I swapped out melee mastery for upper hand and it made a WORLD of difference. Not being able to be knocked back by heavy attacks is HUGE! You can parry inside of a group of 6-7 majoris and still get your gunstrikes off and not be interupprted. And if you gunstrike any damage you take that is contested health, you immediately restore it. The extra 10% on majoris damage i didn't even really notice it. My chainsword still slices and dices. I really recommend it. Especially because parrying is so easy with vangaurd and the only time i have some trouble is when I'm surrounded by majoris enemies and i keep getting heavy hit out of my gunstrikes. Also my favorite one - two combo starter with tip of the spear enemies take 15% more ranged damage was using grapple > melta shot to the face on entry and then my kick combo and another melta or often times they do a parryable attack then so you can gun strike and then melta.
Melta is not the strongest for all applications. In your own video you nicely show doing very low damage against the neurothrope. Instigator is a serious option for extremis/terminus if your team has limited ranged damage. Important to know: instigator does about 2x damage against *ranged* enemies (carrying guns) and can be used to delete them quickly.
Agreed, also there’s a big overlap between the vanguards melee perks/strengths and the meltas close range. With the instigator you have a ranged option for bosses and your buffed up chainsword can deal with everything up close
Neurothropes and Zoanthropes are special cases. Because their entire hitbox is basically a floating head, other weapons are basically getting a 4x damage multiplier on every single shot, which makes meltas feel weak by comparison because meltas (and plasmas) don't get a headshot multiplier.
For sure, but if i queue up in a random and the other two are assault and bulwark, I'll just play tactical. I play vangaurd only if we have a sniper, tactical, or heavy in my group. Although i have been able to consistently bear neurothropes with assult, bulwark, vangaurd with melta team composition before 😅. It just takes longer because we have to wait for him to land.
All ranged guns do 2x more damage to ranged enemies its not just the instigator. I'm not sure where this myth came from. The melta also does 2x more damage to ranged enemies carrying guns. The only things that don't are the multimelta which does the same damage to ranged and melee (which is a lot of damage) and grenade launcher which is even more damage.
Nice Guide! I hated on Vanguard until I saw the 10% heal perk. Decided to try it last after maxing everything (not Heavy) Then it became my FAV class! It's epic
Thx! Hands down best signature perk! Just in general some of the strongest perks in the game. Thats why I think he lacks some build variety, certain perks are so superior you can't not take them without making you considerably weaker. One of my FAV's too!
@donaldstarkey3364 yea only executions or if you keep choping them down with your melee weapon and they die. Unfortunately gun strike executions don't count for the adrenaline rush perk
Good breakdown. Vanguard was the last class I leveled up but was surprised at just how fun it was. I'm with you on us needing some better perk viability and the other melee types needing something else to help with parries. Maybe dodging window is increased + can dodge at anytime when not using fencing? IDK. Bolters really need some love too, they just don't feel good to use (Stalker bolt being the exception and I don't even consider Grenade launcher one a bolt rifle). The game is incredibly fun though. I really hope they do horde mode right and add some variety into operations. Maybe an option to skip the downtime and same chatter you hear over and over, and some more dynamic events here and there. The AI director does a good job at making them always fun, but something else to break up the monotony of essentially doing a single player mission over and over would be nice. More XP for the longer missions is necessary too. If you're being optimal with leveling you really just want to spam mission 1.
Dude. Every class in this game is fun as hell, IMO. That's what I love about it. I have squeezed 200 hours of enjoyment out of the game because I have loved the experience of leveling every class and every weapon. All of the classes feel unique and have their own strengths and weaknesses. And if you are good at playing them, each one can be OP after. One game I'll be running around as a Sniper spending like 40% of my time in stealth and just headhunting majoris enemies. The next game I'll be leaping through the air slamming down a thunder hammer and popping off meaty gunstrikes as assault. Next game I'll be an invincible Bulwark. Man I love this game.
@@connman8d617 I 100% agree man, the game is incredibly fun and rewarding as your skills improve and you better manage swimming around in the horde, spacing, parries/dodges. Every class is super fun, but I can definitely feel the pace of fights are slower when you're not with a meta OP team composition. Its not a problem or anything its a PVE game after all, just would be nice to see some of the under performing guns get a little more love so they feel a little more satisfying to use like the bolters.
I kind of wish they differentiated the perks a bit by what melee weapon you use for vangaurd. So instead of thr 3rd row it could be like with combat knife increase weapon speed by a certain amount for 10 seconds after perfect parry or perfect dodge, and with chainsword increase stagger of heavy hits for 10 seconds after perfect parry or perfect dodge so that you can stun them out of heavy hits and orange hits. I feel like that would make for some really fun game play.
@@Bigborian92783 I like that idea. If its a perk though I'd rather just see those as flat buffs vs more conditional temporary ones. Like you said, lean into the weapons strengths.
Thx! For my bolt pistol I like to take either the ammo or firepower version, depending how good you are at conserving ammo... For perks I do the bottom line straight across, is a 20%dmg increase and 30% magazine increase in total.
If I've learned anything from years in gaming it's that animation canceling rarely gets nerfed. It raises the skill cap so high that 90% of players can't even manage it while still contending with everything else that's happening on screen. The 10% of players that can make use of animation canceling to eke out that little bit of extra dps or survivability deserve those rewards.
Haven't played to many with Vanguard yet but what worked best for me was the Definitive Build setup from this guide paired with the Melta and Chainsword. Your Grapple only really use it closer to you group for knockbacks and dmg. Do not pull yourself across the map without a quick way back. Overall- play a little slower than you normally would really keeping it tight with your team. Until they fix how this armor thing works on lethal.
Yes melta is strong, but it's not even fun ... for real please delete that gun from the game it makes no sense, and also it's not what it is supposed to be. Melta is supposed to be focus anti monster and suck at clearing hordes, this is the exact opposite ...
Speak for yourself buddy, every gun has its uses and all of them can be fun. Just because you’re not having fun with it doesn’t mean it should get deleted.
@@TH3MRH1P3R I keep my position. For the tabletop game lover. This gun is mis conceived. It should melt big target not hords. Then that is the only gun that can be used easily in grey version even in ruthless difficulty. This is the easy mode of the game encewhy it must be nerfed badly. In any build melta will be the strongest option. If you are honest with yourself you know it deserves to be received like a nerf in stats or effects. This is for the balance of the game.
i agree with you about that melta is boring, but this is personal. The fact is that, against a neurotophe/zoantrope and against hive tyrant, you feel quiet harmless... but you feel harmless even with occulus (even on minoris), so the last slot is for istigator... and at the end, you finish up landing on melta again :)
@@belshiro I disagree. With tactical I went stalker. And this is really good ! For the vanguard I went instigator which is really strong as well at popping elite and being better into neurothrope. Since I started with those. I never went back to melta. To be honest the game was too easy with melta that I nearly dropped the all game ...
I swapped out melee mastery for upper hand and it made a WORLD of difference. Not being able to be knocked back by heavy attacks is HUGE! You can parry inside of a group of 6-7 majoris and still get your gunstrikes off and not be interupprted. And if you gunstrike any damage you take that is contested health, you immediately restore it. The extra 10% on majoris damage i didn't even really notice it. My chainsword still slices and dices. I really recommend it. Especially because parrying is so easy with vangaurd and the only time i have some trouble is when I'm surrounded by majoris enemies and i keep getting heavy hit out of my gunstrikes.
Also my favorite one - two combo starter with tip of the spear enemies take 15% more ranged damage was using grapple > melta shot to the face on entry and then my kick combo and another melta or often times they do a parryable attack then so you can gun strike and then melta.
Melta is not the strongest for all applications. In your own video you nicely show doing very low damage against the neurothrope. Instigator is a serious option for extremis/terminus if your team has limited ranged damage. Important to know: instigator does about 2x damage against *ranged* enemies (carrying guns) and can be used to delete them quickly.
I feel that the Melta rifle is dependent on team composition. If you’re running with a bulwark and assault, you need a ranged weapon with some reach.
Agreed, also there’s a big overlap between the vanguards melee perks/strengths and the meltas close range. With the instigator you have a ranged option for bosses and your buffed up chainsword can deal with everything up close
Neurothropes and Zoanthropes are special cases. Because their entire hitbox is basically a floating head, other weapons are basically getting a 4x damage multiplier on every single shot, which makes meltas feel weak by comparison because meltas (and plasmas) don't get a headshot multiplier.
For sure, but if i queue up in a random and the other two are assault and bulwark, I'll just play tactical. I play vangaurd only if we have a sniper, tactical, or heavy in my group.
Although i have been able to consistently bear neurothropes with assult, bulwark, vangaurd with melta team composition before 😅. It just takes longer because we have to wait for him to land.
All ranged guns do 2x more damage to ranged enemies its not just the instigator. I'm not sure where this myth came from. The melta also does 2x more damage to ranged enemies carrying guns. The only things that don't are the multimelta which does the same damage to ranged and melee (which is a lot of damage) and grenade launcher which is even more damage.
Nice Guide! I hated on Vanguard until I saw the 10% heal perk. Decided to try it last after maxing everything (not Heavy) Then it became my FAV class! It's epic
Thx! Hands down best signature perk! Just in general some of the strongest perks in the game. Thats why I think he lacks some build variety, certain perks are so superior you can't not take them without making you considerably weaker. One of my FAV's too!
@@MoProduktionsthe armor return perk on gun shot with assault is amazing too, I love assault so much thanks to it
does executions count as melee kills for this perk??
As long its Major level or higher yes it does, very strong perk!
@donaldstarkey3364 yea only executions or if you keep choping them down with your melee weapon and they die. Unfortunately gun strike executions don't count for the adrenaline rush perk
Melee with balanced combat knife using the infinite heavy blade dancing thingy is amazing in big hordes. Fun, good damage and great survival.
good video man 👍 wanted to try this class more seems cool
Instigator carbine rifle with the combat knife with the perk to gain health on each majoris kill is all I need. Vanguard is #1 🔥
Good breakdown. Vanguard was the last class I leveled up but was surprised at just how fun it was. I'm with you on us needing some better perk viability and the other melee types needing something else to help with parries. Maybe dodging window is increased + can dodge at anytime when not using fencing? IDK. Bolters really need some love too, they just don't feel good to use (Stalker bolt being the exception and I don't even consider Grenade launcher one a bolt rifle).
The game is incredibly fun though. I really hope they do horde mode right and add some variety into operations. Maybe an option to skip the downtime and same chatter you hear over and over, and some more dynamic events here and there. The AI director does a good job at making them always fun, but something else to break up the monotony of essentially doing a single player mission over and over would be nice. More XP for the longer missions is necessary too. If you're being optimal with leveling you really just want to spam mission 1.
Dude. Every class in this game is fun as hell, IMO. That's what I love about it. I have squeezed 200 hours of enjoyment out of the game because I have loved the experience of leveling every class and every weapon. All of the classes feel unique and have their own strengths and weaknesses. And if you are good at playing them, each one can be OP after. One game I'll be running around as a Sniper spending like 40% of my time in stealth and just headhunting majoris enemies. The next game I'll be leaping through the air slamming down a thunder hammer and popping off meaty gunstrikes as assault. Next game I'll be an invincible Bulwark.
Man I love this game.
@@connman8d617 I 100% agree man, the game is incredibly fun and rewarding as your skills improve and you better manage swimming around in the horde, spacing, parries/dodges. Every class is super fun, but I can definitely feel the pace of fights are slower when you're not with a meta OP team composition. Its not a problem or anything its a PVE game after all, just would be nice to see some of the under performing guns get a little more love so they feel a little more satisfying to use like the bolters.
I kind of wish they differentiated the perks a bit by what melee weapon you use for vangaurd. So instead of thr 3rd row it could be like with combat knife increase weapon speed by a certain amount for 10 seconds after perfect parry or perfect dodge, and with chainsword increase stagger of heavy hits for 10 seconds after perfect parry or perfect dodge so that you can stun them out of heavy hits and orange hits. I feel like that would make for some really fun game play.
@@Bigborian92783 I like that idea. If its a perk though I'd rather just see those as flat buffs vs more conditional temporary ones. Like you said, lean into the weapons strengths.
Throw on a fencing knife with this guy, and you practically become Rambo.
Batman with the grapple Rambo with the knife... Batbo
This is a really good guide, do you have the best perks for the bolt pistol too?
Thx! For my bolt pistol I like to take either the ammo or firepower version, depending how good you are at conserving ammo... For perks I do the bottom line straight across, is a 20%dmg increase and 30% magazine increase in total.
If I've learned anything from years in gaming it's that animation canceling rarely gets nerfed. It raises the skill cap so high that 90% of players can't even manage it while still contending with everything else that's happening on screen. The 10% of players that can make use of animation canceling to eke out that little bit of extra dps or survivability deserve those rewards.
Sub for the reload tip! 👍
This comment is after recent patch of 10/17/24.
Any updates y'all got to reply about Lethal difficulty?
Haven't played to many with Vanguard yet but what worked best for me was the Definitive Build setup from this guide paired with the Melta and Chainsword.
Your Grapple only really use it closer to you group for knockbacks and dmg. Do not pull yourself across the map without a quick way back.
Overall- play a little slower than you normally would really keeping it tight with your team. Until they fix how this armor thing works on lethal.
For the lov of god... Emperor
IT'S Chain Sword not chainsaw sword
Lol!
im playing it 95% melee, 😂…
Yes melta is strong, but it's not even fun ... for real please delete that gun from the game it makes no sense, and also it's not what it is supposed to be. Melta is supposed to be focus anti monster and suck at clearing hordes, this is the exact opposite ...
Speak for yourself buddy, every gun has its uses and all of them can be fun. Just because you’re not having fun with it doesn’t mean it should get deleted.
@@TH3MRH1P3R I keep my position. For the tabletop game lover. This gun is mis conceived. It should melt big target not hords.
Then that is the only gun that can be used easily in grey version even in ruthless difficulty.
This is the easy mode of the game encewhy it must be nerfed badly.
In any build melta will be the strongest option. If you are honest with yourself you know it deserves to be received like a nerf in stats or effects. This is for the balance of the game.
Personally I do have fun with the gun. But acknowledge it needs a nerf. And need to be more in line with the lore.
i agree with you about that melta is boring, but this is personal. The fact is that, against a neurotophe/zoantrope and against hive tyrant, you feel quiet harmless... but you feel harmless even with occulus (even on minoris), so the last slot is for istigator... and at the end, you finish up landing on melta again :)
@@belshiro I disagree. With tactical I went stalker. And this is really good !
For the vanguard I went instigator which is really strong as well at popping elite and being better into neurothrope. Since I started with those. I never went back to melta. To be honest the game was too easy with melta that I nearly dropped the all game ...