The whole discussion: *Supposed to be about Luffy vs Gojo and what type of difficulty it would take Luffy to beat Gojo* Dragonball fans: Y'know, Goku though...
The original question WAS about Goku. It was who’s be the weakest: Goku but he isn’t a Saiyan, Gojo with no infinity, Luffy with no devil fruit or Naruto with no Kurama. This is one of those times where Goku solos is actually valid.
@@23TheOneAndOnly23 yeah but the discussion at hand was about luffy against gojo. He was branching off of that question for a debate of its own, which goku should have had no part in.
@23TheOneAndOnly23 The *question* involved Goku, but it wasn't *only about* him. The *discussion* was about Luffy and Gojo, and how much of a problem Gojo would give Luffy before getting turned into a Kit Kat bar again.
This is facts, but what Tony failed to mention is how young Luffy was when he got his power so all his moves are based on gum-gum and without it he's washed. I personally feel that if Luffy had to fight without a Devil Fruit his Haki would be Garp level, that's just me tho 🤷🏾
yea but garp level luffy against sage mode naruto? its hard to say who would win w the competition of the instant nature sensing technique and future sight. imo IF luffy is garp level against sage mode W/ future sight it would be almost an eternal battle. it would come to who could last the longest in durability, which luffy loses without the devil fruit. making luffy garp level changes the argument completely. but thats just drunk thoughts.
Also I think people forget that the sea stones not only take away df abilities, but they also weaken the df user wearing them by a pretty big amount. While the cuffs were a weakened version of the ones in Impel down so the prisoners could still work, they were enough to stop them from breaking the cuffs which normally Luffy would be able to do easily
@@kingcapone5441 my brother in christ skypia was not filler and at then end of the fight enel melted a shit ton of gold to luffy's arm and made it a ball
@@kingcapone5441 Enel is the lighting dude from Skypiea and he melted a big gold ball onto Luffy's arm using the heat from his electricity. Luffy then used that same heavy ass golden ball to punch Enel into the big golden bell, pretty much ending the climax of the arc.
People always confuse what "Infinity" is, Gojo Technique is called the "Limitless" this gives him Red, Blue, Purple, and "Infinity"(also his domain :Unlimited Void). Limitless and Infinity are not the samething, without Limitless you have no Infinity and you can't have Infinity without Limitless.
So the way the question is posed right now, unless I misread what you mean, Gojo STILL has Limitless, just not his Domain Expansion or the thing that makes nobody touch him? I'm confused, because the Limitness technique's whole thing is bringing Infinity. Therefore, are the two actually dissociable? Or maybe I misread and you are actually crucially pairing the two therefore if he loses one he loses both? I'm not into manga but I like seeing people debate and rationalise different power scales.
@@Vulture_King i mean sure as long as tony is the bus driver gojo with no infinity is getting fucking manhandled by luffy haki alone lol wtf are jjk fans on oh and enjoy the inevitable shit ending in 5 count em 5 chapters left lmao
A lot of Naruto's issues in training and powering up came from Kurama holding him back and conflicting with his natural chakra control. So without Kurama, his ceiling is lowered but he makes up for it by becoming A LOT better at everything he remains with. So his gets better at sage mode and sage justu, better at chakra control in general, becomes more efficient in his chakra use so he can go longer.
Not only that but due to his universal understanding with chakra he can master jutsu with the same efficiency as a sharigan user Show when he made created 8 different rasenshuriken off the top of his head vs Kaguya
it kept him alive and boosted him more than his own chakra would sage mode is good but is nowhere near close to tailed beast chakra it held him back from advancing normally not in totality it still gave him a tremendous boost especially in Naruto where non of his training actually started until Shippuden and without that nine tails he wouldn't have made it too Shippuden. nine tails chakra is the 2nd or 3rd strongest in the entire show,
@@balenciagason7175 bro no uzumaki have the biggest chakra reserve the reason is he was actually weaker with the nine tails if he didn’t have kurama he would be like minito if not stronger and faster after he learned it and became friends made him stronger but his chakra reserves where so big it was able to keep the nine tailed at bay
@@backwurds9195this bro people are forgetting that Naruto’s chakra pool is literally nerfed due to the sheer fact that he has Kurama…like kakashi said to a base Naruto in rasenshuriken training that Naruto has 4 times as much chakra as him and if it’s wasn’t for the nine tails which Naruto’s chakra basically kept in check it would be a 100 times more than his
Keep in mind zoro throwing a building at mr 1 was a great show of strength. And luffy was stronger than zoro at that time. And they are WAY stronger now than they are
@@simon-peterwilliamson2412it has too because otherwise it makes no sense for luffy to be strong. Tbh it’s never really made sense we just go along with it, he never even trains.
@@traysold7541 he does. The say it all the time. Training just isnt his focus like Zoro's. Did you not see the 2 year time skip. His fruit was also seen as useless by ace and sabo. And anyone really in his youth. He had to train to make it viable
One Piece characters have crackhead strength. Gojo is no slouch though. He was ripping arms and heads off with pure cursed energy reinforcement. He’s no weakling. I can definitely see it as a tough fight.
I just think the scaling is completely different. JJK is wild but still generally realistic-ish, or at least on a consistent scale. One piece characters do absolutely zany things all the time (ie pre-time-skip Luffy running up a giant beanstalk with a 1.5 million kg giant golden ball stuck to him.) Gojo's way stronger than normal human, but nowhere near One Piece's craziness.
Eh it’s like mid diff for Luffy without his df. Don’t get me wrong gojo is strong but he’s no where near Luffy. Luffy has future sight if gojo tries to pop a domain then Luffy can dodge it, also gojo doesn’t have infinity in this match up so he loses quicker
If you give luffy his haki but not his df and gojo limitless but not infinity (somehow) its still a no-diff for luffy. Luffy wouldve destroyed onigashima in one blow with barjan gun and i know what you'll say well he used his fruit for this and yes you're right but my point is he wouldve one tapped a big ass island if his fist was big enough, now make it smaller its still one tapping a whole city cause onigashima is HUGE. Also, luffy has future sight and crazy conquerers, even if gojo had infinity, conq coating is getting throught that, without it, one singular shot from luffy is cooking gojo and its not even close the amount of damage and power difference in the one piece world and jjk world is immense
@@traysold7541without his devil fruit he split the sky with kaido. Only yonko level fighters can do that. He’s literally yonko level even without his devil fruit
You’re underrating Luffy like crazy if you think he loses to Katakuri with no gum gum. He has Ryou, learned to use conquerors coating in his attacks, his observation is better than katakuri’s now (he was on a similair level to Kaido’s who is significantly stronger observation than Katakuri. His fruit is the reason he beat Kaido for sure but saying he loses to Katakuri is insane after how much haki growth he’s had
@@backwurds9195 obviously. I’m talking about current luffy if he suddenly lost his df fruit. Tony’s argument was that Luffy would lose against Katakuri without df right now which makes no sense
@@moroniw6415 tbh i agree that current luffy with no df wins against katakuri however the difficulty depends on if luffy is given time to adjust to fight without his df. As tony said 90% of his kit is his df moves, if he isn't given time to adjust it will be a high-diff win for luffy but if he gets time then luffy would win pretty easily.
luffy was definitely banging with katakuri, they were both ignoring eachothers fruit related durability with haki, he was eating hits over and over without being able to tank them through reduced damage, hes got insane endurance
I feel like a lot of people downplay Luffys base strength cuz we're so used to seein him use his df abilities in everything he does. Gotta remember it was base luffy not usin his df that speed blitzed the pacifista beams and oneshot um. Wano also made it kinda clear how strong he is without his df when he was locked up doin that crazy yard work with Kidd. Imo adding his Haki to the equation makes the fight lowkey unfair for Gojo, cuz JJK doesn't get nearly as wild as even some of the more downplayed feats in OP.
Just to clear things up infinity is just the neutral application of limitless so if you take away gojos ability to only use infinity he can still amplify (blue) or reverse it(red) or mixing the 2 (purple) and he can still cast a domain i think the question was meant to take away limitless entirely then that's a different story he'd basically just be yuji with the six eyes
@@johnathonthompson2950 it’s not 100% cap you see it in his flashbacks before garp even drops him off to Dadan, Garp was already throwing him into the jungle
@@johnathonthompson2950 Luffy ate the DF and then made his mind up on being king of the pirates which then cause Garp to blame Shanks and drop him to Dadan. So before you call cap maybe know what your talking about
@@johnathonthompson2950look at the scene after enies lobby when garp is revealed. he doesnt have his hat yet which means he didnt have a fruit while garp was training him.
most of the verse wasn't hanging with Enel, Oda himself said bro would have a 500M bounty off rip. Off straight DF power, bro was gonna have one of the highest pre ts bounties without accomplishing anything.
Yeah I get what Tony’s saying, Luffy losing Haki or Devil Fruit powers REALLY hurts his abilities but just cuz he ain’t as HIM as Roger or Garp does not mean he ain’t strong as helllll base or any of his Haki abilities aren’t good 🤔
Luffys Haki plus his df had him dodging. It’s like yall are forgetting he didn’t throw some random punch at Kaido. It was a red roc. How’s he doing that without his df?
@@WriteWhatISee He was fighting in base for like a quarter of the fight, so yeah the stretching helps, but that doesn't make his conquerors any stronger
@@Stumpsville Yes it does. He’s literally using his df abilities to add more force and speed to his hits. The entire reason he can fire off attacks in such rapid succession is because he can stretch. He’s obviously infusing his Haki as well. But his df is the base for why he hits as hard as he does.
@@behindyou2485tf u mean “source?” its common sense.. 😭 the jjk verse powers are only capable of destroying multiple buildings to small city level. (only a few of them can even destroy a small city) less than a handful. whereas in OP there’s multiple characters that are capable of destroying COUNTRIES 😭
@@Fear999.just because the anime doesn’t portray world ending planet destroying feats doesn’t mean it can’t I imagine gojo sending a hollow purple too the center of the earth would destroy it
15:25 limitless and infinity are not one in the same. Limitless is the whole cursed technique, red, blue, purple, and infinity are all part of the LIMITLESS TECHNIQUE. Infinity is just the neutral application of it, while blue is the negative application and red is the positive application. If the question was gojo without limitless, then his domain is included and luffy loses but if it was infinity gojo is just gonna erase luffy.
Jjk tops out at a dozen times faster than lightning and city level. Legit luffy start of post time skip is already a country level threat and many times faster than light. And characters like kaido are dozens of times stronger than that
I'm sorry but high diff???? luffy is still dodging light speed without his devil fruit 😅 bro his weakened gramp just caused a nuke with just haki I'm sure luffy can do that same amount of damage without a devil fruit he still got Top haki in the verse they be splitting islands a good example is zoro bro splitting mountains with no powers but haki and oda said luffy has better haki than him
I think it's closer than we all think it would be. If Luffy lost devil fruit, it means NO gears, his bounty would drop by half instantly. Gojo 6 eyes and luffys foresight might clash. Then it's armament vs gojos recovery and Domain Expansion. I don't think his Haki is there, YET, to hang solely based on that skill. I think Gojo might win off technique and having extra "weapons" on hand
Gojo is literally fodder to current luffy stop overhyping jjk 🗿 The six eyes is nowhere near close to the perception of having future sight Gojo isn't surviving any atks infused with ryou which atk from tye inside out and if luffy uses ryou and punches gojo in the face he's going to die just off the strength and durability gap Even without a df it's still luffy no diffing with just his haki
Luffy vs Enel was just strait up plot because Luffy would have still gotten hurt cuz imagine over 1,000,000 volts of electricity running through rubber that shit would have been obliterated
In general Gojo was already the weakest out of all of them even with infinity. Everyone has better speed, AP, and Durability. Infinity was the only thing stopping Luffy.
@@shemwell4782 not necessarily because Luffy can somewhat manipulate reality with gear 5 so he could potentially get through infinity like how sukuna did also he doesn’t have to touch gojo to hurt him with acoc and acoa
Just a real quick opinion here prior to the rest of the vid, Gojo without infinity is like taking the ammo out of a gun, you can still use it unconventionally, but it's not gonna have that punch.
his whole bag is not the gum gum fruit bro, he literally boxed it out with kaido in base form no DF and literally had him dodging and sweating his hits and use of raw strength and haki was more powerful than gear 4 and downward. luffy is him. gear 5 is icing on the cake.
Luffy stated lightspeed attacks were "too slow" for him all the way back in Sabaody. Sabaody was like 600 episodes ago meaning Luffy's gotten way faster. Mach 3 is the type of speeds that were being hyped up in JJK. Gojo aint nowhere near base Luffy's speed In terms of sheer strength, Luffy back in skypea was lifting and fighting with a giant gold ball attached to his hand which weighed millions of pounds and still punching fast enough to blitz Enel who's made out of lightning and can move at those speeds. Luffy in base was also fighting Kaido. Gojo's strength feats are nowhere close to even skypea Luffy. The only wincon Gojo has is Hollow Purple and his domain expansion. But they wont work due to Observation haki and the speed gap. Luffy can see the future whenever he wants and whenever theres danger he gets a warning from base observation. Gojo stands no chance. Gojo gets speedblitz one tapped less than 1 second into the fight. This goes for the other 3 as well. Naruto, Luffy and Goku all speedblitz one tap Gojo if he doesn't have infinity.
Goku could also just see gojo do the hand sign, read a whole book (wait no nvm he wouldn't do that) eat a whole buffet and then break his fingers before gojo has the time to do his 0.2 seconds domain expansion
you are tripping luffy has insane strength feats, really early on even he pulled off the entire front of the bow of a ship off with his bare hands no stretching, he punched bellamy the hyena so hard he smashed him through the deck they were standing on, he has picked up and UNREAL amount of UNBELIEVEABLY heavy objects like they were nothing, the GOLDEN BELL from skypiea?!
I love Tony’s vids but he’s trippin on this one. Luffys advanced conquerors haki is a bigger power up than gear 4. That’s why gear 4 got 1 shot by kaido. But base luffy with advanced conquerors split the sky with man beast form kaido
Also, I gotta add. We really overplaying how much the gum gum fruit did for Luffy. Awakening aside, Luffy's battle IQ is what made that fruit even remotely good. Are we forgetting what his lunch was before he learned the pistol? Bro was throwing a rubber band at guys basically. He made the most of his body becoming rubber out of pure ingenuity. He basically built a new fighting style that made up for his soft ass stretchy body by using the stretch to build momentum. He then built it into his gears by 1. Pumping blood faster through his body, 2. expanding the mass of his body 3. Blending the rubber of his df and the hardening of his Haki to make ridiculous tension into his punches. Without the df bro still has the hardening, only this time he doesn't have to harden rubber, he's hardening pure hands. Bro gonna be a Vergo that doesn't get hoed out.
Bro kept on saying luffy can’t hang without fruits did bro forget that he is 19 like if he lost his fruit now he still has time to get to Garp or Roger level without the fruit
@@THEDRY_1 Yeah but we can't go off speculation. The discussion is whether or not current Luffy could beat Gojo if he didn't have a df. I'm sure that if Luffy in the story didn't eat the df he would be a monster with haki, it just isn't relevant to the discussion
I was with him until he said luffys haki isn't strong like bro wasn't haki clashing with kaido also literally every character that has a df incorporates their haki in to their powers its not just luffy
Luffy def can fight Garp without his DF powers. He may not win, but he definitely is up there when it comes to Haki intensity. You SLEEPING, Tony. And why TF does people keep mentioning Goku in discussions like this? It's annoying when people bring up OP characters, and its not entertaining.
Current garp gets beaten by luffy with only haki for one reason. Aokiji is beating garp rn with haki only basically his fruit aint doing shit and if i could bet on it i'd put all my chips on the fact that kaido has stronger haki than aokiji, and luffy has stronger haki than kaido. If you don't like this explanation sure but rn to me luffy has surpassed roger and garp (with fruit of course) and shanks has surpassed roger too
10:00 Nah dawg. Roof piece, base Luffy was boxing kaido in base, no gum gum fruit being used. ruclips.net/video/DG5NuXizmts/видео.htmlsi=W0jyDZVu49KvF_zS He doesnt mix it here 😭 Plus he still got future sight, ryou, and conquerors coating
Perfect Sages in Naruto: - hashirama (Demi god reincarnation Top 1 clan) - Naruto (Demi God reincarnation , Top 5 clan - Minato - Kabuto When you really look at it and ask yourself are the perfect sages that strong or enhanced through legacy and lineage.
They’re that strong lmao. If it were solely legacy and lineage then every senju and uzumaki would’ve mastered it. The fact that it’s hard even for kage level characters like jiraiya and orochimaru to master it speaks for itself. Even minato struggles with it despite being a perfect sage. Also being a reincarnation of ashura and indra doesn’t automatically make you op. All it means is that they’re destined to fight to the death. Naruto and Sasuke only got six paths power bc hagoromo wanted them to seal madara and possibly kaguya if she came out.
@@jaybronx98 Right. Because out of the 4 perfect sages we know. Two of them are literally Demi gods and truthfully had their way painted out for them through prophecy. If Jiraya had reached perfect sage and performed even an ounce similar to Naruto or hashi then I’d agree with your point. It’s just not what happened. The only impressive feats from the perfect sages come from Naruto and hashi who are in fact Demi gods. Kabuto was cool too but his abilities didn’t go anywhere and just mastering Edo tensei isn’t gonna really make me hype the sages. Naruto is getting the win against Gojo high diff without kurama.
@@gemachietaylor5339 you just contradicted yourself😂 you said if jiraiya mastered perfect sage mode you’d agree with me (assuming bc he’s not a “demi god”) when Minato isn’t either and he’s also a perfect sage and the only reason he struggles with it is bc it doesn’t work well with his fighting style being ending the battle asap with his speed and assassination skills. Sage mode is more suited for long drawn out battles. Also saying kabutos abilities didn’t go anywhere is false as well considering he was 2v1 edo itachi and ems sasuke without edo tensei and the ONLY reason he lost was bc itachis izanami asspull. Kabuto (who also isn’t a “Demi god” btw) became a perfect sage, something that orochimaru tried for years and failed at. So no, sage mode isn’t a lineage/legacy thing at all when Minato, Kabuto and Mitsuki are also perfect sages. You literally just made that up😂 And wrong, the list goes: Goku, Naruto, Luffy and Gojo. (With Luffy getting the high diff against gojo without his df like tony said) nice try tho.
Can’t forget Luffy training in sea prism chains. He’s supposed to be fatigued because its sea prism but it just gave him momentum to train without his devil fruit powers, all haki.
He probably still would have. Infinity was actually the thing holding him back from learning it because he never had to, because he never got hit. He only learned it once someone got past infinity.
It’s a weird comparison the properties of rubber helps with luffy strength he can stretch his muscles and you have to take in account that gojo can activate his domain for a split second and lobotomies luffy brain and red,blue and purple , if gojo wants him dead he could kill him
Only thing is with haki luffy isn’t in the top 7 users that a strongest he relies on his devil fruit for surviving the blunt force resistance and being able to inflate his limbs and muscles
Split second is nothing to luffy, it’s weird seeing ppl like you down play just for you to be correct🤦🏽♂️ literally in sabaody arc he literally said light speed is too slow for him.
Counter point to Tony's Naruto rant. Naruto wouldn't have been a prodigy or special in any regard beside being a Jinjuriki if he didn't steal and rely on shadow clones. The only reason Naruto is half as good as he is is because he relayed on clones for 95% of his ninja life. He wouldn't have mastered rasengan or sage mode without it and the only reason he was so good at shadow clones was because he literally stole a scroll to help him. Naruto wasn't a prodigy he simply got lucky to have such a busted move such as shadow clone by accident.
Luffy's devil fruit requires him to be super strong physically. However strong of a punch he throws, that same amount of force is sent back to his body when his arm comes back to him. He punched through a concrete wall and stomped someone thru multiple stories in the first saga of the show
I do actually kinda agree. Infinity probably wouldn't do anything to stop Luffy if he used ryou haki since it can hit targets passed barriers. Gojo would probably switch off Infinity himself once he realized it isn't doing anything but drain energy like in the sukuna fight
Nah if Luffy didn’t have the DF he would just be a young garp cause if he didn't have a DF he wouldn't have focused on that as much so his haki would be even more busted since that's all he has
There are 3 routes to take when your apart of the one piece hierarchy. 1. No fruit, full advanced haki mastery 2. Basic haki, full fruit mastery 3.advanced haki mastery, full fruit mastery Luffy has built up his fruit mastery his whole life and now he's in the final stages of advanced haki mastery Without his fruit, he'll lose a lot of his bag. But he's still got a big ass bag. Luffys still working on it though and roger was at the end of his journey. Luffy could hang without his fruit but rogers haki mastery puts him slightly above.
If we are talking about luffy never having the fruit in the first place his haki would be even crazier because that’s what would get him to where he is. He would get closer to Garp faster and would eventually be stronger than Garp
1:24 In the flashback Gojo didn’t have reverse curse technique he just knew about it. It wasn’t until his second fight with Toji that he learned it that’s also when you learned how to do red so before that he only knew blue
Pretty tough, big thing is that without Infinity, Gojo has essentially an infinite reserve of cursed energy due to the Six Eyes to reinforce his body for offense and defense.
okay so gojo is the weakest and its not even close. luffy already has strength beyond most characters. hes also joyboy gojo is strong because he can spam techs with eyes and infinity conq, obs, ryou, adv arm are all things luffy can do. damage negation from conq and then observation haki so gojo is literally never going to land a hit. okay so now lets get into a scenario luffy cannot be hit because he outspeeds gojo. gojo has NEVER gotten a single feat thats FTL gojo also has his confidence because he has infinity without that he doesnt have the will power to fight against luffy luffy has faster than light feats from before time skip. best case scenario gojo can try and open a DE but luffy still moves faster than he can open the domain we're assuming its them out for blood so luffy isnt holding back and he immediately speed blitzes if you have any thoughts lemme know also yes Luffy as of now>katakuri. if you think katakuri right now can fight zoro or sanji you're joking also it goes goku luffy naruto gojo
" Luffy wouldn't have learned Future Sight, Ryuo or Advance Conquerors if he didn't have his devil fruit because he would've died against Katakuri, Kaido, etc" Bruh, like how bias can one be 😭 Naruto without Kurama would not have made it past Haku therefore he would not have learned the Rasengan or Sage Mode Goku without his Saiyan lineage would've not made it pass Dragon Ball therefore no Kaioken nor Ultra Instinct Gojo would not have made it past Toji if he did not have his infinity activated at the time.
Naruto without Kurama would be a child prodigy because he would be trained from the start by Minato and Jiraiya + plus his massive chakra reserves wouldn't be used as prison to lock up kurama in his body Luffy without devil fruit would be a great pugilist and would instinctively learn future sight to become an evasive fighter instead of relying on his df durability (he instinctively used future sight to counter Enel's future sight by turning his brain off lol) Goku without Zenkai boost would take longer to achieve UI but he would still have learned everything that he knew and would arguably might have learned kaioken much faster if he died to king piccolo much earlier Gojo without infinity would have domain and everything but without landing a perfect black flash I don't think he would have a way to replenish his curse energy Gojo might have a way to sure hit his technique but who's to say that Luffy can't tank the hit with future sight+armament
Goku without sayian wouldve died before dragonball started cause he fell off a big ahh cliff and landed on his head, and luffy wouldve just focused on being able to fight normally, with his fruit, every time he launches an attack, the same force is brought back on him, its explained when he's training, so if he didn't need to take that into consideration he woulcve just been coby but better or young garp but better
I know I’m yapping at a wall, but another thing to consider is the Six Eyes and benefits they provide. Apart from seeing Cursed Energy on a molecular level, the Six Eyes also help Gojo process a ridiculous amount of information insanely quick, making his brain nearly a supercomputer. It’s why he’s stated to be able to master anything he chooses immediately. That’s a big advantage. Also, Gojo has been shown on numerous occasions to have a high proficiency in martial arts, which apart from his RGB attacks, is usually his main weapon even when fighting the King of Curses. I think it’s a lot closer than everyone made it out to be, even moreso if stats are equalized. Same thing for Goku and Naruto really, since both were trained practically from birth to throw hands. I honestly think from highest success rate to lowest it would go: Goku > Naruto > Gojo > Luffy and its mostly due to combat knowledge and amount of options in their respective bags.
Gojo, no infinity, claps, no gum gum, luffy. im sorry. But Gojo has still has cursed energy reinforcement allowing for increased strength and speed, beyond his already insane physical abilities, the six eyes allow near infinite stamina, infinite healing, and near precognition. Giving Gojo Blue, Red, Purple, AND domain is wraps
luffy destroys gojo, luffy is way faster and stronger than gojo, he scales to light speed with out his fruit, has future sight so if he sees an attack might kill him he can dodge, the jjk verese isnt even as strong as the mha verse so gojo doesnt come close to luffy
People saying Luffy is just a brawler is cap. Not only was he trained by the HERO OF THE NAVY Garp, he also trained with the RIGHT HAND MAN of the Pirate King in Raleigh. Luffy aint a scrub by any means
I love Tony but he was wrong here. Luffys advanced conquerors is a bigger power multiplier than gear 4. That’s why gear 4 luffy got one shot by kaido. But base luffy with advanced conquerors split the sky with manbeast form kaido
Luffy is 19 years old bruh. Him having the same genes as garp would almost guarantee he could become as powerful without a devil fruit. He would only have haki to train with. Most of garp’s feats and statements come from when he was in his 40s and luffy isn’t even 20 yet and he knows all 3 forms of haki at the advanced level.
I mean, Gojo would still have INSANE control over space with Red and Blue. Since Luffy doesn't have the Gum Gum and can't stretch, couldn't Gojo just fire a blue to keep Luffy in one spot and then shoot a Red at it to make a hollow purple that just zaps Luffy out of existence? Mix with the fact that he still has Limitless and his CE consumption is next to zero (unless he pops his domain, but if he had his domain it's wraps because they can't dodge any move Gojo is throwing) and he has insane RCT and control over conceptual cursed techniques.
luffy would still be able to see into the future. and in base right after his 2 year training was able to dodge pacifista beams made from kizarus df and even called them slow. theres no way gojo could do anything before luffy just punches gojo in the face over and over again. the power boost he got with conq haki in base puts him above anything he's ever done with gears/df before by miles.
I get what he’s saying I think he’s down playing his haki quite a bit though he did split the sky with just his conquers but I think what he means is Luffys haki is strong but he hasn’t actually had full training on his conquers haki hence why characters like garp and shanks have stronger haki / feats until Luffy gets more training I don’t really consider him to be a haki man he relies to much on his devil fruit don’t get me wrong though he obviously has the potential to have the strongest haki in the series but he hasn’t had any sort of guidance with his power he barely acknowledges he uses it half the time
bro doesnt even know what infinity is and hes trying to argue, infinity is his inherited cursed technique, and its also what allowed the creation of the cursed techinque limitless, the field around him the distorts space and time. Blue Red, purple, and hollow purple ALL fall under infinity. theyd all be gone if he did inherit infinity. gojo wouldnt even be able to use domain expansion as its also a byproduct of limitless which is a byproduct of infinity. all gojo could use is black flash, reverse curse, or a simple domain.
and gojo would struggle hitting black flashes and if we were to take away advanced haki like tony said gojo wouldnt have rtc cuz he got it because of the fight with toji when he bypassed gojos infinity
Isn't it the other way around? Limitless and Six Eyes are Gojo's inherit techniques, and Infinity is one application of limitless. Even without Infinity, Gojo still has Red, Blue, Purple, RTC and Domain Expansion.
@@JoãoVieira-f6s limitless is one application of infinity. and limitless is used in Red blue purple and his domain. so no, by proxy he couldn't use any of those said moves. again he's left with, black flash, simple domain, and reverse cursed technique. black flash isn't something he can just do when he wants to its luck if it works. and simple domain wouldn't do anything since Luffy didn't open a domain, unless you want to call gear 5 a domain, then okay but its still pretty useless without infinity or its aforementioned tree of abilities Gojo created with it, through limitless.
@@JoãoVieira-f6syea ur right OP is completely wrong, Infinity is an application of Limitless, he can still use Red, Blue, Purple, Domain Expansion, etc. without Infinity
People gotta understand infinity is just one of the applications of his cursed technique. He was able to go three on one vs. country buster threats without an effective Infinity.
16:10 in the show Gojo opened a 0.2 domain and killed about 1000 curses in that train station in 0. two seconds so no Luffy is not faster than Gojo also that clip of Luffy dodging the lasers. It seems like he’s just running and the lasers are just missing him. I’m gonna need more proof.
It said if Goku wasn't a saiyan. If we getting *technical*, if Goku wasn't a saiyan, he'd be dead, making he the weakest by default. I'd like to take my crown now 🥶
@@jaydenjayden3778 if we want to get technical gojo wouldnt be able to use rtc because he only got it after toji basically killed him through his infinity
Katkuri is comparable to luffy's 4th gears. Kaido 1 shot that luffy in his base form. Luffy in base fought kaido in his stronger dragon form to almost a stand still.
The whole discussion: *Supposed to be about Luffy vs Gojo and what type of difficulty it would take Luffy to beat Gojo*
Dragonball fans: Y'know, Goku though...
GET OU-
The original question WAS about Goku. It was who’s be the weakest: Goku but he isn’t a Saiyan, Gojo with no infinity, Luffy with no devil fruit or Naruto with no Kurama. This is one of those times where Goku solos is actually valid.
@@23TheOneAndOnly23 yeah but the discussion at hand was about luffy against gojo. He was branching off of that question for a debate of its own, which goku should have had no part in.
**aggressive piano starts playing**
@23TheOneAndOnly23 The *question* involved Goku, but it wasn't *only about* him. The *discussion* was about Luffy and Gojo, and how much of a problem Gojo would give Luffy before getting turned into a Kit Kat bar again.
Base luffy was boxing kaido and then split the sky
His haki is insane idk what you on
This is facts, but what Tony failed to mention is how young Luffy was when he got his power so all his moves are based on gum-gum and without it he's washed. I personally feel that if Luffy had to fight without a Devil Fruit his Haki would be Garp level, that's just me tho 🤷🏾
Base Luffy was still using his df in that moment your forgetting.
yea but garp level luffy against sage mode naruto?
its hard to say who would win w the competition of the instant nature sensing technique and future sight. imo IF luffy is garp level against sage mode W/ future sight it would be almost an eternal battle. it would come to who could last the longest in durability, which luffy loses without the devil fruit. making luffy garp level changes the argument completely. but thats just drunk thoughts.
@@dirtyxxdan2163 not really Naruto could just inject nature chakra into Luffy and it's done
@@zyplo-makes sense since without a df he would’ve been trained in the Navy by Garp
Those stones are nothing compared to the golden ball luffy carried against enel. Luffy is ridiculously strong
Also I think people forget that the sea stones not only take away df abilities, but they also weaken the df user wearing them by a pretty big amount. While the cuffs were a weakened version of the ones in Impel down so the prisoners could still work, they were enough to stop them from breaking the cuffs which normally Luffy would be able to do easily
Gold ball? I thought enel was the lightning dude from the fillers what gold ball
@@kingcapone5441 my brother in christ skypia was not filler and at then end of the fight enel melted a shit ton of gold to luffy's arm and made it a ball
@@kingcapone5441 Enel is the lighting dude from Skypiea and he melted a big gold ball onto Luffy's arm using the heat from his electricity. Luffy then used that same heavy ass golden ball to punch Enel into the big golden bell, pretty much ending the climax of the arc.
@@KagzMoonVA damn fr it’s not filler I thought it was I remember enels design I think I remember the golden bell nami wanted or sumn right
Luffy pushed two buildings apart while being wedged between them. With pure shoulder strength, no momentum, bro shoved two buildings apart.
yeah after eating a devil fruit dude he would be a normal human otherwise
@@C3l3bi1Zoro was a “normal human” but was lifting tons almost though
his devil fruit doesn't offer him strength, it just have him the properties of rubber @@C3l3bi1
@@C3l3bi1yeh no luffy was lifting those stone boulders casually without his devil fruit power go read
@@justinbp33be doesn't know what he's talking about
People always confuse what "Infinity" is, Gojo Technique is called the "Limitless" this gives him Red, Blue, Purple, and "Infinity"(also his domain :Unlimited Void). Limitless and Infinity are not the samething, without Limitless you have no Infinity and you can't have Infinity without Limitless.
ur the only one who actually reads the manga
So the way the question is posed right now, unless I misread what you mean, Gojo STILL has Limitless, just not his Domain Expansion or the thing that makes nobody touch him? I'm confused, because the Limitness technique's whole thing is bringing Infinity. Therefore, are the two actually dissociable? Or maybe I misread and you are actually crucially pairing the two therefore if he loses one he loses both? I'm not into manga but I like seeing people debate and rationalise different power scales.
@@JimboTheCrackSmokahe loses the ability that makes him untouchable. He can still do everything else (including DE).
@@WhiteNoBeard471 no he cannot his entire kit is an application of infinity and you cant do domain without a CT
No, his entire kit is an application of LIMITLESS. Not infinity. Infinity comes from Limitless, not the other way around.@@thebestplays3413
Luffy just becomes a mini version of garp. Why we acting like he's useless without his fruit? I don't understand.😅
I think it's because we haven't seen Luffy in a situation where he has to fight without his devil fruit
@@TheBashful0ne He fought law without his fruit look up luffy vs law
@CasheRare if he ain't have is DF crocodile would have toe tagged boy early sadly
@@TheBashful0ne he's going to have to fight Blackbeard soon and will see what Tony has to say ...
Have you seen what garp can do with Haki bro luffy ain’t there yet lol
Tony casually forgetting luffy split the sky’s clashing with kaido while luffy was still in base
He literally read chat saying "he thplit the thky🤓" like 4 times one piece fans actually ride the short bus
@@Vulture_King i mean sure as long as tony is the bus driver gojo with no infinity is getting fucking manhandled by luffy haki alone lol wtf are jjk fans on oh and enjoy the inevitable shit ending in 5 count em 5 chapters left lmao
What episode did that happen
He was using gear 2nd
@@thirdbleach5271why you so mad
A lot of Naruto's issues in training and powering up came from Kurama holding him back and conflicting with his natural chakra control.
So without Kurama, his ceiling is lowered but he makes up for it by becoming A LOT better at everything he remains with. So his gets better at sage mode and sage justu, better at chakra control in general, becomes more efficient in his chakra use so he can go longer.
Not only that but due to his universal understanding with chakra he can master jutsu with the same efficiency as a sharigan user
Show when he made created 8 different rasenshuriken off the top of his head vs Kaguya
it kept him alive and boosted him more than his own chakra would sage mode is good but is nowhere near close to tailed beast chakra it held him back from advancing normally not in totality it still gave him a tremendous boost especially in Naruto where non of his training actually started until Shippuden and without that nine tails he wouldn't have made it too Shippuden. nine tails chakra is the 2nd or 3rd strongest in the entire show,
@@balenciagason7175 bro no uzumaki have the biggest chakra reserve the reason is he was actually weaker with the nine tails if he didn’t have kurama he would be like minito if not stronger and faster after he learned it and became friends made him stronger but his chakra reserves where so big it was able to keep the nine tailed at bay
@@balenciagason7175Naruto literally has more chakra than kurama and he beat him 1v1 in sage mode kurama was more of a liability than anything
@@backwurds9195this bro people are forgetting that Naruto’s chakra pool is literally nerfed due to the sheer fact that he has Kurama…like kakashi said to a base Naruto in rasenshuriken training that Naruto has 4 times as much chakra as him and if it’s wasn’t for the nine tails which Naruto’s chakra basically kept in check it would be a 100 times more than his
Keep in mind zoro throwing a building at mr 1 was a great show of strength. And luffy was stronger than zoro at that time. And they are WAY stronger now than they are
is he stronger than zoro without the fruit tho? we never see luffy carrying weights and training like zoro does, so I just assume it’s his fruit
In wano he has sea prism cuffs that make his fruit irrelevant and luffys fruit doesn’t make him stronger all his damage is himself other than momentum
@@muradrayes410 nah bro. His fruit doesnt increase strength
@@simon-peterwilliamson2412it has too because otherwise it makes no sense for luffy to be strong. Tbh it’s never really made sense we just go along with it, he never even trains.
@@traysold7541 he does. The say it all the time. Training just isnt his focus like Zoro's. Did you not see the 2 year time skip. His fruit was also seen as useless by ace and sabo. And anyone really in his youth. He had to train to make it viable
I'm ngl that Tesla scrambled this guy's brain 😭😭😭 Luffy literally Haki clashed against Kaido with a sandle my guy!!!
One Piece characters have crackhead strength. Gojo is no slouch though. He was ripping arms and heads off with pure cursed energy reinforcement. He’s no weakling. I can definitely see it as a tough fight.
I just think the scaling is completely different. JJK is wild but still generally realistic-ish, or at least on a consistent scale. One piece characters do absolutely zany things all the time (ie pre-time-skip Luffy running up a giant beanstalk with a 1.5 million kg giant golden ball stuck to him.) Gojo's way stronger than normal human, but nowhere near One Piece's craziness.
Eh it’s like mid diff for Luffy without his df. Don’t get me wrong gojo is strong but he’s no where near Luffy. Luffy has future sight if gojo tries to pop a domain then Luffy can dodge it, also gojo doesn’t have infinity in this match up so he loses quicker
If you give luffy his haki but not his df and gojo limitless but not infinity (somehow) its still a no-diff for luffy. Luffy wouldve destroyed onigashima in one blow with barjan gun and i know what you'll say well he used his fruit for this and yes you're right but my point is he wouldve one tapped a big ass island if his fist was big enough, now make it smaller its still one tapping a whole city cause onigashima is HUGE. Also, luffy has future sight and crazy conquerers, even if gojo had infinity, conq coating is getting throught that, without it, one singular shot from luffy is cooking gojo and its not even close the amount of damage and power difference in the one piece world and jjk world is immense
@@xanmiddents6207comparing one piece to real life even slightly is dumb asf
@@ΚρανίΩbro…😂 y’all gotta stop exaggerating these characters man
Luffy’s strength without his devil fruit is nothing to downplay. A ptsd driven, half dead post war Luffy through a big ass boulder at a mountain.
i know people irl who can beat luffy without a devil fruit
@@Jerry11201bruh no cap 😂 I fw luffy too but luffy not talking bout much with that devil fruit
@@traysold7541without his devil fruit he split the sky with kaido. Only yonko level fighters can do that. He’s literally yonko level even without his devil fruit
@@Jerry11201 luffy the type of person to have a steal chin plate nd fight pitbulls if he a real person
@@Jerry11201you are mentally challenged luffy before he was fully grown folds you lil bro
You’re underrating Luffy like crazy if you think he loses to Katakuri with no gum gum. He has Ryou, learned to use conquerors coating in his attacks, his observation is better than katakuri’s now (he was on a similair level to Kaido’s who is significantly stronger observation than Katakuri. His fruit is the reason he beat Kaido for sure but saying he loses to Katakuri is insane after how much haki growth he’s had
i mean he did just get hit by a car he may be concussed...
There’s no way luffy could’ve beaten Katakuri without gear 4 snake man his haki just wasn’t there yet but current luffy no df definitely has a chance
@@backwurds9195 obviously. I’m talking about current luffy if he suddenly lost his df fruit. Tony’s argument was that Luffy would lose against Katakuri without df right now which makes no sense
@@backwurds9195 mb, misunderstood your comment but seems we agree after all
@@moroniw6415 tbh i agree that current luffy with no df wins against katakuri however the difficulty depends on if luffy is given time to adjust to fight without his df. As tony said 90% of his kit is his df moves, if he isn't given time to adjust it will be a high-diff win for luffy but if he gets time then luffy would win pretty easily.
luffy was definitely banging with katakuri, they were both ignoring eachothers fruit related durability with haki, he was eating hits over and over without being able to tank them through reduced damage, hes got insane endurance
I feel like a lot of people downplay Luffys base strength cuz we're so used to seein him use his df abilities in everything he does. Gotta remember it was base luffy not usin his df that speed blitzed the pacifista beams and oneshot um. Wano also made it kinda clear how strong he is without his df when he was locked up doin that crazy yard work with Kidd.
Imo adding his Haki to the equation makes the fight lowkey unfair for Gojo, cuz JJK doesn't get nearly as wild as even some of the more downplayed feats in OP.
Just to clear things up infinity is just the neutral application of limitless so if you take away gojos ability to only use infinity he can still amplify (blue) or reverse it(red) or mixing the 2 (purple) and he can still cast a domain i think the question was meant to take away limitless entirely then that's a different story he'd basically just be yuji with the six eyes
Bro Luffy was fighting giant tigers and gorillas before he had his devil fruit 😭😭 I’m surprised how many bad takes content creators have no cap
This is 100% cap. He had his Df since he was a kid
@@johnathonthompson2950 it’s not 100% cap you see it in his flashbacks before garp even drops him off to Dadan, Garp was already throwing him into the jungle
@@johnathonthompson2950 Luffy ate the DF and then made his mind up on being king of the pirates which then cause Garp to blame Shanks and drop him to Dadan. So before you call cap maybe know what your talking about
@@johnathonthompson2950look at the scene after enies lobby when garp is revealed. he doesnt have his hat yet which means he didnt have a fruit while garp was training him.
@@GolDJewelzlol bro these dudes be on here loud and wrong 😂
He's fast enough to keep up with kizaru
!!! Literally this
he got one shotted by kizaru when he built up to lightspeed so it's eh
@@flappyflap2693 we talking current manga or
@@robertkonek9002 it's current when Luffy brawls with kizaru again he gets speed blitz and tossed across the whole island
@@KingMAXIMUM-up4rzspeed blitz means that luffy couldn’t perceive him but he was able to so you wrong😑
most of the verse wasn't hanging with Enel, Oda himself said bro would have a 500M bounty off rip. Off straight DF power, bro was gonna have one of the highest pre ts bounties without accomplishing anything.
his devil fruit wasn't the only problem bro had observation Haki which amplified his ability
*500M bounty
@@balenciagason7175Other way around lightning amped observation
@@Tinfoilcanmannno in the show it’s just called different in there land I forgot what it was call it was there version of haki
@@M-bn2cv mantra
Really downplaying Luffys conquers. It had Kaido dodging
Yeah he lost me with that , luffy haki is crazy
Yeah I get what Tony’s saying, Luffy losing Haki or Devil Fruit powers REALLY hurts his abilities but just cuz he ain’t as HIM as Roger or Garp does not mean he ain’t strong as helllll base or any of his Haki abilities aren’t good 🤔
Luffys Haki plus his df had him dodging. It’s like yall are forgetting he didn’t throw some random punch at Kaido. It was a red roc. How’s he doing that without his df?
@@WriteWhatISee He was fighting in base for like a quarter of the fight, so yeah the stretching helps, but that doesn't make his conquerors any stronger
@@Stumpsville Yes it does. He’s literally using his df abilities to add more force and speed to his hits. The entire reason he can fire off attacks in such rapid succession is because he can stretch. He’s obviously infusing his Haki as well. But his df is the base for why he hits as hard as he does.
OP has overall higher scaling than JJK
Source?
@@behindyou2485tf u mean “source?” its common sense.. 😭 the jjk verse powers are only capable of destroying multiple buildings to small city level. (only a few of them can even destroy a small city) less than a handful. whereas in OP there’s multiple characters that are capable of destroying COUNTRIES 😭
Don't they also have slower scaling aswell?
@@EngagingOverImmersive no they are faster (One Piece)
@@Fear999.just because the anime doesn’t portray world ending planet destroying feats doesn’t mean it can’t I imagine gojo sending a hollow purple too the center of the earth would destroy it
15:25 limitless and infinity are not one in the same. Limitless is the whole cursed technique, red, blue, purple, and infinity are all part of the LIMITLESS TECHNIQUE. Infinity is just the neutral application of it, while blue is the negative application and red is the positive application. If the question was gojo without limitless, then his domain is included and luffy loses but if it was infinity gojo is just gonna erase luffy.
Luffy still one taps... Bro has future sight, advanced conq, and you, gojo without limitless is instantly dying.
Facts
Tony scaling jjk all the way up to op is crazy work
i stg😂
Jjk tops out at a dozen times faster than lightning and city level.
Legit luffy start of post time skip is already a country level threat and many times faster than light. And characters like kaido are dozens of times stronger than that
Bro got hit by a car and already back to dropping bangers
I love this convo Tony it's like debating with my friends back in the day keep this style of content
I love the debates Tony I NEED MORE😂‼️
I'm sorry but high diff???? luffy is still dodging light speed without his devil fruit 😅 bro his weakened gramp just caused a nuke with just haki I'm sure luffy can do that same amount of damage without a devil fruit he still got Top haki in the verse they be splitting islands a good example is zoro bro splitting mountains with no powers but haki and oda said luffy has better haki than him
I think it's closer than we all think it would be. If Luffy lost devil fruit, it means NO gears, his bounty would drop by half instantly.
Gojo 6 eyes and luffys foresight might clash. Then it's armament vs gojos recovery and Domain Expansion.
I don't think his Haki is there, YET, to hang solely based on that skill. I think Gojo might win off technique and having extra "weapons" on hand
Gojo is literally fodder to current luffy stop overhyping jjk 🗿
The six eyes is nowhere near close to the perception of having future sight
Gojo isn't surviving any atks infused with ryou which atk from tye inside out and if luffy uses ryou and punches gojo in the face he's going to die just off the strength and durability gap
Even without a df it's still luffy no diffing with just his haki
Bounty don't have anything to do with power
Bro I love these clips/discussions from the livestream and the edits are fucking top tier 🤣🤣
Luffy has advanced conq coating. It was the only reason he learned to actually hurt kiado
Luffy vs Enel was just strait up plot because Luffy would have still gotten hurt cuz imagine over 1,000,000 volts of electricity running through rubber that shit would have been obliterated
In general Gojo was already the weakest out of all of them even with infinity. Everyone has better speed, AP, and Durability. Infinity was the only thing stopping Luffy.
domain expansion is an instant lost for luffy so it's pretty possible for him to lose
@@flappyflap2693Luffy would see it with future sight and then get away or hit him before gojo could activate it
You can not read if you came to this condition
In general this would end in a stall @@KS-Strawhat
@@shemwell4782 not necessarily because Luffy can somewhat manipulate reality with gear 5 so he could potentially get through infinity like how sukuna did also he doesn’t have to touch gojo to hurt him with acoc and acoa
Jimbei, Who’s Who, Pica, and Vergo have all used Fullbody Armament Haki.
Just a real quick opinion here prior to the rest of the vid, Gojo without infinity is like taking the ammo out of a gun, you can still use it unconventionally, but it's not gonna have that punch.
Garp was throwing Luffy into jungles with giant tigers and shit before he even got his devil fruit.
his whole bag is not the gum gum fruit bro, he literally boxed it out with kaido in base form no DF and literally had him dodging and sweating his hits and use of raw strength and haki was more powerful than gear 4 and downward. luffy is him. gear 5 is icing on the cake.
Luffy stated lightspeed attacks were "too slow" for him all the way back in Sabaody. Sabaody was like 600 episodes ago meaning Luffy's gotten way faster. Mach 3 is the type of speeds that were being hyped up in JJK. Gojo aint nowhere near base Luffy's speed
In terms of sheer strength, Luffy back in skypea was lifting and fighting with a giant gold ball attached to his hand which weighed millions of pounds and still punching fast enough to blitz Enel who's made out of lightning and can move at those speeds. Luffy in base was also fighting Kaido. Gojo's strength feats are nowhere close to even skypea Luffy.
The only wincon Gojo has is Hollow Purple and his domain expansion. But they wont work due to Observation haki and the speed gap. Luffy can see the future whenever he wants and whenever theres danger he gets a warning from base observation. Gojo stands no chance. Gojo gets speedblitz one tapped less than 1 second into the fight.
This goes for the other 3 as well. Naruto, Luffy and Goku all speedblitz one tap Gojo if he doesn't have infinity.
Lets stop wanking characters with "lightspeed" statements. That weak ass laser aint lightspeed
Luffy and goku are the type of people to just, “ignore” the domain expansion 😭
Goku could also just see gojo do the hand sign, read a whole book (wait no nvm he wouldn't do that) eat a whole buffet and then break his fingers before gojo has the time to do his 0.2 seconds domain expansion
Also we seen Luffy box with lucci no gears nothing when they started fighting 🤷♂️
you are tripping luffy has insane strength feats, really early on even he pulled off the entire front of the bow of a ship off with his bare hands no stretching, he punched bellamy the hyena so hard he smashed him through the deck they were standing on, he has picked up and UNREAL amount of UNBELIEVEABLY heavy objects like they were nothing, the GOLDEN BELL from skypiea?!
The constant DragonBall mentions really helps cement that Tony's twitch chat is actually braindead
I love Tony’s vids but he’s trippin on this one. Luffys advanced conquerors haki is a bigger power up than gear 4.
That’s why gear 4 got 1 shot by kaido. But base luffy with advanced conquerors split the sky with man beast form kaido
Also, I gotta add. We really overplaying how much the gum gum fruit did for Luffy.
Awakening aside, Luffy's battle IQ is what made that fruit even remotely good. Are we forgetting what his lunch was before he learned the pistol? Bro was throwing a rubber band at guys basically. He made the most of his body becoming rubber out of pure ingenuity. He basically built a new fighting style that made up for his soft ass stretchy body by using the stretch to build momentum.
He then built it into his gears by 1. Pumping blood faster through his body, 2. expanding the mass of his body 3. Blending the rubber of his df and the hardening of his Haki to make ridiculous tension into his punches.
Without the df bro still has the hardening, only this time he doesn't have to harden rubber, he's hardening pure hands. Bro gonna be a Vergo that doesn't get hoed out.
10:00 saying the nika fruit is 90 percent of luffy is a crazy take
Bro kept on saying luffy can’t hang without fruits did bro forget that he is 19 like if he lost his fruit now he still has time to get to Garp or Roger level without the fruit
@@THEDRY_1 Yeah but we can't go off speculation. The discussion is whether or not current Luffy could beat Gojo if he didn't have a df. I'm sure that if Luffy in the story didn't eat the df he would be a monster with haki, it just isn't relevant to the discussion
Also besides Goku who else at age 4 was fighting wild animals 10x the size of normal ones 😂
@@jaydenjayden3778 the entire situation is speculation that kinda makes no sense u literally would have to go off speculation
@balenciagason7175 but the discussion is about current Laffy without the fruit powers. Not talking about where he could be in the future
Tony acting like Luffy did not one shot Bellamy like he was a 3 AM snack 😂😂😂😂😂😭
Wow Bellamy he was so strong😂
I was with him until he said luffys haki isn't strong like bro wasn't haki clashing with kaido also literally every character that has a df incorporates their haki in to their powers its not just luffy
ikr he stopped doflamingo a celestial dragon with some fucking chanclas
Tony was trippin this entire vid 😹😹😹
Luffy def can fight Garp without his DF powers. He may not win, but he definitely is up there when it comes to Haki intensity. You SLEEPING, Tony.
And why TF does people keep mentioning Goku in discussions like this? It's annoying when people bring up OP characters, and its not entertaining.
Current garp gets beaten by luffy with only haki for one reason. Aokiji is beating garp rn with haki only basically his fruit aint doing shit and if i could bet on it i'd put all my chips on the fact that kaido has stronger haki than aokiji, and luffy has stronger haki than kaido. If you don't like this explanation sure but rn to me luffy has surpassed roger and garp (with fruit of course) and shanks has surpassed roger too
Bro I like him bro hears from both sides instead of being a glazer for one character
lol Gojo is cooked
Jujuitsu kaisens power scaling is actually quite weak compared to the mainstream shows, even someone like deku could probably find a way to beat him
10:00 Nah dawg. Roof piece, base Luffy was boxing kaido in base, no gum gum fruit being used.
ruclips.net/video/DG5NuXizmts/видео.htmlsi=W0jyDZVu49KvF_zS
He doesnt mix it here 😭
Plus he still got future sight, ryou, and conquerors coating
Luffy base stats make it such a disgusting matchup that he wouldn't even need haki
Perfect Sages in Naruto:
- hashirama (Demi god reincarnation Top 1 clan)
- Naruto (Demi God reincarnation , Top 5 clan
- Minato
- Kabuto
When you really look at it and ask yourself are the perfect sages that strong or enhanced through legacy and lineage.
They’re that strong lmao. If it were solely legacy and lineage then every senju and uzumaki would’ve mastered it. The fact that it’s hard even for kage level characters like jiraiya and orochimaru to master it speaks for itself. Even minato struggles with it despite being a perfect sage.
Also being a reincarnation of ashura and indra doesn’t automatically make you op. All it means is that they’re destined to fight to the death. Naruto and Sasuke only got six paths power bc hagoromo wanted them to seal madara and possibly kaguya if she came out.
@@jaybronx98 Right. Because out of the 4 perfect sages we know. Two of them are literally Demi gods and truthfully had their way painted out for them through prophecy. If Jiraya had reached perfect sage and performed even an ounce similar to Naruto or hashi then I’d agree with your point. It’s just not what happened. The only impressive feats from the perfect sages come from Naruto and hashi who are in fact Demi gods. Kabuto was cool too but his abilities didn’t go anywhere and just mastering Edo tensei isn’t gonna really make me hype the sages. Naruto is getting the win against Gojo high diff without kurama.
@@gemachietaylor5339 you just contradicted yourself😂 you said if jiraiya mastered perfect sage mode you’d agree with me (assuming bc he’s not a “demi god”) when Minato isn’t either and he’s also a perfect sage and the only reason he struggles with it is bc it doesn’t work well with his fighting style being ending the battle asap with his speed and assassination skills. Sage mode is more suited for long drawn out battles.
Also saying kabutos abilities didn’t go anywhere is false as well considering he was 2v1 edo itachi and ems sasuke without edo tensei and the ONLY reason he lost was bc itachis izanami asspull. Kabuto (who also isn’t a “Demi god” btw) became a perfect sage, something that orochimaru tried for years and failed at. So no, sage mode isn’t a lineage/legacy thing at all when Minato, Kabuto and Mitsuki are also perfect sages. You literally just made that up😂
And wrong, the list goes: Goku, Naruto, Luffy and Gojo. (With Luffy getting the high diff against gojo without his df like tony said) nice try tho.
@@gemachietaylor5339I mean it would make more sense if they erased his SOSP mode which is separate from kurama.
Can’t forget Luffy training in sea prism chains. He’s supposed to be fatigued because its sea prism but it just gave him momentum to train without his devil fruit powers, all haki.
ifluffy doesnt get advanced haki gojo doesnt get reversed cure technique because without infinity he never wouldve learned it
He probably still would have. Infinity was actually the thing holding him back from learning it because he never had to, because he never got hit. He only learned it once someone got past infinity.
Tony tweaking this whole segment
Howd goku gans get in the middle of that 😂 2:00
It’s a weird comparison the properties of rubber helps with luffy strength he can stretch his muscles and you have to take in account that gojo can activate his domain for a split second and lobotomies luffy brain and red,blue and purple , if gojo wants him dead he could kill him
Only thing is with haki luffy isn’t in the top 7 users that a strongest he relies on his devil fruit for surviving the blunt force resistance and being able to inflate his limbs and muscles
Split second is nothing to luffy, it’s weird seeing ppl like you down play just for you to be correct🤦🏽♂️ literally in sabaody arc he literally said light speed is too slow for him.
Luffy also punched through a metal block in wano he strong eshi
Counter point to Tony's Naruto rant. Naruto wouldn't have been a prodigy or special in any regard beside being a Jinjuriki if he didn't steal and rely on shadow clones. The only reason Naruto is half as good as he is is because he relayed on clones for 95% of his ninja life. He wouldn't have mastered rasengan or sage mode without it and the only reason he was so good at shadow clones was because he literally stole a scroll to help him. Naruto wasn't a prodigy he simply got lucky to have such a busted move such as shadow clone by accident.
Coughing gojo vs nuclear luffy
Tony your tweet don’t make sense- Gojo has one CT, Limitless. If he doesn’t have that, pre-timeskip Luffy will win.
That’s cool but bugs bunny will wax them all, toon force is unmatched
Bugs bunmy solos fiction, or it goes to a 1v1 with popeye
gear 5 is cartoon too
Luffy's devil fruit requires him to be super strong physically. However strong of a punch he throws, that same amount of force is sent back to his body when his arm comes back to him. He punched through a concrete wall and stomped someone thru multiple stories in the first saga of the show
Luffy without a devil fruit and just haki is stronger than gojo even with infinity
I do actually kinda agree. Infinity probably wouldn't do anything to stop Luffy if he used ryou haki since it can hit targets passed barriers. Gojo would probably switch off Infinity himself once he realized it isn't doing anything but drain energy like in the sukuna fight
Luffy without his fruit still have top tier haki btw. He split the sky with Kaido and wasn't using his fruit in that attack.
bro always downplaying one piece can’t take him seriously lol
I mean Luffy be tanking some mega mountain crushing haki coated attacks so idk what Gojo gonna do honestly.
Nah if Luffy didn’t have the DF he would just be a young garp cause if he didn't have a DF he wouldn't have focused on that as much so his haki would be even more busted since that's all he has
There are 3 routes to take when your apart of the one piece hierarchy.
1. No fruit, full advanced haki mastery
2. Basic haki, full fruit mastery
3.advanced haki mastery, full fruit mastery
Luffy has built up his fruit mastery his whole life and now he's in the final stages of advanced haki mastery
Without his fruit, he'll lose a lot of his bag. But he's still got a big ass bag.
Luffys still working on it though and roger was at the end of his journey. Luffy could hang without his fruit but rogers haki mastery puts him slightly above.
If we are talking about luffy never having the fruit in the first place his haki would be even crazier because that’s what would get him to where he is. He would get closer to Garp faster and would eventually be stronger than Garp
1:24 In the flashback Gojo didn’t have reverse curse technique he just knew about it. It wasn’t until his second fight with Toji that he learned it that’s also when you learned how to do red so before that he only knew blue
gojos the weakest and it isnt close
Pretty tough, big thing is that without Infinity, Gojo has essentially an infinite reserve of cursed energy due to the Six Eyes to reinforce his body for offense and defense.
Its clearly
1. Goku ( plot armor )
2. naruto ( perfect sage )
3.gojo ( domain expansion )
4.luffy ( Haki )
Luffys speed, strength, and haki are far too much for Gojo without infinity.
okay so gojo is the weakest and its not even close.
luffy already has strength beyond most characters. hes also joyboy
gojo is strong because he can spam techs with eyes and infinity
conq, obs, ryou, adv arm are all things luffy can do. damage negation from conq and then observation haki so gojo is literally never going to land a hit.
okay so now lets get into a scenario
luffy cannot be hit because he outspeeds gojo. gojo has NEVER gotten a single feat thats FTL
gojo also has his confidence because he has infinity without that he doesnt have the will power to fight against luffy
luffy has faster than light feats from before time skip.
best case scenario gojo can try and open a DE but luffy still moves faster than he can open the domain
we're assuming its them out for blood so luffy isnt holding back and he immediately speed blitzes
if you have any thoughts lemme know
also yes Luffy as of now>katakuri. if you think katakuri right now can fight zoro or sanji you're joking
also it goes
goku
luffy
naruto
gojo
Gojo I sweeping that man under the rug
Luffy got hands and armament haki
this turned into luffy slander lowkey 😭 we are NOT focusing on the right things - let alone his feats without his DF
" Luffy wouldn't have learned Future Sight, Ryuo or Advance Conquerors if he didn't have his devil fruit because he would've died against Katakuri, Kaido, etc"
Bruh, like how bias can one be 😭
Naruto without Kurama would not have made it past Haku therefore he would not have learned the Rasengan or Sage Mode
Goku without his Saiyan lineage would've not made it pass Dragon Ball therefore no Kaioken nor Ultra Instinct
Gojo would not have made it past Toji if he did not have his infinity activated at the time.
Naruto without Kurama would be a child prodigy because he would be trained from the start by Minato and Jiraiya + plus his massive chakra reserves wouldn't be used as prison to lock up kurama in his body
Luffy without devil fruit would be a great pugilist and would instinctively learn future sight to become an evasive fighter instead of relying on his df durability (he instinctively used future sight to counter Enel's future sight by turning his brain off lol)
Goku without Zenkai boost would take longer to achieve UI but he would still have learned everything that he knew and would arguably might have learned kaioken much faster if he died to king piccolo much earlier
Gojo without infinity would have domain and everything but without landing a perfect black flash I don't think he would have a way to replenish his curse energy
Gojo might have a way to sure hit his technique but who's to say that Luffy can't tank the hit with future sight+armament
@@yuramushi W
Goku without sayian wouldve died before dragonball started cause he fell off a big ahh cliff and landed on his head, and luffy wouldve just focused on being able to fight normally, with his fruit, every time he launches an attack, the same force is brought back on him, its explained when he's training, so if he didn't need to take that into consideration he woulcve just been coby but better or young garp but better
@@yuramushiGoku would died because when he's 1 he fell off a cliff 😂
I know I’m yapping at a wall, but another thing to consider is the Six Eyes and benefits they provide. Apart from seeing Cursed Energy on a molecular level, the Six Eyes also help Gojo process a ridiculous amount of information insanely quick, making his brain nearly a supercomputer. It’s why he’s stated to be able to master anything he chooses immediately. That’s a big advantage. Also, Gojo has been shown on numerous occasions to have a high proficiency in martial arts, which apart from his RGB attacks, is usually his main weapon even when fighting the King of Curses. I think it’s a lot closer than everyone made it out to be, even moreso if stats are equalized. Same thing for Goku and Naruto really, since both were trained practically from birth to throw hands. I honestly think from highest success rate to lowest it would go: Goku > Naruto > Gojo > Luffy and its mostly due to combat knowledge and amount of options in their respective bags.
Gojo, no infinity, claps, no gum gum, luffy. im sorry. But Gojo has still has cursed energy reinforcement allowing for increased strength and speed, beyond his already insane physical abilities, the six eyes allow near infinite stamina, infinite healing, and near precognition. Giving Gojo Blue, Red, Purple, AND domain is wraps
Luffy is way faster and has enough ap to one shot kat. Gojo has never fought someone near light speed.
luffy destroys gojo, luffy is way faster and stronger than gojo, he scales to light speed with out his fruit, has future sight so if he sees an attack might kill him he can dodge, the jjk verese isnt even as strong as the mha verse so gojo doesnt come close to luffy
People saying Luffy is just a brawler is cap. Not only was he trained by the HERO OF THE NAVY Garp, he also trained with the RIGHT HAND MAN of the Pirate King in Raleigh. Luffy aint a scrub by any means
Luffy is essentially = base kaido without his devil fruit.
Nah
He needed gear four just to beat ulti
@@micahbrinson7950 that was before he got advanced conquerors
@@micahbrinson7950 after adv conq base luffy was able to lay out hybrid kaido with just one clean punch to the face
Current luffy has better haki than kaido and current garp
tony is ABSOLUTELY CORRECT. those who disagree are biased
He is not.
Your visibly brainwashed
I love Tony but he was wrong here. Luffys advanced conquerors is a bigger power multiplier than gear 4.
That’s why gear 4 luffy got one shot by kaido. But base luffy with advanced conquerors split the sky with manbeast form kaido
Gojos limitless technique is the manipulation of infinity that’s how he can use blue, red, and purple it’s not just his barrier
Other way around. Infinity is an application of limitless.
It is just his barrier and you would’ve had it backwards Infinity is a technique that he has
Luffy is 19 years old bruh. Him having the same genes as garp would almost guarantee he could become as powerful without a devil fruit. He would only have haki to train with. Most of garp’s feats and statements come from when he was in his 40s and luffy isn’t even 20 yet and he knows all 3 forms of haki at the advanced level.
I mean, Gojo would still have INSANE control over space with Red and Blue. Since Luffy doesn't have the Gum Gum and can't stretch, couldn't Gojo just fire a blue to keep Luffy in one spot and then shoot a Red at it to make a hollow purple that just zaps Luffy out of existence? Mix with the fact that he still has Limitless and his CE consumption is next to zero (unless he pops his domain, but if he had his domain it's wraps because they can't dodge any move Gojo is throwing) and he has insane RCT and control over conceptual cursed techniques.
he can't use red or blue without infinity bruh, that's how he bends space.
luffy would still be able to see into the future. and in base right after his 2 year training was able to dodge pacifista beams made from kizarus df and even called them slow. theres no way gojo could do anything before luffy just punches gojo in the face over and over again. the power boost he got with conq haki in base puts him above anything he's ever done with gears/df before by miles.
Red and blue use infinity
Nah tony saying luffy with his df is basically Chinjao actually made me convulse😭
3:19 WHAT🤨L Take
garps haki is ABSOLUTELY stronger than luffys
I get what he’s saying I think he’s down playing his haki quite a bit though he did split the sky with just his conquers but I think what he means is Luffys haki is strong but he hasn’t actually had full training on his conquers haki hence why characters like garp and shanks have stronger haki / feats until Luffy gets more training I don’t really consider him to be a haki man he relies to much on his devil fruit don’t get me wrong though he obviously has the potential to have the strongest haki in the series but he hasn’t had any sort of guidance with his power he barely acknowledges he uses it half the time
Luffy punched an island sized boat to pieces, gojo lost to toji let’s be real here
bro doesnt even know what infinity is and hes trying to argue, infinity is his inherited cursed technique, and its also what allowed the creation of the cursed techinque limitless, the field around him the distorts space and time. Blue Red, purple, and hollow purple ALL fall under infinity. theyd all be gone if he did inherit infinity.
gojo wouldnt even be able to use domain expansion as its also a byproduct of limitless which is a byproduct of infinity.
all gojo could use is black flash, reverse curse, or a simple domain.
and gojo would struggle hitting black flashes and if we were to take away advanced haki like tony said gojo wouldnt have rtc cuz he got it because of the fight with toji when he bypassed gojos infinity
Isn't it the other way around? Limitless and Six Eyes are Gojo's inherit techniques, and Infinity is one application of limitless. Even without Infinity, Gojo still has Red, Blue, Purple, RTC and Domain Expansion.
@@JoãoVieira-f6s limitless is one application of infinity. and limitless is used in Red blue purple and his domain. so no, by proxy he couldn't use any of those said moves. again he's left with, black flash, simple domain, and reverse cursed technique.
black flash isn't something he can just do when he wants to its luck if it works.
and simple domain wouldn't do anything since Luffy didn't open a domain, unless you want to call gear 5 a domain, then okay but its still pretty useless without infinity or its aforementioned tree of abilities Gojo created with it, through limitless.
@@JoãoVieira-f6syea ur right OP is completely wrong, Infinity is an application of Limitless, he can still use Red, Blue, Purple, Domain Expansion, etc. without Infinity
@@kawaiihaki2480no, it's the otherway round. Infinity is the application of the limitless.
People gotta understand infinity is just one of the applications of his cursed technique. He was able to go three on one vs. country buster threats without an effective Infinity.
Jjk world doesnt compare, its like comparing one piece to dbz. Krillen is maxing out 95% of the verse
100% of his verse. Krillin op asf
@@jaydenjayden3778looses to hacks , we got people who legit bypass durability with a touch
16:10 in the show Gojo opened a 0.2 domain and killed about 1000 curses in that train station in 0. two seconds so no Luffy is not faster than Gojo also that clip of Luffy dodging the lasers. It seems like he’s just running and the lasers are just missing him. I’m gonna need more proof.
Ultra Instinct is not a Saiyan transformation. Goku clears. In terms of weakest, probably Gojo.
It said if Goku wasn't a saiyan. If we getting *technical*, if Goku wasn't a saiyan, he'd be dead, making he the weakest by default. I'd like to take my crown now 🥶
@@jaydenjayden3778 if we want to get technical gojo wouldnt be able to use rtc because he only got it after toji basically killed him through his infinity
Katkuri is comparable to luffy's 4th gears. Kaido 1 shot that luffy in his base form.
Luffy in base fought kaido in his stronger dragon form to almost a stand still.