The most reliable trustworthy reviews of mountain bikes bar none. I've bought a bike Wil has tested and found his observations to be absolutely on point. I won't buy another bike without hearing what he has to say about it first.
@@FlowMountainBikeRUclipsHi Will, i agree. Your reviews are fantastic and you are smart and good at bikes. Will how would one give the bike more rear travel? Obviously the front is just putting a 160 fox 36 on it. And if the travel could be bumped to 160/150, and with maxxis assegai front tyre and dhr II rear tire, would you then choose this bike over the levo?
@@mtb_3930 Cant increase the rear travel unless someone like cascade components makes a new linkage, the shock is max stroke length for the eye to eye size. (185 x 55)
Great review. so how is the motor/climbing in a more normal cadence. It's not realistic to maintain 100+ RPM climbing up a long steep grade. I'm talking 70-80 RPM
Thanks for watching and for the feedback mate! If you're climbing at a lower cadence, the SX motor is pretty mellow in its power output, which helps to conserve the battery. It does depend on which assist mode you're in, with Eco and Tour being comparable to other low-powered motors. eMTB mode is more adaptive to cadence and input torque, so it feels similar to the Eco/Tour mode at lower cadences and if you're not putting a lot of your own energy into the pedals. When you start to push harder and a little faster, that's when you can feel the motor wake up and deliver significantly more power. Turbo mode will get you that feeling of power a lot faster and more easily. It isn't like the Turbo mode on the CX motor, but it still provides a lot of support even in the 70-80RPM cadence range. Personally I preferred the adaptive eMTB mode, as I find it to be more natural and easier to control when riding proper singletrack. In that mode, the SX motor feels considerably punchier and more responsive than other lightweight e-MTB motors when riding undulating terrain. During the standardised range test (10% average gradient) I found that I could cruise uphill pretty comfortably at 18km/h with the SX motor. This was quite a bit faster than comparable e-MTBs fitted with the Fazua Ride 60 (16km/h), the SL 1.1 (14.5km/h) and TQ (13.5km/h) motors. However, it was slower compared to the Bosch CX motor, which would comfortably tick over at 22km/h with even less effort on the pedals. That motor is really impressive if you're after an e-MTB that can carry you up every climb without you having to do a lot of work. Hope that helps, but just shout out if you've got any other questions! [Wil]
@@FlowMountainBikeRUclips Hey Wil, thanks for this input. I wonder if you can compare the SX motor with the Fazua 60 in terms of pedaling support on lower cadence (70 RPM). Which one gives you more support? Thank you!
My pleasure mate! Good question on the Fazua Ride 60 - I'd really need both bikes side-by-side to offer an accurate comparison across the different assist modes with each system. But assuming we're talking about the most powerful setting, I found both motors to deliver a similar amount of support when pedalling at a low cadence up a steady road climb. As mentioned above however, the Bosch SX motor was able to maintain a higher average climbing speed (18 vs 16km/h) during the standardised range test. I must admit I wasn't measuring my cadence on that climb, but it would have been in the 70-80RPM zone. I'll have a more detailed review coming on the Bosch SX motor in the near future, so we'll be sure to put in plenty of comparisons to help benchmark it against the competition. With that in mind, let me know if you've got any other questions you'd like to see addressed in the review! [Wil]
@@FlowMountainBikeRUclips Thanks for the response. Can't wait for that review! Keep 'em coming. The quality of your production is really good. Your reviews are informative!
I have the C1 version, the 150/140 one, I put some maxxis DD DHR2 on the rear straight away and an EX0+ assegai up front, the burlier tyres and the fox fork definitely make it feel pretty good on the descents. Size 4, with pedals / the heavier maxxis tyres set up tubeless total weight was 20.2kg. My only complaint is the same as yours, the rattle from the SX motor, for me its worth the trade off though considering how much better the bike feels that the bigger full power bikes i have ridden in the past. Its pretty playful and nimble due to the geometry but the low central weight of the drive unit and battery makes it feel stable with it gets a bit rough. I'm going to eventually play around with up forking to 160mm, either new damper and air spring on the 36 or just chuck a 38 in there.
How tall are you? I'm taking delivery of this bike tomorrow, and the Norco rep talked me into the recommended size, but it's massive on paper. 497mm reach on the S4, but I'm in the middle of the range at 182CM.
Great review Wil 👏. Thanks for the insights on the Bosch sx and look forward to video coming out on that. Shame Norco didn't release a top spec alloy model with a 36 Grip X or Grip X2 to go with X2 shock, although I suspect this would push weight too far from a figure considered acceptable for an SL bike approx 20kg limit? Have you had a chance to ride new Orbea Rise LT 420wh with full 85nm on tap? I'd be curious to see how the LT Rise would stack up against Fluid VLT although not exactly apples vs apples comparison with one being mullet and other full 29er
Thanks Sandy! I suspect Norco will expand the Fluid VLT lineup with alloy models at some point in time, but maybe it'll be more from a price barrier-lowering perspective. Haven't had the chance to ride the new Rise though I believe we'll have one coming later this year. Looks like a great option! [Wil]
Looks awesome but they should've added a little more travel, 170 is ideal for DH laps, lightweight with good suspension and a range extender gives all options for normal feeling bike handling and big adventures
Having owned a Bosch Performance CX equipped bike for almost 2 years and covered almost 2500 miles, my next emtb will not be a Bosch. It’s powerful and has been reliable but personally… I find the clacking noise really annoying.
It isn't adjustable in the app. With the bigger CX motor, it is possible for a Bosch dealer to disengage the Extended Boost function, though I'm not sure if the same can be done with the newer SX motor - I'll find out and get back to you! [Wil]
We received a Heckler SL six months ago to test, but unfortunately the motor died within the first ride. It went back to Santa Cruz to have the problem diagnosed, but they're yet to send that bike back to us. Hopefully we can get on one in the near future to carry on the review! [Wil]
@@FlowMountainBikeRUclips yeah that's common unfortunately with the early fazua drive units, I've had 2, this it's been strong, but out of both bikes the heckler SL and fluid the fazua is much better and more responsive in the lower cadences rather than the Bosch sx.
Actually the S2 size was spot-on! As mentioned in the review, it's a great fitting bike in terms of both reach and stack, and the cockpit fit me really well. The reference to climbing performance is primarily related to the 27.5in rear wheel and short chainstays. When combined with the perky Bosch motor and low-profile rear tyre, the Fluid VLT struggles for grip on loose and chunky climbs, and it requires more conscious front-end weighting compared to bikes with longer chainstays and dual 29in wheels. Going up to the S3 size likely wouldn't help a whole lot as the rear centre length is only 3mm longer. As for the cockpit, the stack lifts by almost 10mm and the reach increases to 472.5mm which is too long for me. There's a bit more info about sizing, setup and handling in the full review that you might find interesting; flowmountainbike.com/tests/2024-norco-fluid-vlt-review-c2-140/ Hope that helps! [Wil]
That’s a great tip! Sliding the saddle forwards, dropping the stem down and even changing to a shorter stem are all useful techniques for tweaking the fit if you’ve got a bike that feels like it might be too big. I recently did all of those with the latest Canyon Spectral, which has a huge reach and stack for its given size. I was able to get it comfortable in terms of the seated position, but of course there’s not much you can do about the wheelbase and front centre length, and those are really the key elements when it comes to weight distribution and handling. For me that’s where the S2 size is spot-on with the Fluid VLT - I personally wouldn’t want that front centre any longer, as it handles so well! [Wil]
@@FlowMountainBikeRUclips Norco's sizing is weird, the size recommended to me had a longer reach than I'm used to. it looks like a reach of a size Large, I usually ride around 450 reach which is norco's s2
The most reliable trustworthy reviews of mountain bikes bar none. I've bought a bike Wil has tested and found his observations to be absolutely on point. I won't buy another bike without hearing what he has to say about it first.
Thanks very much David, we really appreciate the feedback! [Wil]
agreed... I bought the Norco Sight A3 the same way - no better online reviews can be found. Love it here.
@@FlowMountainBikeRUclipsHi Will, i agree. Your reviews are fantastic and you are smart and good at bikes. Will how would one give the bike more rear travel? Obviously the front is just putting a 160 fox 36 on it. And if the travel could be bumped to 160/150, and with maxxis assegai front tyre and dhr II rear tire, would you then choose this bike over the levo?
@@mtb_3930 Cant increase the rear travel unless someone like cascade components makes a new linkage, the shock is max stroke length for the eye to eye size. (185 x 55)
If you have long legs for your height the Norco is the clean winner against the Levo SL, that thing has super slack actual seat angle
Great review. so how is the motor/climbing in a more normal cadence. It's not realistic to maintain 100+ RPM climbing up a long steep grade. I'm talking 70-80 RPM
Thanks for watching and for the feedback mate!
If you're climbing at a lower cadence, the SX motor is pretty mellow in its power output, which helps to conserve the battery. It does depend on which assist mode you're in, with Eco and Tour being comparable to other low-powered motors.
eMTB mode is more adaptive to cadence and input torque, so it feels similar to the Eco/Tour mode at lower cadences and if you're not putting a lot of your own energy into the pedals. When you start to push harder and a little faster, that's when you can feel the motor wake up and deliver significantly more power.
Turbo mode will get you that feeling of power a lot faster and more easily. It isn't like the Turbo mode on the CX motor, but it still provides a lot of support even in the 70-80RPM cadence range.
Personally I preferred the adaptive eMTB mode, as I find it to be more natural and easier to control when riding proper singletrack. In that mode, the SX motor feels considerably punchier and more responsive than other lightweight e-MTB motors when riding undulating terrain.
During the standardised range test (10% average gradient) I found that I could cruise uphill pretty comfortably at 18km/h with the SX motor. This was quite a bit faster than comparable e-MTBs fitted with the Fazua Ride 60 (16km/h), the SL 1.1 (14.5km/h) and TQ (13.5km/h) motors.
However, it was slower compared to the Bosch CX motor, which would comfortably tick over at 22km/h with even less effort on the pedals. That motor is really impressive if you're after an e-MTB that can carry you up every climb without you having to do a lot of work.
Hope that helps, but just shout out if you've got any other questions!
[Wil]
@@FlowMountainBikeRUclips Hey Wil, thanks for this input. I wonder if you can compare the SX motor with the Fazua 60 in terms of pedaling support on lower cadence (70 RPM). Which one gives you more support? Thank you!
My pleasure mate!
Good question on the Fazua Ride 60 - I'd really need both bikes side-by-side to offer an accurate comparison across the different assist modes with each system. But assuming we're talking about the most powerful setting, I found both motors to deliver a similar amount of support when pedalling at a low cadence up a steady road climb. As mentioned above however, the Bosch SX motor was able to maintain a higher average climbing speed (18 vs 16km/h) during the standardised range test. I must admit I wasn't measuring my cadence on that climb, but it would have been in the 70-80RPM zone.
I'll have a more detailed review coming on the Bosch SX motor in the near future, so we'll be sure to put in plenty of comparisons to help benchmark it against the competition. With that in mind, let me know if you've got any other questions you'd like to see addressed in the review!
[Wil]
@@FlowMountainBikeRUclips Thanks for the response. Can't wait for that review! Keep 'em coming. The quality of your production is really good. Your reviews are informative!
I have the C1 version, the 150/140 one, I put some maxxis DD DHR2 on the rear straight away and an EX0+ assegai up front, the burlier tyres and the fox fork definitely make it feel pretty good on the descents. Size 4, with pedals / the heavier maxxis tyres set up tubeless total weight was 20.2kg.
My only complaint is the same as yours, the rattle from the SX motor, for me its worth the trade off though considering how much better the bike feels that the bigger full power bikes i have ridden in the past. Its pretty playful and nimble due to the geometry but the low central weight of the drive unit and battery makes it feel stable with it gets a bit rough.
I'm going to eventually play around with up forking to 160mm, either new damper and air spring on the 36 or just chuck a 38 in there.
How tall are you? I'm taking delivery of this bike tomorrow, and the Norco rep talked me into the recommended size, but it's massive on paper. 497mm reach on the S4, but I'm in the middle of the range at 182CM.
@@SwimmingBird846 I'm 190. Have always downsized bikes though. Usually ride 500 to 510 reach.
Great review Wil 👏. Thanks for the insights on the Bosch sx and look forward to video coming out on that. Shame Norco didn't release a top spec alloy model with a 36 Grip X or Grip X2 to go with X2 shock, although I suspect this would push weight too far from a figure considered acceptable for an SL bike approx 20kg limit? Have you had a chance to ride new Orbea Rise LT 420wh with full 85nm on tap? I'd be curious to see how the LT Rise would stack up against Fluid VLT although not exactly apples vs apples comparison with one being mullet and other full 29er
Thanks Sandy! I suspect Norco will expand the Fluid VLT lineup with alloy models at some point in time, but maybe it'll be more from a price barrier-lowering perspective.
Haven't had the chance to ride the new Rise though I believe we'll have one coming later this year. Looks like a great option!
[Wil]
Looks awesome but they should've added a little more travel, 170 is ideal for DH laps, lightweight with good suspension and a range extender gives all options for normal feeling bike handling and big adventures
I'm interested to see how this compares to the Pivot Shuttle SL. Does anyone have any experience with both of them?
Having owned a Bosch Performance CX equipped bike for almost 2 years and covered almost 2500 miles, my next emtb will not be a Bosch. It’s powerful and has been reliable but personally… I find the clacking noise really annoying.
Is the extended boost adjustable in the app? I understand the advantages on climbs but I personally hate this motor behavior otherwise.
It isn't adjustable in the app. With the bigger CX motor, it is possible for a Bosch dealer to disengage the Extended Boost function, though I'm not sure if the same can be done with the newer SX motor - I'll find out and get back to you!
[Wil]
@@FlowMountainBikeRUclips thanks!
And one other you forgot the goat, heckler SL , another great option in the SL Market.
We received a Heckler SL six months ago to test, but unfortunately the motor died within the first ride. It went back to Santa Cruz to have the problem diagnosed, but they're yet to send that bike back to us. Hopefully we can get on one in the near future to carry on the review! [Wil]
@@FlowMountainBikeRUclips yeah that's common unfortunately with the early fazua drive units, I've had 2, this it's been strong, but out of both bikes the heckler SL and fluid the fazua is much better and more responsive in the lower cadences rather than the Bosch sx.
Sc heckler Definitely not the goat,fazua sux,pivot shuttle am much closer to goat status
@@DarrenSmith-x6h lol, well you can debate that with AMB in there write up champ 😆
The Orbea Rise was the first to really nail this category.
Chooses a bike a size too small, critiques it for an un-weighting front wheel on climbs.
There's a fix to that.
Ride the correct size bike. 😂
Actually the S2 size was spot-on! As mentioned in the review, it's a great fitting bike in terms of both reach and stack, and the cockpit fit me really well.
The reference to climbing performance is primarily related to the 27.5in rear wheel and short chainstays. When combined with the perky Bosch motor and low-profile rear tyre, the Fluid VLT struggles for grip on loose and chunky climbs, and it requires more conscious front-end weighting compared to bikes with longer chainstays and dual 29in wheels.
Going up to the S3 size likely wouldn't help a whole lot as the rear centre length is only 3mm longer. As for the cockpit, the stack lifts by almost 10mm and the reach increases to 472.5mm which is too long for me.
There's a bit more info about sizing, setup and handling in the full review that you might find interesting; flowmountainbike.com/tests/2024-norco-fluid-vlt-review-c2-140/
Hope that helps!
[Wil]
@@FlowMountainBikeRUclips bigger bike and the saddle slid forward a tad.
Straight up sorcery
That’s a great tip! Sliding the saddle forwards, dropping the stem down and even changing to a shorter stem are all useful techniques for tweaking the fit if you’ve got a bike that feels like it might be too big.
I recently did all of those with the latest Canyon Spectral, which has a huge reach and stack for its given size.
I was able to get it comfortable in terms of the seated position, but of course there’s not much you can do about the wheelbase and front centre length, and those are really the key elements when it comes to weight distribution and handling. For me that’s where the S2 size is spot-on with the Fluid VLT - I personally wouldn’t want that front centre any longer, as it handles so well!
[Wil]
@@FlowMountainBikeRUclips Norco's sizing is weird, the size recommended to me had a longer reach than I'm used to. it looks like a reach of a size Large, I usually ride around 450 reach which is norco's s2
Enough with the bloody motorcycles already... Get back to reviewing proper mountain bikes please :)