There's been a lot of great discussion here and first, I want to thank you all for watching and commenting. I do think it's important that I clarify something though - there are a lot of comments suggesting that I am implying that Synology > TrueNAS. I'm not. I use TrueNAS and love it. ZFS is great. However, I am specifically NOT talking about these NAS operating systems in this video (Unraid, TrueNAS, OMV, etc). I am talking about the prebuilt NAS devices that generally come with their own proprietary OS installed. If you are capable of configuring your own NAS device, you should. It will be exactly what you want and you won't have to play the game of picking between hardware + OS devices, but a lot of people aren't. In this space, I stand firm that I believe Synology is the best option though it's my opinion and that doesn't make it right. I'm also not saying this because I want you to buy a Synology device - I am just sharing my experiences. As mentioned in the video, you should purchase what you want and what you're comfortable with. What I AM saying however, is that if you are picking a prebuilt NAS device that comes with a proprietary OS simply based on hardware specs, you're not looking at the whole picture. Either way, I didn't expect NEARLY this many views or comments when I released the video so I appreciate all of you who watched and commented. I think it shines a great light on some of the options consumers have that the video didn't go into, so thank you for sharing!
I also agree with the overall point of the video, however, the comment that "Synology doesn't have to innovate" is the attitude that took down many great companies: complacency.
Frank, 100% agree: DSM justifies the cost of Synology over competitors that may have better hardware. Superior hardware means nothing if your data is gone or the NAS tools are janky or unreliable. I would hope that anyone who owns a NAS has good backups. But more importantly, a restore strategy. If your data cannot be restored, backups are useless and so is the NAS. DSM offers many great apps and features OOB. Your pyramid analogy is spot-on, too. Coming from many years of ZFS experience, rock-solid filesystem w/volume management is a must-have. Initially I wasn't keen on Synology's choice to go with btrfs but after more than a year of use I've had no issues and have been very pleased with it and Synology's SHR. FWIW, I'm running a 1522+ with 5 12TB IronWolf drives in SHR-2.
You pretty much nailed it Frank. I own 3 brands of NAS and have installed Proxmox and Unraid on old hardware to test and generally just muck about with. Unless you are a really serious tinkerer and understand networks, sharing, etc, don't even consider Proxmox or Unraid. If I had to give up all but one, I would keep my Synology although QNAP would still be a close 2nd because of the hardware. If you understand networking, shares, etc and you like to deep tinker into your stuff, you may just prefer QNAP. But for the other vast majority who just want their NAS to work day after day and don't care about all of the technical spec's because they don't need the extra performance, buy Synology. If I didn't also have a QNAP, I would likely buy a 2 bay Synology to backup my main 4 bay Synology.
FIrst was Netgear Stora, providing photography services for my iMac and Canon D6. iMac HDD crashed, Stora Crashed, 15K+ photos lost! Bought a Pegasus R6 in 2010 and currently still run it as a DAS for my Mac Mini M1 unit with 10GBe to the network. Just bought a DS1621+ and am in the process of installation after 1 week of stress testing it for stability. I have to admit, it was difficult justifying 3 y/o hardware for the total $$ spent to install to my specs. But, after 1 week of trying to break it, and failing miserably, i finally finalized the installation and put it into production. Pegasus R6 is now a second backup and another Synology NAS (723+ or similar) will occupy the dedicated backup for the entire system on site. Offsite backups are trio already but tax the network because i run them overnight on schedule. Synology cost = more, images lost = zero, sleep lost = NONE! You get what you pay for. I want reliability. Will pay thousands for reliability.
I totally agree. Synology is the best. I have two 5 bay units. They are basically mirrors. The primary backs up the secondary every night. This seems to work well for me. However, I can't seem to make it a true mirror. I initially wanted to have files immediately write to both independent NAS units. Couldn't make it work. Called Synology, they said it isn't possible. You should make a video about that. Two independent Synology NAS units in a mirror.
@@EvilTeddie23 yeah but QNAP isn’t as durable and dependable as Synology. QNAP is cheaper, more of a budget NAS. I’ve had both over the years. Synology is better for the money 💰
@@VMXGroove and you base that comment on what exactly? I've been a data storage and data protection architect for the top enterprise companies for the past 20+ years and have run Qnap for almost as long. Qnap have way better hardware than Synology and also have ZFS as a filesystem, which is the industry standard for data protection created by Sun and utilized internally by NetApp. Synology is fine for people who don't know anything about data protection and just want a simple NAS setup, but power users can get way more from QNAP or TrueNAS (also ZFS) or roll their own. Synology's decision to screw their customers and force them to purchase over priced hardware is a big red flag.
@@VMXGroove The QNAP TS-H1290FX-7302P-128G-US 12-Bay NAS Enclosure costs $7000 without disks. Add 12x Western Digital 8TB datacenter drives at $2000 each and this monster costs more than a Toyota. Add SSDs PCI-E cards and you are close to $30,000. That's out of my idea of "budget"
It seems that a lot of NAS users are expanding the role of the NAS from basic file sharing and backups to media services, using security cams, adding containers/VMs, etc. The fact that there are now at least 3 or 4 new players in the NAS market is a good sign that people are not satisfied with what is currently out there. Synology's hardware choices, and relatively recent move to proprietary drive and hardware requirements is further driving some potential users away. In the end, Synology may be aiming to dominate in the High Cost/High Convenience segment. There is money to be made there, and not having to dedicate a lot of resources to support on their mature OS and self branded hardware does make some sense. Curious to see if the other makers in the Mid Price/Pretty Good Hardware/Sometimes Frustrating OS can make the case that saving hundreds or even thousands of dollars draws in enough buyers to be profitable.
I use synology but I think, coming from a developer background, it's a rip off. They disabled many features of open source software or make it hard to install, or risky, using 3rd party vendors that aren't audited. For instance they want you to use their own synology surveillance station and pay the expensive licenses fees per camera, when you could spin off your own open source system provided they hadn't disabled many common features found in ffmpeg for instance.
Yes for unbranded cameras you pay a fee, but you get a free license with synocamera.. But why dont you just run a docker with free survailance software then add ANY cameres for free to that ? All free and no hassle kinda.. Well you have to tinker a bit to get it run great... While on surveilancestation its all based to run cameras and were back where Syno shines brighter than the sun and its their software.. It runs really good on their boxes.. But the thing is you have options even on Synology. if they disabled some stuff you used, well then reactivate it again IF you need that badly. Ohh they uninstalled it ? Well reinstall it then. (ssh into it and dowload it from a reposatory) Or Create a small script for taskmanager that re-enables that function after a reboot. (I do this to remove certain apps) Done or atleast untill they rename the file or moves it. Media codeccs and such are a horrible field to enter into, more or less a sh!t show of a magnitude with no ends. Features in FFmpeg, well now youre actually inside the licenseing .. oboy now thats a legal heavy mess and very EXPENSIVE area. Sure they could support all codecs, legal ones, that would cost a arm and a leg per update of DSM or keep the ones that are royalty free. (what would you do) Sure they could support a greyzone one like ffmpeg and get sued to kingdom come from the rights owners of the slashed and ripped codecs in that one ;P perhaps you have the same issue as i had, on my DS216+II i can run media with a certain 6 channel sound no issues. (d216+II was one of their last with FULL media codecs licenses) The same media cant be played from my DS1621+ unless i use FFMpeg6. My panasonic TV could play it a couple years ago but they had a change of media codeccs and boom i lost the wierd 6 channel codecc there aswell. How i solved it? Well it still works through my ancient Formula box. I just remuxed the 6 channel sound into 5.1 and recoded into h.264, sure its not as good as the 6 channel sound but hey it works on ALL units now. And i dont record in 6channel sound anymore just 5.1 mode. Problems are made to be solved.
@@Perra1901 You're on an old version that wasn't as restrictive. The problems are now much worse. Even docker doesn't work as expected. The reality is, you don't need these kind of problems and restrictions, it's not worth anyone's time. When the goal is to prevent users from using open spurce software when they themselves repackage them for their synology software, there is a problem.
I totally agree with you. My first NAS was DS-211 (decommissioned) then upgrade my NAS to DS-1019+. During these years, I also purchased DS-214+, DS-218+ and DS-220+ for my friends and myself for offsite backup. All of these are reliable. I prefer a stable and reliable device (just like iPhone) rather than performance.
Excellent video, and you absolutely nailed it. I made the mistakes you described and eventually bought a Synology having spent almost double to learn what you just described.
if only manufacturers built NAS hardware and supported using TrueNAS, or other open platforms, not supporting the OS, but the hardware. For instance, Ugreen seems to have great hardware, at a fair price, but refuse to support the hardware if installing 3rd party OS's. This is the behavior that made me build my own. Sadly, most users don't want to have to do that, or don't know how or where to begin.
Is UGREEN saying they won't honor warranties if you don't run their janky version of Debian? Or are they just not offering support for software if you use Ubuntu Server or TrueNAS or whatever?
It would be a nightmare to have to support multiple operating systems on their hardware. Users would blame the manufacturer for issues in software they didn't create. It would also be expensive to support all those operating systems.
Completely agree. Best software out there. They're essentially following Apple's playbook. Normally any of this wouldn't bother me. But in recent years since they started with their restrictions on RAM, and especially SSD/HDDs, is definitely the kind of BS that's pissing me off, and makes me want to go elsewhere. Because make no mistake, Synology knows what they're doing, when pulling stunts like this, all the while selling subpar accessories, for double the price or more, and lying to customers about why.
@@xellaz Agreed. Also giving their customers as little as possible in terms of hardware is equally annoying. 10gbps should be the norm for pro-sumer hardware IMHO.
I totally agree with what you say about the network hardware my DS916+ where I've bonded 2 x 1gbt networks , I wish it has 2.5gbt or you could use a usb 2.5gbt device . Synology does have it's faults , a few days ago I got a your drive as 900+ bad sector replace the drive , so I switched off the nas and ordered a new one , I have 3 x 10tb ironwolfs , so got a 12tb so I know it's a different, now have a spare drive because after I switched it back on all my drives are healthy again , so not sure what happened there , but from your drive is faulty and healthy again in 3 days . But I do love the GUI which shows which drive is faulty and not bad sector on ata-ST10200VN0004-1ZB101_ZA29ZN8X .
I consume a lot of content on youtube. I'm only just now looking into Synology for the first time and don't really want to spend too much time searching through a ton of content on the subject. I say that because I wish you'd just name names. Which competitors have the inferior product? I'd rather not have to search through all of your content to get that information from you. I still do appreciate the video. Thumbs up.
I don't want to bash companies if I don't have to, especially because a video that might be relevant today isn't guaranteed to be relevant tomorrow. From my perspective, there isn't a great pre-built NAS operating system other than DSM, RIGHT NOW. Some people are happy with the other options but I've had a bunch of problems with them, which was my main reason for making the video. I hope the others improve some day, but right now, from a pre-built NAS operating system perspective, DSM is the best in my book.
I've been using Synology since 2011 and have found DSM to be rock solid!!! I currently have a DS718.. I'm looking to upgrade to newer hardware with 4 drive bays, but finding Synology current hardware a bit lacking. Hopefully Synology will be release some more capable hardware in the near future.
He's right. No matter the hardware being older, Synology NAS devices are rock solid. I tried TrueNAS, fine if you have hours to tinker and missing features that should be easy. End of the day don't be dumb just buy a Synology NAS. Its the best of the best.
I agree if you aren't the tinkerer/DIY type. I've personally been DIY'ing my own setup since ZFS was added to FreeBSD, then freenas and now truenas but I'm comfortable putting together my NAS + backup solution for my little homelab setup. If you are at all comfortable doing it yourself and actually evaluate what synology offers for the price it's kind of a ripoff, especially now that they are also trying to sell you HD's and RAM at apple markeup prices for what is basically commodity hardware. But if you aren't then Synology has the best software by a mile and decent support and that matters to the average consumer a lot more than more recent hardware in most cases.
Your points in this video echoes a lot of other stuff I've read about in researching on my first NAS: That Synology is expensive, not the best hardware wise, but goddamn it Just Works As someone who just wants a convenient little box to backup their important files, and doesn't want to spend their weekends tinkering and fiddling over DIY solutions that would probably give me more headaches than solutions, a Synology NAS really sounds like a no brainer I've seen sponsored shit all over the web of other NAS options, and there's been a proliferation of Chinese NAS devices, but at the end of the day, I want to experience life and not waste time and money on a device that shits the bed on the fundamentals Thanks for the super easy to understand video. It was very helpful!
Got lucky that I found the best deal on facebook. I bought a DS1821+ with 3 pcs 18tb wd and it's working good! another 2 pcs on the way now. Thanks for this video!
I've made my decision for Synology for exactly the same reason. Back then, Synology was not that set on the hardware vendor locking game, which helped. I hope that other NAS manufacturers will catch up with their software so that Synology receives some motivation to drop the hardware blackmailing and provide at least decent hardware, as opposed to technology that was already outdated three years ago.
@@Act1veSp1nI bought a $47 USB 2.5 adapter and am using it in my DS1520+ and works good. CableCreation USB 3.0 to 2.5 Gigabit USB Type A. There are drivers on github and is fairly easy to install.
@@Act1veSp1nmy new unit has 2x2.5 gbe, 2xnvme ssd, cpu has transcoding capability, only $175. OEM OS is usable. Upgraded to 32g ddr4 3200mhz at $50 from free market. No complaints.
Have had my DS920+ since 2021. Had to swap the first one out as it had a defective backplane. This has been the best investment I have made since using a PC. I have 16 users, "mostly phone backups," along with 3 pc and plex. Only issue I've had is the backup with ADD. Even though I have a certificate from let's encrypt, it complains about 1 every month or so.
I disagree as a long time synology user . I switched to QNAP as The best NAS solution I’ve come across is a Qnap system such as the TS-664 running Truenas scale . Removing the original O/S and installing Truenas turns the NAS into a system which rivals some enterprise systems and its rock solid with , docker , snapshots, iscsi etc
You are SPOT ON! I appreciate your technical expertise, your clear presentation, and your honesty! Imagine having an Intel i9 PC running Windows 3.1! What’s the point? Rhetorical, on purpose and supports your opinion. Even the complaints about hardware limitations, heck forget 2.5GbE, for like $100 I got 10GbE and zero regrets. I also easily upgraded to 32gb Memory with 3rd party RAM, 3.5 years and not a single issue. I put 2TB of Samsung NVMe for Cache. Listen, for a NAS that will likely last me a decade, the overall cost is minimal to have both hardware and a stellar OS that just works and provides features and functions so worthy of the investment. I came from a decade of Drobo. Take about limitations! Well we know how that story ended. Had an Infrant (now owned by Netgear) NAS before that. Was nothing more than RAID storage. So, others can brag about their hardware, hating the experience while I enjoy both my hardware and software for years to come. Heck, I love them enough to have 3, 2 onsite, 1 off. And caused me to buy a Synology Mesh Network to replace my functionally incapable Orbi Mesh. Again, another great WunderTech video! 👍🏻👍🏻
Thank you! This confirms my decision to buy the DS920+ when I did - based on the research I did at the time, including your videos. I have followed your instructions to setup snapshot replication, hyper backup, and Active Backup for Business. My data has never felt so secure! The Photos app is really very good as well for my needs (anything is better than Google Photos). Synology was the right decision for my personal and business needs! I will probably buy another unit to place at my business partner's house so we can have another level of backup/sync between the two units.
@@WunderTechTutorials my next goal will be to get my small business corporate Sharepoint and OneDrive (I'm the admin) data syncing with my NAS to ensure everything is secure with snapshots and hyperbackup.
100. I resisted your points for years and was stubborn, ran enterprise gear with stuff like FreeNAS, Rockstore, TrueNAS etc. Got a synology and it sips power, I'm running tons of docker containers and a VM on it no issues, everything is an easy tutorial and GUI process to find (thanks a lot to your channel and website) and it just runs and does its job. Yes I'm peeved I couldn't get something with faster network speeds and ECC RAM but other than that, this thing just chugs away and getting it to do things like Tailscale, Kiwix, pi-hole, hiemdall, Plex, Jellyfin, VideoStation, Home Assistant etc has been a breeze compared to other systems.
I was sold when I first saw synology at work: Many years old and all dusty but still working. My home synology (2HDD) has worked 10+ years. One HDD died and I changed both out to ones double the volume. Hardly noticed any delays except everything became faster due to the new HDDs. Why I don't care really, DSM, better components... whatever. One thing though is the photo backup app which functions can be improved. Cheaper than icloud anyway.
I totally agree brother. I have a Synology DS3018XS which is almost six years old. This thing is still the best piece of IT equipment I've ever purchased. I am a systems engineer and also use two TrueNAS scale servers (loaded with RAM, CPU...etc.), my Synology is my go-to device for my mission critical. My TrueNAS setup required expertise in hardware selection/setup etc. that your average hobbyist doesn't possess. My only issue with Synology is the cost of their drives and peripherals. You can use third party drives but the warnings and such piss me off. If their drives were at a 10% premium I wouldn't mind, but 200% is nutty. Synology management needs to do better hitting the sweet spot of value. Otherwise great stuff. JMHO :)
I can't say app on Synology. I have right now a problem with Photos and other things on my nas. But what is really good it is support. You didn't mention it. ))
Software maturity and security. That’s it , I prefer Synology compared to Qnap that can share your data to the whole world :) Qnap have a good hardware but Qnap security is as good as ugreen OS on their new nas…. 100% agree with your Frank, at the end of the day , we want something that is rock solid and it works 100% of the time
100% This! ... That's why I use them. Also with QNAP or UGREEN who knows if there is Chinese backdoors installed. We know that isn't the case with a US company like Synology.
@@CedroCronSynology is Taiwanese. Also you're pretty naive if you don't think US companies or any company for that matter, does the exact same thing ;)
I stand corrected... I was going based information in another RUclips video. My bad... And I'd take my chances with a US company over a Chinese company given the choice. @@blcjck8121
I am 100% a total noob in the space. I’m a professional commercial photographer that understands how important redundancy is, but being my own IT department has its very important limits! I have a Synology unit on its way and can’t wait to feel the security of a nas system vs all the random ass ssd I have laying around. Thanks for confirming I made the right choice. I’m exactly the target market for this system and looking forward to have the best, for me.
Interesting, when I bought my DSM 918+ I bought it because the hardware was a better specification than QNAP, well 7 years of 24x7 service later the only failure that I can put down to Synology is a Power Supply, I obtained a repalcement within 2 days and I bought two so I have a spare. Apart from that 1 x WD Red 4TB HDD required replacement, the Synology OS handled that with a warning and as expected the prodess was a hot swap, oh and the two Samsumg SSDs which were replaced under warranty. All in acll I've very pelased with the NAS and in particular the 100% reliable OS. I use iDrive for backup to the cloud as is is compeditivly priced.
I choose reliability above speed etc anytime. I do some video-editing, but I do it alone. So I can do it on an external SSD and store it, when the project is finished on my NAS. Synology for me is reliable but more important, I understand it and it is easy to use. I bought My DS1522+ last year. It was my first NAS. And your channel and 2 others where the ones who convinced my to go for Synology. So I really agree with you. I saw your video about Ugreen (?) and some others. It looks good, but still I stick with Synology. QNAP I did not like. Saw many video's about them too.
QNAP has failed from a security and failures despite better hardware. Software, security and reliability costs more cuz it's worth more of you value your time and data. My opinion having 30 years experience
For business - definitely Synology. Since time is money - the faster a system allows you to get things done without fiddling too much, over time, the more expensive initial setup pays for itself. There’s equipment I just want it to work, and not have to spend extra time wrestling with it when I have 20 other things that need to be done. This point becomes really clear when you work for an employer that wants you to be more engaged in using your problem solving talents on the business side of things, rather than mucking around in customizable settings. While certainly its always good to have options to be able to exercise, most SMEs need just the basics of file storage, backup, access - so getting to roll out and administrate those things quickly is a good thing. Open Source and very custoimizable setups really shine though, when you really need to deliver something niche, and its something that you can do for your situation, but doesn’t apply to most others.
Quite honestly don't believe this crap. The hardware is weak, the software is ordinary. If you know how to install software you can get better bang for your buck than going with Synology. I believed crap like this video and went in with Synology, and after spending 000s I have it just run as a backpack for my main Nas (self built).
Which is why 1 second into the video it says "if you're in the market for a prebuilt NAS device". I completely agree with you - a DIY NAS will be better for most people, but it's not going to be pre-built.
I wouldn't label Synology as "worse hardware"; perhaps it's lower-spec, but not necessarily worse. Over the years, I've worked with various brands of NAS hardware. Around 12 years ago, a client purchased a Synology DS1010+ but needed assistance setting it up. Despite primarily selling Iomega and Western Digital NAS hardware at the time, I was thoroughly impressed by Synology's DSM. Since then, I've advocated for our company to exclusively offer Synology products. When EMC sold Iomega to Lenovo, we transitioned to Synology for both our internal network and client solutions.
It's definitly worse hardware and has been for ages. That said the software is so much better than other consumer/smb offerings that synology can get away with it.
I've done the research multiple times and always ended up with Synology again, thing is, if you need a NAS, then you don't need a server, if you have a reliable NAS, then you can build another rig to work as a server, and access data from your NAS, speaking of hardware, frankly HDDs are the bottleneck, so unless you're going full SSD build (which makes zero sense for NAS anyway), you'll be always limited by HDDs, not hardware of the NAS (unless you go for low-end Realtek cpu) - one of my NASes is DS420+ with 2GB ram and 2-core cpu can comfortably handle 36TB SHR (4x12TB) pool, if I want VMs then I use Proxmox on i7-4770 8-thread cpu with 32GB ram and all-SSD local pool
I bought an old synology nas (DS416, it wasnt even a '+') off of the ebays and put 2x 14TB HDD in it..... I managed to set up raid 1 and file sharing on the nas, but could not get things like DLNA running or get anything else that I wanted in a NAS ( VM/s, containers, transcoding videos BTRFS and the like). Frustrated I then started to look into getting something decent (at a reasonable price) that could do the things I wanted. At this stage I have settled on the DS920+ it has all the features I need (VM support, BTRFS, containers etc) and it is better at transcoding video than the DS923+ (by virtue of the fact that it as an intel celeron chip with its onboard graphics, where the DS923+ has a ryzen chip with no onboard graphics). BUT, it is not perfect, with the max capacity being 64TB, versus the 72TB of the DS423+, BUT the DS423+ is not expandable, whereas the DS920+ is with the addition of a DX517 unit IS. MEANWHILE..... I was thinking about flogging the DS416 off on ebay so that it bacomes someone elses problem.😊
I agree with you on so many points, but I just wish that Synology devices would be more fair-priced and get cheaper as time goes by. However, that's not the case and is a flaw with Synology.
Why can’t we have both? I am willing to pay premium price for latest hardware from Synology but they just don’t offer it. I’m still holding on to my trusted DS716+II and don’t know what to upgrade to.
Just bought a NAS and even Ugreen would be available I made a decision for Synology. At least you were one of them who made my decision solid rock and I am total fine with my Synology NAS now, even it’s hardware isn’t the best on the market. And I will not store my critical date on a Chinese Hardware with Chinese Software on it. Never ever even I have to spend less money for it!
Couldn't agree with everything you said. I've been with Synology since 2014 and have never been tempted more than fleetingly to change. DSM is outstanding, in fact I just bought a RT6600AX and it's amazing too. The only major criticism I have with them at the moment is that their Customer Services seems to have fallen off a cliff; or maybe I was just unlucky. I've used them in the past (5+ years ago) and they were great. I tried to use them in the last 12 months and it was like talking to a 5 year old.
I see a lot of vids about the hardware... For me it just works. The replication is bullet proof. 10g networking.. And the software plugins are for the most part very good. I have a home lab... I do not need a Net App / SolidFire etc. If I make videos I am the only one and have a seprate volume "disks" for that and I do not see it affect anyone else in my home... Including my VMware host that are iSCSI connected. What else would you want for my use case... NOTHING will pull me off at this point and the only thing I would consider is what Ubiquity comes out with..
The problem is that being "good enough" when competitors are taking massive leaps from a hardware perspective isn't a recipe for long-term success. I don't think they need to lead the industry from a hardware perspective but I do think they need to up their game a little bit.
@@WunderTechTutorials I agree that they do need to up it to keep up with what’s coming. They prob already have plans ready to go. But they will not release it until they have too. They will max out profits until that time comes. Once someone comes out with a product that can truly compete with DSM it will be a diffrent story. Until then this is the best option. At least for me.
DSM is hands down the reason it’s expensive and it works, and works very well. If you’re a content creator and don’t want to manage a device, get a Synology. If you’re hardware and software technically inclined get truenas Unraid OMV and roll your own.
As a photographer / videographer I was told for years to use Drobo because it was the best. I had nothing but problems for a damn decade and it was slow as hell. After Drobo went out of business and I got an 1821+ and Jesus crispies, this is what it’s supposed to be like having a NAS. It just works. Drobo dashboard was a giant turd and had no 10gbe upgrade path.
Over 5 years my 2 Synology s work perfekt until now NO problem .. just one disk lost but Change it without NO Problem… in this time … the Support and performance is getting better…. Nothing else ! All others are a cheap copy but a copy is not the original! 🙏
As a Synology NAS owner (I got a recent one with four drives), all I can say is if DSM is why you should buy Synology, then the Linux based OSes used by the competition, including uGreen, must really be terrible.
All that is True, however there is a limit for a cost of a Synology NAS because as an example, if the minimal cost of one these machines was 10.000 USD, no one will buy it, so is obvious that for you this limit was not reach yet, but for many people it is already there, including me.
QNAPs software has come a long way and most of their previous issues could be solved by simply not letting it contact the internet directly. Synology is the best turnkey solution but there are much better options if you're willing to put in a little time and effort. Intel was in the same situation pre-Zen and look what happened to them. AMD's market share is at record levels, as it should be. If you sliced the cost of a Synology by 20-25%, maybe I'd consider it.
Saying that other brands restoration functions never work when they have to doesn't seem true. Everyone knows Synology has the better software but there is a difference between better and non functional. The fact that Synology has completely abandoned the home media market by not releasing a N100 NAS is beyond me and it shows they don't give a crap about their users. Not unlike Apple... Finally saying that we consumers do not have a choice, and we just have to take it, is a very slippery slope.
I didn't mean to imply they never work, just that I've had problems with it. I truthfully hate the lack of competition, but I haven't come across another pre-built NAS OS that is nearly as reliable as Synology.
Thanks for the video but IMHO Synology is nothing more than overpriced, underperforming GARBAGE, reminds me of crApple devices. You are right in that consumers should do their own research & doing so tends to land you on QNAP which strikes a good balance of great hardware + great software vs Synology's poor 10yr old hardware + great software but hey to each his own. I dont know why I would want a NAS which doesn't even officially support hard drives & memory that aren't branded by them. 🤔
IMHO, I just want something that works out of the box. while you might want to stuff about with alternatives like truenas or QNAP, Synology is a turn key solution. The software is great. I think that a reliable NAS that WILL restore your data has got to be better than a janky POS that is so powerful that it floats on a column of raw energy, but is unreliable. I think Synology is is worth the extra money. The whole point of a NAS is data integrity not performance.
Its very simple. People buy Synology because of the software (DSM). And this software is so much better than any ofher nas software. Yes the hardware is often weaker than similar prised other nas systems, but thats a trade-off one need to take for getting the software. If all one need is a file server on local network, then its better to install Truenas, UNRAID etc. on a old computer. Its two very different systems!
Synology & Qnap should be worried. When Ugreen sorts out the software issues, this NAS is going to be amazing. For now, I’m sticking with my Synology 918+ and 412+ because I don’t like what Synology are doing right now. Locking down what hardware you can use. Synology are getting more & more like Apple.
SW can't be just sorted out. It's a lifelong process and Synology still good on it. Yes it's have weaker hardware part, but for home users like me, my 920 is overkill after memory upgrade. Have all Synology services I need plus 5-6 containers in docker and never run out of CPU power or memory. Only thing I wish - faster lan ports actually. If you using NAS for virtualization it might be another story, but for my taste this job is more for servers. I glad that Ugreen trying to get into NAS business, but if honestly - good SW and professional 24/7 support is what you should start from in this business (suppose that make Synology price so high actually), not a hardware.
Only reason you know about Ugreen is that they sent EVERY tech RUclipsr a review unit. Their software still has a loooong ways to go, from the 54 reviews I've seen lol. Their best option right now would be to make 3rd party OS installs easier - and make it easy to switch back for testing. Or.... Keep pricing low enough that everyone can do their own testing.
Synology should please upgrade the hardware. Why is the RAM soldered to the board? Why AMD instead of Intel? Some people need more RAM because the specified RAM is simply not enough!!! Some people work with 4K videos or use Plex transcoding and for that they need a graphics card. That's why many jump out and buy Qnap or Asustor... or the new Ugreen, here you can even put Unraid or truenas on it because Ugreen gives the end user the possibility to decide everything himself. Of course the software plays a big role, but also security. That's where opinions differ, just like Apple devices and Android. If the hardware was up to date, they would buy a lot more devices.
Why not AMD instead of Intel ? (less power and more performance, but then again you really want another J4125 box due to UHD D600 gfx chip ?) I did use plex a long time ago but now, i dont see the need for it, since 2015. Just record youre homemovies in a newer codecc like H.264/H.265 and the problems are gone. If you have a ton of old movies that needs to be transcoded.. RECODE them and be done! Whats the problem !? Dont you have a home pc with like 6+ cores aka 12+ threads ? Recode goes FAST nowadays what once took 1-2 days now takes and 1 or 2 hrs and max. Why keep it a problem solve it.
@@Perra1901 Hi, the point is that only the housing is being replaced and not the hardware. See the post by @coolcat23. I'm not the only one with this opinion.
It's the Apple of the NAS world. For those who dislike open-source software and prefer not to choose between options, being more than okay with something mediocre that someone else picked for them. DSM is low maintenance and easy to learn, at least according to the marketing hype :D Then these same people install Synology's Docker UI and use that abomination, which is worse than any other open-source Docker UI that has ever existed in the universe, instead of spending the same amount of time learning something useful. ABB has been broken on Linux for months, maybe even years now, since it depends on the kernel, and obviously, they don't care enough to update their app. Why would they, since DSM is also running on an ancient kernel. The other arbitrary limitations, like their camera software licensing, while much better FOSS options exist, or their "custom" hardware, which is just a "custom" firmware without any meaningful change but with a 3x price tag... it's all just a joke. But yeah, DSM is the best, I guess... p.s.: I find it amusing when people claim they switched from ZFS to SHR. If you understand how SHR works under the hood, you'd realize they're not even in the same league. There's a reason SHR isn't an option on Synology's enterprise models.
Yeah agree 100% on the apple comment. But you CAN use FOSS software on synology via DOCKER gui, or 3rd party apps, or advance mode SSH, and install it from there. and yes you can run the REAL none gui'ed docker via SSH aswell if you want to. For cameras i replied to a comment above.. Amusing that you compare ZFS to SHR ... Really like comparing apples to water melons in that case.. ZFS = enterprise file system SHR= hybrid raid system NOT a file system. BTRFS= Consumer/ Prosumer ish../enterprise-ish depends on what wanna run there, usually other better options. Synology mainly use 2 filesystems EXT4 and BTRFS (SHR are available through BTRFS) Also ZFS MUST have ECC ram, BTRFS dont need to but its BETTER to have. And the " XS+" models dont have SHR because most of em have array cards anyway. (hardware raid cards, just SATA flashed etc.) To see what have what, just check for E-sata ports = no array card, MinisasHD port= Array card As you said it youre self. DSM is the best.. OUT OF THE BOX so to speak. How to maintain it ? setup 2 tasks. 1 task smart scan each 6 months 2 task data scrubbing once each 6 months (when drives reach 3-5 years aka their waranty expiry date move down to 3 months on scrubbing) Done. For ZFS dont go longer than 30days between data scrubbs and and preferebly once a week. (helping to kill HDDs is always a good thing, right ?) But if you need the server to be availble 24/7 well then you must run a scrub each night when its least accessed else the server will be down for a 10+ hrs or at worst a full workday or more for scub depending on how much storage you have. (downtime is very very expensive!) If doing longer times between zfs scrubs well be prepred for errors and sitting and watching "repairing" for many many hrs.. BTRFS are more forgiving in that area but not as fast, and if a SHR fails you can mount the drives in a normal Linux box manually and extract the data. with ZFS... well hope you got a spare Array card ready for use :P (oh OHH ure using a SATA- chipset well atleast a new motherboard with same sata chipset then) Older hardware dont need the latest or the greatest kernals with unknown bugs. This is old kernal with tons and tons of known bugs and how to fix alternativly use a workaround on the unfixed bugs are well known no surprises here. Its kinda like at work.. AZURE is renamed and retransformed into ENTRA because microsuck found out it was hacked 1.5 years ago and admin keys where out in the open.. woohoo.. HOW long you think entra gonna last .. as it got hacked due to its exesive log dumps dropped its admin keys in there aswell as the encryption keys.. great job microsuck.. Now take IBM Security identity manager its soo blooody old and still in use, all bugs and issues are well known and there are workaround and fixes to adress them all, well almost all. Brand new stuff are a bit of a nono, as nobody knows its bugs, issues etc. Its all about reliability thats why you dont get brand spanking newer "server cpus" All of them are atleast 12 month old, atleast 1 generation older than on the consumer side, as you the consumer test drive them aka beta test them for futureproofing them for server use. It is what it is.
@@Perra1901 lol. First of all, I only responded because a bunch of newcomers here claimed they switched from ZFS to SHR. I never implied that the two are the same. In fact, I explicitly stated that they are not in the same league, as one is a purpose-built file system while the other is essentially a fancy name for using mdadm+lvm. So you say that DSM is best out of the box, but if I wanna use a FOSS I can use docker or ssh... Which is a really cool feature, and for feature parity, you really have to choose something like every Linux ever :D This "array card" sounds funny, never heard it. IT mode, HBA, pass-through raid card, sure. But "array card", never. BTRFS is maybe prosumer, but not in the way how synology uses it (on top of lvm, it is just a snapshot tool essentially). Given the suge ficant amount of nonsense you mentioned about ZFS (daily scrubbing? MUST have ECC? SATA chipset dependency? downtime during scrubbing?), it sounds like you requested ChatGPT to provide you with some talking points, but you simply didn't grasp the content. - BTRFS and ZFS use ECC ram the same way. If it is necessary for one of them, it is also necessary for the other, and vice versa. Btw. obviously, ECC is a must in every enterprise environment. - The only chipset issue with ZFS is that it cannot obtain the GUID of the drive if you use a poor-quality USB-to-SATA chip that masks the original serial of the drive. Other than that, you can seamlessly move pools between any OS with ZFS integration, which is only absent from the base Linux kernel due to licensing issues. - You can also use any kind of SATA chipset, HBA, IT mode flashed LSI raid card, whatever, as long as it is not using some kind of port replication (which is a big no-no for any kind of raid solution...). - The daily scrub and downtime during scrub is such a nonsense, it perfectly describes that you have no idea what scrub is good for, and that it totally does not cause downtime since your array is still available, especially since scrub is a low-priority operation. If you really think older is better, I guess you are still on XP, using WEP for your wifi... C'mon, even Debian is on Kernel 6.x now... You have not even reacted to any one of my main issues, just tried to explain ZFS to someone, who has plenty of experience using multi-PB size ZFS pools in an enterprise environment and using it at home for multiple years on commodity hardware too... That is why I simply don't argue with fanbois because it is a waste of time. Especially since what you wrote about ZFS is also a big bunch of bullshit, that describes you don't know enough about this topic. And just so you know, we were a reseller for Synology too... Next time, first of all, at least try to understand what the other party says before you vomit out your favorite AI-generated bullshit. I find it puzzling that you attempted to explain SHR and ZFS to me when I simply pointed out the humor in comparing the two. And now you did that too :D
What they don't tell you is that when you replace your Synology HDD, and try to use them in on a windows PC, You can't get the full size back, I had 3 8GB disks, but I could only get windows to format them to 1.3 GB.. I tried everything... NOPE...
Many people think about the hardware like it’s the most important thing. Truth is that good hardware without good software is useless. It’s worth absolutely nothing. Software is the absolute most important thing. Hardware is always of secondary importance. I will never trade my usage of Synology’s products for anything else for the simple reason that their software is leaps above the competition. There are plenty enough people who think the software is the most important thing with security, stability, functions etc for Synology to keep being in business and they couldn’t care less if the hardware is lesser than the competition. Many people don’t need a powerhouse for a NAS either. A NAS should be secure and reliable and if it isn’t, then it’s just an expensive useless brick for MANY people. It’s like having a game console that is better hardware wise but it doesn’t have any good games. Then what is the point?
I completely agree with you, and that's why DSM is still the best option for people who want a pre-built device, but if you're willing to go down the DIY route, TrueNAS/Unraid will provide similar reliability with potentially better data security (in the case of ZFS).
I have had synology since early 2000 when they started. Im switching to UGREEN I feel like UGRREN will hit it. I was right with synology when they started and UGREEN will be the next star. Synology had there time on top. You will see.
I'm also getting Ugreen, but please consider the points in this video, because they are especially valid for them - the software is not there yet. I know what I'm getting into and I will use either Unraid or Truenas, but Ugreen "might" reach viable software in a few years - not now.
Sorry, can someone help me ? I had setup my old laptop for Synology dsm nas server and they work great , but it only about testing environment.Now i have want to make real nas like pc : motherboard with 6 hdd and 2 nvme , ryzen 2600 ,…, and i dont know does it works (which of these nas synology sever they will be , now on my laptop is some 4021xs ), or i must buy orginaly nas server configuration like synology ds1621+ (but i didint like configuration , it is very weak) Thanks for reply
Synology is great as long as you don’t have to go beyond 4 bays. However, if you build your own and go with something like Unraid, it’s infinitely more unreliable. For the price of a 12 bay Synology, I was able to buy a rack, a 10GbE switch, 2 x 36-bay servers with 1TB RAM, 44 cores, and still have money left over. DSM is brittle too. After having a Synology for a year, I cleaned it with some compressed air and it cause a drive to fail, and Synology replaced the enclosure 3 times before it would work and the single drive could be recovered. I had all Synology drives, cache, and enclosure, and when the cache kept corrupting the system, and I could prove it was the Synology cache corrupting the system, they wouldn’t stand behind their hardware, even though they force you to go 100% overpriced Synology drives over 4 drives. It’s a total scam. Unraid is even more unreliable though, albeit more flexible. Haven’t tried TrueNAS yet but that’s my next stop because Synology is a ripoff and UNRAID isn’t ready for prime time on larger storage systems, in my case around 75TB raw.
To all Apple fans who justify spending money on their iPhone in the same way. While we can completely agree that if you want to have a reliable and safe NAS, there is no other way than Synology, but the situation is different in the smartphone market. Apple feels competition and must develop its solutions because Samsung is gaining an advantage.
If you're only planning on running 3-4 and only need two bays, a DS224+ or DS723+ should do the job. Can always upgrade if you'd prefer, but totally your call.
Synology has been lacking with apps. Synology Photo is no good the old app ds photo was better I have seen them going down. They are going diffrent route , routers, AI, Cameras. They have lost it.
Interested to know where you feel the UGreen is a better device from a software perspective? Or do you mean you'd install something like TrueNAS on it?
Very well presented and explained. Yes, the key criteria is stability and reliability. For the past couple weeks RUclips has been all-a-buzz over the new UGreen NAS. Their marketing department has been working overtime. Their software developers unfortunately haven't. All reviewers have said the software is garbage, non-functional. But the hardware is good. I wouldn't rely on the device for MY data. UGreen makes excellent quality cables and adapters (I have some), but that's it. A few years ago I bought a Synology NAS to try out. The cheapest, lowest-end model two-bay they sold. I have run it continuously since and it has been flawless. I also use it for my VPN. My regret is having gone cheap since on this model the RAM is soldered and cannot be upgraded. Only 512M, so I am limited on the number of apps I can install. I have installed and tried out TrueNAS, XigmaNAS and OMV on bigger hardware, but this modest Synology remains a daily driver.
100% Agree! Rubbish quality and completely unreliable RAID array rebuilds that often never fully resync. I battled with Synology for years, upgrading and patching the clunky OS, reformatting drives and restoring data whenever the array stopped syncing, replacing drives that still worked on other systems... then finally I threw the thing in the bin and installed TrueNAS on a custom build PC. Problem solved and it works as it should.
I have technical issues with your recent videos on YT and only with your videos - your lips are behind the sound, they are out of sync. But only your lips. Popups on beginning of video are in sync! All this I've noticed a month ago. Last video that was in sync is your comparison of C2 and Backblaze backups. Each video after that has slight out of sync... Of course, I tested it on pcs, android tvs, mobiles. Not sure what happened here or did anyone reported same issue. I decided to react when I saw pop ups are in-sync, and lips are not. This can't be coincidece. Cheers, kutgw!
@@WunderTechTutorials it's off by same amount across all devices I tried - Android phones and default YT app, Shield TV and SmartTube app, PC with Edge and Vivaldi browsers. At the same time, your older videos play just fine accross same devices. I hope I'm not the only one noticing this :\
@@drkabajt This is great feedback and I genuinely appreciate it. I've felt like it's been off but then I look at it and question if it's just in my head. I looked up a few ways to confirm it and will hopefully have it fixed by the next video - really appreciate the comment!
@@drkabajtThanks again. I think I was able to resolve the issue (or at least it will be A LOT better). There was about a 150ms delay that I found and I adjusted it in the video coming out on Sunday, so I am hopeful it fixed it. Thank you again for letting me know!
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There's been a lot of great discussion here and first, I want to thank you all for watching and commenting. I do think it's important that I clarify something though - there are a lot of comments suggesting that I am implying that Synology > TrueNAS. I'm not. I use TrueNAS and love it. ZFS is great. However, I am specifically NOT talking about these NAS operating systems in this video (Unraid, TrueNAS, OMV, etc). I am talking about the prebuilt NAS devices that generally come with their own proprietary OS installed. If you are capable of configuring your own NAS device, you should. It will be exactly what you want and you won't have to play the game of picking between hardware + OS devices, but a lot of people aren't. In this space, I stand firm that I believe Synology is the best option though it's my opinion and that doesn't make it right. I'm also not saying this because I want you to buy a Synology device - I am just sharing my experiences. As mentioned in the video, you should purchase what you want and what you're comfortable with. What I AM saying however, is that if you are picking a prebuilt NAS device that comes with a proprietary OS simply based on hardware specs, you're not looking at the whole picture.
Either way, I didn't expect NEARLY this many views or comments when I released the video so I appreciate all of you who watched and commented. I think it shines a great light on some of the options consumers have that the video didn't go into, so thank you for sharing!
I also agree with the overall point of the video, however, the comment that "Synology doesn't have to innovate" is the attitude that took down many great companies: complacency.
Frank, 100% agree: DSM justifies the cost of Synology over competitors that may have better hardware. Superior hardware means nothing if your data is gone or the NAS tools are janky or unreliable. I would hope that anyone who owns a NAS has good backups. But more importantly, a restore strategy. If your data cannot be restored, backups are useless and so is the NAS. DSM offers many great apps and features OOB. Your pyramid analogy is spot-on, too. Coming from many years of ZFS experience, rock-solid filesystem w/volume management is a must-have. Initially I wasn't keen on Synology's choice to go with btrfs but after more than a year of use I've had no issues and have been very pleased with it and Synology's SHR. FWIW, I'm running a 1522+ with 5 12TB IronWolf drives in SHR-2.
You pretty much nailed it Frank. I own 3 brands of NAS and have installed Proxmox and Unraid on old hardware to test and generally just muck about with. Unless you are a really serious tinkerer and understand networks, sharing, etc, don't even consider Proxmox or Unraid. If I had to give up all but one, I would keep my Synology although QNAP would still be a close 2nd because of the hardware. If you understand networking, shares, etc and you like to deep tinker into your stuff, you may just prefer QNAP. But for the other vast majority who just want their NAS to work day after day and don't care about all of the technical spec's because they don't need the extra performance, buy Synology. If I didn't also have a QNAP, I would likely buy a 2 bay Synology to backup my main 4 bay Synology.
Steve Jobs once said that Apple was fundamentally a software company. It looks like Synology took a lesson.
FIrst was Netgear Stora, providing photography services for my iMac and Canon D6. iMac HDD crashed, Stora Crashed, 15K+ photos lost! Bought a Pegasus R6 in 2010 and currently still run it as a DAS for my Mac Mini M1 unit with 10GBe to the network. Just bought a DS1621+ and am in the process of installation after 1 week of stress testing it for stability. I have to admit, it was difficult justifying 3 y/o hardware for the total $$ spent to install to my specs. But, after 1 week of trying to break it, and failing miserably, i finally finalized the installation and put it into production. Pegasus R6 is now a second backup and another Synology NAS (723+ or similar) will occupy the dedicated backup for the entire system on site. Offsite backups are trio already but tax the network because i run them overnight on schedule. Synology cost = more, images lost = zero, sleep lost = NONE! You get what you pay for. I want reliability. Will pay thousands for reliability.
I totally agree. Synology is the best. I have two 5 bay units. They are basically mirrors. The primary backs up the secondary every night. This seems to work well for me. However, I can't seem to make it a true mirror. I initially wanted to have files immediately write to both independent NAS units. Couldn't make it work. Called Synology, they said it isn't possible. You should make a video about that. Two independent Synology NAS units in a mirror.
It's possible with QNAP, LOL :)
@@EvilTeddie23 yeah but QNAP isn’t as durable and dependable as Synology. QNAP is cheaper, more of a budget NAS. I’ve had both over the years. Synology is better for the money 💰
@@VMXGroove and you base that comment on what exactly? I've been a data storage and data protection architect for the top enterprise companies for the past 20+ years and have run Qnap for almost as long. Qnap have way better hardware than Synology and also have ZFS as a filesystem, which is the industry standard for data protection created by Sun and utilized internally by NetApp. Synology is fine for people who don't know anything about data protection and just want a simple NAS setup, but power users can get way more from QNAP or TrueNAS (also ZFS) or roll their own. Synology's decision to screw their customers and force them to purchase over priced hardware is a big red flag.
@@VMXGroove The QNAP TS-H1290FX-7302P-128G-US 12-Bay NAS Enclosure costs $7000 without disks. Add 12x Western Digital 8TB datacenter drives at $2000 each and this monster costs more than a Toyota. Add SSDs PCI-E cards and you are close to $30,000. That's out of my idea of "budget"
Love synology. Had it for years. Just bought qnap ts 473a. I really wanted the ram for ai photo mgt.
It seems that a lot of NAS users are expanding the role of the NAS from basic file sharing and backups to media services, using security cams, adding containers/VMs, etc. The fact that there are now at least 3 or 4 new players in the NAS market is a good sign that people are not satisfied with what is currently out there. Synology's hardware choices, and relatively recent move to proprietary drive and hardware requirements is further driving some potential users away. In the end, Synology may be aiming to dominate in the High Cost/High Convenience segment. There is money to be made there, and not having to dedicate a lot of resources to support on their mature OS and self branded hardware does make some sense. Curious to see if the other makers in the Mid Price/Pretty Good Hardware/Sometimes Frustrating OS can make the case that saving hundreds or even thousands of dollars draws in enough buyers to be profitable.
I use synology but I think, coming from a developer background, it's a rip off. They disabled many features of open source software or make it hard to install, or risky, using 3rd party vendors that aren't audited. For instance they want you to use their own synology surveillance station and pay the expensive licenses fees per camera, when you could spin off your own open source system provided they hadn't disabled many common features found in ffmpeg for instance.
Yes for unbranded cameras you pay a fee, but you get a free license with synocamera..
But why dont you just run a docker with free survailance software then add ANY cameres for free to that ?
All free and no hassle kinda..
Well you have to tinker a bit to get it run great...
While on surveilancestation its all based to run cameras and were back where Syno shines brighter than the sun and its their software..
It runs really good on their boxes..
But the thing is you have options even on Synology.
if they disabled some stuff you used, well then reactivate it again IF you need that badly.
Ohh they uninstalled it ?
Well reinstall it then. (ssh into it and dowload it from a reposatory)
Or Create a small script for taskmanager that re-enables that function after a reboot. (I do this to remove certain apps)
Done or atleast untill they rename the file or moves it.
Media codeccs and such are a horrible field to enter into, more or less a sh!t show of a magnitude with no ends.
Features in FFmpeg, well now youre actually inside the licenseing .. oboy now thats a legal heavy mess and very EXPENSIVE area.
Sure they could support all codecs, legal ones, that would cost a arm and a leg per update of DSM or keep the ones that are royalty free. (what would you do)
Sure they could support a greyzone one like ffmpeg and get sued to kingdom come from the rights owners of the slashed and ripped codecs in that one ;P
perhaps you have the same issue as i had, on my DS216+II i can run media with a certain 6 channel sound no issues. (d216+II was one of their last with FULL media codecs licenses)
The same media cant be played from my DS1621+ unless i use FFMpeg6. My panasonic TV could play it a couple years ago but they had a change of media codeccs and boom i lost the wierd 6 channel codecc there aswell.
How i solved it?
Well it still works through my ancient Formula box.
I just remuxed the 6 channel sound into 5.1 and recoded into h.264, sure its not as good as the 6 channel sound but hey it works on ALL units now.
And i dont record in 6channel sound anymore just 5.1 mode.
Problems are made to be solved.
@@Perra1901 You're on an old version that wasn't as restrictive. The problems are now much worse. Even docker doesn't work as expected. The reality is, you don't need these kind of problems and restrictions, it's not worth anyone's time. When the goal is to prevent users from using open spurce software when they themselves repackage them for their synology software, there is a problem.
Why I have not yet bought a NAS! I have 10 gig home connection and this company feels like it is stuck in 2013
When you see a synology from 2013 still working you may start to see why its a good choice
@@reubenha1 Just because it works does not mean it's good. still sucks.
So you can afford 10 gig home internet but not a 10 gig nic?
@@tama47_Ethicality principle is the key, not KIDNAPware principle. So, many users have chosen basic freedom of fair living.
I totally agree with you. My first NAS was DS-211 (decommissioned) then upgrade my NAS to DS-1019+. During these years, I also purchased DS-214+, DS-218+ and DS-220+ for my friends and myself for offsite backup. All of these are reliable. I prefer a stable and reliable device (just like iPhone) rather than performance.
You had me until you said IpHoNe! haha
Really great points here. It really is time for them to have 2.5gbe or 10gbe options that don't require add-ons
Going PC when my Synology dies. No more proprietary file systems that I can't read elsewhere, no more proprietary hardware.
Excellent video, and you absolutely nailed it. I made the mistakes you described and eventually bought a Synology having spent almost double to learn what you just described.
Thank you! This is the deep dive video I was looking for in the sea of shallow overviews about specs and features.
Thx for this! Ugreen have been promoting their new kickstarter, so this is really useful info.
👋👊
Same... rethinking my decision now. Have till tomorrow (May 10th, 2024) to pull out.
if only manufacturers built NAS hardware and supported using TrueNAS, or other open platforms, not supporting the OS, but the hardware. For instance, Ugreen seems to have great hardware, at a fair price, but refuse to support the hardware if installing 3rd party OS's. This is the behavior that made me build my own. Sadly, most users don't want to have to do that, or don't know how or where to begin.
Is UGREEN saying they won't honor warranties if you don't run their janky version of Debian? Or are they just not offering support for software if you use Ubuntu Server or TrueNAS or whatever?
It would be a nightmare to have to support multiple operating systems on their hardware. Users would blame the manufacturer for issues in software they didn't create. It would also be expensive to support all those operating systems.
Completely agree. Best software out there. They're essentially following Apple's playbook. Normally any of this wouldn't bother me. But in recent years since they started with their restrictions on RAM, and especially SSD/HDDs, is definitely the kind of BS that's pissing me off, and makes me want to go elsewhere. Because make no mistake, Synology knows what they're doing, when pulling stunts like this, all the while selling subpar accessories, for double the price or more, and lying to customers about why.
This is one of the reasons I backed a UGreen NAS in Kickstarter recently. Synology is getting too greedy. 😮💨
@@xellaz Agreed. Also giving their customers as little as possible in terms of hardware is equally annoying. 10gbps should be the norm for pro-sumer hardware IMHO.
I totally agree with what you say about the network hardware my DS916+ where I've bonded 2 x 1gbt networks , I wish it has 2.5gbt or you could use a usb 2.5gbt device .
Synology does have it's faults , a few days ago I got a your drive as 900+ bad sector replace the drive , so I switched off the nas and ordered a new one , I have 3 x 10tb ironwolfs , so got a 12tb so I know it's a different, now have a spare drive because after I switched it back on all my drives are healthy again , so not sure what happened there , but from your drive is faulty and healthy again in 3 days .
But I do love the GUI which shows which drive is faulty and not bad sector on ata-ST10200VN0004-1ZB101_ZA29ZN8X .
I consume a lot of content on youtube. I'm only just now looking into Synology for the first time and don't really want to spend too much time searching through a ton of content on the subject. I say that because I wish you'd just name names. Which competitors have the inferior product? I'd rather not have to search through all of your content to get that information from you. I still do appreciate the video. Thumbs up.
I don't want to bash companies if I don't have to, especially because a video that might be relevant today isn't guaranteed to be relevant tomorrow. From my perspective, there isn't a great pre-built NAS operating system other than DSM, RIGHT NOW. Some people are happy with the other options but I've had a bunch of problems with them, which was my main reason for making the video. I hope the others improve some day, but right now, from a pre-built NAS operating system perspective, DSM is the best in my book.
I've been using Synology since 2011 and have found DSM to be rock solid!!! I currently have a DS718.. I'm looking to upgrade to newer hardware with 4 drive bays, but finding Synology current hardware a bit lacking. Hopefully Synology will be release some more capable hardware in the near future.
Damn Frank...you ABSOLUTELY nailed it!!! I cant think of anything else to say other than you absolutely nailed it!!!
He's right. No matter the hardware being older, Synology NAS devices are rock solid. I tried TrueNAS, fine if you have hours to tinker and missing features that should be easy. End of the day don't be dumb just buy a Synology NAS. Its the best of the best.
I agree if you aren't the tinkerer/DIY type. I've personally been DIY'ing my own setup since ZFS was added to FreeBSD, then freenas and now truenas but I'm comfortable putting together my NAS + backup solution for my little homelab setup. If you are at all comfortable doing it yourself and actually evaluate what synology offers for the price it's kind of a ripoff, especially now that they are also trying to sell you HD's and RAM at apple markeup prices for what is basically commodity hardware. But if you aren't then Synology has the best software by a mile and decent support and that matters to the average consumer a lot more than more recent hardware in most cases.
Thank you Frank. This cleared some of my recent thinking about alternate hardware. Decision made for me.🙏
Your points in this video echoes a lot of other stuff I've read about in researching on my first NAS: That Synology is expensive, not the best hardware wise, but goddamn it Just Works
As someone who just wants a convenient little box to backup their important files, and doesn't want to spend their weekends tinkering and fiddling over DIY solutions that would probably give me more headaches than solutions, a Synology NAS really sounds like a no brainer
I've seen sponsored shit all over the web of other NAS options, and there's been a proliferation of Chinese NAS devices, but at the end of the day, I want to experience life and not waste time and money on a device that shits the bed on the fundamentals
Thanks for the super easy to understand video. It was very helpful!
Got lucky that I found the best deal on facebook. I bought a DS1821+ with 3 pcs 18tb wd and it's working good! another 2 pcs on the way now. Thanks for this video!
I've made my decision for Synology for exactly the same reason. Back then, Synology was not that set on the hardware vendor locking game, which helped. I hope that other NAS manufacturers will catch up with their software so that Synology receives some motivation to drop the hardware blackmailing and provide at least decent hardware, as opposed to technology that was already outdated three years ago.
Still no 2.5G in their NASs. At least you can buy 10Gbe NIC for 923 for less than $200 CAD.
@@Act1veSp1nI bought a $47 USB 2.5 adapter and am using it in my DS1520+ and works good. CableCreation USB 3.0 to 2.5 Gigabit USB Type A. There are drivers on github and is fairly easy to install.
@@Act1veSp1nmy new unit has 2x2.5 gbe, 2xnvme ssd, cpu has transcoding capability, only $175. OEM OS is usable. Upgraded to 32g ddr4 3200mhz at $50 from free market. No complaints.
Have had my DS920+ since 2021. Had to swap the first one out as it had a defective backplane. This has been the best investment I have made since using a PC. I have 16 users, "mostly phone backups," along with 3 pc and plex. Only issue I've had is the backup with ADD. Even though I have a certificate from let's encrypt, it complains about 1 every month or so.
I disagree as a long time synology user . I switched to QNAP as The best NAS solution I’ve come across is a Qnap system such as the TS-664 running Truenas scale . Removing the original O/S and installing Truenas turns the NAS into a system which rivals some enterprise systems and its rock solid with , docker , snapshots, iscsi etc
does TrueNAS have native file browser/manager from web UI yet?
@@TazzSmk unfortunately there’s no native app . There is a file browser plugin though that can be used
TrueNAS doesn't support expanding RAID
@@rye419before you write such information check on google "Expande zvol" or "dataset" in Truenas. You will be surprised
You are SPOT ON! I appreciate your technical expertise, your clear presentation, and your honesty!
Imagine having an Intel i9 PC running Windows 3.1! What’s the point? Rhetorical, on purpose and supports your opinion. Even the complaints about hardware limitations, heck forget 2.5GbE, for like $100 I got 10GbE and zero regrets. I also easily upgraded to 32gb Memory with 3rd party RAM, 3.5 years and not a single issue. I put 2TB of Samsung NVMe for Cache. Listen, for a NAS that will likely last me a decade, the overall cost is minimal to have both hardware and a stellar OS that just works and provides features and functions so worthy of the investment.
I came from a decade of Drobo. Take about limitations! Well we know how that story ended. Had an Infrant (now owned by Netgear) NAS before that. Was nothing more than RAID storage.
So, others can brag about their hardware, hating the experience while I enjoy both my hardware and software for years to come. Heck, I love them enough to have 3, 2 onsite, 1 off. And caused me to buy a Synology Mesh Network to replace my functionally incapable Orbi Mesh. Again, another great WunderTech video! 👍🏻👍🏻
Thank you! This confirms my decision to buy the DS920+ when I did - based on the research I did at the time, including your videos. I have followed your instructions to setup snapshot replication, hyper backup, and Active Backup for Business. My data has never felt so secure! The Photos app is really very good as well for my needs (anything is better than Google Photos). Synology was the right decision for my personal and business needs! I will probably buy another unit to place at my business partner's house so we can have another level of backup/sync between the two units.
Glad it helped! Thank you for watching!
@@WunderTechTutorials my next goal will be to get my small business corporate Sharepoint and OneDrive (I'm the admin) data syncing with my NAS to ensure everything is secure with snapshots and hyperbackup.
@@billegbert6262 That's awesome! I haven't personally used it, but I think Active Backup for Microsoft 365 could help with that!
100. I resisted your points for years and was stubborn, ran enterprise gear with stuff like FreeNAS, Rockstore, TrueNAS etc. Got a synology and it sips power, I'm running tons of docker containers and a VM on it no issues, everything is an easy tutorial and GUI process to find (thanks a lot to your channel and website) and it just runs and does its job. Yes I'm peeved I couldn't get something with faster network speeds and ECC RAM but other than that, this thing just chugs away and getting it to do things like Tailscale, Kiwix, pi-hole, hiemdall, Plex, Jellyfin, VideoStation, Home Assistant etc has been a breeze compared to other systems.
I was sold when I first saw synology at work: Many years old and all dusty but still working. My home synology (2HDD) has worked 10+ years. One HDD died and I changed both out to ones double the volume. Hardly noticed any delays except everything became faster due to the new HDDs. Why I don't care really, DSM, better components... whatever. One thing though is the photo backup app which functions can be improved. Cheaper than icloud anyway.
I totally agree brother. I have a Synology DS3018XS which is almost six years old. This thing is still the best piece of IT equipment I've ever purchased. I am a systems engineer and also use two TrueNAS scale servers (loaded with RAM, CPU...etc.), my Synology is my go-to device for my mission critical. My TrueNAS setup required expertise in hardware selection/setup etc. that your average hobbyist doesn't possess.
My only issue with Synology is the cost of their drives and peripherals. You can use third party drives but the warnings and such piss me off. If their drives were at a 10% premium I wouldn't mind, but 200% is nutty. Synology management needs to do better hitting the sweet spot of value. Otherwise great stuff. JMHO :)
I can't say app on Synology. I have right now a problem with Photos and other things on my nas. But what is really good it is support. You didn't mention it. ))
Software maturity and security. That’s it , I prefer Synology compared to Qnap that can share your data to the whole world :) Qnap have a good hardware but Qnap security is as good as ugreen OS on their new nas…. 100% agree with your Frank, at the end of the day , we want something that is rock solid and it works 100% of the time
100% This! ... That's why I use them. Also with QNAP or UGREEN who knows if there is Chinese backdoors installed. We know that isn't the case with a US company like Synology.
@@CedroCronSynology is Taiwanese. Also you're pretty naive if you don't think US companies or any company for that matter, does the exact same thing ;)
I stand corrected... I was going based information in another RUclips video. My bad... And I'd take my chances with a US company over a Chinese company given the choice. @@blcjck8121
@@blcjck8121you’re 100% right. Not sure where he’s getting his info from 😂
@@CedroCronWait till you see what data the USA monitors and stores.
Does anyone know if Synology will be releasing new models anytime soon?
I am 100% a total noob in the space. I’m a professional commercial photographer that understands how important redundancy is, but being my own IT department has its very important limits! I have a Synology unit on its way and can’t wait to feel the security of a nas system vs all the random ass ssd I have laying around. Thanks for confirming I made the right choice. I’m exactly the target market for this system and looking forward to have the best, for me.
Good luck with it! Thanks for watching!
Interesting, when I bought my DSM 918+ I bought it because the hardware was a better specification than QNAP, well 7 years of 24x7 service later the only failure that I can put down to Synology is a Power Supply, I obtained a repalcement within 2 days and I bought two so I have a spare. Apart from that 1 x WD Red 4TB HDD required replacement, the Synology OS handled that with a warning and as expected the prodess was a hot swap, oh and the two Samsumg SSDs which were replaced under warranty. All in acll I've very pelased with the NAS and in particular the 100% reliable OS. I use iDrive for backup to the cloud as is is compeditivly priced.
I choose reliability above speed etc anytime. I do some video-editing, but I do it alone. So I can do it on an external SSD and store it, when the project is finished on my NAS. Synology for me is reliable but more important, I understand it and it is easy to use. I bought My DS1522+ last year. It was my first NAS. And your channel and 2 others where the ones who convinced my to go for Synology. So I really agree with you. I saw your video about Ugreen (?) and some others. It looks good, but still I stick with Synology. QNAP I did not like. Saw many video's about them too.
Synology support has always been great, and their focus on security is important to me. I do hope they upgrade their hardware one day.
QNAP has failed from a security and failures despite better hardware. Software, security and reliability costs more cuz it's worth more of you value your time and data. My opinion having 30 years experience
I have a Seagate 2 bay nas today, use to backup stuff to.
For business - definitely Synology. Since time is money - the faster a system allows you to get things done without fiddling too much, over time, the more expensive initial setup pays for itself. There’s equipment I just want it to work, and not have to spend extra time wrestling with it when I have 20 other things that need to be done. This point becomes really clear when you work for an employer that wants you to be more engaged in using your problem solving talents on the business side of things, rather than mucking around in customizable settings. While certainly its always good to have options to be able to exercise, most SMEs need just the basics of file storage, backup, access - so getting to roll out and administrate those things quickly is a good thing. Open Source and very custoimizable setups really shine though, when you really need to deliver something niche, and its something that you can do for your situation, but doesn’t apply to most others.
Quite honestly don't believe this crap. The hardware is weak, the software is ordinary. If you know how to install software you can get better bang for your buck than going with Synology.
I believed crap like this video and went in with Synology, and after spending 000s I have it just run as a backpack for my main Nas (self built).
Which is why 1 second into the video it says "if you're in the market for a prebuilt NAS device". I completely agree with you - a DIY NAS will be better for most people, but it's not going to be pre-built.
I wouldn't label Synology as "worse hardware"; perhaps it's lower-spec, but not necessarily worse. Over the years, I've worked with various brands of NAS hardware. Around 12 years ago, a client purchased a Synology DS1010+ but needed assistance setting it up. Despite primarily selling Iomega and Western Digital NAS hardware at the time, I was thoroughly impressed by Synology's DSM. Since then, I've advocated for our company to exclusively offer Synology products. When EMC sold Iomega to Lenovo, we transitioned to Synology for both our internal network and client solutions.
It's definitly worse hardware and has been for ages. That said the software is so much better than other consumer/smb offerings that synology can get away with it.
I've done the research multiple times and always ended up with Synology again,
thing is, if you need a NAS, then you don't need a server,
if you have a reliable NAS, then you can build another rig to work as a server, and access data from your NAS,
speaking of hardware, frankly HDDs are the bottleneck, so unless you're going full SSD build (which makes zero sense for NAS anyway), you'll be always limited by HDDs, not hardware of the NAS (unless you go for low-end Realtek cpu) - one of my NASes is DS420+ with 2GB ram and 2-core cpu can comfortably handle 36TB SHR (4x12TB) pool, if I want VMs then I use Proxmox on i7-4770 8-thread cpu with 32GB ram and all-SSD local pool
I bought an old synology nas (DS416, it wasnt even a '+') off of the ebays and put 2x 14TB HDD in it..... I managed to set up raid 1 and file sharing on the nas, but could not get things like DLNA running or get anything else that I wanted in a NAS ( VM/s, containers, transcoding videos BTRFS and the like). Frustrated I then started to look into getting something decent (at a reasonable price) that could do the things I wanted. At this stage I have settled on the DS920+ it has all the features I need (VM support, BTRFS, containers etc) and it is better at transcoding video than the DS923+ (by virtue of the fact that it as an intel celeron chip with its onboard graphics, where the DS923+ has a ryzen chip with no onboard graphics). BUT, it is not perfect, with the max capacity being 64TB, versus the 72TB of the DS423+, BUT the DS423+ is not expandable, whereas the DS920+ is with the addition of a DX517 unit IS. MEANWHILE..... I was thinking about flogging the DS416 off on ebay so that it bacomes someone elses problem.😊
I agree with you on so many points, but I just wish that Synology devices would be more fair-priced and get cheaper as time goes by. However, that's not the case and is a flaw with Synology.
Excellent video Frank. Can’t argue a single point. Well done.
Thanks, Tony! Appreciate you watching!
Why can’t we have both? I am willing to pay premium price for latest hardware from Synology but they just don’t offer it. I’m still holding on to my trusted DS716+II and don’t know what to upgrade to.
Just bought a NAS and even Ugreen would be available I made a decision for Synology. At least you were one of them who made my decision solid rock and I am total fine with my Synology NAS now, even it’s hardware isn’t the best on the market. And I will not store my critical date on a Chinese Hardware with Chinese Software on it. Never ever even I have to spend less money for it!
Couldn't agree with everything you said. I've been with Synology since 2014 and have never been tempted more than fleetingly to change. DSM is outstanding, in fact I just bought a RT6600AX and it's amazing too.
The only major criticism I have with them at the moment is that their Customer Services seems to have fallen off a cliff; or maybe I was just unlucky. I've used them in the past (5+ years ago) and they were great. I tried to use them in the last 12 months and it was like talking to a 5 year old.
I see a lot of vids about the hardware... For me it just works. The replication is bullet proof. 10g networking.. And the software plugins are for the most part very good. I have a home lab... I do not need a Net App / SolidFire etc. If I make videos I am the only one and have a seprate volume "disks" for that and I do not see it affect anyone else in my home... Including my VMware host that are iSCSI connected. What else would you want for my use case... NOTHING will pull me off at this point and the only thing I would consider is what Ubiquity comes out with..
The problem is that being "good enough" when competitors are taking massive leaps from a hardware perspective isn't a recipe for long-term success. I don't think they need to lead the industry from a hardware perspective but I do think they need to up their game a little bit.
@@WunderTechTutorials I agree that they do need to up it to keep up with what’s coming. They prob already have plans ready to go. But they will not release it until they have too. They will max out profits until that time comes. Once someone comes out with a product that can truly compete with DSM it will be a diffrent story. Until then this is the best option. At least for me.
DSM is hands down the reason it’s expensive and it works, and works very well. If you’re a content creator and don’t want to manage a device, get a Synology. If you’re hardware and software technically inclined get truenas Unraid OMV and roll your own.
As a photographer / videographer I was told for years to use Drobo because it was the best. I had nothing but problems for a damn decade and it was slow as hell. After Drobo went out of business and I got an 1821+ and Jesus crispies, this is what it’s supposed to be like having a NAS. It just works. Drobo dashboard was a giant turd and had no 10gbe upgrade path.
Over 5 years my 2 Synology s work perfekt until now NO problem .. just one disk lost but Change it without NO Problem… in this time … the Support and performance is getting better….
Nothing else !
All others are a cheap copy but a copy is not the original!
🙏
I love my synology NAS. One of the coolest things I've bought for years.
As a Synology NAS owner (I got a recent one with four drives), all I can say is if DSM is why you should buy Synology, then the Linux based OSes used by the competition, including uGreen, must really be terrible.
All that is True, however there is a limit for a cost of a Synology NAS because as an example, if the minimal cost of one these machines was 10.000 USD, no one will buy it, so is obvious that for you this limit was not reach yet, but for many people it is already there, including me.
Thanks for the advice!
QNAPs software has come a long way and most of their previous issues could be solved by simply not letting it contact the internet directly. Synology is the best turnkey solution but there are much better options if you're willing to put in a little time and effort. Intel was in the same situation pre-Zen and look what happened to them. AMD's market share is at record levels, as it should be. If you sliced the cost of a Synology by 20-25%, maybe I'd consider it.
One word, Xpenology
Exactly !
Hahahahahha Shhhhhh 😂 . Let’s keep it a secret from the uniniciated
Saying that other brands restoration functions never work when they have to doesn't seem true. Everyone knows Synology has the better software but there is a difference between better and non functional. The fact that Synology has completely abandoned the home media market by not releasing a N100 NAS is beyond me and it shows they don't give a crap about their users. Not unlike Apple...
Finally saying that we consumers do not have a choice, and we just have to take it, is a very slippery slope.
I didn't mean to imply they never work, just that I've had problems with it. I truthfully hate the lack of competition, but I haven't come across another pre-built NAS OS that is nearly as reliable as Synology.
Thanks for the video but IMHO Synology is nothing more than overpriced, underperforming GARBAGE, reminds me of crApple devices. You are right in that consumers should do their own research & doing so tends to land you on QNAP which strikes a good balance of great hardware + great software vs Synology's poor 10yr old hardware + great software but hey to each his own.
I dont know why I would want a NAS which doesn't even officially support hard drives & memory that aren't branded by them. 🤔
IMHO, I just want something that works out of the box. while you might want to stuff about with alternatives like truenas or QNAP, Synology is a turn key solution. The software is great. I think that a reliable NAS that WILL restore your data has got to be better than a janky POS that is so powerful that it floats on a column of raw energy, but is unreliable. I think Synology is is worth the extra money. The whole point of a NAS is data integrity not performance.
Its very simple. People buy Synology because of the software (DSM). And this software is so much better than any ofher nas software. Yes the hardware is often weaker than similar prised other nas systems, but thats a trade-off one need to take for getting the software. If all one need is a file server on local network, then its better to install Truenas, UNRAID etc. on a old computer. Its two very different systems!
Synology & Qnap should be worried. When Ugreen sorts out the software issues, this NAS is going to be amazing. For now, I’m sticking with my Synology 918+ and 412+ because I don’t like what Synology are doing right now. Locking down what hardware you can use. Synology are getting more & more like Apple.
@@CedroCronNot sure where you’re getting your information from. Synology is a Taiwanese corporation.
SW can't be just sorted out. It's a lifelong process and Synology still good on it. Yes it's have weaker hardware part, but for home users like me, my 920 is overkill after memory upgrade. Have all Synology services I need plus 5-6 containers in docker and never run out of CPU power or memory. Only thing I wish - faster lan ports actually. If you using NAS for virtualization it might be another story, but for my taste this job is more for servers.
I glad that Ugreen trying to get into NAS business, but if honestly - good SW and professional 24/7 support is what you should start from in this business (suppose that make Synology price so high actually), not a hardware.
Only reason you know about Ugreen is that they sent EVERY tech RUclipsr a review unit. Their software still has a loooong ways to go, from the 54 reviews I've seen lol. Their best option right now would be to make 3rd party OS installs easier - and make it easy to switch back for testing. Or.... Keep pricing low enough that everyone can do their own testing.
TrueNas…
@@ZoneProduction448inclusing qnap, Taiwanese as well.
Synology should please upgrade the hardware. Why is the RAM soldered to the board? Why AMD instead of Intel? Some people need more RAM because the specified RAM is simply not enough!!! Some people work with 4K videos or use Plex transcoding and for that they need a graphics card. That's why many jump out and buy Qnap or Asustor... or the new Ugreen, here you can even put Unraid or truenas on it because Ugreen gives the end user the possibility to decide everything himself. Of course the software plays a big role, but also security. That's where opinions differ, just like Apple devices and Android. If the hardware was up to date, they would buy a lot more devices.
Why not AMD instead of Intel ? (less power and more performance, but then again you really want another J4125 box due to UHD D600 gfx chip ?)
I did use plex a long time ago but now, i dont see the need for it, since 2015.
Just record youre homemovies in a newer codecc like H.264/H.265 and the problems are gone.
If you have a ton of old movies that needs to be transcoded..
RECODE them and be done!
Whats the problem !?
Dont you have a home pc with like 6+ cores aka 12+ threads ?
Recode goes FAST nowadays what once took 1-2 days now takes and 1 or 2 hrs and max.
Why keep it a problem solve it.
@@Perra1901 Hi, the point is that only the housing is being replaced and not the hardware. See the post by @coolcat23. I'm not the only one with this opinion.
It's the Apple of the NAS world. For those who dislike open-source software and prefer not to choose between options, being more than okay with something mediocre that someone else picked for them. DSM is low maintenance and easy to learn, at least according to the marketing hype :D
Then these same people install Synology's Docker UI and use that abomination, which is worse than any other open-source Docker UI that has ever existed in the universe, instead of spending the same amount of time learning something useful.
ABB has been broken on Linux for months, maybe even years now, since it depends on the kernel, and obviously, they don't care enough to update their app. Why would they, since DSM is also running on an ancient kernel.
The other arbitrary limitations, like their camera software licensing, while much better FOSS options exist, or their "custom" hardware, which is just a "custom" firmware without any meaningful change but with a 3x price tag... it's all just a joke.
But yeah, DSM is the best, I guess...
p.s.: I find it amusing when people claim they switched from ZFS to SHR. If you understand how SHR works under the hood, you'd realize they're not even in the same league. There's a reason SHR isn't an option on Synology's enterprise models.
Yeah agree 100% on the apple comment.
But you CAN use FOSS software on synology via DOCKER gui, or 3rd party apps, or advance mode SSH, and install it from there.
and yes you can run the REAL none gui'ed docker via SSH aswell if you want to.
For cameras i replied to a comment above..
Amusing that you compare ZFS to SHR ... Really like comparing apples to water melons in that case..
ZFS = enterprise file system
SHR= hybrid raid system NOT a file system.
BTRFS= Consumer/ Prosumer ish../enterprise-ish depends on what wanna run there, usually other better options.
Synology mainly use 2 filesystems EXT4 and BTRFS (SHR are available through BTRFS)
Also ZFS MUST have ECC ram, BTRFS dont need to but its BETTER to have.
And the " XS+" models dont have SHR because most of em have array cards anyway. (hardware raid cards, just SATA flashed etc.)
To see what have what, just check for E-sata ports = no array card, MinisasHD port= Array card
As you said it youre self. DSM is the best.. OUT OF THE BOX so to speak.
How to maintain it ? setup 2 tasks.
1 task smart scan each 6 months
2 task data scrubbing once each 6 months (when drives reach 3-5 years aka their waranty expiry date move down to 3 months on scrubbing)
Done.
For ZFS dont go longer than 30days between data scrubbs and and preferebly once a week. (helping to kill HDDs is always a good thing, right ?)
But if you need the server to be availble 24/7 well then you must run a scrub each night when its least accessed else the server will be down for a 10+ hrs or at worst a full workday or more for scub depending on how much storage you have. (downtime is very very expensive!)
If doing longer times between zfs scrubs well be prepred for errors and sitting and watching "repairing" for many many hrs..
BTRFS are more forgiving in that area but not as fast, and if a SHR fails you can mount the drives in a normal Linux box manually and extract the data.
with ZFS... well hope you got a spare Array card ready for use :P (oh OHH ure using a SATA- chipset well atleast a new motherboard with same sata chipset then)
Older hardware dont need the latest or the greatest kernals with unknown bugs.
This is old kernal with tons and tons of known bugs and how to fix alternativly use a workaround on the unfixed bugs are well known no surprises here.
Its kinda like at work..
AZURE is renamed and retransformed into ENTRA because microsuck found out it was hacked 1.5 years ago and admin keys where out in the open.. woohoo..
HOW long you think entra gonna last .. as it got hacked due to its exesive log dumps dropped its admin keys in there aswell as the encryption keys.. great job microsuck..
Now take IBM Security identity manager its soo blooody old and still in use, all bugs and issues are well known and there are workaround and fixes to adress them all, well almost all.
Brand new stuff are a bit of a nono, as nobody knows its bugs, issues etc.
Its all about reliability thats why you dont get brand spanking newer "server cpus"
All of them are atleast 12 month old, atleast 1 generation older than on the consumer side, as you the consumer test drive them aka beta test them for futureproofing them for server use.
It is what it is.
@@Perra1901 lol.
First of all, I only responded because a bunch of newcomers here claimed they switched from ZFS to SHR. I never implied that the two are the same. In fact, I explicitly stated that they are not in the same league, as one is a purpose-built file system while the other is essentially a fancy name for using mdadm+lvm.
So you say that DSM is best out of the box, but if I wanna use a FOSS I can use docker or ssh... Which is a really cool feature, and for feature parity, you really have to choose something like every Linux ever :D
This "array card" sounds funny, never heard it. IT mode, HBA, pass-through raid card, sure. But "array card", never. BTRFS is maybe prosumer, but not in the way how synology uses it (on top of lvm, it is just a snapshot tool essentially).
Given the suge ficant amount of nonsense you mentioned about ZFS (daily scrubbing? MUST have ECC? SATA chipset dependency? downtime during scrubbing?), it sounds like you requested ChatGPT to provide you with some talking points, but you simply didn't grasp the content.
- BTRFS and ZFS use ECC ram the same way. If it is necessary for one of them, it is also necessary for the other, and vice versa. Btw. obviously, ECC is a must in every enterprise environment.
- The only chipset issue with ZFS is that it cannot obtain the GUID of the drive if you use a poor-quality USB-to-SATA chip that masks the original serial of the drive. Other than that, you can seamlessly move pools between any OS with ZFS integration, which is only absent from the base Linux kernel due to licensing issues.
- You can also use any kind of SATA chipset, HBA, IT mode flashed LSI raid card, whatever, as long as it is not using some kind of port replication (which is a big no-no for any kind of raid solution...).
- The daily scrub and downtime during scrub is such a nonsense, it perfectly describes that you have no idea what scrub is good for, and that it totally does not cause downtime since your array is still available, especially since scrub is a low-priority operation.
If you really think older is better, I guess you are still on XP, using WEP for your wifi... C'mon, even Debian is on Kernel 6.x now...
You have not even reacted to any one of my main issues, just tried to explain ZFS to someone, who has plenty of experience using multi-PB size ZFS pools in an enterprise environment and using it at home for multiple years on commodity hardware too... That is why I simply don't argue with fanbois because it is a waste of time. Especially since what you wrote about ZFS is also a big bunch of bullshit, that describes you don't know enough about this topic. And just so you know, we were a reseller for Synology too...
Next time, first of all, at least try to understand what the other party says before you vomit out your favorite AI-generated bullshit. I find it puzzling that you attempted to explain SHR and ZFS to me when I simply pointed out the humor in comparing the two. And now you did that too :D
What they don't tell you is that when you replace your Synology HDD, and try to use them in on a windows PC, You can't get the full size back, I had 3 8GB disks, but I could only get windows to format them to 1.3 GB.. I tried everything... NOPE...
I haven't tried on Windows but you should be able to get it on macOS/Linux.
Synology is still king. 👑
No empirers last forever.
Romen empire is history like others. Arrogance can hurt, entity can vanish.
Synology is an overpriced piece of crap these days. If you’re skilled enough to know you need a nas you’re probably skilled to build your own machine.
Many people think about the hardware like it’s the most important thing. Truth is that good hardware without good software is useless. It’s worth absolutely nothing. Software is the absolute most important thing. Hardware is always of secondary importance.
I will never trade my usage of Synology’s products for anything else for the simple reason that their software is leaps above the competition.
There are plenty enough people who think the software is the most important thing with security, stability, functions etc for Synology to keep being in business and they couldn’t care less if the hardware is lesser than the competition. Many people don’t need a powerhouse for a NAS either.
A NAS should be secure and reliable and if it isn’t, then it’s just an expensive useless brick for MANY people.
It’s like having a game console that is better hardware wise but it doesn’t have any good games. Then what is the point?
I completely agree with you, and that's why DSM is still the best option for people who want a pre-built device, but if you're willing to go down the DIY route, TrueNAS/Unraid will provide similar reliability with potentially better data security (in the case of ZFS).
I have had synology since early 2000 when they started. Im switching to UGREEN I feel like UGRREN will hit it. I was right with synology when they started and UGREEN will be the next star. Synology had there time on top. You will see.
I'm also getting Ugreen, but please consider the points in this video, because they are especially valid for them - the software is not there yet. I know what I'm getting into and I will use either Unraid or Truenas, but Ugreen "might" reach viable software in a few years - not now.
Sorry, can someone help me ? I had setup my old laptop for Synology dsm nas server and they work great , but it only about testing environment.Now i have want to make real nas like pc : motherboard with 6 hdd and 2 nvme , ryzen 2600 ,…, and i dont know does it works (which of these nas synology sever they will be , now on my laptop is some 4021xs ), or i must buy orginaly nas server configuration like synology ds1621+ (but i didint like configuration , it is very weak)
Thanks for reply
I'd buy DSM like Windows if they'd allow it, their hardware isn't as nice as the others available
Synology is great as long as you don’t have to go beyond 4 bays. However, if you build your own and go with something like Unraid, it’s infinitely more unreliable. For the price of a 12 bay Synology, I was able to buy a rack, a 10GbE switch, 2 x 36-bay servers with 1TB RAM, 44 cores, and still have money left over. DSM is brittle too. After having a Synology for a year, I cleaned it with some compressed air and it cause a drive to fail, and Synology replaced the enclosure 3 times before it would work and the single drive could be recovered. I had all Synology drives, cache, and enclosure, and when the cache kept corrupting the system, and I could prove it was the Synology cache corrupting the system, they wouldn’t stand behind their hardware, even though they force you to go 100% overpriced Synology drives over 4 drives. It’s a total scam.
Unraid is even more unreliable though, albeit more flexible. Haven’t tried TrueNAS yet but that’s my next stop because Synology is a ripoff and UNRAID isn’t ready for prime time on larger storage systems, in my case around 75TB raw.
I’ve been a synology user for 20 years including a current 12 device rack mount nas. I won’t be buying from them in the future - QNAP.
Which competition is the best?
In my opinion, a DIY NAS is the best competition.
Shared folder in DSM are not good. In fact, horrible.
Thanks. I enjoy my Synology.
wrong 3 letters SHR..... Jk its about service integrations and SHR
To all Apple fans who justify spending money on their iPhone in the same way. While we can completely agree that if you want to have a reliable and safe NAS, there is no other way than Synology, but the situation is different in the smartphone market. Apple feels competition and must develop its solutions because Samsung is gaining an advantage.
the lack of innovation and playing it easy for so many years is what is gonna crush synology when terramaster and ugreen take the throne
If I wanted to use Synology strictly for the surveillance station app and about 3-4 cameras, which model would you recommend?
If you're only planning on running 3-4 and only need two bays, a DS224+ or DS723+ should do the job. Can always upgrade if you'd prefer, but totally your call.
@@WunderTechTutorials Thanks for the reply!
what about QNAP?
Synology has been lacking with apps. Synology Photo is no good the old app ds photo was better I have seen them going down. They are going diffrent route , routers, AI, Cameras. They have lost it.
Two words, TrueNAS
I would buy Ugreen.
Interested to know where you feel the UGreen is a better device from a software perspective? Or do you mean you'd install something like TrueNAS on it?
love my qnap NAS.
Very well presented and explained. Yes, the key criteria is stability and reliability. For the past couple weeks RUclips has been all-a-buzz over the new UGreen NAS. Their marketing department has been working overtime. Their software developers unfortunately haven't. All reviewers have said the software is garbage, non-functional. But the hardware is good. I wouldn't rely on the device for MY data. UGreen makes excellent quality cables and adapters (I have some), but that's it.
A few years ago I bought a Synology NAS to try out. The cheapest, lowest-end model two-bay they sold. I have run it continuously since and it has been flawless. I also use it for my VPN. My regret is having gone cheap since on this model the RAM is soldered and cannot be upgraded. Only 512M, so I am limited on the number of apps I can install. I have installed and tried out TrueNAS, XigmaNAS and OMV on bigger hardware, but this modest Synology remains a daily driver.
100% Agree! Rubbish quality and completely unreliable RAID array rebuilds that often never fully resync. I battled with Synology for years, upgrading and patching the clunky OS, reformatting drives and restoring data whenever the array stopped syncing, replacing drives that still worked on other systems... then finally I threw the thing in the bin and installed TrueNAS on a custom build PC. Problem solved and it works as it should.
I have technical issues with your recent videos on YT and only with your videos - your lips are behind the sound, they are out of sync. But only your lips. Popups on beginning of video are in sync! All this I've noticed a month ago. Last video that was in sync is your comparison of C2 and Backblaze backups. Each video after that has slight out of sync... Of course, I tested it on pcs, android tvs, mobiles. Not sure what happened here or did anyone reported same issue. I decided to react when I saw pop ups are in-sync, and lips are not. This can't be coincidece. Cheers, kutgw!
Thank you for letting me know! Is it worse on specific devices or is it just off on all of them?
@@WunderTechTutorials it's off by same amount across all devices I tried - Android phones and default YT app, Shield TV and SmartTube app, PC with Edge and Vivaldi browsers. At the same time, your older videos play just fine accross same devices. I hope I'm not the only one noticing this :\
@@WunderTechTutorials I tried forcing VP9 or AV1 stream but I don't see any difference
@@drkabajt This is great feedback and I genuinely appreciate it. I've felt like it's been off but then I look at it and question if it's just in my head. I looked up a few ways to confirm it and will hopefully have it fixed by the next video - really appreciate the comment!
@@drkabajtThanks again. I think I was able to resolve the issue (or at least it will be A LOT better). There was about a 150ms delay that I found and I adjusted it in the video coming out on Sunday, so I am hopeful it fixed it. Thank you again for letting me know!
Excellenti' - Agree 100%
'Objectively better hardware' is an Oxymoron. The hardware is only better if you can use it effectively and usability is what matters most.
Xpenology
45 drives running TrueNas isnt reliable? really?.......i dunno man
Prebuilt, off-the-shelf NAS devices. TrueNAS is great.
It costs a lot of money to develop and test good software. That’s part of the cost of Synology.
Great points so true! Synology hardware does annoy me but cannot beat there software. Thanks