Like you, I also started out with all the microbevel jigs and shapton water stones, and now I also find myself reduced to freehand on 3 diamond plates and a strop......I now listen to what Paul Sellers has to say and try it first :)
This is a good explanation of the strop. I equate it to a steel that a meat carver uses to maintain an edge. The strop only maintains an edge by realigning the microscopic bits of steel that can become deflected from normal usage. I make my strops from leather samples, rejected due to minor imperfections, from the clothing industry. I attach it to a board to add support and make it easier to pull against bench dog. It also makes it less likely to misplace. I apply a dollop of Autosol to the oiled surface. One last point to emphasize is how stropping lengthens the life of an edge tool by avoiding taking off metal with a grinder and sharpening stones. Great work, Shannon
Great video! I use the sandpaper method and strop..strop...strop.... I'm glad you explained all the little details that people worry about. and that they are really not a big deal at all... my next step is going to diamond stones and i should be set for life.... thanks...
Excellent presentation. I believe dubbing does happen. Causes: too much pressure, too many strokes, elevated angle. Use a very light touch with narrow chisels. A piece of MDF charged with compound works very well, too.
Shannon this was excellent. I too have feared the strop. I think I'll give it another go. Thanks for demystifying the wonders of horse butt. btw when I was at TFWW I mentioned I was inspired to buy the strop because of you. They said they get that a lot. Your name is synonymous with good quality Horse Butt...
When comparing your method to Paul Sellers choice of diamond stones in his method, I draw the conclusion that only the double-sided fine/extra-fine diamond-stone and a strop is all you need actually. Paul moves to the strop right after honing on the extra-fine stone, not needing/using and extra-extra-fine stone. That being said that setup (one double-sides DMT and a strop) makes quite an affordable method with superb results.
Hi Shannon. Firstly a great big thank you for the inspiration you've provided and the effort you've put into sharing your thoughts and experience; it's because of you I'm the proud owner of Scott Meek planes. I've put the research in over the past couple of years finding truly skilful, knowledgeable, passionate and humble craftsmen and woodworkers (Richard Maguire for example, who made my vice screws) willing to help and you are right up their! Secondly a small question - is that the same Norton grinding disk?
I strop the hell out of my chisels, but my plane irons go to the stones then strop if needed. I like the idea of using a dog hole to secure one of your strops, atm I just put a clamp behind my strop.
I needed to strop a chisel RIGHT THEN and there so I loaded a piece of printer paper with a honing compound and glued it onto a piece of float glass. Worked like a charm. I think it would be a great option for those in fear of rounded edges ;)
Tome4kkkk or just use leather since the more pliable nature is what makes you not have to worry about the exact bevel angle. Glass will require much more precision
I didn't have any pieces of leather back then. But I get your point. One more important thing. I'm considering a very painful purchase of a waterstone to complement my 1000/3000 waterstone setup, namely an 8000 waterstone. Here's the question. Would it be viable i.e. practical (considerations: time and inadvertent roundind of chisel corners, other) to skip the purchase and rely on stropping?
Y'know I'm not entirely sure. 3000 is still pretty fine so it should work. But here is the thing even with an 8000 grit stone I still recommend a strop. So get to stropping and if you find it isn't working then you can think about a higher grit stone.
@@Tome4kkkk if you search for tack life waterstone they have a very affordable 3000/8000 combo. Works great. This company makes really nice tools for the prices they charge. I've bought a jigsaw and a drill as well from them, both tools are comparable in performance to the big blue, at a fraction of the cost.
Greeting Shannon! Happy to jump in as a subscriber! Your simple sharpening approach looks totally liberating. I’m just getting into hand tool woodworking, so all of this is new to me. Since you also have experience with water stones, I was wondering if diamond plates last as long. I heard that diamonds wear down and cut less and less aggressively over time and have to be replaced more often. Have you found that it takes more time to sharpen with them over time? Also, doesn’t it take a lot longer to sharpen a single primary bevel than to focus on a small secondary? I’m looking at this thick A2 blade on my Lie Nielsen plane that I have yet to try.
I haven't noticed any wear whatsoever with my diamond stones. Still cutting great 5 years after this video was made. I'm sure a microbevel is faster but its not worth the extra fuss for me since I sharpen freehand.
Thanks for the advice! I just ordered the DMT plate with the magna base from Amazon and the horse butt strop and compound from Tools for Working Wood. Ill also get the extra extra fine plate. Also just picked up a nice electric grinder at the neighborhood flea market that appears almost unused. I’ll grind an old chisel and plane blade on it to create a hollow grind and then take the leap with hand sharpening and see how that goes before trying it out on my Lie Nielsen.
Hi Shannon. Incredibly useful info! Looks like you don't add compound to the strop every time you use it, correct? Any rule of thumb about when you like to add compound?
I have always been told to wipe off the blade between each grit of stones. Does this really matter or is that only a concern when on regular stones rather than diamond stones?
Eric Osterhout yes been told that too. The diamond stone isn't friable and therefore no grit is breaking away and transferring to the other stones. At least not an appreciable amount
Thanks for de-mystifying dubbing! I've been avoiding stropping, for fear of dubbing. Looks like that's just not a big concern. Any chance you could do a quick addendum to show how you deal with cambered irons, like for a jack or scrub? Thanks!
shannon are u saying horesbutt or what???? sorry for asking but im tryna search that and kind find anything. So please tell me what its called and where to find that kinda leather. great video i always wondered how u keep ur tools sharp keep it up
jp morso I've bought horse butt remnants on eBay really cheap. You just have to make sure they're large enough. They can be oddly shaped because they're just scraps that would otherwise get thrown away. The smaller pieces are good for gouges and molding plane irons
1. I have a #80 cabinet scraper that I love using but hate sharpening. Any good tricks to make it easier? I have a Stanley replacement blade in it which is short. I find that I can't match the primary angle on it with free hand sharpening because the blade is so small and short. 2. I have been stropping and found that it didn't work as well unless I clean the "Used" honing compound off the leather. I scraped it off with a chisel and then had to resharpen it. (Doh moment). Do you clean your strop and with what? Sorry for the multiple questions. My technique is Tormek for most tools. For odd tools, I use a course diamond stone for initial work and then water stones for fine sharpening.
Jared S nope never cleaned the leather. Never heard that you should remove the compound. That sounds bogus. I sharpen my #80 just like a plane blade, nothing special. I actually find the shorter blades to be easier to feel the bevel.
Thanks for the video. I use a honing guide on my stones because I can't hold the angle consistently. Would you recommend using a honing guide on the strop as well or will it be more forgiving with some angle variation? I wonder if the wheel on my guide would create a groove down the strop🤔
if the blade is already in the guide then by all means go ahead and strop it. No I don't think the guide will groove your strop at all. But the real beauty of the strop is the easy access and dry nature that allows you to stop for a second, strop and go back to work. So the guide will defeat some of that ease.
The DMT Magnabase system is what I use. That is a brand name. I got mine at Tools for Working Wood, www.toolsforworkingwood.com/store/item/MS-DMAG.XX/DMT_12"_Double-Sided_DiaSharp_MagnaBase_System?searchterm=magna
Do you have any Veritas PM-V11 blades? I use water stones and it still takes forever to get an edge 220/1000/8000... (hone and polish with 3M paper/film 1 micron and .3 microns on granite reference plates) But going back to resharpen is hell... Any ideas other than chucking my investment in those blades?
There was a research on the Internet a while ago, written by a guy with access to an electronic microscope. The conclusion was that no matter what steel (cryo\japanese\etc) - they all drop to about ANSI 400 after just a few shavings in a softwood. So you might save some time by not waiting your edge getting too dull (i.e. sharpen often) and by stopping at 8000 grit (btw, what scale is it?)
There are at least 3 major abrasives grit scales, and then there are abrasives manufacturers' scales. When you say "8000 grit" which scale do you mean? J8000 is very different from F8000 for example.
not really no. Every now and then I run them under warm water and scrub them a bit to ensure no swarf is sticking in the grit but that's maybe once a month
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Like you, I also started out with all the microbevel jigs and shapton water stones, and now I also find myself reduced to freehand on 3 diamond plates and a strop......I now listen to what Paul Sellers has to say and try it first :)
This is a good explanation of the strop. I equate it to a steel that a meat carver uses to maintain an edge. The strop only maintains an edge by realigning the microscopic bits of steel that can become deflected from normal usage.
I make my strops from leather samples, rejected due to minor imperfections, from the clothing industry. I attach it to a board to add support and make it easier to pull against bench dog. It also makes it less likely to misplace. I apply a dollop of Autosol to the oiled surface.
One last point to emphasize is how stropping lengthens the life of an edge tool by avoiding taking off metal with a grinder and sharpening stones.
Great work, Shannon
This discussion was VERY helpful to me inasmuch as you showed me how much I need to simplify my sharpening process. So thank you!
Thanks for simplifying the process. I am new to sharpening and some people make it seem so complicated that it is intimidating.
Great video! I use the sandpaper method and strop..strop...strop.... I'm glad you explained all the little details that people worry about. and that they are really not a big deal at all... my next step is going to diamond stones and i should be set for life.... thanks...
Nice video, Shannon! I've used a strop for years, but this is the clearest explanation I've heard for how and why it works.
awesome thanks for recognizing my genius with leather and crayons
Excellent presentation. I believe dubbing does happen. Causes: too much pressure, too many strokes, elevated angle. Use a very light touch with narrow chisels. A piece of MDF charged with compound works very well, too.
I use a piece of old blue jean glued to a block of wood as a strop. Has worked for me so far.
I have the same system as you 400/1000 diamond stones and strop ,mainly just stropping made from pig leather rescued from an old sofa.
Shannon this was excellent. I too have feared the strop. I think I'll give it another go. Thanks for demystifying the wonders of horse butt.
btw when I was at TFWW I mentioned I was inspired to buy the strop because of you. They said they get that a lot. Your name is synonymous with good quality Horse Butt...
James Pring better than bad quality horse butt
When comparing your method to Paul Sellers choice of diamond stones in his method, I draw the conclusion that only the double-sided fine/extra-fine diamond-stone and a strop is all you need actually. Paul moves to the strop right after honing on the extra-fine stone, not needing/using and extra-extra-fine stone. That being said that setup (one double-sides DMT and a strop) makes quite an affordable method with superb results.
That Spider-Man and Silver Surfer piece! Very nice!
Great video Shannon! This has helped me to make a purchasing decision. Thanks.
Hi there from Portugal,
Nice info :D
Obrigado(Thanks)
Hi Shannon.
Firstly a great big thank you for the inspiration you've provided and the effort you've put into sharing your thoughts and experience; it's because of you I'm the proud owner of Scott Meek planes. I've put the research in over the past couple of years finding truly skilful, knowledgeable, passionate and humble craftsmen and woodworkers (Richard Maguire for example, who made my vice screws) willing to help and you are right up their!
Secondly a small question - is that the same Norton grinding disk?
You just reinforced that I wasn't wasting my time by using the extra-extra fine before the strop
Matthew Buntyn or we both could be wrong 😜
Thanks Shannon.
I strop the hell out of my chisels, but my plane irons go to the stones then strop if needed. I like the idea of using a dog hole to secure one of your strops, atm I just put a clamp behind my strop.
I needed to strop a chisel RIGHT THEN and there so I loaded a piece of printer paper with a honing compound and glued it onto a piece of float glass. Worked like a charm. I think it would be a great option for those in fear of rounded edges ;)
Tome4kkkk or just use leather since the more pliable nature is what makes you not have to worry about the exact bevel angle. Glass will require much more precision
I didn't have any pieces of leather back then. But I get your point. One more important thing. I'm considering a very painful purchase of a waterstone to complement my 1000/3000 waterstone setup, namely an 8000 waterstone. Here's the question. Would it be viable i.e. practical (considerations: time and inadvertent roundind of chisel corners, other) to skip the purchase and rely on stropping?
Y'know I'm not entirely sure. 3000 is still pretty fine so it should work. But here is the thing even with an 8000 grit stone I still recommend a strop. So get to stropping and if you find it isn't working then you can think about a higher grit stone.
@@Tome4kkkk if you search for tack life waterstone they have a very affordable 3000/8000 combo. Works great. This company makes really nice tools for the prices they charge. I've bought a jigsaw and a drill as well from them, both tools are comparable in performance to the big blue, at a fraction of the cost.
Great video!
The sign up to the right reads : "TOOL RULES, DON'T TOUCH THEM, DON'T MOVE THEM, DON'T BORROW THEM, DON'T EVEN LOOK AT THEM" LOL!!
Greeting Shannon! Happy to jump in as a subscriber! Your simple sharpening approach looks totally liberating. I’m just getting into hand tool woodworking, so all of this is new to me. Since you also have experience with water stones, I was wondering if diamond plates last as long. I heard that diamonds wear down and cut less and less aggressively over time and have to be replaced more often. Have you found that it takes more time to sharpen with them over time? Also, doesn’t it take a lot longer to sharpen a single primary bevel than to focus on a small secondary? I’m looking at this thick A2 blade on my Lie Nielsen plane that I have yet to try.
I haven't noticed any wear whatsoever with my diamond stones. Still cutting great 5 years after this video was made. I'm sure a microbevel is faster but its not worth the extra fuss for me since I sharpen freehand.
Thanks for the advice! I just ordered the DMT plate with the magna base from Amazon and the horse butt strop and compound from Tools for Working Wood. Ill also get the extra extra fine plate. Also just picked up a nice electric grinder at the neighborhood flea market that appears almost unused. I’ll grind an old chisel and plane blade on it to create a hollow grind and then take the leap with hand sharpening and see how that goes before trying it out on my Lie Nielsen.
Hi Shannon. Incredibly useful info! Looks like you don't add compound to the strop every time you use it, correct? Any rule of thumb about when you like to add compound?
Kris W. very rarely do I add compound. Maybe once a month. No rule of thumb.
I see you haven't colored in your new art work lol. Great video!!
I have always been told to wipe off the blade between each grit of stones. Does this really matter or is that only a concern when on regular stones rather than diamond stones?
Eric Osterhout yes been told that too. The diamond stone isn't friable and therefore no grit is breaking away and transferring to the other stones. At least not an appreciable amount
so the truth. simpler is so much better.
Thanks for de-mystifying dubbing! I've been avoiding stropping, for fear of dubbing. Looks like that's just not a big concern.
Any chance you could do a quick addendum to show how you deal with cambered irons, like for a jack or scrub?
Thanks!
Sean Baker if you check out my fire plane restoration video you will see that in detail.
RenaissanceWW awesome, thanks!!
Do you happen to have a link to where I could get those diamond stones? I'm in the market for a set. =)
Brian's Workshop just google dmt magnabase system. There are several retailers. I bought mine from Tools for Working Wood
shannon are u saying horesbutt or what???? sorry for asking but im tryna search that and kind find anything. So please tell me what its called and where to find that kinda leather. great video i always wondered how u keep ur tools sharp keep it up
jp morso just go to Tools for Working Wood .com and you can find the horses butt strop there
lol thanks shannon
jp morso I've bought horse butt remnants on eBay really cheap. You just have to make sure they're large enough. They can be oddly shaped because they're just scraps that would otherwise get thrown away. The smaller pieces are good for gouges and molding plane irons
1. I have a #80 cabinet scraper that I love using but hate sharpening. Any good tricks to make it easier? I have a Stanley replacement blade in it which is short. I find that I can't match the primary angle on it with free hand sharpening because the blade is so small and short.
2. I have been stropping and found that it didn't work as well unless I clean the "Used" honing compound off the leather. I scraped it off with a chisel and then had to resharpen it. (Doh moment). Do you clean your strop and with what?
Sorry for the multiple questions.
My technique is Tormek for most tools. For odd tools, I use a course diamond stone for initial work and then water stones for fine sharpening.
Jared S nope never cleaned the leather. Never heard that you should remove the compound. That sounds bogus. I sharpen my #80 just like a plane blade, nothing special. I actually find the shorter blades to be easier to feel the bevel.
Thanks for the video. I use a honing guide on my stones because I can't hold the angle consistently. Would you recommend using a honing guide on the strop as well or will it be more forgiving with some angle variation? I wonder if the wheel on my guide would create a groove down the strop🤔
if the blade is already in the guide then by all means go ahead and strop it. No I don't think the guide will groove your strop at all. But the real beauty of the strop is the easy access and dry nature that allows you to stop for a second, strop and go back to work. So the guide will defeat some of that ease.
RenaissanceWW that's a good point. I guess I'll learn to strop free hand. Thanks!
shannon, do you notice any difference in performance or edge wear just using the primary bevel?
Adam Stevens nope
I am looking at the DMT stones but confused on which to get - Can you give us part #'s for the two you have? Thanks!
The DMT Magnabase system is what I use. That is a brand name. I got mine at Tools for Working Wood, www.toolsforworkingwood.com/store/item/MS-DMAG.XX/DMT_12"_Double-Sided_DiaSharp_MagnaBase_System?searchterm=magna
The finest stone I have is the DMT Extra Extra Fine stone.
There are a few different sizes available from DMT. What size do you use?
Paul T I use what came with the magnabase system. It's a 2.5x12 stone
What finish is on your workbench?
Slap Stick technically nothing. Actually, whatever I have spilled on it since I last flattened it
Do you have any Veritas PM-V11 blades? I use water stones and it still takes forever to get an edge 220/1000/8000... (hone and polish with 3M paper/film 1 micron and .3 microns on granite reference plates)
But going back to resharpen is hell...
Any ideas other than chucking my investment in those blades?
Ray Roberts yes I have some PM-V11 as well as A2 and O1. No problems here
I have no problems on anything other than the PM-V11... and once sharp it's great but it takes me forever to get that edge.
There was a research on the Internet a while ago, written by a guy with access to an electronic microscope. The conclusion was that no matter what steel (cryo\japanese\etc) - they all drop to about ANSI 400 after just a few shavings in a softwood. So you might save some time by not waiting your edge getting too dull (i.e. sharpen often) and by stopping at 8000 grit (btw, what scale is it?)
scale?
There are at least 3 major abrasives grit scales, and then there are abrasives manufacturers' scales. When you say "8000 grit" which scale do you mean? J8000 is very different from F8000 for example.
Dub Step!!
oh you beet me too it!
Someone's got a case of the wub-wubs, am I rite? High five!
Shannon, do you rinse your plates between sharpenings?
not really no. Every now and then I run them under warm water and scrub them a bit to ensure no swarf is sticking in the grit but that's maybe once a month
RenaissanceWW Great stuff, learning a lot from your videos !
Thanks, Shannon... $42.74 spent. :)
I wonder what human flesh would be like as a honing leather.