but unlike Gojo, Makima can afford to make mistakes and actually grow from making them.
In the current manga [SPOILER ALERT]
When Gojo battled against Sakuna we’ve seen when he battles a being similar enough in power or just that much more superior he struggles to keep up with them and is put against the ropes, I mean in the manga now he’s utilizing every avenue he has, but only because Sakuna isn’t going all out yet and because Sakuna is choosing to embarrass Gojo during their battle.
I’ll list off some of her more unknown abilties:
Teleportation (She can teleport the people she has control over via her chain links)
Memory Resistance (She could literally remember people erased from history)
Dimensional Travel (She can utilize the spider devil to transport her to hell)
Pain Manipulation (She doesn’t respond to her limbs being blown off or lethal harm being inflicted upon her)
Organic Manipulation (Without touching her opponent she’d be able to utilize the Mold Devil which would in turn cause literal decay and mold to began spreading throughout Gojo’s body)
It hasn’t been shown but she most likely can utilize the ghost devil’s intangibility or Incorporeality (This would make it so that Gojo can’t hurt or touch Makima to begin with at least by conventional means)
She can utilize the stone devils Pretrification (Gojo goes to grab or punch Makima and the stone devil would be utilized and summoned, thus turning Gojo to stone)
Information Manipulation and Madness Manipulation (The cosmos devil can literally instill the total understanding of the universe into an opponent, driving them completely insane)
Makima having control over such a devil would make her resistance by such means of attack near impenetrable unless you believe Gojo’s domain expansion has some higher grade of universal understanding which is highly doubtful and unlikely, seeing as how the cosmos devil is literally as old as the cosmos itself and therefore has literally been there since the beginning..this means Gojo’s domain expansion simply wouldn’t work.
Now lastly…TIME MANIPULATION (The Eternity Devil can cut the flow of time or even manipulate it in such ways on a scale to where to the outside world time isn’t truly effected, this level of time manipulation could quite literally destroy Gojo’s limitless abilities and therefore make it so that Makima can box with him)
Now I’ve said all of this to say this..Makima if in a fight with Gojo and having all of this knowledge would view him as completely inferior to herself as it is in character for her to do so, therefore if she simply perceived him as lower status than herself then she could quite literally control him or at the very least manipulate him.
With everything I’ve covered, it’s not to shit on Gojo. I’m sure everyone knows about Satarou Gojo’s abilities by this point, it’s only to educate others that Makima is not a slouch and has multiple hax abilities and summonings which she could utilize in knowledge and physical prowess to not only gain the edge in battle against our beloved sorcerer..but destroy him entirely.
@@loneli_ Denji killed her, everything denji eats is erased from existence, so makima ´´died``. so yea im pretty sure hollow purple can ´´kill`` she is just coming back as nayuta but Makima dies. and Again i have no idea how Gojo deals with mind control and related abilities. if he cant deal with them then Makima wins, if he can and use hollow purple he could win.
@@loneli_ this is a 1v1 battle, makima wont have support. i dont remember if makima had control over the cosmic devil tho.
@@onyx6774She wouldn’t have support but can still use all the people and entities she has under her control because it’s how she fights. Not giving her all her slaves is nerfing her.
@@Mikah-i5q eh i guess
A. Makima WOULD find Gojo immediately inferior to her. She views all humans as immediately inferior to her. This is shown all the time. Controlling people is often her go to move. She usually doesn't engage people in hand to hand lol. This is definitely the most consistent view. Burden is on you to prove she would immediately see Gojo as her equal/better?
B. .2 seconds is a stated non fatal amount to normal humans. So let's see what what it would take if .2 was fatal for maximum charitiablity, we can calculate123,000,000 as the popular of japan, multiplied by .2 for the number of seconds.
123,000,000 * .2 = 24600000
To hours that's 6833.3333333333 AKA 284 days. Prove that Gojo can maintain his domain for 284 days straight.
C. Ritual wouldn't work because it's a 1 on 1 match? So you put the battle in a universe with no people and broke all of makima's existing contracts? If you don't she could obvisously just make a new contract with any random person to do it, especially considering she can teleport. If you did, that's just weird.
I think she would definitely see gojo a threat and not inferior to her simply because of his presence. In the manga there were multiple times that humans felt an immense presence emanating from gojo. For your second point, I’m honestly thinking that gojo could probably just destroy Japan as a whole with his cursed ability. This would kill all of japans citizens, and I’m pretty sure he would do something like this as he is an arrogant person with apathetic feelings to weak people. On top of that, it’s not his japan, so why would he care. At this point in my theory she won’t have any more lives so then he uses his domain expansion and rips her head off like jogo. And as for her ritual, where she uses humans as sacrifice to kill her targets only being able to be used with the targets first and last name. I don’t think that’s ever gonna happen cause if gojo is in her earth, there would be no way for her to know his first and last name unless he tells her which is something he will not do
@@jager8168Gojo combining six eyes to see her contract could just kill the prime minister
@@jager8168from what I can understand, they feel gojo’s presence because every human is born with an usually small amount of cursed energy (with obvious exceptions), so they feel Gojos pressure. Makima is neither human nor a cursed energy haver
@@Korrupted_dust those exceptions feel the presence as well
@@jager8168 Just got rerecommended this video. What example are you referring to where a human with no cursed energy sense "immense presence emanating from gojo." Give me a chapter and I'll explain why you're confused. Also I can offer the counter example of just chapter 1 of JJK, where Yuji a human with no experience with cursed energy questions whether Gojo can handle 1 finger sukuna, giving no indication that gojo is anything special besides yuji just telling him.
Next why luffy vs Escanor is close.
Ngl want to see that one!
Luffy negs
@@LAVAhound-k8iwhat? Escanor neggd
🤔
@@jackaboynaylor9273 gives us your insight! Since you've been in the comments defending makima with great evidence and feats
The Makima disrespect is crazy, she could literally make contracts with all the world leaders and have billions of lives, the only reason she doesn't is because Japan's population is enough to reach her goal. She could literally take over the world if she wanted to but doesn't because her goal is to erase the devils. If the argument of "it's not the same Japan" is in effect than she just simply makes a contract with Gojo's prime minister. Another thing is that purple isn't imaginary mass its virtual mass so no it would not erase her and as for Gojo's domain it would either have no effect or effect some random person in Japan. She could also just say "bang" and kill him, infinity wouldn't work because there's nothing to stop or slow down (remember infinity is conceptual it either works or it doesn't). She could also squish Gojo or control him then kill him before his brain refresh's. And yes, Makima can control Gojo because she views all humans as lesser than herself, she's lived since the beginning of time, knows the secrets of the universe, and is immortal (having many lives and the ability to reincarnate), to her Gojo is just another human will die of old age and won't live to see the end of times and hasn't lived to experience its beginning.
@gravelordnito6763 Stop glazing and making false head canons about Gojo while downplaying Makima to the ground lol
@gravelordnito6763she can things like the mold devil bypass infinity as they don’t need to travel and simply appear on the target body
@Rad1234-t6n just because he's defending a female character it doesn't means he's a gooner, get a grip.
You forgot to mention the Spear of longinus that completely ignores space and would go through the limitless
lol you were right.
I don't think Makima can touch Gojo if his reverse curse nullifies any mind control. Also I'm not too sure about Gojo's domain expansion (didn't read manga), if it will affect Makima mentally as she didn't get affected by Cosmos halloween. Then again once Gojo figures out the regenerative contract with the citizens, I'm not sure he would be willing to massacre normal citizens. I think if Gojo vaporizes Makima with purple he may kill Makima, but she will be reincarnated as another control devil. I think only Pochita can truly defeat the devils themselves
But at the end of the day that new Control Devil wouldn’t be Makima, so it would still count as Gojo killing Makima and thus as far as VS Battles are concerned it would be a victory for Gojo.
What part of no matter what she will always come back are you not understanding???
Makima can’t land a hit on gojo and if he uses his domain she he wins or purple which literally erases things most people say she comes back from hell but it’s the control devil that comes back not makima meaning gojo wins the fight and also you can’t permanently kill a jujutsu sorcerer unless you finish them off with cursed energy or the will just come back as a vengeful spirit even stronger or heal
Makima doesn't get effected by gojo's domain since she doesn't have curse energy gojo could only win with purple
@@jhiancarlosclemente6168 when you do cross verse battles you have to have verse equalization, cause what happens if we put ichgio against someone? So Ichigo automatically wins cause the other person can’t see him? See how that makes no sense? Like why even have a cross verse battle if you aren’t gonna have verse equalization
I am sure there will be no bias here.
I feel like if Makima says gojo is inferior to her bro would just give 0 fucks and shit talk her like how he did to sukuna and kenjaku after his released from the prison realm.
If your gonna use “gojo isint from csm universe so he wouldn’t be affected by the contract” you could do the same for makima as she doesn’t have cursed energy so De can’t lock on to her. Also using the statistic that gojo could kill makima twice each second it would still take two years for every citizen in Japan to die while not accounting for its growing birth rate
Does not equate. Even if you wanted to rat on that and say DE won’t work on Makima, Gojo would still have more wincons.
Well gojo can destroy a whole country at a time
Gojo has been stated several times to be capable of killing the entire country of Japan by himself, alongside this imbuing things with cursed energy that previously had none has been shown countless times in the shoe
@@inclitus-sulaThat was never stated, at a time is bs, overtime might be but not in one attack, the statement of special grades being able to destroy a country is bs.
@@Kaifunsiu if he can destroy half of the Tokyo with one purple, then it is surely no bs
Hi can destroy a country in few minutes
Gojo just showed he’s better at hand to hand combat than even sukuna can spam domain expansions and heal from even sukuna’s malevolent shrine speed is the only thing makima contends him with but I don’t she her doing anything after being hit by domain expansion
Her contract will just transfer the harmful information.
@@jackaboynaylor9273ey, can you tell me what you think would happen if gojo simply used Unmesurable Void?
Wouldnt the exact same thing that happened in the Cosmo Devil vs Doll Devil fight? Except with every singular citizen in the CSM's japan instead of all dolls under the control of santa all over the world, and with Makima instead of Santa?
Gojo is the type of guy to just use his strongest move when his Six Eyes tell him the opponent is strong
Edit: btw english aint my first language, pardon me for any mistakes
The amount of misinformation on one video is wild
State all xd
@@xammerezekielmarco4406 Wont state all but the biggest misinformation is that Gojo’s hollow purple is an imaginary mass, which is a mistranslation for Virtual mass, the kanji for purple was utilized to describe virtual mass, which is a concept of quantum mechanics that describes an object like it has a certain mass and it behaves like it does but it actually has a complete different mass.
This debunking the argument of “tachyons travel at light speed and makima cant dodge🤓” and he said that Hollow purple deleted concept and is existence erasure(?????) which is never stated and not even hinted in the course of the series.
@@xammerezekielmarco4406 Besides, why did he only one side Gojo? Why didn’t he go deeper on Makima which has far more op hax, infinity is almost the same as the eternity devil.
Why doesn’t Cosmo utilize Halloween on Makima? Makima says that she is far superior to Cosmo and even its ability halloween which is the same as unlimited void “transfer infinite information to a brain making it useless” Makima can:
1. Throw it to a random japanese citizen which wouldn’t cause any loss to her
2. The infinity devil to absorb it
Gojo’s domain is almost the same as Halloween but Gojo’s domain is a one shot only, which would mean Gojo has to activate his domain 123,104,834 times, which we see he can’t because in the domain clash with Sukuna he struggled and had to blow his brains off to keep up with the domain clash and limitless which is an overdo on his CE which is not near enough unlimited to keep up with Makima’s constant reviving
@@Kaifunsiu oh thx I was thinking the same about the cosmos devil
@@Kaifunsiu Look at his avatar and then ask yourself if this channel had any intention to provide an unbiased representation of both characters.
The jujutsu kaisen speed scale is cap
Great video, you should do gojo vs makima tho :)
Its definitely not even close. Unlimited Void would do her in. Also she could try transferring it to someone else, but that wouldn't work, as its literally infinite.
Gojo himself is a citizen of Japan. Gojo can't bypass Makima's contract without loving her.
so are you saying that the pm whom she had a contract with is also the pm or jujutsu kaisen verse nice joke dude
@@Silver-Sparrow_XD I'm saying Gojo is a citizen of Japan.
@@Silver-Sparrow_XDWhy do people say that as if it’s a good thing of Gojo? If the battle takes place on JJKs earth and not a neutral one there’s no way for him effect her Japan. And we know the contract works from any distance because she used it in hell.
@@lightspaceman5064 I'm just saying gojo is not a Japanese citizen of chainsaw man world
Of a different universes Japan.
No. Y'all need to stop downplaying Makima. This is like the 3rd clip where regarding this topic where y'all say the same thing and no new context. If you read the latest chapters, Primordial Devils once they set foot on Earth they automatically set half of the planet in ruins, and she scales w/ them so that makes her multi-continental lvl.
It also won't matter much of what Gojo does since that worm that Denji & Asa were running from destroying Tokyo yet Nayuta w/ no combat experience and physically weaker was able to control its mind. Also MKM's contract, Domain Expansion wouldn't do nothing to CSM's JPN lives but give them sickness or injuries, not Deaths. She also got Future Devil contract to avoid getting caught in the Expansion if she wants.
Makima gauges out Gojo's Eyes w/ his own blood due to her Blood Devil contract and does the Bang to separate his head from his shoulders. Makima solos him & the JJK verse.
Edit: I’ve written this comment six times already and I don’t feel like rewriting it.
Since the creator of the video goes over Gojo’s abilties and why he would win this, I’m going to go over why I believe he is wrong and properly challenge his statement based off of Makima’s abilities alone.
(Also calcs don’t scale higher than statements from the author directly, calc scaling is kind of bias in terms of interpretation on said statements and the information that is presented, therefore I will only state her abilities and provide a conditional hypothetical on how I believe they would effect Gojo if both universes were to meet)
Statement(s):
Remember she can still come back due to her contract with the prime minister of Japan the only way to fully kill her is to be eaten by another devil so that she may be reincarnated so hollow purple wouldn’t even work.
Secondly whenever she does die she retains to information and skill set of the killer and she’s able to utilize that memory in order to find a loophole in her opponents skill set, the ONLY reason she lost to Denji was quite literally because she wanted to in a sense.
She’s already died twenty-six times in her own verse. She can alter the memories and perception of those she comes into contact with, unless the six eyes and or limitless gives Gojo memetic resistance and compulsion resistance then he will simply become a slave to Makima without even realizing it.
Let’s say that he can resist her, the huge issue isn’t that he can’t be touched but how many times can he kill her before she finds a way to absolutely destroy him.
Her ability to sacrifice and instant-kill someone else is definitely a win-con because it has no suggestions to have any restrictions towards distance, time and or the laws of relativity, we know this because Makima used these abilities on Denji a being who scales higher than a being that was darkness incarnate and quite literally existed on a plane higher than any mortal comprehension, and a higher plane of existence entirely, there are multiple statements from the manga to support this as well.
She just has too many win cons going into this and so many hax abilities similar to Gojo but unlike Gojo, Makima can afford to make multiple mistakes and actually grow from making them, where as to Gojo he can grow in battle and adapt to his opponent but it still strains him to do so and if pressured enough he’ll become a sort of glass cannon.
In the current manga [SPOILER ALERT]
When Gojo battled against Sakuna we’ve seen when he battles a being similar enough in power or just that much more superior he struggles to keep up with them and is put against the ropes, I mean in the manga now he’s utilizing every avenue he has, but only because Sakuna isn’t going all out yet and because Sakuna is choosing to embarrass Gojo during their battle.
I’ll list off some of her more unknown abilties:
Teleportation (She can teleport the people she has control over via her chain links)
Memory Resistance (She could literally remember people erased from history)
Dimensional Travel (She can utilize the spider devil to transport her to hell)
Pain Manipulation (She doesn’t respond to her limbs being blown off or lethal harm being inflicted upon her)
Organic Manipulation (Without touching her opponent she’d be able to utilize the Mold Devil which would in turn cause literal decay and mold to began spreading throughout Gojo’s body)
It hasn’t been shown but she most likely can utilize the ghost devil’s intangibility or Incorporeality (This would make it so that Gojo can’t hurt or touch Makima to begin with at least by conventional means)
She can utilize the stone devils Pretrification (Gojo goes to grab or punch Makima and the stone devil would be utilized and summoned, thus turning Gojo to stone)
Information Manipulation and Madness Manipulation (The cosmos devil can literally instill the total understanding of the universe into an opponent, driving them completely insane)
Makima having control over such a devil would make her resistance by such means of attack near impenetrable unless you believe Gojo’s domain expansion has some higher grade of universal understanding which is highly doubtful and unlikely, seeing as how the cosmos devil is literally as old as the cosmos itself and therefore has literally been there since the beginning..this means Gojo’s domain expansion simply wouldn’t work.
Now lastly…TIME MANIPULATION (The Eternity Devil can cut the flow of time or even manipulate it in such ways on a scale to where to the outside world time isn’t truly effected, this level of time manipulation could quite literally destroy Gojo’s limitless abilities and therefore make it so that Makima can box with him)
Now I’ve said all of this to say this..Makima if in a fight with Gojo and having all of this knowledge would view him as completely inferior to herself as it is in character for her to do so, therefore if she simply perceived him as lower status than herself then she could quite literally control him or at the very least manipulate him.
With everything I’ve covered, it’s not to shit on Gojo. I’m sure everyone knows about Satarou Gojo’s abilities by this point, it’s only to educate others that Makima is not a slouch and has multiple hax abilities and summonings which she could utilize in knowledge and physical prowess to not only gain the edge in battle against our beloved sorcerer..but destroy him entirely.
She lost to Denji due to a combination of The regen neg power’s chainsaw granted and the fact her contract only transfers attacks and because Denji didn’t view eating as an attack but as a form of love she didn’t revive.
Purple would also work assuming it erases matter (still haven’t been given the ch where it is stated to do that) because of the fact that she has to “transfer” the attack and if she’s erased there would be nothing to transfer.
I love you(no homo), and completely agree with every single word you just stated.
Gojo is mad overhyped because his arsenal only works against flying bricks. And not even good bricks at that.
And people like to sleep on makima abs act like she isn't absolutely busted.
Not to mention that if she really needed to, she could just make contract with other devils with abilities that can defeat gojo (hell devil, darkness devil, etc)
@@richardnixon2587 ong
All of this to get one tapped by Purple
@@guilha1506 did you even glance at it 💀
What about her ability to use all the devil powers she has and also she can predict movement right
Who wins? Pochita vs Raiden MGR
Nex death battle lets fuking go.
Makima has seen waaay more powerful f*cked up beings in her verse than Gojo. You capping hard
Name one right now this is how i know you dont even read the manga for jjk kid stop saying stupid sht without information🤦♂️
@@mrlasgana5272Darkness Devil, Cosmos Devil( which is hilarious considering she has a arguably more more powerful version of Gojos domain expansion.)
@@mrlasgana5272falling devil messed up the Earth's gravity just by existing
I feel like this would honestly be a trial and error kind of match up. Makima has shown better travel speed feats but the six eyes grant alot of insight I'd say gojo has some better attack+ reaction speeds. Makima's brain chemistry is different so unlimited void wouldn't be as effective as on humans and its not infinite at once (0.2 de = months of knowledge), meaning its most likely infinite exponential growth in the quantity of knowledge. Given makima and how she dealt with the halloween attack and her intelligence, it wouldn't be to crazy for her to try to study DE in general, with attacks from the outside being a prominent weak point. If you remove the "what if" interactions of their hax, then I feel as though makima may win the stamina/endurance battle more often then not. Both have insane regen tho so we'll see gojos upper limits in upcoming chapters.
just say you don't know gojo 🤡. Bro will obliterate makima in all aspects
No bro, you're giving makima prep time to study on gojo, and jjk verse is def faster than csm verse, and makimas brain doesn't really matter it still gets overwhelmed, it's not just knowledge but it's the sensation of feeling everything all at once
@@ajrockss1282 Im not giving makima prep time. Its just the natural course of trial and error when you got millions of lives to spare. Also bro the travel speed in jjk is actually slow considering mach 3 is considered impressive. The reaction speed can be argued up to maybe 1/3 sol on a highball
@@1sosukeaizen1gojo is just slower than makima flat out. Also we are currently seeing gojo doesnt have unlimited stamina and seeing the effects of him restoring his CT and it hasnt even been one day. 86400 seconds in a day and makima has 125 million lives
@@franksarria9693 you must be reading another manga. Bro gojo can teleport instantly also he has indeed infinite stamina but he hurt the part of his brain that releases barrier techniques, you can already see him still fighting with no issues except no domains
obviously lol. dont think he can use domain expansion cause domains dont work against non curse users but his physical prowess and his other hax would blitz makima
He can't blitz her. JJK is a slow verse lol
@@jirenthegray5776 Yeah, Hakari dodging lighting attack is slow.
Nobody talks about the fact she has a contract with so many devil's like the curse devil that will have a guarantee 1 shot after 3 hits and the fox devil and future sight too and who knows how many more
I mean, how much of that matters if she can't bypass Infinity?
@@domicson4587 maybe she still has the cosmos fiend and that could pass it
@@nothingness4068 yeah, it could bypass Infinity but it also has a condition to have it work. On top of that, there are too many "What If" and "Maybe" for this fight
I think it's actually very likely Makima thinks Gojo is inferior to her. She stated that she adores humans like humans adore dogs. So she'd probably think Gojo is inferior. Though even if she does think he's inferior I don't think she would for long because she wouldn't automatically control him(she'd have no reason to), when he engages with her she'd realize how powerful he is and sh'ed most likely realize he's definitely not inferior. One thing I don't agree on though is your Maki mach 19 statement. Awakened Maki is not faster than cursed spirit Naoya, her and Toji's physical stats are honed to a point that they have precognition. If pre awakened Maki has reaction time of mach 19 then awakened Maki should have had a MUCH easier time with cursed spirit Naoya.
Makima wouldn't think of Gojo as inferior. As others will point out, he's kind of just built different. Beyond his birth changing the fate of the world and whatnot, his mere presence is enough to have a significant effect on non-jujutsu sorcerers, like Makima. Kind of hard to feel superior when you are metaphorically under Gojo's weight.
This is a tough match up because of how unknown Makima's power's are but most likely Gojo would win with Hollow Purple as erasing Makima from reality is a good way to take her out, now domain exspasion might not work you could compare it to the ability of the Cosmos devil which is almost the same just with a spooky twist and she tried it on Makima right before she died and it didn't work. EDIT: let it be known this comment is very outdated
Nothing in the manga stated that HOLLOW PURPLE is existence eraser.
It's just a normal destructive attack.
Makima will just tanked HP and if she gets hurt somehow, the damage will automatically transfer to a random Japanese person as an illness or an accident and she will regenerate
@@chiaki.hayakawa18 I sware I heard that hollow purple is an existence eraser somewhere, guess not. Does that mean Gojo has no win con because infinite void doesne't work because of the cosmos devil and Gojo isn't going to kill all of Japan just to kill Makima it isn't in character for him to do so
@@glitch-xegaThat is what that means yes, literally the only reason she lost is because Denji truly did love her even if she didn't notice the actual him. The man viewed eating her as an act of love so he could become one with her which was a loop hole to her contract.
@@nathancurnutt8074 bitter sweet ending for part one of chainsaw man but it's really sad to see dispite all Makima put Denji through he loved her cause she gave him a home and a family even if her intentions where not what he realized at first, I love that manga so much
@@glitch-xega Yeah it really is beautiful, especially since we get to watch as Denji matures over the course of the story into becoming a good father to Nayuta at the very end
even if makima could get the ritual off with a sacrifice, i still don't think makima's telekinesis would have the AP to kill gojo, makiam has at most large town level AP.
and while i don't really agree with island level gojo since high ranking jujutsu officials considered Rika' curse to be a gojo/geto level threat, and followed up by saying rika was capable of destroying a city, this is not long before gojo performs the hollow purple feat, also i have seen "some" people calc hollow purple at large town level.
i do think gojo is at least large mountain level+(to me), so makima is still not even close to gojo's level of power.
also i think the mach 4000 lightning calc is a bit wanky, since i have seen people calc this feat more around mach 500 to 900, but again thats just me, like mach 4760 seems a little high considering Hakari barely even dodged the lighting anyway, and there i have seen calc of other characters from different verses that can completely blitz or out speed lightning barely being calc'ed around mach 2000.
Fami, her sister was more powerful than the falling devil, the falling devil caused earthquakes all ofver the world when she appeared
Simple. Love the video❤
The “hollow purple is an imaginary mass therefore it’s faster than light, because tachyon are an imaginary mass” wounds me deeply
It is factually FTL. Means nothing because no-one in JJK has shown scaling to the speed in a concrete way
Thanks for answering :D
I don’t know the cannon speed of hollow purple, but I said it because assuming that all imaginary masses are FTL because the one of which’s axiome (
The only way Makima can win is by controlling him(which has really low chance of working cause of sex eyes),
And that depends on her confidence of being better(superior )than the one being controlled
If she saw him flying, teleporting, one shotting strongest devils she will definitely lose confidence
And then it's over, at best it would be a tie, gojo can kill her with purple/de though
Sex eyes 💀
But if she didn’t see him use his powers, the moment the battle would begin, Gojo would already be under her control, because to Makima he’s just a regular human for all she knows
@@PloneCity”makina wins if gojo doesnt use his powers”
@@kbthegoatw no, I meant if she didn’t see him use his powers. I’m not taking away his powers dumbass, I’m saying that if makima just saw him just standing there or whatever
Six eyes has no feats of resisting mind control. Nice wank. Makima controls him easily.
Ok with some of the newer info we have we know that Gojo domain expansion does burn through his cursed energy and inside your domain you cant use your cursed technique. So like the mental dmg that is being done to her gets transferred and if that keeps her down due to the process theirs a good chance that the amount of time it would take infinity to kill all 125+million people of japan would be way to long for gojo to keep his domain up even with the ability to heal his burned out curse technique since we know infinity does do a lot of mental dmg. Assuming it kills a person every sec which it wouldnt it would take over 4 years to kill every person in japan which is way longer then gojo can keep up his domain or fight for since gojo is still human and needs to eat drink ect. Outside of domain like her telekinetic ability might be a internal attack which bypasses gojo infinity and she simply uses that to dmg his brain which causes him to not be able to use his cursed technique and he simply dies.
More realistically tbh its going to take much longer then 1 sec per person since it would be how long it takes her to die and she is a lot mentally tougher then normal people so it could take longer then gojo has natural life span for him to kill her perma through her mental durability depending if ya think her mental durability would be destroyed by the domain ect
@@josephvaccariello4181 Not at all.
It takes 0.2 seconds for the damage to become irreversible. Likely 0.5 is enough to killed.
And Gojo can just regenerate using Reverse. Add this to his Mountain+ durability, and there is no damage that she can cause him that he can't regenerate from.
Ok so I'm not sure where you got the information that it burns through his cursed energy, the six eyes literally make the use of cursed energy so efficient that he will literally never run out of cursed energy.(as stated by Yuta several times) Now what I assume your referring to is him not having a cursed technique after his domain is broken, if a domain is broken then the user has to wait a certain amount of time before they can use their technique again, but that's only if the domain is broken, and his domain took hits from a full powered Sukuna from the outside(which is the weakest part of the barrier) before it broke, so it's not like a car hitting it could break it, it has to be something of an insanely high damage output to break the barrier from the outside.
Gojo does not win.
Based take
It's funny to me because Makima 100% would just view Gojo as inferior (unlike what Toaster said), simply because he's human. Not only that, but Halloween Devil has an ability similar to Gojo's Unlimited Void, and people still don't think it'd work on her.
@@CH1C4N0444from your logic she can even beat Goku or even many DBZ characters that are humans isn't it? What a logic. Plus his brain is always keeps refreshing on it's own so even if he's caught with mental control it would snap back immediately. But that's considering if it bypasses infinity at first place.
@@艾可goku ain’t no human
What even makes this whole debate rediculous is that GojoTards do not even know how hollow purple works 😂. Thry keep saying that "Gojo will erase makima from existence with hollow purple". Hollow purple only disintegrate things at the atomic level and out of the physical world. It doesnt take of existence, such as souls and spirits 🤣🤣🤣. Makima continues to exist as long as theres the fear of control in the world, thats what makes her. These gojotards are just rediculous 😂😂😂
One thing I'd argue is Gojo, even if he had his Domain Expansion on foe 0.2 seconds essentially stunned everyone in the vicinity for at least 2 months even powerful curses were adfected. I think Makima would be affected by that as well.
this video has aged like fine wine
Problem comes to Makima herself not seeing. Or devils of her calibre don't remember faces. In her final fight, Dennis basically tells us that she doesn't see/remember human faces. Only how they smell, which is further solidified by the recent chapter showing us that this can also be extended to stronger enemies like devils (famine devil says that the war devil couldn't tell the two forms of Denji and Pochita apart). Back to Makima, she says that anyone she sees is inferior to her. She can't see him. Boring way to end it, but Makima would win (unless Gojo isn't a human and is some kinda cursed entity? Idk, I'm not too well read on JJK)
So by your logic makima beats Saitama since he's a human right? Gojo stomps with little difficulty tbh
@@kryptonight63 She don’t beat him in a fight directly but if she sees herself above him yeah she takes control of him ( saitama). Gojo gets stomped no diff.
@@kryptonight63 yeah, she does, but since Saitama is just THAT GUY, he'd probably have some gag like he's too dumb to be controlled, or a sneeze would release the mind control while destroying everything in the vicinity
Good point, but there's a few other things for consider. As dumb as it sounds, does Gojo even have a scent? He's surrounded by a barrier of infinite distance which he has full control over, so would whatever scent he has be able to travel that distance? Obviously it's a dumb point, but there is actual reason to believe Gojo could counter the whole mind control thing. Unless there's specific statements contradicting me here, Makima's ability to control people is reliant on them hearing her. That sounds very similar to Cursed Speech to me, a well known cursed technique in the JJK verse with Gojo having a student that uses it. Gojo without a doubt would be able to protect himself from Cursed Speech, even without his infinity barrier as Cursed Speech can be countered by protecting the ears and brain with cursed energy. You might argue that Gojo wouldn't be doing that be default and wouldn't be able to tell that Makima has an ability like cursed speech since she lacks the markings for it, there are counters to this too. 1: the Six Eyes being able to recognise cursed techniques just by looking at a person. Whether you think this applies to other abilities is up to you, however I'd personally argue that they should. 2: Gojo has insanely fast reaction speeds, so protecting himself like this the moment he realises something is wrong should be easy for him. Gojo was able to keep up with Toji after his awakening as a teenager, dodging all his attacks with ease. Toji is insanely fast himself, so Gojo's reaction speed scaling above Toji's speed is a pretty strong feat. Another example (spoilers for recent JJK chapters, skip to next paragraph if you care about that) is Gojo vs Sukuna. In their most recent domain clash, Sukuna is behind on his domain by less than 0.01 seconds and that time difference was enough for Gojo to be able to win the domain clash. This means that, in the last few domain clashes, Gojo and Sukuna were opening their domains within less than 0.01 seconds of the other opening theirs and reacting to it with their own.
There's all sorts of other arguments as to why Gojo wouldn't just seem like a regular human to Makima, such as cursed energy being something most characters can sense just by being near a character using large amounts of it (example being Yuji noticing Yuta nearby based on just sensing his cursed energy). There's also the example of Kishibe who, from what i know of CSM, is immune (or was immune, quite a bit behind on the manga) to Makima's control because she doesn't believe she is stronger than him. Again, my CSM manga knowledge is lacking so I don't remember exact wording, but my understanding is that she needs to believe without doubt that she is stronger than whoever she is trying to control in order to control them, so with characters that have any sort of inhuman powers, it's up for debate as to whether she would immediately believe she is superior or not and there's no point getting into head canon debates.
This fight is kinda boring because honestly, one side wins outright depending on where you stand. Either Makima can control Gojo and that's it, game over, or Gojo is immune to control for one reason or another and Makima just has no options to even touch him. Regardless of what side you're on, both are great characters from great mangas and are both insanely strong in their own universe. Sorry for my rant and have a good one!
@@Greninja9001
This is a copy comment I’ve made multiple times so excuse the error of dialogue in the beginning, I just didn’t feel like retyping it a 5th time.
You can skip through most of it up until Makima’s abilties.
Remember she can still come back due to her contract with the prime minister of Japan the only way to fully kill her is to be eaten by another devil so that she may be reincarnated so hollow purple wouldn’t even work, and whenever she does die she retains to information and skill set of the killer and she’s able to utilize that memory in order to find a loophole in her opponents skill set, the ONLY reason she lost to Denji was quite literally because she wanted to in a sense.
She’s already died twenty-six times in her own verse. She can alter the memories and perception of those she comes into contact with, unless the six eyes and or limitless gives Gojo memetic resistance and compulsion resistance then he will simply become a slave to Makima without even realizing it.
Let’s say that he can resist her, the huge issue isn’t that he can’t be touched but how many times can he kill her before she finds a way to absolutely destroy him.
Her ability to sacrifice someone else is definitely a win con because it has no suggestions to have such restrictions towards distance, time and or law of resistance, we know this because Makima used this ability or a variation of it on a being who defeated a being that was darkness incarnate and quite literally existed on a plane higher than any mortal comprehension, there are multiple statements from the manga to support this as well.
She just has too many win cons going into this and so many hax abilities similar to Gojo but unlike Gojo, Makima can afford to make mistakes and actually grow from making them.
In the current manga [SPOILER ALERT]
When Gojo battled against Sakuna we’ve seen when he battles a being similar enough in power or just that much more superior he struggles to keep up with them and is put against the ropes, I mean in the manga now he’s utilizing every avenue he has, but only because Sakuna isn’t going all out yet and because Sakuna is choosing to embarrass Gojo during their battle.
I’ll list off some of her more unknown abilties:
Teleportation (She can teleport the people she has control over via her chain links)
Memory Resistance (She could literally remember people erased from history)
Dimensional Travel (She can utilize the spider devil to transport her to hell)
Pain Manipulation (She doesn’t respond to her limbs being blown off or lethal harm being inflicted upon her)
Organic Manipulation (Without touching her opponent she’d be able to utilize the Mold Devil which would in turn cause literal decay and mold to began spreading throughout Gojo’s body)
It hasn’t been shown but she most likely can utilize the ghost devil’s intangibility or Incorporeality (This would make it so that Gojo can’t hurt or touch Makima to begin with at least by conventional means)
She can utilize the stone devils Pretrification (Gojo goes to grab or punch Makima and the stone devil would be utilized and summoned, thus turning Gojo to stone)
Information Manipulation and Madness Manipulation (The cosmos devil can literally instill the total understanding of the universe into an opponent, driving them completely insane)
Makima having control over such a devil would make her resistance by such means of attack near impenetrable unless you believe Gojo’s domain expansion has some higher grade of universal understanding which is highly doubtful and unlikely, seeing as how the cosmos devil is literally as old as the cosmos itself and therefore has literally been there since the beginning..this means Gojo’s domain expansion simply wouldn’t work.
Now lastly…TIME MANIPULATION (The Eternity Devil can cut the flow of time or even manipulate it in such ways on a scale to where to the outside world time isn’t truly effected, this level of time manipulation could quite literally destroy Gojo’s limitless abilities and therefore make it so that Makima can box with him)
Now I’ve said all of this to say this..Makima if in a fight with Gojo and having all of this knowledge would view him as completely inferior to herself as it is in character for her to do so, therefore if she simply perceived him as lower status than herself then she could quite literally control him or at the very least manipulate him.
With everything I’ve covered, it’s not to shit on Gojo. I’m sure everyone knows about Satarou Gojo’s abilities by this point, it’s only to educate others that Makima is not a slouch and has multiple hax abilities and summonings which she could utilize in knowledge and physical prowess to not only gain the edge in battle against our beloved sorcerer..but destroy him entirely.
I guess it is all subjective and you could scale them entirely close to one another even with current Gojo versus Makima full power.
Honestly after recent manga events, Makima can trivialize this fight by controling the infinity devil.
9:22 Domain Expansion targets beings with cursed energy, as proven by the Maki fight. So you disregard the the "Gojo is apart of Japan" equalization but apply equalization so Gojo can get a Domain Expansion off lmao This dude is a clown.
Verse equalization wouldn’t include something’s that’s not part of her base kit and it’s out-verse. Verse equalization is saying they have the same power system. Saying gojo would be affected due to being a Tokyo citizen is a knowledge claim as CSM author needs authority over jjk universe as these are separate universes with separate Tokyo citizens and prime ministers. This is also nlf btw. You’d get eaten up in a debate with that statement
@@XKIRA376 I don't care about verse equalization. Take Goku for example. If you were to pit him against Asta from Black Clover, would you argue that Asta can negate his ki techniques? When Asta negates Magic specifically? That's stupid and illogical. As per the rules established within JJK itself, Domains target cursed energy. Makima does not have that, so it isn't working.
Easiest argument would be that gojo kills himself by using Limitless Void on Makima. If a normal human can “withstand” 0.2 seconds of it, then a full limitless void would technically kill makima every 0.21seconds, hence killing Japanese, and eventually kill Gojo via the contract.
Note, although Gojo is exempted by Limitless Void, Makima’s contract states that a random illness or death. So yeh. Gojo kills himself on this one.
gojo won EZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
Makima solos. Reasons :-
1. Gojo is a human. Makima can control humans easily as she perceives them lesser than herself (as dogs) and doesn’t have to use her force manipulation [by words/chain] (which she used on hybrids and devils)
2. Mind control isn’t a type of attack. So gojo cannot heal/recover with rct.
3. Now if your gonna say Makima couldn’t control Gojo like Kishibe then your wrong. Makima didn’t even try to control Kishibe because he was one of the first devil hunters and one of the most respected ones in the hunting department. His sole motive was to protect humanity and not beat some other devils just cuz they attacked him. She left him because he was one of strongest humans humanity can offer and didn’t held any personal grudge against any specific devils.
👏👏
Gojo is a Shaman though not just a normal Human.
I'm not really into the vs battle community that much.. but personally, I believe Gojo wins this match up with little difficulty.
The problem with makima controlling gojo is that, people who are weaker then her like angel and power can pretty easily break out of it through strong emotion. Makima's control also needs to meet special conditions before she can actually control someone. Notice how with most of the hybrids she had to beat them first and then she controls them. The same thing applies to chainsawman however, you could make the case that makima didn't control them because she was simply toying with her victims or because they are hybrids. But I personally believe that in order for makima to control someone
1. She needs to be 100% sure they are weaker then her by likely beating them in battle.
2. She needs to break them down and make sure they are mentally weak in order for her to control them. We see her usually control her victims when they are at their weakest moments mentally. She controlled Aki when he was desperate to protect power and denji. She controlled quanxi some time later after quanxi was begging for makima to save her girls, quanxi even said she will do anything for makima if she spares her girls, indicating quanxi herself viewed makima has superior to her and was emotionally broken down by makima. The same goes for reze and likely all the other hybrids.
So if a person either view makima as superior to themselves or if they are emotionally and mentally weak, makima can control them
3. Makima can also use her chains in order to control people who likely don't have much interaction or knowledge of her. During the fight with Chainsaw Man and makima, we ser her controlling devil hunters who may or may not have passed away using her chains. We also see nayuta control war, who she likely had no prior knowledge of course before fami told nayuta her about yoru identity and potential.
Why I think gojo can't be controlled by makima
1. In character Makima when she firsts goes against gojo likely may not try to control depending on the situation but even if she does, I don't think she would be able to control him for long. She needs to make sure that her opponent is weaker then her completely and depending on how the battle starts, she may quickly change her opion on gojo.
So let's say makima uses her control on gojo the first time they meet. I believe gojo would break out of it similar to angel and power. Gojo has a really big ego and against his fight with sukuna, he is able to fortify his mind from feeling any sadness when seeing sukuna using megumi's body as his vessel. I believe makima may control gojo or catch him off guard for a short amount of time, but similar to the situation with Hanami, gojo will immediately break out of makimas control due to his strong emotions and fortified mind. I don't this is too much of a stretch because gojo scales far above power and angel and he has a pretty big ego similar to power, who also able to break out of makima's control.
2. I Belive for reason stated above, gojo will be immune to this form of control from makima because makima has no way of really emotionally manipulating current gojo due to the fortification of his mind. And I doubt makima will convince gojo that she is stronger then him, due to gojo ego. Gojo saw sukuna as a mere challenger to his title when they met again, which shows just how big his ego is.
3. Finnaly, I actually do believe if makima uses her chains on gojo she could control him/manipulate his memories, but before she does that there are some things to consider.
Gojo is extremely faster then makima, makima has no realy speed feats other then slicing the head of a non transformed quanxi who was not even trying to fight bach against her. Quanxi didn't run or do anything against makima she just stood in the same spot until makima killed her. Secondly, Makima should scale no where to the gun devil in speed (Don't listen to chiaki hayakawa's wack scaling, they constally high ball and wank characters to the extreme based on their biased opions. They manipulate the narrative in order to get charcters at those speeds and we can easily wank gojo to FTL+ just like how chiaki wanked makima over mach 1458. In order for this to be a fair and honest fight we never should wank characters to oblivion just becasue we have a personal bias for them. Since most battles, I see on gojo are a high balled makima vs a low ball gojo, I never see a high ball gojo vs a high ball makima. I respect Chiaki as creator very much, I enjoyed and have watched many of their shorts, but they usually leave out facts or information when it comes to gojo vs makima and they usually have a clear bias for not just makima but other characters as well in their vs battles.) because makima literally stood there the whole time, not moving for her spot at all until the gun devil shot her in the head, in which she then used the ability of other devil hunters to kill the gun devil, which isn't really a speed feat but also not that good of a reaction feat when you realize she was also using the future devil in order to gain and catch the gun devil off guard, who wasn't moving away from makima's attack at all, it kinda just stood there and took it.
So, now the real question is how fast are the chains? Honestly we don't really know, we may have to rely on the anime for this one, but I personally don't belive the chains are faster than gojo since we know makima's slower then gojo and when ever nayuta or makima uses the chains on someone they are either incapacitated, caught off guard or our extremely slow in reaction speed and general speed, yoru didn't dodge nayutas chains because of her reaction speed and because she was caught off guard. Personally even if you give the chains the benefit of the doubt of going through gojos infity, I believe gojo would immediately react to it and doge simply before it reaches him, since no really character in CSM other than the gun devil actually has lighting or ftl sped attacks or feats. I'm not saying gojos FTL but he should definitely be around or slightly lower then the speed of lighting which should be far above makima who doesn't have any really good speed feats, also makima seems to have terrible reaction speed and doesnt really have that many good speed feats, and is constantly getting shot in the head and being unable to dodge simple bullets. She reacted to the gun devil attacking because she was using the future devil (notice how makima didn't dodge any of the gun devil's bullets.)
TLDR
I don't think makima can control gojo unless she uses the future devil to catch him off guard with the chains, but even then gojo's six eyes allowed him to perceive things far greater then the average human and he has extremely good reaction speed, since he should scale above hakari who reacted to a lightning based attack. Makima may be in a similar situation to aki, where even though she can see the future, she may not be able to even catch, let alone react to gojo, who has countless speed feats throughout the manga unlike gojo. Also I wouldn't say makima scales above the gun devil, because she need to use other powerful devils to defeat it and she had many hax based devil at her disposal like future and angel to be able to counter the gun devil. We never see her control this version of the gun devil until after she defeats it, and we never she her use the bang ability in the gun devil, which should indicate that makima could not defeat the gun devil on her own without the assistance and contracts of the people she controlled.
I just don't think makima can control gojo because of how many good speed feats we get for gojo and how many anti speed feats we get for makima.
There's quite a lot of issues with your comment. You said "Makima has really no speed feats"First of all Gojo has terrible speed feats lol. In terms of speed the JJK verse is insanley slow in compariosn to the chainsawman verse. Maki is outright stated to be slightly faster than mach 3 and she was able to land hits on a 15 finger sukuna. Based on what the official japanese translations said, sukunas speed was not nerfed in this fight due to megumi holding sukuna back. So Sukuna can get hit by mach 3 level punches. That same sukuna was able to jump in and save kenjaku from gojo. So Gojo was blocked by a character who is slightly faster than mach 3. So a mach 3 character is relative to gojo. You say hakari reacted to lighting attacks. This is false. Hakari is shown to be far slower than lighting attacks. We see him get blitzed by lighting multiple times which shows he is nowhere even close to the speed of lighting. Makima is shown to be on par or faster than pochita in the graveyard in just hand to hand combat. This version of pochita took out every hybrid devil including devil form quanxi. Human quanxi performed a mach 6 feat with her devil form being much faster so makima is easily over mach 10 based on other feats. I could get her much faster but ive proved my point.
Also you seem to have misunderstood some parts of chainsawman. Makima can control someone even if they arent at their lowest point. Aki has been under makimas control for all of chainsawman. This is because Aki keeps saying he loves Makima and she saved her life but we know this is all false. Just before meeting makima we see Aki confused about why he loves makima. This is makimas control ability at work on him. The only time makima needed to break someone down to control them is with denji. And thats because she needed to unleash pochita by breaking denjis contract. This isnt anything to do with her ability lol.
Also you said this : "And I doubt makima will convince gojo that she is stronger then him, due to gojo ego." Im confused by your point here, it seems like you dont understand makimas control ability. It does not matter what gojo thinks of himself, all that matters is what makimas thinks. If she thinks she's stronger than gojo, and gojo thinks hes stronger than makima then makimas abilty would work and she gains control of gojo. We litterally see multiple times where she controls people she just met, she doesnt need to defeat them to control them. She only had to do this with the gun devil and Pochita. 2 extremely OP beings so of course makima needs to beat them in a fight first. Also are you seriously comparing Makimas control ability to Hanamis flower mind relax ability lol? Hanamis flower ability was so weak that even Yuji and Todo were affected by it but were able to break out almost instantly. So gojo breaking out of it is a terrible way to show he is resistant to mind control. He heals his brain with RCT but thats it. This shows his RCT does not make him more immune to mind attacks since yuji was able to do the same thing and break out of the mind control.
Whereas, Makimas mind control is so powerful she can control entire characters for the entire manga and change and alter their past like she did with Aki. The only character who resisted the mind control was angel but he was under control for years and years before he broke free, and then makima just mind controled her again 5 seconds later lol. So breaking out of her mind control isnt even that helpful since she has shown she can just control you again even if you have shown you can break free. So makima would control gojo, order him to disable infinity and then she'd either throw him in hell and let the primal fears tear him apart or she'd just launch him into space like we saw with pochita.
@@yadafty7671
1. For makima's speed feats
She is never stated to be anywhere near mach 3 or above and she has no statements that put her above transformed quanxi. Pochita in his weakned state was able to catch quanxi off guard but keep in mind, before CSM slices her head she is not moving anywhere near her top speeds. We can still see and easily observe this from the panel quanxi is on. Quanxi lossed to CSM because she doesn't have the same level of regenration as makima, makima may be able to react to a weakened pochita, but that is only after pochita attacks her, she never blocks or dodges any of CSM attacks, she only regenerates from them. Also maki in her fight with cursed spirit naoya is later capable of not only blitzing naoya but easiky dodging most his attacks, keep in mind that if curse spitit naoya uses his cursed technique that easily puts him above mach 3 due to the frame rule. Also quanxi doesn't have any feats that would put her significantly above mach 3 unless you signifigantly wank her and high ball through calcs which you can also easily do eith the jjk verse to get to ftl or lightning speed feats. Hakari himself may not be lightning speed in terms of travel speed, but he was still able to react to a lightning based attack which puts his reaction speed far above any of the characters in CSM who have extremely sluggish reaction speed in comparison. Santa claus some we know who should slower than gojo or sukuna, was capable of reacting to all of quanxi's arrows.
Also maki shoulf be far above mach 3 due to her growing in power and speed after fighting naoya. You could also make the argument that sukuna was caught off guard by maki or sukuna wasn't going all out against maki. We also know that gojo is on the same level of a 19 finger sukuna plis tengen's head, so he should easily be above not only the speed of maki, but he should also have a quicker reaction time then hakari, but we may have tow ait for the kashimo vs sukuna fight to prove this. However it sgould be noted that gojo is argubaly faster than this version of sukuna and he is even faster via teleportation. Quanxi and no CSM other then the gun devil should actually scale above mach 1 or higher, especially when there is no feats that put them there in the first place unless you wank their calcs. If you are going to high ball a character like makima or quanxi to or above makis speed, you might as well highball or wank gojo to lightning or FTL speed, since gojo is not onky faster but also stronger than maki by a wide margin. Personally I think gojo is around hypersonic and even faster via teleportarion, unless you wank or lowball him. The problem with saying that CSM characters ae faster, is that they have no speed feats that justify this, no CSM character has ever reacted to lightning type attacks, and makima has lots of anti feats, like how bullets which were confirmed to be normal by makima herself, were easily capable of tagging her, and CSM in his weakened and full armot form is stronger and faster then makima, keep in mind makima is never shown dodging any attack that is faster than gojo or is even equal to his speed. Makima has no feats that show her reaction speed is anywhere near as high as gojo.
Makima is personaly subsonic at best, and that is if you rely on statements rather then feats.
How am I wanking Makima speed? 🤔 when she literally reacted before the Gun Devil bullet hit her in the manga.
She reacted to it, but she didn't bother to dodge it.
Also, Makima didn't have *Future Devil* at the moment, she used Future Devil after she got hit by the bullet.
It's literally show u in the manga.
- You are using Makima anti feats of not dodging normal guns bullets, when that moment occurred way back in 4th arc of CSM.
Makima *Mach 1458* speed feat is in 7th arc of CSM.
Also Makima didn't even dodge the gun bullets in Katana Man arc, because she made a contract with Japanese federation, which gives her extra immortality and that moment in the manga/anime was a cliffhanger and making us wondering if Makima is really dead.
Gun Devil at 20% power reacted to Makima *Mach 1458* attack in gun devil arc and you're saying he's below lightning speed.
GD blitz Hawaii country in 0.4 second in the manga and I calc it at Sub Relativistic/+ speed.
Also, if Makima doesn't have any speed feats, how was she able to fire attacks and reacted before Pochita can move during mid air, mind u Pochita scale higher than GD in speed.
Can also see Pochita getting sentt into outer space at very fast velocity.
@@chiaki.hayakawa18 The main issue was you acted like Makima is slower than gojo which is just dumb. Gojo is max Mach 10 in terms of speed. The JJK verse has very bad speed feats so when you said gojo is FTL I laughed lol. Makima is faster than anyone in the verse by a massive margin.
@@jkillerlioncat3241. Makima was able to react to Angel Devil movements in Gun Devil Arc.
Angel Devil can react to Gun bullets and was calc at *Supersonic+* speed.
Long, one of Quanxi girlfriend, was able to react to Gun bullets two times and it was calculate at Mach 3.6 by ManifestedFavor.
This is very consistent with the low tier characters of CSM VERSE (Speed)
Since Kobeni, Long and Angel was able to react and dodge bullets.
2. Makima blitz, kill Base Quanxi with a sword in international association arc.
Base Quanxi did a zig zag blitz on Dolls and Humans in milli seconds, and it was calc at Mach 200+ by ManifestedFavor and many other anime scaling content creator.
3. Makima reacted to Gun Devil bullet, that move at Mach 1458 speed.
4. Makima fought Denji in the graveyard, latest chapter of CSM confirms this.
Denji exchanging blows on Makima and Quanxi at one point was able to react to Denji, would just upscale both Quanxi & Denji in Devil form to Makima speed.
5. Curse Naoya normal speed is *Supersonic*
When he's using his CT, his speed caps at Mach 3.
6. You guys can't wank the JJK verse speed, since JJK CHARACTERS haven't shown any FTL and Lightning speed and Gege also wrote that Mach 3 statement.
Where as Fujimoto gave us timeframe and how far characters are from each other.
So, we use calculate it and get their speed.
Other characters would upscale to this, base on feats in the manga.
7. Hakari doesn't travel at Lightning speed, he didn't react to lightning and nobody in JJK are faster than lightning speed, lightning speed or close to lightning speed.
8. Teleportation is hax, it's not raw speed.
So Gojo raw speed doesn't improve.
9. Chainsaw man concept that got weaker and still was able to react to Makima, it just upscale him to Makima.
We literally see Pochita true form got Weakened by Makima tactics and Makima still says that Pochita still have enough power, strength and speed to dodge Makima/Angel Devil attack.
Normal Angel Devil attack weapon was able to blitz Gun Devil and this Angel Devil attack that Makima used was amp up by 1000x
So who’s gonna tell him
Naaaaaaaahhhhhhh calling bs on the control ability not working, she's basically seen everything he's done in her own verse, that would not deter her from looking down on him
the ability she used against the darkness devil can bypass gojo's infinity 100%. It comes from inside, she points and makes people bleed and die from the inside instantly without any projectiles,. she can use cosmo's devil and then use the ability, he wouldn't be able to heal mimself. she literally has his domain expansion
an interesting counter to Gojo's domain expansion is that one of Quaxi's side chicks has a power that literally fills your head with infinite knowledge to the point where you only say "Halloween" and even with that ability, Makima pretty much is on higher scale than that devil even with a broken hax like that; she also like no diffs the darkness devil and that devil was manipulating the entire Hell's landscape and was even stated transcendent
As far as i'm aware, the ability you're referencing doesn't fill their head with infinite information, only every piece of information in the universe. That's still a lot, but it's not even close to infinite since, well, nothing is close to infinity other than itself. I forget the exact wording of the ability but since everything in the universe < infinity, unlimited void is infinitely stronger and more potent of an ability. Even if i'm wrong and the ability you mentioned IS infinite information, there's also the fact that unlimited void works by using infinite stimuli repeated infinitely, so the person effected is experiencing simultaneous infinite infinities of information, making unlimited void still infinitely better. It's a point i've seen on this debate before, and everyone seems to forget just how potent gojo's domain really is in comparison. Spoilers for JJK Ch.228 (i think) onwards, but Gojo has also shown that he can decrease the range of his domain to be about the size of a tennis ball (or around that, i forget the exact but it was some sports ball), and by doing so he increases the potency of his domain's effects. Point is that unlimited void is gonna work on Makima regardless of how she compares to the halloween ability you mentioned.
Makima in no way “no diffs” the darkness devil. She held it off for enough time to run away.
@@Greninja9001 Bruh, you are aware that everything in the universe should include things like infinite series, which Gojo’s Whole deal is based on?
I see this every time in a csm vs jjk debate and it is very rather annoying at this point. Even if cosmos ability “Halloween” technique is on par with Gojos hollow purple (which it isn’t on a HUGE massive scale in terms of potential and potency wise) cosmo as a character is very MID at best in the csm verse and has literally no feats or scaling other than using the ability at Santa Claus in the manga Before dying to Makima who practically no diff her and her fiend friends and quanxi herself without no sweat or hesitation to do so. Putting these two characters in a 1v1 verses match is extremely very one sided. Do you actually think cosmo can hit Gojo with her long ass wait time Halloween technique and could get Gojo off guard some how? Gojo would stand there after she did her technique and then Gojo would just speedblitz her beyond perception and rip her head off clean. NO DIFFICULTY Honestly this is just pure copium on the csm side rather than csm vs Jjk debate. There is no character in csm that can even remotely touch Gojo . It is not based on my opinion nor any sort of head cannon or biased on anything else. It is just on facts and pure measurement data. It is what it is end of story.
@@november4196 she does, Makima didn't even fight it properly and wasn't attacking back, if this was THAT serious she'd be running to that corpse. She couldn't go all out due to her circumstances or even stay to fight due to the environment, his DE is not infinite information but repetitive and stuff like that which Makima can easily withstand.
Makima instantly controls him and wins no diff. She will just smell him as a human and she doesn’t care about looks or appearances. ( confirmed by fami in chapter 135).
This is a fact but most wouldn’t take this, they don’t understand that by her being a primordial devil of her caliber and already being stronger than multiple devils that already outscale Gojo by simply existing, she would decide immediately that he is inferior and therefore he would become susceptible to her abilities and manipulation.
@@loneli_ That’s what I’m saying but people dismiss it because they’re biased and don’t want to admit that her control ability can end fights before it starts. Plus it’s jjk fans. Biased is their middle name when it comes to power scaling.
I feel like you're missing something... there's a difference between the humans in CSM and Sorcerers. Even though sorcerers are technically humans you cannot put them in the same category as CSM's normal humans cuz that would be the same as putting fiends in the same level as primal fears...in reality both of them are devils but very different from each other. Sorcerers have supernatural abilities, they can exorcise curses, heal injuries, use powerful techniques etc. Meanwhile the humans in CSM are naturally weak and when it comes to devil hunters they have to rely on contracts with devils cuz they don't have powers of their own. That's what makes those humans inferior to Makima but when it comes to gojo its a whole different story. When makima senses his immense energy coming from him, with his stupid OP HAX to stop any sort of attack coming towards plus the fact that he would be flying in the sky above her that would just prove to her that he is not like most humans and she won't be able to control him on sight.
There's also the fact that in JJK manga angel mentioned that jujutsu sorcerers are capable to resist and counter the effects of the merger with tengen which in my opinion that is a very big feat (even bigger than Makima's control) cuz were talking about an apocalyptic event that can end humanity and sorcerers are immune to that. Now imagine how immune gojo would be to a less threatening ability such as Makima's control.
@@aaronbrown125 That’s the problem though. Socerer’s don’t exist in csm. As you said they are technically human. Because of that his scent would be human to her and she would see herself as above him then take control of him.
Gojo’s immense presence that was sensed by sukuna in ch222 would have makima shitting herself Jjk sorcerers aren’t normal humans let alone the strongest sorcerer
When he said gojo puts on his domain expansion and waits something out, what does he mean?
Also I don’t get why he never mentioned making using the thing where she points and says bang. On top of that why can’t we say that gojo is a Japanese citizen and have attacks eventually reflect on to him. I just want anyone to explain cuz I’m kinda confused.
Gojo is immune to his domain expansion, so he actually COULD just wait out until makima is stuck in place
Im so glad u addressed the dagon star bs
unless he immediately destroys her entire body with purple, which isn't even confirmed to be enough to stop her from coming back to life, he literally cannot win. While it's true that infinite void and all of his abilities can definitely kill her, Gojo is literally a citizen of Japan. Meaning that at some point, even if every human in Japan dies, Gojo will inevitably become a sacrifice for her to come back to life. The sacrifice is instant, meaning that no amount of reversal is going to bring him back
He literally explained in the video why that isn't true
@@Flyingboy25 which part did he explain, and can I get a timestamp
@@97Sugars 8:45 the contract can still arguably bypass it but gojo can just wait it out
The contract isn't really regeneration so go figures.
@@Flyingboy25what is he waiting out?
I think we can say the bullet feat maki did is now a retcon since gege said he shouldn't have had her do that
makima fans are writing actual pages to justify why she’ll win
Because she does win.
Pages on stuff I’ve already covered instead of debating me on discord or something
@@ToasterXDain't got a discord but why didn't you talk about angel?
These essay writers should craft their own character instead of glazing someone elses
@@ToasterXD You are such an obvious di ck rider and biased JJK fanboy that debating you would just be a weste of my precious time. Life in your delusion where you think Gojo can beat Makima. And even if he could, the Darkness Devil /Falling Devil duo solo the JJK verse low diff, so you are only really debating sloppy seconds.
when people somehow misunderstood Makima's power in that one panel shown in the start of the vid and start saying she gonna get clapped every vsbattle (mostly because that one mistranslation). I even have to view the source material (I can read japanese, gladly) to confirm her power, bruh.
Y’all do realize Makima needs gojo to think he’s weaker than her for makima to be able to use ANY of her abilities on him
Where did this headcanon come from? It's based on her perspective, not his.
@@glizzygladiator6969 Incorrect. He has no resistance to mind control.
@@jirenthegray5776 ohhhhh my bad i read csm 4 months ago thanks for letting me know though👍