Why change the design,leaving it as is guarantees the company lots of parts sales and keeps the dealers and repair shops busy. In my 40 years as a shop owner we've seen this over and over again,especially with European cars.
After the Previa were on the road a while, we started getting calls for the accessory drive shaft. Toyota only sold the whole unit...expensive. One old mechanic in my area had me research the sizes of flex joints that Dorman had. One of the BMW discs fit perfectly.
Funny my irritation list is. Front rotors bolted in from behind means wheel bearing service to do rotors. Some rotors have pad retention done with those spring steel circlips those suck the ones with the little cotter pins way better. Rear axles factory you gotta open the diff after market have flanges with torx bits way nicer to replace. Bolts from behind for AC compressor with spacers? Sucks. Doing a guibo make sure you spline the drive shaft halves in the same orientation! No concentric hubs on brakes better have the wheel stud tool handy! Starter on a turbo diesel better have some looong extensions
Bravo for the last couple of videos. David Long “the Wizard” did great job of describing down to the individual item where the issues were and also demonstrating how they are pattern failures, also known as failures known to happen across many models and model years. He also emphasized these are issues that typically appear after many years of regular service. This is a subtle and notable improvement in how the subjects of his videos are presented. And it was done efficiently. Great job! Thank you and your great wife for all the work you do to make these videos better and better. Hope the trend continues.
Yup! I mean, you could probably design a car with solid metal engine mounts that you'd never have to replace, but it would be uncomfortable! If the things last a decade and you have to replace them, sure it's an added cost! But if it offers a superior ride to a part that lasts 50 years (way beyond what any daily driver would last) then it's a pretty good design, so long as it's known that they wear out.
A very balanced view, Car Wizard. I was thinking, why in heck don't Mercedes change the design. But you went to great pains to explain it's just wear that come with age. Great video, thanks.
What you say is not true. This problem arises after many years and continuous use of the car in adverse weather conditions. I bought a Mercedes W108 from my university professor fifteen years ago, and after a while, the exact same problem happened to that car when it was forty years old. The important thing is that the design is so clever that you can easily fix the problem by replacing one or two small parts and drive again for years without problems.@@cruiser6260
Just did the motor and trans mounts on my 230k mile clk55 ohh what a difference! I wouldn’t call them failing at 80-100k miles a problem as they play a big part in that smooth Mercedes ride quality. They’re super soft by design and not a break my wallet fix.
Beautiful car. Hope you get many more miles out of it. I’ve got 142k on my E550 myself and it runs like a dream. I straight piped it to make it even more fun to drive haha
@@Smarterthanyou-mthrfkr yeah that was one of the first things I did when I bought it a couple years ago. I was chasing a rattle in the front wheel area which ended up being a missing anti rattle clip on the brake caliper (duh!). The bilstein’s are a great oem+ upgrade.
A great video Carwizard, absolutely correct in saying these components are not faulty and that it is age/oil/contaminents which takes it's toll on the rubber components of them. Mercedes have been using the Giubo (flex disk) system for many decades on the propshafts of their cars, my dad's 1954 170D used them, with great success and is ultimately much smoother than a hard steel roller bearing cv joint as found in lesser marques. The items you mention in your video ought to be replaced (as you would shock absorbers, brakes etc) to maintain the smooth running of your Mercedes-Benz as a matter of course and should not be ignored.
The rubber discs are to absorb vibration.And so the force are lower for the gearcraft. You change the rubber discs and therfore the gearcraft lasts longer.
I love the fact that you don't spend 30-60 seconds or more of the video talking about BendPak, their products, warranties and "the amazing discount on the website with my code". You mention that they were sent to you, you show how you use it, and get straight back to what you were talking about. It makes it a lot more pleasant to watch and I can see that you're a shop owner - you don't want to waste time, whether it's your time or ours.
The cracks in those flex discs are not bad. The reason many shops sell those prematurely (if you ever take your Mercedes to the dealer they will tell you that you need flex discs even if only the paint on them is cracked) is that some cars in the 80’s and 90’s would crack to the point of failure ( which is WAY beyond these) and when they failed, the driveshaft would hit the tunnel and set off the airbags. I have been working on Mercedes for nearly 20 years and I also own one and I would be perfectly OK having those flex discs on my car. The engine and trans mounts however are junk.
A timely video Wizard. I was sitting at a stop light in my ML 350 and feeling this vibration through the car. Now I know what to look for. Many thanks!
I had a 15 year old Chevy Impala where the universal joint failed, it was easy to fix, compact, lightweight, oil dripping didn't affect it, it didn't dry up cuz there is no rubber. universal joint > flex joint
I had a 1985 230e and on New Year’s Day 1994 on a run out with a then girlfriend, I found out all about those rear flexi disks breaking! 😁 Still can’t believe to this day that I found a garage open and able to fix it before my 120 mile return journey. But your very right in your assessment that it’s more a European manufacturer type part
Thank you as a diesel guy I've kind of always wanted one of the old 300D turbos to turn into a toy and I certainly learned quite a bit about the Mercedes driveline I didn't know in this video
I replaced the flex disc on our 1969 W108 in 1980 for the second time. I found it impossible to replace the engine mounts in an R129 without hoisting the engine and transmission nearly out of the car!
Great video, Wizard. I’ve been around the block a few times with these issues... 1987 190D 2.5 turbo, 1987 300 SDL, 1991 350 SDL, and a 2004 VW Touareg V10 TDI. Same exact issues.
@Car Wizard, I have an 01 E320 and sure enough, it's vibrating. Albeit this one, for now, is only vibrating when in D at a standstill, but I am planning to replace the motor and transmission mounts and flex disks on it. Thank you so much for this video, as I did not even know about the flex disks until now.! Again and again, THANK YOU!!!
I had a 1974 Mercedes 280C, Eurospec brought back from Germany., No power windows or seats, no sunroof, not even an AM radio! Has the model 110 I6 dohc engine. Thin chrome bumpers and halogen headlights. Fast for an old 6 cyl, I had it up to 220kmh on the 5. Racetrack sized air filter. Independent suspension worked well. 0-60 in 7 seconds. Also had a 1976 280 SE with mechanical fuel injection. They have plenty of sound insulation so if you get any rust out in the floor it acts as a sponge, this is why they fog up when parked.
I too had a 67 230S. The same driveline technology as far newer cars. Under the hood, our cars far far easier to work on for sure. Mine had a floor mounted shifter for the 4 speed manual. Our cars had the legendary safety cone door lock latches. A point of pride for Mercedes. They are long gone on newer models. Gone also are the huge three point door hinges with greasing nipples. Too much hand fitment for either item. Just keep increasing the price and removing mechanical quality along the way. These are the times we live in.
Great rundown of the Mercedes issues, Mr. Wizard. FYI: The motor mounts on my 1994 Chevy S-10 pickup collapsed TWICE in 9 years! Dropped it so much the cooling fan was hitting the shroud both times.
I learned my lesson with Chevrolet in my 1985 Eurosport station wagon, my last GM product. At 105,000 miles, 6years old, everything seemed to go wrong.....Rust (car was Rusty Jones undercoated) was taking over, engine had stalling problems that no one could fix, etc. Jim PS.....bought a new Vega station wagon, bought a new Citation......both junk cars.....only good one was 66 Chevell SS396 convertible.
Just had to change motor mounts and transmission mounts in my son’s 2012 c350 with only 80,000 miles. When I saw the estimate because the engine had to come out, I was floored because it had only 80k miles and 8 years old. While I had no choice but to do the work, seeing this video makes me feel better because I know it wasn’t me who drove the car for the first 5 years of its life or my son, it’s just a typical Mercedes issue. My wallet does still hurt...
Chrysler used the exact same flex disk in there LX cars as mercedes and even had the mercedes logo on them. There interchangeable and you can save at least half compared to getting them from the mercedes dealer.
Thanks to this video I can help a friend who has a 2007 Mercedes E280 with a very similar issue. The car is by no means a daily driver but I remember he told me about the issue like a month ago (and I'm pretty sure the car has months without moving) and now I just saw this specific Car Wizard's video. I'll tell him to go to a mechanic and get the engine/transmission mounts/flex discs checked.
You know what's interesting to me? I used to own a Chrysler Crossfire, which was an SLK320 underneath. Suffered from drive line vibration too. Never tried to replace it, wish I had though. If only I saw this video when owning the car all those years back!
There are a raft of other common problems with Merc too. Try the injector black death issue and seriously difficult glow plug removal, head stud problems, all very expensive. Many cars that use centre tailshaft bearings have failures in that part too. Recommended fix buy a new tailshaft for huge $$$$$
I had one and it did not vibrate a bit. It did run hot...I tuned in to see if that was what you would say. Great ride and handling and would do a u turn on a dime...not the least vibration...it just ran hot!
Great info. I’ve had multiple MB’s in the past and currently have 2 which I’m going to check and see how they’re doing in this department. Thanks for sharing!
Yup I drove my buddy’s 540i the other day and he told me not to gun it in first gear otherwise the flex discs would cause the whole car to vibrate. He wasn’t lying. His flex discs are fucked
"have no issues with it" Yet! You will have exactly the same issues sooner or later, you have a low mileage car. There is nothing wrong with them needing replaced and it's a DIY job 👍
@@WeeShoeyDugless I wonder how much keeping a car in a garage has to do with with life span of these parts, the BMW and my 06 Benz have been garaged since day one
LOL !! I knew exactly what your were going to talk about before you did! I have a 2000 E 320 (W210) All 3 have been changed on my car too. When I bought it, the motor mounts and transmission mounts had been changed but I needed to change the flex discs. I tried a China part first and it failed 100 % with a bang at under 1,500 miles of use. The OEM part was 50% more in cost but it came with a 1 year free replacement parts and LABOR should it fail and that is even if I installed it myself. Well worth the cost of OEM parts. The discs I did at about 98000 miles and 19 years old.
I've also had to replace these items on every BMW ive ever owned. With the BMW's i've worked on the only additional thing was the differential bushings, they would fail and lead to a clunk in the rear on acceleration and when parking.
I Hear Ya Brother Have Owned my 2000 CLK 430 for 15years and I replaced all of those items on my car when I bought it and replaced every 5years on Mine because a Master Mercedes Tech told me about these issues I have gotten very good at changing these parts 🤟🏻🤟🏻🤟🏻🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
@@md2k8 the RL is actually one of the greatest cars ever made, it was built like a bank vault and will run forever, first to show the SH AWD drivetrain, even had a carbon fibre driveshaft. Comparing it to it’s competition in 2020 it’s deafest reliable while 5 series and e class are in junk yards
@@KushPizzaSleep The older, 1999 to 2003 RL's and the 2015 to 2020 TLX's are a not to buy. The 2016 and newer ILX's with the dual-clutch automatic transmission is also a not to buy. The RSX is still a good vehicle to buy.
The W108 did have a worse flaw in that the centre mount was not easily replaced. It seems MB had addressed it, and I am glad they did. I must remember to have my S124 checked at some point.
When I bought my '05 SL500, she had a bad motor mount. I replaced all 3, knowing if one went, the other two wern't far behind. Oil can tear those rubber pieces up pretty quick, too. Thanks, Wizard!!!
Something important to keep in mind when dealing with bad flex discs in that not only they cause vibrations, they can wreck the whole car if they fail at high speeds. When they fail at high speeds, the drive shaft destroys the back of the transmission, the transmission tunnel and carpets and even can tear the whole shift selector and parts of the center console out of the car.
Lol my brother had to replace his motor mounds on his 2007 E-320. Drove like a champ once he fixed it tho! I love early 2000’s Benz! Such a classic look
my MB mech friend said MB's biggest fail was the intro of 190's and other entry level cars,, people got one and first repair bill, were in over their head ,, so were turnin the keys in or taking a huge loss unloading it
Great video as usual. Really its all standard service parts. There is not a car on the road that wont need some or all of these parts in its first 15 years. Love your bluntness, 1. worth the Fix, Fix it. 2. Don't Bother to fix get rid of it....
The only problem with this channel is that I've watched every video the Car Wizard ever put out already. The Car Wizard is my favourite channel on RUclips and I'm not even a car guy (apart from Alfa Romeo Giulietta which I'll probably be burried in). Its a pity there isn't a Motorcycle Wizard channel :-(
Love the ‘85, 300D. Nice lines, cool old bus. Have experienced the issues covered here. In extreme cases I’ve had bolts rust into the flex joints which is a pain. I’d always recommend some anti seize on the bolts. Similar applies to bolts through bushes. The flex joints soon tear out if mounts are worn.
I did 13 years in a european workshop. You are right. I did a lot of the flexi joints and engine and g,box mounts. We called them doughnuts. Ive had one that had ripped the canvas layers apart in the doughnuts which basically ended up as 6 blocks of stringy rubber with a nasty vibration. (The drive shaft can't separate from the g,box or diff because they are mounted on a central pin.) Pure neglect and a leadfoot driving style. There is worse out there. The mk I II III VW golfs . The engine mounts collapse and send teeth rattling vibrations through the dashboard especially the convertibles. Ive done whole set of them. The front suspension upper strut mounts collapse too. So when the front struts are at full droop there can be up to 10mm of vertical freeplay between the upper strut mount and its cup in the strut tower. It can't come apart because it has a bracket across the top.
Hi Wizard love your work. What you are saying here is. Mercedes Perfected the mechanical engineering of automobiles 40 years ago when the old slogan " Engineered Like No Other car" was still valid. Whats happened since is pure marketing and the need to keep up with government or EU mandated emission controls via electronic trickery. Not to mention the reduction in quality. I can claim expertise in some matters having owned and worked on 30 Mercedes over the last 45 years. A Mercedes Nut.
Europe has some really tough regulations on creating rubber within their pollution guidelines. All European cars battle the same issues with their drivetrain mounts and suspension control arm bushings. Unreal the amount of times I had to replace motor mounts, control arm bushings and front strut spring seats all due to cracking rubber on my Volvo’s.
If you live in an area like Southern California this is especially true. Jay Leno covered it one time on his channel how ozone deteriorates rubber. Take the rubber band off of your newspaper and set it in a corner of your yard. Come back in a couple of weeks and you will see that it is just rotten. Of course a different rubber is used in flex joints and motor mounts, but it shows how tough the environment is on rubber parts. They aren't invincible.
I have a 1985 500 SEC with an annoying vibration that occurs once I go above 63 mph, especially when accelerating hard in the 60s up into the 70s. It’s a very slight vibration, but it is there. So far unsolved. I replaced the upper control arms a few months ago and that certainly helped. It reduced the vibration by about half. Clearly there is something else going on as well. Hopefully not the flex disc because Mercedes no longer makes them. The aftermarket flex discs for the 126 line are known to be kind of crappy.
I had a 1975 116 280SE which had the donut joint on the drive line. It let go and managed to wrap part of it around the hand brake cable. It stopped the car very quickly and the transmission moved. I had no idea what the problem was. We took it on a flat top to the garage I used and they worked you fairly quickly what had gone wrong. The recurring problem with the Benz was a small part of the fuel injection system - I don't know what it was called though.
Just wondered if there was a mileage number roughly, that they usually go bad as certain maintenance is going to be needed at roughly a certain mileage on any vehicle?? Great Video's & very informative plus like the no nonsense format..
I was always told as low as 80-100k mi for these, but alot depends on environment, (heat, road salt, etc) driving style, & V6 vs V8 applications to name a few. The V8's squash mounts faster as you'd imagine. I'm at 84k mi on my 2010 e350 coupe & mine are all good for now & rides super smooth. My sister's w203 is at 135k mi & she's still on the factory mounts & discs.
You are a excellent mechanic you never obnoxious you always come across as patient and knowledge I wish all mechanics would have this mindset I have to Mercedes excellent cars and I do believe Mercedes gets a bad rap if you can't afford a car please do not buy a car no matter what brand it is it's not the car and a lot of case it's the people who are the owners
All that are simple issues and easy to repair. The M112 engine of my '98 CLK320 shakes and no one knows how to solve the problem. We changed all (really all) the ignition parts, the airflowmeter, cleaned the throttle, changed the crank sensor. New engine mounts, yes, although these couldn't be the problem. New crank pulley and regen vent as well. Still shaking (visible when you open the hood). No power loss, no rev changing or any other problems. If I would live near the Wizard, I would like to let him have a look at that...
I see it's an older video but I appreciate the topic you covered about these era Mercedes. I found it informational and relevant to mechanical issues to be inspected ,addressed and or repaired. I've been restoring my 90 300sel and it is a great mechanics find and comes with many repairs because of these issues of ignorance or neglect.. also too Nice Shop you got there too I'm totally envious..😊😊
Wizard, have to admit when the mentioned parts are working as intended they are superior to other designs. Talk about smooth shifting and idle free of any engine vibration.
Bought a 6-year-old 1981 280CE back in the day. First thing I replaced was the engine mounts. The last thing that led to my ditching it was a vacuum system leak that was going to cost a small fortune to diagnose.
Sad part is that it’s not that hard to narrow down where a vacuum leak is on a W123. You probably had a vacuum leak in the central locking system or auto climate control system if your coupe had those options. The coupes also used vacuum for the front seat back locks.
had one of those flex joints blow out on me on my 86 560 SEC, scared the crap out of me. I was wondering if there is a replacement for the natural rubber flex joints and mounts such as urethane? Is there any advantage to urethane?
I can appreciate the use of the elastomeric mounts and flex plates to provide the luxury experience of a MB. However the MB engineers would also have known that the type of elastomerics they used had a limited useful life. Good video there Wizard. You truly are a Renaissance man. Working on high end vehicles and 🤘 with Metallica.
A brilliant concept of discussing issues over the lifetime of a car brand, I will look forward to more of these, a terrific idea!
Why change the design,leaving it as is guarantees the company lots of parts sales and keeps the dealers and repair shops busy.
In my 40 years as a shop owner we've seen this over and over again,especially with European cars.
After the Previa were on the road a while, we started getting calls for the accessory drive shaft. Toyota only sold the whole unit...expensive. One old mechanic in my area had me research the sizes of flex joints that Dorman had. One of the BMW discs fit perfectly.
As a guy who has 6 Mercedes 79-99, this is helpful, thank you wizard
Funny my irritation list is. Front rotors bolted in from behind means wheel bearing service to do rotors.
Some rotors have pad retention done with those spring steel circlips those suck the ones with the little cotter pins way better.
Rear axles factory you gotta open the diff after market have flanges with torx bits way nicer to replace.
Bolts from behind for AC compressor with spacers? Sucks.
Doing a guibo make sure you spline the drive shaft halves in the same orientation!
No concentric hubs on brakes better have the wheel stud tool handy!
Starter on a turbo diesel better have some looong extensions
Start using a laser pointer when directing us to specific areas of interest. Then your hand won’t be in the way.
Brilliant.👍
Or a toothbrush
Bravo for the last couple of videos. David Long “the Wizard” did great job of describing down to the individual item where the issues were and also demonstrating how they are pattern failures, also known as failures known to happen across many models and model years. He also emphasized these are issues that typically appear after many years of regular service.
This is a subtle and notable improvement in how the subjects of his videos are presented. And it was done efficiently. Great job! Thank you and your great wife for all the work you do to make these videos better and better. Hope the trend continues.
My 01 e320 had almost 150k miles before the mounts went out. They are oil filled. Changing them made a huge difference. Runs smooth as silk now.
Yep. They’re just a serviceable part, just like break pads and shocks.
@James M Didn't listen past 16:00, did you.
Yeah, if you want Mercedes smoothness you've got to maintain them right.
You’d think they would make the parts better over the years
@James M Not my fault if you don't bother to listen.
Yup! I mean, you could probably design a car with solid metal engine mounts that you'd never have to replace, but it would be uncomfortable! If the things last a decade and you have to replace them, sure it's an added cost! But if it offers a superior ride to a part that lasts 50 years (way beyond what any daily driver would last) then it's a pretty good design, so long as it's known that they wear out.
A very balanced view, Car Wizard. I was thinking, why in heck don't Mercedes change the design. But you went to great pains to explain it's just wear that come with age. Great video, thanks.
They're failing before cars are even out of warranty.. when he says not in 2 yrs it means not much more.
What you say is not true. This problem arises after many years and continuous use of the car in adverse weather conditions. I bought a Mercedes W108 from my university professor fifteen years ago, and after a while, the exact same problem happened to that car when it was forty years old. The important thing is that the design is so clever that you can easily fix the problem by replacing one or two small parts and drive again for years without problems.@@cruiser6260
Who else was waiting for Hoovie to show up in an AC/DC shirt?
This comment isn’t getting the traction it really should
huh huh. Settle down.
He he,he he, cornholio says fire fiRE FIRE arrehhhh,
Shut up butt munch
Tyler is at that car auction.
Great catch,, circa MTV in the 90's
Just did the motor and trans mounts on my 230k mile clk55 ohh what a difference! I wouldn’t call them failing at 80-100k miles a problem as they play a big part in that smooth Mercedes ride quality. They’re super soft by design and not a break my wallet fix.
Beautiful w208 💙
Beautiful car. Hope you get many more miles out of it. I’ve got 142k on my E550 myself and it runs like a dream. I straight piped it to make it even more fun to drive haha
I did my clk550, ridiculous change! So much better. 120k miles, have you put the b6 yellow dampers on yours?.
Thanks guys took it to cars and coffee this morning!
@@Smarterthanyou-mthrfkr yeah that was one of the first things I did when I bought it a couple years ago. I was chasing a rattle in the front wheel area which ended up being a missing anti rattle clip on the brake caliper (duh!). The bilstein’s are a great oem+ upgrade.
A great video Carwizard, absolutely correct in saying these components are not faulty and that it is age/oil/contaminents which takes it's toll on the rubber components of them.
Mercedes have been using the Giubo (flex disk) system for many decades on the propshafts of their cars, my dad's 1954 170D used them, with great success and is ultimately much smoother than a hard steel roller bearing cv joint as found in lesser marques.
The items you mention in your video ought to be replaced (as you would shock absorbers, brakes etc) to maintain the smooth running of your Mercedes-Benz as a matter of course and should not be ignored.
Is it true complimentary caviar comes with the parts as a kit?
@@cruiser6260 if you can't afford you don't buy👍
The rubber discs are to absorb vibration.And so the force are lower for the gearcraft. You change the rubber discs and therfore the gearcraft lasts longer.
I love the fact that you don't spend 30-60 seconds or more of the video talking about BendPak, their products, warranties and "the amazing discount on the website with my code". You mention that they were sent to you, you show how you use it, and get straight back to what you were talking about.
It makes it a lot more pleasant to watch and I can see that you're a shop owner - you don't want to waste time, whether it's your time or ours.
The cracks in those flex discs are not bad. The reason many shops sell those prematurely (if you ever take your Mercedes to the dealer they will tell you that you need flex discs even if only the paint on them is cracked) is that some cars in the 80’s and 90’s would crack to the point of failure ( which is WAY beyond these) and when they failed, the driveshaft would hit the tunnel and set off the airbags. I have been working on Mercedes for nearly 20 years and I also own one and I would be perfectly OK having those flex discs on my car. The engine and trans mounts however are junk.
A timely video Wizard. I was sitting at a stop light in my ML 350 and feeling this vibration through the car.
Now I know what to look for.
Many thanks!
Kudos to Mrs. Wizard for the great video camera work!
I love that car. I had a 1982 240D was easy to work on
The Car Wizard is one of three YTbers I trust what they say on Mercedes. The other two are LegitStreetCars and MercedesSource.
What about Scotty Kilmer?
@@johna.4334 you shouldn't trust Scotty in anything he says, he's a moron.
@@johna.4334 I don’t know him. What’s his channel?
@@alexstromberg7696 He needs to drive his Celica to the retirement home.
@@greatpix just type Scotty Kilmer when searching on RUclips. He is an older mechanic.
I've had the same issues on my Mercedes. 1980, 1982 and 1991 models
I had a 15 year old Chevy Impala where the universal joint failed, it was easy to fix, compact, lightweight, oil dripping didn't affect it, it didn't dry up cuz there is no rubber.
universal joint > flex joint
Thank you Wizard. Informative and well explained. You really do give the car community useful information about these cars.
I had a 1985 230e and on New Year’s Day 1994 on a run out with a then girlfriend, I found out all about those rear flexi disks breaking! 😁
Still can’t believe to this day that I found a garage open and able to fix it before my 120 mile return journey.
But your very right in your assessment that it’s more a European manufacturer type part
Thank you as a diesel guy I've kind of always wanted one of the old 300D turbos to turn into a toy and I certainly learned quite a bit about the Mercedes driveline I didn't know in this video
Lmao thanks man my 190e has been shakin like crazy since i bought it lol now i know whats goin on
Thank you, I absolutely love Mercedes.
I replaced the flex disc on our 1969 W108 in 1980 for the second time. I found it impossible to replace the engine mounts in an R129 without hoisting the engine and transmission nearly out of the car!
My 2010 MB E550 Coupe was on its 4th pair of liquid filled mounts at 90k miles when I traded it in.
Great video, Wizard. I’ve been around the block a few times with these issues... 1987 190D 2.5 turbo, 1987 300 SDL, 1991 350 SDL, and a 2004 VW Touareg V10 TDI. Same exact issues.
@Car Wizard, I have an 01 E320 and sure enough, it's vibrating. Albeit this one, for now, is only vibrating when in D at a standstill, but I am planning to replace the motor and transmission mounts and flex disks on it. Thank you so much for this video, as I did not even know about the flex disks until now.! Again and again, THANK YOU!!!
Car Wizard, you are so brilliant which makes you "angelic" as my Mercedes auto expertise expands!
I had a 1974 Mercedes 280C, Eurospec brought back from Germany., No power windows or seats, no sunroof, not even an AM radio! Has the model 110 I6 dohc engine. Thin chrome bumpers and halogen headlights. Fast for an old 6 cyl, I had it up to 220kmh on the 5. Racetrack sized air filter. Independent suspension worked well. 0-60 in 7 seconds. Also had a 1976 280 SE with mechanical fuel injection. They have plenty of sound insulation so if you get any rust out in the floor it acts as a sponge, this is why they fog up when parked.
Interesting how MB, in these cars, reuses their technology.
Excellent video, David !!
Can confirm. Replaced all those parts in my 67 230S, in 1984. Difference was like magic.
I too had a 67 230S. The same driveline technology as far newer cars. Under the hood, our cars far far easier to work on for sure. Mine had a floor mounted shifter for the 4 speed manual. Our cars had the legendary safety cone door lock latches. A point of pride for Mercedes. They are long gone on newer models. Gone also are the huge three point door hinges with greasing nipples. Too much hand fitment for either item. Just keep increasing the price and removing mechanical quality along the way. These are the times we live in.
The Wizard is a true MEA. Mechanic Engineer Artisan. Very very few of these people today.
Great rundown of the Mercedes issues, Mr. Wizard. FYI: The motor mounts on my 1994 Chevy S-10 pickup collapsed TWICE in 9 years! Dropped it so much the cooling fan was hitting the shroud both times.
I learned my lesson with Chevrolet in my 1985 Eurosport station wagon, my last GM product. At 105,000 miles, 6years old, everything seemed to go wrong.....Rust (car was Rusty Jones undercoated) was taking over, engine had stalling problems that no one could fix, etc. Jim
PS.....bought a new Vega station wagon, bought a new Citation......both junk cars.....only good one was 66 Chevell SS396 convertible.
Also worth mentioning as an intergenerational fail point is the steering damper.
8:10 I did some ball joints on an early 2000s GM 2500 pickup that came apart just as easily!
Just had to change motor mounts and transmission mounts in my son’s 2012 c350 with only 80,000 miles. When I saw the estimate because the engine had to come out, I was floored because it had only 80k miles and 8 years old. While I had no choice but to do the work, seeing this video makes me feel better because I know it wasn’t me who drove the car for the first 5 years of its life or my son, it’s just a typical Mercedes issue. My wallet does still hurt...
Chrysler used the exact same flex disk in there LX cars as mercedes and even had the mercedes logo on them. There interchangeable and you can save at least half compared to getting them from the mercedes dealer.
The car does look better without the wrap.. :-) Great video
Thanks to this video I can help a friend who has a 2007 Mercedes E280 with a very similar issue. The car is by no means a daily driver but I remember he told me about the issue like a month ago (and I'm pretty sure the car has months without moving) and now I just saw this specific Car Wizard's video. I'll tell him to go to a mechanic and get the engine/transmission mounts/flex discs checked.
You know what's interesting to me? I used to own a Chrysler Crossfire, which was an SLK320 underneath. Suffered from drive line vibration too. Never tried to replace it, wish I had though. If only I saw this video when owning the car all those years back!
There are a raft of other common problems with Merc too. Try the injector black death issue and seriously difficult glow plug removal, head stud problems, all very expensive. Many cars that use centre tailshaft bearings have failures in that part too. Recommended fix buy a new tailshaft for huge $$$$$
BendPak lifts always play a catchy tune; I like that. BendPak table, not so much @ 8:29-8:30.
Good camera work, good discussion.
when I was a kid in minnesota some of the kaiser cars had the engines fall out on the street when the motor mounts failed.
I love the high quality videos, keep up the good work 👍
Our Santa Fe uses those flex disks also. Now about that vibration...
I had one and it did not vibrate a bit. It did run hot...I tuned in to see if that was what you would say. Great ride and handling and would do a u turn on a dime...not the least vibration...it just ran hot!
Great info. I’ve had multiple MB’s in the past and currently have 2 which I’m going to check and see how they’re doing in this department. Thanks for sharing!
BMW use the flex discs too, our 2005 330 ci with 72k have no issues with it
Yup I drove my buddy’s 540i the other day and he told me not to gun it in first gear otherwise the flex discs would cause the whole car to vibrate. He wasn’t lying. His flex discs are fucked
"have no issues with it"
Yet! You will have exactly the same issues sooner or later, you have a low mileage car.
There is nothing wrong with them needing replaced and it's a DIY job 👍
@@WeeShoeyDugless I wonder how much keeping a car in a garage has to do with with life span of these parts, the BMW and my 06 Benz have been garaged since day one
@@shckltnebay UV breaks down rubber, so if you keep the car outside don't leave it upside down so sunlight reaches the mounts
You have to consider all these parts as service itmes. Replace them as you would other rubbuer parts like seals and hoses.
Or muffler bearings and blinker fluid pumps. :)
Many buyers have been told exactly that when hit with a 1900$ bill not covered by warranty
LOL !! I knew exactly what your were going to talk about before you did! I have a 2000 E 320 (W210) All 3 have been changed on my car too. When I bought it, the motor mounts and transmission mounts had been changed but I needed to change the flex discs. I tried a China part first and it failed 100 % with a bang at under 1,500 miles of use. The OEM part was 50% more in cost but it came with a 1 year free replacement parts and LABOR should it fail and that is even if I installed it myself. Well worth the cost of OEM parts. The discs I did at about 98000 miles and 19 years old.
I've also had to replace these items on every BMW ive ever owned. With the BMW's i've worked on the only additional thing was the differential bushings, they would fail and lead to a clunk in the rear on acceleration and when parking.
I Hear Ya Brother Have Owned my 2000 CLK 430 for 15years and I replaced all of those items on my car when I bought it and replaced every 5years on Mine because a Master Mercedes Tech told me about these issues I have gotten very good at changing these parts 🤟🏻🤟🏻🤟🏻🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
@carwizard can you show that Acura RL in the background..... one of the only made in Japan Honda’s you can buy other than NSX
Don't forget the TSX
I am still waiting for a buy this, not that video for Acura, because the newer RDX is the best SUV to buy. The older MDX is a not to buy for Acura.
@@md2k8 the RL is actually one of the greatest cars ever made, it was built like a bank vault and will run forever, first to show the SH AWD drivetrain, even had a carbon fibre driveshaft. Comparing it to it’s competition in 2020 it’s deafest reliable while 5 series and e class are in junk yards
@@KushPizzaSleep The older, 1999 to 2003 RL's and the 2015 to 2020 TLX's are a not to buy. The 2016 and newer ILX's with the dual-clutch automatic transmission is also a not to buy. The RSX is still a good vehicle to buy.
@@md2k8 most Acura’s these days are trash i would never buy an American made Honda the manufacturer tolerances are not the same
The W108 did have a worse flaw in that the centre mount was not easily replaced. It seems MB had addressed it, and I am glad they did. I must remember to have my S124 checked at some point.
When I bought my '05 SL500, she had a bad motor mount. I replaced all 3, knowing if one went, the other two wern't far behind. Oil can tear those rubber pieces up pretty quick, too. Thanks, Wizard!!!
Flexjoints are a cost effective fix, easily done and cheap, relatively.
Very well thought out, well structured and clearly explained. Great episode. I would almost think a teacher was involved in writing the script.
Cool video, it's interesting that all 3 cars had the same issues at the same time. Thanks Wizard & Mrs Wizard for another interesting video. 👍
Gonna look at mom in laws 2009 SL550 tomorrow. Thanks for tip Wiz!
Give me fuel, give me fire, give me that which I desire, ooh!
If you ask Wizard to repair your Maserati; you are deemed The Unforgiven. lol
On V8 Mercedes the motor mounts are very tough to get to the top bolt, so most people don’t change them.
Flex discs are awesome. The whole idea is they create a smooth quiet driving experience and they are all easy to replace.
Great video as always. Would be interesting to see a "making of" video to show all the behind the scenes work involved in making a Car Wizard video.
Something important to keep in mind when dealing with bad flex discs in that not only they cause vibrations, they can wreck the whole car if they fail at high speeds. When they fail at high speeds, the drive shaft destroys the back of the transmission, the transmission tunnel and carpets and even can tear the whole shift selector and parts of the center console out of the car.
Lol my brother had to replace his motor mounds on his 2007 E-320. Drove like a champ once he fixed it tho! I love early 2000’s Benz! Such a classic look
Grandma had a 1989 300D, a 2000 C280, and now a 2000 C230 Kompressor, all have been good cars.
my MB mech friend said MB's biggest fail was the intro of 190's and other entry level cars,, people got one and first repair bill, were in over their head ,, so were turnin the keys in or taking a huge loss unloading it
Great video as usual. Really its all standard service parts. There is not a car on the road that wont need some or all of these parts in its first 15 years. Love your bluntness, 1. worth the Fix, Fix it. 2. Don't Bother to fix get rid of it....
Your collection of t shirts are amazing wizard, love it
That 300D is a beautiful car.
I'm looking for an MB 300 CE and just love these Mercedes videos. So helpful. Thanks wizard!
The only problem with this channel is that I've watched every video the Car Wizard ever put out already. The Car Wizard is my favourite channel on RUclips and I'm not even a car guy (apart from Alfa Romeo Giulietta which I'll probably be burried in). Its a pity there isn't a Motorcycle Wizard channel :-(
Sometimes I'm amazed that this kind of education is free. I mean I looked at ads and stuff but the value is through the roof there.
Love the ‘85, 300D. Nice lines, cool old bus. Have experienced the issues covered here. In extreme cases I’ve had bolts rust into the flex joints which is a pain. I’d always recommend some anti seize on the bolts. Similar applies to bolts through bushes. The flex joints soon tear out if mounts are worn.
Good presentation, CW :) Seems these parts should be inspected at periodic maintenance & be replaced, BEFORE, trouble develops? Even other car brands?
I did 13 years in a european workshop. You are right. I did a lot of the flexi joints and engine and g,box mounts. We called them doughnuts. Ive had one that had ripped the canvas layers apart in the doughnuts which basically ended up as 6 blocks of stringy rubber with a nasty vibration. (The drive shaft can't separate from the g,box or diff because they are mounted on a central pin.) Pure neglect and a leadfoot driving style. There is worse out there. The mk I II III VW golfs . The engine mounts collapse and send teeth rattling vibrations through the dashboard especially the convertibles. Ive done whole set of them. The front suspension upper strut mounts collapse too. So when the front struts are at full droop there can be up to 10mm of vertical freeplay between the upper strut mount and its cup in the strut tower. It can't come apart because it has a bracket across the top.
I guess i found the reason why my 300E vibrates at idle when engine is warm!
Hi Wizard love your work.
What you are saying here is. Mercedes Perfected the mechanical engineering of automobiles 40 years ago when the old slogan " Engineered Like No Other car" was still valid.
Whats happened since is pure marketing and the need to keep up with government or EU mandated emission controls via electronic trickery.
Not to mention the reduction in quality.
I can claim expertise in some matters having owned and worked on 30 Mercedes over the last 45 years. A Mercedes Nut.
Europe has some really tough regulations on creating rubber within their pollution guidelines. All European cars battle the same issues with their drivetrain mounts and suspension control arm bushings. Unreal the amount of times I had to replace motor mounts, control arm bushings and front strut spring seats all due to cracking rubber on my Volvo’s.
I really don't need another car in my life right now but, man, that old 300D gives me the wants for an early 80s Benz.
Kind of reminds me of the drive shaft hanger bearing on 1960s Chevrolets. When that thing lets go, you know about it _immediately._
If you live in an area like Southern California this is especially true.
Jay Leno covered it one time on his channel how ozone deteriorates rubber.
Take the rubber band off of your newspaper and set it in a corner of your yard.
Come back in a couple of weeks and you will see that it is just rotten.
Of course a different rubber is used in flex joints and motor mounts, but it
shows how tough the environment is on rubber parts. They aren't invincible.
I've always preferred the term "propeller" shaft when discussing Mercedes.
I have a 1985 500 SEC with an annoying vibration that occurs once I go above 63 mph, especially when accelerating hard in the 60s up into the 70s. It’s a very slight vibration, but it is there. So far unsolved. I replaced the upper control arms a few months ago and that certainly helped. It reduced the vibration by about half. Clearly there is something else going on as well. Hopefully not the flex disc because Mercedes no longer makes them. The aftermarket flex discs for the 126 line are known to be kind of crappy.
I had a 1975 116 280SE which had the donut joint on the drive line. It let go and managed to wrap part of it around the hand brake cable. It stopped the car very quickly and the transmission moved. I had no idea what the problem was. We took it on a flat top to the garage I used and they worked you fairly quickly what had gone wrong. The recurring problem with the Benz was a small part of the fuel injection system - I don't know what it was called though.
Just wondered if there was a mileage number roughly, that they usually go bad as certain maintenance is going to be needed at roughly a certain mileage on any vehicle?? Great Video's & very informative plus like the no nonsense format..
I was always told as low as 80-100k mi for these, but alot depends on environment, (heat, road salt, etc) driving style, & V6 vs V8 applications to name a few. The V8's squash mounts faster as you'd imagine. I'm at 84k mi on my 2010 e350 coupe & mine are all good for now & rides super smooth. My sister's w203 is at 135k mi & she's still on the factory mounts & discs.
You are a excellent mechanic you never obnoxious you always come across as patient and knowledge I wish all mechanics would have this mindset I have to Mercedes excellent cars and I do believe Mercedes gets a bad rap if you can't afford a car please do not buy a car no matter what brand it is it's not the car and a lot of case it's the people who are the owners
yes more older mercedes videos!! I work on my own 1999 W140 S420 and my friends 1991 350SDL W126
All that are simple issues and easy to repair. The M112 engine of my '98 CLK320 shakes and no one knows how to solve the problem. We changed all (really all) the ignition parts, the airflowmeter, cleaned the throttle, changed the crank sensor. New engine mounts, yes, although these couldn't be the problem. New crank pulley and regen vent as well. Still shaking (visible when you open the hood). No power loss, no rev changing or any other problems. If I would live near the Wizard, I would like to let him have a look at that...
I see it's an older video but I appreciate the topic you covered about these era Mercedes. I found it informational and relevant to mechanical issues to be inspected ,addressed and or repaired. I've been restoring my 90 300sel and it is a great mechanics find and comes with many repairs because of these issues of ignorance or neglect.. also too Nice Shop you got there too I'm totally envious..😊😊
this is so true, i encountered them on my 190E
Great subject, Wizards!!! Great video!
Wizard, have to admit when the mentioned parts are working as intended they are superior to other designs. Talk about smooth shifting and idle free of any engine vibration.
Answering the question. Flattest support part I've ever seen on a car has been the body mounts. I'd like the Wizard to do a video on those too.
My 1970 W108 is on its second flex joint on the cardan shaft, not bad over 53 years though. The old MB quality.
Bought a 6-year-old 1981 280CE back in the day. First thing I replaced was the engine mounts. The last thing that led to my ditching it was a vacuum system leak that was going to cost a small fortune to diagnose.
Sad part is that it’s not that hard to narrow down where a vacuum leak is on a W123. You probably had a vacuum leak in the central locking system or auto climate control system if your coupe had those options. The coupes also used vacuum for the front seat back locks.
Great video. These items are on my list for my r129
had one of those flex joints blow out on me on my 86 560 SEC, scared the crap out of me. I was wondering if there is a replacement for the natural rubber flex joints and mounts such as urethane? Is there any advantage to urethane?
I can appreciate the use of the elastomeric mounts and flex plates to provide the luxury experience of a MB. However the MB engineers would also have known that the type of elastomerics they used had a limited useful life.
Good video there Wizard. You truly are a Renaissance man. Working on high end vehicles and 🤘 with Metallica.
Wow! A car that needs something minor replaced after 150k miles?! Never heard of that before
My mercedes had a rattle.... I wrapped the driveshaft with a Car Wizard T'shirt...... Rattle gone ;)