How Does a Commercial Pilot Make This Mistake
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- Опубликовано: 23 сен 2024
- this is why words matter when talking with ATC
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if you run out of fuel, you become a glider. if you run out of snacks, Kelsey becomes hangry.
actually though
Mayday, mayday, mayday, we have minimum snacks…!!
@@Midnight.Rain.747. actually, though, this particular morning, I'm a half hour from leaving for the airport, and I have snacks with me, just in case. (actually in case my wife gets hangry, but it's always good to be prepared.)
@@kenbrown2808 that’s crazy, where are you going??
LOL. And as to which is worse, opinions vary.
When ATC's voice sounds even 10% stressed, you know something terrible is happening.
Every pilot should arrange a tour of a control tower sometime. The difference between ATC on radio, and when they unkey the mic can be a dramatic switch in less than a second flat. The amount of creative invective between bursts of professional direction is amazing to see.
@RipleySawzen Especially ATC at ORD. They've seen/heard just about everything.
@@zmortis111 you'd think so. and hope so. but this particular donut was on break when "LOW FUEL" was annouced.. over and over and over. I'm pleased that the rest of the professionals in ATC have some idea of priority. that muppets braincell was not anywhere in tune with a developing critical event. Incompetent. Not willingly, simply not "able" to do the job.
Do you have a source for this claim? I cannot concieve how a single controller going on break would have any effect on ORD tower operations. That is not how ATC breaks work.
Even if ATC did bungle the hand off, at the end of the day it is ultimately on the pilot for not knowing their aircraft and holding rather than declaring an emergency before they ran out of gas. If you don't declare an emergency in a situation like this responsibility ends in the cockpit. Point, blank, period. As far as I can tell they failed to navigate and communicate while they had adequate time to do so.
I do appreciate your use of donut and muppet though lol.
@@Palmit_When it comes to messages, it's the sender's responsibility to communicate his message clearly, not the receiver to interpret it or read his/her mind.
Anybody else see the value and advantage of honesty and integrity of character here? Kelsey does. Love ya Brother!
No, I'm voting for Trump. 😮
no, you’re THE only one 🤪
My thoughts exactly! Should have called Mayday Fuel at the appropriate time so the controller could have gotten him in faster. Atleast he lived to learn the lesson.
See that's what I'm saying. The guy let his ego get in the way.
@@gregentclemory9285 Congrats on never letting an opportunity to spout leftist propaganda go by. If Kamala wins, I hope you will get everything your vote will entitle you to. You might want to take the next couple of months to learn how to survive without functioning infrastructure.
Filling out paperwork after an inflight emergency is actually extremely enjoyable for the simple reason that you are still capable of filling out paperwork.
“I’m in so much trouble - this is great! 😅” - Alive guy/gal
that is a great way of looking at it
Kelsey's reactions ~
Running out of fuel: "Meh, I got this..."
Running out snacks: "WE'RE ALL GONNAH STARVE TO DEATH!!!" 🤣🤣🤣
"Miss, are you absolutely telling us the truth?" "Well, no sir. We've also run out of coffee."
@@sct913
loss of snacks is not as serious as no coffee!
😂😂😂😂😂
Why not declare emergency?
Paperwork and questions are always better than a crash. That's pretty much good advice for many things in life.
It's so astonishing that so many people can't seem to figure this out. Even at my job where 99% of the time no one is even going to get mildly scolded, there are people who don't want to run it up the chain "I think we may have a situation here", they wait until it is for sure an catastrophe.
Plus, if you don't like paperwork. I can confidently say as accident investigator (although in rail, not air) that if you actually have an accident or even any kind of serious incidents. That generates a hell of a lot more paperwork.
I'd hope airline fuel policies are set up in a way that allows the pilots to avoid a running out of fuel situation, but it isn't hard to imagine how pressure to cut costs could push the margin too low, and then a running out of fuel situation occurs. Fuel costs are a huge part of the costs of running an airline, and more back up fuel makes the plane heavier which means you need even more fuel. You can get by pushing the margin for quite a while, but eventually something like this could happen.
Hi, On a completely different note: I love the hat in your picture. Yours, Ann
i remember a video of Cpt. Al Haynes giving a talk about United 232 at NASA Dryden, (it's on yt). He did EXACTLY the same. He took a moment to address general aviation pilots directly, and told them to not be scared of declaring an emergency.
Even if (his word) they would hear about it, if it turned out unnecessary, from other pilots and have a lot of paperwork. But that's better than dying from being too poiite and not wanting to be an annoyance.
Or being criticized by management, who are not flying the plane!
Dryden at Edwards AFB, near Lancaster, California (where I grew up in the 1960's) has miles and MILES of hard-pack dry lake surrounding the runway. A great place to test aircraft!
I used to know a pilot with one of the major airlines. He told me a story where their destination airport was closed due to a major winter storm. Their alternate airport was also closed as where most airports in the are. This was in the New England area. They finally had to fly back about 300 miles to an open airport. Unfortunately, they hit major headwinds. They told approach control they were minimum fuel. The controller advised the pilots to stand by for vectors. He proceeded to give them vectors for a holding pattern because so many flights were being diverted to this airport. Being the strong-willed pilot he was, he said no, they needed a direct approach and restated they were minimum fuel. The controller asked if they were declaring a fuel emergency. They responded yes. When they landed, of course they were delayed getting to a gate by about 45 minutes. One of the engines quit because of fuel exhaustion. If they would have allowed the controller to make their decision, they probably would have crashed. The PIC is flying the plane, not the controllers.
There is a four letter word that could be used instead of "strong willed"😊
I was directed to take the first exit but was too fast and ATC had to send a commuter on another lap while letting me know he was not happy. I told him he was responsible for letting them get too close and he controls a chair, not an aircraft. After tying down I went to the coffee shop and heard tower freq radio inside while I got smiles and thumbs up. BTW it was one of my cross country flights for my private cert. Beech Skipper at that.
Don’t be a quitter. Keep fighting. Great message from our captain on this sunday morning!
“If you’re faced with a forced landing, fly the thing as far into the crash as possible.”
- Bob Hoover
Be a man! Land it on the interstate!
ok - but first, that last cup of joe!
@@prestonburton8504 And quick, where are the snacks?!?!
But always be aware of your skills. Maybe you can do more elsewhere.
I’ll say it again: 4-stripe Kelsey is far more assertive than 3-stripe Kelsey. I like it.
And his shirts are professionally cleaned and no longer laundered!
I agree.. Those Epaulettes with 4 bars certainly boosted confidence.. Good dude..
I'm feeling dominated by the 4th stripe
@@suse9784 Just look away because the 4th stripe can't be stopped
He is bolder!
Reminds me of Avianca Flight 052 from 1990.
After that crash, it was clarified which phrases should be used, so that everyone understands the seriousness of the event. This time it doesn't sound like it was a language barrier that was the cause. As a pilot he should know the difference between "minimum fuel" and "mayday mayday mayday fuel".
If it was paperwork he wanted to avoid by not declaring emergency. I'm pretty sure there was a lot more paperwork after this.
I'm glad to hear he survived.
"Paperwork is going to be kill me."
"I would be more worried about crashing doing it."
same with swiss air and valuejet. Both regarded the first sign of smoke as mostly inconsequential and failed to communicate effectively with tower - once they realized they were in deep caca.
Air Canada, Gimli Glider happened about the same time Canada Was changeing from Imperial to Metric measurement.
Was that where they said priority rather than emergency?
@@MsJubjubbird Yes. In Spanish, use of the phrase "la prioridad" (priority) is interpreted as "immediate urgency". Of course, that was only one of several issues, including some unfortunate coincidences, that contributed to the tragedy.
Perceived risk versus actual risk is a fascinating subject.
Second worst thing after having a fire on board, having no snacks. I love it! 😂
Captain giving the rundown and the best advice of never giving up and keep fighting - making my Sunday the best as always. You know that pilot made it because of back up snacks. Thanks Kelsey.
"You don't have time for extra time" I'm putting that on a T-shirt 🙂
Kelsey's always a pleasure to watch, but this was exceptionally good, especially his advice at the end about not throwing your hands up when everything's going wrong. Also, the errant pilot may deserve some praise for choosing the field over a highway for an additional reason: perhaps he realized that landing on a Chicago highway risked other lives as well as his own. I'm sure the highway looked more tempting and it was apparently his original choice. Thank Heaven he did the right thing for all concerned. Great video!
Man I bet that controller had words for that guy when he jumped right from min fuel to out of fuel in just a few minutes. But just dealt with the vastly different situation the pilot handed him.
Wise words at the end not just for pilots but anyone facing seemingly lost causes in life
There's a line from a TV show that I love that exemplifies what Kelsey said at the end - "We'll do everything we can...until we can't".
Of course, there's the other saying - "Fly the plane all the way to the scene of the crash".
Not just that, but "Fly it as far into the crash as you can."
Crashes are a relative thing.. If you walk away unscathed,, it was not a greaser, but still a good landing. ;)
As been a surgeon myself, sometimes you can be stuck in a "tunnel" when you are in trouble in operating room, keep saying to yourself I will handle it and I never give up. Controlling my high level of stress. It's my background and experience saved me in these situations. In surgery, now we are procedure of safety like as Check-list. In my surgery, always check by myself no blind trusting. Very fan of your job.😊
I'm from a family of Drs, God bless you. I was the black sheep choosing instead to work on machines. I could never imagine that level of patience, experience having dealing with unexpected issues revealed on first cut while having to face relatives afterwards. WOW!
@@RightToFreedomGirl He must work for the US Veterans Administration. 😂
@@RightToFreedomGirl Let's hope he doesn't practise in an English speaking country.
@@prestonburton8504 I am so proud you followed your own mind and dodnt bow to fam pressure. Drs. hv a high sue-cide rate btw & r heavily in debt. They attract gold diggers also, not meaningful, authentic companionship.
y'all r dumb af... we all have the same body. however, synaptic bonds are distinct features.
I'm a yacht Captain and I am right there with you. Fire is the danger! Run out of fuel OK, glide best you can to safety. I run out of fuel kill time fishing because we are floating fine, call a tow and drift.
Running out of fuel is so rare it's laughable. My only time was a mechanical issue. We had fuel, were at roughly half on each tank. We had topped off in Mexico and got dirty diesel. Both fuel filters completely clogged. Besides MY checklist, I now walk with any crew member that has a checklist. ZERO SPARE FILTERS and we needed at least two
Good morning, Kelsey! Thanks for helping me be able to talk to my cousin who's a FO on Emirates flying the 777🎉 He is probably wondering how I know about crabbing when I asked him if he did that while he was landing the other day in strong winds😅😅😅. I will never disclose my secret😊
😂😂😂
You’re treading on dangerous ground, he’s gonna stop spelling out the infinite acronyms and you’ll be even more lost 😂
A month into instrument and it’s so much fun flying simulated IMC tracking VOR’s into a LOC (LP) or ILS (LPV). But if I’m going precision-like for an LNAV I’ll need to ensure WAAS is enabled. Since I don’t have a Baro Nav that would give me VNAV, I’ll have to use a MDA / VDP / MAP instead of a DA. I’m still a little foggy on the SOP’s and what to do when joining a AF or IAF or crossing the FAF. I have a back to back sim / flight in a five hours so I hope the VOR app via IAF/PT/DME goes well. Probably won’t do the flight though, as there’s a conv sigmet coming in.
@@_purge9488 Eh!
LOL @ youtube being a "secret"
@@_purge9488 I've always said that with all the industries there are and all the acronyms for a whole bunch of things, sometimes there can be confusion:
Years ago, my brother (he was a NYC Transit Cop - before the merger) was telling a story at the dinner table. He said 'EDP' and for me, as a computer programmer/system admin person, I was confused since it meant Electronic Data Processing to me. So a few minutes go by and I still have no idea what he meant. The other cop brother knew and my parents and the 3rd brother didn't care. So I finally interrupted him and asked, "What does EDP mean to a NYC Transit Cop?" - "Emotionally Disturbed Person" came the response.
Sure we all would have said a regular term but no, he used the official term. Now his story made sense.
Fight to the last breath, never give in
there are two magic words every pilot can use with ATC - "unable", and "emergency" (or"mayday"). that usually gets their attention, because they are used to pilots following their instructions like sheep. and if you are in a pickle, priority attention is exactly what you need. nice of you to add a positive comment at the end about the forced landing.
"Hey boss, Ya, about your million dollar airplane......." Never want to be in that position.
Your comment reminds me of some of the comments from the 11ft8inch bridge videos. Having to go back and tell them that a train trestle just jumped on top of the truck and tore it off the frame.
Extremely good words of wisdom at the end - "if you get yourself in a bad situation wherever you're at in life, don't be a quitter, keep fighting." Life is always hard for everybody, quitting is the only failure.
Instructions unclear and i'm now barricaded inside a bank vault with SWAT team about to breach in...Do i still keep on fighting? Kinda running out of bullets and hostages at this point...
Ah now i see.. context matters...
@@Hellsong89 I would say in your scenario you chose to be a quitter by robbing a bank instead of making money the honest way and are now experiencing the consequences of bad decision making.
"When you're going through hell, keep going." - Ducky to Palmer on NCIS.
I've declared an emergency twice. Once there was no paperwork, and the other the FSDO called and just asked for a written statement of what happened (smoke in the cockpit). Granted if the emergency is the result of poor planning there could be more to it, but still, it is better to declare the emergency than to keep the true situation a secret and hope things work out. Filing an ASRS form will also mitigate some of the consequences, again as long as no one is hurt, the airplane wasn't significantly damaged, and there is nothing to make the FAA think you are incompetent and require a 709 ride.
My daughter has started the second half of her commercial training and the emergency/incident regulations are her least favorite part. 😂 Memorizing all that stuff is the part of flying we passengers never think about.
Exactly! My last emergency was a hydraulic failure on the landing gear. I chose an airport with appropriate emergency services and passed a few that had services but returned to an airport I was familiar with. Once I landed they asked to see "ARROW" paperwork. 3 weeks later the FSDO called and asked what happened. I explained the nature and process in a 5 minute phone call. He simply asked that when the mechanic found the problem if I wouldn't mind sending him a copy of the log book entry. It's definately not much paperwork and only a few minutes. Wouldn't hesitate to declare again. Definately think people don't know or haven't had to deal with the FAA o nthis but it's much easier than most believe. Never had to do any paperwork for any of the situations and this was extremly simple.
@@jahbern Please encourage her to study and practice emergency procedures. There will be a time when she will need them under stress.
@@JackDouglas-l7r she does. Every flight. She has had excellent training, fortunately. Her current instructor has her check gear, mags, etc three times instead of just a standard crosscheck. Last year a student belly landed a plane at her university, so the instructors are paranoid. My daughter enjoys emergency procedures - I think she has been incredibly fortunate to have thorough, conscientious instructors who don’t scare her but make sure she is completely aware of what can happen. She takes it seriously, thankfully.
Mayday fuel situations can become common in england... as pilots "chase the fog", orbiting 1 airport thats closed due to fog.. then told to go to an alternate, arriving there only to find i socked in with fog.. then told to go to another alternate that has "opened" only for it to close. This is one of the banes of UK.
To a lesser extent same thing can happen in the USA... where 1 airport gets closed for weather, you divert to your alternate, which also gets closed... This usually involves unusual weather events through that "change" quickly... storms changing course and instead of going west swing north and curve back east causing strings of shut downs.
Do we? In the 25 years or so I flew I’ve heard one Mayday in Britain due to low fuel (a colleague). I’m sure there have been more. I have in Brussels (due snow) and Spain (due widespread thunderstorms). We also do not close airports in Britain due to fog. Snow - yes, closing time - yes but not fog. We also choose to fly to an alternate, we are not told. That’s now how things work.
@@Trevor_Austin Loganair has a history of delays and canceled flights in and out of Ronaldsway.
Concern #2 is very VALID! Hey the Captain needs fuel too! 😂
Kelsey you said the wisest words any one can say, "Don't give up, don't quit. I have survived 2 horrifying bouts of breast cancer in the last 4 years and I don't give up and I never quit. My brother in law is suffering terribly from chemo and I tell him my son's US Army Infantry motto, " Follow me-he followed me and we are soon to be in remission. Ex FA and retired registered nurse here. Your words have reached many many people today. Keep the blue side up !
Keep moving forward Nancy Harris. We may or may not be related (my maternal grandparents were Harris from IL) but I’m happy you and your brother are kicking the crap out of cancer (Grandma Harris died eventually of her second round in the late 70s). You will both be well. And Warrior Angels are over watch of your son’s infantry group. Breathe.
Lost my daughter to that horrible disease even though she put up a 100% effort to fight it. My prayer for you two is to beat it. Sending big hugs from South Africa.
My father had bladder cancer. He went through an experimental surgery where they used a section of large intestine and made a bladder out of it. For several years he enjoyed life, continued golfing. Then one day he didn't feel well and went to the doctor. He was told he had cancer on his lung and liver. His mindset at that time, I don't want to fight. He was gone within 6 months. What a difference between the two outcomes. I believe his mindset played a part in both of them. First time, he was a fighter, he had things he looked forward to doing. Second time, he threw in the towel and his body said OK and gave up as well. Never give up. Never surrender!!
Great Job Nancy! This month (Sept 2024) is my 18th anniversary of getting diagnosed with kidney cancer. At that time my doctor told me I had 5 months to live - IF I was lucky. Well, Thank God I'm not very lucky! It's not all been fun and games, but I've got two grandsons now, one who will graduate High School next spring!
I know that one day cancer will kill me. But NOT Today!
Fight. Fight. And fight some more! And always remember: "I have cancer, cancer does NOT have me!"
REMEMBER: SPEED IS LIFE ALTITUDE IS LIFE INSURANCE
REMEMBER: IF YOU USE ALL CAPS ON THE INTERNET IT MAKES YOU LOOK LIKE AN IGNORAMUS WHO IS ALWAYS SHOUTING
You gotta be faster than that son speed is life
Great explanation Kelsey. Aviate, navigate, communicate. That pilot didn’t communicate
Kudos to this pilot for not parachuting out with fire extinguishers strapped to his ankles.
Is Bonehead still in jail???
If it works, is it a dumb idea? 😅
🤣🤣 Great comment. that dude got what he wanted, someone to pay attention to him!
Released June 12 this year (2024)
😄😄😄😝
I had one other thought that Kelsey didn't mention: this was a solo pilot flying a King Air. Now, the King Air is certified for one pilot and there is absolutely nothing illegal or wrong with a single pilot flying a King Air....but.... The King Air is a LOT of airplane. It's big, fast and complex. Sure, one pilot can manage it, but, when you get into an emergency situation, it can really help to have another pilot on board, whether to handle coms and watch for traffic , or even just to question your choices and bounce ideas off of. Put yourself in this pilot's shoes: He's in the middle of an approach - that means he's busy configuring the landing gear, flaps, airspeeds, and trying to follow the approach plates. Plus he's talking with ATC and having to make readbacks and look for traffic while getting vectors for an approach that he did not brief. Sure, he's VMC and can see the runway, but was he prepared to land on that runway? Does it have a PAPI or VASI or displaced threshold? Does he have the taxi diagram pulled up and ready for after he lands? NOW throw a fuel emergency on top of all that... It sure would have helped to have someone else next to him to help with the workload. And I know that corporate/charter companies operate on thin margins, but there are so many new commercial pilots out there desperate for flight hours, that a lot of them would probably ride along for next to nothing.
Of course it would be an immense help to have a second pilot but the guy is flying into O'HARE! If he's not capable of handling two extra helpings of stress, he shouldn't have been there in the first place.
The King Air is a doll. It is much easier to fly than most twin trainers. It is many things but a difficult or complex aircraft it is not.
Great video. Knew an extremely proficient and well admired by his colleagues a firefighting helicopter pilot who had a technique of swinging the Bambi bucket in an arc like a ball on the end of a string which caused the water to spray rather than dump straight down. It was necessary to fly low in order to apply this technique at times when circumstances made it most effective. One fateful day he was low on fuel (not critical low) but thought he had enough for one more pass. He made his usual approach and tilted his bird to about 30 degrees to make the swing but in doing so the helo sucked air when what little fuel remained moved all to one side of the tank and exposed the outlet port. The engine failed and he was too low to perform an auto. The bird struck the ground hard and he perished.😢
firefighting is dangerous EVERYWHERE!!
It's sad that they don't have better designed tanks and extraction.
@@Google_Does_Evil_Now you'd think they'd figure that out by now...after all these years... Im no engineer but maybe place 3 or 4 fuel intake ports in the tank or wing would help?
@@HollywoodConnection-jast for sure something simple and reliable like that.
Oh yeah. Sunday is complete, 74 Gear drops a new video.
That’s what I was thinking! 🎉
I am in my shop for a reason?.... Oh thats right 74Gear
I knew a guy who ran out of gas in a Cessna 182. He had been putting out static line students and the only passenger at that point was the jumpmaster. Say what you will about his fuel management; his airmanship was excellent because the plane never did reach the ground. It got hung up in the trees, in fact he and the jumpmaster had to tie all the static lines together to repel down to the ground. The lesson I took was that even if you do become a glider and there's nothing but trees below you never stop fighting.
God did say: Never Stop Fighting!
Why didn't the jumpmaster jump? Skydivers train for low altitude jumps when the plane has an emergency. For that matter, why didn't the pilot jump? Jump plane pilots wear parachutes for emergencies. If you can see there is nowhere to land, get out of there. They were very lucky to survive landing in trees.
@@thomasdalton1508 I don't know. The pilot was an hour builder. So he had minimal experience jumping or perhaps none at all and he only had a round emergency parachute. The jumpmaster was not an AFF instructor at the time but; he was a very experienced jumper and was wearing his personal rig.
My personal position as a skydiver with a couple hundred jumps and plenty of time flying Skhawks and 152s is that I'd only abandon a plane on fire and even then only if I could be certain it wouldn't stray into a bunch of people. Being pilot in command carries a burden.
I never got within a mile of the experience level of the jumpmaster; but I know the plane was no more than 3000 AGL and perhaps much less when the engine gave way. A sport parachute will likely work from 600 AGL; but no guarantees. Minor deployment problems like end cell closure or line twists get very serious down that low. That is the altitude paratroopers use when in combat though and their parachutes open kinda slow. I'd speculate he looked straight down and didn't like what he saw.
No excuses, got himself in a situation , complete idiot
@thomasdalton1508 Jump pilots don't always wear emergency parachutes. I've never understood why more pilots don't wear them honestly but to each their own. I couldn't tell you why the jumpmaster wouldn't go unless it happened after everyone else was out and he'd planned on landing with the plane then everything went to hell low and there were no visible outs. 🤷♂️
I have to thank you! I hadn't flown in over 30 years and was very nervous. I. Extremely claustrophobic and almost called off the flight from mco to SeaTac to go on a 7 day cruise to alaska. You really made me so comfortable and gave me so much faith in the crew especially the stewards ❤ I just got home it was a trip of a lifetime and I owe it all to you!!!!❤❤❤🎉🎉🎉🎉❤❤❤❤
Congratulations 🎉!!! I'm so glad whenever I hear of someone overcoming a terrible flying phobia (a common phobia too) and achieve their objectives, in your case a lifetime adventure opportunity!
I have been fighting my flying phobia for decades, since a decompression at cruising altitude when I was a child (very scary for anyone, and suddenly the quick dive to below 14,000 feet or so by necessity, and pilots did the right thing by handling the situation and therefore couldn't tell us what was going on until after). But I fly and fly again, and sometimes I have genuinely good flights, others not so much.
So I'm always proud of folks, whether I know them or not, who fight and win against the fear of flying monster to live their lives as THEY choose to. Great work!
I’m so glad you got to go ❤ MCO is my home gateway. And my daughter is a pilot - the funny thing is, her learning to fly made me even more comfortable about flying, because I know more than ever now how safe it is!
Kelsey is good at explaining turbulence is something to not worry about. The airframe can take it, and when he is flying cargo they don't slow down in turbulence. But do keep seatbelts fasten and pay attention to cabin crew.
I have to commend Kelsey and whoever puts these videos together for the lack of "cuts" in the video. Perhaps it because he can talk for 10 minutes without taking a breath or perhaps its skillful editing, but I find the lack if distracting cuts makes these videos easy to watch. His videos are probably smoother than some of his early landings (by his own admission).
RUclips, I am declaring minimum snack level!
which means we are only minutes away from Mayday Mayday Maydad Snack Level!
The wife and I took a flight from LaGuardia to Phoenix around 5 years ago. Somewhere over Oklahoma the pilot comes on the horn saying they were low on fuel and were landing in Albuquerque to fuel up ( forgot to make a left toin at Albuquerque). At Albuquerque I made an announcement that everyone should dig into their pockets for a few bucks each to help with the gas money. That got a big laugh
Love Bugs Bunny!
Haha, I’d love to see everybody lining up as they exit the plane, handing dollar bills to the pilot and saying, “thanks for the flight, this is for the gas”. 😂
If a pilot is reluctant to take action because he will have to fill out paperwork, that seems like a fundamental failure of the system.
Bureaucracy is the bane of all organizations.
@@grondhero I agree but from a safety standpoint you DO need to document and investigate any incidents so I don't know what the solution is. Other than make it as easy for the pilots as possible.
The "no fault go around" being an example.
It isn't though. Most of the time there are no issues. Sometimes not even paperwork and it's just a phone call.
Ive never allowed myself to be in a "Min Fuel" situation. Once, many years ago, we were operating an MD80 Part 121 scheduled KIAH-KSEA.
DEPARTING Houston, we had several delay vectors around T-storms. Once finally heading northwest, we were looking at fuel over destination. My F/O was overly concerned.
Short story? Weather in Seattle was fine, we landed with proper teserves...because I had bumped up our Dispatch fuel by a few thousand pounds.
I got min vs mayday fuel question wrong on the PAR this week. Thanks for explaining.
A friend of ours rented a plane once to fly from the San Francisco north bay area to Modoc County. It was a quick day trip up and back, and there should have been enough fuel for the trip, but on the return we started getting low fuel indications. The pilot declared minimum fuel and we were cleared to land at an airport south of Sacramento. Upon landing the fuel indicators suddenly indicated sufficient fuel, but we had lost faith in the fuel guages and out of an abundance of caution topped off the gas for the short remaining flight back to the north bay. It was all rather nerve racking until we got on the ground.
Does the so-called Black box record that kind of thing? Or does it record it on your kind of aircraft?
A much better failure than the opposite, see Tuninter Flight 1153 for what happens when a fuel gauge indicates sufficient fuel when there isn't. (Cause was installing a fuel gauge with the wrong calibration.)
Did you ever find out how much fuel you actually had when you declared min fuel?
Correct decisions either way of course, regardless of how much fuel was actually in the tanks - you can only work with the information you've got, and you don't want to screw around with insufficient fuel.
@@aeray3581small planes don't have black boxes.
@@patheddles4004
This was about 45 years ago, and please excuse the incorrect terminology -- I'm not a pilot. We had roughly 1/3 to half a tank left as I recall. It was more than enough to make the final leg of the journey, but we added fuel anyway out of an abundance of caution. A cursory inspection did not indicate any obvious fuel leaks or other problems. Please note this was a small Cessna aircraft.
I think the pilot should have called a mayday. This could have been the first time he is in this situation.
Jepp, and rejcting the instruction to to line up behind the Embraer, insisting on landing immediately.
@@petraireneThat, and rejecting to amend the altitude from 3,000 ft to 2,500 ft while he was out of gliding distance.
That's what this day was missing ... a bit of life advice from Captain Kelsey ❤
Kelsey, your insight is valuable way beyond aviation!
“Don’t be a quitter.” Absolutely, GD right.
What the hell was this pilot thinking. Declare Mayday fuel. Don't wait until you're out. This is very poor planning
Great video kesley , glad you’re still with us, every time I see your company’s aircraft I ask who brought it in lol! This guy definitely dropped the ball on this one, I would have called a pan pan at minimum immediately and made ATC aware, even when they were aware he didn’t come across worried. Oh well lesson learned, stay safe up there.
Number 2 is the hotel not having free breakfast
That's not a fear while piloting, though. 😉
Kelsey - Next time your at DFW I will give a 'BIG' snack bag!!! Thks for your expertise!!
11:00 - show the Gimli Glider! Show the Gimli Glider! Awe, come on Kelsey!
Ikr? It's just begging for the glider at this point.
Mentour Pilot has surely made a video on that one.
I love how Kelsey talks so frankly about all the things did wrong, but also the thing the pilot did RIGHT - fly it right down the whole way and your chances go up to survive
Lost a sump drain on a 152 one time over Hollywood, FL. Let me tell you how focused your attention becomes when you’re two miles from the airport at 800’ AGL and the prop stops turning. And your private pilot, commercial student looks at you like a deer in the headlights. I put it down and didn’t kill or even injure anybody, nor cause any damage on the ground. Totaled the airplane only because there was a pile of sand in the open lot I landed it in, and it caught the nose wheel and flipped us over, bending the firewall. The guy from the FAA congratulated me as he took my license.
Congratulations on your survival. If you'll excuse me for hijacking your post, this highlights just how critical torque settings are on the sump drains on Lycoming and Continental engines. They are a taper thread fitting. If you under torque them, you face the very real risk of them falling out. If you over torque them, you risk cracking the housing with potentially
catastrophic consequences. It is worth cleaning and inspecting the area around the quick drain to inspect for cracks. It's an uncommon problem, but I have first hand experience
with it, so it does happen.
Sounded to me like the guy was Mayday fuel not minimum fuel to start with.
You’re good at this, man. Research, production, presentation - top notch. Thank you…
Apparently one other thing this pilot did RIGHT is kept his airspeed up and hit the ground in a "relatively controlled" manner. The temptation is so strong to keep pulling back on the yoke trying to stretch a few hundred feet more. Then you stall, hit the ground sideways (or whatever) and probably end up way worse.
Exactly, all the training goes out the window, you are so desperate to keep the plane in the air.
I so love your videos. What I learn from you is astounding. The fact that you always talk about accountability is refreshing in this time. Thank you for what you do. Today's lesson, take accountability and never give up.
Nice ☮
Your videos are so Informative Kelsey! I’m a private pilot in FL. Been following you since you started. Keep it up!!!
I sooo love this channel! For myself in work, I've always found it better to own up to any mistakes really early - people will see how it came about, and never blame (usually).
I just hope Kelsey never has to declare Mayday Snacks.
Good morning Kelsey from SAT
LOVE your Show!
same 😻
I think the modern term for this problem is "toxic positivity". The fear of reporting a serious problem that needs to be addressed.
Aviate, navigate, communicate? Nah.
1. Fire
2. Snacks
3. Fuel
Priorities....
Kelsey could not pass medical exam if he were low on snacks.
I called a mayday fuel driving on a congested highway but nobody cleared the road for me. Oh well. Pilots get all the breaks.
Gotta grab wake turbulence from a big rig.
I watched a police video recently, where the officers tried to pull over a car going 120 mph. She was pitted after refusing to stop. Her excuse for speeding, she was low on fuel.
@@DrDeuteron Back in the late '70's my friend had a Vega wagon. We were on the Long Island Expressway. He says to me, "watch this". He pulled up behind a rig so close it sucked us in. He put the stick in neutral and coasted for a couple miles. FREAKED me out. Nothing but a bumper in front of us.
I think I saw that or one similar on Code Blue Cam.
My flight instructor told me that if you and your passengers and aircraft are on the ground safely, you will never get in trouble for declaring an emergency. He said "Pilot fatigue" and even "fear of bug on dashboard" are valid reasons.
Great video, once again Kelsey. Another example of situational awareness and maintaining clear comms.
Kelsey dug deep, real deep and managed to pull out that nugget of positivity to end the vid by saying that the pilot did not give up.
ran my rotax low on fuel on a flight to the Sutter Buttes one day, same scenario, exposed the inlet to air, killed the engine 200 feet above the ground, 1 st rule of flying, fly the aircraft, dont panic, greased a mountain top emergency landing.
Any landing you walk away from is a success.
He crash landed a few blocks away from a hospital too.
Talk about range anxiety
Kelsey: we’re declaring mayday snacks.
ATC: understood. Moving traffic. Land anywhere.
I always carry extra snacks with me when flying ever since I learned how critical snacks are to Kelsey. So, Kelsey before you call in "minimum snacks" or "mayday mayday mayday snacks" and if you happen to have passengers rather than all cargo, you might want to make a PA announcement and ask if Maggie is onboard ! 😃😃😃
😁🤣😂🤣❤
I work near Route 83 straight west of O'Hare, but I don't even remember hearing about this. The fact that there were no fatalities and only the plane was destroyed probably caused it to drop off the news quickly. Route 83 is a busy 6 lane divided surface street with a lot of stoplights and trucks, so Busse Woods was a better choice.
Run out of fuel. Routine. We. good.
Run out of snacks. Mayday. 😂
On my first flight with passengers as a new pilot the low fuel buzzer came on while on final at the destination airport. To make weight I only put in half tank of fuel (four guys with camping gear in a 172). Right before take off I checked the weather again and it showed a rain storm that we would have to avoid which wasn't a big deal, but I knew I would have to keep an eye on the fuel if the weather pushed us out very far. Obviously we were fine, but lessons learned. Don't short your fuel safety margins. I'm not sure I did, but in retrospect it sure seems likely. I know I way over exceeded the minimum clearances from the storm. If we waited 15-30 minutes the storm would have passed by, so that is clearly the choice I should have made. Also, I would error on the side of making to the airport over following vfr minimums.
Many years ago,I owned two VW rabbit convertibles, if you ran out of fuel, you toasted the fuel pump,which was cooled by fuel pass thru. Expensive mistake. Unfortunately I did the dastardly deed, (twice) lesson finally learned.
Someone needs to buy Kelsey a lifetime supply of snacks. Make his day 😂
IF it was an Attractive Young Intelligent Blonde with the LIFETIME SNACKS OFFER, he might consider a Proposal!?¡¿!?🤩😁😂🤣😂🤣💖
Orchard Field. Dedicated to the pilots who flew the military planes out of there during WWII. The airport itself is named after Edward "Butch" O'Hare, Jr., a WWII hero, who is buried overseas. Nice to see a video from you, once again. Ceci
It was named that way so not to mention O’hare sr a St Louis based cpa who brought down Al Capone. Considering that O’hare had nothing else to do with Chicago except for Scarface naming an airport after his son was payback for removing Capone.
It's called a surge box around the fuel pumps to keep a head of pressure on the pump.
74 Gear...The meaning of excellence...#1
No Fuel....... Remember the Gimli Glider .... Canada just changed from pounds to Kilograms and the Pilot miscalculated the Amount of Fuel needed to reach his destination and Landed on an un used Airport in Gimli Manitoba ........
It was the fuel loaders, the pilot wasn't at fault here.
@@owensparks5013pilot didn’t check the paperwork and catch it.
You don’t go from min to out in a circuit. Pilot didn’t declare emergency leading me to believe he wasn’t aware of exactly how much fuel he had.
Kelsey, you are such a naturally likeable guy. Thanks for your channel. I like watching your content. Please keep it up.
An empty fuel tank is more dangerous than a full one - when empty it becomes a massive fuel/air bomb :o
Only if the ratio is right - gasoline is pretty picky about its stoichiometry for proper detonation - but you're absolutely right that it's a real bad time if you do get unlucky.
"Don't be a quitter. Keep fighting." Thanks. Very useful to me.
I really do wish one of these days Kelsey would have the opportunity to talk to one of the pilots involved in such things, so we can learn and hear from them directly what they were thinking, and hear them respond to Kelsey's comments.
Like wouldn't this be a great interview for this channel?
Excellent advice. I wish more people would live my that. It saved me more times than I can count. Thank you for this and all your videos.
ORD is for Orchard Field... it was a military field back in the day as I recall
I remember that, but it still looks like ORDinance instead of ORcharD, hence remembering that it was a military field.
Douglas built lots of planes there during wwii. Now there’s no fields there and landing on 83 isn’t a good idea either.
Thanks Capt for another GREAT video. Amazing how some people don't take safety important enough!
The worst part of the story is, according to the flight history report, the originating airport is the same, ORD. Bad planning.
"Dog gonnit, Sweets, you told me that you'd get me to the primary!" "I'm sorry, Sir. That estimate was based on the original loss rate factor, not at two zero five."
Many moons ago when I was working at our local FBO I was inside doing some paperwork when I spotted this guy walking across midfield. He comes inside and asked if he could use the phone. I said sure then asked him where he came from. Cool as a cucumber he says I ran out of gas. Sure enough he dead sticked in, hit the chain link property fence and bounced about thirty yards and ended up dead on the centerline of the runway. Belly up I don't know if he forgot the gear or if the fence ripped it off but otherwise the plane was in pretty good shape. Just one of several planes that didn't make it in. We're exactly halfway between south Florida and New York. Stronger than forecast winds did a lot of then in.
Good message Kelsey 💪💪💪
#1 fly the plane all the way to the crash site #2 an old Republic pilot told me ORD was once orchard road airfield #3 all of us who enjoy and appreciate this channel hope you are never air born with your snacks on fire!
Those who stop fighting invariably stop breathing.
Pilot: I am minimum fuel and I can see the runway. Tower: Okay you are number two behind a plane TEN MILES OUT, follow them.
SO TRUE! Controller was told numerous times "LOW FUEL" - but it seems they it needed to be sent on a postcard, or any form of writing to get the message.
Maybe 'Sky Writing?' would have been at least noticeable to the rest of the world. Or perhaps a gender reveal style .. "nose down, accelerating and shouting low fuel several times, it's a fuel vacuum!".
If nose up Accelerating "it's a joke.. we dont have low fuel really haha, got you that time silly rabbit controller"