As many others have suggested there are energy losses associated to the magnetic fields and I guess there will be a limitation on the max load (or torque) the gear can take before the magnets get in contact and possibly suffer damage. Anyway it's a great idea and surely a nice improvement for many machines/systems.
Thanks. Alloy units (ruclips.net/video/AzZwyj650QI/видео.html ) would do 160 - 1,200Nm as standard, exchange ratio up to the client. Lifetime 50 years, and every year you save oil, spare parts and gain some efficiency.
Agreed, an actual scientific experiment to show the efficiency comparison would be great, as well as to see the performance under different amounts of load.
@@neo-dyne322 is it just one 1%? there is still and repulsive force that the driver gear is experiencing during operation and must overcome, heat dissipation in the system, the wires aren't perfect conductors, slight drag because of the air, can it perform similar workloads to traditional gears?
While this is very interesting, I think there's a few things that should be noted: - It is not entirely friction-less, magnetic fields do bring friction with them. - I think there are definitely vibrations transmitted. - When the system is overloaded, damage can definitely be done by the gears touching. That's why "normal" gears are made to have contact at all times, to minimize damage from wobble. - When overloaded, the system isn't quite as effective and efficient. Having said that, I think this is a very cool concept! I bet this way of gearing can be advantageous over normal gearing in certain applications.
Hi there, this demo unit obviously does not show solutions to the problems you outlined, I did this just to share a principle. But between this demo and the real life units (ruclips.net/video/AzZwyj650QI/видео.html) there are many differences.
If you imagine heavy duty aplication is quite challange, however I see this for small projects where is standart load. Nevertheless you can design the safety factor to avoid touching the magnets.
I was thinking the same thing. No losses eh? What happens when I put a conductive plate next to it?. Tbh, people just take some stuff to lightly, and others take the same stuff to seriously. Welcome to the 21st century of polarization.
@@neo-dyne322 If you use cabon, your gear will be a magnetic transmitter wich it might be no good. If you want something with more structural force, try doing it in nylon with 100% infill.
I bet the gear system itself is mostly quiet. It would definitely sound different and potentially quieter than a normal gear system. However, those electric motors definitely make noise, and the sound of the wheel whipping through the air would also make noise. I don't know why they call it silent with the audio off completely... It's a bit misleading.
@@pyromaniac1441 Dogs barking and shop noise:) That was not a lab and we did the movie for fun. Next time we'll pay more attention to your requirements.
Isn't there energy loss with the changes in magnetic field strength, as the magnets approach & separates? Magnetic Flux, induction, Eddie currents, and stuff like that?
@@neo-dyne322 wow you actually replied to a 2 year old video. so what application did you use this devide already? did you put this in a motorcycle now? just curious.
When I said “no losses” I meant that these gears are more efficient than mechanical ones, specially at high rpm’s, low to medium torque settings. Alloy units (ruclips.net/video/AzZwyj650QI/видео.html ) would do 160 - 1,200Nm as standard, exchange ratio up to the client.
Well, it has absolutely no noise when it runs - just the motors humming. But I'll do a commercial version of this, and add the sound track. Just to give people an idea.
Yes I messed up on that one:) Alloy units (ruclips.net/video/AzZwyj650QI/видео.html ) would do 160 - 1,200Nm as standard, exchange ratio up to the client. Lifetime 50 years, and every year you save oil, spare parts and gain some efficiency.
@@neo-dyne322 You also can't say "no friction", "no noise", and "no vibrations". All of these statements are objectively false. Compared to a normal gear, all of these will be low but not zero.
@@daniellemeyer8568 That depends on the RPM and the load. A mechanical gear turning with an extremely high load at a low rpm will be much quieter and have fewer vibrations whilst doing the same mechanical work.
As soon as you put a reasonable load on the outer gear, you will see how ineffective this idea is. However, the build quality is great and a lot of work was obviously put into this project. A+ for effort, Keep working with a mind like that a true breakthrough is sure to come.
Yea the gears dont trasmitte vibrationse like promissed the engin behind it does. :/. Also i think you commented one the wrong video here is the one your looking for. ruclips.net/video/e1jO7gbWqXw/видео.html
also if you where talking about this video it doesnt do justice the the system. as everything it atached my 2 plastice plants that btw do transmite vibrations
Very nice 👌 now put a load on it and see what happens when the torque required exceeds the magnetic flux of the magnets. I suspect the gear system would stall or desync at that point but i like the general idea.
With overload, the magnets will touch and behave like metal gears...and make noise etc. This is a very small demo unit, our standard electric boat gear boxes will take 160Nm
@@alanpartridge2140 This is the exact issue I saw aswell. Cool concept but I wouldn't trust this for any load situation where contact happens. I'd argue you could try this concept in an automatic transmissions clutch plate using fluid to transfer excess torque instead of gears.... You'd still lose a fair amount of efficiency in doing so but I see next to zero wear on the parts making the reliability of this design very interesting.
@@chrispowell1224 bro its so cool, does this mean there's no transmission oil needed? also the case in which these gears are could be under vacuum, pretty much impossible to get rid of induction tho
@@bluezz5002 I was merely commenting on the no sound no energy lost no friction In the video, technically at an atomic level a normal gear does exactly the same as this. It's just that here the magnetic moments are stronger than normal because they're aligned.
I'm assuming difficult to make high-torque applications. Additionally allows for harmonic frequencies in the "bouncing" between the gears. Also I want to know the resistive losses from the induced currents in the magnets. This isn't so say this isn't super cool - just I 'd need a LOT more information before it could seem viable
I guess they are not very common for many reasons including lowered efficiency due to the currents induced by the magnets, narrowband vibrations due to the magnetic interaction nonlinearity, very low mechanical shock resistance and much higher price of such a big amount of magnets and their holders compared to just a machined piece of metal. And the only real benifits are reduced total noise, lower acceptable manufacturing tolerances and largely reduced lubrication requirements. For most applications it is just not worth it I guess.
Nice presentation. Yours is different. I remember seeing a video some 5 years ago in which the inventor used the same technique but he was able to produce massive torque. I will see if i can find that video to put here as a reference. Thank you for sharing. The invention is cool and so is the decoration. It looks artistic mind behind it. Nice job.
@@neo-dyne322 it is suitable to paramotors gear boxs ? (range of 55 kg < 150 kg pull force meter , 1 471 nm min i may calculate all wrong [asuming you count the force of the air being break every rotary movement])
@@neo-dyne322 is that physical torque how much before the magnets “cam out” and the teeth contact and it starts going into the range of physical torque? (Think in terms of bolts and the elastic and plastic deformation)
That's what I was thinking, as well. There's only so much load you can put on that setup before the magnets bottom out against each other. It would obviously depend on the strength of the magnets, but I'd be surprised if the bottom-out load is even close to a mechanical link.
Losses should scale with load, but exactly what that relationship looks like, or even a rough approximation of worst case losses is a mystery to me. Could be not quite linear, could be worse than linear. Worst case losses could be much worse than gears, or much better. I really don't know here. What I expect to happen is that as the load increases, the gears that are meshing move closer and closer together, until they touch when the magnetic force is completely overcome. Assuming RPM remains constant, this means you're moving one magnetic field through another at both increasing speed and distance, which both will work to amplify the eddy currents inside the magnets, which should be the primary source of losses. That said, I suspect this design retains high efficiency with a fairly wide range of loads. Or at least I think it can be made to do so, that's probably just an engineering problem as you can size the magnets up significantly to reduce the "squishiness" of the teeth and thus the losses. Though I believe this would increase your baseline losses, so there's some nontrivial math to optimize this. Also, it's definitely worth considering that spur gears also have worse efficiency at high load. Which one scales worse? Hell if I know. The real problem from where I'm standing is durability when load ratings are exceeded. Like if you used this for a lathe and then crashed it. This thing ain't gonna slip, those teeth are going to bottom out and it's going to fail catastrophically with magnets flying everywhere. So for many applications this needs to be paired with a clutch of some kind that can slip and protect the gearbox in an overload. This is also true of a lot of geared designs, but this being made of plastic makes it a hell of a lot worse at withstanding such events. But to throw some rain on the parade, this is definitely not revolutionary and won't take the world by storm. Magnetic gears have been a thing for more than a century, the first patent I could find was filed in 1901. Magnetic gears are interesting and have some advantages, but there's a reason they haven't seen wide adoption, and it ain't tradition. Spur gears are already extremely efficient (98% or so?) and require very little maintenance. Hell, even a worn out V-belt hits something like 93% efficiency (98% properly tensioned), are much less likely to fail in an overload, and when they do fail anybody with a wrench can replace them in minutes with a part that costs a few bucks. At the end of the day, reliability matters way, way more than bumping your power transmission efficiency from 98% to 99%. And it's really, really hard to beat the reliability of a dumb chunk of metal like a spur gear.
I'm guessing this is mostly for low load applications, I can't exactly see this being used for large machines. I'm curious what's it like to make a clock with these.
This would be amazing for bicycle gearhub (IGH) or gearbox. A lot of folks do not like them because of noise and loses but this magnetic gears would fix that. I think Effigear gearbox would be the easiest to modify for magnetic gears.
It actually would not be great for a bicycle. The magnets couldn't handle much torque. To increase the torque potential would take far more powerful magnets. This would create far too much weight. It would be a terrible application for this.
@@funkingitup1805 This is exactly what I was thinking when I saw this. This likely can't handle much torque, I doubt magnets would have more force to resist slipping than the friction of physically touching gears. Very interesting to watch nonetheless. Edit: I've seen in other comments Neo-Dyne explaining that this is a demo unit and that the commercial ones can withstand 160 Nm or more.
@@neo-dyne322 You still have losses through the lorentz forces during magnetic interaction, no? I'd imagine the resistance is similar to back-emf in a PM electric motor
actually trying to think of a use for it 4 it..might be able to put more torque on gears if was housed nd pressurised in oil.so oil acts as buffer if magents need to touch under torque something like that..basiaclly my point is gears are designed for torque or timing this doesent do eather cool design just no real use 4 it...
Really cool concept! Even if overloaded, the magnetically applied force will reduce the wear and tear on the gears. I'd like to see how far you can push this idea.
No depending on the torque load its more likely to damage the gears. The teeth are not properly meshed and don't have good bearing angles they would wear terribly if they mechanically meshed. The gears also can't be made out of ferromagnetic materials so they would either have to be made of plastic like this and be weak or be made out of exotic expensive materials like titanium. This means that under sudden torque they are likely just to shear.
Love the idea! I think that magnetic fields running through each other will cause some heat, and im also curious about what the gears would do under a moderate to heavy load.
Alloy units (ruclips.net/video/AzZwyj650QI/видео.html ) would do 160 - 1,200Nm as standard, exchange ratio up to the client. Lifetime 50 years, and every year you save oil, spare parts and gain some efficiency. So far they stay cold
And no-one died in the attack on congress earlier this week. "No-one died" refers to the very low death rate relative to the holocaust and the coronavirus pandemic.
That would be true, if not for the fact that their rig has NO LOAD. You cannot test for efficiency with no load. the second you have any resistance, those magnets will be useless and the gears will make contact. Or there will be slippage. This is a scam.
@@Bungaroosh yeah it's funny because he has absolutely no information on his website either. I really like the concept, but he's making claims that obviously aren't true.
the removal of friction is the real winner in this, the implications are huge if it can be used to replace oil in mechanical devices and other moving parts in contact.
Hi Cosmin, this is a good question. Usually the term "backlash" is associated with mechanical cogs. These magnetic cogs work in levitation and lock in the air. This is a demo unit to help to see better, however commercial units are tighter, more compact. Here's a demo movie, a try to create backlash: ruclips.net/video/q-W-AbG4Ruw/видео.html
True, because some of that energy is lost in other forms of energy such as pushing the air thats around the contraption, energy into heat transferal, and so on. I mean I THE LORD teach humans this but humans still want to come up with youtube videos claiming BS lmao
Mechanical loss at the gears isn’t *because* *of* *the* gears, it’s from *turning* the gears. It doesn’t matter how the gears work or are arranged(unless they’re slipping) it’s not going to reduce or increase loss.
Interesting. Definitely, more expensive than machined gears. Rare earth magnets are not cheap. If electromagnets are used, there will be a continuous energy cost, and carbon footprint. How much load can it take? How robust are they if the teeth touch? How will extra weight affect them? What applications are these lightweight gears intended?
You could still use electromagnets for the purpose of making a really quiet machine. Would like to see this thing actually do something though to see if it works at all
Do you have any proof that this is even as efficient as gears? Gears are very efficient as it is, and I can imagine this would produce large eddy currents in the magnets which would suck alot of the power away.
ok so gotta use this to work on a perpetual motion generator ive been working on. solving how to eliminate friction energy lose was a pain. i knew magnets would be the answer, but this is perfect!
Yes, dogs barking outside. Took the sound off. Gears however are quiet, you just hear the drive unit like in this movie: ruclips.net/video/AzZwyj650QI/видео.html
It does not have practical or commercial value. Comparing with cheap belt and pulley system. Unless you stick Apple or Tesla logo on it and sell it as a unpractical novelty.
There must always be some gear-to-gear power loss. A magnetic interface might (or might not) be more efficient than a mechanical interface (even in a vacuum, even spinning on a magnetic bearing, etc), but it cannot ever be lossless. Rotating magnetic fields turn power into electrical fields, along with electrical losses vs induction effects, imperfect insulators, etc. Manufacturing costs for magnetically-oriented parts would be higher than for ordinary metal parts. Sudden starts or stops would cause the gears to collide possibly grind, and this might be catastrophic under load.
Yes. Here’s one with sound: ruclips.net/video/e1jO7gbWqXw/видео.html. Alloy units (ruclips.net/video/AzZwyj650QI/видео.html ) would do 160 - 1,200Nm as standard, exchange ratio up to the client. Lifetime 50 years, and every year you save oil, spare parts and gain some efficiency.
It is crazy how you have replied to every individual to clarify losses ! but an interesting thing this is ! am sure this would be better way to propel a wheel !
I get how he said, “no losses”, but it’s likely damn close. Not the best choice of words, but give the dude a break. It’s a idea/concept. Some thrive, some are just cool/impractical. Also, I think a really interesting characteristic is it’s ability to cushion impacts. Imagine this used in a racecar transmission. On heavy launches or shifts it could help reduce the internal shear and normal stress on parts. Good work brother! Keep perfecting!
excellent work,but it would be nice if you make a side by side comparison of the magnetic heat with a gear that looks exactly like the one in the video sans the magnets .
Thanks man - I think what these guys want to see is a real application. So I am going to make an electro-magnetic boat! Then when I'm cruising down a river they can see it really works.
Folks, PLEASE remember that these toys are nothing more than minuscule curiosities which can only work when they are small and low mass in relation to the magnetic forces imposed by those magnets. That air gap between gear teeth will be reduced to zero and then start grinding on whatever was on the other side of those air gaps the moment the gear itself requires any sort of real torque to drive it (or worse, get it started from a cold stop). If you're thinking that ANYTHING like this stuff is going to be incorporated into real-world tools and mechanisms, you are very sadly mistaken.
This is a game changer. Using magnets in gears might just prove to be more efficient and may dramatically decrease the power consumption and reduce repair costs in the long run. Downside? Higher manufacturing costs leading to increased price of the equipment in which it is used also may render unusable in products using metals gears, especially like high tensile materials containing ferromagnetic substances like steel due to its self magnetization properties of said materials. That means, it could be unusable in automobiles, in which these systems are most required as they consume fossil fuels (Exception: Electric Vehicles.) This technology is a practically usable one if used in the conjunction with diamagnetic or non magnetic materials or until a non-magnetic and cheap substitute of steel gears are available. Still, it is an ingenious invention and has the potential to be big.
Alloy units (ruclips.net/video/AzZwyj650QI/видео.html ) would do 160 - 1,200Nm as standard, exchange ratio up to the client. Lifetime 50 years, and every year you save oil, spare parts and gain some efficiency.
You're going to lose some to eddy currents, which will become more and more of a problem at higher speeds, but this is very nice as a practically zero-maintenance solution and you have the added benefit of no shear losses from the lubricant.
This would be able to transmit a tiny fraction of the torque that classic steel gears would be able to for the same building space, so no, I really don't think so. Only for very specific applications perhaps.
"All power is transmitted to the propeller without losses" *NO!* Losses due to eddy currents, friction from the motors, and heat, etc! Not all power is transmitted to the propeller! Plus there is loss created as the gears turn from magnetic attraction and repulsion, cogging, as well as the moving air produced by rotating gears are all losses. All that being said, it is a cool demonstration of a magnetic gear drive...👍
This is good in use for mechanisms that receive impacts because the teeth doesn't hit each other and is floating so it will behave like a suspension. It can also utilize the magnets to drive another gear adjacent to it but is seperetated by a thin wall. it can also be used as a natural clutch as it will disengage if it exceeds the limit of the gear.But It's hard to use if what you need is high torque, as it will probably overcome the magnetic force. It also feels like it's hard to miniaturize or produce a smaller gear set. Also having a gear train with this is hard as other magnets might interfere with the gear from the adjacent gear. Still, its a good concept and design, utlizing magnets to drive another gear. I think it will be a good use for a brush cutter so if it hit a metal pole or a rock the blade wil stop even though the engine is still running.
Yes, miniaturizing and oversizing have their limits. But having said that, there are some practical products being made. Alloy units (ruclips.net/video/AzZwyj650QI/видео.html ) would do 160 - 1,200Nm as standard, exchange ratio up to the client. Lifetime 50 years, and every year you save oil, spare parts and gain some efficiency.
![ARGENTINA vs. PERÚ [1-0] | RESUMEN | ELIMINATORIAS SUDAMERICANAS | FECHA 12](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/xtI25ENDDSY/mqdefault.jpg)
"No noise"
Video has no audio track.
Here’s one with sound: ruclips.net/video/e1jO7gbWqXw/видео.html
Thats why it doesn't make noise! Because there's no audio
@@neo-dyne322 also very impressive!
Also "no vibrations" and you can see the whole thing vibrating like crazy :D
@@neo-dyne322 "Low noise" there ya go, now you're sentence is honest
As many others have suggested there are energy losses associated to the magnetic fields and I guess there will be a limitation on the max load (or torque) the gear can take before the magnets get in contact and possibly suffer damage. Anyway it's a great idea and surely a nice improvement for many machines/systems.
Thanks. Alloy units (ruclips.net/video/AzZwyj650QI/видео.html ) would do 160 - 1,200Nm as standard, exchange ratio up to the client. Lifetime 50 years, and every year you save oil, spare parts and gain some efficiency.
"no friction"
Not true, magnetic induction is still a thing.
Normal gears are actually very low friction, I would love to see an actual comparison.
Agreed, an actual scientific experiment to show the efficiency comparison would be great, as well as to see the performance under different amounts of load.
Hmmmm, the efficiency also depend on whether it is caged around other metallic parts I presume?
Though I guess techically it isn't friction ^^.
I see your point, but friction is one of the main causes of failure using normal gears. Mostly because of maintenance, which this tech solves.
There is air friction too between the gears 😂😂😂😂
Like+, but I can't believe in "no losses" in this beautiful transmission.
Yes there are some 1% losses
Eddy current loses?
@@neo-dyne322 please care to explain.
@@neo-dyne322 is it just one 1%? there is still and repulsive force that the driver gear is experiencing during operation and must overcome, heat dissipation in the system, the wires aren't perfect conductors, slight drag because of the air,
can it perform similar workloads to traditional gears?
Good for light work and other applications, keep yer mind opened for possibilities :D
While this is very interesting, I think there's a few things that should be noted:
- It is not entirely friction-less, magnetic fields do bring friction with them.
- I think there are definitely vibrations transmitted.
- When the system is overloaded, damage can definitely be done by the gears touching. That's why "normal" gears are made to have contact at all times, to minimize damage from wobble.
- When overloaded, the system isn't quite as effective and efficient.
Having said that, I think this is a very cool concept! I bet this way of gearing can be advantageous over normal gearing in certain applications.
Hi there, this demo unit obviously does not show solutions to the problems you outlined, I did this just to share a principle. But between this demo and the real life units (ruclips.net/video/AzZwyj650QI/видео.html) there are many differences.
@@neo-dyne322
What kind of torque can you develop before overloading?
Edit: Nvm... the answer was in the video you posted. Rated 160 Nm. Thx
I see this being really useful for low torque and high rpm. Like a small wind turbine.
If you imagine heavy duty aplication is quite challange, however I see this for small projects where is standart load. Nevertheless you can design the safety factor to avoid touching the magnets.
What I’d be most interested in is if the design was noiseless. If so then they would be useful in mechanical art installations
"No losses"
-Physics left the call
Bruh
Physics was slain by Neo-Dyne using [Magnets]
probably meant "no significant losses"
shut up weeb`
I was thinking the same thing. No losses eh? What happens when I put a conductive plate next to it?. Tbh, people just take some stuff to lightly, and others take the same stuff to seriously. Welcome to the 21st century of polarization.
I love seeing 3d printing being used for stuff like this
Yes, finally my Z18 works (fingers crossed). Man, I was ready to throw it out the window, then it printed this transmission flawlessly.
@@neo-dyne322 that's an amazing printer! What type of filament did you use for this?
@@3dPrintingMillennial I used PLA for the low torque demo's. Will try other filaments like carbon if there is one out there.
me too
@@neo-dyne322 If you use cabon, your gear will be a magnetic transmitter wich it might be no good. If you want something with more structural force, try doing it in nylon with 100% infill.
I have no idea why RUclips recommended this to me, but I like it!
Well it's Xmas:) And thanks for the kind words!
That's why)
recommend why you like
@@neo-dyne322 I kinda know why I was recommend this, and I have a genius invention to share. Any contact info to reach out?
@@deathskayebolo6806 tech@neo-dyne.com
"No vibration" I can't even imagine how many physics laws this would be breaking.
A mute video saying "no noise"
X to doubt
Ha-ha you're right. Sound next time.
I bet the gear system itself is mostly quiet. It would definitely sound different and potentially quieter than a normal gear system. However, those electric motors definitely make noise, and the sound of the wheel whipping through the air would also make noise.
I don't know why they call it silent with the audio off completely... It's a bit misleading.
@@pyromaniac1441 Dogs barking and shop noise:) That was not a lab and we did the movie for fun. Next time we'll pay more attention to your requirements.
Well Im gonna expect its gonna sound like an electric fan wooshing
Lol
Isn't there energy loss with the changes in magnetic field strength, as the magnets approach & separates?
Magnetic Flux, induction, Eddie currents, and stuff like that?
Hi Sion, yes there is, I would say the efficiency is around 99%.
@@neo-dyne322 Air friction also.
Won't the brittle magnets crumble after the gear reaches a certain speed?
@@neo-dyne322 wow you actually replied to a 2 year old video. so what application did you use this devide already? did you put this in a motorcycle now? just curious.
@@jetfu400 ...just some electric boats - ruclips.net/video/AzZwyj650QI/видео.html
"All power is transmitted without loss" lol
When I said “no losses” I meant that these gears are more efficient than mechanical ones, specially at high rpm’s, low to medium torque settings. Alloy units (ruclips.net/video/AzZwyj650QI/видео.html ) would do 160 - 1,200Nm as standard, exchange ratio up to the client.
@@neo-dyne322 Again, if that's what you meant, why didn't you say that?
@@nathangamble125 Simplify it dummy..
@@neo-dyne322 They're not more efficient. Your system has NO LOAD.
@@predatorcity2920 It is still wrong. No losses mean no losses. It would have been just as easy to say "minimal losses" or "more efficient."
I really wanted to know what it sounded like
Well, it has absolutely no noise when it runs - just the motors humming. But I'll do a commercial version of this, and add the sound track. Just to give people an idea.
@@neo-dyne322 Did you did the commercial? I'm curious about the sound.
@@neo-dyne322 Excelente te deseo mucha suerte.
@@neo-dyne322 having no sound channel at at all while claiming it's silent is a bit sus.
@@neo-dyne322 When you add the sound track. Make sure when you turn the power on it sounds like a light saber. LOL...
You can't just say "no losses" when most people here are working with mechanics
Yes I messed up on that one:) Alloy units (ruclips.net/video/AzZwyj650QI/видео.html ) would do 160 - 1,200Nm as standard, exchange ratio up to the client. Lifetime 50 years, and every year you save oil, spare parts and gain some efficiency.
The biggest loss will be the permanent magnets losing their magnetic properties within weeks when fixed into a repelling configuration.
@@neo-dyne322 You also can't say "no friction", "no noise", and "no vibrations". All of these statements are objectively false. Compared to a normal gear, all of these will be low but not zero.
@@daniellemeyer8568 That depends on the RPM and the load. A mechanical gear turning with an extremely high load at a low rpm will be much quieter and have fewer vibrations whilst doing the same mechanical work.
Remember to all of you guys, we're in engineering not physics.
As soon as you put a reasonable load on the outer gear, you will see how ineffective this idea is. However, the build quality is great and a lot of work was obviously put into this project. A+ for effort, Keep working with a mind like that a true breakthrough is sure to come.
Interesting concept, i am skeptical about the amount of torque that this gear arrangement can produce before slippage occurs...
"no vibrations transmitted"
whole rig: r a t t l e m e b o n e s
probably imperfections in the design of the model
I would guess that it is just the motors vibrating.
there is a difference between no vibrations and no vibrations transmitted
Yea the gears dont trasmitte vibrationse like promissed the engin behind it does. :/. Also i think you commented one the wrong video here is the one your looking for. ruclips.net/video/e1jO7gbWqXw/видео.html
also if you where talking about this video it doesnt do justice the the system. as everything it atached my 2 plastice plants that btw do transmite vibrations
Theres me checking the volume of my speakers to hear the 'no noise' lol
Me
no audio.
Very nice 👌 now put a load on it and see what happens when the torque required exceeds the magnetic flux of the magnets. I suspect the gear system would stall or desync at that point but i like the general idea.
With overload, the magnets will touch and behave like metal gears...and make noise etc. This is a very small demo unit, our standard electric boat gear boxes will take 160Nm
@@neo-dyne322 Is the profile of the teeth designed for this contact?
@@alanpartridge2140 This is the exact issue I saw aswell. Cool concept but I wouldn't trust this for any load situation where contact happens. I'd argue you could try this concept in an automatic transmissions clutch plate using fluid to transfer excess torque instead of gears.... You'd still lose a fair amount of efficiency in doing so but I see next to zero wear on the parts making the reliability of this design very interesting.
*0:34*
"no friction"
Umm, air resistance and magnetic induction...by definition...power loss.
"No losses" mentioned here refers to the efficiency being very high when compared to conventional motor driven gears
@@neo-dyne322 sooo....some losses then.
@@chrispowell1224 bro its so cool, does this mean there's no transmission oil needed?
also the case in which these gears are could be under vacuum, pretty much impossible to get rid of induction tho
@@bluezz5002 I was merely commenting on the
no sound
no energy lost
no friction
In the video, technically at an atomic level a normal gear does exactly the same as this. It's just that here the magnetic moments are stronger than normal because they're aligned.
yeah, but no friction at all, only power loses.
Great demonstration! Would be interesting to see how the air gap changes with velocity and load changes using a high speed camera.
Sure - we'll need one.
This is one of those examples of "Why the hell doesn't this exist already"; what a brilliant idea.
Thanks!
Becouse magnet material will break if you put any torque on it.
I'm assuming difficult to make high-torque applications. Additionally allows for harmonic frequencies in the "bouncing" between the gears. Also I want to know the resistive losses from the induced currents in the magnets. This isn't so say this isn't super cool - just I 'd need a LOT more information before it could seem viable
I guess they are not very common for many reasons including lowered efficiency due to the currents induced by the magnets, narrowband vibrations due to the magnetic interaction nonlinearity, very low mechanical shock resistance and much higher price of such a big amount of magnets and their holders compared to just a machined piece of metal. And the only real benifits are reduced total noise, lower acceptable manufacturing tolerances and largely reduced lubrication requirements. For most applications it is just not worth it I guess.
moreover spinigi it near metal enclosures will heat or even melt them
You Tube and this video through the years.
2018: "hold!"
2019: "HOLD!!!"
2020: "aaaaaaand recommend at the end of the year!"
Yeah funny thing man
@@neo-dyne322 Strange . Good work any way.
same
@@AlexBarbu La Multi Ani!
Nice and Happy New years
even after watching 5-times, I just can't get enough........ so I've downloaded the video............. very nicely done Sir!
Glad you liked it
One of the coolest things ive ever seen.
Thanks!
No direct friction, no heat -> coolest gears literally.
This looks like a brilliant solution for low torque applications, Great job!
Thank you. Commercial units do 160Nm @ 8,000 rpm - ruclips.net/video/AzZwyj650QI/видео.html
@@neo-dyne322 "no noise"
Video: Says these gears make no noise
Also video: *muted*
Here's one of the same contraption WITH audio track sorry for the weird intro ruclips.net/video/BsIa_LKojJI/видео.html
i like your music of choice, totally enjoyed it. there should be more videos like this. what a breath of fresh air.
Here’s one with sound: ruclips.net/video/e1jO7gbWqXw/видео.html
Nice presentation. Yours is different. I remember seeing a video some 5 years ago in which the inventor used the same technique but he was able to produce massive torque. I will see if i can find that video to put here as a reference. Thank you for sharing. The invention is cool and so is the decoration. It looks artistic mind behind it. Nice job.
Hi Shaider, thank you for your comments. This is a demo unit, commercial ones do around 160Nm and more.
@@neo-dyne322 it is suitable to paramotors gear boxs ? (range of 55 kg < 150 kg pull force meter , 1 471 nm min i may calculate all wrong [asuming you count the force of the air being break every rotary movement])
@@rubitocop Hi there, if you have a tech query, we can discuss it - my email is tech@neo-dyne.com, looking forward for your specs.
@@neo-dyne322 is that physical torque how much before the magnets “cam out” and the teeth contact and it starts going into the range of physical torque? (Think in terms of bolts and the elastic and plastic deformation)
"No noise" and high efficiency when there is no load. Cool, but what about when using the gears to do something?
That's what I was thinking, as well. There's only so much load you can put on that setup before the magnets bottom out against each other. It would obviously depend on the strength of the magnets, but I'd be surprised if the bottom-out load is even close to a mechanical link.
Also if the uneven roads make the wheel and gears collide
Losses should scale with load, but exactly what that relationship looks like, or even a rough approximation of worst case losses is a mystery to me. Could be not quite linear, could be worse than linear. Worst case losses could be much worse than gears, or much better. I really don't know here.
What I expect to happen is that as the load increases, the gears that are meshing move closer and closer together, until they touch when the magnetic force is completely overcome. Assuming RPM remains constant, this means you're moving one magnetic field through another at both increasing speed and distance, which both will work to amplify the eddy currents inside the magnets, which should be the primary source of losses.
That said, I suspect this design retains high efficiency with a fairly wide range of loads. Or at least I think it can be made to do so, that's probably just an engineering problem as you can size the magnets up significantly to reduce the "squishiness" of the teeth and thus the losses. Though I believe this would increase your baseline losses, so there's some nontrivial math to optimize this. Also, it's definitely worth considering that spur gears also have worse efficiency at high load. Which one scales worse? Hell if I know.
The real problem from where I'm standing is durability when load ratings are exceeded. Like if you used this for a lathe and then crashed it. This thing ain't gonna slip, those teeth are going to bottom out and it's going to fail catastrophically with magnets flying everywhere. So for many applications this needs to be paired with a clutch of some kind that can slip and protect the gearbox in an overload. This is also true of a lot of geared designs, but this being made of plastic makes it a hell of a lot worse at withstanding such events.
But to throw some rain on the parade, this is definitely not revolutionary and won't take the world by storm. Magnetic gears have been a thing for more than a century, the first patent I could find was filed in 1901. Magnetic gears are interesting and have some advantages, but there's a reason they haven't seen wide adoption, and it ain't tradition. Spur gears are already extremely efficient (98% or so?) and require very little maintenance. Hell, even a worn out V-belt hits something like 93% efficiency (98% properly tensioned), are much less likely to fail in an overload, and when they do fail anybody with a wrench can replace them in minutes with a part that costs a few bucks.
At the end of the day, reliability matters way, way more than bumping your power transmission efficiency from 98% to 99%. And it's really, really hard to beat the reliability of a dumb chunk of metal like a spur gear.
Are you crazy? When would you ever need to use gears to drive a load?
wtf is your name and how do i do it
I'm guessing this is mostly for low load applications, I can't exactly see this being used for large machines. I'm curious what's it like to make a clock with these.
Commercial units do 160Nm @ 8,000 rpm - ruclips.net/video/AzZwyj650QI/видео.html
@@neo-dyne322 That shit is loud.
@@skyboyrsd I think that is just the motor
With some gear reduction, there could be a few heavyweight applications for this.
this literally blew my mind & will blow the minds of the people that will get this recommended in the future
Thanks man, this is a demo, you should see the real gear boxes in action: ruclips.net/video/AzZwyj650QI/видео.html
No it wont
Well the future is now
im from future
I think it's interesting, and I dream of putting those on an eletric bicycle, but nothing blew.
There are seemingly endless possibilities for magnetic inventions. Cant wait to see what the future bring.
Now this is something I love to see in my recommended tab
Cool
This would be amazing for bicycle gearhub (IGH) or gearbox. A lot of folks do not like them because of noise and loses but this magnetic gears would fix that.
I think Effigear gearbox would be the easiest to modify for magnetic gears.
It could be, if I had the max dimensions for it, I could design a unit.
It actually would not be great for a bicycle. The magnets couldn't handle much torque. To increase the torque potential would take far more powerful magnets. This would create far too much weight. It would be a terrible application for this.
@@funkingitup1805 This is exactly what I was thinking when I saw this. This likely can't handle much torque, I doubt magnets would have more force to resist slipping than the friction of physically touching gears. Very interesting to watch nonetheless.
Edit: I've seen in other comments Neo-Dyne explaining that this is a demo unit and that the commercial ones can withstand 160 Nm or more.
@@neo-dyne322 You still have losses through the lorentz forces during magnetic interaction, no? I'd imagine the resistance is similar to back-emf in a PM electric motor
actually trying to think of a use for it 4 it..might be able to put more torque on gears if was housed nd pressurised in oil.so oil acts as buffer if magents need to touch under torque something like that..basiaclly my point is gears are designed for torque or timing this doesent do eather cool design just no real use 4 it...
Great idea and respect for the amount of work required to bring this to life. Good job 👍
very cool! where do you get those custom shaped magnets?
Hi Chris, most magnet manufacturers could wire cut magnets for you, like Zhaobao in Ningbo, China - talk to Daniel.
I like all of this, except the "No losses" part.
Really cool concept! Even if overloaded, the magnetically applied force will reduce the wear and tear on the gears. I'd like to see how far you can push this idea.
No depending on the torque load its more likely to damage the gears. The teeth are not properly meshed and don't have good bearing angles they would wear terribly if they mechanically meshed. The gears also can't be made out of ferromagnetic materials so they would either have to be made of plastic like this and be weak or be made out of exotic expensive materials like titanium. This means that under sudden torque they are likely just to shear.
Very interesting, curious to see what future this tech has.
Well, this gear box was made for electric boats for example: ruclips.net/video/AzZwyj650QI/видео.html
Love the idea! I think that magnetic fields running through each other will cause some heat, and im also curious about what the gears would do under a moderate to heavy load.
Alloy units (ruclips.net/video/AzZwyj650QI/видео.html ) would do 160 - 1,200Nm as standard, exchange ratio up to the client. Lifetime 50 years, and every year you save oil, spare parts and gain some efficiency. So far they stay cold
The funny thing is that the video itself is a super high quality production.
"No noise"
Video editor: "whatever you want mate"
Here's one of the same contraption WITH audio track sorry for the weird intro ruclips.net/video/BsIa_LKojJI/видео.html
@@PutsOnSneakers nice
The "No losses" mentioned here refers to the efficiency being very high when compared to conventional motor driven gears
Yes
And no-one died in the attack on congress earlier this week.
"No-one died" refers to the very low death rate relative to the holocaust and the coronavirus pandemic.
That would be true, if not for the fact that their rig has NO LOAD. You cannot test for efficiency with no load. the second you have any resistance, those magnets will be useless and the gears will make contact. Or there will be slippage.
This is a scam.
COOL IDEA! The magnets at that size probably has a low load capability but this scales up well well.
This is amazing. It is impossible to have no losses though.
Yeah, Frictionless doesn't mean totsl loss-less. Some testing and some numbers would be nice
@@Bungaroosh yeah it's funny because he has absolutely no information on his website either. I really like the concept, but he's making claims that obviously aren't true.
Air has friction
It's not amazing at all. wtf are you smoking?
No friction ... No noise... No torque!! Truly amazing what the human mind can do.
thats really cool!
But magnetism does cause resistance along with air. awesome work on reducing!
Try to give it load (in other word, put it in actual working machine, then let that machine to it's work), and check if it's still friction free.
commercial units do 160Nm @ 8,000 rpm - ruclips.net/video/AzZwyj650QI/видео.html - friction free 99% (except the bearings)
"All power is transmitted without loss" Impossible. There is always loss in a system.
I think this gonna be very useful in gearboxes while you shift gear, literally no friction moving sideways.
I wonder how cool it would look as an holographic clock
Also same, it showed up here even though the video is 2 years old
Well, let's make one:) I can do the transmission if you can provide the rest.
I have no idea how i got here
but that's rad af
this is excellent. As a result of this demo, several ideas for the innovation of renewable energies can come out
"no vibration"
the whole thing vibrating.
I could see something like this being very useful in something like... A clock.
hows that useful?
Maybe if you had it run in insanely high speeds, you could compensate for the torque maybe? But honestly idk wtf engineers gonna use it in lol
the removal of friction is the real winner in this, the implications are huge if it can be used to replace oil in mechanical devices and other moving parts in contact.
Loss or No Loss, It's a fking amazing concept. Extremely poggers.
Video message: "No losses!"
Me: coughing loudly!
Physics has been innovative like never before...
So I assume this was definetly not designed for least backlash?
Hi Cosmin, this is a good question. Usually the term "backlash" is associated with mechanical cogs. These magnetic cogs work in levitation and lock in the air. This is a demo unit to help to see better, however commercial units are tighter, more compact. Here's a demo movie, a try to create backlash: ruclips.net/video/q-W-AbG4Ruw/видео.html
@@neo-dyne322 you done any prototypes that are more like a Helical gear?
is this video without audio ? why the hell would yo claim "no noise" when there's no audio at all on the video ??
I can see massive uses for this. Thank you for this innovation. Let's see how to bring this to the railway industry.
That looks amazing...Will there be a bicycle available with that soon ?
Hi Android, yes , I hope, I got the gear but not the budget:)
@@neo-dyne322 try selling it to BMW or another big company ...they make high quality bikes ..
But be extremely careful ..
Gates belt drive is better system.
@@zakaroonetwork777 What is the advantage of a belt drive compared to this magnetic gear system?
"without losses" - I doubt that
True, because some of that energy is lost in other forms of energy such as pushing the air thats around the contraption, energy into heat transferal, and so on.
I mean I THE LORD teach humans this but humans still want to come up with youtube videos claiming BS lmao
Mechanical loss at the gears isn’t *because* *of* *the* gears, it’s from *turning* the gears. It doesn’t matter how the gears work or are arranged(unless they’re slipping) it’s not going to reduce or increase loss.
Interesting. Definitely, more expensive than machined gears. Rare earth magnets are not cheap. If electromagnets are used, there will be a continuous energy cost, and carbon footprint. How much load can it take? How robust are they if the teeth touch? How will extra weight affect them? What applications are these lightweight gears intended?
You could still use electromagnets for the purpose of making a really quiet machine.
Would like to see this thing actually do something though to see if it works at all
You can use solar energy as energy source for the electricity of the electromagnets.
And, you can make permanent magnets.
Wow, have you done calculations on the efficiency of energy transfer for these gears? I can already think of hundreds of ways to use these
Hi QP, yes I have a chart with different values, if you have any applications then please let me know - tech@neo-dyne.com
Amazing. Would love to see real world applications, like in a clock (or watch), bicycle sprockets, chainsaws etc.
Do you have any proof that this is even as efficient as gears? Gears are very efficient as it is, and I can imagine this would produce large eddy currents in the magnets which would suck alot of the power away.
That is somehow the most beautiful thing I have ever seen, I mean besides some of the insta-girls I follow.
Thanks man
simp
I never knew you can inter-lock a magnet in mid-air. That's cool.
and what happens when the orientation of those magnets shift due to the magnetic flux?
It is creating it's own field. Magnetic FLUX should have no effect. Helicopters have Flux valves for navigation., It has no effect.
Ciao! May I ask how is the polarity on the magnets? I would be really interested. Did you write some paper on it?
Hi Andrea, there are multiple poles, and the magnets levitate - will explain in more details after the patent application is approved.
ok so gotta use this to work on a perpetual motion generator ive been working on. solving how to eliminate friction energy lose was a pain. i knew magnets would be the answer, but this is perfect!
THIS IS REVOLUTIONARY
Thanks!
It wasn't no noise, it was just muted.
Yes, dogs barking outside. Took the sound off. Gears however are quiet, you just hear the drive unit like in this movie: ruclips.net/video/AzZwyj650QI/видео.html
The lack of magnets is probably the reason why this isn't going commercial yet
It does not have practical or commercial value. Comparing with cheap belt and pulley system. Unless you stick Apple or Tesla logo on it and sell it as a unpractical novelty.
There must always be some gear-to-gear power loss. A magnetic interface might (or might not) be more efficient than a mechanical interface (even in a vacuum, even spinning on a magnetic bearing, etc), but it cannot ever be lossless.
Rotating magnetic fields turn power into electrical fields, along with electrical losses vs induction effects, imperfect insulators, etc.
Manufacturing costs for magnetically-oriented parts would be higher than for ordinary metal parts.
Sudden starts or stops would cause the gears to collide possibly grind, and this might be catastrophic under load.
WOW, no noise, no friction, no wear, no heat,no resistance, Amazing
Finally. I've been wondering when I'd see this sort of tech for like ten years. Seems like an obv way to use less lube
Yes. Here’s one with sound: ruclips.net/video/e1jO7gbWqXw/видео.html. Alloy units (ruclips.net/video/AzZwyj650QI/видео.html ) would do 160 - 1,200Nm as standard, exchange ratio up to the client. Lifetime 50 years, and every year you save oil, spare parts and gain some efficiency.
Impractical. Permanent magnets lose their magnetic properties within weeks when fixed into a repelling configuration.
It is crazy how you have replied to every individual to clarify losses !
but an interesting thing this is !
am sure this would be better way to propel a wheel !
I get how he said, “no losses”, but it’s likely damn close. Not the best choice of words, but give the dude a break. It’s a idea/concept. Some thrive, some are just cool/impractical. Also, I think a really interesting characteristic is it’s ability to cushion impacts. Imagine this used in a racecar transmission. On heavy launches or shifts it could help reduce the internal shear and normal stress on parts. Good work brother! Keep perfecting!
excellent work,but it would be nice if you make a side by side comparison of the magnetic heat with a gear that looks exactly like the one in the video sans the magnets .
Jesus Christ why is everyone hating you in the comments? Your design is amazing!
Thanks man - I think what these guys want to see is a real application. So I am going to make an electro-magnetic boat! Then when I'm cruising down a river they can see it really works.
@@neo-dyne322 woow that would be so cool! I hope it works
Machine from future. I hope john titor see this
Grat job bro
Folks, PLEASE remember that these toys are nothing more than minuscule curiosities which can only work when they are small and low mass in relation to the magnetic forces imposed by those magnets. That air gap between gear teeth will be reduced to zero and then start grinding on whatever was on the other side of those air gaps the moment the gear itself requires any sort of real torque to drive it (or worse, get it started from a cold stop). If you're thinking that ANYTHING like this stuff is going to be incorporated into real-world tools and mechanisms, you are very sadly mistaken.
This is a game changer. Using magnets in gears might just prove to be more efficient and may dramatically decrease the power consumption and reduce repair costs in the long run. Downside? Higher manufacturing costs leading to increased price of the equipment in which it is used also may render unusable in products using metals gears, especially like high tensile materials containing ferromagnetic substances like steel due to its self magnetization properties of said materials. That means, it could be unusable in automobiles, in which these systems are most required as they consume fossil fuels (Exception: Electric Vehicles.) This technology is a practically usable one if used in the conjunction with diamagnetic or non magnetic materials or until a non-magnetic and cheap substitute of steel gears are available. Still, it is an ingenious invention and has the potential to be big.
Id love to buy some of those Magnets.. be a fun kit to play with
That's a new way to prevent the gear teeth from breaking down.
Alloy units (ruclips.net/video/AzZwyj650QI/видео.html ) would do 160 - 1,200Nm as standard, exchange ratio up to the client. Lifetime 50 years, and every year you save oil, spare parts and gain some efficiency.
You're going to lose some to eddy currents, which will become more and more of a problem at higher speeds, but this is very nice as a practically zero-maintenance solution and you have the added benefit of no shear losses from the lubricant.
The magnets will lose their power over time.
claims aside, this feels like a huge step forward in making large-scale gears last longer, even if it's not exactly cheaper up front.
This would be able to transmit a tiny fraction of the torque that classic steel gears would be able to for the same building space, so no, I really don't think so. Only for very specific applications perhaps.
You are gonna change the world one day
Thanks man
This is a very clever solution to gear friction. What is the measured back emf load?
Super idea sir it reduces the frictional losses
"All power is transmitted to the propeller without losses"
*NO!*
Losses due to eddy currents, friction from the motors, and heat, etc! Not all power is transmitted to the propeller! Plus there is loss created as the gears turn from magnetic attraction and repulsion, cogging, as well as the moving air produced by rotating gears are all losses. All that being said, it is a cool demonstration of a magnetic gear drive...👍
lol guy who made the video doesn't know the basics of magnets. but the team who made it hats off.
I could see this being useful as a sort of shock absorbing gear
This is good in use for mechanisms that receive impacts because the teeth doesn't hit each other and is floating so it will behave like a suspension. It can also utilize the magnets to drive another gear adjacent to it but is seperetated by a thin wall. it can also be used as a natural clutch as it will disengage if it exceeds the limit of the gear.But It's hard to use if what you need is high torque, as it will probably overcome the magnetic force. It also feels like it's hard to miniaturize or produce a smaller gear set. Also having a gear train with this is hard as other magnets might interfere with the gear from the adjacent gear. Still, its a good concept and design, utlizing magnets to drive another gear. I think it will be a good use for a brush cutter so if it hit a metal pole or a rock the blade wil stop even though the engine is still running.
Yes, miniaturizing and oversizing have their limits. But having said that, there are some practical products being made. Alloy units (ruclips.net/video/AzZwyj650QI/видео.html ) would do 160 - 1,200Nm as standard, exchange ratio up to the client. Lifetime 50 years, and every year you save oil, spare parts and gain some efficiency.
Good idea 👍 no friction, no oiling, no over heating. Amazing.