James never really graduated, in fact he left school when things became threathening: *"If you remember when Lily, James and co. were at school, the first war was raging. It never reached the heights that the second war reached, because the Ministry was never infiltrated to that extend but it was a very bad time, the same disappearances, the same deaths. So that’s what they did, they left school."* Of course when something is threathening your life, you would actively fight against it, people call James heroic for fighting against something that threathens them.
My question is if everyone including Harry knew how bad Voldy Moldy did and was willing to go, then how come nobody believed that he wouldn't scoop so low as to use a student to kill Dumbledore or anyone else?
He never did though, we were just told that he changed, by his *TWO BEST FRIENDS* who would lie for him, we were never shown of any real change. And he never tried to atone for the bullying that he did.
Exactly. It’s always bothered me how people can hate James, but also love Draco and Snape. Especially since Draco and James are cut from the same cloth.
@@konuralpyldzkan1495 And here is the most used justification for Draco’s behavior. Daddy issues. If somebody has a bad father, then all their crimes are forgiven. Besides, it’s not like Lucius was abusive to Draco. He and his wife spoiled their son. Also, if that justifies Draco’s behavior, the it justifies James’ behavior. James also was spoiled by his parents. Both of them were bullies during their school days, and both of them grew out of that behavior as adults. People need to stop vilifying one of them and cherishing the other.
@Joe This is the exact reason why I love Draco and James more than Snape. Yes, he did save Harry on multiple times, but he bullied students as an adult. James and Draco at least was bullying people the same age as them and was children tthemselves.
@@Joe-ik1ph this is not a justification. i didn't forgive draco for what he has done. i am just saying that draco and james are exactly the same is not true. even their behaviours as bullies are titally different.
Tbh, the difference is that we get to see the change in other characters, plus we see them in actions, whereas we're just told about James, but never see him do anything, though we do see him giving Harry good advice and being a good paternal figure.
Exactly. And we are told by his friends which doesn't give it much credibility ... He really does sound like an awful guy in the books. People always say to Harry what a great quidditch player he was, what a good duelist he was. It is never about his character.
@@akina4126 he doesn't sounds so awful. I see him as similar to the weasley twins but up to eleven because, at that time, the rivalry between slytherin and giffindor was way worse. we are always told, specially from snape's point of view/memories, how horrible James was but almost never about how much lily had to cover from snape's horrible behavior towards her and other muggleborns. Snape even invented lethal curses while being a student. we praise him for that acomplishment but that's the behavior of a socipath. James... sure. he pranked a lot and he may have gone a bit over the top sometimes but he was never a bully or awful. it was snape the one that insulted and betrayed Lily. his first friend despite all the chances she gave him. it was James the one that became suportive of Lily and earned her trust and love. and you say he was awful? hell no. he wasn't even half as bad as draco even when he was at his worst. remember. fun fact, James saved Severus life and it's mentioned, I'm not sure by who, that Snape never forgave him for that. since when an awful bully does that? since when the bullied doesn't forgive the one that saved his life? let me tell you why. Severus wanted to be harmed so dumbledore would be forced to expell remus. I could half understand if severus wanted james expelled but Remus did nothing against him. it was just to harm James and Sirius by proxy. but Snape's behavior is rarely mentioned whenever James being a bully is claimed. sorry to say but James was far from awful. he was immature, skilled and a prankster but not awful. he did everything for his friends even at his own risk. Snape was fine with the death eaters killing everybody and more so long as they spared Lily. and only helped Harry after being forced by Dumbledore.
Had this chat with a friend how Harry is always saying "My dad didn't_____" "My dad wasn't_______" and whatnot, whenever someone would talk sh!t about James. *kid you didn't even know what your dad was like you only heard what people told you...*
@@jenniflower6569 well... other than snivelus, the dork lard, his minions and the turdsley, everybody agrees that James was a respectable man. and, it's evident that some people has told evident lies about James. like petunia turdsley claiming james was a jobless drunkard that died in a car accident and lily was a wh*re. one thing harry knows for sure about James and Lily, they sacrificed their lives to save him (and saved him again, as ghosts, after the triwizard). he also learned (thanks to a pensieve) that Snivelus was a childhood friend of Lily but insulted her and her friends. he also has a few moving pictures of his parents and has undeniable proof that James, at the very least, helped create the marauder's map. so, while I agree that Harry can't remember how James was, he knows quite a few things that weren't told. they were proven.
@@WilliamWizeroh...stop man...Snape was not as good as people assume but James was no less. He protected Snape only to protect him and his friends from getting expelled at the least. As no one knows that remus was a warewolf except Dumbledore and it would have caused Dumbledore his post and them their further education and their wands could have been taken forever just like Hagrid. And it was sirius only who told Snape where to find remus. Snape was into dark arts but not till 5th year...He never got pranked it was bullying...n he found only one way to protect him n that was dark arts. It was wrong of him ,very wrong of him to say harsh words to lily...but he was being embarrassed in front of her and the last thing anyone would want is to be insulted in front of their friends/crush n in that embarrassment or whatever he said those words n he regretted n got his fair share of karma by loosing his only friend. Snape was a bully n James n sirius got a big role in that....even remus and serius said that James used to go behind Lily's back to pick a fight with Snape. Snape was no good but don't tell me that James was any less....you have a change of heart doesn't make up for the things you have done in the past... Snape just got 1 point more than James coz he comes from a broken and poor family,he was bullied just because he was in a certain house and liked a girl of different house ,lost his only friend to his bully ,that is enough to send a person to a path beyond limits either good or bad.. Draco was a child in front of them.😂😂😂he was only a big mouth never had the guts. Enough of James...😂😂 Snape was a sneaky bastard to bully Neville and other kids....but I think that he was maxed out biased teacher...helping his house kids.. Say whatever u want to about anyone Snape,dumbledore,Draco ,sirius ...James stand tall for me 😂😂 in terms of bullying...if iam writing this I also should went out my feelings for sirius as I might get busy n may not be able to reply. In the movies,in the books I never found a single moment to like this guy. If you do please do tell me😂
Not to mention James was a rich pureblood but still accepted people who were different like Remus, took Sirius in when he had nowhere else to go and stood up against the real world equivalent of racists. I mean really when did bullying the racist kid become so controversial
@@JoaodaSilvaeSouza yeah, and even still he didn't treat them badly either, like he just liked Lily from at least fifth year and was genuine about it for the most part, even writing her initials on his exam papers (before scribbling them out when the teacher walked by), like yeah he was bad about the snape incident but he clearly did something to make Lily consider him (also could be mentioned that Snape used his cutting spell with wordless magic so it's not like he wasn't willing to play dirty)
@@swiftlyaswiftieIt's controversial because the only "supposedly" racist kid he bullied is Snape, while the other person he bullied, *Bertram Aubrey,* isn't really a Death Eater. He accepted Remus and Sirius because they are Gryffindors, when did he exactly accepted outcasts from Ravenclaw or Hufflepuff? Ah yes, Snape is obsessed with Lily, but you can literally see he never scribbled Lily's name on his book in half blood prince book when Harry got a hold of it, but James scribbling Lily's name is not obsessive.
@@hynankublai2013Snape wasnt in love he was obsessed because you dont yell slurs at your crushes when they try to help you. We dont know much about who else did james hang out w except for the maraduers but we know Snape was a deatheater and hung out with most of them e.g. Mulciber Barty, Rosier, Malfoy ect. And we dont know the exact reason they threw a curse at bertram couldve been a simple joke or a prank.
@@janalerotic4266 nah he was embarrassed and his manliness was at stake and getting saved by your crush in that situation is embarrassing and it slipped up
@@diamonshade7484 you still dont call them a slur yeah sure you were mad and emberassed but that gives you no right to insult someone who tried to help you
I agree that James did change, probably influenced by Lily and his own maturity. And he sacrificed a lot, eventually giving his life. That’s the ultimate sacrifice. But, the harmful psychological effect of being bullied cannot be understated. I doubt that the one scene we saw was the only time that James bullied Snape and I'm sure Snape was no angel. But just because it was a long time ago and James ultimately changed doesn't excuse or undo the emotional harm that being bullied had on Snape. As an adult, James looking back on things would have viewed the bullying as an issue of "Well, that was years ago and we were all just kids playing around back then. That’s what kids do.” To Snape it probably caused lifelong emotional damage. Snape had to learn to live with this damage and the effect it had on him. Of course, I know that these are all made-up characters in a story, but in real life the psychological damage of bullying is very real and has, for many years, been minimalized by people, especially the ones doing the bullying.
@@SCGMLBit's also worse than that as people forget James NEVER changed and apologised even after school. Wasn't even neutral. We know this when Harry was angry at sirius and lupin after looking at snapes memory and lupin said "Oh well Snape was a special case. That continued even after but its not like he was cursing Snape in front of Lily on dates.'
Everything great Dumbledore did? Dumbledore used and manipulated everyone, including and worst of all Harry. He groomed Harry for the sole purpose of using him to defeat Voldemort. Dumbledore knew about the Horcruxes since the beginning. He knew what Harry was. Yet groomed and trained him for 6 yrs , never telling him the truth because he knew on the end Harry was the better man. He even allowed Sirius Black to rot in Azkaban for 13 yrs to accompmish his plan. He constantly put students, and staff in danger, and refused to step up when needed most because of his self doubts about himself. Its amazing because of the way Rowling frames the character, that fans think Dumbledore is a good man. And the Fantastic Beasts movies do a shit poor job of showing him too. His Brother said it best " Ever notice the people my brother loved were always the ones hurt the most?".
I personally disagree. I don’t forgive James, but do forgive Snape and Draco. Like many said here, Draco was brainwashed into his blood purity kind of thinking. Tbh, I think if Harry joined Slytherin, they would be great friends. He really only started bullying Harry because Harry stood up for Ron and publicly humiliated him. Snape is forgiven solely based on his last actions. He died so Harry could proceed with Dumbledores plan. Beyond that, if he was a coward, he could’ve sold Draco out telling Voldemort Draco was the owner of the Elder Wand. But I think beyond the plan, Snape had compassion for Draco and died to protect both Harry & Draco as well as the rest of the world. That is extremely selfless. James on the other hand, while I see your point, was not someone who would’ve changed without Lilly. He’s just lucky he had Lilly to reign in the craziness. Snapes adjectives to describe him are pretty accurate. I have respect that he died trying to protect his son. But tbh, unless I hear other convincing arguments, I don’t forgive James.
Since you keep banging on about how there is nothing likeable about James Potter, why don't we have a look: - he befriended people who were considered 'outcasts' - he became an animagus at a very young age in order to support Remus Lupin during his monthly transformations after finding out the latter was a werewolf (rather than abandoning Remus like most people would have) - he saved his arch-nemesis Snape's life (and at great risk to his own life) after a prank by one of his friends (a prank that James had no part in) - he stood up for his friends and other people who were cruelly treated by aspiring-Death Eaters like Snape - he gave Sirius Black a home to stay in after the latter ran away from his abusive family - he used his wealth to financially support Remus Lupin (who couldn't find a job due to anti-werewolf laws) - he strongly disagreed with the concept of blood purity (despite being a pure-blood himself) and was disgusted with any prejudice towards Muggle-borns and did not hold prejudice towards half-breeds (such as Remus Lupin or Rubeus Hagrid, who were two of his dearest friends) - he joined the Order and took part in battles against Death Eaters and other dark forces and surviving until the end of the war (he and Lily even personally faced Voldemort three times) - he was willing to sacrifice himself for his wife and son, as demonstrated when he told Lily to take Harry and run while he held off Voldemort, proving himself to be a true Gryffindor. This is something that a gullible Snape apologist like you refuses to understand.
@@paulyb7267 sorry that I think Snape’s sacrifice was greater and life was a lot harder for Snape. I’m not excusing some of Snape’s bad actions, but clearly his actions helped save the world. Also a few red herrings in your argument, if Snape and Lilly were married, don’t you think he would’ve sacrificed his life for his wife and child? Forget Snape in that example for a minute. If someone came in and was trying to murder my wife and child, I would absolutely do the same thing. The action is noble, but not something anyone else would do. Honestly, most of the points you’re making seem to me that the general public would make. I’m not saying James isn’t a compelling character. He just seems like he a great friend to those close to him, but an absolute jerk to anyone else. Maybe he changed as he got older, but from everything I’ve seen, at worst he’s not a great person. At best, he does stuff that most other Gryffindors would do. Maybe the new TV show will help round out some of the older characters and I can actually get a better sense of who he was and what he did. But you’re probably on the cancel the show train guessing from the absolute triggering that was your comment based on a fantasy series.
@@Narm758First, James would have sacrifice himself to save his wife and son even of he hadn't marry Lily. Plus, Lily didn't love Snape because he was a horrible person (at this time). Second, he used the privileges that he had to help the ones rejected by society. Even other Gryffindors would have rejected Lupin when they heard he was a werewolf. Third, he chose to fight against Voldemort. He didn't have to, Voldemort would have accepted him in his ranks, he chose to. It's something that Snape and Draco couldn't do because they were selfish. I understand that Draco was raised that way since his parents were already deatheaters, but Sirius, Regullus and Andromeda all decided to fight against Voldemort and they were from the same family. Andromeda is literally his AUNT, which proves that it isn't about education. You can't say that James only became a good person because of Lily because Snape was still friend with her when he turned towards dark magic. In conclusion, during his first years at Hogwarts, James Potter was as bad of a bully as Draco. Which isn't too surprising because their childhood were very similar (minus the racism). He was arrogant and selfish. But then he grew up. When he discovered that Remus was a werewolf, instead of rejecting him, he learnt increasingly advanced magic to support him. He realised that the world wasn't all pink and that there was a war outside. When he left Hogwarts with tones of money, a very good degree, a strong group of friends and a girlfriend, he could have done anything he wanted. But he chose to fight. He sacrificed everything, from his money to his life to fight against injustice. Let's not forget that he died at only 21. He used to be a bully, yes, but he grew up to become a selfless and brave man which is why Lily fell in love with him.
Not to mention snape was a bully as a teen as well! He hung around future death eaters, hexed and called muggleborns mudbloods, tried to tell Lily Remus' secret and laughed at Mary MacDonald being attacked, calling it a 'prank' when it's described by Lily as creepy and dark and whenever Lily tried to confront him on his behaviour he got mean, insulted her and essentially manipulated her saying stuff like "oh I thought you were my friend" when she brought up valid criticism
Being a Snapehead, I would agree with you at this point. But I think, Snape was a Slytherin and the basic quality of a Slytherin is to be cold, mean and extremely choosy. He didnt like James as a company, and thus went with other Slytherins, who convinced him the "Dark"magic as mere pranks... And that was what made him a bully in school... But I think his love or the so called "obsession" for Lily and his last straw for Harry in his most dark times, when his parents were not present to protect him, he deserves a round of applause from all Potterheads... Thank you.
@@sohinibanerjee4450 I personally do not like him but I don't care if you like him so what I'll say is what i hope is unbias but his prejudice against muggles was present before Hogwarts, with him belittling Petunia based on her being one
@@swiftlyaswiftieWhen did he bully anyone? People here are making things up when there's no evidence in the book that he bullied anyone. Lol when did he hexed muggleborns? It's unavoidable to hang around with them, there roommates! It's hipocritical of Lily to isolate him from his own roommates when she herself hangs around her own roommates. And it's not like he hangs around with them all time, Lily literally has to tell Snape about his roommates that he doesn't know. And the people who he *hangs around with* weren't really there to help him when he gets bullied. When a dark creature nearly kills you, ofcourse you will tell someone about it, your life is being threatened! Snape is only rebutting on Lily's bs on calling someone from his house "dark and creepy" when there's a creature much "darker and creepier" from Lily's house who by the way *nearly kills people* many times compared to the creepy people from Snape's house, and that is said by *Lupin himself.* Lol the part where he said *“…thought we were supposed to be friends?”* came before all of the things Lily said about Avery and Mulciber, he wasn't threatening her on it. And to be fair, Lily never really considered him as her friend, evident by her statement: *"None of my friends can understand why I even talk to you."* so there's nothing to threathen her about anyway.
@@hynankublai2013 Chapter Prince's Tale -"wouldn't spy on _you_ anyway, _you're_ a muggle" and "she's only a-" both lines said by snape to petunia showing an early prejudice against muggles before entering Hogwarts -he hangs around bad people who perform dark magic, if you're going to blame Remus for being complicit in the marauders then you sure as hell better for snape -Snape was controlling to Lily saying he won't "let her" do things (something she calls out) -"-to call me a mudblood? But you call everyone of my birth mudblood, Severus. Why should i be any different?" a direct quote from Lily to Severus, proving that he was, at the very least, a verbal bully saying a _slur_ to them. This is direct quotes from the books proving my point, not even getting into context clues of if he learned dark magic and made dark spells and hung around dark Wizards who did dark stuff while holding prejudice then he probably, at the very least, told them about his spells considering he wasn't shy about using them.
@@swiftlyaswiftie Lol you forgot that Snape is being abused by his own muggle father, so how can exactly he be not biased against them. And he *befriended Lily,* so it's not exactly like he views himself superior over them. Hangs out with people who perform dark magic, what about James? He uses hexes that can be considered as dark magic. James uses Levicorpus which is considered as dark magic. Lol the double standards. Lol show the full context, so we can judge it unbiasedly: *“Saved? Saved? You think he was playing the hero? He was saving his neck and his friends’ too! You’re not going to - I won’t let you - ”* What Snape is trying to say here is that Lily is downplaying his near death experience as was something his fault when Sirius instigated the whole thing. And she d*mn did when she believed rumors over him and when hearing about his near-death experience didn't even ask him if he was alright, some friend she is. Half-bloods are also mudblood, are you saying he is calling himself a slur too? Most of the people in his house are already prejudiced about him, what exactly can he do so he won't be bullied by his own house too? Lol proving your point, but what exactly did it prove, it doesn't support anything about him bullying anyone nor hexing anyone. What you just did was avoid what I said and literally add other things not related to the existing context.
Absolute rubbish. You know, comments like yours make me realize that perhaps it will be much better if there was a prequel centred around James Potter being the main/central character in a story about either the Potter family or the Marauders under James's POV. Maybe that way, it will shut up haters like you for good!
There are differences Draco was bullying people because he was racist, James was bullying people who practiced dark magic Snape was a bully even at his thirties, James stopped being a bully after he graduated school
@@ildimid9423 and Draco also matured after Hogwarts, and no, Practicing dark arts (or any sort of magic for that matter) is no excuse for James bullying Snape. if you think it is, then that explains why your messed up view on life as a whole tbh and snape definitely had a difficult past at home. doesnt excuse him from bullying, but James bullied because he finds it fun, James has 0 excuse, Snape does at least have something
@@ildimid9423 and i can almost guarantee you, if James had not bullied Snape the way he did, i'm 99.9999% sure Snape wouldnt have become the man that he eventually became. Yes Snape was a bully, but it was James' fault that he was
@@questrequested9171 I never said that Snape practicing dark arts excuses James, I’m just talking about the motives The thing is that James actually changed, when Snape at his age still bullies kids to some extreme point (remember Neville)
@@questrequested9171 it’s not James’s fault that Snape is a bully. Even if it applies to Harry, it doesn’t apply to anyone else. He’s being sadistic sometimes to people who never harmed him (again, remember how poisoned Neville’s frog, who would die, if it wasn’t for Hermione’s help)
Most bullies grow up to be decent people in the end, but the damage they inflicted on less fortunate kids while teenagers leave deep scars. Fortunately, these scars help sometimes. The bullied become deeper and more sympathetic to suffering. Some of them... Others become vengeful, cautious, and cold...
i dont agree.. people who suffer from bullying either give in or be like harry. snape gave in. harry was bullied too... by snape, draco and his idotic friends... but harry wasn't like snape. snape cant be defended by your point.
“Fortunately, these scars help sometimes” So bullies are necessary evil? Lol 😂 Ppl can be sympathetic & kind even without being tormented. Sick logic 🤢
@@enterokinaz. They are Gryffindors, who would Harry would have inherited his bravery and will to fight, they just went to hiding when the Prophesy was made
Yes, he had. Leaving the country like almost every muggle-born family did during the fist Wizarding war. Moreover, is not the best choice bringing your wife into the Order and put her in more danger. So your point is pointless
Hmm. Wasn’t Draco and Snape’s form of bullying verbal? I understand any form is bad but James used force to humiliate Snape, Sirius nearly got him killed by the whomping Willow. And if we remove the Mudblood word (racism is never ok) didn’t their adversaries also hurl insults etc. Bullying is bad whoever does it. But while James grew into a decent man it was said Snape was a “special case” he didn’t apologise, didn’t seem to have regrets. These characters are mostly grey, good and bad as most people are.
Remus never tried to kill Snape Sirius was an idiot and thought it would've been funny to lead Snape to the Shrieking Shack while Remus was transformed
Verbal? Remember when Draco stomped on Harry’s nose on the hogwarts express and left him there? And snape was actually a death eater at one point and probably murdered many people. James never did that. Snape also created sectumsempra.
First of all, I think that Draco Malfoy has the weakest "redemption arc" in all of literature. Second of all, the difference between James and Snape is that we _see_ Snape's, but we only _hear_ about the redemption arc of James Potter. For all we know, he could have just been a jerk who made the right decision.
Draco wasn't supposed to have a big redemption arc, so it's not weak at all, because that wasn't the point. Draco is an example of a bully that seems like he can change, but he'll always be a bully. Not everyone can change.
@@dannyjorde2677 Agreed. My comment was more aimed at the people who wax poetic about his redemption and how was The Boy Who Had No Choice. Everywhere in the book, the entire point is that you _do_ have a choice. As manipulative as Dumbledore could be, he always gave people a choice. It is fair to argue that once Draco saw up close and personal how bad the Death Eaters were that he didn't really want to go that far, but he went along far more often than not.
I agree with you. I never thought Malfoy was a good person even after his weak redemption arc. In my eyes, he is always going to be a bully. Same with Dudley.
James messed up. He might just as well been envious of Voldemort. Also his wife was muggle born. She would have been in danger, especially if Voldemort would have won. Also, I suspect he made more than 1 Death Eater an enemy so that means that Voldemort would have been hostile to him too. If Voldemort would have won the Death Eaters, which James made enemies of early on, would have been capable of attacking and even killing him with no consequences, maybe even taking his fortune. There was nothing selfless about him.
You know what your problem is, *you hate how successful James is,* so you use whatever flaws that James has (such as being a bully) in order to bring him down and downplay his selflessness. You did it with Rowling (regarding her transgender comments) and you're doing it with James.
@@geordineilson5476 It does if he had to do those things in order to maintain his cover so he could do the good things at the end. Doesn't make Teen Snape any better, but we do see his complete redemption arc.
People keep on mentioning other victims, but I honestly do not see any evidence of any other victims. We only have a mention of Snape. And he was a known , death, eater, sympathiser, and he gave as good as he got, because if you read the books, Snape actually physically caused harm to James. Yes, it was in retaliation for James but he only became even more cruel after Snape said the slur to Lily
@@wvu05he treated Harry like trash from day one he wasn’t maintaining anything he also caused neville be afraid of him that was still before Voldemorts return not to mention he didn’t care if James AND BABY Harry got killed by Voldemort
Just because James protected the people he cared about does not negate him being a shitstain of a person. Those are completely mutual exclusive ideas that coexist beside each other. Draco mellowed out over time when he realized he was on the wrong side. Snape turned double agent because of Lily, but stayed in that position even after her death when he could’ve easily gone to either side, which saved countless lives besides just Harry time and time again. James isn’t even close to those arcs. He still would have been a bully had he lived. Instead, he became a martyr and rallying point for the cause along with Lily.
Absolute rubbish. You know, comments like yours make me realize that perhaps it will be much better if there was a prequel centred around James Potter being the main/central character in a story about either the Potter family or the Marauders under James's POV. Maybe that way, it will shut up haters like you for good!
@@paulyb7267 Look. If you want to deify an abusive person just because they’re dead, go for it. I don’t have to 🤷♂️🤷♂️ Since you brought up the Marauders however, let’s compare him to his closest companions. Peter gave him up to be spared, Sirius and Remus still chose to talk mad shit about Snape despite knowing he was working as a double agent for Dumbledore, 20~ years on. Call it rubbish all you want, mate. But just because someone else’s opinion gets you all up in your feelies doesn’t make that opinion wrong. If you’d like a more comprehensive list and analysis of shitty people becoming slightly less/very specifically less shitty when it directly effects them, please see every single conservative politician ever in the history of the world. 🤦♂️🤦♂️
@@theycallmejodamo First of all, James was not abusive. He wasn't some sort of wife beater or child abuser like you want him to be in your own delusional fanfictions. You know who really is a child abuser, that's right, Snivellus Snape.
@@paulyb7267 A.) The fact that you call his victim the same thing he did speaks VOLUMES about your own character. B.) You can be abusive without being physical. The fact that your immediately went to spousal/child abuse, again, speaks volumes about you. C.) At the end of the day, every single one of them are fictional characters, so it doesn’t matter what their content of character is or isn’t, because they’re not real. D.) I don’t write fanfics, dear. I’ve published two full-length novels with original characters. What’s your excuse for the projection now?
James was active member of order of phoenix. He had no reason to join it at age of 19 he was rich and have everything he want,on the other hand snape even after turning older was with voldemort and he didn't stopped even after lily tried to stop him. And if not for Lily he wouldn't have done what he did. Snapes flaws are forgivable then james flaws are also forgiveable. Draco was better than both of them,i agree on that part because his family was supremacist so he was just result of thier upbringing.
Nah james never actually apologized to snape for the way he treated him and yet snape still took the responsibility of making sure his enemies kid survived bro even gave his life for him
And snape apologize for all he did during his teacher's year to his students ? I don't think so. James changed, snape not, that is the difference. And don't says me he's a Hero because he's not. He only decide to join the right sight because he was obsess by Lily. Remember, he demand to Voldemort to kill James and Harry but not Lily. Dumbledore himself called him pathetic. He wanted the death of a baby ! And the death of james. James nerver wanted the death of snape. He saved him. Also remember, during his school years snape was Friends with mulciber and Avery and they joked about mudbloods. He wasn't a good Guy.
would you apologize to your enemy in a war just because you were mean at school? that's BS. Snape never helped his enemies kid. Snape helped Lily's kid. Dumbledore had to manipulate him for that. Snape was in debted to Dumbledore for claiming snape was a spy working for him. if not for that, Snape would had been send to azkaban.
I agree with your assessment. But then again, irrespective of how much of a great person he truly became post his Hogwarts life, that still doesn't absolve him of his wrongdoings. He was an outright Bully. You talked about Draco Malfoy's bullying but Draco never Physically attacked anyone, while James would hex / jinx unsuspecting ppl purely out of boredom. It was James constant tormenting that forced Snape to seek out Lucius Malfoy and eventually join his band of budding Death Eaters. Had James not bullied Snape, there was a very real possibility that Snape would've never joined the Death Eaters.
@@abyuneend compare the leg locker or some weird curse to forcibly trying to strip people in public or making someone's head so swollen and painful that he got to be taken to hospital wing .
@@abyunee In the Start of Book-6, it was Harry who actively sought Draco and later on Draco catches Harry spying on him. So in a way Draco was justified in his actions. I agree with your point regarding the OOTP. Draco attacking Harry was totally uncalled for, but nonetheless, he got what he deserved.
Nah, he was a spoiled a hole who didn't do anything sitnificant. Yeah he joined the order but he still didn't do anything within it. Meanwhile Snape devoted his life and image to getting close to the dark lord securing his defeat l.
You saying James does nothing for the Order. So he never thwarted Voldemort three times then? You know what your problem is: you hate how James is so successful in life so you use whatever flaws he may have (such as being a bully) to bring him down. You did it with Rowling (with her transgender views) and you're doing it with James.
@@paulyb7267 I didn't even call out anyone for being an unforgivable bigot but here you are all by yourself telling me you are lol. Jk rowling is a POS and anyone who defends her is the same lol
@@bobosstroll9798Also, you're making up stupid and ridiculous reasons (that are not canon) as to why James would join the Order and fight Voldemort. Whether you like him or not, James was just as much of a brave, committed and vital Order member as Moody, the Longbottoms, Sirius, Rem heus, Kingsley, and the Prewetts. Grow up!
James get‘s betrayed by one of his best friends, dies trying to help his family and never get‘s to watch his son grow up. Also unlike the other two he isn’t prejudiced against muggle borns and doesn’t bully his STUDENTS for no reason
Yep. We see Snape and Malfoy have something of a redemption arc though the story isn’t told from their perspective. We don’t see that from James. We are told he “grew up” but that Snape was a “special case”. Whether it was possessiveness or personality flaw we don’t know because we never got more context.
Even though James changed, he left Snape behind means he has never been apologetic for his behaviour. Snape sacrifices himself for that kid whose father used to bully him Draco in the last stands for his mates even though he doesn't like many of them. It would be great if James took the initiative and fixed things
Rubbish, you're making up stupid and ridiculous reasons (that are not canon) as to why James would join the Order and fight Voldemort. Whether you like him or not, James was just as much of a brave, committed and vital Order member as Moody, the Longbottoms, Sirius, Remus, Kingsley, and the Prewetts. Grow up!
Absolute rubbish. You know, comments like yours make me realize that perhaps it will be much better if there was a prequel centred around James Potter being the main/central character in a story about either the Potter family or the Marauders under James's POV. Maybe that way, it will shut up haters like you for good.
Draco bullied because he lived in an oppressive household which taught him to look down on others who aren’t as well off or pure blood as he was. His father would ridicule him in public and forced him to join the death eaters and manipulated him into attempting to kill Dumbledore. James bullied because he was a better wizard than most others and he had friends to back him up. He had money, a girl, and a future, but still bullied Severus because he had a crush on lily. They both had redemption arcs. But James didn’t realize he was a bully and change. He just matured as we all do. Draco realized he was on the wrong side and defied not just his families wishes, but the wishes of some of the most powerful wizards in the world. Their arcs are not alike.
James was always a glory seeker (and literally the team's Seeker). He joined the Order of the Phoenix because he wanted to look good. He only joined after all his friends did. He couldn't NOT join then, and he didn't actually think Voldemort would kill him because he was so arrogant. Did James ever apologize to Snape? Did he really ever show that he changed? He loved his family, but so do a lot of horrible people, that doesn't mean he was a good guy. His best friend was Wormtail, so he obviously had characteristics that went with evil wizards. Lilly sacrificed herself for Harry, not James. If anyone can tell me one nice thing James did to people that weren't his close family and friends...I'll consider that he wasn't just a total jerk. Oh yeah...and he stole Snape's love of his life and made fun of him while doing it. And to say he was just 15...lots of bad people are in jail for life at 15. Malfoy had more of an excuse...James grew up in a rich, loving home.
You know what your problem is: you hate how James is so successful in life so you use whatever flaws he may have (such as being a bully) to bring him down. You did it with Rowling (with her transgender views) and you're doing it with James.
@@paulyb7267😆 I have a signed picture that I got from Rowling when I was 9 years old. I have always been on her side over the whole stupid cancelling thing of her. Just because I hate the character James, doesn't mean I don't like her. There is something seriously wrong with your brain that you instantly made that odd connection....
@@aaronmartin4611Because you're jealous and resentful of James just because he had everything that Snape didn't have. Also, you're making up stupid and ridiculous reasons (that are not canon) as to why James would join the Order and fight Voldemort. Whether you like him or not, James was just as much of a brave, committed and vital Order member as Moody, the Longbottoms, Sirius, Remus, Kingsley, and the Prewetts. Grow up!
@@paulyb7267 You're telling me to grow up...kid, you're the one getting this mad at me because I said I didn't like a character in a book. You haven't given me any example of James actually being a nice person...but your reaction is alarming. I honestly think you need some meds or something man lol I just said what I thought about a character in a book. Xanax? Lithium? Ask your doctor bro lol I've edited this twice because I'm not trying to be mean...I think you need help. Instead of giving me reasons why you disagreed that I didn't like James, you instead immediately starting personally attacking me. That's not normal behavior. I really hope you figure this out man, because you're going to have a tough life ahead if you don't change. Good luck to you.
@@aaronmartin4611Since you keep banging on about how there is nothing likeable about James Potter, why don't we have a look: - he befriended people who were considered 'outcasts' - he became an animagus at a very young age in order to support Remus Lupin during his monthly transformations after finding out the latter was a werewolf (rather than abandoning Remus like most people would have) - he saved his arch-nemesis Snape's life (and at great risk to his own life) after a prank by one of his friends (a prank that James had no part in) - he stood up for his friends and other people who were cruelly treated by aspiring-Death Eaters like Snape - he gave Sirius Black a home to stay in after the latter ran away from his abusive family - he used his wealth to financially support Remus Lupin (who couldn't find a job due to anti-werewolf laws) - he strongly disagreed with the concept of blood purity (despite being a pure-blood himself) and was disgusted with any prejudice towards Muggle-borns and did not hold prejudice towards half-breeds (such as Remus Lupin or Rubeus Hagrid, who were two of his dearest friends) - he joined the Order and took part in battles against Death Eaters and other dark forces and surviving until the end of the war (he and Lily even personally faced Voldemort three times) - he was willing to sacrifice himself for his wife and son, as demonstrated when he told Lily to take Harry and run while he held off Voldemort, proving himself to be a true Gryffindor. This is something that a gullible Snape apologist like you refuses to understand.
So just because you have money and belong to the unoppressed pure-blood status, not being a terrorist becomes a huge thing?? Snape dedicated almost 20 years of his life to the good cause. Draco had his moments of redemption....deliberately not recognizing Harry in DH was a huge risk etc. etc. On the other hand this brat sexually assaulted Snape publically for no reason. He deserves no love.
The only reason snape ever did anything "good" was for his own selfish reasons. He wanted lily spared, not because shes a wife and a mother, but because HE wanted her. Its not love, its an obsession. All he had to do was not be a racist asshole in school and he prolly could have gotten with her, but because his school crush didn't like him back he spends 20 years bullying and tormenting students. He wasnt fighting the good fight, he didnt know the plan until the very end, he just thought they were trying to keep harry alive for lilys sake. Snape was and always will be a peice of shit who deserves no sympathy
Absolute rubbish. You know, comments like yours make me realize that perhaps it will be much better if there was a prequel centred around James Potter being the main/central character in a story about either the Potter family or the Marauders under James's POV. Maybe that way, it will shut up haters like you for good.
James did the biggest character arc of them all , changing himself completely for the woman he loved and matured so much. Snape never got over Lily even after she was married to James. Draco was still never good and (in my opinion) never had a character arc so I agree
nah, anyone blaming james for snape turning death eater is bullshitting themselves, snape did it all on his own, not amount of bullying in school caused that
Since you keep banging on about how there is nothing likeable about James Potter, why don't we have a look: - he befriended people who were considered 'outcasts' - he became an animagus at a very young age in order to support Remus Lupin during his monthly transformations after finding out the latter was a werewolf (rather than abandoning Remus like most people would have) - he saved his arch-nemesis Snape's life (and at great risk to his own life) after a prank by one of his friends (a prank that James had no part in) - he stood up for his friends and other people who were cruelly treated by aspiring-Death Eaters like Snape - he gave Sirius Black a home to stay in after the latter ran away from his abusive family - he used his wealth to financially support Remus Lupin (who couldn't find a job due to anti-werewolf laws) - he strongly disagreed with the concept of blood purity (despite being a pure-blood himself) and was disgusted with any prejudice towards Muggle-borns and did not hold prejudice towards half-breeds (such as Remus Lupin or Rubeus Hagrid, who were two of his dearest friends) - he joined the Order and took part in battles against Death Eaters and other dark forces and surviving until the end of the war (he and Lily even personally faced Voldemort three times) - he was willing to sacrifice himself for his wife and son, as demonstrated when he told Lily to take Harry and run while he held off Voldemort, proving himself to be a true Gryffindor. This is something that a gullible Snape apologist like you refuses to understand.
@@marcopolo1472 Besides, Draco was never abused, in fact he was spoiled, coddled and given everything he wanted. Draco Malfoy sucks and the onlyy reason why people love and romanticize him is because Tom Felton is hot.
You know what your problem is: you hate how James is so successful in life so you use whatever flaws he may have (such as being a bully) to bring him down. You did it with Rowling (with her transgender views) and you're doing it with James.
It really annoys we how much people like Draco and Snape and say they are misunderstood and such when Snape was also a bully, I’m pretty sure in the books it mentions that he hexed muggleborns or his friends did, he helped and befriended death eaters and only tried to do the right thing after the one person he cared about died, he didn’t care that James died and wouldn’t have cared if Harry did, not to mention that even as an adult he still childishly bullied the son of his enemy. And as for Draco well he bullied Harry and all his friends as well as tried to kill or hurt Harry multiple times, he never even attempted to do anything thing good and just did what he could to weasel his way out of trouble. Lastly James bullied a kid who didn’t seem very nice anyways when he was 15 but in the end he dedicated his life to try and stop Voldemort, he took Lupin and Sirius in even though Lupin was a werewolf and Sirius had a horrible family. Yet James is the one people talk crap about
Absolute rubbish. You know, comments like yours make me realize that perhaps it will be much better if there was a prequel centred around James Potter being the main/central character in a story about either the Potter family or the Marauders under James's POV. Maybe that way, it will shut up haters like you for good!
@@bonk78624if the bully grows and matures into a better person that in it self is respectable it's only when he remains a bully even after growing up that we can say he deserves no respect. Because bullying = childishness really.
@@annduruibe625 Did he apologize to Snape for bullying him? Nope. He never did. Just because he's changed doesn't mean he's good. He hurt someone and never apologized. You know that people kill themselves because of being bullied... right? It messes people up. So... for your little two cents... completely unneeded because it paints that just because other people see him as this good guy doesn't excuse his behaviour of hurting another.
If he was punished for what he did and apologised to Snape, then I would agree with your statement. Being successful or doing good to the world does not give him a jail pass. If he is as great as we think, then he should try his best to fix his wrong doings.
Absolute rubbish. You know, comments like yours make me realize that perhaps it will be much better if there was a prequel centred around James Potter being the main/central character in a story about either the Potter family or the Marauders under James's POV. Maybe that way, it will shut up haters like you for good.
Snape and Draco were neglected and emotionally and Snape probably physically abused and chose the most inappropriate coping mechanisms. James was a well fed, loved and taken care child who became a bully - no excuse .... and unpopular opinion: I don't think the Order of the Phoenix was such a big deal; he didn't become an Auror who lived more dangerously. we don't even know what the order of the phoenix actually did during that time.
I will tell you what your real problem is: you hate how successful a person like James is in life, so you use whatever flaws that this successful person has in order to knock them down. You did it with Rowling (regarding transgender views) and your doing it with James. Also, Draco was never neglected or abused, in fact he was loved, spoiled, and well taken care of (just like James). The real reason why you are making excuses for Draco and romanticising him is because Tom Felton is hot, period!
@@paulyb7267 you made me chuckle and laugh out loud :D either you posted this on the wrong comment or your logical thinking skills are completely off. But as for Draco: yes, he was emotionally neglected by his father - he never paid any interest in him unless Lucius could use Draco against Dumbledore; this is a form of neglect and the opposite of love
@@xyincognito This is bullshit. Nowhere in the books is Lucius ever neglectful or abusive of Draco, in fact he gives Draco whatever he wants (including buying the whole Slytherin team new broomsticks and having Buckbeak executed for attacking his son). The only reason why your making all this up is because Tom Felton is hot.
1.)Snape had an abusive and unloved childhood I get it and certainly why he hated marauders is also justified but why he chose to be friends with death eaters instead of Lilly?who was her best friend and never judged him for who he was and he called her mudblood.Also lily always use to curse James unlike Snape yet he never insulted her and James got more mature in his 7th year and stopped bullying people unlike Snape who became a death eater. When he lost lily he still had a chance to become good as a professor yet he chose to bully children. 2.) Draco was a spoilt brat (fact) but he bullied people because his behaviour was justified by his parents and he got bad company no real friends who could stop him from doing this or make him realise it bas bad until he was mature enough to realise he was from the wrong side but he did not had the guts to go against voldemort or his family. 3.) Order of phoenix is a pretty big deal for 18 year old teenagers just out of Hogwarts to join a group where you have to fight against most dangerous and dark wizards with your life on stake just to save the wisarding world (not a big deal obviously) when you can obviously would have lived a pretty luxurious life.Not everybody is that brave and selfless to do that.
You know what your problem is: you hate how James is so successful in life so you use whatever flaws he may have (such as being a bully) to bring him down. You did it with Rowling (with her transgender views) and you're doing it with James.
Comments like yours make me realize that perhaps it will be much better if there was a prequel centred around James Potter being the main/central character in a story about either the Potter family or the Marauders under James's POV. Maybe that way, it will silence haters like you for good.
No. I'll still hate James. He was rich, only son, popular, bully. He was a bully for a whole 7 years before he "supposedly" changed . Severus was bully because he had a character to portray on the command of albums and to maintain his spy status. Severus was poor, abused, insecure as child and no one, not a single adult was there for him through his teenage years. He had nothing. Of course he would join Voldemort when that extremely charming and manipulative man was the first person to tell him that he is worthy, he promised Severus respect, glory and acceptance when the whole world turned away from him. James potter, Sirius black and their friends will always be bullies.
Snape only had a cover to maintain for the last 3 books the first 3 he was jerk for the hell of it and being abused and bullied doesn’t excuse that it makes it worse
nah but i still don't get how ppl actually think snape had a so called 'redemption arc' dude- maybe in the movies he did, or maybe ppl just love movie snape because of alan rickman- idk-- but in the books, snape was the biggest bully EVER- im not kidding- he was the most selfish character to ever exist, he switched sides only when he got to know that lily was in danger, he didn't actually care about anyone else other than lily, he begged dumbledore to save lily, when Dumbledore replied saying that snape was selfish and didn't even care about the boy-- snape was like 'yeah, save the kid too- or whatever' nah i seriously don't think snape deserves the love he's been getting-- also Draco too didn't have any strong sort of 'redemption' anyway, i do think james got his redemption arc very well when compared to snape and draco
@@user-eg7dz5ff5e bruh I've read the books- go read em... have you read it tho? because all the ppl who have actually read it share same views-- if you dont know sh*t dont go calling ppl on the internet kids u dont know me
Exactly Draco and Snape were mean horrible bully’s and only did the right thing for their own selfish reasons yet everyone talks shit about James for being a bully when he was 15 even though he dedicated his life to the downfall of Voldemort meanwhile Snape is besties with the death eaters
Right but see, Snape was a DEATH EATER when he made that request to Dumbledore. He was still a bad guy. So of course he's not gonna give a shit about Harry or James' life (side note, why should he even care about the life of someone who made his own life a living hell all those years?) Later in the chapter though we see that Snape did care for other people. He regrets not being able to save the lives of others ("how many people have you watched die?" "Lately, only those who I could not save") and is outraged that Dumbledore essentially raised Harry to die. Granted it's more out of love for Lily than Harry but Snape undeniably had a redemption arc, he died to save the Wizarding world.
I have a friend who is a victim of bullies, let say people change to be better, but the pain and trauma bullies inflicted on their victim will never fade, so is the guilt
Comments like yours make me realize that perhaps it will be much better if there was a prequel centred around James Potter being the main/central character in a story about either the Potter family or the Marauders under James's POV. Maybe that way, it will silence haters like you for good.
@@paulyb7267 I am not a hater, I am probably neutral in this subject since they are only fictional characters. It is a pretty complicate subject for me too, and I have been advicing my friend that people changed and that what they did as a child is because they are immature. But trying to understand my friend feeling that it does not matter they changed or not, it just feel unfair that despite the fact that the bullies are the one who made them miserable are now living happily and they supposed to live with the fact that they can't blame anyone and continue to suffer the trauma that never seem to fade. And my friend doesnt even blame that person anymore, she blame herseft for being too weak to deal with this world and because of that she can never be happy, just because some kids decided that they were bored. That was cruel. And for someone who was that cruel to be hail a hero really feel unfair. I just like the people to acknowledge this, just because you turn out fine now doesnt mean the pain you inflicted to other people in the past is gone. But people rarely say sorry or admit that they was cruel to something that happen like 10 years ago. In James situation, I would love to have a prequel centering that and show how much Jame redeem himself and tried to help Snape, admit his past wrongdoing and cruelness, but Snape just show his hateful and cold nature, revealing what made him the person he become in later year (Snape isnt a good person, he trully believe Muggle born to be inferior, look down on others, mean and cruel as opposed to Harry who has a good heart). To be clear, I dont hate James, but my friend does, she hates bullies overall. I liked Bakugo, but I dont mention it in front of her. I feel like because of some people past, they have a harder time forgiving bullies characters. And people going around justifying bullies action feel cruel to the victims. Say that they changed don't help either.
James, Sirius, and Draco grew up and fought against evil. Snape really didn’t change. He grew up became a big bully working for the greatest evil bully of all time and only turned away from evil when his boss killed the woman he loved. Yes at that point he did fight against Voldemort but continued being a bully to little kids. Draco and Sirius really are the two who grew up in the same situation. Both of them were pure bloods whose parents were blood purity fanatics. Sirius fought against that early on, from his meeting James on the train until his death. Draco started fighting against it when he realized Voldemort had given him a task he was meant to dying trying to do just to punish his father more. James was a bully which is wrong, but his bullying was focused on those who were cruel and used the dark arts. It doesn’t make it right. He never bullied someone just for being shy, or muggle born. He truly redeemed himself completely and was willing to die to protect people he didn’t even know.
Absolute rubbish. You know, comments like yours make me realize that perhaps it will be much better if there was a prequel centred around James Potter being the main/central character in a story about either the Potter family or the Marauders under James's POV. Maybe that way, it will shut up haters like you for good!
JK Rowling has recently admitted about how unnerved she is at the James Potter bashing. Rowling feels that James is more sympathetic than either Draco or Dudley.
Yet he never apologized to Snape, you can’t undo something with doing another good thing. It is like hitting your brother and helping your sister, does that erase what you did? No, once a bully always a bully. Snape was so traumatized by it that in POA he hated Lupin and Sirius still for what they done. Even bullies have good friends, the Marauders were just another extension of James’s bullying. We have to acknowledge that James is a pos.
Since you keep banging on about how there is nothing likeable about James Potter, why don't we have a look: - he befriended people who were considered 'outcasts' - he became an animagus at a very young age in order to support Remus Lupin during his monthly transformations after finding out the latter was a werewolf (rather than abandoning Remus like most people would have) - he saved his arch-nemesis Snape's life (and at great risk to his own life) after a prank by one of his friends (a prank that James had no part in) - he stood up for his friends and other people who were cruelly treated by aspiring-Death Eaters like Snape - he gave Sirius Black a home to stay in after the latter ran away from his abusive family - he used his wealth to financially support Remus Lupin (who couldn't find a job due to anti-werewolf laws) - he strongly disagreed with the concept of blood purity (despite being a pure-blood himself) and was disgusted with any prejudice towards Muggle-borns and did not hold prejudice towards half-breeds (such as Remus Lupin or Rubeus Hagrid, who were two of his dearest friends) - he joined the Order and took part in battles against Death Eaters and other dark forces and surviving until the end of the war (he and Lily even personally faced Voldemort three times) - he was willing to sacrifice himself for his wife and son, as demonstrated when he told Lily to take Harry and run while he held off Voldemort, proving himself to be a true Gryffindor. This is something that a gullible Snape apologist like you refuses to understand.
@@paulyb7267 James was very good to the people he chose to befriend. Not so much everyone else. Even saving Snape's life was trying to save his friend first and foremost. And while there was some risk, he could have easily switched to his Animagus form and been safe. Snape saved a lot of people he didn't even like and who never appreciated what he did for them in his lifetime. To me, that is far more noble.
Even Draco didn't sexually harrass people and he had some remorse 😂. He was a nasty bully , but James was on an entirely different level and Snape wasn't his only victim . Yes , he changed ... But doesn't mean I need to love him ; nor do I love Snape the child abuser. JK Rowling could write as much about a toxic person getting changed by love and becoming great , doesn't mean I need to accept that . If anything, I love Regulus Black more , who literally joined the dark side out of his own accord yet chose to die stealing a Horcrux ... when he was mere 16/17.
Absolute rubbish. You know, comments like yours make me realize that perhaps it will be much better if there was a prequel centred around James Potter being the main/central character in a story about either the Potter family or the Marauders under James's POV. Maybe that way, it will shut up haters like you for good!
@@paulyb7267 well... He was a gryffindor, it fits. I mean, gryffindor house is known to do the brave thing instead of the smart, sensible or ambitious thing
@@edmundprice5276 And here is why you are definitely wrong and why James was a true Gryffindor: *- He was brave:* Along with his wife, Lily, he repeatedly acted against Voldemort to such an extent that Trelawney’s prophecy specifically stated that they’d defied The Dark Lord three times. Then, when Voldemort did find them, James tried to hold him off so that Lily could escape with Harry. *- He was daring:* Take the way he and Sirius set themselves and Peter Pettigrew the task of becoming Animagi so they could accompany Lupin on his wolfish forays. True, Lupin called those little escapades ‘the best times of my life’, so it was clearly an act of support that meant a lot to him. But the fact this also required a lot of rebellion would’ve likely attracted James to the task too. Sirius, who was also no stranger to rebellion, later compared Harry to James (Sirius replied: The risk would’ve been what made it fun for James.’) - even though by Marauder standards, Harry was, comparatively, a lot more careful. A risk-taker with a dislike of authority and an appetite for troublemaking. Sounds like quite a few Gryffindors we know. *- He was chivalrous:* He considered it the greatest insult to mistrust his friends and stood up for Lily when Snape called her a mudblood. *- He was loyal:* His closest friends were those many people would turn away from. He also helped his friends more than anyone else in his friend group, giving Sirius a second home and financially supporting Remus. *- He was arrogant:* At least at age 15. The most popular boy in school, the most talented, and the Quidditch star. Of course James had a big head. The only other thing to say in mitigation is that James was certainly not the only Gryffindor whose bravery came with a healthy side-order of arrogance. Sirius was almost as bad; Dumbledore, in his youth, was arrogant enough to think he and Gellert Grindelwald might unite the Deathly Hallows and so conquer death; even Harry had, as Hermione called it, ‘a bit of a - saving-people thing…’ which often led him to ignore other people’s advice. *- He was reckless:* Another Gryffindor-esque trait Harry and his father shared was a tendency to act before thinking. Not as bad as Sirius, but James never thought about consequences. He just did what he wanted, the worst was running the grounds with a werewolf. Lupin said there were near misses. When Sirius told Harry James enjoyed taking risks, he said it with a sense of pride, but such actions usually come with consequences. A patronus/animagus (which we CANNOT choose) can only take the form of the animal that represents our true personality and inner traits. There is a reason why James's animagus and patronus took the form of a stag (a male deer); as the kings of the forest, stags are considered noble and they symbolize/represent *leadership, courage, pride, masculinity, nobility, power, freedom, purity (not unlike the unicorn), stamina, virility, grace, instincts, maturity, regeneration, and spiritual enlightenment.* Both James and Harry had these stag-like traits, and most of these stag traits were Gryffindor traits. You may not like him, but like his son, James certainly had lion-esque energy that flowed through to Harry.
He "selflessly" joined a secret society headed by the most powerful wizard alive against a foe that would of required him to kill his wife and child due to their "dirty" blood. He only "changed" when the world forced him to change.
Rubbish, you're making up stupid and ridiculous reasons (that are not canon) as to why James would join the Order and fight Voldemort. Whether you like him or not, James was just as much of a brave, committed and vital Order member as Moody, the Longbottoms, Sirius, Remus, Kingsley, and the Prewetts. Grow up!
Adult Snape=Teenaged James Both were huge bullies that tormented people for fun, had an unrequited love for Lily and opposed Voldemort Edit:well, fun/because they could
@@geordineilson5476 James hexed and SAd classmates. Just for fun! Severus would never do that! Yes both bullied, but James bullied cause of fun and Severus cause he had a trauma. James was more worse than Severus.
@@keinname9912 mental trauma from bullying is just as bad what James did, and Snape was the thing Neville feared most. Snape traumatised who knows how many students.
People who agree have not read the books. James was a bully who bullied and cursed many of his classmates just for fun! James SAd Severus! James tried to blackmail Lily into a date! And James never stopped bullying, nor did he ever apologize or regret it. He also made fun of Vernon when he first saw him! James never matured and just because he joined the Order doesn't mean he matured and became a good person.
Ok you’re saying that James never matured but Snape wasn’t much better. I mean do you accept Snape’s character arc ? If so why don’t you accept James’s? Snape was a 32 year old bully bullying 11 year old kids James was 15 and he did grow out of it.
@@dalilamata Snapes Bullying was wrong too. But the age is not an Excuse. James Bullying was wrong. And Snapes Bullying was wrong. And James never "did grow of it". He never stopped the bullying and was mean to Vernon and made fun of him when he FIRST SAW HIM.
@@keinname9912 Rubbish, James never made fun of Vernon, it was the other way around (Vernon trying to patronise James). If you think that a child abusing monster like Vernon is better than James then you must be living on another planet.
@@keinname9912 What, by simply describing his broomstick (after Vernon patronisingly asked what car he drove)? By explaining to Vernon about Gringotts and the fortune his family had (after Vernon suggested he lived on unemployment benefits)? The only person who was in the wrong in all this was Vernon. James was even willing to make up with Vernon (when he shouldn't be and when it should have been Vernon apologizing) but only for Vernon to ignore him. If you think that James did any wrong in this (when it was Vernon), then you really are thick in the head.
Snape and Draco were victims of circumstance, James wasn’t, Draco became like that because of his death eater father and Snape became like that due to his upbringing.
He was a bully and even when talking to Harry with the Resurrection stone brought him back . Lily was the one who showed more love for Harry than anyone
I just can’t just accept James. He bullied snape so much and I know he went off to fight Voldemort and he joined the order of the phoenix, but snape also fought for Voldemort, he was the only witch or wizard to be an undercover death eater and tricked Voldemort himself. James did seem like he had a lot going for him and fighting against Voldemort seems like a selfless thing to do, which it is, but snape gave his whole life to protecting Harry and being an undercover death eater. He still protected Harry even though it reminded him of James because they were so similar and that probably made him upset thinking back to how he was bullied by James and how James got to marry lily and he didn’t. Also seeing lily’s eyes in Harry made him hurt because that was always the love of his life, he never stopped loving her despite her being married to James his bully and also despite her being dead. Which that also brought pain to him. People saw him as evil, a death eater, even though he was fighting for good the whole time, despite all his pain. Even mcgonagall casted spells at snape in the one of the Deathly Hallows movies and snape still only used defensive spells, not trying to hurt anyone, only defending himself. Everyone always thought he was bad because he was a death eater and killed dumbledore. Snape was constantly trying to protect Harry and no one knew it except dumbledore until after snape died. Snape deserves so much more credit, he was a great man.
Everything about that was wrong. Snape didn't give two shits about harry. The ONLY reason he does anything good in the books is guilt from lilys death.(he was mad because HE could not have her) He would have gladly let both harry and james die if voldy let lilly live, he would have happily kept carryout out voldermorts orders. He relentlessy bullies children because he is insecure and a loser, he was nowhere near a man, he was simply a tool thay Dumbledore realized he could use, he diues just as cruel and just as selfish as hes ever been
@@gagefogle2607 Honestly, how do you think that Snape could have fulfilled his mission if he was kindly like Flitwick or Sprout? How could Harry have completed his mission if Snape didn't stop trying to staunch his wound so Harry could find out the truth? Without Snape, Voldemort wins, period.
Except for the fact that Snape was willing to let Voldemort kill James and Harry. He got sad because Lily died boohoo. He only switched side because Lily died not because he was a good person or a 'great person'.
I feel the same way when it comes to Percy, it’s pretty irritating how hypocritical fans are by hating him but adoring Snape and Malfoy, especially when Percy actually had a redemption moment in the books and his actions weren’t as horrible as those two, nor were they as bad as fans make it out to be.
Lol those who hate Percy are general fans of Harry Potter, especailly since the most occuring thing in Harry Potter is the rule breaking, Percy who is a stuck up to rule would look bad to Harry Potter fans. And no, Snape fans doesn't hate Percy, it's just your imagination.
People hate Percy and praise Narcissa Malfoy, who supported the deatheater goals her entire life, raised her son to be a bigot, abused her slave to the point where he snapped, and condemned Snape to death unless he committed murder for her family, The woman is absolute trash, but had one second of "good" in her, that was also just about her son.
RIGHT?!? It annoys me that people are like “Oh but Draco was just a kid, he had a bad influence, he is a good person!” But when it comes to james, they are acting as if he was the most horrible person in the world. If you wanna accept draco, u gotta accept james, he was also just a dumb teenager, JUST LIKE DRACO. But guess what? He turned out to be a better person than draco. (Despite the fact that they were in two different generations)
Absolutely True 100%, and these despicable kids who stan him keep romanticizing his character because of some silly fanfics that are totally different from canon
Snape killed almost 60 muggles to become one of the most trusted Voldemort's counselors. I think we can all pass through the fact that James lifted Snape's pants after Snape harmed with Dark Arts a Gryffindor muggle-born
Curious as to where you pulled that number out of your ass because there is no canon writing about how many people severus killed, only that he was Voldemort's chosen council member after revealing the prophecy of his downfall, and voldemort granted he would do his best to not kill Lily to him. Snape only joined the death eaters under peer pressure, as all of his friends at hogwarts joined them and drug him along. @@aurelioscorrano5389
First of all, no he did not. What he did was not okay, but it wasn’t sexual assualt. Second of all, James got a grip and stopped being a bully, whereas Snape continued to be that way. Anything good Snape ever did was because of Lily, not the greater good. He didn’t care about anyone except Lily, in an obsessive creepy way.
Rubbish, you're making up stupid and ridiculous reasons (that are not canon) as to why James would join the Order and fight Voldemort. Whether you like him or not, James was just as much of a brave, committed and vital Order member as Moody, the Longbottoms, Sirius, Remus, Kingsley, and the Prewetts. Grow up!
Absolute rubbish. You know, comments like yours make me realize that perhaps it will be much better if there was a prequel centred around James Potter being the main/central character in a story about either the Potter family or the Marauders under James's POV. Maybe that way, it will shut up haters like you for good.
The reason he joined the order is because Voldemort wanted non magical folk dead, his soon to be wife was not from a magical lineage, so he didn't join the order out of selfless reasons
Rubbish, you're making up stupid and ridiculous reasons (that are not canon) as to why James would join the Order and fight Voldemort. Whether you like him or not, James was just as much of a brave, committed and vital Order member as Moody, the Longbottoms, Sirius, Remus, Kingsley, and the Prewetts. Grow up!
I don't know man. I would imagine that before their schooling was over the two probably got into some unforgivable fights like Harry and Draco did in the half blood prince. Considering James was only 20 when he died, then I think it would be safe to assume Snape had already joined the death eaters by the time he left hogworts. Voldamort was untrustworthy in general, but he did try to be fair to his followers. I would imagine he would think in terms of "an attack on the kings men is the same as an attack on the king himself" to steal a quote from the movie Braveheart. Then, bring in the fact that Lily was muggle born, I doubt even leaving her would have spelled much for his future having fraternized with her at all. Add the final nail in the coffin of the prophecy, and I would argue his choices were all about survival and a promise of protection by Dumbledore. Sure, he was brave like most grifindors, but like most people, he had a duality about him. He was a rich ass hole that ended up on the right side. He had no choice in the matter. Voldamort would have killed him no matter what he did. Best pick an ally opposed to that person, especially if they are offering. Also, consider this. Who was in the original order? James his 3 best friends his wife his wife's best friend his professor and the longbottoms who got caught up in the same prophecy! That's almost half of the order right there. The order wasn't some Rebel army fighting against the evil empire. It was some kids trying to save their own asses and got some help from some adults. Maybe I'm being cynical here, but come on. James turned 18 and suddenly became virtuous? Naw, he was a basturd that history will remember favorably.
You know what your problem is: you hate how James is so successful in life so you use whatever flaws he may have (such as being a bully) to bring him down. You did it with Rowling (with her transgender views) and you're doing it with James.
James was the best Marauder because: 1. He was a wealthy pureblood, but was pro-Muggle and defended Muggleborns like Lily 2. He joined the Order of the Phoenix (they all did but still) 3. Unlike Sirius and Snape, he saw Remus as a person, not a monster 4. He gave Sirius, a victim of abuse, a home, family and brotherhood 5. He was a good husband, unlike Remus 6. He was a loving father 7. Because unlike Snape, he grew out of his arrogance and immaturity
@@huealexg3068 Mainly due to “the Prank” where Sirius lured Snape into the Whomping Willow when Remus was in his wolf form. Luckily it failed because James got Snape out in time but what if wolf!Remus had actually killed Snape, he wouldn’t have only been expelled, but he would face additional discrimination from the Wizarding World and would forever have to live with the fact that he took someone’s life
Well, I can quite understand why Remus acted like that. James was just a normal human, unlike Remus, so he could just marry his sweetheart without any problems. Remus had had regrets. He didn’t want to make the lives of his loved ones harder
The problem is that we never saw his character arc. He went from asshole to suddenly being amazing in a few years, but we never see him change. So many just assume that he remained an asshole.
Remus and Sirius explain that he grew up in 6 and 7 years, he became a Head Boy, witch mean that he was respected to be name HB, and during that year she fall in love with him, the explain that he grew up
Many things here need fixing: 1.The fact his father is a bully has nothing to do with his dedicating fight against Voldy,cause those r 2 differrent things.And remember this:anyone comes from Griffindors always fight against bully,so no surprise that he joined The Order of the Phoenix 2.I agree,we have to except James's character,but we have right to hate him for bullying Snape,right?Didn't u see how this fact was mention....gently:big-head born from a wealthy family got a lot of friend so they pick up some rebel kids to bully,sounds familiar?Mrs Rowling was trying to tell us that happens everydays,so bullies like James is always there,so we have to protect ourselves
You could also look at it as he joined because he enjoyed being the centre of attention and being seen as a hero and dragged his wife and newborn child to their deaths. Only be sheer chance did his child not die because of his need to play the hero.
Rubbish, you're making up stupid and ridiculous reasons (that are not canon) as to why James would join the Order and fight Voldemort. Whether you like him or not, James was just as much of a brave, committed and vital Order member as Moody, the Longbottoms, Sirius, Remus, Kingsley, and the Prewetts. Grow up!
@@silentkaine9352Why? Because you hate the fact that James was a brave and selfless Order member and not a ruthless and bloodthirsty Death Eater like you would have preferred in your headcanons?
He joined because his wife was muggle born and would be killed this is the most stupid point I’ve read all day, he couldn’t change anything about his wife or sons death because it was told in a prophecy which would always come true! He didn’t drag his son in when he had him he went into hiding to protect him!
If I got hung upside down and threatened to get my underpants taken off at 15, I don't need to apologize to you for the person I will become. Shut the fuck up
I feel like, if you've gone through the experience of not having a parent around to visually prove a change, it's more true to real life. You have to rely on the words of those who knew your parent in ways you didn't, and trust that they aren't giving you rose-colored visions of their late friend.
exactly! Snape was a death eater and a faithful servant of the Dark lord before Lily's death. James might have been a bully, but it was when he was only a teen and as he gained maturity, he gave it up. We should also remember that he bullied only a few dark wizards like Snape and they actually deserve it since they torture other people. While James gave up bullying as he was growing, Snape did bullying even when he had gained maturity and became an adult James is really better than Snape and people still like Snape better
Snape would have let Harry and James or just any other family die without pity. He had no empathy for murdered BABIES. If he'd met anyone but Dumbledore, he would've been arrested or murdered on the spot. And judging by his death eater history, most people would've assumed they were Saving countless future lives.
@@marcopolo1472 But he did go to Dumbledore, and he did the things necessary to make saving the world from Voldemort possible. Either redemption is a thing, or it isn't. If it isn't, then a) hell is going to be a pretty full place, and b) no one who ever does bad can ever have any hope and might as well just give into depravity fully. Great lesson.
Exact! Finally someone who speaks up for James, I see too much hatred towards him and too many excuses for the victimization of Snape and Draco, in my opinion James was far better than them
Even JK Rowling has admitted how unnerved she is at people who bash James and glorify Draco, stating that she finds James more sympathetic than either Draco or Dudley. Rowling never intended for Draco to be so loved and for James to be so hated.
@@marcosalvini4561 Absolutely. If we only had the books and not the movies (and therefore no Tom Felton) then I highly doubt Draco Malfoy would be that popular.
Book Club Livestream on Chapters 6-12 of Goblet of Fire will be this Sunday at 10am PST!!
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James still a bully which is big L
James never really graduated, in fact he left school when things became threathening: *"If you remember when Lily, James and co. were at school,
the first war was raging. It never reached the heights that the second war reached, because the Ministry was never infiltrated to that extend but it was a very bad time, the same disappearances, the
same deaths. So that’s what they did, they left school."*
Of course when something is threathening your life, you would actively fight against it, people call James heroic for fighting against something that threathens them.
I love how Voldemort, a being of pure evil who wanted to eradicate half of the wizard population is being reduced to “the biggest bully in the world”
Voldemort was clearly a victim of bullying himself. Someone went too far with the "Got your nose" prank.
@@naterksmr😂
Yeah I think reducing genocide down to "bullying" is a bit... 😂
@@naterksmrHELP
My question is if everyone including Harry knew how bad Voldy Moldy did and was willing to go, then how come nobody believed that he wouldn't scoop so low as to use a student to kill Dumbledore or anyone else?
Completely agree. He changed and in a best possible way.
👍🏻👍🏻🤓
Yeh, but u can argue he joined the order to look heroic and strong Infront of his peers
@@thepeepshow9099 People don’t join up to go to war to impress their mates bfr
People do not change
He never did though, we were just told that he changed, by his *TWO BEST FRIENDS* who would lie for him, we were never shown of any real change. And he never tried to atone for the bullying that he did.
Exactly. It’s always bothered me how people can hate James, but also love Draco and Snape. Especially since Draco and James are cut from the same cloth.
👍🏻😊
draco was bad because of his father's influence on him. james was bad because he just wanted to be bad. that's the difference
@@konuralpyldzkan1495 And here is the most used justification for Draco’s behavior. Daddy issues. If somebody has a bad father, then all their crimes are forgiven. Besides, it’s not like Lucius was abusive to Draco. He and his wife spoiled their son. Also, if that justifies Draco’s behavior, the it justifies James’ behavior. James also was spoiled by his parents. Both of them were bullies during their school days, and both of them grew out of that behavior as adults. People need to stop vilifying one of them and cherishing the other.
@Joe This is the exact reason why I love Draco and James more than Snape. Yes, he did save Harry on multiple times, but he bullied students as an adult. James and Draco at least was bullying people the same age as them and was children tthemselves.
@@Joe-ik1ph this is not a justification. i didn't forgive draco for what he has done. i am just saying that draco and james are exactly the same is not true. even their behaviours as bullies are titally different.
HP’s parents be looking 40 when they were actually just 20😭
20!! I thought they were 39 😂
@@Iammheretoday they were both 21 years when they died😂
@@retepeter2305 DID THEY?! Oml.
@@retepeter2305Guess both had no time but to have a child at early age because a crazy man is not too far from killing them. 😂
They did that because of Alan Rickman playing Snape.
Seeing James at supposed to be 21 in the films with a receding hairline is hilarious still
some people can't help how their hair grows really
@@dustingilbreth5643this guy doesn't look 21.
I had a receding hairline at 21, so there.
They aged everyone in the films
@@czopik95hope they'll stick to the books in the series. It's their only chance to not fck this up.
Tbh, the difference is that we get to see the change in other characters, plus we see them in actions, whereas we're just told about James, but never see him do anything, though we do see him giving Harry good advice and being a good paternal figure.
Exactly. And we are told by his friends which doesn't give it much credibility ...
He really does sound like an awful guy in the books. People always say to Harry what a great quidditch player he was, what a good duelist he was. It is never about his character.
@@akina4126 he doesn't sounds so awful.
I see him as similar to the weasley twins but up to eleven because, at that time, the rivalry between slytherin and giffindor was way worse.
we are always told, specially from snape's point of view/memories, how horrible James was but almost never about how much lily had to cover from snape's horrible behavior towards her and other muggleborns.
Snape even invented lethal curses while being a student. we praise him for that acomplishment but that's the behavior of a socipath.
James... sure. he pranked a lot and he may have gone a bit over the top sometimes but he was never a bully or awful.
it was snape the one that insulted and betrayed Lily. his first friend despite all the chances she gave him.
it was James the one that became suportive of Lily and earned her trust and love.
and you say he was awful?
hell no. he wasn't even half as bad as draco even when he was at his worst.
remember. fun fact, James saved Severus life and it's mentioned, I'm not sure by who, that Snape never forgave him for that.
since when an awful bully does that? since when the bullied doesn't forgive the one that saved his life?
let me tell you why. Severus wanted to be harmed so dumbledore would be forced to expell remus. I could half understand if severus wanted james expelled but Remus did nothing against him. it was just to harm James and Sirius by proxy.
but Snape's behavior is rarely mentioned whenever James being a bully is claimed.
sorry to say but James was far from awful. he was immature, skilled and a prankster but not awful. he did everything for his friends even at his own risk.
Snape was fine with the death eaters killing everybody and more so long as they spared Lily. and only helped Harry after being forced by Dumbledore.
Had this chat with a friend how Harry is always saying "My dad didn't_____" "My dad wasn't_______" and whatnot, whenever someone would talk sh!t about James. *kid you didn't even know what your dad was like you only heard what people told you...*
@@jenniflower6569 well... other than snivelus, the dork lard, his minions and the turdsley, everybody agrees that James was a respectable man.
and, it's evident that some people has told evident lies about James. like petunia turdsley claiming james was a jobless drunkard that died in a car accident and lily was a wh*re.
one thing harry knows for sure about James and Lily, they sacrificed their lives to save him (and saved him again, as ghosts, after the triwizard). he also learned (thanks to a pensieve) that Snivelus was a childhood friend of Lily but insulted her and her friends.
he also has a few moving pictures of his parents and has undeniable proof that James, at the very least, helped create the marauder's map.
so, while I agree that Harry can't remember how James was, he knows quite a few things that weren't told. they were proven.
@@WilliamWizeroh...stop man...Snape was not as good as people assume but James was no less.
He protected Snape only to protect him and his friends from getting expelled at the least. As no one knows that remus was a warewolf except Dumbledore and it would have caused Dumbledore his post and them their further education and their wands could have been taken forever just like Hagrid.
And it was sirius only who told Snape where to find remus.
Snape was into dark arts but not till 5th year...He never got pranked it was bullying...n he found only one way to protect him n that was dark arts.
It was wrong of him ,very wrong of him to say harsh words to lily...but he was being embarrassed in front of her and the last thing anyone would want is to be insulted in front of their friends/crush n in that embarrassment or whatever he said those words n he regretted n got his fair share of karma by loosing his only friend.
Snape was a bully n James n sirius got a big role in that....even remus and serius said that James used to go behind Lily's back to pick a fight with Snape.
Snape was no good but don't tell me that James was any less....you have a change of heart doesn't make up for the things you have done in the past...
Snape just got 1 point more than James coz he comes from a broken and poor family,he was bullied just because he was in a certain house and liked a girl of different house ,lost his only friend to his bully ,that is enough to send a person to a path beyond limits either good or bad..
Draco was a child in front of them.😂😂😂he was only a big mouth never had the guts.
Enough of James...😂😂
Snape was a sneaky bastard to bully Neville and other kids....but I think that he was maxed out biased teacher...helping his house kids..
Say whatever u want to about anyone
Snape,dumbledore,Draco ,sirius ...James stand tall for me 😂😂 in terms of bullying...if iam writing this I also should went out my feelings for sirius as I might get busy n may not be able to reply.
In the movies,in the books I never found a single moment to like this guy. If you do please do tell me😂
Not to mention James was a rich pureblood but still accepted people who were different like Remus, took Sirius in when he had nowhere else to go and stood up against the real world equivalent of racists. I mean really when did bullying the racist kid become so controversial
@@JoaodaSilvaeSouza yeah, and even still he didn't treat them badly either, like he just liked Lily from at least fifth year and was genuine about it for the most part, even writing her initials on his exam papers (before scribbling them out when the teacher walked by), like yeah he was bad about the snape incident but he clearly did something to make Lily consider him (also could be mentioned that Snape used his cutting spell with wordless magic so it's not like he wasn't willing to play dirty)
@@swiftlyaswiftieIt's controversial because the only "supposedly" racist kid he bullied is Snape, while the other person he bullied, *Bertram Aubrey,* isn't really a Death Eater.
He accepted Remus and Sirius because they are Gryffindors, when did he exactly accepted outcasts from Ravenclaw or Hufflepuff?
Ah yes, Snape is obsessed with Lily, but you can literally see he never scribbled Lily's name on his book in half blood prince book when Harry got a hold of it, but James scribbling Lily's name is not obsessive.
@@hynankublai2013Snape wasnt in love he was obsessed because you dont yell slurs at your crushes when they try to help you. We dont know much about who else did james hang out w except for the maraduers but we know Snape was a deatheater and hung out with most of them e.g. Mulciber Barty, Rosier, Malfoy ect. And we dont know the exact reason they threw a curse at bertram couldve been a simple joke or a prank.
@@janalerotic4266 nah he was embarrassed and his manliness was at stake and getting saved by your crush in that situation is embarrassing and it slipped up
@@diamonshade7484 you still dont call them a slur yeah sure you were mad and emberassed but that gives you no right to insult someone who tried to help you
I agree that James did change, probably influenced by Lily and his own maturity. And he sacrificed a lot, eventually giving his life. That’s the ultimate sacrifice. But, the harmful psychological effect of being bullied cannot be understated. I doubt that the one scene we saw was the only time that James bullied Snape and I'm sure Snape was no angel. But just because it was a long time ago and James ultimately changed doesn't excuse or undo the emotional harm that being bullied had on Snape.
As an adult, James looking back on things would have viewed the bullying as an issue of "Well, that was years ago and we were all just kids playing around back then. That’s what kids do.” To Snape it probably caused lifelong emotional damage. Snape had to learn to live with this damage and the effect it had on him.
Of course, I know that these are all made-up characters in a story, but in real life the psychological damage of bullying is very real and has, for many years, been minimalized by people, especially the ones doing the bullying.
I agree, actions shouldn't be underseen because another character did worse
But Snape was already damaged before he came to Hogwarts.
@@paulyb7267 His backstory mentioned that he didn’t have a happy childhood, but being bullied only made things worse.
@@SCGMLBit's also worse than that as people forget James NEVER changed and apologised even after school. Wasn't even neutral. We know this when Harry was angry at sirius and lupin after looking at snapes memory and lupin said "Oh well Snape was a special case. That continued even after but its not like he was cursing Snape in front of Lily on dates.'
The thing is , it wasn't just Snape .
So we forgive James but ignore everything great Dumbledore did and still hate him?
Yea
Only stupid non fans person forgive this bully James! He was meant to hate him, idiots!!!
Nah. Imo Dumbledore is the most interesting character.
Everything great Dumbledore did? Dumbledore used and manipulated everyone, including and worst of all Harry. He groomed Harry for the sole purpose of using him to defeat Voldemort. Dumbledore knew about the Horcruxes since the beginning. He knew what Harry was. Yet groomed and trained him for 6 yrs , never telling him the truth because he knew on the end Harry was the better man. He even allowed Sirius Black to rot in Azkaban for 13 yrs to accompmish his plan. He constantly put students, and staff in danger, and refused to step up when needed most because of his self doubts about himself. Its amazing because of the way Rowling frames the character, that fans think Dumbledore is a good man. And the Fantastic Beasts movies do a shit poor job of showing him too. His Brother said it best " Ever notice the people my brother loved were always the ones hurt the most?".
@@auntiewewe972 he was playing 4D Chess and sacrificed himself for it
He also spent years learning a advanced magic so his friend wouldn’t have to be alone
I personally disagree. I don’t forgive James, but do forgive Snape and Draco. Like many said here, Draco was brainwashed into his blood purity kind of thinking. Tbh, I think if Harry joined Slytherin, they would be great friends. He really only started bullying Harry because Harry stood up for Ron and publicly humiliated him.
Snape is forgiven solely based on his last actions. He died so Harry could proceed with Dumbledores plan. Beyond that, if he was a coward, he could’ve sold Draco out telling Voldemort Draco was the owner of the Elder Wand. But I think beyond the plan, Snape had compassion for Draco and died to protect both Harry & Draco as well as the rest of the world. That is extremely selfless.
James on the other hand, while I see your point, was not someone who would’ve changed without Lilly. He’s just lucky he had Lilly to reign in the craziness. Snapes adjectives to describe him are pretty accurate. I have respect that he died trying to protect his son. But tbh, unless I hear other convincing arguments, I don’t forgive James.
Since you keep banging on about how there is nothing likeable about James Potter, why don't we have a look:
- he befriended people who were considered 'outcasts'
- he became an animagus at a very young age in order to support Remus Lupin during his monthly transformations after finding out the latter was a werewolf (rather than abandoning Remus like most people would have)
- he saved his arch-nemesis Snape's life (and at great risk to his own life) after a prank by one of his friends (a prank that James had no part in)
- he stood up for his friends and other people who were cruelly treated by aspiring-Death Eaters like Snape
- he gave Sirius Black a home to stay in after the latter ran away from his abusive family
- he used his wealth to financially support Remus Lupin (who couldn't find a job due to anti-werewolf laws)
- he strongly disagreed with the concept of blood purity (despite being a pure-blood himself) and was disgusted with any prejudice towards Muggle-borns and did not hold prejudice towards half-breeds (such as Remus Lupin or Rubeus Hagrid, who were two of his dearest friends)
- he joined the Order and took part in battles against Death Eaters and other dark forces and surviving until the end of the war (he and Lily even personally faced Voldemort three times)
- he was willing to sacrifice himself for his wife and son, as demonstrated when he told Lily to take Harry and run while he held off Voldemort, proving himself to be a true Gryffindor.
This is something that a gullible Snape apologist like you refuses to understand.
@@paulyb7267 sorry that I think Snape’s sacrifice was greater and life was a lot harder for Snape. I’m not excusing some of Snape’s bad actions, but clearly his actions helped save the world. Also a few red herrings in your argument, if Snape and Lilly were married, don’t you think he would’ve sacrificed his life for his wife and child? Forget Snape in that example for a minute. If someone came in and was trying to murder my wife and child, I would absolutely do the same thing. The action is noble, but not something anyone else would do. Honestly, most of the points you’re making seem to me that the general public would make. I’m not saying James isn’t a compelling character. He just seems like he a great friend to those close to him, but an absolute jerk to anyone else. Maybe he changed as he got older, but from everything I’ve seen, at worst he’s not a great person. At best, he does stuff that most other Gryffindors would do. Maybe the new TV show will help round out some of the older characters and I can actually get a better sense of who he was and what he did. But you’re probably on the cancel the show train guessing from the absolute triggering that was your comment based on a fantasy series.
@@Narm758First, James would have sacrifice himself to save his wife and son even of he hadn't marry Lily. Plus, Lily didn't love Snape because he was a horrible person (at this time).
Second, he used the privileges that he had to help the ones rejected by society. Even other Gryffindors would have rejected Lupin when they heard he was a werewolf.
Third, he chose to fight against Voldemort. He didn't have to, Voldemort would have accepted him in his ranks, he chose to. It's something that Snape and Draco couldn't do because they were selfish.
I understand that Draco was raised that way since his parents were already deatheaters, but Sirius, Regullus and Andromeda all decided to fight against Voldemort and they were from the same family. Andromeda is literally his AUNT, which proves that it isn't about education.
You can't say that James only became a good person because of Lily because Snape was still friend with her when he turned towards dark magic.
In conclusion, during his first years at Hogwarts, James Potter was as bad of a bully as Draco. Which isn't too surprising because their childhood were very similar (minus the racism). He was arrogant and selfish.
But then he grew up. When he discovered that Remus was a werewolf, instead of rejecting him, he learnt increasingly advanced magic to support him.
He realised that the world wasn't all pink and that there was a war outside. When he left Hogwarts with tones of money, a very good degree, a strong group of friends and a girlfriend, he could have done anything he wanted. But he chose to fight. He sacrificed everything, from his money to his life to fight against injustice. Let's not forget that he died at only 21.
He used to be a bully, yes, but he grew up to become a selfless and brave man which is why Lily fell in love with him.
Not to mention snape was a bully as a teen as well! He hung around future death eaters, hexed and called muggleborns mudbloods, tried to tell Lily Remus' secret and laughed at Mary MacDonald being attacked, calling it a 'prank' when it's described by Lily as creepy and dark and whenever Lily tried to confront him on his behaviour he got mean, insulted her and essentially manipulated her saying stuff like "oh I thought you were my friend" when she brought up valid criticism
Being a Snapehead, I would agree with you at this point. But I think, Snape was a Slytherin and the basic quality of a Slytherin is to be cold, mean and extremely choosy. He didnt like James as a company, and thus went with other Slytherins, who convinced him the "Dark"magic as mere pranks... And that was what made him a bully in school... But I think his love or the so called "obsession" for Lily and his last straw for Harry in his most dark times, when his parents were not present to protect him, he deserves a round of applause from all Potterheads...
Thank you.
@@sohinibanerjee4450 I personally do not like him but I don't care if you like him so what I'll say is what i hope is unbias but his prejudice against muggles was present before Hogwarts, with him belittling Petunia based on her being one
@@swiftlyaswiftieWhen did he bully anyone? People here are making things up when there's no evidence in the book that he bullied anyone. Lol when did he hexed muggleborns?
It's unavoidable to hang around with them, there roommates! It's hipocritical of Lily to isolate him from his own roommates when she herself hangs around her own roommates. And it's not like he hangs around with them all time, Lily literally has to tell Snape about his roommates that he doesn't know. And the people who he *hangs around with* weren't really there to help him when he gets bullied.
When a dark creature nearly kills you, ofcourse you will tell someone about it, your life is being threatened!
Snape is only rebutting on Lily's bs on calling someone from his house "dark and creepy" when there's a creature much "darker and creepier" from Lily's house who by the way *nearly kills people* many times compared to the creepy people from Snape's house, and that is said by *Lupin himself.*
Lol the part where he said *“…thought we were supposed to be friends?”* came before all of the things Lily said about Avery and Mulciber, he wasn't threatening her on it. And to be fair, Lily never really considered him as her friend, evident by her statement: *"None of my friends can understand why I even talk to you."* so there's nothing to threathen her about anyway.
@@hynankublai2013 Chapter Prince's Tale
-"wouldn't spy on _you_ anyway, _you're_ a muggle" and "she's only a-" both lines said by snape to petunia showing an early prejudice against muggles before entering Hogwarts
-he hangs around bad people who perform dark magic, if you're going to blame Remus for being complicit in the marauders then you sure as hell better for snape
-Snape was controlling to Lily saying he won't "let her" do things (something she calls out)
-"-to call me a mudblood? But you call everyone of my birth mudblood, Severus. Why should i be any different?" a direct quote from Lily to Severus, proving that he was, at the very least, a verbal bully saying a _slur_ to them.
This is direct quotes from the books proving my point, not even getting into context clues of if he learned dark magic and made dark spells and hung around dark Wizards who did dark stuff while holding prejudice then he probably, at the very least, told them about his spells considering he wasn't shy about using them.
@@swiftlyaswiftie Lol you forgot that Snape is being abused by his own muggle father, so how can exactly he be not biased against them. And he *befriended Lily,* so it's not exactly like he views himself superior over them.
Hangs out with people who perform dark magic, what about James? He uses hexes that can be considered as dark magic. James uses Levicorpus which is considered as dark magic. Lol the double standards.
Lol show the full context, so we can judge it unbiasedly:
*“Saved? Saved? You think he was playing the hero? He was saving his neck and his friends’ too! You’re not going to - I won’t let you - ”*
What Snape is trying to say here is that Lily is downplaying his near death experience as was something his fault when Sirius instigated the whole thing. And she d*mn did when she believed rumors over him and when hearing about his near-death experience didn't even ask him if he was alright, some friend she is.
Half-bloods are also mudblood, are you saying he is calling himself a slur too? Most of the people in his house are already prejudiced about him, what exactly can he do so he won't be bullied by his own house too?
Lol proving your point, but what exactly did it prove, it doesn't support anything about him bullying anyone nor hexing anyone. What you just did was avoid what I said and literally add other things not related to the existing context.
To be fair despite his dark side Snape wasn't a bully growing up, not a fair comparison.
Absolute rubbish. You know, comments like yours make me realize that perhaps it will be much better if there was a prequel centred around James Potter being the main/central character in a story about either the Potter family or the Marauders under James's POV. Maybe that way, it will shut up haters like you for good!
you can also turn this around tho. if you think Snape and Draco are despicable bullies, James was just as much of a bully as them
There are differences
Draco was bullying people because he was racist, James was bullying people who practiced dark magic
Snape was a bully even at his thirties, James stopped being a bully after he graduated school
@@ildimid9423 and Draco also matured after Hogwarts, and no, Practicing dark arts (or any sort of magic for that matter) is no excuse for James bullying Snape. if you think it is, then that explains why your messed up view on life as a whole tbh
and snape definitely had a difficult past at home. doesnt excuse him from bullying, but James bullied because he finds it fun, James has 0 excuse, Snape does at least have something
@@ildimid9423 and i can almost guarantee you, if James had not bullied Snape the way he did, i'm 99.9999% sure Snape wouldnt have become the man that he eventually became. Yes Snape was a bully, but it was James' fault that he was
@@questrequested9171 I never said that Snape practicing dark arts excuses James, I’m just talking about the motives
The thing is that James actually changed, when Snape at his age still bullies kids to some extreme point (remember Neville)
@@questrequested9171 it’s not James’s fault that Snape is a bully. Even if it applies to Harry, it doesn’t apply to anyone else. He’s being sadistic sometimes to people who never harmed him (again, remember how poisoned Neville’s frog, who would die, if it wasn’t for Hermione’s help)
Most bullies grow up to be decent people in the end, but the damage they inflicted on less fortunate kids while teenagers leave deep scars. Fortunately, these scars help sometimes. The bullied become deeper and more sympathetic to suffering. Some of them... Others become vengeful, cautious, and cold...
i dont agree..
people who suffer from bullying either give in or be like harry.
snape gave in. harry was bullied too... by snape, draco and his idotic friends...
but harry wasn't like snape.
snape cant be defended by your point.
“Fortunately, these scars help sometimes”
So bullies are necessary evil? Lol 😂
Ppl can be sympathetic & kind even without being tormented. Sick logic 🤢
No, few bullies ever grow up. I could have done without all of these scars and the depression. Your logic is completely flawed.
Bullies don't grow up or change for the better, some just learn to adapt better. They bully other people in different more subtle ways.
The ones got bullied don't care about how those bullies become decent, they just want apologies and punishments to get justice.
No buddy , if he didn't go to war with Voldemort , and Voldemort wins , James's wife as a muggle would be in danger
Bingo. It was self-interest.
Lol 😂
Lily wasn't a muggle
@@pokyzard8667 muggle-born, which voldy and death eaters still abhor anyway
Then He could have hide not go into the amry where he and Lily and in more danger
Just pointing out, Lily was muggleborn. If he wanted to live his life with her by her side, he didn’t really have a choice
they could just run away. live in some other country etc.
He had many muggleborn friends too and he respected them
@@enterokinaz. No, Voldemort couldn't find people in another country. Oh, wait. See also: Karkarov, Igor.
@@enterokinaz. They are Gryffindors, who would Harry would have inherited his bravery and will to fight, they just went to hiding when the Prophesy was made
Yes, he had. Leaving the country like almost every muggle-born family did during the fist Wizarding war. Moreover, is not the best choice bringing your wife into the Order and put her in more danger. So your point is pointless
Hmm. Wasn’t Draco and Snape’s form of bullying verbal? I understand any form is bad but James used force to humiliate Snape, Sirius nearly got him killed by the whomping Willow. And if we remove the Mudblood word (racism is never ok) didn’t their adversaries also hurl insults etc. Bullying is bad whoever does it. But while James grew into a decent man it was said Snape was a “special case” he didn’t apologise, didn’t seem to have regrets. These characters are mostly grey, good and bad as most people are.
agree mostly but i just want to defend my wolfboy. it wasn't his fault. he would never hurt someone even it's snape (school years i mean not the war)
Remus never tried to kill Snape
Sirius was an idiot and thought it would've been funny to lead Snape to the Shrieking Shack while Remus was transformed
@@aymanabdullah9662 you are right I did mean Sirius.
@@enterokinaz. I’ve changed it. I did of course mean Sirius.
Verbal? Remember when Draco stomped on Harry’s nose on the hogwarts express and left him there? And snape was actually a death eater at one point and probably murdered many people. James never did that. Snape also created sectumsempra.
First of all, I think that Draco Malfoy has the weakest "redemption arc" in all of literature. Second of all, the difference between James and Snape is that we _see_ Snape's, but we only _hear_ about the redemption arc of James Potter. For all we know, he could have just been a jerk who made the right decision.
Draco wasn't supposed to have a big redemption arc, so it's not weak at all, because that wasn't the point. Draco is an example of a bully that seems like he can change, but he'll always be a bully. Not everyone can change.
@@dannyjorde2677 Agreed. My comment was more aimed at the people who wax poetic about his redemption and how was The Boy Who Had No Choice. Everywhere in the book, the entire point is that you _do_ have a choice. As manipulative as Dumbledore could be, he always gave people a choice. It is fair to argue that once Draco saw up close and personal how bad the Death Eaters were that he didn't really want to go that far, but he went along far more often than not.
@@wvu05straight fac
I agree with you. I never thought Malfoy was a good person even after his weak redemption arc. In my eyes, he is always going to be a bully. Same with Dudley.
But that dosent mean he was a jerk in the end, just because you dont see it dosnet mean didnt happened
You were never bullied
Yes, but I've never practiced dark arts against a Gryffindor in front of you
@@aurelioscorrano5389Damn someone was never hanged upside down and stripped in school. Shut the fuck up
James messed up. He might just as well been envious of Voldemort. Also his wife was muggle born. She would have been in danger, especially if Voldemort would have won. Also, I suspect he made more than 1 Death Eater an enemy so that means that Voldemort would have been hostile to him too. If Voldemort would have won the Death Eaters, which James made enemies of early on, would have been capable of attacking and even killing him with no consequences, maybe even taking his fortune. There was nothing selfless about him.
You know what your problem is, *you hate how successful James is,* so you use whatever flaws that James has (such as being a bully) in order to bring him down and downplay his selflessness. You did it with Rowling (regarding her transgender comments) and you're doing it with James.
@@paulyb7267dang bro
So because he decided to be better after being a bully. It washes away the pain he inflicted on Snape and his other victims?
And because Snape was a good guy in the end it washes away the pain he inflicted on his classmates and students?
@@geordineilson5476 It does if he had to do those things in order to maintain his cover so he could do the good things at the end. Doesn't make Teen Snape any better, but we do see his complete redemption arc.
People keep on mentioning other victims, but I honestly do not see any evidence of any other victims. We only have a mention of Snape. And he was a known , death, eater, sympathiser, and he gave as good as he got, because if you read the books, Snape actually physically caused harm to James. Yes, it was in retaliation for James but he only became even more cruel after Snape said the slur to Lily
@@wvu05he treated Harry like trash from day one he wasn’t maintaining anything he also caused neville be afraid of him that was still before Voldemorts return not to mention he didn’t care if James AND BABY Harry got killed by Voldemort
@@jonahginter9558 No, he wasn't a double agent at all. /s
Just because James protected the people he cared about does not negate him being a shitstain of a person. Those are completely mutual exclusive ideas that coexist beside each other.
Draco mellowed out over time when he realized he was on the wrong side. Snape turned double agent because of Lily, but stayed in that position even after her death when he could’ve easily gone to either side, which saved countless lives besides just Harry time and time again.
James isn’t even close to those arcs. He still would have been a bully had he lived. Instead, he became a martyr and rallying point for the cause along with Lily.
Absolute rubbish. You know, comments like yours make me realize that perhaps it will be much better if there was a prequel centred around James Potter being the main/central character in a story about either the Potter family or the Marauders under James's POV. Maybe that way, it will shut up haters like you for good!
@@paulyb7267 Look. If you want to deify an abusive person just because they’re dead, go for it. I don’t have to 🤷♂️🤷♂️
Since you brought up the Marauders however, let’s compare him to his closest companions. Peter gave him up to be spared, Sirius and Remus still chose to talk mad shit about Snape despite knowing he was working as a double agent for Dumbledore, 20~ years on.
Call it rubbish all you want, mate. But just because someone else’s opinion gets you all up in your feelies doesn’t make that opinion wrong.
If you’d like a more comprehensive list and analysis of shitty people becoming slightly less/very specifically less shitty when it directly effects them, please see every single conservative politician ever in the history of the world. 🤦♂️🤦♂️
@@theycallmejodamo First of all, James was not abusive. He wasn't some sort of wife beater or child abuser like you want him to be in your own delusional fanfictions. You know who really is a child abuser, that's right, Snivellus Snape.
@@paulyb7267 A.) The fact that you call his victim the same thing he did speaks VOLUMES about your own character.
B.) You can be abusive without being physical. The fact that your immediately went to spousal/child abuse, again, speaks volumes about you.
C.) At the end of the day, every single one of them are fictional characters, so it doesn’t matter what their content of character is or isn’t, because they’re not real.
D.) I don’t write fanfics, dear. I’ve published two full-length novels with original characters. What’s your excuse for the projection now?
James was active member of order of phoenix. He had no reason to join it at age of 19 he was rich and have everything he want,on the other hand snape even after turning older was with voldemort and he didn't stopped even after lily tried to stop him. And if not for Lily he wouldn't have done what he did. Snapes flaws are forgivable then james flaws are also forgiveable.
Draco was better than both of them,i agree on that part because his family was supremacist so he was just result of thier upbringing.
He traumatized kids into becoming death eaters and wound up murdered by one.
I am pretty sure Snape's liking of the Dark Arts was what put them against each other in the first place. That and Lily.
Nah james never actually apologized to snape for the way he treated him and yet snape still took the responsibility of making sure his enemies kid survived bro even gave his life for him
True
And snape apologize for all he did during his teacher's year to his students ? I don't think so.
James changed, snape not, that is the difference. And don't says me he's a Hero because he's not. He only decide to join the right sight because he was obsess by Lily. Remember, he demand to Voldemort to kill James and Harry but not Lily. Dumbledore himself called him pathetic. He wanted the death of a baby ! And the death of james. James nerver wanted the death of snape. He saved him.
Also remember, during his school years snape was Friends with mulciber and Avery and they joked about mudbloods. He wasn't a good Guy.
I dont apologise to racists, snape only regretted killing muggleborns when Lily died.
Technically he saved harry for lily even though he hated james woth all his being .
would you apologize to your enemy in a war just because you were mean at school?
that's BS.
Snape never helped his enemies kid. Snape helped Lily's kid. Dumbledore had to manipulate him for that. Snape was in debted to Dumbledore for claiming snape was a spy working for him. if not for that, Snape would had been send to azkaban.
I agree with your assessment. But then again, irrespective of how much of a great person he truly became post his Hogwarts life, that still doesn't absolve him of his wrongdoings. He was an outright Bully. You talked about Draco Malfoy's bullying but Draco never Physically attacked anyone, while James would hex / jinx unsuspecting ppl purely out of boredom. It was James constant tormenting that forced Snape to seek out Lucius Malfoy and eventually join his band of budding Death Eaters. Had James not bullied Snape, there was a very real possibility that Snape would've never joined the Death Eaters.
Draco did physically attack people. For example he put a leg locker curse on Neville in Sorcerer’s Stone
@@Half-BloodUniversity_ and he attacked harry on the train at the end of book five and at the start of book 6
@@abyuneend compare the leg locker or some weird curse to forcibly trying to strip people in public or making someone's head so swollen and painful that he got to be taken to hospital wing .
@@abyunee In the Start of Book-6, it was Harry who actively sought Draco and later on Draco catches Harry spying on him. So in a way Draco was justified in his actions. I agree with your point regarding the OOTP. Draco attacking Harry was totally uncalled for, but nonetheless, he got what he deserved.
@@abyunee - To be fair, Harry DID kinda deserve that for spying on him.
Nah, he was a spoiled a hole who didn't do anything sitnificant. Yeah he joined the order but he still didn't do anything within it. Meanwhile Snape devoted his life and image to getting close to the dark lord securing his defeat l.
You saying James does nothing for the Order. So he never thwarted Voldemort three times then?
You know what your problem is: you hate how James is so successful in life so you use whatever flaws he may have (such as being a bully) to bring him down. You did it with Rowling (with her transgender views) and you're doing it with James.
@@paulyb7267 I didn't even call out anyone for being an unforgivable bigot but here you are all by yourself telling me you are lol. Jk rowling is a POS and anyone who defends her is the same lol
@@bobosstroll9798Also, you're making up stupid and ridiculous reasons (that are not canon) as to why James would join the Order and fight Voldemort. Whether you like him or not, James was just as much of a brave, committed and vital Order member as Moody, the Longbottoms, Sirius, Rem heus, Kingsley, and the Prewetts. Grow up!
What people have a problem with is no repercussions. Draco and Snape get shat on and he felt no sting for being a bully.
This!
James get‘s betrayed by one of his best friends, dies trying to help his family and never get‘s to watch his son grow up. Also unlike the other two he isn’t prejudiced against muggle borns and doesn’t bully his STUDENTS for no reason
Yep. We see Snape and Malfoy have something of a redemption arc though the story isn’t told from their perspective. We don’t see that from James. We are told he “grew up” but that Snape was a “special case”. Whether it was possessiveness or personality flaw we don’t know because we never got more context.
James was murdered when he was like 22
That avadakadavra sure did sting
Even though James changed, he left Snape behind means he has never been apologetic for his behaviour.
Snape sacrifices himself for that kid whose father used to bully him
Draco in the last stands for his mates even though he doesn't like many of them.
It would be great if James took the initiative and fixed things
James died a bully and the other 2 redeemed themselves
Rubbish, you're making up stupid and ridiculous reasons (that are not canon) as to why James would join the Order and fight Voldemort. Whether you like him or not, James was just as much of a brave, committed and vital Order member as Moody, the Longbottoms, Sirius, Remus, Kingsley, and the Prewetts. Grow up!
real
You are 100% wrong.
He is a Gryffindor. He is not selfless. He did it for the pride and glory. He is a show off
Absolute rubbish. You know, comments like yours make me realize that perhaps it will be much better if there was a prequel centred around James Potter being the main/central character in a story about either the Potter family or the Marauders under James's POV. Maybe that way, it will shut up haters like you for good.
@@paulyb7267lighten up 😅
The point is, he did it. Our beloved Harry did blow up his aunt... Very nice twist on the story.
Draco bullied because he lived in an oppressive household which taught him to look down on others who aren’t as well off or pure blood as he was. His father would ridicule him in public and forced him to join the death eaters and manipulated him into attempting to kill Dumbledore.
James bullied because he was a better wizard than most others and he had friends to back him up. He had money, a girl, and a future, but still bullied Severus because he had a crush on lily.
They both had redemption arcs. But James didn’t realize he was a bully and change. He just matured as we all do. Draco realized he was on the wrong side and defied not just his families wishes, but the wishes of some of the most powerful wizards in the world.
Their arcs are not alike.
James wasn’t bullied… he was the bully
@@user-tf7nd7ho5o that’s what I said
@@trentwise3762 Ohk
@@trentwise3762 Ohk
Just write you love tom felton 😅
James was always a glory seeker (and literally the team's Seeker). He joined the Order of the Phoenix because he wanted to look good. He only joined after all his friends did. He couldn't NOT join then, and he didn't actually think Voldemort would kill him because he was so arrogant. Did James ever apologize to Snape? Did he really ever show that he changed? He loved his family, but so do a lot of horrible people, that doesn't mean he was a good guy. His best friend was Wormtail, so he obviously had characteristics that went with evil wizards. Lilly sacrificed herself for Harry, not James. If anyone can tell me one nice thing James did to people that weren't his close family and friends...I'll consider that he wasn't just a total jerk. Oh yeah...and he stole Snape's love of his life and made fun of him while doing it. And to say he was just 15...lots of bad people are in jail for life at 15. Malfoy had more of an excuse...James grew up in a rich, loving home.
You know what your problem is: you hate how James is so successful in life so you use whatever flaws he may have (such as being a bully) to bring him down. You did it with Rowling (with her transgender views) and you're doing it with James.
@@paulyb7267😆 I have a signed picture that I got from Rowling when I was 9 years old. I have always been on her side over the whole stupid cancelling thing of her. Just because I hate the character James, doesn't mean I don't like her. There is something seriously wrong with your brain that you instantly made that odd connection....
@@aaronmartin4611Because you're jealous and resentful of James just because he had everything that Snape didn't have.
Also, you're making up stupid and ridiculous reasons (that are not canon) as to why James would join the Order and fight Voldemort. Whether you like him or not, James was just as much of a brave, committed and vital Order member as Moody, the Longbottoms, Sirius, Remus, Kingsley, and the Prewetts. Grow up!
@@paulyb7267 You're telling me to grow up...kid, you're the one getting this mad at me because I said I didn't like a character in a book. You haven't given me any example of James actually being a nice person...but your reaction is alarming. I honestly think you need some meds or something man lol I just said what I thought about a character in a book. Xanax? Lithium? Ask your doctor bro lol I've edited this twice because I'm not trying to be mean...I think you need help. Instead of giving me reasons why you disagreed that I didn't like James, you instead immediately starting personally attacking me. That's not normal behavior. I really hope you figure this out man, because you're going to have a tough life ahead if you don't change. Good luck to you.
@@aaronmartin4611Since you keep banging on about how there is nothing likeable about James Potter, why don't we have a look:
- he befriended people who were considered 'outcasts'
- he became an animagus at a very young age in order to support Remus Lupin during his monthly transformations after finding out the latter was a werewolf (rather than abandoning Remus like most people would have)
- he saved his arch-nemesis Snape's life (and at great risk to his own life) after a prank by one of his friends (a prank that James had no part in)
- he stood up for his friends and other people who were cruelly treated by aspiring-Death Eaters like Snape
- he gave Sirius Black a home to stay in after the latter ran away from his abusive family
- he used his wealth to financially support Remus Lupin (who couldn't find a job due to anti-werewolf laws)
- he strongly disagreed with the concept of blood purity (despite being a pure-blood himself) and was disgusted with any prejudice towards Muggle-borns and did not hold prejudice towards half-breeds (such as Remus Lupin or Rubeus Hagrid, who were two of his dearest friends)
- he joined the Order and took part in battles against Death Eaters and other dark forces and surviving until the end of the war (he and Lily even personally faced Voldemort three times)
- he was willing to sacrifice himself for his wife and son, as demonstrated when he told Lily to take Harry and run while he held off Voldemort, proving himself to be a true Gryffindor.
This is something that a gullible Snape apologist like you refuses to understand.
So just because you have money and belong to the unoppressed pure-blood status, not being a terrorist becomes a huge thing?? Snape dedicated almost 20 years of his life to the good cause. Draco had his moments of redemption....deliberately not recognizing Harry in DH was a huge risk etc. etc. On the other hand this brat sexually assaulted Snape publically for no reason. He deserves no love.
Rubbish. Listen, your jealous and resentful of James simply because he had everything in life that Snape didn't have.
@@paulyb7267 this reply to what I wrote really tells of your thinking so I’d rather not argue. Sure, go on believing that.
The only reason snape ever did anything "good" was for his own selfish reasons. He wanted lily spared, not because shes a wife and a mother, but because HE wanted her. Its not love, its an obsession. All he had to do was not be a racist asshole in school and he prolly could have gotten with her, but because his school crush didn't like him back he spends 20 years bullying and tormenting students. He wasnt fighting the good fight, he didnt know the plan until the very end, he just thought they were trying to keep harry alive for lilys sake. Snape was and always will be a peice of shit who deserves no sympathy
@@Severus.Sit's the same rubbish this idiotic kid is repeating on every comment actually 😂
Totally true 100%
James wanted to be the biggest bully
so he joined
Absolute rubbish. You know, comments like yours make me realize that perhaps it will be much better if there was a prequel centred around James Potter being the main/central character in a story about either the Potter family or the Marauders under James's POV. Maybe that way, it will shut up haters like you for good.
James did the biggest character arc of them all , changing himself completely for the woman he loved and matured so much. Snape never got over Lily even after she was married to James. Draco was still never good and (in my opinion) never had a character arc so I agree
so true!!
Same
Agreed
Idiot!
🤡🤡👹
Only snape!!!
Draco has a character arc to some extent. The problem is that it's incomplete :/
He effectively turned Snape into a lackey of Voldemort. Had he been nice to Snape they'd have a brilliant sorcerer on their side from day 1
nah, anyone blaming james for snape turning death eater is bullshitting themselves, snape did it all on his own, not amount of bullying in school caused that
Friendly reminder that both parties hexed or jinxed each other on every occasion.
three great friends-
also one of them: HEY BALDIE MORTIE I GOT HIS IP ADRESS-
Draco was forced to be the way he was James wasn't and Snape was beaten into what he was
Since you keep banging on about how there is nothing likeable about James Potter, why don't we have a look:
- he befriended people who were considered 'outcasts'
- he became an animagus at a very young age in order to support Remus Lupin during his monthly transformations after finding out the latter was a werewolf (rather than abandoning Remus like most people would have)
- he saved his arch-nemesis Snape's life (and at great risk to his own life) after a prank by one of his friends (a prank that James had no part in)
- he stood up for his friends and other people who were cruelly treated by aspiring-Death Eaters like Snape
- he gave Sirius Black a home to stay in after the latter ran away from his abusive family
- he used his wealth to financially support Remus Lupin (who couldn't find a job due to anti-werewolf laws)
- he strongly disagreed with the concept of blood purity (despite being a pure-blood himself) and was disgusted with any prejudice towards Muggle-borns and did not hold prejudice towards half-breeds (such as Remus Lupin or Rubeus Hagrid, who were two of his dearest friends)
- he joined the Order and took part in battles against Death Eaters and other dark forces and surviving until the end of the war (he and Lily even personally faced Voldemort three times)
- he was willing to sacrifice himself for his wife and son, as demonstrated when he told Lily to take Harry and run while he held off Voldemort, proving himself to be a true Gryffindor.
This is something that a gullible Snape apologist like you refuses to understand.
@@paulyb7267 when did I say there’s nothing likeable about James?
Zero proof. Draco was a guy who loved violence, domination and could've taken help After bis family tell from grace.
@@marcopolo1472 Besides, Draco was never abused, in fact he was spoiled, coddled and given everything he wanted. Draco Malfoy sucks and the onlyy reason why people love and romanticize him is because Tom Felton is hot.
He literally forced Lily to love him by hexing Snape
You know what your problem is: you hate how James is so successful in life so you use whatever flaws he may have (such as being a bully) to bring him down. You did it with Rowling (with her transgender views) and you're doing it with James.
@@paulyb7267 I have no problem with Rowling
@@Johnny2137 Also, there should be less of Snily (which you seem to prefer) and more Jily stories.
@@paulyb7267what an idiotic comment you keep pasting 😂😂😂
@@paulyb7267
Dude are you ok? You randomly accuse people like that in this comment section.
Usually when there is a war like this you don’t have choice
Oh please, in what way is it selfish for James to want to protect people? Protecting people is never selfish.
It really annoys we how much people like Draco and Snape and say they are misunderstood and such when Snape was also a bully, I’m pretty sure in the books it mentions that he hexed muggleborns or his friends did, he helped and befriended death eaters and only tried to do the right thing after the one person he cared about died, he didn’t care that James died and wouldn’t have cared if Harry did, not to mention that even as an adult he still childishly bullied the son of his enemy.
And as for Draco well he bullied Harry and all his friends as well as tried to kill or hurt Harry multiple times, he never even attempted to do anything thing good and just did what he could to weasel his way out of trouble.
Lastly James bullied a kid who didn’t seem very nice anyways when he was 15 but in the end he dedicated his life to try and stop Voldemort, he took Lupin and Sirius in even though Lupin was a werewolf and Sirius had a horrible family. Yet James is the one people talk crap about
Exactly! Thank you for saying this. James was quite the idiot and bully when he was younger, but he grew up and changed!
But he's still a bully. He bullied someone. There's nothing that can change that.
Absolute rubbish. You know, comments like yours make me realize that perhaps it will be much better if there was a prequel centred around James Potter being the main/central character in a story about either the Potter family or the Marauders under James's POV. Maybe that way, it will shut up haters like you for good!
@@bonk78624if the bully grows and matures into a better person that in it self is respectable it's only when he remains a bully even after growing up that we can say he deserves no respect. Because bullying = childishness really.
@@annduruibe625 Did he apologize to Snape for bullying him? Nope. He never did. Just because he's changed doesn't mean he's good. He hurt someone and never apologized. You know that people kill themselves because of being bullied... right? It messes people up. So... for your little two cents... completely unneeded because it paints that just because other people see him as this good guy doesn't excuse his behaviour of hurting another.
I don't hate james but people saying "stan james" is annoying me 😭 i love snape too
If he was punished for what he did and apologised to Snape, then I would agree with your statement.
Being successful or doing good to the world does not give him a jail pass. If he is as great as we think, then he should try his best to fix his wrong doings.
Absolute rubbish. You know, comments like yours make me realize that perhaps it will be much better if there was a prequel centred around James Potter being the main/central character in a story about either the Potter family or the Marauders under James's POV. Maybe that way, it will shut up haters like you for good.
Small bully fighting the big bully to improve his bully status 😂😂
Snape and Draco were neglected and emotionally and Snape probably physically abused and chose the most inappropriate coping mechanisms. James was a well fed, loved and taken care child who became a bully - no excuse .... and unpopular opinion: I don't think the Order of the Phoenix was such a big deal; he didn't become an Auror who lived more dangerously. we don't even know what the order of the phoenix actually did during that time.
I will tell you what your real problem is: you hate how successful a person like James is in life, so you use whatever flaws that this successful person has in order to knock them down. You did it with Rowling (regarding transgender views) and your doing it with James.
Also, Draco was never neglected or abused, in fact he was loved, spoiled, and well taken care of (just like James). The real reason why you are making excuses for Draco and romanticising him is because Tom Felton is hot, period!
@@paulyb7267 you made me chuckle and laugh out loud :D either you posted this on the wrong comment or your logical thinking skills are completely off. But as for Draco: yes, he was emotionally neglected by his father - he never paid any interest in him unless Lucius could use Draco against Dumbledore; this is a form of neglect and the opposite of love
@@xyincognito This is bullshit. Nowhere in the books is Lucius ever neglectful or abusive of Draco, in fact he gives Draco whatever he wants (including buying the whole Slytherin team new broomsticks and having Buckbeak executed for attacking his son).
The only reason why your making all this up is because Tom Felton is hot.
@@paulyb7267 now I'm not pro draco but it was obvius that lucius used his son only to redeem himself infront of voldy
1.)Snape had an abusive and unloved childhood I get it and certainly why he hated marauders is also justified but why he chose to be friends with death eaters instead of Lilly?who was her best friend and never judged him for who he was and he called her mudblood.Also lily always use to curse James unlike Snape yet he never insulted her and James got more mature in his 7th year and stopped bullying people unlike Snape who became a death eater. When he lost lily he still had a chance to become good as a professor yet he chose to bully children.
2.) Draco was a spoilt brat (fact) but he bullied people because his behaviour was justified by his parents and he got bad company no real friends who could stop him from doing this or make him realise it bas bad until he was mature enough to realise he was from the wrong side but he did not had the guts to go against voldemort or his family.
3.) Order of phoenix is a pretty big deal for 18 year old teenagers just out of Hogwarts to join a group where you have to fight against most dangerous and dark wizards with your life on stake just to save the wisarding world (not a big deal obviously) when you can obviously would have lived a pretty luxurious life.Not everybody is that brave and selfless to do that.
Still doesn't Change the fact that he was a bully 😤.
You know what your problem is: you hate how James is so successful in life so you use whatever flaws he may have (such as being a bully) to bring him down. You did it with Rowling (with her transgender views) and you're doing it with James.
It does not matter how he changed, he should apologize to those he bullied at the very least.
Comments like yours make me realize that perhaps it will be much better if there was a prequel centred around James Potter being the main/central character in a story about either the Potter family or the Marauders under James's POV. Maybe that way, it will silence haters like you for good.
I don't HAVE to accept James if I don't want to, I don't have to do anything lol
No. I'll still hate James. He was rich, only son, popular, bully. He was a bully for a whole 7 years before he "supposedly" changed . Severus was bully because he had a character to portray on the command of albums and to maintain his spy status. Severus was poor, abused, insecure as child and no one, not a single adult was there for him through his teenage years. He had nothing. Of course he would join Voldemort when that extremely charming and manipulative man was the first person to tell him that he is worthy, he promised Severus respect, glory and acceptance when the whole world turned away from him. James potter, Sirius black and their friends will always be bullies.
Agreed 4 sure
Snape also had childhood trauma
YES!
This!
THANK YOU!!!
This is quite hypocritical
Snape only had a cover to maintain for the last 3 books the first 3 he was jerk for the hell of it and being abused and bullied doesn’t excuse that it makes it worse
nah but i still don't get how ppl actually think snape had a so called 'redemption arc' dude- maybe in the movies he did, or maybe ppl just love movie snape because of alan rickman- idk-- but in the books, snape was the biggest bully EVER- im not kidding- he was the most selfish character to ever exist, he switched sides only when he got to know that lily was in danger, he didn't actually care about anyone else other than lily, he begged dumbledore to save lily, when Dumbledore replied saying that snape was selfish and didn't even care about the boy-- snape was like 'yeah, save the kid too- or whatever'
nah i seriously don't think snape deserves the love he's been getting-- also Draco too didn't have any strong sort of 'redemption'
anyway, i do think james got his redemption arc very well when compared to snape and draco
kiddo, you're still affected by fanfics, you're talking rubbish, go read the books
@@user-eg7dz5ff5e bruh I've read the books- go read em... have you read it tho? because all the ppl who have actually read it share same views-- if you dont know sh*t dont go calling ppl on the internet kids u dont know me
Exactly Draco and Snape were mean horrible bully’s and only did the right thing for their own selfish reasons yet everyone talks shit about James for being a bully when he was 15 even though he dedicated his life to the downfall of Voldemort meanwhile Snape is besties with the death eaters
Right but see, Snape was a DEATH EATER when he made that request to Dumbledore. He was still a bad guy. So of course he's not gonna give a shit about Harry or James' life (side note, why should he even care about the life of someone who made his own life a living hell all those years?)
Later in the chapter though we see that Snape did care for other people. He regrets not being able to save the lives of others ("how many people have you watched die?" "Lately, only those who I could not save") and is outraged that Dumbledore essentially raised Harry to die. Granted it's more out of love for Lily than Harry but Snape undeniably had a redemption arc, he died to save the Wizarding world.
So did James
I have a friend who is a victim of bullies, let say people change to be better, but the pain and trauma bullies inflicted on their victim will never fade, so is the guilt
Comments like yours make me realize that perhaps it will be much better if there was a prequel centred around James Potter being the main/central character in a story about either the Potter family or the Marauders under James's POV. Maybe that way, it will silence haters like you for good.
@@paulyb7267 I am not a hater, I am probably neutral in this subject since they are only fictional characters. It is a pretty complicate subject for me too, and I have been advicing my friend that people changed and that what they did as a child is because they are immature. But trying to understand my friend feeling that it does not matter they changed or not, it just feel unfair that despite the fact that the bullies are the one who made them miserable are now living happily and they supposed to live with the fact that they can't blame anyone and continue to suffer the trauma that never seem to fade.
And my friend doesnt even blame that person anymore, she blame herseft for being too weak to deal with this world and because of that she can never be happy, just because some kids decided that they were bored. That was cruel. And for someone who was that cruel to be hail a hero really feel unfair. I just like the people to acknowledge this, just because you turn out fine now doesnt mean the pain you inflicted to other people in the past is gone. But people rarely say sorry or admit that they was cruel to something that happen like 10 years ago.
In James situation, I would love to have a prequel centering that and show how much Jame redeem himself and tried to help Snape, admit his past wrongdoing and cruelness, but Snape just show his hateful and cold nature, revealing what made him the person he become in later year (Snape isnt a good person, he trully believe Muggle born to be inferior, look down on others, mean and cruel as opposed to Harry who has a good heart).
To be clear, I dont hate James, but my friend does, she hates bullies overall. I liked Bakugo, but I dont mention it in front of her. I feel like because of some people past, they have a harder time forgiving bullies characters. And people going around justifying bullies action feel cruel to the victims. Say that they changed don't help either.
@@paulyb7267 Sorry I talked too much
James, Sirius, and Draco grew up and fought against evil. Snape really didn’t change. He grew up became a big bully working for the greatest evil bully of all time and only turned away from evil when his boss killed the woman he loved. Yes at that point he did fight against Voldemort but continued being a bully to little kids. Draco and Sirius really are the two who grew up in the same situation. Both of them were pure bloods whose parents were blood purity fanatics. Sirius fought against that early on, from his meeting James on the train until his death. Draco started fighting against it when he realized Voldemort had given him a task he was meant to dying trying to do just to punish his father more. James was a bully which is wrong, but his bullying was focused on those who were cruel and used the dark arts. It doesn’t make it right. He never bullied someone just for being shy, or muggle born. He truly redeemed himself completely and was willing to die to protect people he didn’t even know.
But he decided by hisself that he wanted to be a bully, snape and Draco were forced to
Absolute rubbish. You know, comments like yours make me realize that perhaps it will be much better if there was a prequel centred around James Potter being the main/central character in a story about either the Potter family or the Marauders under James's POV. Maybe that way, it will shut up haters like you for good!
snape was not forced to be bully when he was teacher, he literally decided to bully all griffindoor students for no reason for years
James had to fight for Lilly. He couldn't just not take a side with a muggle born wife.
Yes, but why you make a question question like was a bad thing
Yes, he could. He could flee with his family like other muggle-born families did during the fist Wizarding war
Two. Two great friends.
How paradox to stand against the biggest bully but being oneself
JK Rowling has recently admitted about how unnerved she is at the James Potter bashing. Rowling feels that James is more sympathetic than either Draco or Dudley.
Yet he never apologized to Snape, you can’t undo something with doing another good thing. It is like hitting your brother and helping your sister, does that erase what you did? No, once a bully always a bully. Snape was so traumatized by it that in POA he hated Lupin and Sirius still for what they done. Even bullies have good friends, the Marauders were just another extension of James’s bullying.
We have to acknowledge that James is a pos.
Since you keep banging on about how there is nothing likeable about James Potter, why don't we have a look:
- he befriended people who were considered 'outcasts'
- he became an animagus at a very young age in order to support Remus Lupin during his monthly transformations after finding out the latter was a werewolf (rather than abandoning Remus like most people would have)
- he saved his arch-nemesis Snape's life (and at great risk to his own life) after a prank by one of his friends (a prank that James had no part in)
- he stood up for his friends and other people who were cruelly treated by aspiring-Death Eaters like Snape
- he gave Sirius Black a home to stay in after the latter ran away from his abusive family
- he used his wealth to financially support Remus Lupin (who couldn't find a job due to anti-werewolf laws)
- he strongly disagreed with the concept of blood purity (despite being a pure-blood himself) and was disgusted with any prejudice towards Muggle-borns and did not hold prejudice towards half-breeds (such as Remus Lupin or Rubeus Hagrid, who were two of his dearest friends)
- he joined the Order and took part in battles against Death Eaters and other dark forces and surviving until the end of the war (he and Lily even personally faced Voldemort three times)
- he was willing to sacrifice himself for his wife and son, as demonstrated when he told Lily to take Harry and run while he held off Voldemort, proving himself to be a true Gryffindor.
This is something that a gullible Snape apologist like you refuses to understand.
@@paulyb7267 James was very good to the people he chose to befriend. Not so much everyone else. Even saving Snape's life was trying to save his friend first and foremost. And while there was some risk, he could have easily switched to his Animagus form and been safe.
Snape saved a lot of people he didn't even like and who never appreciated what he did for them in his lifetime. To me, that is far more noble.
@@wvu05absolutely
Even Draco didn't sexually harrass people and he had some remorse 😂. He was a nasty bully , but James was on an entirely different level and Snape wasn't his only victim . Yes , he changed ... But doesn't mean I need to love him ; nor do I love Snape the child abuser. JK Rowling could write as much about a toxic person getting changed by love and becoming great , doesn't mean I need to accept that . If anything, I love Regulus Black more , who literally joined the dark side out of his own accord yet chose to die stealing a Horcrux ... when he was mere 16/17.
I agree. You can change if you want.
For his own sense of bravado and bravery and self gratification
Absolute rubbish. You know, comments like yours make me realize that perhaps it will be much better if there was a prequel centred around James Potter being the main/central character in a story about either the Potter family or the Marauders under James's POV. Maybe that way, it will shut up haters like you for good!
@@paulyb7267 well... He was a gryffindor, it fits.
I mean, gryffindor house is known to do the brave thing instead of the smart, sensible or ambitious thing
@@edmundprice5276 And here is why you are definitely wrong and why James was a true Gryffindor:
*- He was brave:* Along with his wife, Lily, he repeatedly acted against Voldemort to such an extent that Trelawney’s prophecy specifically stated that they’d defied The Dark Lord three times. Then, when Voldemort did find them, James tried to hold him off so that Lily could escape with Harry.
*- He was daring:* Take the way he and Sirius set themselves and Peter Pettigrew the task of becoming Animagi so they could accompany Lupin on his wolfish forays. True, Lupin called those little escapades ‘the best times of my life’, so it was clearly an act of support that meant a lot to him. But the fact this also required a lot of rebellion would’ve likely attracted James to the task too. Sirius, who was also no stranger to rebellion, later compared Harry to James (Sirius replied: The risk would’ve been what made it fun for James.’) - even though by Marauder standards, Harry was, comparatively, a lot more careful. A risk-taker with a dislike of authority and an appetite for troublemaking. Sounds like quite a few Gryffindors we know.
*- He was chivalrous:* He considered it the greatest insult to mistrust his friends and stood up for Lily when Snape called her a mudblood.
*- He was loyal:* His closest friends were those many people would turn away from. He also helped his friends more than anyone else in his friend group, giving Sirius a second home and financially supporting Remus.
*- He was arrogant:* At least at age 15. The most popular boy in school, the most talented, and the Quidditch star. Of course James had a big head. The only other thing to say in mitigation is that James was certainly not the only Gryffindor whose bravery came with a healthy side-order of arrogance. Sirius was almost as bad; Dumbledore, in his youth, was arrogant enough to think he and Gellert Grindelwald might unite the Deathly Hallows and so conquer death; even Harry had, as Hermione called it, ‘a bit of a - saving-people thing…’ which often led him to ignore other people’s advice.
*- He was reckless:* Another Gryffindor-esque trait Harry and his father shared was a tendency to act before thinking. Not as bad as Sirius, but James never thought about consequences. He just did what he wanted, the worst was running the grounds with a werewolf. Lupin said there were near misses. When Sirius told Harry James enjoyed taking risks, he said it with a sense of pride, but such actions usually come with consequences.
A patronus/animagus (which we CANNOT choose) can only take the form of the animal that represents our true personality and inner traits. There is a reason why James's animagus and patronus took the form of a stag (a male deer); as the kings of the forest, stags are considered noble and they symbolize/represent *leadership, courage, pride, masculinity, nobility, power, freedom, purity (not unlike the unicorn), stamina, virility, grace, instincts, maturity, regeneration, and spiritual enlightenment.* Both James and Harry had these stag-like traits, and most of these stag traits were Gryffindor traits.
You may not like him, but like his son, James certainly had lion-esque energy that flowed through to Harry.
James is one of the bravest character in the series.
But he wanted the fame in true griffindor fashion
“Uh uh “
-Snape said calmly
He "selflessly" joined a secret society headed by the most powerful wizard alive against a foe that would of required him to kill his wife and child due to their "dirty" blood. He only "changed" when the world forced him to change.
Rubbish, you're making up stupid and ridiculous reasons (that are not canon) as to why James would join the Order and fight Voldemort. Whether you like him or not, James was just as much of a brave, committed and vital Order member as Moody, the Longbottoms, Sirius, Remus, Kingsley, and the Prewetts. Grow up!
Love Snape, Tolerate Draco, Hate teenage James.
YES!
What makes you love Snape?
Adult Snape=Teenaged James
Both were huge bullies that tormented people for fun, had an unrequited love for Lily and opposed Voldemort
Edit:well, fun/because they could
@@geordineilson5476
James hexed and SAd classmates.
Just for fun!
Severus would never do that!
Yes both bullied, but James bullied cause of fun and Severus cause he had a trauma.
James was more worse than Severus.
@@keinname9912 mental trauma from bullying is just as bad what James did, and Snape was the thing Neville feared most. Snape traumatised who knows how many students.
People who agree have not read the books.
James was a bully who bullied and cursed many of his classmates just for fun!
James SAd Severus!
James tried to blackmail Lily into a date!
And James never stopped bullying, nor did he ever apologize or regret it.
He also made fun of Vernon when he first saw him!
James never matured and just because he joined the Order doesn't mean he matured and became a good person.
Ok you’re saying that James never matured but Snape wasn’t much better. I mean do you accept Snape’s character arc ? If so why don’t you accept James’s? Snape was a 32 year old bully bullying 11 year old kids James was 15 and he did grow out of it.
@@dalilamata
Snapes Bullying was wrong too.
But the age is not an Excuse.
James Bullying was wrong.
And Snapes Bullying was wrong.
And James never "did grow of it".
He never stopped the bullying and was mean to Vernon and made fun of him when he FIRST SAW HIM.
@@keinname9912 Rubbish, James never made fun of Vernon, it was the other way around (Vernon trying to patronise James). If you think that a child abusing monster like Vernon is better than James then you must be living on another planet.
@@paulyb7267
James made fun of Vernon.
(According by Pottermore)
And i never said that Vernon is better.
@@keinname9912 What, by simply describing his broomstick (after Vernon patronisingly asked what car he drove)? By explaining to Vernon about Gringotts and the fortune his family had (after Vernon suggested he lived on unemployment benefits)? The only person who was in the wrong in all this was Vernon. James was even willing to make up with Vernon (when he shouldn't be and when it should have been Vernon apologizing) but only for Vernon to ignore him. If you think that James did any wrong in this (when it was Vernon), then you really are thick in the head.
Snape and Draco were victims of circumstance, James wasn’t, Draco became like that because of his death eater father and Snape became like that due to his upbringing.
He was a bully and even when talking to Harry with the Resurrection stone brought him back . Lily was the one who showed more love for Harry than anyone
James bullied Harry when talking to him with the Resurrection Stone, don't make me laugh 😂😂
I just can’t just accept James. He bullied snape so much and I know he went off to fight Voldemort and he joined the order of the phoenix, but snape also fought for Voldemort, he was the only witch or wizard to be an undercover death eater and tricked Voldemort himself. James did seem like he had a lot going for him and fighting against Voldemort seems like a selfless thing to do, which it is, but snape gave his whole life to protecting Harry and being an undercover death eater. He still protected Harry even though it reminded him of James because they were so similar and that probably made him upset thinking back to how he was bullied by James and how James got to marry lily and he didn’t. Also seeing lily’s eyes in Harry made him hurt because that was always the love of his life, he never stopped loving her despite her being married to James his bully and also despite her being dead. Which that also brought pain to him. People saw him as evil, a death eater, even though he was fighting for good the whole time, despite all his pain. Even mcgonagall casted spells at snape in the one of the Deathly Hallows movies and snape still only used defensive spells, not trying to hurt anyone, only defending himself. Everyone always thought he was bad because he was a death eater and killed dumbledore. Snape was constantly trying to protect Harry and no one knew it except dumbledore until after snape died. Snape deserves so much more credit, he was a great man.
AGREE!
Everything about that was wrong. Snape didn't give two shits about harry. The ONLY reason he does anything good in the books is guilt from lilys death.(he was mad because HE could not have her) He would have gladly let both harry and james die if voldy let lilly live, he would have happily kept carryout out voldermorts orders. He relentlessy bullies children because he is insecure and a loser, he was nowhere near a man, he was simply a tool thay Dumbledore realized he could use, he diues just as cruel and just as selfish as hes ever been
@@gagefogle2607 Honestly, how do you think that Snape could have fulfilled his mission if he was kindly like Flitwick or Sprout? How could Harry have completed his mission if Snape didn't stop trying to staunch his wound so Harry could find out the truth? Without Snape, Voldemort wins, period.
Except for the fact that Snape was willing to let Voldemort kill James and Harry. He got sad because Lily died boohoo. He only switched side because Lily died not because he was a good person or a 'great person'.
@@hisinddjsomnsl He switched sides before Lily died.
I feel the same way when it comes to Percy, it’s pretty irritating how hypocritical fans are by hating him but adoring Snape and Malfoy, especially when Percy actually had a redemption moment in the books and his actions weren’t as horrible as those two, nor were they as bad as fans make it out to be.
This channel is idiot, such like you! 🤮🤢🤮
True fans hate James and Percy. Idiot!
Lol those who hate Percy are general fans of Harry Potter, especailly since the most occuring thing in Harry Potter is the rule breaking, Percy who is a stuck up to rule would look bad to Harry Potter fans. And no, Snape fans doesn't hate Percy, it's just your imagination.
Who even is percy💀😭
People hate Percy and praise Narcissa Malfoy, who supported the deatheater goals her entire life, raised her son to be a bigot, abused her slave to the point where he snapped, and condemned Snape to death unless he committed murder for her family,
The woman is absolute trash, but had one second of "good" in her, that was also just about her son.
RIGHT?!? It annoys me that people are like “Oh but Draco was just a kid, he had a bad influence, he is a good person!” But when it comes to james, they are acting as if he was the most horrible person in the world. If you wanna accept draco, u gotta accept james, he was also just a dumb teenager, JUST LIKE DRACO. But guess what? He turned out to be a better person than draco. (Despite the fact that they were in two different generations)
“Yes it was James Potter who had the ego the size of a lake, but a heart to match it.”
I accept nothing. James sexually assaulted Snape.
Absolutely True 100%, and these despicable kids who stan him keep romanticizing his character because of some silly fanfics that are totally different from canon
Snape killed almost 60 muggles to become one of the most trusted Voldemort's counselors. I think we can all pass through the fact that James lifted Snape's pants after Snape harmed with Dark Arts a Gryffindor muggle-born
Curious as to where you pulled that number out of your ass because there is no canon writing about how many people severus killed, only that he was Voldemort's chosen council member after revealing the prophecy of his downfall, and voldemort granted he would do his best to not kill Lily to him. Snape only joined the death eaters under peer pressure, as all of his friends at hogwarts joined them and drug him along. @@aurelioscorrano5389
First of all, no he did not. What he did was not okay, but it wasn’t sexual assualt. Second of all, James got a grip and stopped being a bully, whereas Snape continued to be that way. Anything good Snape ever did was because of Lily, not the greater good. He didn’t care about anyone except Lily, in an obsessive creepy way.
@@misschanandlerbong753 exposing someone's underwear/genitals without their consent is sexual assault.
The reason why so many potterheads love Draco because Tom Felton was very handsome in his teenage years
When they like a Harry Potter character just because he/she is handsome, they are not potterheads(my opinion)
OR he just wanted to be a big hero, a big chad who saves the day.
Rubbish, you're making up stupid and ridiculous reasons (that are not canon) as to why James would join the Order and fight Voldemort. Whether you like him or not, James was just as much of a brave, committed and vital Order member as Moody, the Longbottoms, Sirius, Remus, Kingsley, and the Prewetts. Grow up!
In real life. Not all bully’s learn their mistakes. Sometimes they amplify them.
I think the conditional statement here is 'if you accept Snape and draco's Arc'....no.
Nah. I bet he joined the order because Lilly did. Screw that guy.
Absolute rubbish. You know, comments like yours make me realize that perhaps it will be much better if there was a prequel centred around James Potter being the main/central character in a story about either the Potter family or the Marauders under James's POV. Maybe that way, it will shut up haters like you for good.
The reason he joined the order is because Voldemort wanted non magical folk dead, his soon to be wife was not from a magical lineage, so he didn't join the order out of selfless reasons
Rubbish, you're making up stupid and ridiculous reasons (that are not canon) as to why James would join the Order and fight Voldemort. Whether you like him or not, James was just as much of a brave, committed and vital Order member as Moody, the Longbottoms, Sirius, Remus, Kingsley, and the Prewetts. Grow up!
I don't know man. I would imagine that before their schooling was over the two probably got into some unforgivable fights like Harry and Draco did in the half blood prince. Considering James was only 20 when he died, then I think it would be safe to assume Snape had already joined the death eaters by the time he left hogworts. Voldamort was untrustworthy in general, but he did try to be fair to his followers. I would imagine he would think in terms of "an attack on the kings men is the same as an attack on the king himself" to steal a quote from the movie Braveheart. Then, bring in the fact that Lily was muggle born, I doubt even leaving her would have spelled much for his future having fraternized with her at all. Add the final nail in the coffin of the prophecy, and I would argue his choices were all about survival and a promise of protection by Dumbledore. Sure, he was brave like most grifindors, but like most people, he had a duality about him. He was a rich ass hole that ended up on the right side. He had no choice in the matter. Voldamort would have killed him no matter what he did. Best pick an ally opposed to that person, especially if they are offering. Also, consider this. Who was in the original order? James his 3 best friends his wife his wife's best friend his professor and the longbottoms who got caught up in the same prophecy! That's almost half of the order right there. The order wasn't some Rebel army fighting against the evil empire. It was some kids trying to save their own asses and got some help from some adults. Maybe I'm being cynical here, but come on. James turned 18 and suddenly became virtuous? Naw, he was a basturd that history will remember favorably.
You know what your problem is: you hate how James is so successful in life so you use whatever flaws he may have (such as being a bully) to bring him down. You did it with Rowling (with her transgender views) and you're doing it with James.
James was the best Marauder because:
1. He was a wealthy pureblood, but was pro-Muggle and defended Muggleborns like Lily
2. He joined the Order of the Phoenix (they all did but still)
3. Unlike Sirius and Snape, he saw Remus as a person, not a monster
4. He gave Sirius, a victim of abuse, a home, family and brotherhood
5. He was a good husband, unlike Remus
6. He was a loving father
7. Because unlike Snape, he grew out of his arrogance and immaturity
why would sirius think remus is a monster
@@huealexg3068 Mainly due to “the Prank” where Sirius lured Snape into the Whomping Willow when Remus was in his wolf form. Luckily it failed because James got Snape out in time but what if wolf!Remus had actually killed Snape, he wouldn’t have only been expelled, but he would face additional discrimination from the Wizarding World and would forever have to live with the fact that he took someone’s life
I don't think Sirius has ever seen Lupin as a monster
Well, I can quite understand why Remus acted like that. James was just a normal human, unlike Remus, so he could just marry his sweetheart without any problems. Remus had had regrets. He didn’t want to make the lives of his loved ones harder
Well said.
I agree. Yes James was arrogant but he changed for the better.
youre the type that will forgive Cosby once he's interviewed by that tnuc Oprah
@@Mr.woman_lover that's completely different.
The problem is that we never saw his character arc. He went from asshole to suddenly being amazing in a few years, but we never see him change. So many just assume that he remained an asshole.
I think he has “two” great friends 😂😂
I agree but if you read the book then you have to be confused why he got married to Lily when she hated him.
Remus and Sirius explain that he grew up in 6 and 7 years, he became a Head Boy, witch mean that he was respected to be name HB, and during that year she fall in love with him, the explain that he grew up
Many things here need fixing:
1.The fact his father is a bully has nothing to do with his dedicating fight against Voldy,cause those r 2 differrent things.And remember this:anyone comes from Griffindors always fight against bully,so no surprise that he joined The Order of the Phoenix
2.I agree,we have to except James's character,but we have right to hate him for bullying Snape,right?Didn't u see how this fact was mention....gently:big-head born from a wealthy family got a lot of friend so they pick up some rebel kids to bully,sounds familiar?Mrs Rowling was trying to tell us that happens everydays,so bullies like James is always there,so we have to protect ourselves
He- "3 biggest friends"
Me- Remember wormtail was one of them
You could also look at it as he joined because he enjoyed being the centre of attention and being seen as a hero and dragged his wife and newborn child to their deaths. Only be sheer chance did his child not die because of his need to play the hero.
Rubbish, you're making up stupid and ridiculous reasons (that are not canon) as to why James would join the Order and fight Voldemort. Whether you like him or not, James was just as much of a brave, committed and vital Order member as Moody, the Longbottoms, Sirius, Remus, Kingsley, and the Prewetts. Grow up!
@@paulyb7267 Absolutely no evidence against what I said.
@@silentkaine9352Why? Because you hate the fact that James was a brave and selfless Order member and not a ruthless and bloodthirsty Death Eater like you would have preferred in your headcanons?
@paulyb7267 jesus you're nute and over assuming
He joined because his wife was muggle born and would be killed this is the most stupid point I’ve read all day, he couldn’t change anything about his wife or sons death because it was told in a prophecy which would always come true! He didn’t drag his son in when he had him he went into hiding to protect him!
It's true that you can't really judge people based on who they were when they were 15 years old. Most people learn, grow, and become better people.
If I got hung upside down and threatened to get my underpants taken off at 15, I don't need to apologize to you for the person I will become. Shut the fuck up
I feel like, if you've gone through the experience of not having a parent around to visually prove a change, it's more true to real life. You have to rely on the words of those who knew your parent in ways you didn't, and trust that they aren't giving you rose-colored visions of their late friend.
exactly! Snape was a death eater and a faithful servant of the Dark lord before Lily's death. James might have been a bully, but it was when he was only a teen and as he gained maturity, he gave it up. We should also remember that he bullied only a few dark wizards like Snape and they actually deserve it since they torture other people.
While James gave up bullying as he was growing, Snape did bullying even when he had gained maturity and became an adult
James is really better than Snape and people still like Snape better
Snape switched sides before Lily died.
because we couldnt saw James mature, but I like his arc,
Snape would have let Harry and James or just any other family die without pity. He had no empathy for murdered BABIES. If he'd met anyone but Dumbledore, he would've been arrested or murdered on the spot. And judging by his death eater history, most people would've assumed they were Saving countless future lives.
@@marcopolo1472 But he did go to Dumbledore, and he did the things necessary to make saving the world from Voldemort possible. Either redemption is a thing, or it isn't. If it isn't, then a) hell is going to be a pretty full place, and b) no one who ever does bad can ever have any hope and might as well just give into depravity fully. Great lesson.
Like for James Potter!!
Liked
Liked
Yeah but he caused an entire generation of Gryffindors to hate potions class
2 great friends
Problem is even if he didn't join the order the prophecy would still stand and idk if they would know what to do that time too
Exact! Finally someone who speaks up for James, I see too much hatred towards him and too many excuses for the victimization of Snape and Draco, in my opinion James was far better than them
Even JK Rowling has admitted how unnerved she is at people who bash James and glorify Draco, stating that she finds James more sympathetic than either Draco or Dudley. Rowling never intended for Draco to be so loved and for James to be so hated.
@@paulyb7267 In fact it's the fandom's fault, they're too blinded by Draco's "beauty" to really figure out who's worse
@@marcosalvini4561 Absolutely. If we only had the books and not the movies (and therefore no Tom Felton) then I highly doubt Draco Malfoy would be that popular.
@@paulyb7267 YES THATS IT Same thing for Snape and Alan Rickman
I'm surprised people will excuse any of them, they all suck. They're good characters but as people they're revolting.