Subtitles are more-or-less fixed! Avatar is still just a Halloween Costume and not a permanent wardrobe change. Animating hair and gloves is hard enough without the extra detail. But I like to think, given the subject matter at the ending of the video, die-hard fans might appreciate the Magus (Chrono Trigger) reference.
I'm pretty sure being the only human, having your parents divorce, and having your brother leave for college on top of being controlled by someone forcing them to do stuff they don't want to do would probably mess Kris up.
They're not the only human. In chapter 2 if you go to the library there's a book with a photo of other "unfamiliar humans". Kris, upon seeing this, quickly shuts the book
Also, isn't it possible that Noelle's focus on "glitches in games" could be meta? Like, since she's in a game, it's effectively her searching for a way to break or circumvent the rules of reality, which is exactly what magic does.
noelle IS the main focus of a creepy secret route that breaks the “rules” of the game (killing someone despite being told that our choices don’t matter)
@@peeka_ Technically, it's the kind of rulebreaking that break what is perceived as rules by using the specifics of what the actual rules are. I think it's called finding a loophole.
@@peeka_ Yes, but I'm starting to think it's not as generic as "choices of others" that breaks the rules of the game, but rather just Noelle herself. Fans might think this sounds relatively boring, but I think all the other chapters weird routes will feature Noelle as well. This explains why chapter 1 didn't have one, since Noelle wasn't there. It fits with all the stories in the Spamton Sweepstakes of Noelle getting connected with finding secrets in games and possibly even connected to Gaster with the eggs.
Makes sense with the fact and her sister seem to have some game breaking past too. She breaks the in game games and the game itself. It’s like she also operates like a game character, like how she joins the party and then feels compelled to follow orders from the player (Whereas it feels like Ralsei and Susie can disobey but will listen out of respect for the friendship (wonder if finding out the meeting was motivated by the player will effect, and wouldn’t have been friends without that interference (shadow Crystals? ). Just like how Asriel could function like a player in UT in a way, Ralsei being “deeper” in the code, Noelle/December’s game glitching abilities, Susie being first mentioned by the clamgirl/goner clamgirl, they all have some sort of “outside” of the game abilities. In way, the shadow world serves as how the world of DR is to us, like “game”/escapism. Those friends are real to them, just like the cast is “real” to us. And maybe lightners are just “game breakers” with authority over the worlds the dark worlds create.
Your primary example of magic actually being shown in the light world is the opening of a dark world, which still makes me think that magic is a property of the dark world, but it's possible we'll see more examples of dark worlds and the light world intersecting. Perhaps that's the nature of the occult in Deltarune?
@@TSSmith well, the light world having magic does not mean that it has the same magic as the dark world or undertale, so healing magic could easily be rare, difficult, or underdeveloped to the point that, yes, the hospital _does_ staff individuals capable of using healing magic, but it does little more than mend bruises or relieve pain that's one possibility that wasn't really mentioned, that lightners can use magic but aren't particularly impressive with it. so noelle could possibly know how to freeze water into snowflakes, or cool a mildly warm room, but something like healing her sick dad back to good health? yeah, perhaps that's a bit more in the realm of fantasy
I don't personally think Kris is DEAD per se, but definitely traumatized in some way by whatever happened at the bunker, likely the same event that made Dess go missing all that time ago. I personally always thought the corpse theming was tying in to Kris not having control of their body, basically being a zombie controlled by some parasitic virus, that being the Player in this analogy.
I would agree with this but Kris' Zombie like movements when removing their soul lead me to believe that there is smth deeper going on. Like, there are clearly themes of possesion that regard to the player but the themes of being dead/ a zombie only come into play whenever the player _isn't_ controlling Kris.
@@tobiasbayer4866 Kris themselves *is* essentially a zombie since we are the soul, and if these two are seen as separate then Kris is left in the "body" position, unable to act much without the soul. The zombie movement when they rip the soul off is cuz they are slowly dying, having their soul separated from their body and all, and have limited time before putting the soul back in again. They are a vessel, a "puppet" for us. We had a different, intended vessel that we created at the beginning, but it got discarded and we got put in Kris instead. I'm curious about why there was a mix-up. I wish the game was released already 🥺
As someone who studies actual black magic on the left hand path... and is convinced toby practices jewish Estoericism in secret, Kris needed a sacrifice. Of either his own blood, or Noelles. The left hand path can be many things but it penultimatey has to revolve around chaos, extreme ego, and bouts of mania.
I swear if that throwaway line about the frozen pond actually is teasing Dess being frozen at the bottom of the river with the red guitar being what Onion is hearing I'm going to be laughing my head off at the ensuing Snowgrave jokes 5 years down the line.
the deltarune theory community going insane due to content starvation to a point where basically any throwaway line or file labelling could potentially be seen as capital lore information is something I didn't expect but also kind of did
I mean that's what's been happening to the undertale fandom for years before deltarune so it's only fitting. Toby has this really consistent way of making games that make people go absolutely feral for more.
@@b_delta9725 Toby actually knows that players of his games will dig into the internal files of the games. We've seen this in Undertale, where an sound file existed within the internal code of the game, that told a warning against people trying to dig into the game's internal code and spoiling the game. A sound file you'd never hear ingame
@@b_delta9725 He originally didn't want ANY data miners because he wanted people to have no idea about how say the fun events in undertale worked. He wanted them to become mew under the truck type things, playground rumors essentially. Data miners leaked everything anyway. Toby then was like, "you wanna look at the code? I'll make you look at the code". For any other game using filenames in theories is a bad idea imo. But for deltarune? Toby knew we'd be datamining he hell out of it because we did it to undertale despite him not wanting us to. His exact reaction to everyone datamining undertale was something like "very well you have made yourself clear"
One of the humans in the Undertale cutscene has a magic staff, and jevil tail rises Kris' magic capacity over zero, so yeah, tools/objects allowing humans to perform magic makes sense
This reminds me of a fan comic I saw once in twitter with Kris and Catti summoning a demon in Catti’s room. Kris tried to finish the spell, and after everything was finished, Catti asked if it had work. At this point, Kris was already possessed by the player, and when tying to answer, the player text box pops up with the options of Yes and No. I wish I could remember who the artist was. This was about a year ago I saw it, I believe
@@coldslawsYES! I just saw your comment so I tried looking it up, and it was even better than what I remembered. Especially good for such a short comic too
I havent finished the video yet, but when you dont use magic in the ralsie tutorial, Ralsie will wonder if humans cant even ask other people to use magic, which means that darkners seem to have it as an accepted fact that humans cant use magic in the first place. (Fun fact! This is the same dialogue that describes why kris points when acting)
To expand on this point, what's interesting about Kris's ACT commands enhancing monster magic in the boss battles is it parallels what we already know to be true about humans from Undertale's barrier. Someone will probably go like "Deltarune and Undertale aren't the same canon you fool" but that doesn't hold a ton of relevance in this context considering how similar they are in relation to one another. We have to assume that they at least have shared plot elements, as it's been proven many times how they are directly connected. Anyways I could be wrong about that but if I'm not, Undertale’s barrier lore specifically states that humans used magic to seal the monsters underground. We know that Frisk cannot use magic canonically, but another thing we also know is that the orb that got it’s mechanic retconned was supposedly going to grant them the power to use magic. Of course this doesn’t technically happen in canon, but even without those unused assets as evidence we see a human with a staff wielding some form of magic in the starting cutscene. From those three things, we can put them together and reasonably conclude that humans can likely only do magic when channeling it through some form of powerful object themselves. We never really have this interaction play out directly in Deltarune, but I’d like to make a case for why this could exist there as well. In Deltarune, I think Kris might be able to harness the Thorn Ring in the same way. Noelle is casting the spell. But she says herself that she doesn’t know the spell. However, we do. And by commanding her to use it through our TP, we can channel SnowGrave through her. We can't do this when any other ring is equipped, only the Thorn Ring. It's object specific. I think this also works in a similar way during other fights, where Kris is shining the power of their soul onto Susie and Ralsei in order for them to use their spells. Another example I’d like to bring to mind is Susie’s solo fight with Lancer. She doesn’t use Rude Buster in battle without Kris there and is priorly berserked into regular attacks until she starts listening to Kris in battle. I don't think it's fair to say that she just wasn't listening to the player in this battle and that's why she didn't use her spells. Because at this point in the story she has definitely realized the power of Rude Buster in battle. If she was trying to get past Lancer in sheer anger, wouldn't it make sense to use her strongest spells with the TP you build up during the battle? She and Ralsei do use magic outside of battle, but as far as we know that system may work entirely differently and we still never see them use Red Buster or Dual Heal which are specifically the magics that Kris grants power for them to use. The prophecy does state that it requires a human, a monster, and a prince of the dark. What if that’s the reason why? Kris's SOUL could very well be the key to harnessing enhanced magic in the dark world. This idea has a lot of potential holes (Undertale/Deltarune not being synonymous in magic system, objects just not being the connection at all, all spells outside of the ACT command being useable outside of battle, etc.) but I hope that was at least an interesting thought experiment. I'm very interested in just how the magic system will unfold.
@@BelBelle468 Ralsei's Pacify spell. He has, like, 10 likes of dialogue each for every possible button you can press when you're ignoring what he's asking you to do
@@AltoRed_doesnt that make them pansexual? i mean, if theyre gay and they dont have a gender, who are the people their gender? i mean, yeah they could be gay for other nonbinary people but🤔
I'd also raise the fact that Kris can, somehow, phase their hand through their chest and reach into some sort of weird astral plane where the culmination of their being is, then grab that culmination of their being, and then somehow pull it out into the real world whilst their chest has no damage whatsoever including to the sweater (showing that the soul isn't like, literally in their body like their real heart is), and then ALSO being able to put it straight back inside of them, phasing it through AGAIN. To me, this has gotta be at least one instance of magic in the Light World, right?
Halfbread PLEASE check into Werewire’s check enemy dialogue. It’s one of the only mentions of the word nightmare in deltarune and definitely relates to kris
@@TheSkyGuy77 might as well be. It’s like when I liken fetuses to parasites. Stealing the nutrients from the host and getting bigger. Sure it’s not actually a parasite and eventually will come out in around 10 months and then live on their own in 20 years. But they kinda be acting parasitic.
I think that the fountain isn’t magic. Queen said that by focusing their will and determination into a blade, one could make a dark fountain. I feel it’s more a technique than magic. “I CAST CREATE DARK FOUNTAIN”
that's still supernatural though? unless you're trying to say that 'magic' specifically refers to stuff like healing spells, and bullets and stuff like that.
I think there may be a human version of magic, less about bullets and summoned attacks, but more about the soul. Y’know, making/closing dark worlds, saving and loading, the [[BIGSHOT]] and making/destroying the barrier (seeing as human souls are needed for it to work) (Also Undertale Yellow isn’t cannon but if it was, the laser thing from the genocide route’s end would also count)
Dude, so much of this sounds highly improvable, but yet you tie it all together with little bits and pieces of info. You’re AMAZING, and this is why I subbed.
While Noelle's line about magic is vague enough to still allow for magic to exist, I'd say the situation is pretty good evidence it doesn't in a large capacity. She's wishing she could use healing magic to cure her dad... In a hospital who's job it is to cure her dad. If any place would have a magic-user, even if magic was somewhat restricted by religion, I'd say it'd be the hospital. After all, healing magic is often aligned with holy magic in jrpgs and the like which Deltarune is definitely taking some inspiration from. (And parodying somewhat) Also, while Determination is basically magic to us, Kris's moves powered by their soul in boss fights are classified as acts, so I feel we cant really classify feats of soul power to "magic" in the way it is defined in the Deltarune world. Is Determination a soul power? I dont know, its all very unclear at the moment, but it's reason to be hesitant anyways. Other than that I enjoyed every other part of this video though! Kris being undead would be an interesting parallel to Flowey, perhaps Kris was injected with Determination too in order to save their life? Although, the only one I could see doing that in this universe is Gaster lol. "Weird" being a sort of code word definitely has some interesting implications we'll have to keep an eye on for the rest of the story.
I think there may be a human version of magic, less about bullets and summoned attacks, but more about the soul. Y’know, making/closing dark worlds, saving and loading, the [[BIGSHOT]] and making/destroying the barrier (seeing as human souls are needed for it to work) (Also Undertale Yellow isn’t cannon but if it was, the laser thing from the genocide route’s end would also count)
I think Kris’ divorced parents, lack of good friends prior to Susie and Ralsei, and co-dependent attachment to their brother due to said lack of friends may have led to some serious mental health issues, only exacerbated by Asriel going to college and Toriel seeming to be completely oblivious to what her kid is going through
@@scruffles3838 Maybe that’s what the “Kris seeing through their hand” means. They don’t want to be perceived, maybe? Perhaps instead of believing they’re invisible, they want to be invisible, because they’re disgusted by their own human form, or for some other reason. It’d be in character and a hell of an allegory. This could explain Susie’s too. Maybe instead of interpreting it as Susie glaring at Kris, it’s her staring straight through them, because as much as they love Susie they can’t stand to feel perceived.
I HAVE BEEN SO ADAMENT ABOUT MAGIC IN THE LIGHT WORLD FOREVER. I do like the take that it's tied to religion. That has a lot of interesting implications for the story.
My thoughts on magic in deltarune are more along the lines of it still existing but more unknown to monsters. After all in undertale, magic explained how monsters such as Grillby even existed and we see in deltarune there are flame people that still exist. I think magic is inherent to this world, just not normalized or even understood amongst the general population. That's why we hear so little about it and why it could be seen as taboo. I liked the costume btw!
I really should be revising for 2 tests tomorrow, but nope. HalfBreadChaos video takes full priority. Edit: So I’ve watched the video now and here is my theory on why Kris wants to use magic. Undertale has shown that only monsters can use magic and humans can’t. Kris is the only human in a town full of monsters, so they feel like an outcast and want to be a monster, thus explaining why they wore the red horn headband. Magic most likely still exists in the world of Deltarune, and as I mentioned before, only monsters can use it. Kris wants to try and blend in as a monster as much as possible, thus trying to use magic in any way they can, which is why they study occult magic with Catty and have searched online how to use magic. Edit 2: I don’t remember where or when in the game exactly, but there is a book in the library, which when opened, is about humans. Kris immediately shuts the book without our control, thus more evidence that Kris doesn’t like being a human.
undertale never says humans cant use magic it only says humans cant express themselves with magic or something like that meaning for humans magic is most likley something similar to a martial art not something they are incapable of doing afterall they made the barrier which is stated to be magic
One thing i haven't seen anyone take into account yet is how Undertale focused on how human souls have Determination naturally, while in Monster souls, determination makes their bodies melt, so they dont have it as much and it's really rare; Boss monsters are the only ones strong enough to have souls that persist after death and have souls that have a bit of Determination in them The barrier required a Monster Soul and a Human soul in order to cross through it; we're told that the reason why humans were frightened of monsters was because monsters could absorb human souls (i dont remember how they can do this without melting...???) Whereas in Deltarune, Cyber Queen implied that "any lighter with enough determination can create a Dark Fountain" which makes me wonder if she meant if both humans and monsters have Determination in their souls I dont know what that would mean for magic in Deltarune, i guess for some reason i assumed that having Determination in Undertale, meant you weren't as good with Magic, or more incompatible with Magic, seeing as Undyne's "puzzle" in pascifist route was to push rocks down a waterfall because she didn't want to make a puzzle There's a book in the library at one point where it talks about the nature of souls in Deltarune, but i forgot which chapter it was
I wonder… maybe Kris made a deal with Gaster to try and help find Dess? Since they and Noelle are childhood friends, I could totally see them recognizing how much Noelle is struggling and selling their soul to try and help. To get stronger in a way similar to Noelle on the weird route.
Something that has been weaseling around in my head is that Kris' "Human" class description is "Body containing a human SOUL" which is... Kind of a really strange way to phrase that I wonder if Kris is like, a Zombie Monster, or something? Like, literally a body with a human soul within. (Heck, if a "human" can be a human body with a human soul, it might even explain why Sans bleeds, knows about timeline stuff, and can dodge attacks and the like)
Undyne said that Sans *is really good at dodging* which implies that other monsters try to dodge your hits but are bad at it. Besides Asgore since he probably can dodge but doesn't do that, Omega Flowey because he is just basically Titan like and Asriel since he is god like.
This is an interesting video indeed. I really like the editing of it... I personally still think that magic doesn't exist in the Light world the same way it did in Undertale, the only form of "magic" that we can see is the opening of Dark fountains... I like the idea that the magic each character has in the Dark world is somehow shaped by their feelings, desires or general nature, and that the same sort of magic is not possible in the Light world. Notice how Light world magic is only referred to as "magic tricks" or occult related spells and rituals... which isn't really how magic works in either the Dark world or Undertale, however it is the concept of "magic" that we have in our real world. I think that light world magic is just that, tricks and occult, aside from opening dark fountains which could be tied more so to the nature of the Dark worlds themselves (they are these sorts of spaces formed by objects coming to life, which is why the Lightners are seen as "superior" to Darkners- they quite literally have the power to give these objects a story by interacting with them and using them, hence creating the Dark worlds in that manner) rather than some sort of Light world magic by itself.
I agree. Magic doesn't seem to exist, but determination on the other hand? It seems more prevalent than ever, with it seeming like every Lightner regardless of human or monster has a substantial enough amount of it. Enough to open dark fountains.
It is very easy to forget that in Undertale it was humanity who sealed away the monsters with magic, creating the Barrier at the cost of human life. That sounds quite occult and ritualistic, doesn't it? And since the opening scene of Deltarune portrays the world as one where the monsters never were sealed and for all intents and purposes *take the place of humanity*, is it so hard to assume that their magic situation would be flipped as well? And I do hear you say: there are humans above ground! Kris was adopted and they had to come from somewhere! But consider this. Would the monsters take the same actions that humanity did, and seal away the defeated species, killing the rest, or would they accept whoever surrendered? And furthermore, who's to say that the Barrier was not still made by the same people, for the opposite purpose? This of course requires evidence of The War happening in Deltarune, confirmation of the thematic framing of monsterkind taking the place of humanity on the surface, and an explanation of what exactly is humanity's situation is. And y'know, the Barrier having any significance in Deltarune.
What if magic is basically illegal in light world? Like if a woman could do anything out of the ordinary in the Middle Ages, she was considered a witch and burned at the stake. If you talk straight about magic here, people might think bad about you, leading to unwanted consequences. From a religious point of view, magic is something hellish and demonic, which even reinforces the theory of Kris giving out their soul to a devil. That also consolidates light & dark worlds as faith & sorcery worlds. Actually, what are darkners' points on religion? Was that ever mentioned in the game?
@@joshuasanders162 This is certainly an interesting way to think about this, though I personally don't think that humans have magic in Deltarune. I believe that instead of the magic we knew from UT (even the magic that the old human mages used to posess), we simply have... well, determination. The power to will Dark worlds into being, that each Lightner- human or monster- has. As I said in my original comment, I think that this could also be somewhat related to how the Darkners are objects, and by interacting with them and using them in our daily life we give them a story of their own... here in Deltarune, this is shown by the objects quite literally coming to life, and having their stories/abilities shaped by the Lightners who have interacted with them in the Light world (such as Spamton knowing Noelle, or Queen's search result rooms... so on, so forth). The existence of magic in the Light world is, in my opinion, just party tricks or occult, not really the magic we see in other places in UTDR. But again, this is just my personal interpretation- I don't know- nor can I know- where Toby Fox himself is going with all this. And every other interpretation is just as valid.
Happy to see someone pointing out that Kris not only has connections to Spamton, but Jevil as well. It's very interesting seeing just how much people have been able to discover with only 2/7th's of a game. Great video!
I do really like the idea that magic exists as more of a spiritual and religious thing in Deltarune. It would bring me a step closer to believing Kris is also named after the 'kris' dagger, as it is a spiritual dagger believed to possess magical powers.
With regard to your point on the Swatchling ACTs: I was asking myself, "What body of water in Hometown could have frozen over in the winter to be used to ice-skate?" There's really only one it could be, and that's the pond where Onionsan hangs around. In chapter 2, there is some secret dialogue in which Onionsan tells Kris that he can hear music coming from deep beneath the pond. We know that a certain winter-themed person has *somehow* disappeared, and we also know they're associated with a guitar - a musical instrument. If this scenario with skating on the pond happens to be real foreshadowing, I...think you might have just figured out where Dess is.
We know that in Undertale humans also had access to magic, given that they were able to seal the monsters underground with a magic spell, so maybe in Deltarune it's not that there is no magic, but that the roles of humans and monsters were flipped. Maybe in Deltarune the humans are the ones that regularly perform magic, but keep it to themselfes, and monsters are the ones where doing magic is limited to a select few powerful people. Edit: Or given how in Deltarune everyone has determination, not just humans, maybe everyone can do magic aswell and its just really really rare? For example only one monster in Undertale could use determination (Undyne) and all of humanity apparently only had 8 wizards. So in Deltarune maybe everyone has both, its just much, much weaker/rarer.
It could also be that, as technology progresses, there was less of a necesity to learn magic, specially the more complicated spells and such, so people just didn't learn as much, and as years go by, magic is probably just not something common that you learn without looking out for it
@@Nobuhara Would be cool but that wouldn explain the existence of Kris and the "how to care for a human" book. To me it seems like they are both free and know about each other, they are just segregated. Either willingly or unwillingly.
Well in Undertale, it doesn't really say that monsters can't have determination but too much of it, they will melt and Asriel says it himself; "They're all burning with the same desire. With everyone's power... With everyone's determination..." I also think Undyne says this as well in the genocide route, I might be wrong about that part.
@@tobiasbayer4866 What I'm thinking, is that instead of one race being banished, the two races negotiated and thus have become restricted from the use of magic. Possibly to prevent another war? So technically they can use magic, they just are incapable because of a treaty of some kind?
One thing that still bugs my mind is Kris’ skin color in the dark world, it’s the only one who’s skin color changed. In my limited knowledge I see blue skin as hints of lack of oxygen. My theory is that Kris didn’t sold his soul, at least not willingly. This is just speculation but maybe he got himself in a situation that should have killed him (mainly by drowning) but at that moment either someone gave him a deal to save him for the exchange of his soul or he offered his soul to get saved. That’s just my headcanon
As far as I'm concernned that line you brought up about magic tricks requiring floating hands and orbs confirms that Magic is still an element in this universe. The concept of having hands that float off of your body is one of many things about monsters that are biologically and physically impossible, and thus can only be really rationalized with magic. Another instance of this is that the text on the graves heavily implies that Monster's burial customs are the same as they are in Undertale, which implies that just like in Undertale they are made primarily of magic with only a small fraction of flakey dust-like matter comprising their physical mass. The thing about Kris tho is that it's a pretty clear fundamental element of their character that they can't do magic. Yes, Undertale was a bit self-contradictory on whether Humans use magic, but the only time they're even suggested to be capable of it is in the case of them making the barrier, and the picture on screen when that's described specifically shows a human mage using a big glowy firey magic staff, which seems to suggest an obvious way to reconcile the seeming contradiction, that humans are indeed not _natively_ capable of magic, and can only use it by using artifacts granted with magic power. For Kris in particular, a massive chunk of the narrative surrounding their character seems to be about how they feel othered and ostracized in the monster community for being Human. They want to do magic not just because they're mimicking their family like a child does, but because they wish they were like their family, because they're painfully aware that they're not. The Dark World furthers this, by showing that even when the others get magic boosts and have whole skill loadouts centering around magic, Kris's skillset is deliberately limited to Actions, and, even when they're stuck in a big boss battle by themselves, special attacks that are more akin to physical skills than anything magical. As for how they make the Dark World, I can get behind the notion that it's magic, but it's very clearly not a normal common type of magic. If it was, at least SOMEONE in town would know about it. The ability to create entire pocket dimensions should obviously be a big deal, and thus be relatively common knowledge if it's actually a normal thing. Even with Kris having connections to the Occult as established by Catti, if the Dark Fountains were based on powers Catti had experience with, shouldn't she know about it by now? All this combined with the fact that its connection to Gaster is still being alluded to it even when Kris uses it to make the chapter 3 Dark Fountain, (With the TV static and creepy smile showing up on the TV, both elements associated with Gaster,) I think that its some kind of special Shadow-Dimensional magic that Gaster discovered and is imbuing into Kris. After all, if Fountains need Determination, which is something that even Deltarune suggests comes from the Soul, Soulless Kris should be unable to make a Fountain anyway.
i just noticed that the word Gaster has 6 letters does that mean Toby wanted to name him "Dr.WingDing Aster",but the word aster has only 5 letters,so he was like "nahh,you'll be Gaster then"
The whole “Kris isn’t Chara, they just went to eat nighttime pie,” twist from the start of Chapter 2 has me convinced that Chapter 3 will begin a similar way. Rather than it being the opening of a Dark World, this is actually just an Epic Prank, and Kris just caused a bunch of smoke to erupt by rupturing a pipe.
They could be messing with the player, especially in pacifist route Kris and the player will probably end up becoming more like friends It could have different meanings as well In pacifist route, it's just Kris playing a prank to the player/soul In the snow grave one, it's Kris trying to prove that they are in control as well
The section about magic in the Light World is very intriguing. We definitely know that the Light World operates on some kind of rules beyond our reality's laws of physics; not just because of the ability to create Fountains or remove one's own SOUL, but due to the existence of monsters like the ghosts and fire elementals, whose anatomy would be impossible in our world. And based on the bunny child who remarks on humans being "made of blood," and monster funeral rites seeming identical between Undertale and Deltarune, it seems like Deltarune monsters are animated by magic rather than physical matter just like in Undertale. So magic definitely seems to be an active force within Deltarune's world even outside of Dark Worlds. However, I think it's pretty indisputable that whatever magic exists in the Light World is very different from the kind we see used in the Dark Worlds. Noelle can cast Heal Prayer in the Dark World without any prior instruction, but very explicitly does not know healing magic in "real life." True, Susie might not know how to wield an axe in "real life" either... But pay close attention to what specifically Noelle says about healing. She describes the Dark World as a place "where everything can be healed with a little spell," and then later, says that if she knew healing magic in "real life," she'd use it to make Rudy better. So it seems like she genuinely believes that the Heal Prayer spell she can cast in the Dark World would be capable of curing whatever Rudy is afflicted with. Whether or not she's correct about this, the fact that Noelle believes it tells us something crucial - that the doctors who are currently treating Rudy cannot cast Heal Prayer in the Light World. If they could, then either he would already be cured, or Noelle would know that Heal Prayer couldn't make him better. Surely if healing magic is possible in the Light World, even if it were more difficult or obscure, medical professionals would be the one group that would for sure have access to it? So it can't just be a matter of Noelle not knowing the spell outside of Dark Worlds; *nobody* in the Light World can use it. Either that, or the cultural taboo against magic is so strong that doctors would refuse to use healing magic even to save a life, which I find difficult to believe. Meanwhile, Heal Prayer in the Dark Worlds seems to be very easy to learn; both Ralsei and Noelle know it, with Noelle knowing it despite arriving in the Cyber World for the first time only hours beforehand. Even Susie is able to learn a little healing despite it being incompatible with her personality. Basically, what this tells us is that the Light World and Dark World are operating on completely different magic systems. Whatever magic is possible in the Light World, it does *not* include the mechanics of gathering TP and spending it to cast spells like Heal Prayer. And, pulling this back to the actual topic of the video, this TP system is also how Noelle is able to cast both IceShock and Snowgrave, meaning that her ice magic is likely not possible within the Light World. I wouldn't be surprised if Kris and Noelle's trauma, and Dess's disappearance, is somehow related to the cold; however, I think it's probably just a mundane blizzard that coincided with whatever the event was, or maybe falling into the frozen lake if the Swatchling flavor text is indeed Woshua-esque foreshadowing. As for Kris looking up how to use magic, I personally still think they're probably the Knight, so I suspect that was them researching how to make Dark Worlds. Even if they're not the Knight and didn't know how to make Dark Worlds until Queen explained it, their whole situation with the red SOUL isn't exactly normal, or physically possible in our reality, so they'd still have reason to research magic in order to try to deal with that. Or maybe it was part of their research on demon-summoning, which may be part of the Light World's magic system. It's too early to say for sure one way or another, but the possibilities are certainly intriguing!
i love arriving early enough to a video that you get to see the like count scroll up live. very good points regarding magic. it might be too early to say for certain if magic does exist (barring the opening of the dark world), but there def isn't enough evidence to say no magic exists, only that it's not as common as it was in undertale fantastic ending, pulled a 10/10 on my spookometer
its rare that I watch a Deltarune theory video and I'm told information about the games code that I've never heard before (The X coordinate trigger) Loved this great video *_-the ceo of 💀_*
I dont know what it is about your theories but they are just so well put together. It really feels like your looking at the correct aspects toby fox wants us to analyse
something i never really thought about until now is Spamton's line of "maybe you three can break your own strings", is Ralsei under some kind of control? we know he feels obligated to help lighters, but is there more to that? what about Susie? what kind of control is she under?
They are all bound by prophecy. Considering Susie literally takes away choices from you sometimes, she probably isn't being directly controlled by anything. But her "path" is decided by the prophecy pretty much.
Maybe it's something other than control? Like, the player can MAKE a character do a thing. But being BOUND by morality also compels them. INSTINCT and self-serving also dictates what you do. So Ralsie is bound by morality. Susie is bound by either poverty, or image, or instinct. While Kris is controlled physically.
HalfBreadChaos's attempt at JaruJaru's theorizing style felt surprisingly accurate, yet somehow still kinda possible on some points. Also FINALLY someone points out that humans *can* (or at least could) use magic!
I had always assumed Kris made an agreement with Gaster somehow, just like Jevil and Spamton. No way us being in control of Kris is a freak accident. They probably want to find Dess, to return their life back to when they played with Noelle all the time, their family wasn't split apart, etc, or to gain friends through this weird journey we're taking. I feel like Spamton solidified how this will play out. Gaster gives Kris the player to get through this/solve things they couldn't on their own, but the moment the player/Gaster leaves Kris (or Suzie/Noelle figure out Kris is being controlled), everything will go up in flames just like it did when Gaster left Spamton. Edit: To add on, Kris is probably acting 'weird' to us because they have their end of a deal to fill. It can't just be letting the player in. Gaster wants something of us and Kris, and Gaster is probably the one setting the terms of the agreement. Everything they do when they take us out is for a reason.
5:52 Kris knows how to bake and has definitely helped Toriel out before, since she casually asks them to help with the pie at the end of Chapter 2. Toriel isn't the only one who uses that stove, and Kris can't use magic, so that could be the reason why the stovetop is dirty; magic isn't gone, Toriel just has a housemate now.
@@david5310 actually, this doesn't happen just when you follow toriel. It happens few metres from the stairs whenever you stand there and look right. Maybe it's just a bug, gotta check if some letsplayer had this thing too.
What if Noelle wishing she “knew healing magic in real life” is not referring to healing magic being real, but rather that she wishes she could wield healing magic just like she could in the Dark World.
Yeah I thought it was a somewhat obvious allusion to wanting to heal her father, who is repeatedly shown to be extremely, if not terminally ill. With him saying 'they found something and now I have to stay [in the hospital]' (paraphrased). Usually you just measure stuff, but doing a scan and /finding/ something hints at maybe cancer, or at least a monster version of it, since tumours are more of an 'object'. Coming from the perspective of a terminally ill girl with brain cancer :') I empathise a lot with Noelle and Rudy. I too wish I knew healing magic in real life... But it's one of those things where it could certainly be drawn to mean a lot! But Occam's (or is it Hanlon's?) Razor is a hell of a thing. Sometimes the simplest answer is key for this one, in that she has the magic in the Dark World, this 'dream' she thinks she's having, and wishes she could have it in 'real' life (hopefully for the sake of her dad).
4:24 (this is an answer to the question in the chapters name) considering Madjick is a thing in the DR universe(since there is a little line that references Madjicks floating hands and orbs) Magic probably something only some species of monster could use despite the fact that all monsters(or at least most of them) are made of magic
11:22 I think that kris has gotta be looking for dess. I feel like there wouldn’t be many other things a human who lives a… (honestly) sub happy life would summon a demon for. Maybe one time kris scared noel so badly that she accidentally used magic she didn’t know she had. Kind of like when you get scared and as a creature who evolved to live in the wild, automatically find a way to defend yourself. Examples could include but are not limited to: slapping, punching, yelling, or using deadly ice magic.
you're the best, bread, so excited for this new video. the section on summarizing how the word "weird" is used in the game is very interesting, and i'll definitely be keeping a look out for mentions of the word in future chapters. i have also had the headcanon that kris and noelle were involved in some kind of deal with the "devil" situation for a while so i'm happy to see you mention something similar. my favorite and least favorite thing about deltarune are the fourth wall breaks, because as fun as they are it's hard to tell which ones are story-significant (spamton, seam, ralsei??) and which ones are just for functional purposes/jokes (lancer, background characters, low level enemies). i think there are definitely some characters that know way too much about the nature of their world and kris could be one of them. i hope we get to meet kris's genuine personality without the influence of the player or other third parties, if not through a segment where the player is ejected from their body then through a cutscene of the past or something. i also really hope we get a clear recap of what happened to kris, asriel, noelle, and dess on the day that dess disappeared by the end of the series. your theories are always so interesting and great to relisten to while at work because the voice is clear enough that i can understand easily so i appreciate the style of your videos. deltarune theory videos in general are such a comfort side of youtube to me but your videos especially are thought-provoking and approachable and rewatchable. the animations and visuals on this one are fantastic as well, so yeah basically keep up the great work. (i am required by law to ramble incoherently about deltarune for several hundred words on every theory post sorry) (toby fox what have you done to me)
Another thing with the word "weird"- I'm pretty sure it used to be used to refer to someone skilled in magic. So in Macbeth, the witches are referred to as the Weird Sisters, meaning that they use magic. Which, thinking about it as someone breaking the laws of reality, makes a lot of sense...
6:28 Speaking of protection and Noelle, anyone else see how the ice globe thing that shows up around Noelle at the end of most battles in the Snowgrave Route looks like a shield? Like we're trapping her within our control, and protecting her from the truth of the horrific things we made her to do? What makes this worse is that we shatter this shield we've made for her when she notices our watch. "In your dream." Chilling.
yknow yeah, honestly the idea to think of the opening of the dark world itself is magic just sorta never occured to me that reminds me tho, idk if its important at all but what the hell is that little effect (8:06) that appears behind kris right before they stab the earth? my best guess is that its supposed to represent the in-game attack mechanic or bullets, but whats with that weird up and down pattern that almost looks like a melody on a piano roll? been thinking about it since chapter 2 dropped
no halfbread, kris nailing a pipeline and poisoning their household is not magic /j always so happy when you upload with fascinating, unique theories that don't go over an hour (though with your style, i wouldn't mind an hour long theory some day)
Awesome video as always ! I don't know how to explain it, but I think it's one of these theories that, if it happens to be true, i'll be like "Ok yeah it makes sense", but if it doesn't I'll be like "Well yeah figures" Like the proof is there, yet it still feels a lil farfetched, but it's tied incredibly well still. So I don't know, let's just wait and see i guess ✌️
I love your videos, and I can really see the quality improving! Your pixel art is becoming God-tier, my friend, and it really adds to your theory diving.
hey did you know about the origins and archaic definitions of the word "weird"? like, the old english word "wyrd" means "destiny", and as an adjective, "weird" used to mean "having the power to control destiny"??? and how it used to be a verb or even noun relating to spells or the act of casting them????? anyway just some fun facts haha
That's a really cool fact actually. Feels like it can fit in well, as there is already symbolism about changing destiny in the weird route, like the hospital bead toy. The bead toy in the hospital usually has flavor text stating something like: "The beads march grimly along their set path." But after the weird route, this bead toy is mysteriously broken.
7:07 another thing to note about the idea that Kris likes magic, or at least the idea of it, is the description for Act "Do all sorts of things. It isn't magic." the fact that the game specifies that it isn't magic feels significant yes, this is the explanation as to why it doesn't cost any TP (usually), but TP cost is already a separate thing displayed, and most players would understand that it isnt magic and therefore costs no TP Kris wants to do magic, but they cant
ive always subscribed to the idea that both frisk and kris are undead, even before chapter 2 came out. my interpretation of frisk was always that they were charas body with the players soul in it. said interpretation was inspired by flowey and chara's dialouge. also frisk literally means "to seize" like the player seizing control over charas body. i could go more into detail but i dont feel like dropping a wall of text (also ive always wanted to make a video about it)
About the Kris being a ghost or something, i still find interesting the quote Goner Kid said back in deltarune: " Have you ever thought about a world where everything is exactly the same..., Except you don't exist? Everything functions perfectly without you... Ha, ha... The thought terrifies me" Specially since in one of the teasers in chapter 4 (or 3? i dont remember to check) it IS raining. And Frisk can offer the Goner Kid an umbrella... (but is it a coincidence? Or foreshadowing?) Maybe its the reverse? The way kris's room is depicted, it seems like they're inserted into the world. Btw sans's door in undertale also seems to have the weird light... what about "weird" in undertale?
I'm in total agreement on Kris probably summoning a demon or other entity, like Gaster, ICE-E, or The Knight. But I disagree about the state of magic. Magic has only been shown to be related to darkworlds in deltarune. Even Kris stabbing the ground is creating a dark fountain, so we have no non-darkworld related magic depicted on screen. I'm not saying magic doesn't exist, just that the evidence on what it is inconclusive right now. It's possible it's like Undertale, but the evidence leaves too much doubt, at least for me. Of course Chapter 3 might start out with Toriel telling us how she flunked out of M,agic classes three times before she got her license. Anyways another banger :D
2:53 WHAT. I never knew this dialogue existed in Undertale. That's really cool! And weird... because Washua as an enemy only appears in Waterfall which is a section of the game that comes before you even learn about Chara & Asriel's story in all of the routes.
Hey HalfBread! I'm having a really hard time right now, and I want you to know that your content is amazing and your videos is one of the very few things that I like that i currently can direct my attention to without triggering more anxiety. You make some of the most impressively thought out and logically founded theories and analyses I've seen regarding Deltarune, and your inclusive and friendly attitude makes me feel welcome even if I'm just lurking. I hope you keep making great content, whether it's Deltarune or something else that you enjoy. You are a wonderful person, thank you for existing.
I just feel like there's been a seperation of what Humans abilities and Monster magic is. I think if creating dark worlds counts and magic, then Saving and Loading is also magic. The one thing that ties them together is determination. Though it feels like Undertale especially (except for the opening sequence) makes it very clear that Humans can't use the same magic monsters can at the very least. I guess you could also argue Frisk being able to increase his defense through "Hope" and heal himself with "Dreams" is magic at the end of the pacifist route in that case.
Subtitles are more-or-less fixed! Avatar is still just a Halloween Costume and not a permanent wardrobe change.
Animating hair and gloves is hard enough without the extra detail. But I like to think, given the subject matter at the ending of the video, die-hard fans might appreciate the Magus (Chrono Trigger) reference.
Nuh uh
Uh huh
It appears that the subtitles are already there
Wait up, thou hast a new sprite?
yuh huh
I'm pretty sure being the only human, having your parents divorce, and having your brother leave for college on top of being controlled by someone forcing them to do stuff they don't want to do would probably mess Kris up.
True true
but in this case, halfbread is trying to figure out why they were weird even before the soul, and that the soul was even a choice of theirs
they aren't the only human in existance, just in the town, so technically they would sorta fit in
They're not the only human. In chapter 2 if you go to the library there's a book with a photo of other "unfamiliar humans". Kris, upon seeing this, quickly shuts the book
@@brawlmaster0190 in town
Which is also closed
I hate how this sounds batshit insane yet somehow reasonable
* A small white dog is laughing at you.
@@thewindwakinghero7423
*I’m yelling at a dog…
*god is a dog and I’m yelling at it…
Welcome to Deltarune theorizing.
@@Wh1teNoise616i got the reference
I mean, that's just Toby Fox, the UTDR fandom, and Bread for you.
Fun fact: the word "weird" comes from the Old English word "wyrd", which meant *fate,* *destiny,* or *doom.*
Kris is the doom slayer?!?!?!
@@DogsRNicereal
Wyrdeer
this is such a sexy fun fact i will b thinking about this for days thank u
"Wyrd" also has a connection to magic if I am remembering right!
Also, isn't it possible that Noelle's focus on "glitches in games" could be meta? Like, since she's in a game, it's effectively her searching for a way to break or circumvent the rules of reality, which is exactly what magic does.
noelle IS the main focus of a creepy secret route that breaks the “rules” of the game (killing someone despite being told that our choices don’t matter)
@@yeet1208 technically, we don't break the rules, since despite out choices not mattering, choices of others do, which we abuse to our own advantage
@@peeka_ Technically, it's the kind of rulebreaking that break what is perceived as rules by using the specifics of what the actual rules are. I think it's called finding a loophole.
@@peeka_ Yes, but I'm starting to think it's not as generic as "choices of others" that breaks the rules of the game, but rather just Noelle herself. Fans might think this sounds relatively boring, but I think all the other chapters weird routes will feature Noelle as well. This explains why chapter 1 didn't have one, since Noelle wasn't there. It fits with all the stories in the Spamton Sweepstakes of Noelle getting connected with finding secrets in games and possibly even connected to Gaster with the eggs.
Makes sense with the fact and her sister seem to have some game breaking past too. She breaks the in game games and the game itself. It’s like she also operates like a game character, like how she joins the party and then feels compelled to follow orders from the player (Whereas it feels like Ralsei and Susie can disobey but will listen out of respect for the friendship (wonder if finding out the meeting was motivated by the player will effect, and wouldn’t have been friends without that interference (shadow Crystals? ).
Just like how Asriel could function like a player in UT in a way, Ralsei being “deeper” in the code, Noelle/December’s game glitching abilities, Susie being first mentioned by the clamgirl/goner clamgirl, they all have some sort of “outside” of the game abilities.
In way, the shadow world serves as how the world of DR is to us, like “game”/escapism. Those friends are real to them, just like the cast is “real” to us. And maybe lightners are just “game breakers” with authority over the worlds the dark worlds create.
Your primary example of magic actually being shown in the light world is the opening of a dark world, which still makes me think that magic is a property of the dark world, but it's possible we'll see more examples of dark worlds and the light world intersecting. Perhaps that's the nature of the occult in Deltarune?
Also ripping ones soul out seems rather magical too
Ok but like
Wouldn't a hospital have healing mages?
@@TSSmith…
ReLiGiOn
@@TSSmith well, the light world having magic does not mean that it has the same magic as the dark world or undertale, so healing magic could easily be rare, difficult, or underdeveloped to the point that, yes, the hospital _does_ staff individuals capable of using healing magic, but it does little more than mend bruises or relieve pain
that's one possibility that wasn't really mentioned, that lightners can use magic but aren't particularly impressive with it. so noelle could possibly know how to freeze water into snowflakes, or cool a mildly warm room, but something like healing her sick dad back to good health? yeah, perhaps that's a bit more in the realm of fantasy
We need more Dark World info.
I don't personally think Kris is DEAD per se, but definitely traumatized in some way by whatever happened at the bunker, likely the same event that made Dess go missing all that time ago. I personally always thought the corpse theming was tying in to Kris not having control of their body, basically being a zombie controlled by some parasitic virus, that being the Player in this analogy.
I would agree with this but Kris' Zombie like movements when removing their soul lead me to believe that there is smth deeper going on.
Like, there are clearly themes of possesion that regard to the player but the themes of being dead/ a zombie only come into play whenever the player _isn't_ controlling Kris.
@@tobiasbayer4866 Kris themselves *is* essentially a zombie since we are the soul, and if these two are seen as separate then Kris is left in the "body" position, unable to act much without the soul. The zombie movement when they rip the soul off is cuz they are slowly dying, having their soul separated from their body and all, and have limited time before putting the soul back in again.
They are a vessel, a "puppet" for us. We had a different, intended vessel that we created at the beginning, but it got discarded and we got put in Kris instead. I'm curious about why there was a mix-up. I wish the game was released already 🥺
As someone who studies actual black magic on the left hand path... and is convinced toby practices jewish Estoericism in secret, Kris needed a sacrifice. Of either his own blood, or Noelles. The left hand path can be many things but it penultimatey has to revolve around chaos, extreme ego, and bouts of mania.
@@sirrealism7300What??
@@sirrealism7300 this was so random, i gigled a little
I swear if that throwaway line about the frozen pond actually is teasing Dess being frozen at the bottom of the river with the red guitar being what Onion is hearing I'm going to be laughing my head off at the ensuing Snowgrave jokes 5 years down the line.
Oh i can hear them already,,
Kris's skin is blue in the Dark World. What if he tried to save Dess and failed and almost drowned himself?
@@assassincat4942what if they actually did die, their soul shattered, and that's how they ended up "sharing" the red soul with us?
@@makeitraynex3875thats completely reasonable, but they would have died and they did have no reason to be able to share the soul with us
I mean Chara died and they were able to do basically the same thing @@niccoloilfanditutti3052
the deltarune theory community going insane due to content starvation to a point where basically any throwaway line or file labelling could potentially be seen as capital lore information is something I didn't expect but also kind of did
Honestly that is funny as shit
I mean that's what's been happening to the undertale fandom for years before deltarune so it's only fitting.
Toby has this really consistent way of making games that make people go absolutely feral for more.
It's toby's fault for leaving random clues in code files like it wasn't gonna create a cult of dataminers
@@b_delta9725 Toby actually knows that players of his games will dig into the internal files of the games. We've seen this in Undertale, where an sound file existed within the internal code of the game, that told a warning against people trying to dig into the game's internal code and spoiling the game. A sound file you'd never hear ingame
@@b_delta9725 He originally didn't want ANY data miners because he wanted people to have no idea about how say the fun events in undertale worked. He wanted them to become mew under the truck type things, playground rumors essentially. Data miners leaked everything anyway. Toby then was like, "you wanna look at the code? I'll make you look at the code".
For any other game using filenames in theories is a bad idea imo. But for deltarune? Toby knew we'd be datamining he hell out of it because we did it to undertale despite him not wanting us to. His exact reaction to everyone datamining undertale was something like "very well you have made yourself clear"
One of the humans in the Undertale cutscene has a magic staff, and jevil tail rises Kris' magic capacity over zero, so yeah, tools/objects allowing humans to perform magic makes sense
The nesacary orbs and floating hands
Because what are humans notable for if not their use of tools?
@@TooFewSecretslong distance running
@@TooFewSecrets murdering eachother with said tools
@@TooFewSecrets throwing things good
This reminds me of a fan comic I saw once in twitter with Kris and Catti summoning a demon in Catti’s room. Kris tried to finish the spell, and after everything was finished, Catti asked if it had work. At this point, Kris was already possessed by the player, and when tying to answer, the player text box pops up with the options of Yes and No.
I wish I could remember who the artist was. This was about a year ago I saw it, I believe
Is it lynxgriffin?
i saw that too! i think i saw it in a deltarune voice acting memes compilation tho :3
@@coldslawsYES! I just saw your comment so I tried looking it up, and it was even better than what I remembered. Especially good for such a short comic too
I saw that one too!
I havent finished the video yet, but when you dont use magic in the ralsie tutorial, Ralsie will wonder if humans cant even ask other people to use magic, which means that darkners seem to have it as an accepted fact that humans cant use magic in the first place. (Fun fact! This is the same dialogue that describes why kris points when acting)
What magic?
when ralsei asks you to tell him to cast pacify @@BelBelle468
To expand on this point, what's interesting about Kris's ACT commands enhancing monster magic in the boss battles is it parallels what we already know to be true about humans from Undertale's barrier. Someone will probably go like "Deltarune and Undertale aren't the same canon you fool" but that doesn't hold a ton of relevance in this context considering how similar they are in relation to one another. We have to assume that they at least have shared plot elements, as it's been proven many times how they are directly connected.
Anyways I could be wrong about that but if I'm not, Undertale’s barrier lore specifically states that humans used magic to seal the monsters underground. We know that Frisk cannot use magic canonically, but another thing we also know is that the orb that got it’s mechanic retconned was supposedly going to grant them the power to use magic. Of course this doesn’t technically happen in canon, but even without those unused assets as evidence we see a human with a staff wielding some form of magic in the starting cutscene. From those three things, we can put them together and reasonably conclude that humans can likely only do magic when channeling it through some form of powerful object themselves. We never really have this interaction play out directly in Deltarune, but I’d like to make a case for why this could exist there as well.
In Deltarune, I think Kris might be able to harness the Thorn Ring in the same way. Noelle is casting the spell. But she says herself that she doesn’t know the spell. However, we do. And by commanding her to use it through our TP, we can channel SnowGrave through her. We can't do this when any other ring is equipped, only the Thorn Ring. It's object specific. I think this also works in a similar way during other fights, where Kris is shining the power of their soul onto Susie and Ralsei in order for them to use their spells. Another example I’d like to bring to mind is Susie’s solo fight with Lancer. She doesn’t use Rude Buster in battle without Kris there and is priorly berserked into regular attacks until she starts listening to Kris in battle. I don't think it's fair to say that she just wasn't listening to the player in this battle and that's why she didn't use her spells. Because at this point in the story she has definitely realized the power of Rude Buster in battle. If she was trying to get past Lancer in sheer anger, wouldn't it make sense to use her strongest spells with the TP you build up during the battle? She and Ralsei do use magic outside of battle, but as far as we know that system may work entirely differently and we still never see them use Red Buster or Dual Heal which are specifically the magics that Kris grants power for them to use. The prophecy does state that it requires a human, a monster, and a prince of the dark. What if that’s the reason why? Kris's SOUL could very well be the key to harnessing enhanced magic in the dark world.
This idea has a lot of potential holes (Undertale/Deltarune not being synonymous in magic system, objects just not being the connection at all, all spells outside of the ACT command being useable outside of battle, etc.) but I hope that was at least an interesting thought experiment. I'm very interested in just how the magic system will unfold.
@@BelBelle468 Ralsei's Pacify spell. He has, like, 10 likes of dialogue each for every possible button you can press when you're ignoring what he's asking you to do
@@greyscaleadavenThis is the best theory for human magic imo
Gotta love deltarune theorists go insane every upload
Theory: Kris is secretly gay
@@AltoRed_ > secretly
@@AltoRed_doesnt that make them pansexual? i mean, if theyre gay and they dont have a gender, who are the people their gender? i mean, yeah they could be gay for other nonbinary people but🤔
NOT THE PANS@@markfaites
insane (affectionate)
I'd also raise the fact that Kris can, somehow, phase their hand through their chest and reach into some sort of weird astral plane where the culmination of their being is, then grab that culmination of their being, and then somehow pull it out into the real world whilst their chest has no damage whatsoever including to the sweater (showing that the soul isn't like, literally in their body like their real heart is), and then ALSO being able to put it straight back inside of them, phasing it through AGAIN. To me, this has gotta be at least one instance of magic in the Light World, right?
This sounds logical to me to be honest
I think thats just how souls work
@@Azrael_66666 But is that not, itself, magical?
@@curlyfordoge4366 I guess that technically is
Halfbread PLEASE check into Werewire’s check enemy dialogue. It’s one of the only mentions of the word nightmare in deltarune and definitely relates to kris
"Controlled by the Queen's wire, it's sleepwalking through a nightmare! [Check]" Yep that does line up with Kris fairly well.
"Why is kris wierd"
I'd act the same way if I had some sort of parasite controlling everything I do and say.
The player isn't a parasite
Consume moss lol
@@TheSkyGuy77 might as well be. It’s like when I liken fetuses to parasites. Stealing the nutrients from the host and getting bigger.
Sure it’s not actually a parasite and eventually will come out in around 10 months and then live on their own in 20 years. But they kinda be acting parasitic.
@@TheSkyGuy77 how is the player not a parasite
@@__vic.
How are we harming Kris? We didn't even have a choice.
Kinda seems like the kind of thing Toby wouldn't support.
I think that the fountain isn’t magic. Queen said that by focusing their will and determination into a blade, one could make a dark fountain. I feel it’s more a technique than magic. “I CAST CREATE DARK FOUNTAIN”
This.
that's still supernatural though? unless you're trying to say that 'magic' specifically refers to stuff like healing spells, and bullets and stuff like that.
I think there may be a human version of magic, less about bullets and summoned attacks, but more about the soul. Y’know, making/closing dark worlds, saving and loading, the [[BIGSHOT]] and making/destroying the barrier (seeing as human souls are needed for it to work)
(Also Undertale Yellow isn’t cannon but if it was, the laser thing from the genocide route’s end would also count)
Dude, so much of this sounds highly improvable, but yet you tie it all together with little bits and pieces of info. You’re AMAZING, and this is why I subbed.
While Noelle's line about magic is vague enough to still allow for magic to exist, I'd say the situation is pretty good evidence it doesn't in a large capacity. She's wishing she could use healing magic to cure her dad... In a hospital who's job it is to cure her dad. If any place would have a magic-user, even if magic was somewhat restricted by religion, I'd say it'd be the hospital. After all, healing magic is often aligned with holy magic in jrpgs and the like which Deltarune is definitely taking some inspiration from. (And parodying somewhat)
Also, while Determination is basically magic to us, Kris's moves powered by their soul in boss fights are classified as acts, so I feel we cant really classify feats of soul power to "magic" in the way it is defined in the Deltarune world. Is Determination a soul power? I dont know, its all very unclear at the moment, but it's reason to be hesitant anyways.
Other than that I enjoyed every other part of this video though! Kris being undead would be an interesting parallel to Flowey, perhaps Kris was injected with Determination too in order to save their life? Although, the only one I could see doing that in this universe is Gaster lol.
"Weird" being a sort of code word definitely has some interesting implications we'll have to keep an eye on for the rest of the story.
I think there may be a human version of magic, less about bullets and summoned attacks, but more about the soul. Y’know, making/closing dark worlds, saving and loading, the [[BIGSHOT]] and making/destroying the barrier (seeing as human souls are needed for it to work)
(Also Undertale Yellow isn’t cannon but if it was, the laser thing from the genocide route’s end would also count)
I think Kris’ divorced parents, lack of good friends prior to Susie and Ralsei, and co-dependent attachment to their brother due to said lack of friends may have led to some serious mental health issues, only exacerbated by Asriel going to college and Toriel seeming to be completely oblivious to what her kid is going through
they're the only human in the entire town, which can already drive one's mind insane
@visthj they also seem to have some kind of intense aversion to looking at other humans which has it's own can of worms
@@scruffles3838 Maybe that’s what the “Kris seeing through their hand” means. They don’t want to be perceived, maybe? Perhaps instead of believing they’re invisible, they want to be invisible, because they’re disgusted by their own human form, or for some other reason. It’d be in character and a hell of an allegory.
This could explain Susie’s too. Maybe instead of interpreting it as Susie glaring at Kris, it’s her staring straight through them, because as much as they love Susie they can’t stand to feel perceived.
I HAVE BEEN SO ADAMENT ABOUT MAGIC IN THE LIGHT WORLD FOREVER. I do like the take that it's tied to religion. That has a lot of interesting implications for the story.
means atheists are highly nerfed in the deltarune world
@@guywithgrasspfp the final boss is a pastor 😭
@@wontonschannel the knight's a pastor
@@guywithgrasspfp They are in our reality too, since Demons abuse them and God punishes them.
My thoughts on magic in deltarune are more along the lines of it still existing but more unknown to monsters. After all in undertale, magic explained how monsters such as Grillby even existed and we see in deltarune there are flame people that still exist. I think magic is inherent to this world, just not normalized or even understood amongst the general population. That's why we hear so little about it and why it could be seen as taboo. I liked the costume btw!
I really should be revising for 2 tests tomorrow, but nope. HalfBreadChaos video takes full priority.
Edit: So I’ve watched the video now and here is my theory on why Kris wants to use magic. Undertale has shown that only monsters can use magic and humans can’t. Kris is the only human in a town full of monsters, so they feel like an outcast and want to be a monster, thus explaining why they wore the red horn headband. Magic most likely still exists in the world of Deltarune, and as I mentioned before, only monsters can use it. Kris wants to try and blend in as a monster as much as possible, thus trying to use magic in any way they can, which is why they study occult magic with Catty and have searched online how to use magic.
Edit 2: I don’t remember where or when in the game exactly, but there is a book in the library, which when opened, is about humans. Kris immediately shuts the book without our control, thus more evidence that Kris doesn’t like being a human.
That book can be found at the tail end of Chapter 1, on the second floor of the library
@@gorade1901 Thank you for clarifying! Unfortunately I can’t edit my comment without removing HalfBreadChaos’s like. :(
undertale never says humans cant use magic it only says humans cant express themselves with magic or something like that meaning for humans magic is most likley something similar to a martial art not something they are incapable of doing afterall they made the barrier which is stated to be magic
One thing i haven't seen anyone take into account yet is how Undertale focused on how human souls have Determination naturally, while in Monster souls, determination makes their bodies melt, so they dont have it as much and it's really rare; Boss monsters are the only ones strong enough to have souls that persist after death and have souls that have a bit of Determination in them
The barrier required a Monster Soul and a Human soul in order to cross through it; we're told that the reason why humans were frightened of monsters was because monsters could absorb human souls (i dont remember how they can do this without melting...???)
Whereas in Deltarune, Cyber Queen implied that "any lighter with enough determination can create a Dark Fountain" which makes me wonder if she meant if both humans and monsters have Determination in their souls
I dont know what that would mean for magic in Deltarune, i guess for some reason i assumed that having Determination in Undertale, meant you weren't as good with Magic, or more incompatible with Magic, seeing as Undyne's "puzzle" in pascifist route was to push rocks down a waterfall because she didn't want to make a puzzle
There's a book in the library at one point where it talks about the nature of souls in Deltarune, but i forgot which chapter it was
I wonder… maybe Kris made a deal with Gaster to try and help find Dess? Since they and Noelle are childhood friends, I could totally see them recognizing how much Noelle is struggling and selling their soul to try and help. To get stronger in a way similar to Noelle on the weird route.
This is what I think happened and why they were summoning and doing occult stuff with Catty.
Something that has been weaseling around in my head is that Kris' "Human" class description is "Body containing a human SOUL" which is... Kind of a really strange way to phrase that
I wonder if Kris is like, a Zombie Monster, or something? Like, literally a body with a human soul within.
(Heck, if a "human" can be a human body with a human soul, it might even explain why Sans bleeds, knows about timeline stuff, and can dodge attacks and the like)
Undyne said that Sans *is really good at dodging* which implies that other monsters try to dodge your hits but are bad at it.
Besides Asgore since he probably can dodge but doesn't do that, Omega Flowey because he is just basically Titan like and Asriel since he is god like.
Turns out the dark world wasn't real. Susie and Kris were just getting high off marker fumes inside the closet
This is an interesting video indeed. I really like the editing of it...
I personally still think that magic doesn't exist in the Light world the same way it did in Undertale, the only form of "magic" that we can see is the opening of Dark fountains... I like the idea that the magic each character has in the Dark world is somehow shaped by their feelings, desires or general nature, and that the same sort of magic is not possible in the Light world.
Notice how Light world magic is only referred to as "magic tricks" or occult related spells and rituals... which isn't really how magic works in either the Dark world or Undertale, however it is the concept of "magic" that we have in our real world.
I think that light world magic is just that, tricks and occult, aside from opening dark fountains which could be tied more so to the nature of the Dark worlds themselves (they are these sorts of spaces formed by objects coming to life, which is why the Lightners are seen as "superior" to Darkners- they quite literally have the power to give these objects a story by interacting with them and using them, hence creating the Dark worlds in that manner) rather than some sort of Light world magic by itself.
I agree. Magic doesn't seem to exist, but determination on the other hand? It seems more prevalent than ever, with it seeming like every Lightner regardless of human or monster has a substantial enough amount of it. Enough to open dark fountains.
It is very easy to forget that in Undertale it was humanity who sealed away the monsters with magic, creating the Barrier at the cost of human life. That sounds quite occult and ritualistic, doesn't it?
And since the opening scene of Deltarune portrays the world as one where the monsters never were sealed and for all intents and purposes *take the place of humanity*, is it so hard to assume that their magic situation would be flipped as well?
And I do hear you say: there are humans above ground! Kris was adopted and they had to come from somewhere!
But consider this. Would the monsters take the same actions that humanity did, and seal away the defeated species, killing the rest, or would they accept whoever surrendered? And furthermore, who's to say that the Barrier was not still made by the same people, for the opposite purpose?
This of course requires evidence of The War happening in Deltarune, confirmation of the thematic framing of monsterkind taking the place of humanity on the surface, and an explanation of what exactly is humanity's situation is. And y'know, the Barrier having any significance in Deltarune.
What if magic is basically illegal in light world? Like if a woman could do anything out of the ordinary in the Middle Ages, she was considered a witch and burned at the stake. If you talk straight about magic here, people might think bad about you, leading to unwanted consequences. From a religious point of view, magic is something hellish and demonic, which even reinforces the theory of Kris giving out their soul to a devil. That also consolidates light & dark worlds as faith & sorcery worlds. Actually, what are darkners' points on religion? Was that ever mentioned in the game?
@@joshuasanders162 This is certainly an interesting way to think about this, though I personally don't think that humans have magic in Deltarune. I believe that instead of the magic we knew from UT (even the magic that the old human mages used to posess), we simply have... well, determination. The power to will Dark worlds into being, that each Lightner- human or monster- has.
As I said in my original comment, I think that this could also be somewhat related to how the Darkners are objects, and by interacting with them and using them in our daily life we give them a story of their own... here in Deltarune, this is shown by the objects quite literally coming to life, and having their stories/abilities shaped by the Lightners who have interacted with them in the Light world (such as Spamton knowing Noelle, or Queen's search result rooms... so on, so forth).
The existence of magic in the Light world is, in my opinion, just party tricks or occult, not really the magic we see in other places in UTDR.
But again, this is just my personal interpretation- I don't know- nor can I know- where Toby Fox himself is going with all this. And every other interpretation is just as valid.
Happy to see someone pointing out that Kris not only has connections to Spamton, but Jevil as well. It's very interesting seeing just how much people have been able to discover with only 2/7th's of a game. Great video!
I do really like the idea that magic exists as more of a spiritual and religious thing in Deltarune. It would bring me a step closer to believing Kris is also named after the 'kris' dagger, as it is a spiritual dagger believed to possess magical powers.
8:15 isn’t magic, Toby confirmed that Kris simply found an oil reserve under the house
may I ask where? I would like a link to where Toby has said this.
The spring newletter from last year
@@pbandmayosandwich3208 I literally can’t find anything on Google for spring newsletter 2022, do you have the link?
With regard to your point on the Swatchling ACTs: I was asking myself, "What body of water in Hometown could have frozen over in the winter to be used to ice-skate?" There's really only one it could be, and that's the pond where Onionsan hangs around. In chapter 2, there is some secret dialogue in which Onionsan tells Kris that he can hear music coming from deep beneath the pond.
We know that a certain winter-themed person has *somehow* disappeared, and we also know they're associated with a guitar - a musical instrument. If this scenario with skating on the pond happens to be real foreshadowing, I...think you might have just figured out where Dess is.
We know that in Undertale humans also had access to magic, given that they were able to seal the monsters underground with a magic spell, so maybe in Deltarune it's not that there is no magic, but that the roles of humans and monsters were flipped. Maybe in Deltarune the humans are the ones that regularly perform magic, but keep it to themselfes, and monsters are the ones where doing magic is limited to a select few powerful people.
Edit: Or given how in Deltarune everyone has determination, not just humans, maybe everyone can do magic aswell and its just really really rare? For example only one monster in Undertale could use determination (Undyne) and all of humanity apparently only had 8 wizards.
So in Deltarune maybe everyone has both, its just much, much weaker/rarer.
It could also be that, as technology progresses, there was less of a necesity to learn magic, specially the more complicated spells and such, so people just didn't learn as much, and as years go by, magic is probably just not something common that you learn without looking out for it
Imagine also a full reversal, in Deltarune the humans are locked up underground while the monsters just go on with their lives.
@@Nobuhara
Would be cool but that wouldn explain the existence of Kris and the "how to care for a human" book.
To me it seems like they are both free and know about each other, they are just segregated. Either willingly or unwillingly.
Well in Undertale, it doesn't really say that monsters can't have determination but too much of it, they will melt and Asriel says it himself; "They're all burning with the same desire. With everyone's power... With everyone's determination..." I also think Undyne says this as well in the genocide route, I might be wrong about that part.
@@tobiasbayer4866 What I'm thinking, is that instead of one race being banished, the two races negotiated and thus have become restricted from the use of magic. Possibly to prevent another war? So technically they can use magic, they just are incapable because of a treaty of some kind?
One thing that still bugs my mind is Kris’ skin color in the dark world, it’s the only one who’s skin color changed. In my limited knowledge I see blue skin as hints of lack of oxygen. My theory is that Kris didn’t sold his soul, at least not willingly. This is just speculation but maybe he got himself in a situation that should have killed him (mainly by drowning) but at that moment either someone gave him a deal to save him for the exchange of his soul or he offered his soul to get saved. That’s just my headcanon
that's a cool theory, idk what it is but I think something about the ocean will have a part to play in kris' story
It could be the fact Kris is human.
Its just a phase.
IT'S NOT A PHASE, GOAT MOM!!
“MOMMMMMM I ALREADY TOLD YOU ITS NOT A PHAAAAAAASE!”
You've gone through a few yourself, you know?
Yeah, like those two weeks you spent narrating your own life?
real
As far as I'm concernned that line you brought up about magic tricks requiring floating hands and orbs confirms that Magic is still an element in this universe. The concept of having hands that float off of your body is one of many things about monsters that are biologically and physically impossible, and thus can only be really rationalized with magic. Another instance of this is that the text on the graves heavily implies that Monster's burial customs are the same as they are in Undertale, which implies that just like in Undertale they are made primarily of magic with only a small fraction of flakey dust-like matter comprising their physical mass.
The thing about Kris tho is that it's a pretty clear fundamental element of their character that they can't do magic.
Yes, Undertale was a bit self-contradictory on whether Humans use magic, but the only time they're even suggested to be capable of it is in the case of them making the barrier, and the picture on screen when that's described specifically shows a human mage using a big glowy firey magic staff, which seems to suggest an obvious way to reconcile the seeming contradiction, that humans are indeed not _natively_ capable of magic, and can only use it by using artifacts granted with magic power.
For Kris in particular, a massive chunk of the narrative surrounding their character seems to be about how they feel othered and ostracized in the monster community for being Human. They want to do magic not just because they're mimicking their family like a child does, but because they wish they were like their family, because they're painfully aware that they're not.
The Dark World furthers this, by showing that even when the others get magic boosts and have whole skill loadouts centering around magic, Kris's skillset is deliberately limited to Actions, and, even when they're stuck in a big boss battle by themselves, special attacks that are more akin to physical skills than anything magical.
As for how they make the Dark World, I can get behind the notion that it's magic, but it's very clearly not a normal common type of magic. If it was, at least SOMEONE in town would know about it. The ability to create entire pocket dimensions should obviously be a big deal, and thus be relatively common knowledge if it's actually a normal thing.
Even with Kris having connections to the Occult as established by Catti, if the Dark Fountains were based on powers Catti had experience with, shouldn't she know about it by now?
All this combined with the fact that its connection to Gaster is still being alluded to it even when Kris uses it to make the chapter 3 Dark Fountain, (With the TV static and creepy smile showing up on the TV, both elements associated with Gaster,) I think that its some kind of special Shadow-Dimensional magic that Gaster discovered and is imbuing into Kris.
After all, if Fountains need Determination, which is something that even Deltarune suggests comes from the Soul, Soulless Kris should be unable to make a Fountain anyway.
Loaf Of Bread no longer wants to NOT talk about Gaster so much...
Dr.WingDin possesed Bread confirmed???
13:56 posessed Bread?!?
i just noticed that the word Gaster has 6 letters
does that mean Toby wanted to name him "Dr.WingDing Aster",but the word aster has only 5 letters,so he was like "nahh,you'll be Gaster then"
The whole “Kris isn’t Chara, they just went to eat nighttime pie,” twist from the start of Chapter 2 has me convinced that Chapter 3 will begin a similar way. Rather than it being the opening of a Dark World, this is actually just an Epic Prank, and Kris just caused a bunch of smoke to erupt by rupturing a pipe.
Kris causes a gas leak and blows up the house.
@@Zonic3451 Precisely.
@@Zonic3451the gas leak dark world chapter..
They could be messing with the player, especially in pacifist route Kris and the player will probably end up becoming more like friends
It could have different meanings as well
In pacifist route, it's just Kris playing a prank to the player/soul
In the snow grave one, it's Kris trying to prove that they are in control as well
Yeah I can see Toby doing that.
We are witnessing Bread turning into JaruJaru. 10:39 also if ICE-E turns out to be a demon I need a video of Bread flipping a biscuit irl.
already knows that this is certified banger before i even watch it
The section about magic in the Light World is very intriguing. We definitely know that the Light World operates on some kind of rules beyond our reality's laws of physics; not just because of the ability to create Fountains or remove one's own SOUL, but due to the existence of monsters like the ghosts and fire elementals, whose anatomy would be impossible in our world. And based on the bunny child who remarks on humans being "made of blood," and monster funeral rites seeming identical between Undertale and Deltarune, it seems like Deltarune monsters are animated by magic rather than physical matter just like in Undertale. So magic definitely seems to be an active force within Deltarune's world even outside of Dark Worlds.
However, I think it's pretty indisputable that whatever magic exists in the Light World is very different from the kind we see used in the Dark Worlds. Noelle can cast Heal Prayer in the Dark World without any prior instruction, but very explicitly does not know healing magic in "real life." True, Susie might not know how to wield an axe in "real life" either... But pay close attention to what specifically Noelle says about healing. She describes the Dark World as a place "where everything can be healed with a little spell," and then later, says that if she knew healing magic in "real life," she'd use it to make Rudy better. So it seems like she genuinely believes that the Heal Prayer spell she can cast in the Dark World would be capable of curing whatever Rudy is afflicted with. Whether or not she's correct about this, the fact that Noelle believes it tells us something crucial - that the doctors who are currently treating Rudy cannot cast Heal Prayer in the Light World. If they could, then either he would already be cured, or Noelle would know that Heal Prayer couldn't make him better. Surely if healing magic is possible in the Light World, even if it were more difficult or obscure, medical professionals would be the one group that would for sure have access to it?
So it can't just be a matter of Noelle not knowing the spell outside of Dark Worlds; *nobody* in the Light World can use it. Either that, or the cultural taboo against magic is so strong that doctors would refuse to use healing magic even to save a life, which I find difficult to believe. Meanwhile, Heal Prayer in the Dark Worlds seems to be very easy to learn; both Ralsei and Noelle know it, with Noelle knowing it despite arriving in the Cyber World for the first time only hours beforehand. Even Susie is able to learn a little healing despite it being incompatible with her personality. Basically, what this tells us is that the Light World and Dark World are operating on completely different magic systems. Whatever magic is possible in the Light World, it does *not* include the mechanics of gathering TP and spending it to cast spells like Heal Prayer.
And, pulling this back to the actual topic of the video, this TP system is also how Noelle is able to cast both IceShock and Snowgrave, meaning that her ice magic is likely not possible within the Light World. I wouldn't be surprised if Kris and Noelle's trauma, and Dess's disappearance, is somehow related to the cold; however, I think it's probably just a mundane blizzard that coincided with whatever the event was, or maybe falling into the frozen lake if the Swatchling flavor text is indeed Woshua-esque foreshadowing. As for Kris looking up how to use magic, I personally still think they're probably the Knight, so I suspect that was them researching how to make Dark Worlds. Even if they're not the Knight and didn't know how to make Dark Worlds until Queen explained it, their whole situation with the red SOUL isn't exactly normal, or physically possible in our reality, so they'd still have reason to research magic in order to try to deal with that. Or maybe it was part of their research on demon-summoning, which may be part of the Light World's magic system. It's too early to say for sure one way or another, but the possibilities are certainly intriguing!
Kris isn't weird
They is a cutie lil' human, what have some troubles with a player
I love that goofball
It'd be funny though if Kris is being weird not because of any past events but because he's just that type of guy
not to be that person buttttt they're* /nm
@@puzzled3071no, be that person
i love arriving early enough to a video that you get to see the like count scroll up live.
very good points regarding magic. it might be too early to say for certain if magic does exist (barring the opening of the dark world), but there def isn't enough evidence to say no magic exists, only that it's not as common as it was in undertale
fantastic ending, pulled a 10/10 on my spookometer
its rare that I watch a Deltarune theory video and I'm told information about the games code that I've never heard before (The X coordinate trigger)
Loved this great video
*_-the ceo of 💀_*
i love how the tts in the end just gave up the laugh and just said "HATHATHATHATHATHATHATHATHAT" repeatedly
I dont know what it is about your theories but they are just so well put together. It really feels like your looking at the correct aspects toby fox wants us to analyse
something i never really thought about until now is Spamton's line of "maybe you three can break your own strings", is Ralsei under some kind of control? we know he feels obligated to help lighters, but is there more to that? what about Susie? what kind of control is she under?
They are all bound by prophecy. Considering Susie literally takes away choices from you sometimes, she probably isn't being directly controlled by anything. But her "path" is decided by the prophecy pretty much.
@@masterblaster2678 given that Jevil has knowledge of the prophecy too, that would make sense
The third person is clearly pocket lancer
Maybe it's something other than control?
Like, the player can MAKE a character do a thing. But being BOUND by morality also compels them. INSTINCT and self-serving also dictates what you do.
So Ralsie is bound by morality.
Susie is bound by either poverty, or image, or instinct.
While Kris is controlled physically.
HalfBreadChaos's attempt at JaruJaru's theorizing style felt surprisingly accurate, yet somehow still kinda possible on some points. Also FINALLY someone points out that humans *can* (or at least could) use magic!
I had always assumed Kris made an agreement with Gaster somehow, just like Jevil and Spamton. No way us being in control of Kris is a freak accident. They probably want to find Dess, to return their life back to when they played with Noelle all the time, their family wasn't split apart, etc, or to gain friends through this weird journey we're taking. I feel like Spamton solidified how this will play out. Gaster gives Kris the player to get through this/solve things they couldn't on their own, but the moment the player/Gaster leaves Kris (or Suzie/Noelle figure out Kris is being controlled), everything will go up in flames just like it did when Gaster left Spamton.
Edit: To add on, Kris is probably acting 'weird' to us because they have their end of a deal to fill. It can't just be letting the player in. Gaster wants something of us and Kris, and Gaster is probably the one setting the terms of the agreement. Everything they do when they take us out is for a reason.
it's absolutely insane how much kris making a deal with a devil/being of sorts immediately made sense to me that'd be epic
9:29 so, if each party member's magic is a manifestation of their desires, is Kris' desire to be in control?
2:35 This genuinely made me laugh out loud
5:52 Kris knows how to bake and has definitely helped Toriel out before, since she casually asks them to help with the pie at the end of Chapter 2. Toriel isn't the only one who uses that stove, and Kris can't use magic, so that could be the reason why the stovetop is dirty; magic isn't gone, Toriel just has a housemate now.
autism tends to do that
In Anglo-Saxon mythology, “Wyrd” is used to mean fate or destiny
holy crap that’s literally insane, there’s no way that’s a coincidence
Love the new bread-sona character for Halloween looks sick!
liking the Magus costume, HalfBread!
Taking adventage on the small number of comments:
Frisk has angry eyes when they follow toriel in her basement.
I haven't seen anyone noticing this cute fact before
@@HaidashVYour pfp reminds me of something.
@@UniqueHandle977s-seriously? You didn't even wonder if I'm lying?
When does this appear? I forgor...
@@david5310 actually, this doesn't happen just when you follow toriel. It happens few metres from the stairs whenever you stand there and look right. Maybe it's just a bug, gotta check if some letsplayer had this thing too.
What if Noelle wishing she “knew healing magic in real life” is not referring to healing magic being real, but rather that she wishes she could wield healing magic just like she could in the Dark World.
Yeah I thought it was a somewhat obvious allusion to wanting to heal her father, who is repeatedly shown to be extremely, if not terminally ill. With him saying 'they found something and now I have to stay [in the hospital]' (paraphrased). Usually you just measure stuff, but doing a scan and /finding/ something hints at maybe cancer, or at least a monster version of it, since tumours are more of an 'object'. Coming from the perspective of a terminally ill girl with brain cancer :') I empathise a lot with Noelle and Rudy. I too wish I knew healing magic in real life...
But it's one of those things where it could certainly be drawn to mean a lot! But Occam's (or is it Hanlon's?) Razor is a hell of a thing. Sometimes the simplest answer is key for this one, in that she has the magic in the Dark World, this 'dream' she thinks she's having, and wishes she could have it in 'real' life (hopefully for the sake of her dad).
@@Ava-uq5dhall I remember reading was “terminally ill with brain cancer” and I’m sorry :(
Thank you ❤ I have my family and friends around me, and a few experimental treatments down the line at least...
2:36 never would have expected this reference. my brother use to torture me with this in versus and this ref had me rollin. thanks for the laughs
4:24 (this is an answer to the question in the chapters name) considering Madjick is a thing in the DR universe(since there is a little line that references Madjicks floating hands and orbs) Magic probably something only some species of monster could use despite the fact that all monsters(or at least most of them) are made of magic
They’re just a little quirky, that’s all :>
0:01 they said while in the midddle of some demonic ritual
4:02
"ₕₑᵣₘ" - HalfBreadChaos 2023
TTS had a voice crack XD
11:22 I think that kris has gotta be looking for dess. I feel like there wouldn’t be many other things a human who lives a… (honestly) sub happy life would summon a demon for. Maybe one time kris scared noel so badly that she accidentally used magic she didn’t know she had. Kind of like when you get scared and as a creature who evolved to live in the wild, automatically find a way to defend yourself. Examples could include but are not limited to: slapping, punching, yelling, or using deadly ice magic.
you're the best, bread, so excited for this new video. the section on summarizing how the word "weird" is used in the game is very interesting, and i'll definitely be keeping a look out for mentions of the word in future chapters. i have also had the headcanon that kris and noelle were involved in some kind of deal with the "devil" situation for a while so i'm happy to see you mention something similar. my favorite and least favorite thing about deltarune are the fourth wall breaks, because as fun as they are it's hard to tell which ones are story-significant (spamton, seam, ralsei??) and which ones are just for functional purposes/jokes (lancer, background characters, low level enemies). i think there are definitely some characters that know way too much about the nature of their world and kris could be one of them. i hope we get to meet kris's genuine personality without the influence of the player or other third parties, if not through a segment where the player is ejected from their body then through a cutscene of the past or something. i also really hope we get a clear recap of what happened to kris, asriel, noelle, and dess on the day that dess disappeared by the end of the series. your theories are always so interesting and great to relisten to while at work because the voice is clear enough that i can understand easily so i appreciate the style of your videos. deltarune theory videos in general are such a comfort side of youtube to me but your videos especially are thought-provoking and approachable and rewatchable. the animations and visuals on this one are fantastic as well, so yeah basically keep up the great work. (i am required by law to ramble incoherently about deltarune for several hundred words on every theory post sorry) (toby fox what have you done to me)
Another thing with the word "weird"- I'm pretty sure it used to be used to refer to someone skilled in magic. So in Macbeth, the witches are referred to as the Weird Sisters, meaning that they use magic. Which, thinking about it as someone breaking the laws of reality, makes a lot of sense...
6:28 Speaking of protection and Noelle, anyone else see how the ice globe thing that shows up around Noelle at the end of most battles in the Snowgrave Route looks like a shield? Like we're trapping her within our control, and protecting her from the truth of the horrific things we made her to do? What makes this worse is that we shatter this shield we've made for her when she notices our watch.
"In your dream." Chilling.
yknow yeah, honestly the idea to think of the opening of the dark world itself is magic just sorta
never occured to me
that reminds me tho, idk if its important at all but what the hell is that little effect (8:06) that appears behind kris right before they stab the earth?
my best guess is that its supposed to represent the in-game attack mechanic or bullets, but whats with that weird up and down pattern that almost looks like a melody on a piano roll? been thinking about it since chapter 2 dropped
Actually Kris just hasn't had a snickers in a while
no halfbread, kris nailing a pipeline and poisoning their household is not magic /j
always so happy when you upload with fascinating, unique theories that don't go over an hour (though with your style, i wouldn't mind an hour long theory some day)
8:48 Before they stab into the ground a sparkly effect can be seen. Maybe i'ts magic?
Awesome video as always !
I don't know how to explain it, but I think it's one of these theories that, if it happens to be true, i'll be like "Ok yeah it makes sense", but if it doesn't I'll be like "Well yeah figures"
Like the proof is there, yet it still feels a lil farfetched, but it's tied incredibly well still.
So I don't know, let's just wait and see i guess ✌️
The connections you made about the word "weird" is very interesting! Another great video
I love your videos, and I can really see the quality improving! Your pixel art is becoming God-tier, my friend, and it really adds to your theory diving.
hey did you know about the origins and archaic definitions of the word "weird"? like, the old english word "wyrd" means "destiny", and as an adjective, "weird" used to mean "having the power to control destiny"??? and how it used to be a verb or even noun relating to spells or the act of casting them????? anyway just some fun facts haha
That's pretty dope
That's a really cool fact actually. Feels like it can fit in well, as there is already symbolism about changing destiny in the weird route, like the hospital bead toy.
The bead toy in the hospital usually has flavor text stating something like: "The beads march grimly along their set path." But after the weird route, this bead toy is mysteriously broken.
7:07
another thing to note about the idea that Kris likes magic, or at least the idea of it, is the description for Act
"Do all sorts of things. It isn't magic."
the fact that the game specifies that it isn't magic feels significant
yes, this is the explanation as to why it doesn't cost any TP (usually), but TP cost is already a separate thing displayed, and most players would understand that it isnt magic and therefore costs no TP
Kris wants to do magic, but they cant
Half Bread I am always blown away how you come up with new and/or interesting talking points! You're a joy to watch & listen to.
I was so taken aback by the different model(?) at first but it's really cool
I love your videos and I your dedication when making them
ive always subscribed to the idea that both frisk and kris are undead, even before chapter 2 came out. my interpretation of frisk was always that they were charas body with the players soul in it. said interpretation was inspired by flowey and chara's dialouge. also frisk literally means "to seize" like the player seizing control over charas body.
i could go more into detail but i dont feel like dropping a wall of text (also ive always wanted to make a video about it)
Another great video with amazing animation this will surely be a treat, wonder where is the trick though
The Gaster studies the player, while this player studies Gaster.
About the Kris being a ghost or something, i still find interesting the quote Goner Kid said back in deltarune: " Have you ever thought about a world where everything is exactly the same..., Except you don't exist? Everything functions perfectly without you... Ha, ha... The thought terrifies me"
Specially since in one of the teasers in chapter 4 (or 3? i dont remember to check) it IS raining. And Frisk can offer the Goner Kid an umbrella... (but is it a coincidence? Or foreshadowing?)
Maybe its the reverse? The way kris's room is depicted, it seems like they're inserted into the world.
Btw sans's door in undertale also seems to have the weird light... what about "weird" in undertale?
12:20 Maybe in the ful release, the real way to win the game is to not trigger the weird events. It's like canon events
I'm in total agreement on Kris probably summoning a demon or other entity, like Gaster, ICE-E, or The Knight. But I disagree about the state of magic. Magic has only been shown to be related to darkworlds in deltarune. Even Kris stabbing the ground is creating a dark fountain, so we have no non-darkworld related magic depicted on screen. I'm not saying magic doesn't exist, just that the evidence on what it is inconclusive right now. It's possible it's like Undertale, but the evidence leaves too much doubt, at least for me. Of course Chapter 3 might start out with Toriel telling us how she flunked out of M,agic classes three times before she got her license.
Anyways another banger :D
Kris got that dawg in them
If the dark worlds just turn out to be Higurashi's plot line of the "gas" escaping from the ground, I'm gonna be really disappointed.
My personal headcannon is neurodivergence
I love the sprites and animations in this video
2:53
WHAT. I never knew this dialogue existed in Undertale. That's really cool! And weird... because Washua as an enemy only appears in Waterfall which is a section of the game that comes before you even learn about Chara & Asriel's story in all of the routes.
before even finishing the vid, gotta say, the spritework is getting fancy fancy. good shit bbg😘
As a nonbinary teenager who just spent last night eating wood with its friends, kris seems pretty normal to me
I completely understood all of this. I always knew that religion would play a big part in Deltarune. But its hard to find exacts and specifics.
Videos are just getting vetter and better
Hey HalfBread! I'm having a really hard time right now, and I want you to know that your content is amazing and your videos is one of the very few things that I like that i currently can direct my attention to without triggering more anxiety. You make some of the most impressively thought out and logically founded theories and analyses I've seen regarding Deltarune, and your inclusive and friendly attitude makes me feel welcome even if I'm just lurking. I hope you keep making great content, whether it's Deltarune or something else that you enjoy. You are a wonderful person, thank you for existing.
THE BREAD HAS RETURNED!!!
I never understood why people thought you couldn't use magic in the lightwold haha. Now I feel a little less alone in that xd.
Good video i think the idea of magic in the light world seems really interesting
I think you're onto something with paralleling word "weird" with "out of this world".
I just feel like there's been a seperation of what Humans abilities and Monster magic is. I think if creating dark worlds counts and magic, then Saving and Loading is also magic. The one thing that ties them together is determination. Though it feels like Undertale especially (except for the opening sequence) makes it very clear that Humans can't use the same magic monsters can at the very least. I guess you could also argue Frisk being able to increase his defense through "Hope" and heal himself with "Dreams" is magic at the end of the pacifist route in that case.