I own a collectors edition and I hadn't even noticed any of the small flaws you discussed. I knew some people didn't like the metal cubes, but it doesn't bother me. Maybe I'm just easy to please when it comes to board game components. The cards are my favourite part, love that gold foiling on the side bar
Great video Jamey. Thanks for showing so many mid-stage components and talking about lessons learned. Just goes to show it happens all the time, even with practiced veterans.
Thanks Jamey. I really appreciate the honesty about the decision making when it comes to putting this game together. I found ways to solve a lot of these issues for my collector's edition.
While I agree that some of the metal cubes are very similar in color, I don't think it "breaks" the game as some reviews have said. I am happy to see that replacement cubes are being produced and I'm interested to hear how those will be available to owners of the Collector's Edition. I actually use the bags that came with the Collector's edition to store each house's components. I always store player components in bags when I can as it makes it easier to distribute and put away pieces. So, I've not experienced any issues with components shifting while storing vertically. I would also agree that the card holders do fall sometimes, especially if you have a ceiling fan on. I still use them, but it's a shame it doesn't have a bit more weight to it. Something you didn't mention that I wanted to bring up is ease of seeing the cards on the board. We found that the wolf tray was so tall that it made it difficult for some players to see some of the cards, depending on where they were sitting. The same is true for the draw pile. Instead, we actually use the wolf LID to store the helium and put the draw deck on the top of the board instead of on it. In general, I'm curious if players complained about not being able to see the cards depending on where they sat during playtesting. All that being said, Red Rising is still a lot of fun and won't be leaving my collection any time soon. This is probably because my wife and I loved the books after learning about them thanks to this game. Thanks for this video Jamey. Always appreciate your honesty!
Really great vid. Count me as one of the people who has a love/hate relationship with the Collector's Edition. All of the problems you mentioned, except the Gold foil stamp see-through, have been challenging for my gaming group. I created a solution for the insert, and we just don't use the card holders. So, the only continued problem is the metal cube color, which is really only an issue at 5 or 6 players. Other than those issues, it's a beautiful production and the game is a ton of fun. Thanks!
I would imagine that the reason why you can see the gold on the back is because the smaller the stamping area, the more pressure has to be applied. I had a similar issue with punchboards in one of my guys. Because it was a very small box game and I had punchboards in it, there were slight exit wounds on the board
Very nice video. Real honest of you to acknowledge some of the "issues" some players might have. Even more awesome that you're willing to learn from them. Top notch! I was wondering about the board size. It really is a small condens game board with a very slick surface. Every game we played we tend to bump other components than the intented ones (like the helium container). Especially if you approach the board from the side or from the upside down angle. The cards have a tendancy to slide over the board and mess up the rows often. Have you experimented with board size/usability or maybe considered a playmat for the collectors edition?
Thank you for the video. I love listening to you talk about games. I can feel your passion. This is a beautiful game. I work in a game store so this gives me a greater understanding of the game.
Hey Jamie! Really appreciate the accessibility considerations that you mentioned. As someone who loves a great board game but has very low vision I can tell you it can be an added layer of challenge that does not come with any points bonuses! Thanks for keeping it in mind. Keep making great games.
Always love hearing your thoughts behind how you produce games! Thank you for all your focus on bringing not only amazing games but games with amazing components too! :)
This was a fascinating video! Love the early-on, behind the scenes look, followed by your lessons learned. I remember how much "drama" there was surrounding the metal cubes when the game first came out! Haha! People complained a bit about the insert/cover and card holders, but the attention around the colors of those metal cubes was quite something! I love the game and the books a lot, and I love this Tales of Production concept for videos! Great job!
Mr Stegmaier, thank you so much for bringing the incredible world of Pierce Brown to life! Your game is amazing and it will allow so many more people to discover this book series. Keep up the amazing work, always looking forward to your new games 😊
Thanks! I can't do it for many of them, as I've long since recycled the components I would need for these videos, though there are design diary posts on the Stonemaier Games about them. However, I do have one such video for Rolling Realms here: ruclips.net/video/ri3dg9nO4B8/видео.html
Great video, Jamey! Many lessons learnt. The game eventually turned out awesome, high quality components and insert. Personally, I store my games carefully, always on horizontal, not vertical, So I don t have issues with the cubes being apart inside of the box. And also I haven t noticed the Gold written from the back of the card, interesting.
Thanks for having a look behind the development scenes. Very interesting (to me). In the video you talked about the lid. What I missed here is a hole/opening in the lid (like CTG does). This makes is better to take off.
Surely I can't be the only one that had zero issues with the metal tokens? Not saying those that did were wrong, but I also don't think you were necessarily wrong in going the route you did. Loved the video!
After purchasing this game I of course grew curious about the books. I just finished the last book in the series, to date that is. Fantastic series, fantastic extrapolation to a board game. Highly recommend both to anyone, especially sci-fi fans. Impeccably done, as usual.
@@jameystegmaier One of the things that upset me the most however, is when you have testing days for a new game, I live too far away and cannot participate. Is there any chance you can add a Zoom aspect to it somehow? Even as a spectator?
@@susanmills316 I appreciate your curiosity, though we don't broadcast local playtests. We do, however, send out digital files to blind playtesters around the world for them to try our in-progress designs at home and offer feedback. We find great playtesters from our Ambassador program if you're interested: stonemaiergames.com/about/ambassador-program/
This was very interesting. It's a part of the gaming industry that most people don't talk about. I'm affected by the metal cubes color issue, but can still play fine.
FYI the gold foil trim on the side does bleed through the cards (not as much as the name gold), although you can see it if you are looking for it it really hasn't affected gameplay for us.
@@jameystegmaier sorry, auto correct must have screwed what I was trying to say. It really hasn't impacted the game. I have never noticed it while playing. I will edit the comment.
It’s always nice to see major productions with humble beginnings, whether it be a board game, movie, or album. By the way, what’s the name of that color blindness app? That sounds pretty useful.
Hi Jamey, I love Red Rising, but I have to say that the game made a lot more sense after I finished the first book. I do plan on reading the other books. I was wondering if you had thought about doing more cross promotion, i.e. a more elaborate introduction to the world of Red Rising, or a download code to an exerpt with the first few chapters of the first book? Maybe an introuction of some of the key characters would have been nice as well.
Do you still use the thought of "only being able to design 10 games" serve as a guiding principle while designing? If so, to what extent did that affect the different potential versions of this game?
Did you ever consider an "alternative" Darrow (trying to avoid spoilers here) ? We do love the metal cubes, but we are lucky to have daylight lamps above our board game table. 🎲
Thank you for sharing even slight "would do differently". Are you considering not putting the word "gold" in foil for future print runs of the collector's edition?
Great video to see what kind of stuff could potentially go wrong (or less ideal) during the production! btw. if you'd need an extra pair of eyes for proofreading anytime in the future, I'd be very happy to help. :-)
Absolutely loving this video series so far and looking forward to more! As a Red Rising book fan myself, I can’t say enough about the artwork and the incorporation of the characters within the game, it’s literally amazing, particularly the detail that went into how the cards/colors interact with one another. Did Pierce Brown have any influence on character design at all? Just curious! :) - Kayla
Thanks Kayla! We sent all of the character illustrations to Pierce for his review/approval, and I can't recall him changing anything. The artists had read the books and knew the character descriptions quite well at that point. :)
I removed my insert yesterday and stored it away baggies just seem to work better for me. Is there any plans for a neoprene matt with maybe a bit more space between the components while playing everything feels so tight although I like the layout it's a bit cramped and can be difficult to grab a card from Mars or Luna due to the wolf helium container
Currently we don't have plans for that, as any board/neoprene mat that's bigger wouldn't fit in the box (unless you're thinking of something I'm not picturing). You can definitely keep the helium tray elsewhere on the table if it's getting in the way, though. :)
Sounds like the biggest takeaway is that you should actually play and use the production sample version of the game before going forward. Looking at components to inspect quality is great, but then actually using them for their intended purpose in the game may reveal issues that wouldn’t be considered otherwise (and found too late in your case here). Though I agree with you that getting the most attractive looking components seems more exciting… those anodized metal cubes certainly do look nice. It’s a shame there wasn’t more contrast between your colour options from the factory - I wonder if it would be possible to use the anodized metal with edge painting to make the colours pop more… I guess that’s the part of the process you are trying to show us. I recently played a new release game from another publisher, and immediately started critiquing their obvious lack of proof reading and usability of certain components, including reference cards that were essential for learning and playing the game… this is definitely a hugely important factor to consider, especially when it changes a new player’s first impressions of the game, and how they play it. If a component feels off, it can really mess with your perceptions of the game as a whole, even if it seems well designed at its core, or you love the theme.
@@jameystegmaier I certainly believe that you must! I have not yet played Red Rising, but all the games of yours that I own have been quite impressive with the quality of components and readability of icons, etc. Things like the card holders tipping over, or the insert lid allowing components to move around, aren’t easy to notice right away - and certainly aren’t game breaking! Even the symbol on the die being missed until it was too late to change, doesn’t sound like a huge issue, and easily fixed for future print runs.
This video was more focused on production than design, but I was curious about your experiences doing this as a co-design. Were you in the same room with Alex when designing? Or did you iterate designs?
We had a few in-person meetings and playtests, but we also worked independently on it quite a bit. We each took care of specific roles, particularly when reviewing and implementing playtest data.
I own a collectors edition and I hadn't even noticed any of the small flaws you discussed. I knew some people didn't like the metal cubes, but it doesn't bother me. Maybe I'm just easy to please when it comes to board game components. The cards are my favourite part, love that gold foiling on the side bar
Great video Jamey. Thanks for showing so many mid-stage components and talking about lessons learned. Just goes to show it happens all the time, even with practiced veterans.
Thanks Jamey. I really appreciate the honesty about the decision making when it comes to putting this game together. I found ways to solve a lot of these issues for my collector's edition.
While I agree that some of the metal cubes are very similar in color, I don't think it "breaks" the game as some reviews have said. I am happy to see that replacement cubes are being produced and I'm interested to hear how those will be available to owners of the Collector's Edition.
I actually use the bags that came with the Collector's edition to store each house's components. I always store player components in bags when I can as it makes it easier to distribute and put away pieces. So, I've not experienced any issues with components shifting while storing vertically.
I would also agree that the card holders do fall sometimes, especially if you have a ceiling fan on. I still use them, but it's a shame it doesn't have a bit more weight to it.
Something you didn't mention that I wanted to bring up is ease of seeing the cards on the board. We found that the wolf tray was so tall that it made it difficult for some players to see some of the cards, depending on where they were sitting. The same is true for the draw pile. Instead, we actually use the wolf LID to store the helium and put the draw deck on the top of the board instead of on it. In general, I'm curious if players complained about not being able to see the cards depending on where they sat during playtesting.
All that being said, Red Rising is still a lot of fun and won't be leaving my collection any time soon. This is probably because my wife and I loved the books after learning about them thanks to this game. Thanks for this video Jamey. Always appreciate your honesty!
Really great vid. Count me as one of the people who has a love/hate relationship with the Collector's Edition. All of the problems you mentioned, except the Gold foil stamp see-through, have been challenging for my gaming group. I created a solution for the insert, and we just don't use the card holders. So, the only continued problem is the metal cube color, which is really only an issue at 5 or 6 players. Other than those issues, it's a beautiful production and the game is a ton of fun. Thanks!
I would imagine that the reason why you can see the gold on the back is because the smaller the stamping area, the more pressure has to be applied. I had a similar issue with punchboards in one of my guys. Because it was a very small box game and I had punchboards in it, there were slight exit wounds on the board
Love hearing about the care, passion and enthusiasm you put into your games.
Very nice video. Real honest of you to acknowledge some of the "issues" some players might have. Even more awesome that you're willing to learn from them. Top notch!
I was wondering about the board size. It really is a small condens game board with a very slick surface. Every game we played we tend to bump other components than the intented ones (like the helium container). Especially if you approach the board from the side or from the upside down angle. The cards have a tendancy to slide over the board and mess up the rows often.
Have you experimented with board size/usability or maybe considered a playmat for the collectors edition?
Thank you for the video. I love listening to you talk about games. I can feel your passion. This is a beautiful game. I work in a game store so this gives me a greater understanding of the game.
Thank you! If I can ever answer any questions about our games to make your job easier, please let me know! :)
Hey Jamie! Really appreciate the accessibility considerations that you mentioned. As someone who loves a great board game but has very low vision I can tell you it can be an added layer of challenge that does not come with any points bonuses! Thanks for keeping it in mind. Keep making great games.
Thanks! We're always trying to improve the level of accessibility in our components.
Always love hearing your thoughts behind how you produce games! Thank you for all your focus on bringing not only amazing games but games with amazing components too! :)
Thanks Liz!
This was a fascinating video! Love the early-on, behind the scenes look, followed by your lessons learned. I remember how much "drama" there was surrounding the metal cubes when the game first came out! Haha! People complained a bit about the insert/cover and card holders, but the attention around the colors of those metal cubes was quite something! I love the game and the books a lot, and I love this Tales of Production concept for videos! Great job!
Very interesting video. You’re known for high production quality games, so insightful to see what this process actually looks like.
Mr Stegmaier, thank you so much for bringing the incredible world of Pierce Brown to life! Your game is amazing and it will allow so many more people to discover this book series. Keep up the amazing work, always looking forward to your new games 😊
Thank you so much, Sarah-Maude! I've heard from so many gamers who have discovered the series thanks to the game, which makes me very happy. :)
I loved that you shared items from testing process and how they changed. I would love to see similar videos for other games :)
Thanks! I can't do it for many of them, as I've long since recycled the components I would need for these videos, though there are design diary posts on the Stonemaier Games about them. However, I do have one such video for Rolling Realms here: ruclips.net/video/ri3dg9nO4B8/видео.html
Great video, Jamey! Many lessons learnt. The game eventually turned out awesome, high quality components and insert. Personally, I store my games carefully, always on horizontal, not vertical, So I don t have issues with the cubes being apart inside of the box. And also I haven t noticed the Gold written from the back of the card, interesting.
Thanks for having a look behind the development scenes. Very interesting (to me). In the video you talked about the lid. What I missed here is a hole/opening in the lid (like CTG does). This makes is better to take off.
Surely I can't be the only one that had zero issues with the metal tokens? Not saying those that did were wrong, but I also don't think you were necessarily wrong in going the route you did. Loved the video!
Great video! Would be interested in more of these.
After purchasing this game I of course grew curious about the books. I just finished the last book in the series, to date that is. Fantastic series, fantastic extrapolation to a board game. Highly recommend both to anyone, especially sci-fi fans. Impeccably done, as usual.
Thanks Susan! I love hearing when people try the books after buying/playing the game. :)
@@jameystegmaier One of the things that upset me the most however, is when you have testing days for a new game, I live too far away and cannot participate. Is there any chance you can add a Zoom aspect to it somehow? Even as a spectator?
@@susanmills316 I appreciate your curiosity, though we don't broadcast local playtests. We do, however, send out digital files to blind playtesters around the world for them to try our in-progress designs at home and offer feedback. We find great playtesters from our Ambassador program if you're interested: stonemaiergames.com/about/ambassador-program/
This was very interesting. It's a part of the gaming industry that most people don't talk about. I'm affected by the metal cubes color issue, but can still play fine.
FYI the gold foil trim on the side does bleed through the cards (not as much as the name gold), although you can see it if you are looking for it it really hasn't affected gameplay for us.
It has impacted gameplay for you, John?
@@jameystegmaier sorry, auto correct must have screwed what I was trying to say. It really hasn't impacted the game. I have never noticed it while playing. I will edit the comment.
It’s always nice to see major productions with humble beginnings, whether it be a board game, movie, or album. By the way, what’s the name of that color blindness app? That sounds pretty useful.
It's called Color Blind Pal.
Hi Jamey, I love Red Rising, but I have to say that the game made a lot more sense after I finished the first book. I do plan on reading the other books. I was wondering if you had thought about doing more cross promotion, i.e. a more elaborate introduction to the world of Red Rising, or a download code to an exerpt with the first few chapters of the first book? Maybe an introuction of some of the key characters would have been nice as well.
That's an interesting question, and I'll talk about it with Pierce's agent!
Do you still use the thought of "only being able to design 10 games" serve as a guiding principle while designing? If so, to what extent did that affect the different potential versions of this game?
Did you ever consider an "alternative" Darrow (trying to avoid spoilers here) ?
We do love the metal cubes, but we are lucky to have daylight lamps above our board game table. 🎲
Not for the core game, but if/when we make an expansion/spinoff, yes. :)
Thank you for sharing even slight "would do differently". Are you considering not putting the word "gold" in foil for future print runs of the collector's edition?
I don't think we'll reprint the Collector's Edition, but if we did, we wouldn't gold-stamp the word "gold".
Great video to see what kind of stuff could potentially go wrong (or less ideal) during the production! btw. if you'd need an extra pair of eyes for proofreading anytime in the future, I'd be very happy to help. :-)
Absolutely loving this video series so far and looking forward to more! As a Red Rising book fan myself, I can’t say enough about the artwork and the incorporation of the characters within the game, it’s literally amazing, particularly the detail that went into how the cards/colors interact with one another. Did Pierce Brown have any influence on character design at all? Just curious! :) - Kayla
Thanks Kayla! We sent all of the character illustrations to Pierce for his review/approval, and I can't recall him changing anything. The artists had read the books and knew the character descriptions quite well at that point. :)
I removed my insert yesterday and stored it away baggies just seem to work better for me. Is there any plans for a neoprene matt with maybe a bit more space between the components while playing everything feels so tight although I like the layout it's a bit cramped and can be difficult to grab a card from Mars or Luna due to the wolf helium container
Currently we don't have plans for that, as any board/neoprene mat that's bigger wouldn't fit in the box (unless you're thinking of something I'm not picturing). You can definitely keep the helium tray elsewhere on the table if it's getting in the way, though. :)
Sounds like the biggest takeaway is that you should actually play and use the production sample version of the game before going forward. Looking at components to inspect quality is great, but then actually using them for their intended purpose in the game may reveal issues that wouldn’t be considered otherwise (and found too late in your case here). Though I agree with you that getting the most attractive looking components seems more exciting… those anodized metal cubes certainly do look nice. It’s a shame there wasn’t more contrast between your colour options from the factory - I wonder if it would be possible to use the anodized metal with edge painting to make the colours pop more… I guess that’s the part of the process you are trying to show us.
I recently played a new release game from another publisher, and immediately started critiquing their obvious lack of proof reading and usability of certain components, including reference cards that were essential for learning and playing the game… this is definitely a hugely important factor to consider, especially when it changes a new player’s first impressions of the game, and how they play it. If a component feels off, it can really mess with your perceptions of the game as a whole, even if it seems well designed at its core, or you love the theme.
Absolutely! We do that (and we did it with Red Rising).
@@jameystegmaier I certainly believe that you must! I have not yet played Red Rising, but all the games of yours that I own have been quite impressive with the quality of components and readability of icons, etc.
Things like the card holders tipping over, or the insert lid allowing components to move around, aren’t easy to notice right away - and certainly aren’t game breaking! Even the symbol on the die being missed until it was too late to change, doesn’t sound like a huge issue, and easily fixed for future print runs.
This video was more focused on production than design, but I was curious about your experiences doing this as a co-design. Were you in the same room with Alex when designing? Or did you iterate designs?
We had a few in-person meetings and playtests, but we also worked independently on it quite a bit. We each took care of specific roles, particularly when reviewing and implementing playtest data.
Last playtest should be fully blind, to catch rule, icon changes.
But great job trying to catch things.
The color blind apps are great.
I’m half into Iron Gold ! Start reading the serie because i like your game that much!
Do you have ideas for future expansion?
I'm glad you're enjoying the books! We're waiting until the 6th book is released, and then we'll discuss ideas for an expansion or sequel.
Hi Jamie, what's the colorblind test app called please? I'd like to use it myself on game designs. Thanks!
It's Color Blind Pal.
Will you offer a corrected die for us to buy?
No, we don't plan to do that.
hi, love the game, but I was wondering, because of this game's very nature , how hard can an expansion be made for this?