Stovepipe water heater
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- Опубликовано: 7 сен 2024
- Intent here is to utilized the galvanized pipe as means of making the coil. It will not be installed anywhere. Further intent is that the coil should not make any direct contact with the stovepipe, and that there will be an aluminum shield surrounding the outside.
Although I mention heating the domestic water, the primary goal is to transfer heat from the stove location to the radiator that will one day be placed at the coldest end of the house. The system design calls for continous circulation through that radiator with a tap off of it somehwere to feed the existing water heater.
The mistake was the soldering before the coiling of the new pipe. The coupling fitting created a very rigid point to allow a continuous curvature. Next time it will be better to coil the next pipe first then proceed with the soldering. Anyway, if the water heater doesn't work, you have the main contraption for a moonshine distiller. Great video!
Great idea and assembly video. 2 points to consider... 1. When copper pipe directly touches galvanized steel it will induce a dielectric corrosion process. This will cause a rapid corrosion process. 2. If you will wind your copper on both sets of coils before sweating them, you will reduce the kinking. When you sweat copper, it reduces the temper and makes it prone to kinking.
I would suggest wrapping your copper around a pipe 1/2" l - 1" larger than the intended vent size, slide it off and then insert short strips of non-conductive material between the copper tubing and the standpipe. This would eliminate any dielectric process.
can also fill pipe with sand to prevent kinking
Hey, you almost got it right, at least you got your head in the right direction. I made one like this and had some problems with it, which lead me to understand the secrets to correcting it. Using one single 3/4" copper tube allows too much flow which is greater than your heating process, meaning you only get a few gallons of really hot water and the fresh makeup supply cools it back down and leaves you waiting.
The correction is to use three 3/8" copper tubes alternating them side-by-side so that none have time to cool out faster than you can heat them. Another problem is heat warping over time, so you want to wrap them tight and also brass braze (not solder) them in about three places from side to side as you go around the entire bundle, to keep them together and close to the stove pipe. You might as well upgrade your tin snap-lock vent pipe to the solid heavy duty steel pipe so it doesn't burn through and wreck your expensive copper. At both ends where the three 3/8 tubes come around, join them through fittings soldered with Sil-Flos a high temp stick brazing rod, so they don't overheat and come unsoldered, where they go in your manifold fittings. It is also best to feed the fresh water in from the bottom, with a check valve because the heating process without a tank will force pressure back to your supply, and heating from bottom up works better.
Plumber here.
To help you with coiling copper, obviously thinner soft copper is easier.
Alternatively, don’t be afraid to throw some heat on it!
Nice coil. I enjoyed watching this even though I literally handle copper all day at work 😂
I am plumber in Canada and I have made one of these for a customer of mine, to get a good roll on the copper we used a roll of tar paper as form and laid it down on a flat surface and it worked like a rolling pin, the weight of the roll helped and there was two of us rolling. I made the same joint that you did but with the heavy roll it blended in quite well.
A word of caution, this system must have a PRESSURE RELIEF VALVE! (sorry to shout) if it is a closed system. Simple and cheap 30psi. 240F same as on smaller boilers. Also an expansion tank is a good idea.
The system I made was for in floor heating.
I like your style good video!
How large of an expansion tank?
You may already know this, but I'll say it anyway. Copper work hardens. To anneal the copper (anneal means to soften the material by normalising the crystal grain structure) you simply heat it to about cherry heat and allow it to cool slowly in air. You will find that the copper much softer to work after this process. Remember, as you deform it, you will harden it. If it gets too hard you can anneal it again to soften it as often as you need. Great video. Thanks.
+Phillip Harris actually phillip , you heat it to cherry red then rapidly cool it, exzactly the opposite of iron. this works with most nonferrous metals (brass, silver, bronze and copper).if nonferrous materials cool slowly they harden up quite a bit. since reading down I saw a few suggesting "annealing" by slow cooling, get a piece of 14 gauge house wire and heat it to cherry red and let it cool slowly(as suggested) it'll stiffen up a lot, then heat again and quench it, it'll soften up, the proof as they say is in the pudding.
Hi Orvarg. I am surprised. I was under the impression that any effectively pure metal eg iron or copper, will not be effected by quenching because of the lack of alloying elements to make use of. The rate of quench therefore, should not affect the final hardness and strength. I will try the copper wire test to satisfy my curiosity, but I am basing my understanding on what I studied and have done experimentally at college. I would expect copper based alloys like bronze and brass to have different outcomes on the rate of quench due to their alloying contents, but not commercially pure copper grades used in water/gas pipes and electrical wire.
+Phillip Harris my understanding comes from experience as a smith making colonial type kitchen implements in these materials. when working with copper (say for a ladle bowl) it will work harden, in order to not have the bowl crack under a dishing hammer I have to reheat it then quench it to remove the work hardening from the piece.( and you are correct in that alloying does make a difference in how a piece hardens( hence the various alloys of steel that either oil harden or air harden)
Just a thought; coil the first line, then start the second -- then trim them where they will connect and solder. It might be easier then trying to solder first and try to prevent the kink.
I think it needed to set off that pipe anyway to keep from getting so hot it might re flow the solder on that union, what's it hold primed is my question and how much it weighed
Thank you! Your hours of hard work figuring out the most productive way saved me hours of hard work.
I love that old GMC TRUCK! Look at that chrome shine! Looks like a beautiful beast! Wow! Having that on some land in the mountains would make a homestead complete!
Twisting an adjustable wrench around any kinked metal tubing will get it back round. A trick I learned from local water company installing a compression fitting splice. Saved me more than once with bending brake lines and copper tubing. Just dial the wrench down on a straight section and spiral it around from one end of the kink to the other. Gets it almost perfect again, as long as it's not creased to bad.
To avoid flattening of the pipe during this winding process you should fill it first with a dry sand. This will minimize the risk or even eliminate it completely :-)
This is how they make brass instruments as well. Great tip!
You are absolutely right filling the inner gap with dry winnowed sand prevents flatting the tube while bending 🌹🌹🌹
Thought it was amazing the first time I tried that
He said he likes it flat because that's more surface area to grab more heat.
Good video!
I would like to see the follow-up video and how well it worked for you, and/or any unforeseen troubles you may have experienced along the way.
If he's anything like me, he got ADHD and moved onto aquascaping, bird house crafting, and who knows what else over the past few years. It's probably still sitting on the saw horses he made it on, lol.
This is a very neat idea. You could probably put a wider pipe to cover the coil to get even better heat transfer to your water, or leaving it open will probably help draw more heat from the stovepipe into the room. On top of all that, you've also got yourself a very large, highly conductive coil which could possibly generate some electricity if you run a magnet along the sides. If the center pipe is iron or steel, you could apply an electric current to the coil to generate a magnetic force in the pipe for whatever purpose.
That's awesome. As an ex machinist (never an ex machinist that's sacrilegious) now a thermal engineer I can say that's great.
I decided to do the same in my cabin except I ran the same two lengths of copper tube in parallel to avoid that soldered connection. Same total length as yours in the end. Kinda' like a double start thread. I also put an insulated sheet metal shroud around the coil to contain all of the thermal energy at that point. It works very well; a little too well as I have to dump some of the heateed water at times so I am working on a radiator that will help to heat the cabin rather than dump the hot water. NOTE: An amendment to this is that I checked the inside of the pipe after one season and very little noticeable creosote build-up at the coil portion of the vent pipe interior.
Thanks, Ian. The whole concept here is to make the coil diameter large enough to not make contact with the pipe directly. After that, aluminum sheet enclosing the coil, as aluminum reflects 98% of all radiant heat. The heated water was to flow across the attic space and down the wall to a radiator under the kitchen sink, as that's the coldest spot i the house. (north east corner) From there it's plumbed through the crawl space back to the stove. A 2 gallon reservoir was to be placed in the attic just before the drop. With an open top, it would act as a vent and an expansion tank. My theory was that it would passively circulate as long as i could get the inlet temp back to ambient, and my wife wouldn't have cold feet anymore!
@@ElderlyIron Yes. All very good and of course momma cannot ever have cold feets.
When I first saw the video I was concerned about conduction at the contact point of the copper to the vent pipe. But I realized there would be very little contact and hence no cooling of vent gases. there is some contact in mine but the gases are kept hot enough to vapourize the carbon build which attempts to build up. Good qualtiy and properly seasoned hardwood is key as well.
I have considered building an underground hopper to hold a 5 year supply of anthracite coal with an auger to supply my boiler on demand. It does actually burn clean. At least cleaner than wood and is cheap and easy. But then, who doesn't like a wood fire?!
I forgot to add. I want the hopper underground because I can call in a larger hopper truck to simply park and dump. the location is a high spot so no water to contaminate the coal.
Great video! Just a suggestion here ; you should start the bending on the second coil before sautering it to avoid kinking.
Love that you shared your success and failure in this....you just taught this slightly younger buck some good stuff! Thanks for sharing your wisdom Sir!
There are three types of copper. Type M, L and K. Type K is primarily used for underground and depending on where you live is readily available. Type L and K can both be purchased in a soft copper roll. When bending the tubing around a cylinder, sometimes it’s better to use a 45 degree fitting instead of a coupling depending on the radius of the cylinder.
good idea using the 45 degree fitting
They also make 22.5 degree fittings, if you're coiling around a larger cylinder.
Don’t forget type Q, or the curly type!
Tip for you, first fill the pipe with sand before you bend it. Great channel Thanks for sharing!
+Burl Nicholson YES
I was thinking the same thing. Or, fill it with water and freeze it.
+Burl Nicholson .....The kinking problem was caused because of the inability of the connector to bend. otherwise he would have almost no problems conforming that tubing around an 8 inch pipe.
Allen Ray you can also freeze water in the pipe before bending to keep it from kinking.
You can't realistically fill that amount of coiled pipe with sand and get it compact enough to prevent kinks this only works with short ish pipes where you can use gravity and "tap" the sand into the pipe and as for freezing water, how the hell do you plan to do that? maybe if you live in the arctic. The way to join two coils with out removing them from a pipe is simple: You bend the first coil as far as you can then cut back so its all coil no straight bits and fit a connector, then you start a second coil, once you have a couple of turns on the stove pipe you again cut off the first straight part then loosen off the second coil a bit push it up to the first coil and rotate it round the stove pipe into the connector. OR If you don't care what the coil looks like: Wind on the first coil, then wind on a second coil in the opposite direction then join the two ends with a return bend connector.
The point is moot anyway as according to the description the finished coil will not be touching the actual stove pipe so he should have just made two separate coils and joined them later off the pipe.
This was the first video i saw of Elderlyiron i would love to see the finished product.
I love your truck. It reminds me of my dad's old truck. Old blue was a good old truck and hauled many cords of wood in it's day. Several years ago he finally got rid of old blue. I hope who ever he gave it to enjoys it and makes as many memories in it as we did.
WOW!!!!! I thought of doing this a couple of months ago and now you just made my life so much easier!!! Thanks!
It´s a great idea, but you did not realize it. Everybody wants to see the thing working like an off-grid wonder of the world.
What he was making was a giant tesla coil. I was hoping he'd hook electricity to it.
Largest evaporation tube ever, for a moonshine still, but we'll just say its for making hot water to cut down on the bills (wink-wink).
Condenser coil.
Having built many stills we use a water jacket system. Much, much cheaper
i am an engineer and made one of these myself about 7 years ago for hot water in my claw foot tub during the winter months in michigan.(didn't think to make a video) here's the trick:
acquire a heavy-ish spring approximately a foot long that closely fits over the copper and slides along it easily but not too loosely. you can then bend away without the possibility of kinking. just be sure that all bending occurs within the spring itself and not beyond its ends. slide it along as you go. at the end portion where you will join pieces together, don't be concerned with the very end being bent(it's next to impossible to get the very end to cooperate). pick a spot back up the copper at the nearest point from the end where the coil is bent to the conforming diameter and cut with a copper tubing cutter. perfectly curved ends. with the same principle and a larger spring, you can also bend the coupling piece over a mandrel to match the curve of the pieces to be joined, providing a very nice finished look. this only increases the cost by the amount of money it takes to get whatever springs you can find. VOILA...good luck boys and happy bending
Thanks for showing us how to wrap copper pipe around a rare galvanized stove-pipe.
When I bought my old house, it had an old coal furnace. Next to the furnace was the oil-fired water heater. I'm not sure who did it, but someone ran a heavy pipe (probably steel) out the bottom of the water heater, up & into the back of the fire box about 10 to 12 inches deep, made the turn with 2 90's and back out, then the pipe went back into the water heater thru the top. Whenever I'd have a fire going, natural hot & cold currents would constantly circulate the water thru the pipe & water heater. There was a problem though - whenever the water would get too hot, the pressure release valve on the water heater would pop and release quite a bit of hot water. Fortunately, the other side of the basement was dirt floor so I hooked up a plastic pipe to the valve so when it would pop, it would drain over to the dirt side. It would only happen when it was very cold outside & I'd have the fire really hot. Be careful though, because the water that came out of the spigots was so damn hot the steam would roll across the ceiling and I could've probably cooked pasta in the sink. haha
What was needed on the output of the overly hot water heater was a Tempering Valve. A Tempering Valve has a cold water line hooked to it and it adds just enough cold water to it to make the hot water come out at whatever you set the temperature on the valve.
Rustaholic777 Could've used that info 10 years ago. haha
Daniel Heller
I have only known that for the last 35 years or more.
One of my sweet wife's uncles bought a house that had a wood stove in the basement that had a hot water line running through it. Upstairs at the sink Aunt Peggy showed me the steam that would come out of the faucet every time she opened it. I told them about the tempering valve and they sure were happy. I do believe that was 36 years ago.
You my dear sir are playing with fire! The pop off valve is to work that way but only in an emergency with a run away water heater! The reason the pop off valve was invented and installed on water heaters in the first place was because water heaters use to not have them and pressure would build and rupture the tank and all that water wanted to turn to steam and it would literally blow up a house and kill everyone inside! You had better remove that pipe so you may live longer! Just giving you sound advice from a scientist/engineer!
in nz they do this to heat there water . they run a pipe to the roof . if it over heats water just pushes out and runs down the roof to th ground . like a vent for your drains . simple and cool . it just coiled once or twin the back corner .
If you bend it as close to the ends as you can, then cut off the unbendable end 4" bits you can avoid the big fight with the join by having it already uniformly bent first
They have a tool for that. In a pinch you could use a conduit bender.
m Hoppe don't know that that would work radius on a 3/4 emt bender is 8 inches so that would only take him down to a 16 inch internal diameter.
TheOldGunsmith58 ‘
kinks can be taken out easily with an adjustable wrench, start at a good section and set the size of the wrench, then slowly work back and forth towards the kink and you'll be almost round again!
Good tip.
I love this idea. I am a mechanical contractor and the only advice is instead of a hammer use a pair of pliers to take out kinks.....Great Idea!
I saw a video on a similar topic. The TRIZ trick to eliminate the problem of crimping the copper coil when bending it is - wait for it - wait for it ... Answer: Putting water in the coil and FREEZING IT. That way, when the coil is bent, the ice inside of it keeps it from crimping.
seems to me if you throw a 10 inch stovepipe over top to trap heat and it will make a better exchanger. love this video
just wrap in in some good house insulation tape it and it should do the same for less dollars
Thanks for the vid, gave me some ideas. As far as all the negative "engineers" who don't know how to actually accomplish anything with their own hands or know his intentions or means....well...your opinions mean absolutely nothing :) As long as we still have people like this guy in the vid, maybe America still has a chance.
This is a old application but very successful, love this guys video's keep up the good work
OMG it was painful watching him slide that pvc T around and around 50 ft just to unkink pipe. im a refrigeration tech for 25 yrs now. the absolute best way to remove kink from any size any schedule copper stick or tubing is with 1 tool. thats right any size, schedule, and type and only 1 tool. that tool is in every single mans box and it's a south carolina socket set (10 inch adjustable wrench) put the wrench at a good part of pipe and adj to fit pipe. then dont change wrench size and put it on flat part of kink and rotate back and forth. move left and right thru kink as you rotate back and forth. keep doing this til the wrench will do a 360 around pipe. you sir now have a round pipe again...your welcome. btw, i did thos same exact thing to my shop 15 yrs ago for free hot water to wash up with. 15 yrs later, its still going strong and free. still no water heater in shop and dont need one. never had a problem with copper breakdown, never a leak, never a rusted flue pipe. all my pipe is 24 yrs old. no difference in ash or creosote buildup inside from before to after inventing my little free water heater. and no difference in how stove temp heats or cools down. its really just free use of a waste product. i even have a fan blowing across my pipe and copper to spread the heat across shop. it makes the shop warmer much faster. i clean it out every other yr and maybe get half of a 5 gallon bucket of ash...now thats efficient and thats also using your noggin.
Michael Collins
Michael Collins
PLEASE make a Video !!!
Michael Collins
You tube
You tube
Michael Collins thanks for the wrench Tip. How many gallons of water and approximate temperature could you get in a set up like this guy put together approximately? Thank you from the sand hills of North Carolina
You remind me of my dad. Hard work, smart work = great job. You seem very innovative. I would like to try this. Thank you for the video. It was very helpful. Just what I was looking for. Thanks again.
i haven't read the comments but to my experience, once you heat a pipe when sodering it becomes weaker on the heated part so is better to roll both pieces before sodering, and using an electrical tube bender makes things easier
Someone may have mentioned this in the comments but to help prevent it from kinking use sugar and fill the copper tube and crimp the ends . When you are done wrapping it cut off the crimped ends ,throw it in the tub and pour boiling water on it and and it will dissolve the sugar . Sand is cheapest but I find it doesn't always come out as easy as you would like it .. Salt works too and that can be a pain in the ass also .
125 ft of rolled copper
Filled w sugar
Hmmmm
No
@J thats how they make brass wind instruments (trumpets)
Sand works good, but not just any sand. Use the same 80 grit that a sheet rock finisher will use for skip trowel.
The reason it linked is because he overheated the copper when he soldered it can just tell he’s not too good at soldering (I’m a plumber) best way to fix a kink is to squeeze the pipe in a flaring block
Thanks
That looks like a condenser for a moonshine still.
That trick with the Tee to unkink the pipe was worth watching. I seriously needed to know that.
An easier way to fix copper tubing that is out of round is to use a Crescent wrench. Open it up not quite as wide as the widest part of the oval, put on the tubing and start working the wrench back and forth like you are freeing a rusted nut as you work your way over the oval. Tighten the jaws a little and do it over until round. After you've done this a couple times it is fast and easy to do. Hope I explained it well enough to help someone out in the future.
"Now that it's gettin on to headin toward winter..."
Reminds me of a southern boy I knew who'd say "it's fixin to gettin on toward being almost lunchtime." Which meant about 11:55.
"lunchtime" from a southern boy?....suspect...11:55?....nah
It finna be dinna
FOR ANYONE WANTING TO KNOW HOW THIS WORKS....cold water goes in top or bottom, out to hot water heater, and back into house...basically its heating the water, as it goes into hot water heater, so all the heater has to do is keep the water at temp, instead of heating it from cold to start..personally id go bottom to top though, as the water gets hot it will help pump itself up and out.
in bottom out top natural circulation heat rises cold sinks.
I'm definitely doing this for my tiny home, thank you!
Great idea and looks better than an old stove pipe as well. Hook up a solar panel, water pump? Showing the output temperature would be a plus. Blessings!
my family home had one of these when i was very young. that water was so damn hot all the time. worked insanely well.
Would be a good idea to add a Thermostatic Mixing Valve to this kind of setup.
www.watts.com/resources/references-tools/thermostatic-mixing-valves
Ive wanted to do something like this for my barn. Not to have hot water in my sinks or anything but to pump through the concrete floors and have heated floors in the winter.
chefdan87 look into pex floor heat if you mean to encase the pipe in concrete
This guy heats! What a great idea !
Did the water pump through the floor for heat? This is exactly what I want to do for a small cottage. I'd love to see\hear ideas of how this would work?
I know a guy who did that in his garage, as soon as the water froze all his underfloor heating pipes burst. You can't use water if there is a risk of freezing..
@@ydnark83 Most radiant floor systems recommend using a propylene glycol solution. Or run of the mill antifreeze like you would run in you car. That way you don't have to worry about it freezing if you don't heat round the clock.
Chemical reaction from copper to galvanized pipe, small pin holes will form in the copper
Maybe a thin layer of silicone sprayed or some heat resistant painting on the stovepipe will prevent that....something like Thurmalox f.e. www.dampney.com/Product-Line/AT/ViewType/PTID/23
Ryan P in 6 years it has not happened yet to mine
They make these bending springs for copper tube. They prevent kinks altogether.
And how are you gonna get it trough the pipe, and when you're bending how do you know where the spring is?
@@lukie4ever it goes on the outside of the pipe
so for the future, take a torch and heat the copper tubing to around 350-400 degrees. That will anneal it so it bends real easy. You can just start at one end and work your way to opposite end. Once it gets hot you can/will need to move faster. If you're using Oxy-Acetelyne torch, take the torch and light it without any oxygen. Wave the sooty flame over the material, leaving behind soot on the copper. Then add Oxygen for a proper flame and begin heating the tubing. When the copper reaches 350-400 degrees F. the soot will magically disappear, letting you know you've reached the critical temperature. DO NOT quench the tubing with water, I don't care what anyone else says, just let it cool naturally. Now you can bend it much easier than before. This also works with Aluminum tubing, and believe it or not, Brass tubing as well. Peace to All.
+WelLRoundeDSquarE I agree, your right. I do this every day, and yes it does work very very well. I was making props for a tv commercial and needed a clean bend right in the middle of 1/2" solid aluminum rod 6061-T6 (that is the hardness rating), and even after a a simple MAPP gas torch without bottled oxygen I was able to bend just the torched section over my knee. This was after letting it cool naturally. The rod only bent right at the torch area only. looked beautiful and was still very strong without cracking. Thanx WelRoundeDSquarE!
Man you are one tough dude. I would have bought two steel tubes one bigger than the other. I would have the flue gas in smalker one and water jacketing with the bigger tube. Simple! You just increased the price of copper!
Without a way to modulate the heat from the smoke pipe, the water will boil and create a serious hazard. without a relief valve installed, that hazard goes from a scalding hazard to an explosion hazard. This is no joke.
I suggest anyone reading this to look up the safety training video of a water heater going off with no heat control and no relief valve. If I told you what happens in the video, you wouldn't believe me or think I was exaggerating. Let's just say "you'll be impressed". In the early days of steam heating, the industry averaged 1 death per day.
There is a name for uncontrolled pressure/energy in a closed vessel. It's called a BOMB. Think it through VERY carefully.
True enough. I suppose the next best thing is to actually set this thing up with a Combo PRV/RELIEF Valve and maybe even an expansion tank like a #15 Amtrol.
Alexander Grimsmo The size of the explosion is related to the amount of energy released, not so much as volume. 5 gallon failure of a thin walled vessel is nothing compared to a 5 gallon thick walled vessel. Like I said, think it through carefully. There are more than a few guys (and gals for that matter) around, maybe you know a friend that knows a friend who could look over your design? Tell ya what though, besides a proper relief valve, find a scrap length of baseboard fin tube and plumb that in at a good spot. That stuff is VERY thin walled. Might be a good secondary 'weak spot'. As you can tell, I'm ALL about safety. Been working in this trade for well, seems like forever. Safety is everything. Good luck. Drop a post when you get it fired up. Be good to know it all worked out OK.
If you have water fed t it no problem. I stayed with someone who had a separate fire to heat up the coil and as long as the water flowed you were good to go, but you cut the water off and the pipe started banging and shaking and then if you turned the water back on you had pure steam come out for quit a while.
john hanrahan
i did this in my shop 15 yrs ago around my stove pipe...will not hurt a thing. 40 ft shop so by time it gets to sink, its hot just like a house...no where near boiling. no pop offs needed, no safety needed. just good common sense and engineering. pipe size vs pipe length and it all dissapates evenly thruout the copper. i have 150 ft of coil but only 100 is on pipe and 50 is coiled up 3 ft downstream away from stove and thats the difference between an engineer and someone just guessing. its all about having a place for all that hot water to mix back with some cold water and other way around. mine last little over 3 mins and its free. 15 yrs later and never a leak, or any other problem with the lines. they still look new. stove temp and flue buildup are no different than the 10 yrs prior to me making it either.
Freeze water in the coil then bend it. Remains circular.
if u ever want to bend soft copper tubing pack the tubing with sand
If you had a wood lathe you could do that on low speed on the lathe. Anchor the start point, don't bother to reform the copper from pancake to loose-coil, pass the outer end of the pancake onto a former (can be wood you've lathed down to shape) and pass the copper tube from the pancake through that white plastic 'T' you have and showed us (anchor it to the lathe tool post) and with slow speed you will wind that soft copper onto the former. (former as in a shape that something else is being formed to). But, looking at the end result of what you did, I'd say that a professional job couldn't be better. Absolute marvel you are. And, I'm going to make one of these. Thanks for show us all here. 7.531 million views, well done lad!
I want to win the lottery so I can buy a bunch of land and build a pond and have a stove pipe hot water for the pond in the winter with a filtration system and water pumps to keep the pond toasty. I hope this would work. My pond will be 100 ft long x 50 ft wide deep end 15ft with a reataining wall at the one end. Take of all the trees, and grow food for the deer and other animals. Lots of permissions, apples and native plants they eat.
Here is a trick that will work alot better. If temos are below freezing kink one end then fill with water, let it freeze over night and whamo it bends like a charm without altering copper pipe shape. Good luck!
i hear filling it with sand, capped on both ends, serves the same purpose.
As a 25 + years as well driller I've seen many a frozen pipe, open ended or not and all they did was freeze and split the copper!
Yea it will do that at times but not all the time. If a person does not have a bender this is an alternative.
I've heard but not tried using fine fish tank sand in the pipe will let it bend how ever you want it to bend. But what the ----- do I know. GL.
John King
I think the basic idea is to have some type of pressure from the inside of the pipe, whether it be water or sand, or whatever. I have my concerns about ice though, had to many busted pipes in winter.
That's a cool, old , truck, they go forever n ever.
What year/model is that? I love it!
@Brock Main3 I hear that....ok....n thanx for responding.
They are super hard to come bye
Yees i now right.
When joining another length of copper tube, cut the strait end of the coil off and cut the strait piece off the second coil then join them together.. Now no kink in the coil.;
We did that as a graduation project in the 90s, BsE. Put the pipe in a big lathe and fed copper through the window. Got about 1 kW out of it at peak value
Ours was just the first piece of copper, about 1 meter long winding
to prevent kinking use a propane torch and gradually heat 12" both directions from your bends it will allow the copper to be more mauable and less likely to kink............hope this helps great vid by the way
Cool, but it does rob the heat for drafting properly. Especially conductive is copper and any other metal which conducts electricity well.
Check.
Steve Foley
Then ground the pipe
Steve, electricity and heat are apples and oranges. That said, I think I get what you were talking about initially. I think you were wondering if too much heat was being lost into the copper, which might slow down the exhaust air simply because it would be cooler, and therefore not rise as fast. If that's what you meant, it would not be a problem, because this type of heat scavenging would likely be so little that the air rising up the stack would still be plenty hot and keep the firebox breathing just fine.
One thing to consider, though, is that the copper might keep that section of pipe cool enough that smoke and creosote could condense out onto the inner wall, building up enough to be a problem and a fire danger if it got thick enough to ignite and cause a chimney fire.
I love it, but what about the dissimilar metals? The electrolysis between the gal and the copper?
I thought this video was about how to build a device that produces green copper salts over an extended period of time.
could've used a 45 instead of straight coupling
unless you're using a thermosiphon, any sharp bends are bad news!
I'm a old gas man from years ago used it allot they do make a small flexable slinky looking device that slices over Cooper tubing to help you with out crimping the copper comes in all sizes works pretty good !
Looks like the moonshine distiller is coming along fine.....
Thanks IRon, I love how hard you work on things, hi Barney 👋🏻
Dang, I felt for you when you put that kink into it. All those perfect bends and then an instant bottleneck.
Get some playground sand, it's a lot finer, fill the tube with sand before you roll it it will keep it shape.
Still seems like it would take a month to get all the sand out..
110 % for effort, really glad you use the old 3/4" dia pipe, we've gone soft and use 22mm yuck. Greetings from Cornwall.
Bet it worked. Anything to get heat from one place to another. Put it where you need it. Good job Kid!
too cool haha... I subb'd at "Where'd my hammer go?"... I been there!
Looks like a good way to make a still lol
Randall Berry well in effect it is a condenser coil working in reverse
Yup..I also saw a worm happening there. It's got to have a massive flake stand...lol
Great video, thank you, I may use this with my new home made woodburner. Just a thought, could you made the join in the tube using a 135 or 90 degree coupling? Of course the join would stick out but could look neat if done well and could avoid the kinking. Nice work anyway. I've built my own stoves for a long time and have put a lot of thought into them. Good wishes, John
just a suggestion. Copper is soft, as you know, but when I have to continue (lengthen) a copper pipe.....anout 2 inches from my coupler I anneal the copper....heat to a dull cherry red then slowly cool. This (now softer) copper tubing has FAR less of a chance kinking. great project!!
great idea...hook it up to a hot water tank or a 30 gallon plastic barrel....you can hook a 12 volt water pump to circulate the water through the system...awesome thanks
Isn't filling the pipe w/ sand or ice use to bend pipe like that, eliminating the kinking problem??
sand can be hard to removed sometimes. salt works like magic.
if you fill the pipe with water and freeze it it will prevent it pipe from kinking
Daniel Leonard fill it with water and freeze it and it will split
@@larrycurrier290 Even if it didn't split (which I think would happen), trying to bend copper pipe full of solid ice would wind up cracking the pipe from the ice trying to bend it.
Watch the videos with ice, it works.
It does work. Pipe won't split if it's open on both ends. Problem is, how does he get 60ft of 3/4 in his freezer? It wasn't cold enough yet where he was
Galvanized steel reacts with copper... Heat will accelerate this process....
Dissimilar metals don't play well together!
@@oldschoolman1444 There's a limit to the reaction, possibly. There might be a layer where the galvanized material has copper infusion, but stops short of causing a problem. Not sure about this, but going on the fact that galvanized steel hangers are used for pressure treated lumber ( containing copper) without problems.
Cool set up,This will work for short term usage only,Within 2 years the copper and galvy will have a hydrolysis reaction causing the copper to leak.
I was a warranty tech for softub the electric motor was wound the same way and insulated with mastic and a fiberglass wrap. This is how they heated the water so efficiently...
I just did a spot check of this tubing on Amazon. You're looking at roughly $600 worth of copper. Now, it begs the question, how long will it take for this project to pay for itself?
My thumbnail calculation is that, in my situation, it may pay for itself in 2 years, and then save $290/year thereafter.
Assumptions: this coil essentially replaces a propane hot water heater, and I already use the firewood whose heat I am harnessing for this.
1) my propane hot water heater cost $700. I expect it will be depreciated to $0 value in no more than 10 years. So I have a built in capital cost of $70/year over the life of the heater, plus the lost alternative investment income of the loss of $700.
2) Alternatively, the copper coil may well last indefinitely, and its $600 cost will not depreciate to nothing. So the capital cost of the copper will be both less and is spread over a greater time period. Let's say you live another 30 years and use it all during that time, for an annual cost of $20/year, plus the lost alternative investment income of the loss of $600 (-) the non-trivial end-of-period scrap value of the copper. Let us assume that the appreciating scrap value of the copper cancels out the time value of money calc. So $20/year.
3) Then there is the cost of propane vs firewood. The propane could be a non-trivial annual expense, but let us assume $240/year, or $10/mo. In the alternative, if your firewood is gathered/not purchased, then your cost is the pro rata value of your free time and any tools (such as a splitter) you may use. Since you probably will not be using much/any more firewood, it is possible that your added firewood cost is $0.
Upshot: This stovepipe hot water heater might save $50/year in capital cost, plus $240/year in fuel cost, for a total of $290/year in savings.
Therefore, in my situation, I calculate that the copper material cost of $600 might pay for itself in a little more than 2 years, and then save me $290/year thereafter.
Just a hint: if you cool down the exhaust gases of your stove pipe too much, the exhaust gas wont ascend as intended - that might cause carbon monoxide to stockpile in your living room and intoxicate you
so keep a CO alarm around if you make such thing
Did you miss the part where he explained this is just capturing the heat radiating off the pipe, the heat that has already escaped into the room anyway?
Nevir202 yes, and this cools the pipe and the exhaust gas down - qed
suit1337
No more so than the air of the room already does since it isn't going to be touching the pipe when installed. He is using that pipe as a mandrel to make it over sized, it says it's not going to touch the pipe when installed in the description.
By your logic standing by the fireplace is lowering the temperature of the exhaust. -_-
Nevir202 the copper pipe with the water in it creates an extra heat drain, it drains the heat exacly like a water cooling system would do - in fact, it is a walter cooling system - even if it does not touch, the system carrys away way more enery than it would, when there was just air around
and yes, standing by the fireplace in fact lowers the temperature, since a human body has more thermal conductivity and thermal capacity than air and is cooler than the exhaust - of course this is not signifikant, since it is not close - but the more and more close you go to the pipe or even touch it, the more energy you would drain
this is not "my" logic, this is a simple thermodynamics problem where the first and second law applys: the internal energy of both systems is different (exhaust hot, air and pipe cold) - the systems want do be leveled - if the cool part has a greater thermal conductivity, capacity or even carries the energy out of the system (like the pipe does), then the energy of the first system gets carried faster away
suit1337
And yet you completely ignore that the heat captured by this already left the exhaust system and reached the pipe either by radiation or convection through the air.
Unless he is piping freezing cold water in which is actually lowering the air temp around the pipe it simply isn't going to do anything appreciable. You may as well complain about him using water in his house at all as the cool water entering the house is cooling the entire room which is lowering the exhaust temp. Most stove pipes I've ever seen go outside where I guarantee it's a lot colder than it is in the house.
You saying that standing near the stove is lowering the temperature may be technically true in the most hypothetical mathematical sense but it has NO real word application as the difference is imperceptibly tiny. What do you think it would be 1/100th of a degree? I bet it would be even less, even if you put bodies encircling the pipe just inches away.
My wife wants your truck!!!!
Generals Gila
No, when the truck showed up she said, "I want that truck!?
***** I want that truck- and yes I am a wife.
onetwothree57 .. GM should wake up and recreate their glory days
Jax Kat They can't make stuff that looks like that anymore with all of these pedestrian safety laws and such. The torpedoes on the front at chest height won't be very good for that.
I havn't read wjat anyone else wrote but if you dry fit the nest schedule K with the coupling and then did the bend, it is less likely to kink. Once bent, then back up a bit if necessary or leave in place when you solder. Heat tends to anneal the copper (so does bending - called heat-work because bending causes the copper to heat slightly) and make it stiffer so it is more likely to kink at the next soft point. OK, not easy if you can't pull on it! But that's where your ingenuity comes in. The heat-work thing becomes more obvious when working with large diameter copper wire. Maybe it's just easier to "unkink" with the PVC.
Awesome video I’m pretty sure you’re the guy that sold me my blue Chevy truck. The light blue square body.
Wouldn't the heat from the fire melt the solder? Sil fos would be a better because it has a higher melting point than the solder.
If thats a concern 95/5 will do just perfect...
harris 15, buddy
shouldn't this be titled "How to bend copper tubing?"
Funny how only two of us noticed that.
Shows ya how many dumb asses are out there. Lemmings?
for the cost of two rolls of copper tubing that size you can just about buy any water heater you want and pay the bills for several years
Costs around 100usd for 40ft
You, sir, are brilliant, and I can' thank you enough. I messed up my first attempt to bend copper pipe for my mountain "hillbilly" hot tub. I have some old stove piping and am going to try this. I knew You Tube would save me
When it 'kinks' in the coil maybe a tubing bender would help, but when it's right near the end or beginning, cut it, try again. It's probably the heat from the soldering that weakened the metal in that area. Don't put the connection on the curve, go up straight, over and down. You can fill the tube with sand or any grain you can wash out easily before bending, to stop 'kinking' too. We have to make stuff up in Canada too. Red Green is the Master.
I made one years ago and it heated my entire 25' x 45' pool but I owned a tree company
Keep it rusty.why would you want chrome?
Allow me to guess the details that you forgot ...
You owned a tree company, which provided enough firewood to keep a swimming pool heated?
@@marshalllhiepler I don't think that's what he meant. I suspect it means the chrome peeled off from heat or something like that... But yeah, details would be nice.
Just so you know, the galvanized pipe you're using isn't stove pipe, it's heavy GA. SLP (snap lock pipe). You don't wanna use it as stove pipe, it's very dangerous, the reason being it will melt, it's a soft steel not made for high heat applications, it's made for HVAC, round ductwork, it's what real "Tinners" use, craftsman that care about their work, instead of using flex duct. The pipe is also toxic, if it doesn't melt on ya, the galvanized, creosote, heat, and moisture combined make a toxic corrosive acid that will eat that pipe up quickly. Many a home has been burnt to the ground because of it, usually it happens before bed you'll load the stove up, damper the fire back and hit the hay, 2:00 am a pinhole will open up, and it'll start sucking air, next thing ya know your either dead from the smoke or the flames. Next problem is the copper touching the pipe, hello electrolysis, goodbye copper, and pipe. The fix is form the copper around a 9" pipe or a 10" then slip your copper coil over the 8" pipe..Then find some ceramic floor tiles cut it into 1" x 12" strips, use them as spacers/insulators to keep the copper from touching the pipe, fasten the tile to the copper 3 strips evenly spaced, before you cut the tile drill a couple holes in each strip so you can fasten them with copper wire to the copper coil, get em tight so they don't rattle from expanding and contracting. Now to solve the moisture problem. Get some 12" pipe and put it over the coil, it'll need spacer as well, what your doing is making a double wall pipe with a the coil it the middle, make sure and cap the top so the heat stays in, you can stuff some rock wool between the outside pipe and the out side of the coil, don't put it in between the inside pipe and inside of the coil, this will be your heat exchanger. Yes it will take a little longer to heat, but it will be safe and lasting. 3/4 or even 5/8 would have been easier than that 7/8, just saying. Oh, you can pick up a spring bender on eBay for less than $15, just saying.. Good luck.
hi Kurt sounds like you're like my Dad retired Union Pipe fitter. I like to learn how to do radiant heat.My Dad told them not to do the ac and heat when building house in 63 basement concrete floor is heated under a pore floor and kitchen under tile.I asked him to teach me but being Italian, he told me no cuz I was a girl.I know a lot from watching him.I managed the apt.I live for 12 yr.just cuz of some things I know but later he had the maintenance guy do my portion cuz I can't lift heavy stuff.Thanks Deb
Have you read what is in the description area?
haha, got emm ^
Kurt Ballard
Millions of views and no part 2???
I am a HVAC professional and next time you have a kink in your line use a pair of channel lock pliers . Set the channel lock to about 1 inch and squeeze them just enough on the pinched ends and the copper will round back out . You can also turn them and let them slid around as you apply pressure on them they will easily remove the kink from your copper.
Next time remove the blade from a pair of tubing cutters and clamp them on the pipe where it's kinking before you bend it down and as you pull the tubbing cutter will keep it from kinking and you can use it to get the kink out . Use it without the blade and turn it around the kink but first you start on the two flat sharp side so as you tighten the handle it compresses the kink , once your done you can spin to to round it out even more . That will also remove the kink . Use a small no handle tubbing cutter not the big baulky one . I hope this helps you the next time you make a mountain man water heater . Thank you .
Thanks Ed!
Make a still next...you got the right technique....that will keep you warm
btw change the name of the video from stovepipe water heater to making coil for stovepipe water heater
how did this end up working bud? did yas get er finished?
My guess is that solder joint popped a leak the first time he heated it up. Stove pipe temperatures run around 450-550F, solder melts (depending on type) between 350-425F.
Solder will only melt with no water; try to solder a joint with water in it- you can't get it hot enough to melt unless all the water is out.
@@eugenepearson4467 - It's not that copper soldered joints won't melt with water, it's that along with the copper itself, water often can act as an effective heat sink and dissipate the heat from a single torch (even w/ MAP) elsewhere relatively quickly. Now, what if, under pressure, the water superheats to 425F? The solder will melt and open joints. Here's some documentation from the Copper Development Association that states 250ºF is the maximum temperature for soldered joints (Brazing the joint would be the proper joining method): www.copper.org/applications/plumbing/techcorner/cu_tube_steam_systems.html
@@eugenepearson4467 Do NOT put a torch on a pipe with water in it. Not unless you like flying shrapnel. Water expands, turns to steam, expands more, BOOM. Less than enjoyable rest of day.
@@paulchilders9969 We can't tell from this but I'd assume that there was a pressure release safety valve in the system anyway.
I can not believe you have 5 million views on this lol oh by the way to keep that from kinking solder valve ends on that and fill it with water then shut the valves when your done just cut them off
But how do you fit a 42" diameter in a chest freezer?
ElderlyIron
Use water under capped ends. Not ice.
Bad plumbing
fill with sand wont kink
approaching 7.2 million now!!
i have never had soot ( creosote ) problems yet with mine and my stack is only 6", all i do is give it a oil forced burnout every month , flute and vents open for 15 minutes also heats the stove up quick if after quick cabin warmth , so i support ChiefJustice Middleton on this 1 , i put a cover sleeve over my copper pipe to retain the stack heat better so the copper pipe heates better
Would love to watch future work in progress