If you notice in the first 3 minutes bill lambier said if you stop jordan you're good cause there's nobody else on this team. His teammates didn't develop till later, then they beat the pistons
As much as I hated Lambier, I have to admit he was absolutely right. The Bulls had no one else able to step up. Scottie and the rest of the team weren't ready - weren't capable, yet.
A little history on "The Jordan Rules." The Jordan Rules were born after a nationally-televised game on Easter Sunday in 1988, when Jordan exploded for 59 points in a 112-110 victory against Detroit in the Pontiac Silverdome. Prior to Jordan Rules, in 12 games against Detroit, Jordan was averaging 39.3ppg on 47%FG . ( Bulls 5-7 record) After Jordan Rules, the next 12 games Jordan was averaging 26.9ppg on 44%FG. (Bulls 1-10 record) In Jordan's first championship season (1991), Jordan averaged 31.6ppg on 53%FG in 5 games against Detroit. ( Bulls 3-2 record, and a 4-0 playoff sweep) Imagine having to beat and swarm Jordan on defense, to get him to average near 27 a game.
That Pistons team is a top 5 all-time defensive squad. They had two top 10 perimeter defenders all-time (Rodman/Dumars). They were extremely physical and could get a little too dirty. I watched all of them games and it was obvious they were trying to intimidate Mike by blatantly hurting him when he came to the bucket. But you heard their big (Edwards) say Mike had no quit in him. Even without much help he was a predator like Schwarzenegger in Terminator. Years before this against that vaunted Celtics team (1985) he became a Dahmer cadaver hoarder how he severed the defensive skills of all them hall-of-famers. So much so that Bird said "that was God disguised as Jordan." The guy's mindset was Manson maniacal. Zero quit. Can't say the same for Bron. He's been known to play passively, quit or just abandon ship like Titanic mechanics soon as dookey gets thick. Us fans have seen it, his peers have said it and even his team owner (Gilbert) has said so.
Jordan could always pass, hell he had almost 6 assists/game as a rookie…problem is his teammates weren’t reliable at all. MJ missed out on numerous assists in the 80’s because of the bums on his teams.
It's not about just trusting teammates when your whole team is is scared pippen faked a headache lebron passes off because he's not clutch at all that's why he passes he scared to take the shot 😂😂
Here’s the problem with your bron statement. For one, what teammates were gonna knock those shots down? His team was trash. Second, bron trusting his teamates was more due to him actually HAVING QUALITY SHOOTERS. As bad as people make those original Cleveland teams seem, he had players that atleast fit his style of play. All shooters and good defense. And third, that style that bron plays is more due to him not being an elite shooter. That’s why the goal for San Antonio in both the 07 and 2014 finals was to clog the lane, lock up the rest of the team and force bron to shoot or pass to teammates. Trusting your teammates works when the teammates are quality. If they aren’t, and your playing against a great defense, that’s a whole other story. Whether ur willing to pass or not, the results are typically the same
Paxson was a respectable shooter, Craig Hodges, Harper, Steve Kerr (who holds the record for highest 3pt pct in league history), Scottie. He had people….he just didn’t use them.
the thing lebron fans dont get is he has never faced a defense any thing close to detroit - this was jordan learning the game from the best defense ever - la - boston - and detroit of the 80's were all better than any of lebron's teams - i know it is hard to hear - best of all time jordan - kareem - majic - bird - the teams today are just to soft
Even when you said "that's a flagrant" -- that's what you don't get... No back then they weren't. Sometimes they would punch, elbow, shove and it wouldn't even get called a regular foul if the ref claimed to not see it. So the whole thing about that Jordan just needed to do this or that -- nah -- he had to make sure he didn't get entangled in a career ending injury (while still carrying the team on his shoulders to win the series, and came really close) because they would literally try to do that. This is why there is a special vitriol toward the Pistons and why they introduced flagrants in 90. They say it "benefited Jordan" -- but it benefited every team except the Pistons just about and benefited the NBA as a whole. If you lose your superstars to flagrant career ending injuries, you lose a lot of money. LeBron and even Kobe never played a day in their lives in the league that unabashedly allowed flagrant fouls like this. And some of that was that NBA players sort of reigned themselves in that they wouldn't play dirty -- they didn't generally sweep legs or pull guys to the ground from the air because they treated it like a golden rule. People wanted to win, yes -- but none of them wanted to lose their careers to paralysis, so they kept it in check for the most part. It still played pretty hard in the 90s and back then flagrant meant FLAGRANT. What they were doing was not basketball. It was the equivalent of a low blow the ref misses in a boxing match, or a kick to the nuts in MMA. No one respected it. So it's debatable whether it's smart or not. In life and death combat, and in a zombie apocalypse - sure I'll take the Pistons style - but in almost all professional sports there's the whole idea of winning on merit and sportsmanship. Today's equivalent is "the flop" I'd say -- except the flop is just sad and doesn't hurt anyone except the person caught doing it. If you think flopping is good basketball, then that makes the Pistons defense good basketball.
2nd greatest lol his best is Lechoke who got punked by JJ Barea in the finals and got swept twice in the most important and grandest series that is the finals.
Don't sound so dumb duke. Bron also had a multitude of All-Star teammates (Wade, Ray Allen, Bosh, Kyrie, Love, Rondo, AD, Westbrook). This version of Jordan didn't have one. I remember Magic saying that as soon as Mike had the right horses it would be over. And as soon as Pippen became the first and only prime All-Star teammate Mike had it was as over as Kurt Cobain with a loaded shotty.
You say kick it out to a shooter but at the time, Jordan had no shooters. Which is why the pistons felt comfortable fully focusing on him. Pippen wasn’t even an Al star until the year the bulls won their first chip
Nah. Pass it. Nobody had shooters back then. Simple play. They went 7 games with no shooters. If Jordan just passed the ball a lil bit more they beat the pistons. They literally used the Jordan rules for 7 games. Maybe he needed the triangle offense. But the bulls should have won the series.
@@gradymckinney7306 nah there were great shooters back then (Bird, Rolando Blackman, Dale Ellis, Craig Hodges, Mark Price, John Stockton, Eddie Johnson, Joe Dumars, etc..only casuals say 💩 like that) but Jordan didn’t trust his so it made no sense to pass when he could draw a foul and knock the free throws down. It didn’t matter how many times MJ passed the ball because the Pistons played together as a team better than the Bulls despite Jordan’s numbers. Nash McIntosh is right. The Bulls could have passed as much as they wanted and Detroit would have still beat them with the game plan that they used to knock them out of the playoffs three times in a row. The Bulls just weren’t ready until they were.
@@gradymckinney7306 I’m not saying he’s right for not passing. I’m just saying he didn’t have the amount of help back then that people think he did. It was similar to when Kobe ball-hogged because he didn’t have teammates that he trusted to consistently perform. Also they even said that part of the Jordan rules was to make him pass the ball because nobody else on that bulls team could beat them. So the 80’s Detroit pistons basically confirmed what I’m saying. That he didn’t have reliable help at the time.
@@gradymckinney7306Jordan averaged 8.2 ssists per game in 1988 to 1989. 7 assists per game during the playoffs. Saying Jordan didnt pass proves you never watched the game
@@gradymckinney7306Did you ever watch 1980s Bulls games? The Bulls players were missing open shots under the ring. In the 1988, 1989, 1990 playoffs, Jordan averaged 7.3 assists per game. Thats when he faced playoffs. I cant stand when people that never watched the games mouth off
Notice how Laimbeer said if you shut MJ down they lose? And he full of shit talking about LEARNING to use his teammates..his teammates were entirely unreliable..go look at the series box scores for those 3 years. MJ had zero help and it’s not about trust. All athletes get a chance, who was he gonna kick it to Kyle Macy 😂😂😂✌🏽
@@redhotmamakennels7738 Asses tend to forget that Pippen wasn't all that great until he rubbed elbows with the GOAT. Pip wasn't even recruited out of high-school. He walked on some little university in Arkansas as an equipment mgr./player. His main duty as a freshman was to keep gym/locker tidy. Only reason he got playing time was because some teammates quit the team. And as a rookie he was being smacked around by Oakley and couldn't beat out Sellers for 3 spot. But after a few years under Air Jordan's wings he became Robin to MJ's Batman.
That plan led the Bad Boy Detroit Pistons to three EC Championships in a row and Back-to-Back NBA World Championships, all at MJ's expense. So, tip your hat to one of the greatest teams of all-time...The Detroit Pistons.
It was smart strategy / defense until Detroit turned it into "jail ball". I lost all respect for them after that happened. The walk off the court, without shaking the Bulls hands, after being swept was completely unforgivable and unprofessional. Jordan took the abuse and STILL shook they're hands for 3 years straight. The 4th year was his. He earned their respect but they wouldn't show it. Smh
Hold up, Turbo. Nobody in Detroit cried when the Boston Celtics walked off the court with time left in game 6 of the 88' ECF. Detroit was at the foul line with time left on the clock and all the Celtics starters walked off except McHale. Pistons fans were happy they left the floor. Plus, there wasn't any rule back then that opponents had to shake hands after a game, you sound like a baby, just as Jordan did. unforgivable and unprofessional.... Blah, blah, blah, blah. The main reason why most of the Pistons walked off without shaking hands was because Jordan went to the media, TV, the newspapers before the sweep and said, and I'm paraphrasing, that "the Pistons were bad for basketball, that they were undeserving champions, and everybody will be happy when they go away." So, why in the F--- would Isiah and Laimbeer shake his hand after he said those things. The Detroit Pistons had been in five EC Finals in a row and three NBA Finals in a row, winning Back-to-Back NBA World Titles, beat everybody, including MJ three years in a row. So, MJ can piss up a rope as far as Bad Boy Pistons are concerned. We got ours and there's nothing anybody can do about it.
U trippin fam they was fuccing him up hacking the shit out of him you gotta watch the actual game bro these highlights ain't even showing the real shit they was fuccing him up bro 😂😂
Paxson was scared to shoot do you play basketball 🏀 fam ??i can tell you don't how you talking and you said he the second greatest behind the biggest flopper and loser of all time 😂😂
So so sad when professional basketball players are so threatened by the greatness of another player that they have to result to thuggish behavior to get the win. Disgusting.
Since you keep sayin trust your teammates pipped faked a migraine 😂😂the bulls didn't start going crazy when he learned how to trust his teammates they went crazy when they quit being scared and giving up in mid game 😂😂
Jordan averaged 6 assist against the pistons in those series. I think he always knew 1 man couldn't beat them but they weren't ready. Were they not called Jordan and the Jordanaires at one point? As soon as he got a good squad it was over.
The bad boys exploited the rules back then to the absolute limit.. exploited the wording to the absolute limit.. The bulls roster was razor thin till 1990.. pre 1990 MJ didn’t trust his team mates.. once the triangle offence was learnt by all players completely by the 91 finals then MJ started to trust his team mates.. Once Scottie was fully developed by 1990/91 then bulls became hard to beat and from then onwards MJ started trusting Scottie Paxton Armstrong and co
He had a mid team around him at the time (if you watch, when he passes his teammates can’t even make layups) and they had at least 1-2 flagrants a game against him .. and Jordan STILL figured it out to the point that the pistons were done and he never lost in the finals again. LBJ isn’t a great comparison .. the spurs actual game plan was, let him shoot .. and they killed the cavs .. if their gameplan against Jordan involves the entire team, multiple defenders, foul him as hard as you need to .. and the game plan against LBJ was “let him shoot” .. yeah, it’s clear one player was feared, the other flawed.
"and Jordan still figured it out to the point that the pistons were done and he never lost in the finals again." I would certainly hope MJ and the Bulls could figure it out on the FOURTH attempt in the NBA playoffs. If the Pistons being done means that they went to five EC Finals in a row, won three straight EC Championships, and won Back-to-Back NBA World Titles, then my friend, I'm fine with that. Nobody DOMINATED MJ like the Bad Boys did...PERIOD!!
@@artmeddaugh6669 it’s all perspective .. you’re lauding the pistons going to the EC finals 5 times and winning 2 titles as impressive, whilst trying to minimize 6 titles and two 3peats as something anyone would have figured out. Reality is, pistons run was shorter, less successful and 100% ended by the bulls, who then embarked on a STILL unprecedented and unmatched 6 chip run .. I’d stay we’re both clearly biased, I just happen to be right this time. Side note: no one ever came along and figured out the bulls, even after 6 EC finals appearances .. so it’s apparently not as sure or easy as you make it out to be.
@@michaelshaw8240 Where did I try to minimize 6 titles and two 3peats? I just stated the Bad Boys had their way with MJ and the Bulls three years in a row in the playoffs, that's a fact. Don't forget 3 NBA Finals in a row. Reality is the that the Pistons didn't have the best player in the world on their team like the Bulls did. Detroit played like a team, and their best player was a 6-foot PG. Just because they hounded and harassed MJ all over the court, doesn't give you cover to minimize one of the greatest teams in NBA History. Don't try to minimize the Pistons five-year run. Whether it was shorter or less successful than the Bulls doesn't mean Jack to me, the facts are the facts. The Bad Boys did what they did to MJ and you, or any other MJ lover can't do a darn thing about it. The Bull's run was shorter and less successful than the Boston Celtics teams of the 50's and 60's that won 8 NBA Championships in a row...so what's your point? And you are wrong on the unprecedented and unmatched part...fool!
@@artmeddaugh6669 you fail repeatedly in your arguments, so it makes sense you’d resort to name calling. You’re in a deep minority when calling Detroit one of the greatest teams in NBA history .. top 75, sure. Top 50, maybe. Top 10 .. not even close .. all 6 bulls teams and at least 3 warriors teams are ahead of them, not to mention multiple lakers and Celtics teams .. but you do seem to define mediocrity as great when it fits your narrative. 3 finals in a row is awesome, 3 finals wins in a row is the bulls. Did the pistons beat the bulls before they went on their run, yep .. clippers beat the warriors, LBJ was beat by different teams,and guess what, Detroit lost with Isaiah before they figured it out .. what the hell does that prove? That experience and a squad are needed to win? Genius .. wow, you’ve unlocked the secret .. all great players lose, and use those experiences as stepping stones to their true greatness. You stay on the side of the stepping stones, because the only “fool” in this conversation is the one who claims Detroit is one of the greatest teams in NBA history when comparing them to the bulls .. I’d say kneel down like the stepping stone detroit ended up as, but I’m quite certain you’ll take the classless approach and refuse to shake the hand of your better, just as they did .. and be remembered for the bad sport you are, just like your team is.
@@michaelshaw8240 I think you need to read the NBA publications and magazines that put the 1989 Detroit Pistons in the Top 10 of the greatest NBA teams of All-Time. I'm looking at a sticker from one of those books at that Detroit team who went 63-19 in the regular season and 15-2 in the playoffs. Swept the Bucks, swept the Celtics, lost 2 to the Bulls, swept the Lakers to win the Championship. Look it up, foolio, from a schmuck who said the Bulls run was unprecedented and all I had to say was Boston Celtics 8 in a row. You're to much in your MJ feelings, can't cope with the fact that the Bad Boys kicked MJ's Ass not once, not twice, but three times while collecting rings. Haha, can't change it, but I understand why MJ apologists want to deny it ever happened. Grow a pair and accept it for what it is.
I watched all through the 80s. The player who was constantly mugged by Detroit was Larry Bird. He was constantly being elbowed in the face and neck, smacked in the face, hit in the small of his back and knocked down (of course they knew about his back) and even body slammed. The
Karl Malone put the Jordan Rules on Isiah and then they knew what it was Like.. Isiah got it good with 4 inch gash above his eyebrow. He was the little boy that started it all in Isiah....Karma comes back at you Isiah!!!
The respect wasn’t reciprocated because of what he said about the Detroit in the media once he was going to FINALLY beat us. He was VERY disrespectful…..in public.
It wasn't a coincidence that when Pippen became an All Star, the Bulls started winning championships, so Jordan had to do it alone because the second-highest scorer on the team only averaged 15 points a game, Jordan's scoring average went from 30 points in the regular season to 38 in the playoffs because he was the only one on the team who could handle the added playoff pressure. The Pistons had three all stars and a two time Defensive Player of the year, and Jordan took them to 7 games with no other All Stars on his team. You talk about LeBron passing the ball, and Jordan not passing the ball ... maybe that's the difference between 6 NBA Finals wins and 6 NBA Final loses.
This was early in MJs career before championship mode it wasn't just about trusting the teammates it was also about the teammates being ready for Detroits mental and physical abuse..MJ was the only threat and Detroit wasn't worried about everyone else but once MJ and his leadership lead by example got everyone else mentally and physically tough enough then he could definitely trust them
The Detroit Pistons were one of the best teams in Nba history, the argument that they were basically professional wrestlers in shorts is good for kids who live in forums and create this alternative universe because they worship this or that player and they can't deal with straight facts. When they see Laimbeer hitting Jordan they say "killers!!!" When they see McHale clothesline Rambis mid-air they say "damn the 80s were cool man!"
He does trust his team though, as you could see in the beginning, unfortunately they weren't as good offensively, so he had to work and wait until they could finally play their parts
Lets break it down : Jordan was INDEED a Ball Hog!! BUT you saw he was averaging that 38 pts. The Bad Boy Pistons are 1 of the GREATEST defensive teams of all time and these Rules allowed them to shut him down and FORCE him to f up or pass to his team because they knew they could be the Bulls if Michael wasn't allowed to shot because the rest of them were horrible. In some ways, he had no choice but to keep trying. Its like if early Lebron was playing with 2023-2024 LA clippers, Lebron would pretty much carry the whole team.
The Bad Boy Detroit Pistons. The team that put MJ and the baby bulls out of the NBA playoffs three years in a row, twice in the ECF, while winning three EC Championships in a row, and winning Back-to-Back NBA World Titles, and MJ had to sit and watch. MJ finally won on the FOURTH attempt; some things are unfortunate...
NEAL, THE BULLS TEAM AT THAT TIME WAS NOT READY. THE ONLY STARTER SHOOTER WAS PAXON & OFF THE BENCH WAS CRAIG HODGES! HORACE & SCOTTIE WERE NOT READY YET!
You guys kept on saying mj wasn’t trusting his teamates. When lebron and the lakers had trash shooters and kept on missing threes, you all were saying “Lebron needs more help”
"The secret to stopping MJ." Outscore his teammates. Same way how Golden State "stopped" Lebron in most cases. Jordan averaged 37 points a game against the Pistons. Thats hardly stopping.
"The intention of making Jordan rules is to force jordan to pass the ball" from that line it was clear that Jordans teammates was terrible shooters back then. That is why trusting his teammates was hard for him unlike Lebron who played with a lot of good shooters. But if LeBron experienced this kind of rules he will surely bend cause he always flop.
No you are wrong he’s not second, he’s first.LeBron couldn’t of lasted if he was taking the brutal punishment that MJ went thru, he would have quit in the middle of the game, like he always do. They didn’t have no Bill Cartwright Rules ,nor any Scottie Pippen Rules, they only had Rules for MJ. That’s another reason why he was and still is the G.O.A.T. And Kobe Bean Bryant’ is the #2 G.O.A.T Period.
Lebron against a goon squad like the pistons... they would have stomped his ass as strong as he is... Jordan had no quit, jordan played through the pain, jordan refused to stay down...Lebron has no heart... the pistons would have broken him.
Mj won 6 ring in 11 full season minus his second year and 95 were he only plays less than 20 games with the bulls being selfish. While lbj only won 4 rings in 20 full season by trusting his teammate and being unselfish most of the time.
Hey, RUclipsr. Have you ever tried watching the full games? Very few "Lebron fan reacts" RUclipsrs are respectable enough to bother doing so. But I found a few that do. Your "Jordan doesn't pass" and "Jordan doesn't trust teammates" would be silenced the moment you watch full games and stop being lazy. Jordan drew double teams like Steph Curry and generally passed it off to the open guy on most drives. They missed. Highlights dont show that context. You are so used to Lebron superteams that you cannot comprehend how bad MJ's 1980s Bulls teammates were
What's LBJ excuse lol he had plenty of top 75 players plenty of help. He lose a lot of times as well. LBJ had the blue print to chase the league is behind him.
jordan had to learn the hard way that its a sport with 4 other players of your team on the court. even if you are the goat. back in the days it was way more physical, flagrant was nearly never a thing! that is why we older generation always tell yall its a different sport since the changes made to the game on physicality, cause lebron would have not been that dominant in the late 80s early 90s.
Don't let this clip fool you I saw those games and the pistons had no chance of winning so they had to hurt michael jordan used physicality, hitting him when he came through the lane. And know disrespect to the bulls team they really wasn't a reliable team with out jordan, Because if pistons played the game and didn't brutally foul Michael Jordan, they would've got beat the first time in the eastern conference finals.
Blah, Blah, Blah, Blah. What alternate reality are you living in. I watched all the games as they happened, either in the stands or on TV, and 99% of the time the game was played clean. Yeah, they hit MJ, they fouled him hard, they bumped and elbowed him, tied him up, but that's how the game was played back in the 80's. The Celtics played rough, so did the Sixers and Bucks, even the Lakers mixed it up. So, stop crying about it. Would've, could've, should've. The Bad Boys put MJ down and out three years in a row in the NBA playoffs, twice in the ECF, while going to the NBA Finals all three years and won Back-to-Back NBA World Titles. Love it, eat it, live with it because that's what happened.
Jordan's teammates were complete ass until '89 at the earliest. Go watch those games. Hell even the highlights here show it. Wasn't no one hitting shit on that team other than MJ. And the commenter above is correct, other than MJ his teammates were scared to death of Detroit. Pippen was faking migraines.
NEAL, THE BULLS TEAM AT THAT TIME WAS NOT READY. THE ONLY STARTER SHOOTER WAS PAXON & OFF THE BENCH WAS CRAIG HODGES! HORACE & SCOTTIE WERE NOT READY YET!
If you notice in the first 3 minutes bill lambier said if you stop jordan you're good cause there's nobody else on this team. His teammates didn't develop till later, then they beat the pistons
Nobody who could beat u....
As much as I hated Lambier, I have to admit he was absolutely right. The Bulls had no one else able to step up. Scottie and the rest of the team weren't ready - weren't capable, yet.
A little history on "The Jordan Rules."
The Jordan Rules were born after a nationally-televised game on Easter Sunday in 1988, when Jordan exploded for 59 points in a 112-110 victory against Detroit in the Pontiac Silverdome.
Prior to Jordan Rules, in 12 games against Detroit, Jordan was averaging 39.3ppg on 47%FG . ( Bulls 5-7 record)
After Jordan Rules, the next 12 games Jordan was averaging 26.9ppg on 44%FG. (Bulls 1-10 record)
In Jordan's first championship season (1991), Jordan averaged 31.6ppg on 53%FG in 5 games against Detroit. ( Bulls 3-2 record, and a 4-0 playoff sweep)
Imagine having to beat and swarm Jordan on defense, to get him to average near 27 a game.
well explained
That’s just crazy. Jordan a different beast
That Pistons team is a top 5 all-time defensive squad. They had two top 10 perimeter defenders all-time (Rodman/Dumars). They were extremely physical and could get a little too dirty. I watched all of them games and it was obvious they were trying to intimidate Mike by blatantly hurting him when he came to the bucket. But you heard their big (Edwards) say Mike had no quit in him. Even without much help he was a predator like Schwarzenegger in Terminator. Years before this against that vaunted Celtics team (1985) he became a Dahmer cadaver hoarder how he severed the defensive skills of all them hall-of-famers. So much so that Bird said "that was God disguised as Jordan." The guy's mindset was Manson maniacal. Zero quit. Can't say the same for Bron. He's been known to play passively, quit or just abandon ship like Titanic mechanics soon as dookey gets thick. Us fans have seen it, his peers have said it and even his team owner (Gilbert) has said so.
Jordan could always pass, hell he had almost 6 assists/game as a rookie…problem is his teammates weren’t reliable at all. MJ missed out on numerous assists in the 80’s because of the bums on his teams.
It's not about just trusting teammates when your whole team is is scared pippen faked a headache lebron passes off because he's not clutch at all that's why he passes he scared to take the shot 😂😂
Just tell him to watch the full games. Why dont Lebron fans have the decency to do so? Put effort into their arguments?
Here’s the problem with your bron statement.
For one, what teammates were gonna knock those shots down? His team was trash. Second, bron trusting his teamates was more due to him actually HAVING QUALITY SHOOTERS. As bad as people make those original Cleveland teams seem, he had players that atleast fit his style of play. All shooters and good defense.
And third, that style that bron plays is more due to him not being an elite shooter. That’s why the goal for San Antonio in both the 07 and 2014 finals was to clog the lane, lock up the rest of the team and force bron to shoot or pass to teammates. Trusting your teammates works when the teammates are quality. If they aren’t, and your playing against a great defense, that’s a whole other story. Whether ur willing to pass or not, the results are typically the same
Paxson was a respectable shooter, Craig Hodges, Harper, Steve Kerr (who holds the record for highest 3pt pct in league history), Scottie. He had people….he just didn’t use them.
the thing lebron fans dont get is he has never faced a defense any thing close to detroit - this was jordan learning the game from the best defense ever - la - boston - and detroit of the 80's were all better than any of lebron's teams - i know it is hard to hear - best of all time jordan - kareem - majic - bird - the teams today are just to soft
Even when you said "that's a flagrant" -- that's what you don't get... No back then they weren't. Sometimes they would punch, elbow, shove and it wouldn't even get called a regular foul if the ref claimed to not see it. So the whole thing about that Jordan just needed to do this or that -- nah -- he had to make sure he didn't get entangled in a career ending injury (while still carrying the team on his shoulders to win the series, and came really close) because they would literally try to do that. This is why there is a special vitriol toward the Pistons and why they introduced flagrants in 90. They say it "benefited Jordan" -- but it benefited every team except the Pistons just about and benefited the NBA as a whole. If you lose your superstars to flagrant career ending injuries, you lose a lot of money.
LeBron and even Kobe never played a day in their lives in the league that unabashedly allowed flagrant fouls like this. And some of that was that NBA players sort of reigned themselves in that they wouldn't play dirty -- they didn't generally sweep legs or pull guys to the ground from the air because they treated it like a golden rule. People wanted to win, yes -- but none of them wanted to lose their careers to paralysis, so they kept it in check for the most part. It still played pretty hard in the 90s and back then flagrant meant FLAGRANT. What they were doing was not basketball. It was the equivalent of a low blow the ref misses in a boxing match, or a kick to the nuts in MMA. No one respected it. So it's debatable whether it's smart or not.
In life and death combat, and in a zombie apocalypse - sure I'll take the Pistons style - but in almost all professional sports there's the whole idea of winning on merit and sportsmanship. Today's equivalent is "the flop" I'd say -- except the flop is just sad and doesn't hurt anyone except the person caught doing it. If you think flopping is good basketball, then that makes the Pistons defense good basketball.
2nd greatest lol his best is Lechoke who got punked by JJ Barea in the finals and got swept twice in the most important and grandest series that is the finals.
Don't sound so dumb duke. Bron also had a multitude of All-Star teammates (Wade, Ray Allen, Bosh, Kyrie, Love, Rondo, AD, Westbrook). This version of Jordan didn't have one. I remember Magic saying that as soon as Mike had the right horses it would be over. And as soon as Pippen became the first and only prime All-Star teammate Mike had it was as over as Kurt Cobain with a loaded shotty.
Let this sink in...Imagine a basketball player so unstoppable that the only thing you can do to slow him down is....Violence!
Yep. So so sad.
the whole league played like that in the playoffs man...
And he still averaged 37ppg against The Bad Boy Pistons. 29.6 against the Pistons for his career overall. Let that sink in.
You say kick it out to a shooter but at the time, Jordan had no shooters. Which is why the pistons felt comfortable fully focusing on him. Pippen wasn’t even an Al star until the year the bulls won their first chip
Nah. Pass it. Nobody had shooters back then. Simple play. They went 7 games with no shooters. If Jordan just passed the ball a lil bit more they beat the pistons. They literally used the Jordan rules for 7 games. Maybe he needed the triangle offense. But the bulls should have won the series.
@@gradymckinney7306 nah there were great shooters back then (Bird, Rolando Blackman, Dale Ellis, Craig Hodges, Mark Price, John Stockton, Eddie Johnson, Joe Dumars, etc..only casuals say 💩 like that) but Jordan didn’t trust his so it made no sense to pass when he could draw a foul and knock the free throws down. It didn’t matter how many times MJ passed the ball because the Pistons played together as a team better than the Bulls despite Jordan’s numbers. Nash McIntosh is right. The Bulls could have passed as much as they wanted and Detroit would have still beat them with the game plan that they used to knock them out of the playoffs three times in a row. The Bulls just weren’t ready until they were.
@@gradymckinney7306 I’m not saying he’s right for not passing. I’m just saying he didn’t have the amount of help back then that people think he did. It was similar to when Kobe ball-hogged because he didn’t have teammates that he trusted to consistently perform. Also they even said that part of the Jordan rules was to make him pass the ball because nobody else on that bulls team could beat them. So the 80’s Detroit pistons basically confirmed what I’m saying. That he didn’t have reliable help at the time.
@@gradymckinney7306Jordan averaged 8.2 ssists per game in 1988 to 1989. 7 assists per game during the playoffs. Saying Jordan didnt pass proves you never watched the game
@@gradymckinney7306Did you ever watch 1980s Bulls games? The Bulls players were missing open shots under the ring. In the 1988, 1989, 1990 playoffs, Jordan averaged 7.3 assists per game. Thats when he faced playoffs. I cant stand when people that never watched the games mouth off
Jordan rules actually started in 1984 during the USA team vs nba al stars..Oscar Robertson was the nba coach.
Notice how Laimbeer said if you shut MJ down they lose? And he full of shit talking about LEARNING to use his teammates..his teammates were entirely unreliable..go look at the series box scores for those 3 years. MJ had zero help and it’s not about trust. All athletes get a chance, who was he gonna kick it to Kyle Macy 😂😂😂✌🏽
How about Corzine or Sellers? Man, this RUclipsr has no idea how anemic MJ's teammates were back then. Not one All-Star teammate.
@@katrinachavez3533 Pippen sat behind Sellers until Sellers asked for a trade in Pippen second year.
@@redhotmamakennels7738 Asses tend to forget that Pippen wasn't all that great until he rubbed elbows with the GOAT. Pip wasn't even recruited out of high-school. He walked on some little university in Arkansas as an equipment mgr./player. His main duty as a freshman was to keep gym/locker tidy. Only reason he got playing time was because some teammates quit the team. And as a rookie he was being smacked around by Oakley and couldn't beat out Sellers for 3 spot. But after a few years under Air Jordan's wings he became Robin to MJ's Batman.
@@katrinachavez3533 he sucked for several years period ✌🏽
It was very SMART DEFENSE, but it goes to show you how great the goat was that they had to make a whole plan to stop him.
That plan led the Bad Boy Detroit Pistons to three EC Championships in a row and Back-to-Back NBA World Championships, all at MJ's expense. So, tip your hat to one of the greatest teams of all-time...The Detroit Pistons.
It was smart strategy / defense until Detroit turned it into "jail ball". I lost all respect for them after that happened. The walk off the court, without shaking the Bulls hands, after being swept was completely unforgivable and unprofessional. Jordan took the abuse and STILL shook they're hands for 3 years straight. The 4th year was his. He earned their respect but they wouldn't show it. Smh
Hold up, Turbo. Nobody in Detroit cried when the Boston Celtics walked off the court with time left in game 6 of the 88' ECF. Detroit was at the foul line with time left on the clock and all the Celtics starters walked off except McHale. Pistons fans were happy they left the floor. Plus, there wasn't any rule back then that opponents had to shake hands after a game, you sound like a baby, just as Jordan did. unforgivable and unprofessional.... Blah, blah, blah, blah.
The main reason why most of the Pistons walked off without shaking hands was because Jordan went to the media, TV, the newspapers before the sweep and said, and I'm paraphrasing, that "the Pistons were bad for basketball, that they were undeserving champions, and everybody will be happy when they go away." So, why in the F--- would Isiah and Laimbeer shake his hand after he said those things.
The Detroit Pistons had been in five EC Finals in a row and three NBA Finals in a row, winning Back-to-Back NBA World Titles, beat everybody, including MJ three years in a row. So, MJ can piss up a rope as far as Bad Boy Pistons are concerned. We got ours and there's nothing anybody can do about it.
Your acting like micheal did now about playing as a team . He made a bunch of normal people Allstars
Other teams couldn't as they didn't have the same amount of tough guys to do it. Knicks was the closest
Mike 2nd greatest? are you tripping? hahahaha
U trippin fam they was fuccing him up hacking the shit out of him you gotta watch the actual game bro these highlights ain't even showing the real shit they was fuccing him up bro 😂😂
Paxson was scared to shoot do you play basketball 🏀 fam ??i can tell you don't how you talking and you said he the second greatest behind the biggest flopper and loser of all time 😂😂
So so sad when professional basketball players are so threatened by the greatness of another player that they have to result to thuggish behavior to get the win. Disgusting.
Since you keep sayin trust your teammates pipped faked a migraine 😂😂the bulls didn't start going crazy when he learned how to trust his teammates they went crazy when they quit being scared and giving up in mid game 😂😂
Jordan averaged 6 assist against the pistons in those series. I think he always knew 1 man couldn't beat them but they weren't ready. Were they not called Jordan and the Jordanaires at one point? As soon as he got a good squad it was over.
The bad boys exploited the rules back then to the absolute limit.. exploited the wording to the absolute limit..
The bulls roster was razor thin till 1990.. pre 1990 MJ didn’t trust his team mates.. once the triangle offence was learnt by all players completely by the 91 finals then MJ started to trust his team mates..
Once Scottie was fully developed by 1990/91 then bulls became hard to beat and from then onwards MJ started trusting Scottie Paxton Armstrong and co
He had a mid team around him at the time (if you watch, when he passes his teammates can’t even make layups) and they had at least 1-2 flagrants a game against him .. and Jordan STILL figured it out to the point that the pistons were done and he never lost in the finals again.
LBJ isn’t a great comparison .. the spurs actual game plan was, let him shoot .. and they killed the cavs .. if their gameplan against Jordan involves the entire team, multiple defenders, foul him as hard as you need to .. and the game plan against LBJ was “let him shoot” .. yeah, it’s clear one player was feared, the other flawed.
"and Jordan still figured it out to the point that the pistons were done and he never lost in the finals again."
I would certainly hope MJ and the Bulls could figure it out on the FOURTH attempt in the NBA playoffs. If the Pistons being done means that they went to five EC Finals in a row, won three straight EC Championships, and won Back-to-Back NBA World Titles, then my friend, I'm fine with that. Nobody DOMINATED MJ like the Bad Boys did...PERIOD!!
@@artmeddaugh6669 it’s all perspective .. you’re lauding the pistons going to the EC finals 5 times and winning 2 titles as impressive, whilst trying to minimize 6 titles and two 3peats as something anyone would have figured out. Reality is, pistons run was shorter, less successful and 100% ended by the bulls, who then embarked on a STILL unprecedented and unmatched 6 chip run .. I’d stay we’re both clearly biased, I just happen to be right this time.
Side note: no one ever came along and figured out the bulls, even after 6 EC finals appearances .. so it’s apparently not as sure or easy as you make it out to be.
@@michaelshaw8240 Where did I try to minimize 6 titles and two 3peats? I just stated the Bad Boys had their way with MJ and the Bulls three years in a row in the playoffs, that's a fact. Don't forget 3 NBA Finals in a row. Reality is the that the Pistons didn't have the best player in the world on their team like the Bulls did. Detroit played like a team, and their best player was a 6-foot PG. Just because they hounded and harassed MJ all over the court, doesn't give you cover to minimize one of the greatest teams in NBA History.
Don't try to minimize the Pistons five-year run. Whether it was shorter or less successful than the Bulls doesn't mean Jack to me, the facts are the facts. The Bad Boys did what they did to MJ and you, or any other MJ lover can't do a darn thing about it. The Bull's run was shorter and less successful than the Boston Celtics teams of the 50's and 60's that won 8 NBA Championships in a row...so what's your point? And you are wrong on the unprecedented and unmatched part...fool!
@@artmeddaugh6669 you fail repeatedly in your arguments, so it makes sense you’d resort to name calling. You’re in a deep minority when calling Detroit one of the greatest teams in NBA history .. top 75, sure. Top 50, maybe. Top 10 .. not even close .. all 6 bulls teams and at least 3 warriors teams are ahead of them, not to mention multiple lakers and Celtics teams .. but you do seem to define mediocrity as great when it fits your narrative.
3 finals in a row is awesome, 3 finals wins in a row is the bulls. Did the pistons beat the bulls before they went on their run, yep .. clippers beat the warriors, LBJ was beat by different teams,and guess what, Detroit lost with Isaiah before they figured it out .. what the hell does that prove? That experience and a squad are needed to win? Genius .. wow, you’ve unlocked the secret .. all great players lose, and use those experiences as stepping stones to their true greatness. You stay on the side of the stepping stones, because the only “fool” in this conversation is the one who claims Detroit is one of the greatest teams in NBA history when comparing them to the bulls .. I’d say kneel down like the stepping stone detroit ended up as, but I’m quite certain you’ll take the classless approach and refuse to shake the hand of your better, just as they did .. and be remembered for the bad sport you are, just like your team is.
@@michaelshaw8240 I think you need to read the NBA publications and magazines that put the 1989 Detroit Pistons in the Top 10 of the greatest NBA teams of All-Time. I'm looking at a sticker from one of those books at that Detroit team who went 63-19 in the regular season and 15-2 in the playoffs. Swept the Bucks, swept the Celtics, lost 2 to the Bulls, swept the Lakers to win the Championship.
Look it up, foolio, from a schmuck who said the Bulls run was unprecedented and all I had to say was Boston Celtics 8 in a row. You're to much in your MJ feelings, can't cope with the fact that the Bad Boys kicked MJ's Ass not once, not twice, but three times while collecting rings. Haha, can't change it, but I understand why MJ apologists want to deny it ever happened. Grow a pair and accept it for what it is.
You gotta remember this was Mike earning his stripes before trusting his team mates and two 3 peat's...
Only rules they changed for MJ was the illegal offense rule. They stopped those clotheslines bridging etc etc fouls that created fights.
He didn't have that at first they always let him down. But they finally got the right pieces and it was on.
I watched all through the 80s. The player who was constantly mugged by Detroit was Larry Bird. He was constantly being elbowed in the face and neck, smacked in the face, hit in the small of his back and knocked down (of course they knew about his back) and even body slammed. The
Karl Malone put the Jordan Rules on Isiah and then they knew what it was Like.. Isiah got it good with 4 inch gash above his eyebrow. He was the little boy that started it all in Isiah....Karma comes back at you Isiah!!!
And the next game the Pistons played the Jazz, Isiah TORCHED Stockton for 42 points in a Pistons win.
MJ 🐐🐐🐐🐐🐐🐐
The respect wasn’t reciprocated because of what he said about the Detroit in the media once he was going to FINALLY beat us. He was VERY disrespectful…..in public.
It wasn't a coincidence that when Pippen became an All Star, the Bulls started winning championships, so Jordan had to do it alone because the second-highest scorer on the team only averaged 15 points a game, Jordan's scoring average went from 30 points in the regular season to 38 in the playoffs because he was the only one on the team who could handle the added playoff pressure. The Pistons had three all stars and a two time Defensive Player of the year, and Jordan took them to 7 games with no other All Stars on his team. You talk about LeBron passing the ball, and Jordan not passing the ball ... maybe that's the difference between 6 NBA Finals wins and 6 NBA Final loses.
This was early in MJs career before championship mode it wasn't just about trusting the teammates it was also about the teammates being ready for Detroits mental and physical abuse..MJ was the only threat and Detroit wasn't worried about everyone else but once MJ and his leadership lead by example got everyone else mentally and physically tough enough then he could definitely trust them
The Pistons had the Jordan Rules while the Spurs had the Lebron Rule in 2013. 😅
The Bad Boys Pistons are one of if not THE GREATEST defensive team of all time.❤❤❤
The Detroit Pistons were one of the best teams in Nba history, the argument that they were basically professional wrestlers in shorts is good for kids who live in forums and create this alternative universe because they worship this or that player and they can't deal with straight facts.
When they see Laimbeer hitting Jordan they say "killers!!!"
When they see McHale clothesline Rambis mid-air they say "damn the 80s were cool man!"
He does trust his team though, as you could see in the beginning, unfortunately they weren't as good offensively, so he had to work and wait until they could finally play their parts
Lets break it down : Jordan was INDEED a Ball Hog!! BUT you saw he was averaging that 38 pts. The Bad Boy Pistons are 1 of the GREATEST defensive teams of all time and these Rules allowed them to shut him down and FORCE him to f up or pass to his team because they knew they could be the Bulls if Michael wasn't allowed to shot because the rest of them were horrible. In some ways, he had no choice but to keep trying. Its like if early Lebron was playing with 2023-2024 LA clippers, Lebron would pretty much carry the whole team.
The Bad Boy Detroit Pistons. The team that put MJ and the baby bulls out of the NBA playoffs three years in a row, twice in the ECF, while winning three EC Championships in a row, and winning Back-to-Back NBA World Titles, and MJ had to sit and watch. MJ finally won on the FOURTH attempt; some things are unfortunate...
NEAL, THE BULLS TEAM AT THAT TIME WAS NOT READY. THE ONLY STARTER SHOOTER WAS PAXON & OFF THE BENCH WAS CRAIG HODGES! HORACE & SCOTTIE WERE NOT READY YET!
Dude, trust starts in practice. If he sees players slacking in practice, he won't pass in game time.
You guys kept on saying mj wasn’t trusting his teamates. When lebron and the lakers had trash shooters and kept on missing threes, you all were saying “Lebron needs more help”
I agree MJ should have pass the ball Scottie was punched by the bad boys. That was the word back then. That's why he had a migraine in 1990
Bron would cry on every play if he played against the Pistons.
"The secret to stopping MJ." Outscore his teammates. Same way how Golden State "stopped" Lebron in most cases. Jordan averaged 37 points a game against the Pistons. Thats hardly stopping.
There's a Lebron rule,, dont sneeze at him or you'll be on a foul trouble🤣
"The intention of making Jordan rules is to force jordan to pass the ball" from that line it was clear that Jordans teammates was terrible shooters back then. That is why trusting his teammates was hard for him unlike Lebron who played with a lot of good shooters. But if LeBron experienced this kind of rules he will surely bend cause he always flop.
No you are wrong he’s not second, he’s first.LeBron couldn’t of lasted if he was taking the brutal punishment that MJ went thru, he would have quit in the middle of the game, like he always do. They didn’t have no Bill Cartwright Rules ,nor any Scottie Pippen Rules, they only had Rules for MJ. That’s another reason why he was and still is the G.O.A.T. And Kobe Bean Bryant’ is the #2 G.O.A.T Period.
Lebron against a goon squad like the pistons... they would have stomped his ass as strong as he is... Jordan had no quit, jordan played through the pain, jordan refused to stay down...Lebron has no heart... the pistons would have broken him.
Bro needed the triangle offense lol
Mj won 6 ring in 11 full season minus his second year and 95 were he only plays less than 20 games with the bulls being selfish. While lbj only won 4 rings in 20 full season by trusting his teammate and being unselfish most of the time.
Just imagine how many rings lbj will have if he have mj or kobe's unselfishness
The Knicks kinda had a thing for MJ too.
That is why he became a GOAT coz he over come that kind of physicallity and thoughness...he stay on the bulls ang the rest is history..LBJ...?
Hey, RUclipsr. Have you ever tried watching the full games? Very few "Lebron fan reacts" RUclipsrs are respectable enough to bother doing so. But I found a few that do.
Your "Jordan doesn't pass" and "Jordan doesn't trust teammates" would be silenced the moment you watch full games and stop being lazy. Jordan drew double teams like Steph Curry and generally passed it off to the open guy on most drives. They missed. Highlights dont show that context.
You are so used to Lebron superteams that you cannot comprehend how bad MJ's 1980s Bulls teammates were
What's LBJ excuse lol he had plenty of top 75 players plenty of help. He lose a lot of times as well. LBJ had the blue print to chase the league is behind him.
CHECKOUT THE AGE OF THE PISTONS IN 1991. THEY WERE NOT OLD!
jordan had to learn the hard way that its a sport with 4 other players of your team on the court. even if you are the goat. back in the days it was way more physical, flagrant was nearly never a thing! that is why we older generation always tell yall its a different sport since the changes made to the game on physicality, cause lebron would have not been that dominant in the late 80s early 90s.
Naw his teammates had to learn to go harder pippen was scared of the pistons 😂
Labron passes only because he can't shoot
Don't let this clip fool you I saw those games and the pistons had no chance of winning so they had to hurt michael jordan used physicality, hitting him when he came through the lane. And know disrespect to the bulls team they really wasn't a reliable team with out jordan, Because if pistons played the game and didn't brutally foul Michael Jordan, they would've got beat the first time in the eastern conference finals.
Blah, Blah, Blah, Blah. What alternate reality are you living in. I watched all the games as they happened, either in the stands or on TV, and 99% of the time the game was played clean. Yeah, they hit MJ, they fouled him hard, they bumped and elbowed him, tied him up, but that's how the game was played back in the 80's. The Celtics played rough, so did the Sixers and Bucks, even the Lakers mixed it up. So, stop crying about it. Would've, could've, should've. The Bad Boys put MJ down and out three years in a row in the NBA playoffs, twice in the ECF, while going to the NBA Finals all three years and won Back-to-Back NBA World Titles.
Love it, eat it, live with it because that's what happened.
2nd greatest? Watch the best defender highlights.
Lebron never had a shot
Did you say Jordan is the second "Greatest"? Naaah bruh!
2nd greatest player? Lol that’s asinine bro
Lebron don't even play defense lol
AHAHAHAH LEGAY ALWAYS BLAMING HES TEAMATES PERIOD YOU BS
this person is a legay fan...he thinks that legays ERA have a physical def like before...what a clown legay fan..
Hes not like ur Legay So Soft As Cotton dude...
True Mike didn't make the greatest decisions early on.
What decisions to make he ain't have no squad they were all scared pippen faked a migraine 😂😂😂
Jordan's teammates were complete ass until '89 at the earliest. Go watch those games. Hell even the highlights here show it. Wasn't no one hitting shit on that team other than MJ. And the commenter above is correct, other than MJ his teammates were scared to death of Detroit. Pippen was faking migraines.
Bron would cry on every play if he played against the Pistons.
NEAL, THE BULLS TEAM AT THAT TIME WAS NOT READY. THE ONLY STARTER SHOOTER WAS PAXON & OFF THE BENCH WAS CRAIG HODGES! HORACE & SCOTTIE WERE NOT READY YET!